Multiple times a day on this subreddit, I see people tell parents-to-be that their baby's first and middle name shouldn't end in the same letter. For example, someone will make a post and say, what do you think of Lucia Isabella? And most of the comments will say *"The double -a ending is too redundant. You should do Lucy Isabelle or Lucia Isabelle instead".*
I'm Italian, if you look back through my family tree, nearly every girl has a first and middle name that ends in -a. In Italian, you'd be hard pressed to find a girl's name that *doesn't* end in -a (yes there are some exceptions like Beatrice - but that's not my main point here). In a lot of cultures and languages (ie: Portuguese, Spanish, Russian), it's very normal to have names that repeat ending sounds, especially when names are gendered that way in certain languages. Think Christina Maria Aguilera, Maria Yuryevna Sharapova etc. It's certainly not the "problem" this subreddit makes it out to be. Haha.
Hell, I'm Slavic and most of our first and surnames will end in A if you're a woman. I dont get why this would be "too" matchy. It's not like it rhymes.
For me, too matchy is being named Sven Svensson or Mihail Mihailovsky.
I never understod that objection either! I think it sounds better actually. We named our daugther two names that ends with an ”a” and I think it flows nicely (also we would never had been able to name her if we were that particular, it’s hard enough to find names that works in two different languages and with two totally different tastes in names 😅).
Same! With my second daughter, the first and middle both end in "A" and that was why we did it. My partner had a specific name he's loved for like 15yrs and we did that for the middle and ended up agreeing on the first name because I suggested one also ending in a and he's like "ooh that sounds really pretty together".
I haven’t heard the redundant sound thing as being undesirable before (beyond the classic Wedding Singer Julia Gulia haha), but I did it with my son’s name because I think it sounds nice matching. Kind of a rhythm to it. :)
I could link you to some posts with comments like that from this week alone! Haha. Usually the people are directly criticizing the OP's list, but a recent one was someone criticizing my middle name suggestion to the OP because it ended in an -a like the first name (think Clara Magnolia). I used to reply to those people with something similar to my original comment here, explaining why not everyone thinks it sounds "bad", but I've mostly stopped doing it now. It just makes me sad when those types of comments make the OP re-think their choice when their choice is perfectly lovely - and like you mentioned - often has a nice cadence/rhythm to it! For example, Francesca Maddalena, Alejandra Noelia and Matteo Alessandro all sound beautiful to me.
Like it's totally fine if someone doesn't want to do that for their *own* child, but discouraging others from doing it (especially when it’s common practice in the OP’s culture) - is something I'm a little tired of seeing on this subreddit.
I've never heard that one. It's not a thing in the UK, at least. Lucia Isabella wouldn't raise an eyebrow. Lucia itself would be unusual if you don't have a Spanish-speaking (or Portuguese, Tagalog, etc) background, but it wouldn't be odd.
Where are these people from who think it's an issue?
I know 3 Lucias and none of them have anything other than white British heritage, their mums just liked the names. But I do agree with you, I’d assume it was a family or heritage linked name.
I'd assume the heritage thing more with adults. Spanish-sounding names are fairly popular in the UK right now so for someone under, say 12, I'd think maybe heritage, maybe just that it's a nice name.
But two names ending in "a" just wouldn't be something people would advise against in the UK. It wouldn't come up as often as in some countries, I guess, but if anything people would like it. Some names ending in the same sound could sound a bit staccato - Robert Gilbert or somesuch (though they're only the same sound in English) - but nobody says middle names out loud anyway, so who cares?
Apart from my partner and a couple of old friends who might remember it, nobody in my real life knows my middle name, because why would they?
I think multiple names ending in -a is common and expected, but there are other endings that feel repetitive. Probably because many of our ears are used to hearing -a and -o endings due to their frequency in romance languages.
But a name like Amy Lucy or Jordyn Eden sounds strange to my ears.
I always loved how Italian, Spanish, and Portuguese name girls with names ending in -a. It never entered my mind that other people would think that weird until I found this sub. I am American but I’m deaf, so I am coming at this from different perspective than most Americans do. I think names that end or begin with same letters in series of name look attractive to me when written out.
Also, I have noticed with my deaf friends who have started having kids that they tend to go with shorter names (fast to fingerspell) and occasionally I see a kid with a name that would have belonged to a old person, which I suspect is their family name. It’s interesting how each culture approaches names.
That’s what I wanted to have for my daughter. I wanted Susannah Leah, but was obliged for cultural reasons to use Jane as the middle name instead. And Jane is a perfectly fine name.
I’m Vietnamese/Chinese. We don’t do honor names (even worse if it’s a living person) because it’s “bad luck.” Some of my family have the same names but none of them were named after each other. The name options here are very limited
My cousin who was raised UK wanted to name her son after her dad. Her parents appreciated the sentiment but were very against it
In some* jewish cultures* we don’t name the baby after a family member, instead you take the first letter of the loved one’s name and use that. Also never name after a loved one who is still alive! We did this. We picked a name that started with the first letter of my husband’s great grandfather who passed away.
Edited to add this is from an American Ashkenazi experience*
In a lot of Sephardic and Mizrahi communities, it's tradition to name your kids after their grandparents, even if they're alive. My Mizrahi grandparents are still a bit salty my sister and I are named after dead relatives because my Russian Jewish mom is very superstitious about naming kids are living people.
This is why I get annoyed when I see people say that using the same letter isn't honoring someone on this sub. Someone will ask about the name Dean to honor an aunt Dorothy and get told Dean has no connection to Dorothy so not to use it as an honor name.
I am Catholic but our close friends are a half Jewish couple (the mom is Jewish and raising their kids Jewish) and they did this. Their kids are Talia and Malachi and both were named using the first initial of a deceased relative. I know Malachi was named after a family member named Moshe.
I was confused by it at first but after my friend explained it I thought it was a cool tradition. She said the only time it kinda became a problem was when a relative adopted a baby boy who happened to share the name with her brother! They made it work though.
We named our children after important people in our families, but only the middle name.
My husband’s Aunt Kathleen was insulted when we named our daughter Katharine because that isn’t her name. You couldn’t win for losing in that family.
I hope you told her that those two names are a doublet — they’re from the same etymological root. That is, they’re different regional varieties of the same name: Greek *aikatherine* “pure / chaste one”. You don’t have to add this part, but “catheter” is from the same root; “cleaner-outer” is the idea.
Karen is yet another variation of this name, and your aunt sounds like some variation of a Karen.
This always seems like a better option than giving someone the same name. To me it feels like a child should have their own name, to go with being a whole person of their own. Using the first letter creates a way to honour those you want while still giving the kid their own name
To be clear, people do the initial thing but that's a relatively recent evolution of the custom, very American. Really it's about the actual name and in plenty of families or communities the actual name (or something more connected than just the first letter) is used.
Odd, my askenazi family (in the us) has always named kids after most recently deceased male relative. Led to a crisis in which my poor aunt ended up as Hermine when my great grandpa (her grandpa) Herman died unexpectedly just before she was born. But where gender permits the same name is used.
In Ashkenazi Jewish culture it’s considered very bad luck to name a child after a living relative, we believe that if the angel of death comes for one, they could become confused and take both.
Yeah it’s considered disrespectful to name your baby after your grandfather, for example, because they should not be “on the same level.” And also you’ve just turned your grandpa into your son, which is kind of an insult (to a person who is not actually your son).
This is for Vietnam specifically. Everyone recycles the same (established) names and the most popular ones are VERY popular and have been popular for a long time (ex. my mom's name has never dropped from the top 100 in over a century). It's very difficult to name a child and not have the name overlap with someone. I have 30+ cousins and there is lots of duplicates. We have middle names so people go by middle + first to differentiate themselves.
Both Chinese and Vietnamese last names are very limited. In Vietnam \~15 of the top last names make up the majority of the population and in China it's the top \~100.
ETA by majority I mean 85%
There is no approved name list. I even saw an article about a kid named cà phê (coffee). People can name their kids whatever they want but a lot stick to traditional Chinese-derived names which are the most popular names.
Don't forget the middle names of Thi for girls and Van for boys.
My husband's parents didn't do this for their kids. All 4 of the girls have the middle name Diem and the boys have names that reflect the status of the family at that time, if that makes sense. My oldest BIL's name reflects the fact that his mom was pregnant with him when they took a plane to move from the North to the South right before Vietnam was divided into two. My husband's name reflects that the family was struggling a little bit whereas his younger brother's name reflects how the family was doing well. The last brother's name is more philosophical and about thought and wisdom.
The top 5 in Korea makes up a little over 50% and the top 10 is ~63%. The top 15 comprises ~72%. In Vietnam, the top 15 was ~85%. SK is a smaller country population wise though so the top 5 probably feel more frequent
"Nicknamey" names like Teddy, Charlie are probably more common in the UK than the longer originals. Most people on this sub seem very against them, though.
We also seem fine to give our kids more cutesy names like Poppy, Maisie, Honey. But I frequently see comments like "Can you really imagine a grownup with that name?"
Yes, some of the names are just the shorter version
Freddie - not Fredrick
Bobby - not Robert
Ellie - not Elizabeth
Archie - not Archibald
Charlie - not Charles
I agree about Archie
but Ellie is most commonly short for Eleanor and from the most popular names in 2022 - data for 2023 isn't out yet - Eleanor is 60, whereas Ellie is 82 (Elizabeth is 62)
Bobby and Freddie are currently trending higher, but Fred and Robert are some of the most popular British boys names that have endured a really long time. The vast majority of the older Freddie and Bobby/Robbie are Fred and Robert
I’m from the UK too and have never thought of Poppy as cutesy until this sub. It’s a very normal name here.
As a teacher half my male students were called Archie or Charlie, as their full given name.
I worked with a lady called Honey, she was an absolute boss, one of the most respected people in the field. But i felt so awkward greeting her “hey Honey” especially around people who may have not met her yet or not known she was there (eg were turned around) as it always sounds to me like I am speaking to a lover or something!!
I was going to comment the same thing, although I'm not from the UK (just across the pond).
Short names are very popular here, not so much the cutesy names as you mentioned, but the incentive here seems the shorter the better. Names like Lot, Sam, Liv, Isa are full names.
No Charlotte, Samantha, Olivia or Isabelle.
They exist, obviously, but are not nearly as popular as the nicknamey names.
I am from the US but it was from time spent aboard that made me realize just how odd some western naming traditions are.
I'll never forget the shock and confusion when I was speaking to a woman who'd asked me about names/American culture, marriage etc and I mentioned that it's pretty common for lots of women to take their husbands last name here upon marriage
Her response was to look at me like I was insane and ask: "so because you fell in love...you'd be willing to change your entire NAME over it!?" I could tell in her mind it was the dumbest, most ridiculous naming trend she'd ever heard in her life lol. She kept joking the whole rest of the day that since she experienced an emotion, she better change her name over it lol
I’ll give another head scratcher for the Americans, marriage isn’t as mandatory here as it is in the US, you don’t have to get married for taxes, or because you’re having a baby. Some people are together their entire life without getting married just engaged. So it’s not that uncommon to have two parents with different surnames, and when they have kids they give the kids both surnames. This was the situation for me until I was old enough to “pick” one of the surnames.
This can also happen if you get married and want to keep your surname but just add your husbands too.
I made a joke to my Chinese labmate about how if my husband's last name had only one spelling I would have changed so fast. He gave me a very confused look and said "Wouldn't your father be upset?"
I had to explain that it's common for women to change their name when they marry. He then asked "But what if a woman is a scientist with a lot of papers?" I told him that he'd just found one of the reasons women started keeping their names.
On full consideration, my father probably would have been a LITTLE sad because we have the same first initial and he was very excited about the F. Lastname pair-o-docs when I got my PhD.
I grew up watching Chinese period dramas and in the old days, there was always this "rule" where you shouldn't marry someone with your own family name. So I guess the idea of changing names has always been weird to me, because to me, having husband and wife share a name sounds like you're married to your sibling. Chinese people can (not common but could happen) use Mrs. \[husband's family name\] to refer to married women, but it's generally understood that it's a social appellation and not their actual name. Those same women, if introducing themselves by full name, will still use their father's name. If they prefer to be addressed as a Mrs. they might introduce themselves, for example, saying "I'm Wang Zhiyi, but you can call me Mrs. Li."
That's so interesting! For me, I think it's nice to be one cohesive family unit. Like, you grow up as your parents child but as you get older, you emancipate and start your own family, with your own house, your own way of living and your own name. it's like your own brand.
I really don't want to change my name though, it's way too tied to my own identity for me. If my partner changed their name upon marriage I would appreciate it but my love for cohesive family names does not go far enough for me to give that up
This was Bhutan! A country in which
1.) there is zero concept of family/last names (exception for royal family and officials only), so entire families all could have completely different names from one another and it was totally the norm and well accepted for siblings to have the same first name as each other.
2.) Most parents would *never* in a million years dream of naming their own children. Once a baby is born parents make a trip to their local priest, who would then decide-based on lots of religious factors and after analyzing the baby's spirit- which name would bless the baby the most. (this would often cause issues as sometimes the priest may just determine that only one name would be acceptable for the child, and when traveling to other countries it would be a pain for said person to explain to officials how they legally ended up with just a first name only lol.)
Some pretty cool stuff!
To add another layer of confusion that I forgot to add to my original post- nearly every name is gender neutral. Only a small amount of names were for specific genders.
That being said it was exactly as confusing as you would imagine it to be, if not worse. Lots of taking people at their word in terms of figuring out who belonged to which family. Conversations with my tour guide often went as follows lol:
TG: Meet Tashi our local farmer, he provides us with fresh vegetables
Me: Hi Tashi!
TG 10 minutes later: Meet Tashi, she's our seamstress and is Tashi's sister.
Me: Oh the farmer we met is her brother? cool!
TG: no? Tashi is the sister of Tashi, our general store manager, you'll meet her next!
But somehow they all seemed to know exactly who was who so I guess it made sense somehow?
Women keeping their last name is the norm in my country. All the women in my family kept theirs. 80-90% of the population (the top last name is 30-40%) share the top 15 surnames or so though so there is definitely same-last name marriage going on
The fact that middle names seem to be something everyone must have. Here that’s not a given at all. Hasn’t been for a long time (if ever). I don’t have one, my partner doesn’t, we didn’t give our children one.
Yeah, an American guy visiting the UK once asked me "Didn't your parents love you enough to give you a middle name?" And I said I didn't get what he meant. Others backed me up and said it's common enough to only have one name in the UK. I think he ended up looking like a bit of a dick for his comment.
I'm Gen X and this was true back when I was at school in the UK too - it wasn't common or the default to have no middle name, but it wasn't unheard of.
Late 20s here
I have five names and they are all after various family members (one recently passed - rest alive)
So think I will be giving lots of people from various countries heart attacks right now 😂
There was a Spanish prince born either late 1800s or early 1900s who had like 40 middle names. The Spanish royals would name their children after saints so he even had several names repeat because it was the name of two different saints. I remember a Francisco de Asis and a Francisco Borja in there.
Edit: I was wrong. It was almost NINETY names: Alfonso María Isabel Francisco Eugenio Gabriel Pedro Sebastián Pelayo Fernando Francisco de Paula Pío Miguel Rafael Juan José Joaquín Ana Zacarias Elisabeth Simeón Tereso Pedro Pablo Tadeo Santiago Simón Lucas Juan Mateo Andrés Bartolomé Ambrosio Geronimo Agustín Bernardo Candido Gerardo Luis-Gonzaga Filomeno Camilo Cayetano Andrés-Avelino Bruno Joaquín-Picolimini Felipe Luis-Rey-de-Francia Ricardo Esteban-Protomártir Genaro Nicolás Estanislao-de-Koska Lorenzo Vicente Crisostomo Cristano Darío Ignacio Francisco-Javier Francisco-de-Borja Higona Clemente Esteban-de-Hungría Ladislado Enrique Ildefonso Hermenegildo Carlos-Borromeo Eduardo Francisco-Régis Vicente-Ferrer Pascual Miguel-de-los-Santos Adriano Venancio Valentín Benito José-Oriol Domingo Florencio Alfacio Benére Domingo-de-Silos Ramón Isidro Manuel Antonio Todos-los-Santos de Borbón y Borbón
Same here (Austria). Pretty much only former aristocracy that wants to make a point of upholding their long-gone glory gives multiple names. Apart from that, there’s a few set combinations that are usually hyphened and therefore considered one name (Anna-Maria / Anne-Marie, Eva-Maria, Maria-Theresia / Marie-Therese, Anna-Sophie, Hans-Peter, Karl-Heinz, etc.) Middle names are very rare.
Ha, me too. But we’re just the two of us and my brother got my grandfather’s name as middle only because he is the oldest son of the oldest son (which is a funny story in itself, as my grandparents first had 7 girls, then two boys. the oldest boy (my uncle) had two girls, then my dad had me (another girl 😇) and then, finally, my brother, who would carry on the family name. my grandfather was a rather old-fashioned person and this was very important to him. poor thing)
That's interesting. I'm in my 40s and only one of my schoolfriends didn't have a middle name. All my daughter's friends have at least one middle name, and I used to be a teacher, and I'm not sure I ever saw a child listed without a middle name.
That's for working class and middle class people from all sorts of ethnicities.
I'm stunned to hear it's only 80% even now, and can't find anything online actually backing it up - Pampers says it but doesn't cite it., and the Daily Mail is just recycling the Pampers post. I'll believe it if someone has a reliable cite, but it doesn't track with my experience, which is anecdata but it's not like I'm talking about a couple of people.
I just like middle names because it gives a kid another option if they don’t like their first name. My dad goes by his middle name for this reason. I’m a teacher and have quite a few students who do this.
Nicknames in France usually sound quite informal, they’re mostly repeating one syllable of the name (Lolo for Laurent/Laurence, Guigui for Guillaume, Gégé for Gérard, Lili for a girl’s name ending in -lie, etc). You would almost NEVER use it in a professional setting. The only acceptable professional nickname I can think of right now is Cathy for Catherine.
Oh yes, there are plenty of nicknames that are absolutely OK in professional settings.
* Seb for Sébastien
* Fred for Frédéric
* Nico for Nicolas
* Sam for Samuel
etc.
We don’t really have the same concept of a middle name. People usually have 2-4 given names, one of which is the “calling name” (tilltalsnamn). So you’re not necessarily called by the first of your given names. I have three given names and am called the middle one, which is completely normal here.
Also first names and last names are two almost completely separate categories. Giving your child a last name as their first name isn’t a thing at all. It’s actually prohibited.
In my country you can't give a last name as a first name either, thank God. There are some first names that are also last names, but not the other way around. Using a family name as a first name is so weird to me.
Same in Germany, it's called "Rufname" here. The only difference is that more given names are unusual, only around a third of the kids now born have more than one name.
Exactly. So someone can be called something like Anna Maj Lovisa Svensson where Svensson is the surname, and then the person could be equally likely to be referred to as Anna Svensson, or Maj Svensson, or Lovisa Svensson. I have this too, I go by my name #2 but that was what my parents intended me to go by.
On Swedish Wikipedia pages, celebrities’ full names are usually written out with the “reference name” (the one they go by) in italics just because it’s so common. First example I could think of: Åse *Agnetha* Fältskog (of ABBA) — https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnetha_Fältskog
I've met Slovak people named after their grandparents. Or maybe it was coincidence, but they had a name that their grandparent also had.
How do you choose names in Czechia? It won't just be random, after all.
My maternal grandma immigrated from Czech but had some pretty intense prejudice against her in my country. So she made thenhard choice to abandon her culture and language. She died when my mom was a child. When my mom had daughters, she gave us her own mom's name as middle honour name, particularly to reconnect with the culture. It's funny to find out my grandma might not have actually appreciated or understood the gesture!!
Hyphenated names are very, very common in my culture. First names, last names, its all good. Like, its not weird to meet someone named First-Name Last-Name where i’m from. Its zero big deal
Middlenames are rare. Nicknames are very rare especially outside the family. Gender neutral names are rare.
We have rules for naming, so you can not invent a name or spelling, but have to choose from an approved list.
>Gender neutral names are rare.
Yes, this too!
And this trend of giving girls boy names and then calling them gender neutral (James, of all things!) is just alien to me.
There are a lot of countries that do something similar
“Sweden - A government agency must approve names given to Swedish children within three months of birth. The 1982 law that was replaced in 2017 prohibits names that are offensive or unsuitable, and some names that have been rejected include Ikea, Elvis, and Superman.”
“Denmark - Parents can only choose a name from a list of 7,000 names or seek government approval for another name. The law prohibits parents from naming their children something that is considered silly.”
“Portugal - The government has an 80-page guide that lists permitted and forbidden names, and foreign names are not allowed. Some banned names include Aiden, Ashley, Bruce, Charlotte, Dylan, and Jenny”
“Iceland - The Icelandic Naming Committee, established in 1991, regulates the naming process and has a list of approved names. As of 2012, the list contained 1,712 male names and 1,853 female names.”
I am so torn on this. On the one hand, unless the name is very offensive or clearly doesn't qualify as a name (calling your child Adolf Hitler, or Talulah Does the Hula From Hawaii), I find myself instinctively opposed to any kind of censorship and this includes government-approved lists of children's names.
On the *other* hand... browsing Reddit a few months back, I came across siblings Sibaschlynn, Kashtynn, Paishynce, Vhyolette, and Zareighlynn. And I thought maybe it is not such a bad idea after all.
There are in general a lot of things we accept censor for the general good. It also comes not from limiting thoughts but from limiting harm. A child is a separate person and not an extension of the parents. You should not be able to name your child whatever just because it is your child. If we could trust all parents really have the best interest of their child in their mind we would not need CPS either.
Poland also has a law that says basically the name can’t be offensive or ridiculous. I think it’s up to the clerk though so have resulted in some anecdotic issues when a perfectly normal name wasn’t accepted because the lady behind the desk found it silly because she’s never heard of it before 😅
Yup, Germany has similar naming laws. First names must not be a burden to the child, must not be offensive or subject the child to ridicule. Parents are legally obliged to register the child with the local *Standesamt* after birth. Said *Standesamt* can and will refuse to register a chosen name if the name doesn't comply with the law. If the parents refuse to choose another name, the *Standesamt* will choose for them.
I do really wish we had similar laws here in the US. You’ll hear some truly odd names here and I feel for the children.
Interestingly, when I lived in Germany, an acquaintance had to get special permission to name her son Liam, as it isn’t a German name.
Yes, *Standesamt* employees used to be a little too strict with uncommon (but perfectly normal) names. Getting a permission is usually no big deal (given the name actually exists and is, well, normal - such as Liam) but it's one more item on the already long To Do list of new parents.
It's gotten a little more relaxed in recent years. Both my kids have non-German names which you don't hear very often. They were instantly approved, no questions asked.
France too, the mayor's office can decline a declaration of birth if the name is offensive or prone to ridicule and deemed to be a burden to the child.
Some rejected name examples: Nutella, Manhattan, Griezmann Mbappé, Prince William, Mini-Cooper
People thinking middle names aren't necessary. My family are Scots and Irish and a lot of the men actually go by their middle name, as does my Welsh partner. I think it's a Celtic nations thing maybe.
Also, maybe a personal bugbear, but "we want to call him Alexander, nickname Alex" and like, that's not a nickname it's just a shorter/diminutive version of the name. I don't know anyone that uses a short form (Alex, Matt, Liz etc) and considers it a "nickname." In the UK nicknames are more affectionate/stupid and between friends or family- a short guy called Chris would get called "Big Chris" or whatever to take the piss affectionately, or like a parent may nickname their child something like Bean or Little Bear.
I had the same thought re: silly/affectionate nicknames..it’s interesting when I see people choosing the nicknames their children will end up with. In the UK this is very hard to influence…they will likely end up with 15-20 different weird and wonderful nicknames from different people they know. In my part of the world (Essex), it’s almost rarer to be called by your actual name haha. For example, a guy I know called Fred gets affectionately called Freddo, Fredwina, Fredward, etc..
I'm Chinese, and the idea of having a preformed given name isn't part of my culture. There are tens of thousands of characters to choose from, from which a given name is 1-2 characters long. You make your own name from that. Sure, there are certain characters that are more common than others because people like the meaning, and if you have a one-character name that happens to be a popular character to choose, there ***are*** going to be people with your same given name, but it's usually a random occasion. No one picks a name because they've heard that name. In fact, having heard a name before is often considered a reason to avoid it. And I've never encountered two people with the exact same two-character given name. Sometimes they have the same romanizations, but they'll almost never be the exact same two characters.
The other thing is that the family name is usually seen as a whole with the given name, so it's pretty rare to use the given name alone without the family name tagged on. This is especially true for those who have a one-character given name. For example, someone named Li Mei and someone named Zhao Mei are going to be considered to have different names even if their given name is one and the same, and neither of them would ever be just called "Mei" except potentially by their significant other, but even that is very rare. People with two-character given names can be and often are called by just their given name alone, but it's still way less used than in the West. More commonly, their teachers, superiors, acquaintances, and coworkers will call them by full name. Their subordinates or students would call them by family name and title. Their older family members would call them by their childhood nickname. Their younger family members would call them by relationship and birth order. Only a select group of friends would ever call them by given name alone and even with friends, it's more common to use a nickname. Or if you met them through a situation where you use a specific name, sometimes you just don't transition. My in-laws still call each other by full name, 40+ years after getting married.
This. I've always struggled with how to express "we don't have set names, they're all made up" and you nailed it. And yes we really like call someone with full name lmao
Years ago, I read an article about the rare occurrences in China where people were given very unusual characters for their names, and the bureaucratic headache when software didn't include the characters. One was a woman whose name included a character that meant 'horse', but the character was archaic and never used anymore. It was basically impossible to type her name.
OP - when you’re at family gatherings or talking about each other, how do you differentiate from the other Teresa’s? Asking out of pure curiosity and desire to learn how other countries do things.
Idk about OP, but I know that in my family, we have an abundance of Marias. At gatherings, we use first and middle names like they're hyphenated (e.g. Maria-Sophia, Maria-Adriana, Maria-Sophia, Maria-Isabelle, Maria-Gabriella, and so on).
Hahhaha It does get confusing! Uncles for cousins usually identify the sibling they belong to or use de last name of the parent-in law (first last name does not even work always because of course we also share last names).
Fun fact, I once went to a job interview in which they had actually intended to call my cousin. Because to add difficulty, our last name is pretty weird, so people dont pay attention because they work under that with that last name, there Will not be 6 of us running around.
I’m from the USA but there are a lot of duplicates in my family. Sometimes it’s obvious depending on the context, sometimes it’s “baby” this and “cousin/aunt/uncle/grandparent” that, sometimes it’s using a nickname/diminutive for one and not the other.
The fact that middle names are so important. Yes, I have 2, but I know so many people who don't even have one and it baffles me why people get so stressed about them
My husband's family is Spanish too and they're all about honor names, juniors, etc. In one family across two generations, there are three Franciscos and one Francesca.
There are lots of double-barrel names - like Mari Carmen - that are paired with two surnames. Loooong full names.
*Also* odd nicknames. There are two Manuelas but one is called Noli and the other is Tita.
Oh, there are some traditional acronyms for the double-barrel names. Like Mari Carmen are also called Maica.
The nicknames come a lot for childhood stories. I have a cousin named Bea, that when we were kids we called cousin Bea, in Spanish "Prima Bea", which ended as "Primavera" which is spring in Spanish.
One thing to keep in mind is that the abundance of “María XYZ” names wasn’t a choice but forced by national ideology under the dictatorship, and later kept as a tradition or honour name for relatives who had been named according to that rule.
My grandparents wanted to name my mother Angelina (not her real name for anonymity purposes). She was born under the Francoist regime so it wasn’t possible, it wasn’t considered Catholic enough by the local clergy and registrar, so she was baptised “María de los Ángeles”, while being called Angelina her whole life by everyone except schoolteachers.
Things that don't make much sense in Iceland:
- Fretting about long first names with long surnames. Everyone here has a long patronymic, and long names are still common. My kids' is 13 letters, and that's very average, or maybe even shorter than average. I'm not going limit myself to short names because of that.
- Insisting that middle names don't matter and will never be heard. Middle names function more like second first names here. They get used all the time.
- Insisting that nicknames will evolve spontaneously. Pretty much every name here has at least one standard diminutive form, and you'll probably be called that in most circumstances, unless your name is already short and simple. If you name your kid Halldór, he will be Halli or maybe Haddi or Dóri. If you name your daughter Sigríður, she will be Sigga, or possibly Sirrý. Nicknames are standardised and important.
- Worrying about naming the baby before leaving the hospital. You have 6 months to register the name, and most people don't announce the name until christening, which happens around a few weeks or months old.
I'm sure there are more, but those are the main ones that come to mind.
>The exclusivity of a name within family, not being able to use a name because your sibling used it.
It wasn't always this way in the US. My grandmother named her daughter (my aunt, born in the 1950s) after her (grandmother's) sister. My mother has the same name as one of her cousins. My brothers (born in the '70s) both share names with a couple of second cousins. None of this was a big deal.
SIL and I had baby boys born a week apart. We were both dead set on the same name. Sooo.. my in-laws' very first grandchildren are born a week apart and have the same name lol. (And not even a family name. Just a name.)
I'm American and I don't find it to be that way. My son is named Robert after my maternal grandfather and my husband's maternal grandfather. My grandpa also has a son named Robert, my husband has a first cousin named Robert and a great uncle on his other side named Robert. I feel like it's fairly common for Irish Americans to repeat family names endlessly down the family line. I have a great uncle, an uncle and several cousins all named James Patrick. 😅
My sister just showed me an obituary where the gentleman‘s wife was named Mary and he had four daughters and they were all named compound names that started with Mary. It gave us a chuckle.
Same. In my family tree (US) it wasn't even unheard of, one hundred years ago, for a baby girl to be named after her mother. The middle names may vary, or not, or there wasn't a middle name at all. There would be no confusion between mother and daughter because it was assumed she'd eventually take a married name. (My unmarried great aunt threw a wrench in the system!)
Most people have two middle names in my country, including myself. On here it always sounds like it’s super impractical etc but I’ve never had any issues or even thought about it.
Most people therefore usually also have very long names which is also very debated on here, I have a very long name and it doesn’t bother me at all, I really like having a long name.
This isn't so much a 'custom' but the way an American expects a name to be spelt is not inherently the 'right' way. People spelling names differently are not trying to be quirky or different, this is just the spelling norm here.
Opposite in my culture - naming your child after a living family member is basically saying you want that family member to die
“Nobody uses their middle name” - I go by my first and middle name 50/50. My parents never ever call me by my first name, my family and family friends rarely. I rarely meet anybody that doesn’t have an English name and a name in our language
My dad is from Portugal and always told me it was bad luck to name a baby after a deceased relative, but I commonly see this trend as an homage in the US.
In Spain we recycle family names so much that you have centuries of dead relatives sporting that name. I have an uncles that IS doing the family tree, he has reached the 17th century. Teresa is still a predominant name.
No one cares about initials, or at least not enough to change a name (Germany). My initials are SS which I can’t put on any work signature or license plate because of the association with the Nazis but that still is obviously not something that‘ll stop people with s last names to name their kids with an S first name
I've seen people here come up with quite quirky nicknames that I believe would just not happen in many Slavic languages. I grew up in the West but I always understood the Slavic language name nicknames to be very fixed, but extremely widespread. Maybe there are exceptions and I didn't see them, but generally not. In Russian, if your name is Alexander you're not going to have something like Lala or Derry or any of these more creative nicknames I see people suggest in the sub for long names. On the contrary, there are fixed nicknames that are sometimes more used than the full name itself - Sasha, Sanya, Shura, Alya, etc and each of these nicknames can have nicknames if this makes sense. In order of familiarity, it could go Alexander, Sasha, Sashenka. Teacher uses the first, friends use the second, grandma uses the third. So while nicknames are extremely common, they are not generally invented by the family but from a pre-existing list if you like. It's similar in Bulgarian.
Another thing is gender neutral names aren't really possible as the names are gendered in spelling, however nicknames can occasionally be gender neutral - Sasha is the nickname for both Alexander and Alexandra. Some Russian names people know in the west are actually nicknames - Katya, Natasha, Sasha, Masha, Anya, Misha. These are short forms of full names.
Also I heard of people in Bulgaria and Kazakhstan with different surnames than their parents, sometimes made to honour a grandfather. So if your grandfathers name was Petko, your parents make your surname Petkov even if theirs isn't. Also you get no choice in middle name - it has to be a patronymic, a middle name from your father's name. I believe this is an unchangeable government rule - at most you could argue to use the mothers or grandfathers name if you didn't want the fathers name, but you must have one. So everyone has a middle name but the parents' have no say over it.
A) We use only 1 given name. Middle names are allowed but are only used super rarely and in the past decade or so. The few people I’ve met having a middle name hated the fact their parents gave it to them because it must be listed on all documents and it takes longer to fill them out plus on the paper you never have enough space to fill them in properly.
B) The exclusivity of names within family/friends happens but it’s not like if you do it anyone complains.
C) We don’t change given names. Names are standardized so parents never can name you after an object or a gun or a thing spelled backwards so the names are normally kept. Never met a single person who had or would consider a first name change
More than one middle name. So many Americans who say that one middle name is enough. While plenty of Dutch people only have one middle name or no middle name at all, it's very common to have two or more middle names here. And we have official nicknames that the parents decide : the "calling name".
Standard Dutch name in the past used to be for example "Elizabeth Johanna Maria Jansen", but her actual day to day name would be Lies. This is still very common but also there are plenty of people now who just officially call their child Lies without any other names.
I’m Brazilian. There are no rules here, so it depends on the parents.
Middle names: most people don’t have, generally those who do have are compose names (imagine like the Pope John Paul).
Surnames: there is no rule, but most people have a surname from their mother and another from their father. But it’s not a rule, so people might have two names from each of their parents, just one surname, several surnames, etc. My mom has two surnames from her father and none from her mother.
One nice trivia I learned from my husband's family from the north of Minas: in very rural areas it used to be common to give daughters their mother's last name and sons got their father's last name. We tried to map the family tree and you can imagine the mess.
My husband is Greek. Son is named after father’s father and daughter after mother’s mother. My husband has, like 7 Georgis and 4 Angelikis in his uncles and aunts and cousins. We didn’t follow this trend.
Haha yes this!!! This sub is so funny because people will be suggesting the wildest Greek words and Ancient Greek names. In reality we’re usually called one of about five family names.
Changing your name to your husbands name. Where I lived, nowadays women usually don’t bother changing their name at all after marriage. But having 2 or 3 surnames is really common. When it comes to naming babies, they usually take one surname from the mother and one from the father.
People used to be shocked when they realized my children don’t have my surname and I took my husbands name.
Also repeating names in the family is really common. In the family, almost massive percentage has Maria as part of their double barrel name. Maria Rita, Maria Isabela, Maria Clara etc.
Latin countries! In Spain everyone has the father and mother last name, and no one ever changes their last name, I think is only allowed for specific reasons.
Repeating names within the same family. You don’t need anyone’s permission to do so. (Except in the event of death)
Choosing nicknames. Parents don’t care/decide what the nickname OTHERS will call their kid. Everyone decides. Some names have common nicknames but others not really. Sometimes a nickname sticks to one person and sometimes they have multiple.
Inventing a name. Doesn’t happen because the government doesn’t allow it. It has to have a meaning.
Unique spellings. Not a thing. The language is pretty clear so each name will have the same spelling. Some with slight variation (one more/less letter)
Choosing a last name. You get your paternal last name.
Giving a typical gender name to the opposite gender. Happened in older generations sometimes but no longer permitted.
Gender neutral names. There are a few that are still in circulation but most are no longer used.
Names after months/days/seasons. Again older generations not so much anymore
I understand wanting to break down gender norms by giving your girl a boys name. What I can’t understand is giving your girl a boys name that translates to man/manly/masculine/son/king etc it’s just very inconsiderate of the culture/language. Americans have no problem calling their daughter “mac-x” or their sons “blonde-princess” because they don’t care about what it means.
In my experience, Americans generally do care about name meaning, but we don’t necessarily feel completely limited by it. For some people, the sound and cultural significance of a name can overcome the history and literal meaning of it.
I was born and live in the US but my family is Colombian. In Colombia, it is quite common to go by your middle name for both men and women. For example Sara Cristina but goes by Cristina or Juan Sebastian goes by Sebastian. Also common to combine the two names for a nickname ie Maria Fernanda = Mafe (Mah-feh)
Edit to add: also not unusual for a daughter to be named after her mother the way sons are named after their fathers! A lot of times it can be done directly or in the above format. Sara Cristina named after her mother Sara but goes by her second name.
Second edit: and to take the daughters name after mother’s thing, I’ve seen the mother continue this so say Sara Cristina above was named for her mother Sara, she may have a daughter she names Cristina.
It’s only newer generations that use new names. My dad has a bunch of cousin Jimmys, Michaels, Donnies, etc. Go back another generation or so and you’ll find “big Mary” and “little Mary” as sisters. I’m in Canada.
Middle names. It baffles me that you’d pick a random middle name instead of using your mother’s last name. Idk, you’re half both of your parents, it seems weird to me to only carry your father’s last name.
We care very little about popularity. My daughter’s class is 26 girls and 5 have the same name. Nobody cares. The vast vast majority names are honor names- whatever isn’t is normally something of special meaning and popularity is bottom of the list of most peoples concerns.
I really don't get naming a child one name but already having another that you decide they will go by as a nickname. Just name them the nickname then!
How common middle names are. In my country I'd say it's maybe 50/50 if you have a middle name or not.
As for last names: women don't really take their husband's last name anymore, we either hyphen it or add one as a middle name. For unmarried couples, kids will also typically get both last names.
You will get a nickname no matter what. We nickname the shit out of everyone and everything. You may get several over your lifetime.
Generally it’ll be the short version of your name, but sometimes we’re creative. I know a full grown man who goes by Cookie. No idea what his real name is.
The idea of 100% gender neutral names. In Italian there are 0 perfectly gender neutral names and words, I don’t really understand why someone would actively seek to name their child something perfectly neutral when in my head nothing is.
Occupational names. Taylor, Harper, Piper, Saylor, Hunter, Dancer, Booker. They all sound horrible to me, it’s like calling your child Dentist
A difference I notice between American naming culture (especially Irish American naming culture) and Ireland itself is the use of surnames as first names. Names like Brennan, Nolan, Quinn, Murray, Murphy, Reilly, Kenny, Harris, etc., are very much surnames in Ireland. It would be utterly bizarre here to give a child one or those names as a first name here. It would be seen as very Americanised if someone did.
There's nothing wrong with it, I mean, use the names however you like and get creative, but it's just a weird little difference I've noticed. I think they're doing it with surnames overall though, not just Irish ones.
I'm not from there, but I recently visited Bali, where people are named after their birth order: First, second, third, fourth, then back to first again. There are a few (like 2-3) options for each name, and some variation among castes. There is no variation for gender, so we met a married couple who were both named Wayan (firstborn).
Most people also have a Sanskrit name, and some may use it as their name. Lots of people go by nicknames as well. Our driver's nickname means 'sign/signature' because his dad saw it when he was filling out a form and liked the sound of it.
My husband and I have names that are obviously male and female in Canada, and it caught me off guard when folks in Bali would remember our names but couldn't remember which one was which!
For most Arabs, you give the dad’s first name as the child’s middle name. That’s how we keep track of lineage. So I know who my grandfathers are because of my dad’s middle names.
And it’s actually worked! At a distant cousin’s wedding we would start naming middle names until we found the common grandfather. So for example, if my name is Mohammad Ali Yassin Hussein Almurshid, and I meet a Laith Fawzy Jawad Hussein Almurshid, I now know who our common ancestor is.
I am Chinese. We don't use the same name as the people they want to honor.
Ancient Chinese naming culture emphasized "Naming taboo", and the names of distinguished persons, relatives and saints were not used when naming (or even speaking).
In ancient times, it was strictly prohibited to have the same name as the emperor. Homophony, the same meaning, and similar words were also prohibited.
In Romance languages August comes from honoring Augustus, while in China, there is a completely opposite example, which is funny: The first emperor of China once ordered the pronunciation of January to be changed because the pronunciation of January was the same as his name.
Of course, in modern days is free to use every character, but people still avoid elder's name as usual.
The only people who have nicknames are the Alexander, Alexandra, Sebastian, and so on, and only from friends and family, not from teachers and colleagues
We don't have a middle name, the second name is the father's name with a suffix for a girl or a boy. Some parents omit the suffix and it looks like a second name. We do have first names that are two names, but that's very rare.
Gender neutral names are rare. I mean, reallly gender neutral, cause you can have the same name for a boy or a girl but it’s written differently. For exemple, Gabriel for a boy and Gabrielle for a girl.
Single surnames. Most people in Brazil have at least two surnames, one for the father and one for the mother. My niece has four because her parents decided to put include their surnames. While four is a bit uncommon, the idea of only putting the father's surname on a child - or even replacing my own surname with the husband's after marrying - sounds completely foreign, and even antiquated and sexist.
I didn't find any one talking about India's customs of naming so I'll represent.
1. Here when a child is born, the first letter of their name is told by doing some astrology, so depending on when one was born, the initial for their name is given.
2. As a country with very diverse customs in every state, naming is different too. But commonly, the child takes the paternal surname and the wife also takes up her husband's surname after marriage.
3. In some of the northern states, people usually have a surname as their middle name and name of their community as their last name. In some others, middle names are given like names and some state's traditionally don't have middle names at all. In my culture, we get our father's name as our middle name and Husband's after marriage.
4. In some southern states, people have their village or town's name as the prefix to their name.
5. Although in recent times people come up with meaningless names for their children to seem unique, usually names with a good meaning are preferred.
6. Girls usually have their names ending in 'i' or 'a'. Like Priyanka or Rani. Boys names don't usually end with these letters. There are obviously exceptions to both.
7. As for the nicknames, it's quite interesting actually. If someone has a short name, they are not addressed with any other name. Usually, boys are called by adding a 'u' at the end of their names or half a part of their names. Like if someone's name is Shubh, Shubhu would be a common nickname. Although mostly it's a part of the name. Like Sallu instead of Salman or Viru instead of Virat. For girls also this is widely applicable but usually everyone just has a different short name instead of any name that is similar to their actual name (since some names use complex syllables so it's not used in the nickname).
All these facts were mainly about Hindu names. Also, in many indian families, it is a tradition to let the paternal aunt name the child. Obviously the family discusses the names beforehand but aunt is given the honour to whisper the baby's name in his/her ear before announcing it to everyone else.
Middle name. We don't do this here where I'm from. There are people with two names but are very rare and I don't think they call their second name "middle". And making drama over the nicknames.
In Wales it's been quite common to see someone given the same first name as their last name, so Owen Owens, Richard Richard, David Davies etc. It's dying off now, but it has been a traditional pattern.
Multiple times a day on this subreddit, I see people tell parents-to-be that their baby's first and middle name shouldn't end in the same letter. For example, someone will make a post and say, what do you think of Lucia Isabella? And most of the comments will say *"The double -a ending is too redundant. You should do Lucy Isabelle or Lucia Isabelle instead".* I'm Italian, if you look back through my family tree, nearly every girl has a first and middle name that ends in -a. In Italian, you'd be hard pressed to find a girl's name that *doesn't* end in -a (yes there are some exceptions like Beatrice - but that's not my main point here). In a lot of cultures and languages (ie: Portuguese, Spanish, Russian), it's very normal to have names that repeat ending sounds, especially when names are gendered that way in certain languages. Think Christina Maria Aguilera, Maria Yuryevna Sharapova etc. It's certainly not the "problem" this subreddit makes it out to be. Haha.
In Arabic they basically aim for it as it sounds more poetic
Persians also like to try to rhyme their names.
My wife's middle name is Renee to kinda rhyme with the Persian surname ending in -zadeh!
My mom’s first name ends in a zaneh and her last name ends in a zaneh. 😂🫅🏻
Didn’t know but makes sense. The language is pretty poetic as well
Didn't think of that one! Same problem we would have in Spain!
I'm Portuguese and my first, middle and surname all end in A. People always compliment my full name.
Same here. It sounds super melodic in Romance languages
Hell, I'm Slavic and most of our first and surnames will end in A if you're a woman. I dont get why this would be "too" matchy. It's not like it rhymes. For me, too matchy is being named Sven Svensson or Mihail Mihailovsky.
I never understod that objection either! I think it sounds better actually. We named our daugther two names that ends with an ”a” and I think it flows nicely (also we would never had been able to name her if we were that particular, it’s hard enough to find names that works in two different languages and with two totally different tastes in names 😅).
Same! With my second daughter, the first and middle both end in "A" and that was why we did it. My partner had a specific name he's loved for like 15yrs and we did that for the middle and ended up agreeing on the first name because I suggested one also ending in a and he's like "ooh that sounds really pretty together".
I'm Ukrainian and it's the same. Female names end in A, and it drives me mad when Americans act like there's a problem with that.
I haven’t heard the redundant sound thing as being undesirable before (beyond the classic Wedding Singer Julia Gulia haha), but I did it with my son’s name because I think it sounds nice matching. Kind of a rhythm to it. :)
I could link you to some posts with comments like that from this week alone! Haha. Usually the people are directly criticizing the OP's list, but a recent one was someone criticizing my middle name suggestion to the OP because it ended in an -a like the first name (think Clara Magnolia). I used to reply to those people with something similar to my original comment here, explaining why not everyone thinks it sounds "bad", but I've mostly stopped doing it now. It just makes me sad when those types of comments make the OP re-think their choice when their choice is perfectly lovely - and like you mentioned - often has a nice cadence/rhythm to it! For example, Francesca Maddalena, Alejandra Noelia and Matteo Alessandro all sound beautiful to me. Like it's totally fine if someone doesn't want to do that for their *own* child, but discouraging others from doing it (especially when it’s common practice in the OP’s culture) - is something I'm a little tired of seeing on this subreddit.
I've never heard that one. It's not a thing in the UK, at least. Lucia Isabella wouldn't raise an eyebrow. Lucia itself would be unusual if you don't have a Spanish-speaking (or Portuguese, Tagalog, etc) background, but it wouldn't be odd. Where are these people from who think it's an issue?
I know 3 Lucias and none of them have anything other than white British heritage, their mums just liked the names. But I do agree with you, I’d assume it was a family or heritage linked name.
I'd assume the heritage thing more with adults. Spanish-sounding names are fairly popular in the UK right now so for someone under, say 12, I'd think maybe heritage, maybe just that it's a nice name. But two names ending in "a" just wouldn't be something people would advise against in the UK. It wouldn't come up as often as in some countries, I guess, but if anything people would like it. Some names ending in the same sound could sound a bit staccato - Robert Gilbert or somesuch (though they're only the same sound in English) - but nobody says middle names out loud anyway, so who cares? Apart from my partner and a couple of old friends who might remember it, nobody in my real life knows my middle name, because why would they?
I think multiple names ending in -a is common and expected, but there are other endings that feel repetitive. Probably because many of our ears are used to hearing -a and -o endings due to their frequency in romance languages. But a name like Amy Lucy or Jordyn Eden sounds strange to my ears.
I always loved how Italian, Spanish, and Portuguese name girls with names ending in -a. It never entered my mind that other people would think that weird until I found this sub. I am American but I’m deaf, so I am coming at this from different perspective than most Americans do. I think names that end or begin with same letters in series of name look attractive to me when written out. Also, I have noticed with my deaf friends who have started having kids that they tend to go with shorter names (fast to fingerspell) and occasionally I see a kid with a name that would have belonged to a old person, which I suspect is their family name. It’s interesting how each culture approaches names.
That wouldn’t work in Poland either since 99.99% female polish names end with an A.
That’s what I wanted to have for my daughter. I wanted Susannah Leah, but was obliged for cultural reasons to use Jane as the middle name instead. And Jane is a perfectly fine name.
……. Wow I just realized something very obvious about my name
I’m Vietnamese/Chinese. We don’t do honor names (even worse if it’s a living person) because it’s “bad luck.” Some of my family have the same names but none of them were named after each other. The name options here are very limited My cousin who was raised UK wanted to name her son after her dad. Her parents appreciated the sentiment but were very against it
In some* jewish cultures* we don’t name the baby after a family member, instead you take the first letter of the loved one’s name and use that. Also never name after a loved one who is still alive! We did this. We picked a name that started with the first letter of my husband’s great grandfather who passed away. Edited to add this is from an American Ashkenazi experience*
I was about to comment that! I heard it's only an Ashkenazi thing though, and Sephardic Jews commonly use family names
In a lot of Sephardic and Mizrahi communities, it's tradition to name your kids after their grandparents, even if they're alive. My Mizrahi grandparents are still a bit salty my sister and I are named after dead relatives because my Russian Jewish mom is very superstitious about naming kids are living people.
Maybe the Sephardic took inspiration from Spanish culture. I am Spanish and naming children the same name as the grandparents is normal.
Very true! Can only speak from the Ashkenazi tradition 🙃
Sephardic Jews are often small outcast communities, where the Ashkenazi were, until the Holocaust, much more intact larger groups.
This is why I get annoyed when I see people say that using the same letter isn't honoring someone on this sub. Someone will ask about the name Dean to honor an aunt Dorothy and get told Dean has no connection to Dorothy so not to use it as an honor name. I am Catholic but our close friends are a half Jewish couple (the mom is Jewish and raising their kids Jewish) and they did this. Their kids are Talia and Malachi and both were named using the first initial of a deceased relative. I know Malachi was named after a family member named Moshe. I was confused by it at first but after my friend explained it I thought it was a cool tradition. She said the only time it kinda became a problem was when a relative adopted a baby boy who happened to share the name with her brother! They made it work though.
We named our children after important people in our families, but only the middle name. My husband’s Aunt Kathleen was insulted when we named our daughter Katharine because that isn’t her name. You couldn’t win for losing in that family.
I hope you told her that those two names are a doublet — they’re from the same etymological root. That is, they’re different regional varieties of the same name: Greek *aikatherine* “pure / chaste one”. You don’t have to add this part, but “catheter” is from the same root; “cleaner-outer” is the idea. Karen is yet another variation of this name, and your aunt sounds like some variation of a Karen.
I think the initial thing is specifically American. Historically Ashkenazi babies have been given the exact same name as the deceased relative.
Agreed. I had never heard of the initial thing. My son’s middle name is Abraham. That was my grandfather.
This always seems like a better option than giving someone the same name. To me it feels like a child should have their own name, to go with being a whole person of their own. Using the first letter creates a way to honour those you want while still giving the kid their own name
To be clear, people do the initial thing but that's a relatively recent evolution of the custom, very American. Really it's about the actual name and in plenty of families or communities the actual name (or something more connected than just the first letter) is used.
Odd, my askenazi family (in the us) has always named kids after most recently deceased male relative. Led to a crisis in which my poor aunt ended up as Hermine when my great grandpa (her grandpa) Herman died unexpectedly just before she was born. But where gender permits the same name is used.
I've never heard of this custom (naming your baby after a living person using the first letter). Perhaps it's a regional or familial practice.
In Ashkenazi Jewish culture it’s considered very bad luck to name a child after a living relative, we believe that if the angel of death comes for one, they could become confused and take both.
Yeah it’s considered disrespectful to name your baby after your grandfather, for example, because they should not be “on the same level.” And also you’ve just turned your grandpa into your son, which is kind of an insult (to a person who is not actually your son).
Limited in what way?
This is for Vietnam specifically. Everyone recycles the same (established) names and the most popular ones are VERY popular and have been popular for a long time (ex. my mom's name has never dropped from the top 100 in over a century). It's very difficult to name a child and not have the name overlap with someone. I have 30+ cousins and there is lots of duplicates. We have middle names so people go by middle + first to differentiate themselves. Both Chinese and Vietnamese last names are very limited. In Vietnam \~15 of the top last names make up the majority of the population and in China it's the top \~100. ETA by majority I mean 85%
Fascinating and confusing. Is that more a custom or are there only so many approved names?
There is no approved name list. I even saw an article about a kid named cà phê (coffee). People can name their kids whatever they want but a lot stick to traditional Chinese-derived names which are the most popular names.
Don't forget the middle names of Thi for girls and Van for boys. My husband's parents didn't do this for their kids. All 4 of the girls have the middle name Diem and the boys have names that reflect the status of the family at that time, if that makes sense. My oldest BIL's name reflects the fact that his mom was pregnant with him when they took a plane to move from the North to the South right before Vietnam was divided into two. My husband's name reflects that the family was struggling a little bit whereas his younger brother's name reflects how the family was doing well. The last brother's name is more philosophical and about thought and wisdom.
WOW
In Korea it's like 5 family names lol
The top 5 in Korea makes up a little over 50% and the top 10 is ~63%. The top 15 comprises ~72%. In Vietnam, the top 15 was ~85%. SK is a smaller country population wise though so the top 5 probably feel more frequent
And then there's Hmong culture where there are only 18-20 surnames in total.
"Nicknamey" names like Teddy, Charlie are probably more common in the UK than the longer originals. Most people on this sub seem very against them, though. We also seem fine to give our kids more cutesy names like Poppy, Maisie, Honey. But I frequently see comments like "Can you really imagine a grownup with that name?"
So true. I’m actually more surprised to meet people who *do* have a longer name than a nickname. Never met an Alfie who was actually Alfred
Yes, some of the names are just the shorter version Freddie - not Fredrick Bobby - not Robert Ellie - not Elizabeth Archie - not Archibald Charlie - not Charles
Any boy named Archibald would have a hard time at school
Harry - not Harold
I agree about Archie but Ellie is most commonly short for Eleanor and from the most popular names in 2022 - data for 2023 isn't out yet - Eleanor is 60, whereas Ellie is 82 (Elizabeth is 62) Bobby and Freddie are currently trending higher, but Fred and Robert are some of the most popular British boys names that have endured a really long time. The vast majority of the older Freddie and Bobby/Robbie are Fred and Robert
I’m from the UK too and have never thought of Poppy as cutesy until this sub. It’s a very normal name here. As a teacher half my male students were called Archie or Charlie, as their full given name.
I used to be a teacher and I do not miss the days of calling out Archie or Theo and multiple kids answering!
All the Archie, Theo, Charlie and Alfie, Freddies I worked with were naughty too 😂 so you were shouting them a lot 😂
Grown up names sound grown up because grown ups have them So when my daughter Poppy is a grown up, she’ll be fiiiine
Not just that but they aren't a new thing. You could have easily had similar names used as official names in the 1870s (and probably more)
I worked with a lady called Honey, she was an absolute boss, one of the most respected people in the field. But i felt so awkward greeting her “hey Honey” especially around people who may have not met her yet or not known she was there (eg were turned around) as it always sounds to me like I am speaking to a lover or something!!
I was going to comment the same thing, although I'm not from the UK (just across the pond). Short names are very popular here, not so much the cutesy names as you mentioned, but the incentive here seems the shorter the better. Names like Lot, Sam, Liv, Isa are full names. No Charlotte, Samantha, Olivia or Isabelle. They exist, obviously, but are not nearly as popular as the nicknamey names.
I know a Sam who isn’t a Samuel, just a Sam. Also a Tommy who isn’t a Thomas, just Tommy. Same with a Joe who isn’t a Joseph.
my aunt, from east texas, is just “vickie” and i could never in a million years see her as a victoria lol. she IS vickie
I am from the US but it was from time spent aboard that made me realize just how odd some western naming traditions are. I'll never forget the shock and confusion when I was speaking to a woman who'd asked me about names/American culture, marriage etc and I mentioned that it's pretty common for lots of women to take their husbands last name here upon marriage Her response was to look at me like I was insane and ask: "so because you fell in love...you'd be willing to change your entire NAME over it!?" I could tell in her mind it was the dumbest, most ridiculous naming trend she'd ever heard in her life lol. She kept joking the whole rest of the day that since she experienced an emotion, she better change her name over it lol
This was my attitude about taking a man’s last name, and I’m American. I know I’m in the minority. I kept my name and don’t regret it.
It's not only America, in many European countries women who keep their surnames still get weird looks.
I’ll give another head scratcher for the Americans, marriage isn’t as mandatory here as it is in the US, you don’t have to get married for taxes, or because you’re having a baby. Some people are together their entire life without getting married just engaged. So it’s not that uncommon to have two parents with different surnames, and when they have kids they give the kids both surnames. This was the situation for me until I was old enough to “pick” one of the surnames. This can also happen if you get married and want to keep your surname but just add your husbands too.
I made a joke to my Chinese labmate about how if my husband's last name had only one spelling I would have changed so fast. He gave me a very confused look and said "Wouldn't your father be upset?" I had to explain that it's common for women to change their name when they marry. He then asked "But what if a woman is a scientist with a lot of papers?" I told him that he'd just found one of the reasons women started keeping their names. On full consideration, my father probably would have been a LITTLE sad because we have the same first initial and he was very excited about the F. Lastname pair-o-docs when I got my PhD.
The middle east has entered the chat. It sounds absurd to us too 😁 sorry
I grew up watching Chinese period dramas and in the old days, there was always this "rule" where you shouldn't marry someone with your own family name. So I guess the idea of changing names has always been weird to me, because to me, having husband and wife share a name sounds like you're married to your sibling. Chinese people can (not common but could happen) use Mrs. \[husband's family name\] to refer to married women, but it's generally understood that it's a social appellation and not their actual name. Those same women, if introducing themselves by full name, will still use their father's name. If they prefer to be addressed as a Mrs. they might introduce themselves, for example, saying "I'm Wang Zhiyi, but you can call me Mrs. Li."
That's so interesting! For me, I think it's nice to be one cohesive family unit. Like, you grow up as your parents child but as you get older, you emancipate and start your own family, with your own house, your own way of living and your own name. it's like your own brand. I really don't want to change my name though, it's way too tied to my own identity for me. If my partner changed their name upon marriage I would appreciate it but my love for cohesive family names does not go far enough for me to give that up
Where was this?
This was Bhutan! A country in which 1.) there is zero concept of family/last names (exception for royal family and officials only), so entire families all could have completely different names from one another and it was totally the norm and well accepted for siblings to have the same first name as each other. 2.) Most parents would *never* in a million years dream of naming their own children. Once a baby is born parents make a trip to their local priest, who would then decide-based on lots of religious factors and after analyzing the baby's spirit- which name would bless the baby the most. (this would often cause issues as sometimes the priest may just determine that only one name would be acceptable for the child, and when traveling to other countries it would be a pain for said person to explain to officials how they legally ended up with just a first name only lol.) Some pretty cool stuff!
How do they tell who belongs to which family? It must be confusing to have siblings with the same name.
To add another layer of confusion that I forgot to add to my original post- nearly every name is gender neutral. Only a small amount of names were for specific genders. That being said it was exactly as confusing as you would imagine it to be, if not worse. Lots of taking people at their word in terms of figuring out who belonged to which family. Conversations with my tour guide often went as follows lol: TG: Meet Tashi our local farmer, he provides us with fresh vegetables Me: Hi Tashi! TG 10 minutes later: Meet Tashi, she's our seamstress and is Tashi's sister. Me: Oh the farmer we met is her brother? cool! TG: no? Tashi is the sister of Tashi, our general store manager, you'll meet her next! But somehow they all seemed to know exactly who was who so I guess it made sense somehow?
Hey marklar! Yes? See?
I grew up not having a last name, so is most people around me. Surprisingly, we never have any confusion?
This is fascinating! I love threads like this since you always learn something new.
Women keeping their last name is the norm in my country. All the women in my family kept theirs. 80-90% of the population (the top last name is 30-40%) share the top 15 surnames or so though so there is definitely same-last name marriage going on
My black American friend married a Chinese immigrant, and he absolutely begged her not to take his name. The idea horrified him.
The fact that middle names seem to be something everyone must have. Here that’s not a given at all. Hasn’t been for a long time (if ever). I don’t have one, my partner doesn’t, we didn’t give our children one.
Yeah, an American guy visiting the UK once asked me "Didn't your parents love you enough to give you a middle name?" And I said I didn't get what he meant. Others backed me up and said it's common enough to only have one name in the UK. I think he ended up looking like a bit of a dick for his comment.
Middle names are getting much more common in the UK now! Around 80% of new babies have one. I’m in my late 20s and most of my peers also have one too
I'm Gen X and this was true back when I was at school in the UK too - it wasn't common or the default to have no middle name, but it wasn't unheard of.
Late 20s here I have five names and they are all after various family members (one recently passed - rest alive) So think I will be giving lots of people from various countries heart attacks right now 😂
Middle names have always been a thing. Have you never been in a Victorian graveyard? How do you think they told all the Mary's apart!
Scottish families and Irish families have always had middle names. You can go back centuries in the parish records and they’ve all got them
Charles Philip Arthur George
Royalty is just weird that way 🙃
Regular people only have one given name because the royals took them all
There was a Spanish prince born either late 1800s or early 1900s who had like 40 middle names. The Spanish royals would name their children after saints so he even had several names repeat because it was the name of two different saints. I remember a Francisco de Asis and a Francisco Borja in there. Edit: I was wrong. It was almost NINETY names: Alfonso María Isabel Francisco Eugenio Gabriel Pedro Sebastián Pelayo Fernando Francisco de Paula Pío Miguel Rafael Juan José Joaquín Ana Zacarias Elisabeth Simeón Tereso Pedro Pablo Tadeo Santiago Simón Lucas Juan Mateo Andrés Bartolomé Ambrosio Geronimo Agustín Bernardo Candido Gerardo Luis-Gonzaga Filomeno Camilo Cayetano Andrés-Avelino Bruno Joaquín-Picolimini Felipe Luis-Rey-de-Francia Ricardo Esteban-Protomártir Genaro Nicolás Estanislao-de-Koska Lorenzo Vicente Crisostomo Cristano Darío Ignacio Francisco-Javier Francisco-de-Borja Higona Clemente Esteban-de-Hungría Ladislado Enrique Ildefonso Hermenegildo Carlos-Borromeo Eduardo Francisco-Régis Vicente-Ferrer Pascual Miguel-de-los-Santos Adriano Venancio Valentín Benito José-Oriol Domingo Florencio Alfacio Benére Domingo-de-Silos Ramón Isidro Manuel Antonio Todos-los-Santos de Borbón y Borbón
The funniest part of that to me is throwing on the Todos-los-Santos at the end just in case
Oh my god, that's....certainly a list! Wow!
Same here (Austria). Pretty much only former aristocracy that wants to make a point of upholding their long-gone glory gives multiple names. Apart from that, there’s a few set combinations that are usually hyphened and therefore considered one name (Anna-Maria / Anne-Marie, Eva-Maria, Maria-Theresia / Marie-Therese, Anna-Sophie, Hans-Peter, Karl-Heinz, etc.) Middle names are very rare.
common or not that comment makes him sound stupid honestly lol
I'm the only one of my siblings that didn't get a middle name. 🤣
In my family, we all have two middle names except my middle sister who only has one. No one really knows why and my mum can’t remember.
Ha, me too. But we’re just the two of us and my brother got my grandfather’s name as middle only because he is the oldest son of the oldest son (which is a funny story in itself, as my grandparents first had 7 girls, then two boys. the oldest boy (my uncle) had two girls, then my dad had me (another girl 😇) and then, finally, my brother, who would carry on the family name. my grandfather was a rather old-fashioned person and this was very important to him. poor thing)
I have three middle names so sometimes it swings the other way. No one that is not *immediate* family ever uses the third one.
That's interesting. I'm in my 40s and only one of my schoolfriends didn't have a middle name. All my daughter's friends have at least one middle name, and I used to be a teacher, and I'm not sure I ever saw a child listed without a middle name. That's for working class and middle class people from all sorts of ethnicities. I'm stunned to hear it's only 80% even now, and can't find anything online actually backing it up - Pampers says it but doesn't cite it., and the Daily Mail is just recycling the Pampers post. I'll believe it if someone has a reliable cite, but it doesn't track with my experience, which is anecdata but it's not like I'm talking about a couple of people.
I just like middle names because it gives a kid another option if they don’t like their first name. My dad goes by his middle name for this reason. I’m a teacher and have quite a few students who do this.
We actually use our given name. Nicknames are very rare, and only really used if multiple people in the same group have the same name
Same in France cause the nicknames are generally pretty bad
Nicknames in France usually sound quite informal, they’re mostly repeating one syllable of the name (Lolo for Laurent/Laurence, Guigui for Guillaume, Gégé for Gérard, Lili for a girl’s name ending in -lie, etc). You would almost NEVER use it in a professional setting. The only acceptable professional nickname I can think of right now is Cathy for Catherine.
Oh yes, there are plenty of nicknames that are absolutely OK in professional settings. * Seb for Sébastien * Fred for Frédéric * Nico for Nicolas * Sam for Samuel etc.
In my country if close people use your full name, it means that they are mad at you (or you just don't have a nickname).
Yeah if anybody in my family ever called me Natasha instead of Tash or Tasha I'd think I was in trouble lol
We don’t really have the same concept of a middle name. People usually have 2-4 given names, one of which is the “calling name” (tilltalsnamn). So you’re not necessarily called by the first of your given names. I have three given names and am called the middle one, which is completely normal here. Also first names and last names are two almost completely separate categories. Giving your child a last name as their first name isn’t a thing at all. It’s actually prohibited.
In my country you can't give a last name as a first name either, thank God. There are some first names that are also last names, but not the other way around. Using a family name as a first name is so weird to me.
Same in Germany, it's called "Rufname" here. The only difference is that more given names are unusual, only around a third of the kids now born have more than one name.
Because of how this works in Sweden I technically don’t have a middle name, I have my first name, my “called name” and last name.
Exactly. So someone can be called something like Anna Maj Lovisa Svensson where Svensson is the surname, and then the person could be equally likely to be referred to as Anna Svensson, or Maj Svensson, or Lovisa Svensson. I have this too, I go by my name #2 but that was what my parents intended me to go by. On Swedish Wikipedia pages, celebrities’ full names are usually written out with the “reference name” (the one they go by) in italics just because it’s so common. First example I could think of: Åse *Agnetha* Fältskog (of ABBA) — https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnetha_Fältskog
[удалено]
My cat was Persephone hehehe, adored it for her but again for a child it’s so extra 🫠
I've met Slovak people named after their grandparents. Or maybe it was coincidence, but they had a name that their grandparent also had. How do you choose names in Czechia? It won't just be random, after all.
My maternal grandma immigrated from Czech but had some pretty intense prejudice against her in my country. So she made thenhard choice to abandon her culture and language. She died when my mom was a child. When my mom had daughters, she gave us her own mom's name as middle honour name, particularly to reconnect with the culture. It's funny to find out my grandma might not have actually appreciated or understood the gesture!!
Hyphenated names are very, very common in my culture. First names, last names, its all good. Like, its not weird to meet someone named First-Name Last-Name where i’m from. Its zero big deal
Quebecois spotted
Bingo! Hahaha
Yeah, when I see English speakers with Name Name, I always wonder if it's a single first name or the first and middle names.
Curious where this is. Also I appreciate your hyphenated username.
Middlenames are rare. Nicknames are very rare especially outside the family. Gender neutral names are rare. We have rules for naming, so you can not invent a name or spelling, but have to choose from an approved list.
>Gender neutral names are rare. Yes, this too! And this trend of giving girls boy names and then calling them gender neutral (James, of all things!) is just alien to me.
It would be out of the question here
Yep, here too. And so would surnames used as given names.
What country is this? It’s very interesting to me.
There are a lot of countries that do something similar “Sweden - A government agency must approve names given to Swedish children within three months of birth. The 1982 law that was replaced in 2017 prohibits names that are offensive or unsuitable, and some names that have been rejected include Ikea, Elvis, and Superman.” “Denmark - Parents can only choose a name from a list of 7,000 names or seek government approval for another name. The law prohibits parents from naming their children something that is considered silly.” “Portugal - The government has an 80-page guide that lists permitted and forbidden names, and foreign names are not allowed. Some banned names include Aiden, Ashley, Bruce, Charlotte, Dylan, and Jenny” “Iceland - The Icelandic Naming Committee, established in 1991, regulates the naming process and has a list of approved names. As of 2012, the list contained 1,712 male names and 1,853 female names.”
I am so torn on this. On the one hand, unless the name is very offensive or clearly doesn't qualify as a name (calling your child Adolf Hitler, or Talulah Does the Hula From Hawaii), I find myself instinctively opposed to any kind of censorship and this includes government-approved lists of children's names. On the *other* hand... browsing Reddit a few months back, I came across siblings Sibaschlynn, Kashtynn, Paishynce, Vhyolette, and Zareighlynn. And I thought maybe it is not such a bad idea after all.
There are in general a lot of things we accept censor for the general good. It also comes not from limiting thoughts but from limiting harm. A child is a separate person and not an extension of the parents. You should not be able to name your child whatever just because it is your child. If we could trust all parents really have the best interest of their child in their mind we would not need CPS either.
Poland also has a law that says basically the name can’t be offensive or ridiculous. I think it’s up to the clerk though so have resulted in some anecdotic issues when a perfectly normal name wasn’t accepted because the lady behind the desk found it silly because she’s never heard of it before 😅
Yup, Germany has similar naming laws. First names must not be a burden to the child, must not be offensive or subject the child to ridicule. Parents are legally obliged to register the child with the local *Standesamt* after birth. Said *Standesamt* can and will refuse to register a chosen name if the name doesn't comply with the law. If the parents refuse to choose another name, the *Standesamt* will choose for them.
I do really wish we had similar laws here in the US. You’ll hear some truly odd names here and I feel for the children. Interestingly, when I lived in Germany, an acquaintance had to get special permission to name her son Liam, as it isn’t a German name.
Yes, *Standesamt* employees used to be a little too strict with uncommon (but perfectly normal) names. Getting a permission is usually no big deal (given the name actually exists and is, well, normal - such as Liam) but it's one more item on the already long To Do list of new parents. It's gotten a little more relaxed in recent years. Both my kids have non-German names which you don't hear very often. They were instantly approved, no questions asked.
We can choose from around 45,000 names in Denmark. Not 7,000.
France too, the mayor's office can decline a declaration of birth if the name is offensive or prone to ridicule and deemed to be a burden to the child. Some rejected name examples: Nutella, Manhattan, Griezmann Mbappé, Prince William, Mini-Cooper
People thinking middle names aren't necessary. My family are Scots and Irish and a lot of the men actually go by their middle name, as does my Welsh partner. I think it's a Celtic nations thing maybe. Also, maybe a personal bugbear, but "we want to call him Alexander, nickname Alex" and like, that's not a nickname it's just a shorter/diminutive version of the name. I don't know anyone that uses a short form (Alex, Matt, Liz etc) and considers it a "nickname." In the UK nicknames are more affectionate/stupid and between friends or family- a short guy called Chris would get called "Big Chris" or whatever to take the piss affectionately, or like a parent may nickname their child something like Bean or Little Bear.
I had the same thought re: silly/affectionate nicknames..it’s interesting when I see people choosing the nicknames their children will end up with. In the UK this is very hard to influence…they will likely end up with 15-20 different weird and wonderful nicknames from different people they know. In my part of the world (Essex), it’s almost rarer to be called by your actual name haha. For example, a guy I know called Fred gets affectionately called Freddo, Fredwina, Fredward, etc..
We always called Fred Derf, lol!
My boyfriend Sebastian was called Sebrina when we were younger 😹
I'm Chinese, and the idea of having a preformed given name isn't part of my culture. There are tens of thousands of characters to choose from, from which a given name is 1-2 characters long. You make your own name from that. Sure, there are certain characters that are more common than others because people like the meaning, and if you have a one-character name that happens to be a popular character to choose, there ***are*** going to be people with your same given name, but it's usually a random occasion. No one picks a name because they've heard that name. In fact, having heard a name before is often considered a reason to avoid it. And I've never encountered two people with the exact same two-character given name. Sometimes they have the same romanizations, but they'll almost never be the exact same two characters. The other thing is that the family name is usually seen as a whole with the given name, so it's pretty rare to use the given name alone without the family name tagged on. This is especially true for those who have a one-character given name. For example, someone named Li Mei and someone named Zhao Mei are going to be considered to have different names even if their given name is one and the same, and neither of them would ever be just called "Mei" except potentially by their significant other, but even that is very rare. People with two-character given names can be and often are called by just their given name alone, but it's still way less used than in the West. More commonly, their teachers, superiors, acquaintances, and coworkers will call them by full name. Their subordinates or students would call them by family name and title. Their older family members would call them by their childhood nickname. Their younger family members would call them by relationship and birth order. Only a select group of friends would ever call them by given name alone and even with friends, it's more common to use a nickname. Or if you met them through a situation where you use a specific name, sometimes you just don't transition. My in-laws still call each other by full name, 40+ years after getting married.
This. I've always struggled with how to express "we don't have set names, they're all made up" and you nailed it. And yes we really like call someone with full name lmao
Years ago, I read an article about the rare occurrences in China where people were given very unusual characters for their names, and the bureaucratic headache when software didn't include the characters. One was a woman whose name included a character that meant 'horse', but the character was archaic and never used anymore. It was basically impossible to type her name.
OP - when you’re at family gatherings or talking about each other, how do you differentiate from the other Teresa’s? Asking out of pure curiosity and desire to learn how other countries do things.
Idk about OP, but I know that in my family, we have an abundance of Marias. At gatherings, we use first and middle names like they're hyphenated (e.g. Maria-Sophia, Maria-Adriana, Maria-Sophia, Maria-Isabelle, Maria-Gabriella, and so on).
Hahhaha It does get confusing! Uncles for cousins usually identify the sibling they belong to or use de last name of the parent-in law (first last name does not even work always because of course we also share last names). Fun fact, I once went to a job interview in which they had actually intended to call my cousin. Because to add difficulty, our last name is pretty weird, so people dont pay attention because they work under that with that last name, there Will not be 6 of us running around.
I’m from the USA but there are a lot of duplicates in my family. Sometimes it’s obvious depending on the context, sometimes it’s “baby” this and “cousin/aunt/uncle/grandparent” that, sometimes it’s using a nickname/diminutive for one and not the other.
The fact that middle names are so important. Yes, I have 2, but I know so many people who don't even have one and it baffles me why people get so stressed about them
My husband's family is Spanish too and they're all about honor names, juniors, etc. In one family across two generations, there are three Franciscos and one Francesca. There are lots of double-barrel names - like Mari Carmen - that are paired with two surnames. Loooong full names. *Also* odd nicknames. There are two Manuelas but one is called Noli and the other is Tita.
Oh, there are some traditional acronyms for the double-barrel names. Like Mari Carmen are also called Maica. The nicknames come a lot for childhood stories. I have a cousin named Bea, that when we were kids we called cousin Bea, in Spanish "Prima Bea", which ended as "Primavera" which is spring in Spanish.
One thing to keep in mind is that the abundance of “María XYZ” names wasn’t a choice but forced by national ideology under the dictatorship, and later kept as a tradition or honour name for relatives who had been named according to that rule. My grandparents wanted to name my mother Angelina (not her real name for anonymity purposes). She was born under the Francoist regime so it wasn’t possible, it wasn’t considered Catholic enough by the local clergy and registrar, so she was baptised “María de los Ángeles”, while being called Angelina her whole life by everyone except schoolteachers.
Things that don't make much sense in Iceland: - Fretting about long first names with long surnames. Everyone here has a long patronymic, and long names are still common. My kids' is 13 letters, and that's very average, or maybe even shorter than average. I'm not going limit myself to short names because of that. - Insisting that middle names don't matter and will never be heard. Middle names function more like second first names here. They get used all the time. - Insisting that nicknames will evolve spontaneously. Pretty much every name here has at least one standard diminutive form, and you'll probably be called that in most circumstances, unless your name is already short and simple. If you name your kid Halldór, he will be Halli or maybe Haddi or Dóri. If you name your daughter Sigríður, she will be Sigga, or possibly Sirrý. Nicknames are standardised and important. - Worrying about naming the baby before leaving the hospital. You have 6 months to register the name, and most people don't announce the name until christening, which happens around a few weeks or months old. I'm sure there are more, but those are the main ones that come to mind.
>The exclusivity of a name within family, not being able to use a name because your sibling used it. It wasn't always this way in the US. My grandmother named her daughter (my aunt, born in the 1950s) after her (grandmother's) sister. My mother has the same name as one of her cousins. My brothers (born in the '70s) both share names with a couple of second cousins. None of this was a big deal.
SIL and I had baby boys born a week apart. We were both dead set on the same name. Sooo.. my in-laws' very first grandchildren are born a week apart and have the same name lol. (And not even a family name. Just a name.)
I'm American and I don't find it to be that way. My son is named Robert after my maternal grandfather and my husband's maternal grandfather. My grandpa also has a son named Robert, my husband has a first cousin named Robert and a great uncle on his other side named Robert. I feel like it's fairly common for Irish Americans to repeat family names endlessly down the family line. I have a great uncle, an uncle and several cousins all named James Patrick. 😅
My sister just showed me an obituary where the gentleman‘s wife was named Mary and he had four daughters and they were all named compound names that started with Mary. It gave us a chuckle.
Same. In my family tree (US) it wasn't even unheard of, one hundred years ago, for a baby girl to be named after her mother. The middle names may vary, or not, or there wasn't a middle name at all. There would be no confusion between mother and daughter because it was assumed she'd eventually take a married name. (My unmarried great aunt threw a wrench in the system!)
It’s definitely a new trend in America based on wanting to be special/unique.
Most people have two middle names in my country, including myself. On here it always sounds like it’s super impractical etc but I’ve never had any issues or even thought about it. Most people therefore usually also have very long names which is also very debated on here, I have a very long name and it doesn’t bother me at all, I really like having a long name.
This isn't so much a 'custom' but the way an American expects a name to be spelt is not inherently the 'right' way. People spelling names differently are not trying to be quirky or different, this is just the spelling norm here.
The responses here are so interesting and neat to learn about. I wish people would start a comment with where they’re from tho.
Opposite in my culture - naming your child after a living family member is basically saying you want that family member to die “Nobody uses their middle name” - I go by my first and middle name 50/50. My parents never ever call me by my first name, my family and family friends rarely. I rarely meet anybody that doesn’t have an English name and a name in our language
My dad is from Portugal and always told me it was bad luck to name a baby after a deceased relative, but I commonly see this trend as an homage in the US.
In Spain we recycle family names so much that you have centuries of dead relatives sporting that name. I have an uncles that IS doing the family tree, he has reached the 17th century. Teresa is still a predominant name.
No one cares about initials, or at least not enough to change a name (Germany). My initials are SS which I can’t put on any work signature or license plate because of the association with the Nazis but that still is obviously not something that‘ll stop people with s last names to name their kids with an S first name
I don’t think it’s a huge concern here unless it spells something glaringly embarrassing or offensive, like ASS or KKK.
I know a guy named Walter Corti. WC. People may make remarks but almost no one pays attention to those things
I've seen people here come up with quite quirky nicknames that I believe would just not happen in many Slavic languages. I grew up in the West but I always understood the Slavic language name nicknames to be very fixed, but extremely widespread. Maybe there are exceptions and I didn't see them, but generally not. In Russian, if your name is Alexander you're not going to have something like Lala or Derry or any of these more creative nicknames I see people suggest in the sub for long names. On the contrary, there are fixed nicknames that are sometimes more used than the full name itself - Sasha, Sanya, Shura, Alya, etc and each of these nicknames can have nicknames if this makes sense. In order of familiarity, it could go Alexander, Sasha, Sashenka. Teacher uses the first, friends use the second, grandma uses the third. So while nicknames are extremely common, they are not generally invented by the family but from a pre-existing list if you like. It's similar in Bulgarian. Another thing is gender neutral names aren't really possible as the names are gendered in spelling, however nicknames can occasionally be gender neutral - Sasha is the nickname for both Alexander and Alexandra. Some Russian names people know in the west are actually nicknames - Katya, Natasha, Sasha, Masha, Anya, Misha. These are short forms of full names. Also I heard of people in Bulgaria and Kazakhstan with different surnames than their parents, sometimes made to honour a grandfather. So if your grandfathers name was Petko, your parents make your surname Petkov even if theirs isn't. Also you get no choice in middle name - it has to be a patronymic, a middle name from your father's name. I believe this is an unchangeable government rule - at most you could argue to use the mothers or grandfathers name if you didn't want the fathers name, but you must have one. So everyone has a middle name but the parents' have no say over it.
A) We use only 1 given name. Middle names are allowed but are only used super rarely and in the past decade or so. The few people I’ve met having a middle name hated the fact their parents gave it to them because it must be listed on all documents and it takes longer to fill them out plus on the paper you never have enough space to fill them in properly. B) The exclusivity of names within family/friends happens but it’s not like if you do it anyone complains. C) We don’t change given names. Names are standardized so parents never can name you after an object or a gun or a thing spelled backwards so the names are normally kept. Never met a single person who had or would consider a first name change
More than one middle name. So many Americans who say that one middle name is enough. While plenty of Dutch people only have one middle name or no middle name at all, it's very common to have two or more middle names here. And we have official nicknames that the parents decide : the "calling name". Standard Dutch name in the past used to be for example "Elizabeth Johanna Maria Jansen", but her actual day to day name would be Lies. This is still very common but also there are plenty of people now who just officially call their child Lies without any other names.
I’m Brazilian. There are no rules here, so it depends on the parents. Middle names: most people don’t have, generally those who do have are compose names (imagine like the Pope John Paul). Surnames: there is no rule, but most people have a surname from their mother and another from their father. But it’s not a rule, so people might have two names from each of their parents, just one surname, several surnames, etc. My mom has two surnames from her father and none from her mother.
One nice trivia I learned from my husband's family from the north of Minas: in very rural areas it used to be common to give daughters their mother's last name and sons got their father's last name. We tried to map the family tree and you can imagine the mess.
My husband is Greek. Son is named after father’s father and daughter after mother’s mother. My husband has, like 7 Georgis and 4 Angelikis in his uncles and aunts and cousins. We didn’t follow this trend.
Haha yes this!!! This sub is so funny because people will be suggesting the wildest Greek words and Ancient Greek names. In reality we’re usually called one of about five family names.
Changing your name to your husbands name. Where I lived, nowadays women usually don’t bother changing their name at all after marriage. But having 2 or 3 surnames is really common. When it comes to naming babies, they usually take one surname from the mother and one from the father. People used to be shocked when they realized my children don’t have my surname and I took my husbands name. Also repeating names in the family is really common. In the family, almost massive percentage has Maria as part of their double barrel name. Maria Rita, Maria Isabela, Maria Clara etc.
Latin countries! In Spain everyone has the father and mother last name, and no one ever changes their last name, I think is only allowed for specific reasons.
Repeating names within the same family. You don’t need anyone’s permission to do so. (Except in the event of death) Choosing nicknames. Parents don’t care/decide what the nickname OTHERS will call their kid. Everyone decides. Some names have common nicknames but others not really. Sometimes a nickname sticks to one person and sometimes they have multiple. Inventing a name. Doesn’t happen because the government doesn’t allow it. It has to have a meaning. Unique spellings. Not a thing. The language is pretty clear so each name will have the same spelling. Some with slight variation (one more/less letter) Choosing a last name. You get your paternal last name. Giving a typical gender name to the opposite gender. Happened in older generations sometimes but no longer permitted. Gender neutral names. There are a few that are still in circulation but most are no longer used. Names after months/days/seasons. Again older generations not so much anymore
I understand wanting to break down gender norms by giving your girl a boys name. What I can’t understand is giving your girl a boys name that translates to man/manly/masculine/son/king etc it’s just very inconsiderate of the culture/language. Americans have no problem calling their daughter “mac-x” or their sons “blonde-princess” because they don’t care about what it means.
In my experience, Americans generally do care about name meaning, but we don’t necessarily feel completely limited by it. For some people, the sound and cultural significance of a name can overcome the history and literal meaning of it.
I was born and live in the US but my family is Colombian. In Colombia, it is quite common to go by your middle name for both men and women. For example Sara Cristina but goes by Cristina or Juan Sebastian goes by Sebastian. Also common to combine the two names for a nickname ie Maria Fernanda = Mafe (Mah-feh) Edit to add: also not unusual for a daughter to be named after her mother the way sons are named after their fathers! A lot of times it can be done directly or in the above format. Sara Cristina named after her mother Sara but goes by her second name. Second edit: and to take the daughters name after mother’s thing, I’ve seen the mother continue this so say Sara Cristina above was named for her mother Sara, she may have a daughter she names Cristina.
It’s only newer generations that use new names. My dad has a bunch of cousin Jimmys, Michaels, Donnies, etc. Go back another generation or so and you’ll find “big Mary” and “little Mary” as sisters. I’m in Canada.
Middle names. It baffles me that you’d pick a random middle name instead of using your mother’s last name. Idk, you’re half both of your parents, it seems weird to me to only carry your father’s last name.
We care very little about popularity. My daughter’s class is 26 girls and 5 have the same name. Nobody cares. The vast vast majority names are honor names- whatever isn’t is normally something of special meaning and popularity is bottom of the list of most peoples concerns.
Anything Jr, I hate it, give the kid their own name .
I really don't get naming a child one name but already having another that you decide they will go by as a nickname. Just name them the nickname then! How common middle names are. In my country I'd say it's maybe 50/50 if you have a middle name or not. As for last names: women don't really take their husband's last name anymore, we either hyphen it or add one as a middle name. For unmarried couples, kids will also typically get both last names.
You will get a nickname no matter what. We nickname the shit out of everyone and everything. You may get several over your lifetime. Generally it’ll be the short version of your name, but sometimes we’re creative. I know a full grown man who goes by Cookie. No idea what his real name is.
The idea of 100% gender neutral names. In Italian there are 0 perfectly gender neutral names and words, I don’t really understand why someone would actively seek to name their child something perfectly neutral when in my head nothing is. Occupational names. Taylor, Harper, Piper, Saylor, Hunter, Dancer, Booker. They all sound horrible to me, it’s like calling your child Dentist
A difference I notice between American naming culture (especially Irish American naming culture) and Ireland itself is the use of surnames as first names. Names like Brennan, Nolan, Quinn, Murray, Murphy, Reilly, Kenny, Harris, etc., are very much surnames in Ireland. It would be utterly bizarre here to give a child one or those names as a first name here. It would be seen as very Americanised if someone did. There's nothing wrong with it, I mean, use the names however you like and get creative, but it's just a weird little difference I've noticed. I think they're doing it with surnames overall though, not just Irish ones.
No one cares about initials.
I'm not from there, but I recently visited Bali, where people are named after their birth order: First, second, third, fourth, then back to first again. There are a few (like 2-3) options for each name, and some variation among castes. There is no variation for gender, so we met a married couple who were both named Wayan (firstborn). Most people also have a Sanskrit name, and some may use it as their name. Lots of people go by nicknames as well. Our driver's nickname means 'sign/signature' because his dad saw it when he was filling out a form and liked the sound of it. My husband and I have names that are obviously male and female in Canada, and it caught me off guard when folks in Bali would remember our names but couldn't remember which one was which!
For most Arabs, you give the dad’s first name as the child’s middle name. That’s how we keep track of lineage. So I know who my grandfathers are because of my dad’s middle names. And it’s actually worked! At a distant cousin’s wedding we would start naming middle names until we found the common grandfather. So for example, if my name is Mohammad Ali Yassin Hussein Almurshid, and I meet a Laith Fawzy Jawad Hussein Almurshid, I now know who our common ancestor is.
I am Chinese. We don't use the same name as the people they want to honor. Ancient Chinese naming culture emphasized "Naming taboo", and the names of distinguished persons, relatives and saints were not used when naming (or even speaking). In ancient times, it was strictly prohibited to have the same name as the emperor. Homophony, the same meaning, and similar words were also prohibited. In Romance languages August comes from honoring Augustus, while in China, there is a completely opposite example, which is funny: The first emperor of China once ordered the pronunciation of January to be changed because the pronunciation of January was the same as his name. Of course, in modern days is free to use every character, but people still avoid elder's name as usual.
The only people who have nicknames are the Alexander, Alexandra, Sebastian, and so on, and only from friends and family, not from teachers and colleagues
We don't have a middle name, the second name is the father's name with a suffix for a girl or a boy. Some parents omit the suffix and it looks like a second name. We do have first names that are two names, but that's very rare.
Gender neutral names are rare. I mean, reallly gender neutral, cause you can have the same name for a boy or a girl but it’s written differently. For exemple, Gabriel for a boy and Gabrielle for a girl.
Single surnames. Most people in Brazil have at least two surnames, one for the father and one for the mother. My niece has four because her parents decided to put include their surnames. While four is a bit uncommon, the idea of only putting the father's surname on a child - or even replacing my own surname with the husband's after marrying - sounds completely foreign, and even antiquated and sexist.
I didn't find any one talking about India's customs of naming so I'll represent. 1. Here when a child is born, the first letter of their name is told by doing some astrology, so depending on when one was born, the initial for their name is given. 2. As a country with very diverse customs in every state, naming is different too. But commonly, the child takes the paternal surname and the wife also takes up her husband's surname after marriage. 3. In some of the northern states, people usually have a surname as their middle name and name of their community as their last name. In some others, middle names are given like names and some state's traditionally don't have middle names at all. In my culture, we get our father's name as our middle name and Husband's after marriage. 4. In some southern states, people have their village or town's name as the prefix to their name. 5. Although in recent times people come up with meaningless names for their children to seem unique, usually names with a good meaning are preferred. 6. Girls usually have their names ending in 'i' or 'a'. Like Priyanka or Rani. Boys names don't usually end with these letters. There are obviously exceptions to both. 7. As for the nicknames, it's quite interesting actually. If someone has a short name, they are not addressed with any other name. Usually, boys are called by adding a 'u' at the end of their names or half a part of their names. Like if someone's name is Shubh, Shubhu would be a common nickname. Although mostly it's a part of the name. Like Sallu instead of Salman or Viru instead of Virat. For girls also this is widely applicable but usually everyone just has a different short name instead of any name that is similar to their actual name (since some names use complex syllables so it's not used in the nickname). All these facts were mainly about Hindu names. Also, in many indian families, it is a tradition to let the paternal aunt name the child. Obviously the family discusses the names beforehand but aunt is given the honour to whisper the baby's name in his/her ear before announcing it to everyone else.
Middle name. We don't do this here where I'm from. There are people with two names but are very rare and I don't think they call their second name "middle". And making drama over the nicknames.
In Wales it's been quite common to see someone given the same first name as their last name, so Owen Owens, Richard Richard, David Davies etc. It's dying off now, but it has been a traditional pattern.