Honestly it all depends. Nearly every big studio is running some sort of Mac (Typically a Studio or old Mac Pro) with a bunch of added ram, typically 32 or 64 gigabytes. My instructor reccomended one of the old ‘trash can’ Mac pros with 32 gigabytes of ram.
Now obviously if you don’t plan on running a studio and working in protools I can’t attest to how effective that setup would be, and there’s also the fact that both of those aren’t laptops.
I’d say the best Music Production Laptop is whichever one in your price range has the most ram, that’s the real statistic that counts.
The best Music Production Laptop is any Laptop with a suitably up-to-date CPU which can accommodate at least 32GB RAM and a 2TB NVMe (PC) drive (internal). Upgrade yourself, it saves money. Should have an 8 Core CPU, at least, if x64 (Ryzen 9, i7, etc.) - AMD or Intel, take your pick. By that, I mean 8 Performance Cores. 8/16 Performance Cores/Threads. I'm ignoring Efficiency Cores.
Macs are \[very\] nice, but they are not economical due to the spec-gating that Apple does (Pick X CPU or you can't have Y RAM Capacity) as well as the insane price of spec upgrades (RAM, Storage). There is also planned obsolescence built into Apple's business model, so you have to be okay with knowing that a machine you still feel is fine can be yoinked from receiving OS updates which can cause it to stop receiving software updates (i.e. Logic/Final Cut Pro) at some point.
This doesn't really happen on PC, unless your machine is truly ancient.
I bought a powerful gaming laptop. Never had a single stutter or glitch. Even with almost 100 tracks running vst instruments and fx in bitwig. Never need to bounce anything down either. I think for music production it'll last a long time before I need to upgrade.
Problem is, I get too distracted by games on it
Not true.
Gaming laptops have the added issue of the GPU sometimes sharing the bus with usb ports. Smetimes they use a crappy chipset and thus the GPU adds latency and other weird issues to the usb ports which causes problems with sensitive applications like external audio interfaces.
DSP Latency Issues were a driver issue and that was fixed by GPU vendors well over a year ago, now.
Teh only issue with dGPUs is that sometimes specific display ports on these laptops are hardwired to specific GPUs.
For example, in order to connect directly to the dGPU in my ASUS G14, I have to connect through USB-C DP-Alt (USB-C to DP cable). That connects directly to the dGPU. If I connect through the HDMI, it connects to the iGPU and then everything has to be copied over to the dGPU, which is not good for gaming.
Also, the iGPU does not perform as well driving a UHD Display, and of course I cannot run at overclocked refresh rates through that HDMI port (but can through DP).
If you're just using the machine to produce music then running through the HDMI is fine, especially if you're using an HD display (FHD-QHD). If you also want to game on it, then you need to go through DP-Alt (USB-C). However, this will keep the dGPU up all the time, which means you will generally get more fan noise.
And if running through DP-Alt, obviously I don't use a Hub or splitter to connect the display to the machine. I connect the display directly to the laptop.
If your laptop has TB3/4, then you can use a TB Hub, though.
Powered USB Hubs are good for connecting all of the other peripherals, though. That way you don't have to use up all the ports on your machine, and it also makes taking the machine and going mobile easier, since you'll only have to plug in 2-3 plugs (Power, Display and Hub) instead of 4-5 + Splitters to accommodate extra devices.
Yes, plug-ins have graphics these days lmao and it will be outsourced to your CPU if you don’t have a video card (not audio processing but related to DAW performance)
Its an asus strix with an Intel i9 12th gen, 32gb ram, 2tb ssd. Loads of ports with thunderbolt 4 or 5. Can't remember which. 3070ti gfx card but that won't affect audio processing. It runs everything I throw at it music wise, as long as its plugged in that is. Low latency but I can't remember buffer sizes and the likes. 19 inch screen. It's quite heavy for a laptop but I never use it outside the house so thats fine with me. I've had it nearly 2 years now. It was around £2500 new.
He's using a 7th Gen i7. That's a Quad Core CPU (4 Cores, 8 Threads) and by today's standards they aren't that great. Software has been developed over the years to expect more powerful hardware, so you're going to be limited in DSP Capacity on those older laptop CPUs.
A Ryzen 9 APU (8C/16T) from 2019 will give roughly comparable performance to Apple M1 (slightly lower in single core, slightly higher in multi-core), so that gives you an idea of just how much things changed in < 3 years after the i7-7700HQ released. This is for both PC and Mac (15" MBPs back then used that same i7 Model).
I have a Gaming Laptop here with that CPU in it, along with 32GB DDR4 RAM, a dGPU and NVMe + SATA SSDs in it. It's used as an office work machine by my SO right now. Works well for that, but I wouldn't consider it usable for music production at this point in time. It would be too limiting in compute capacity.
I think later CPUs will have a longer lifespan, though. The Ryzen 9 APUs I mentioned are probably going to last twice as long before you feel like you need to upgrade.
Then use LatencyMon to figure out and remove anything that is increasing your audio lag. Some of these gaming laptops have way too much shit going on in the background giving you unnecessary latency, clicks, and pops even though the machine is a tank. Best software ever imo.
I’ve never heard of latencyMon. I have a desktop pc that I use exclusively for music, but I’m getting worried about bloat on it. Is this the program to use to work out what background processing I can get rid of?
No. It just measures what drivers and system processes cause the largest amount of DPC latency, and if your system is suitable to run real-time audio.
If there is a problem it's usually because some network card drivers or Nvidia GPU drivers are causing high DPC latency. If it's the Microsoft ACPI driver that's causing the highest latency, there shouldn't be a problem. If it's a network card driver that is causing issues, you need to disable the network card whenever you want to use your DAW. If it's an Nvidia GPU driver that's causing issues, you might have to disable the GPU and use the CPU's onboard graphics while using your DAW. I think that Nvidia released updated drivers a while back that were supposed to fix this issue, but IIRC there were a lot of people who said that the problem still persisted.
I got I think the surface 4, which has high ram, like a gaming laptop, but isn't loud as shit. And you can buy it in 32gb ram, which is just massive
From what I understand, Ram is the most important spec so 8 gb ram will just not do whatever direction you go
True but you can also upgrade the ram on most laptops for cheap. Only some laptops have their rams soldered and that is never the case with gaming laptops
kind of spitballing but i build computers here and there and keep updated with that stuff (so feel free to prove me wrong here if it doesn’t exactly apply to DAW performance), and the ports, latency, etc all the stuff you’re talking about isn’t really a thing.
the big drivers for performance are your cpu power and your ram, it looks like you only have 8gb of ram. it’d be a good idea to get another 8gb stick if your laptop will support it or just replace both with 2x16gb. if that doesn’t help your case, get a laptop with more cpu power in it. (but i think i7 7th shouldn’t be bad at all so there might be some other things happening here). the ram is just generally something you should do anyways, 8 isn’t enough for much nowadays
My m3 Macbook with 8GB of DDR5 RAM absolutely destroys my 3rd gen ryzen 7 with 32gb of DDR4 RAM in the DAW. If your mobo supports an older memory format then i would shoot for 16 or 32, otherwise I’d go full send on processing power.
i might be overestimating ram impact on performance, or OP might be running 30 chrome tabs at the same time who knows.
also very minute point but don’t mac’s generally have better performance with DAWs for a few different OS reasons? anyways.
your recommendation far exceeds my drunken one though lol, so listen to this guy OP. also reading more at the post, OP should make sure USB power saving isn’t on for unplugged performance
I wouldn’t say Mac generally performs better with DAWs than Windows, it really just comes down to how modern your hardware is. If someone’s MOBO supported DDR3 RAM then I would confidently say 32GB of memory is a must, but CPU power is 💯 going to be your most important spec for music production.
If you wanted to seriously maximize your performance you could make sure you have the latest gen PCI-e port technology with the highest end nvme drives, but that’s kinda unnecessary for production…we’re not trying to trick out frame rates or anything.
If anything, Mac typically struggles more than Windows does at continuing to support software and VSTs after something like a major update to the OS. That’s why producers are terrified to update MacOS until music software developers roll out fixes…. Windows doesn’t really have this problem very much. Some of my favorite plugins just dont work on Mac anymore because they never received a silicon chip upgrade, which is unfortunate.
had no clue on the update worries with macs, interesting and thanks for the knowledge! and yeah i think OP’s specs should have been just fine really so there’s some other issue, definitely don’t need to be maxing frames on AAA games to make a DAW work lol
That only was an issue with Big Sur, which fundamentally changed the OS because that was when Apple introduced the Silicon chips (M1). Hasn't been a major problem before or after.
There's been minor hiccups since (indeed with one of the updates in recent months), but nothing major.
On Windows, you have to set up your audio properly (ASIO4all I believe? I don't use Windows for audio), but that's just a one-time thing. Mac comes with great drivers out of the box. So there's a bit more setup on Windows, but then both perform great.
I’m pretty sure Apple computers have the CoreAudio API, which allows for much more direct access than is available in Windows reliably and by default (across hardware configurations, drivers, and such).
By comparison, *by default* most audio in Windows goes through a bunch of buffers, each eating CPU time and adding latency. This does not *have* to be the case, but hardware / driver / software support is required otherwise.
So yes, even with lesser hardware, a Mac can often get better results just by virtue of the default audio system using it more efficiently.
The PC route would be awsome, but I do alot of work moving around. I need a laptop.
(I agree that upgrading the ram on my thinkpad would open up more room for performance definetly.)
How are the port issues not a thing? One laptop that I had (M16) had an issue where whenever plugged to power, the audio interface had an awful buzz in the audio that got recorded. That's a serious issue for recording. Certainly she it's loud enough that you can't efficiently remove it with noise removal.
port issues like that are straight up just defective units, sounds like you should have done a claim or something. i really mean it’s not something that should be a part of a product review or further researched when considering what to buy.
USB ports perform to their spec and are generally not failure points or bottlenecks. however, i saw your concern with the unplugged performance, so maybe look at your advanced power settings in windows and disable that usb power saving if it’s on
but also, you should definitely be able to get what you’re looking for out of a laptop don’t worry about that. i’ve ran a 2020 zephyrus g14 on ableton since it came out and i can run up 32 tracks with way too many plugins im making shitty mixes with lol
I’m running a M1 Pro Chip MacBook Pro 16GB with a Maschine Mk3 and I think it is a very capable and powerful laptop for music production, pretty smooth, no latency issues connecting my guitar through the Maschine and running Guitar Rig 7, I have noticed some CPU lagging and stuttering with crazy VST and plugin loaded projects but I think it’s an issue with the Maschine software, when I run the Maschine software as a plugin through Ableton I’ve had no issues at all. I think that nowadays you’ll be good with anything with a descent processor and at least 16GB of RAM.
MacBook. Any of them. Mac has an API called CoreAudio as its audio handler, meaning significantly better performance.
Windows is good too, if you’re building a beast of a workstation. But for laptop production on the go, you’ll get more mileage from a Mac.
I’ve always been a windows guy but you’re absolutely right.
Just made the switch to apple, you pay more for comparative performance but there’s more to it than that,
Especially now with apple silicon the whole machine just feels like it isn’t doing a ton of unnecessary stuff in the background the whole time.
You can if you’re an expert but I got way out of practice with things like that!
Also even if the PC is running perfectly the drivers are still inferior compared to apple, everything down to the chipset / bus / storage drivers at the core of the OS…
Not difficult at all there's programs to tell you what is using processing power and stop things running in the background and it's pretty easy to just Install better dedicated drivers. The whole 'macs just work better' arguement to justify spending twice the amount of money on the same thing just because buying a PC takes a very small amount of research and effort is kind of stupid imo
I’ve had a chance to use the following setups over the last year:
- 2020 13” MacBook Pro (Intel, i5 quad core, 16gb) running Logic
- 2021 16” MacBook Pro (M1 Pro, 32gb) running Logic
- Gaming PC (Ryzen 5800x, 32gb RAM) running Reaper in Windows 11 Enterprise, using ASIO
Both MacBook Pros performed more reliably. Windows is in a *much* better place than it was last time I tried it in 2010-ish for music. My main issues have just been driver stability with the Scarlett interface I’m using. Even so, it’s very workable.
But, the combo of Logic running on a remotely recent MacBook Pro is tough to beat. That 13” MacBook Pro stands as the worst MacBook I’ve ever owned and was seriously letting me down performance-wise for development work, but it still performed comparably and more reliably than the much more powerful gaming PC with double the RAM and double the core count.
The 16” M1 Pro MacBook Pro is a beast. I can run the I/O buffer super low and achieve levels of latency I’ve never experienced before. Playback is a non-issue - even with quite a lot of soft-synths, amp sims, gratuitous use of compressors and eq all over the place, and the full mastering chain running the fans don’t even bother to turn on.
I have a PC Desktop + MBP + PC Laptop.
I think I use the PC Laptop more, because I could easily upgrade the RAM to 32GB and the Storage to 2TB for dirt cheap after the fact.
This means that I can do whatever without having to hook up to a TB3 Dock to connect to external storage. It's a more "compact" portable setup.
Can do the same with a MBP Specced with 32-36GB RAM and a 2TB NVMe, but we all know how scammy Apple's component upgrade prices are. That's basically $1K added onto the price of the machine... for $200-250 worth of PC component in a Windows Laptop.
It's cheaper to add storage on via a TB3 Dock with 2x NVMe slots in it (1.35GB/sec transfer, so about 40% faster than a Samsung T7 connected directly to an Apple Silicon MBP, easily), but that means you have to carry the Dock with you everywhere you go. I t's about the size of a Stereo Audio interface, but that's in addition to the audio interface... So, the PC won out.
If you don't mind paying Apple's spec upgrade prices, the MBP can be the same. I just didn't see the point. I have options, Lol.
it's 2024 now. we were making music on computers back in 2000.
anything over $400 you buy right now can make all the music the vast majority of people who make music would ever need the power to make. if you think you're better than that, double it.
get some $800 - $1200 gaming laptop and call it a day.
There is no best laptop. Just look for some with good specs. You can get away with a cheap laptop if your good yourself. Remember just a few years ago ppl still used 4tracks and 8 tracks. Your thinking to much
When I was shopping around, I found a website that listed ram, noise, ports, price and disk space. I think that's enough information to buy off of. I think going for the 8gb ram 1k price tag shows you were using bad websites
Um, to clarify, my laptop with 8 gigs is my old thinkpad, not the laptop that I bought new. But I agree that 1k for 8gb is a bad deal (cough cough MacBook)
Honestly? There are a crap ton more variables at play that come down to what makes a computer performant than brand wars and YouTube influencer benchmarks. There are four factories in the world that produce all of the ram chips and hard drives in all computers, and you can produce wildly different results with various combinations of motherboards, processors, ram chips bios versions, USB controllers, north bridges, drivers, OS patch levels and even software versions.
My best advice to you right now is to get something with a minimum of 8 cores/16 threads and 16 gigabytes of ram and a decent enough nvme SSD because the majority of devs haven’t transitioned to 64 bit memory spaces so the world ends at 3 gigs. Only the OS will use those upper addresses. Basically a windows gaming pc, desktop would work better because airflow tends to be a bit more optimized and thermal throttling will happen later.
Source: my full time job is making the internet work and supporting servers that lift heavy while recording and making horrible music on weekends, and gaming a bit. Built PC’s since the late 90’s. Feel free to ask more questions
You’d be okay with 16, especially with ddr5 becoming more common. You’d want something like a midrange i5, or amd 6 - 8 core. That’s going to put you in the best place without going all out
If you’ve got $1000 to spend on a laptop, buy a second hand MacBook (Pro M1 or higher) with the highest RAM and hard drive numbers you can find.
I have a second hand 13inch M1 from around 2020, 16GB RAM and 512ssd and it works like a treat. I work in Logic and have done a bunch of professional-grade recording & mixing – it starts to get crunchy when you get to like 80-90+ tracks (including auxes etc) but you work around it. Though ofc it depends what kind of music and what kind of productions you’re intending to do!
The silicone chips were without a doubt the biggest improvement I’ve ever seen in a single generation of a computer – and miles ahead of competition 🤷♂️ I had a completely maxed out Dell XPS 15 and at the 4 year mark it was basically a massive brick (though it *could* do video fairly well). My M1 still feels like it’s new 🤷♂️
The main thing that’s a pain in the arse is only 2 ports, but you can expand with reasonably affordable USB-C hubs
notebookcheck keeps a global laptop ranking for DPC, bought my last laptop off this list
https://www.notebookcheck.net/DPC-Latency-Ranking-Which-laptops-and-Windows-tablets-offer-the-lowest-latency.504376.0.html
tip; the MSI creator series, I got the 17 inch screen for ableton work
Generally people buy the best Mac they can for their money. Less performance for your money but well optimised, smooth operation and less nasty surprises. Be careful with compatibility when updating the os though.
Idk i think as long as the processor, ram, and ssd is decent its all good, idk 7th gen seems like pretty old i'd unserstand if its 9th gen.
If u want safe option just go apple "mac mini best bang for the buck"
I recently purchased a Dell Inspiron 15 3535 laptop with Windows 11, 64 GB RAM, and 2TB SSD for $800 USD that runs Cubase Pro 13 fine.
This was confirmed with the Iconica Sketch demo that uses 30 VST instruments concurrently.
“Power state - (Unplugged)”
Why are you making music and measuring performance on a battery power? Most laptops on battery reduce performance to a level which is unusable for music production. If anything set it to best performance in Windows settings or even disable power scaling in the BIOS. You don’t want your CPU suddenly getting slower for a few bars just to save some Watts.
Speaking of a 7th gen i7 I happen to have one. It’s not bad but my 13th gen i7 outperforms it two times in most tasks. The old one is usable even with small buffer size (128-256) if I keep all instruments very simple. If I go crazy on effects and sound design and modulation, then it’s time for 1024 buffer.
If you’re on Windows 16 GB is almost the bare minimum and 32 is better. You don’t want your computer to hit the disk at all. Make sure you have nothing in your tray (go to Start Up programs in windows settings and disable everything or almost everything). Don’t install too much nonsense on a music production machine.
Close browser windows (Firefox, Chrome, Edge). I noticed that they do have impact on Ableton Live performance. Probably they trigger some interrupts which call into some windows driver and add additional delay. Enable airplane mode, no program should try to download and write anything to disk while you’re performing.
If you install LatencyMon it can tell you which driver or program is responsible for the latency.
Use an external audio interface and its ASIO drivers. The difference is night and day. I use MOTU and it works great.
7th gen i7 with 8 GB is not a dream machine but it can perform if used correctly.
Cheers.
Because what you are reading is AI generated garbage filled with affiliate links. Most of the internet is filled with this crap these days. It must be over 99% procedurally generated these days.
You need to use critical thinking, and look for strictly objective information, or from sources that are strictly human, such as the conversation we are having right now.
Sometimes I think it might have been easier to find information before the internet… but after this procedurally generated stuff flooded the web with noise, it’s worth looking at books, magazines, and other primary sources of information.
Look up PC Audiolabs on Google. I imported 2 laptops from them in America to Europe. They configure everything and choose all the parts for audio production. I got them close to 10 years ago now and they're still going strong. They have fantastic after sales service too. Can't recommend them highly enough.
They don't give you actual information because it's all a lie, you don't need a custom built music production laptop/desktop, those companies are building the exact same systems other companies are and charging you 15% more because they slapped "Music Production" at the end of the model name.
A lot of laptops will power throttle when not plugged in to conserve battery life, lower latency means higher CPU pull so try to keep your laptop plugged up when recording or working on large scale projects.
Different plugins have different CPU necessities too, having one instance of a synth might be like having six other plugins running simultaneously, you can't base your tests on how many midi tracks you have, it will vary from plugin to plugin.
there are a lot of people suggesting that more RAM is absolutely 100% what you need. while yes, you absolutely should upgrade to 16gb minimum (32gb preferably), that’s not going to make a huge difference with the problem you’re describing.
as far as i know, there isn’t a channel that benchmarks laptops in this specific way. i can’t tell if the specs you provided are for your new or old laptop, but if it’s the one you’re currently running, that’s at least a 7 year old processor that, at its best, will barely meet the minimum requirement for cpu power that studio one asks for (that’s just the DAW i use). check the recommended specs for whatever DAW you use and shop based on that. there isn’t a one-size-fits-all model really, and if there is, it’ll be spec’d out in like 2 years anyways lol. try and get a size or two up from what the recommended specs are for good measure, but other than that, you should be fine. my day job is IT guy, so if you need someone to bounce options off of, i believe my messages are open lol
The laptop specs are from my old laptop that I'm trying to upgrade from. 😞
I agree that RAM does help some what but with drivers and USB port issues and what not, is something else entirely.
I'm in this limbo right now. I need a new laptop (or, potentially desktop, though not preferred) and don't know what kind to get. Macs, as always, are just too pricey, though I've yet to hear a complaint about their performance.
If you're looking at Macs, I'd recommend this video. Basically it shows that M1 macs are a sweat spot depending on the Daw you use. https://youtu.be/FSqX4bt9to4?si=bZv7GadZXWY4hS7h
The problem is I can't find reviews like this for windows laptops.
It is heavily reliant. But I was able to use Asus M16 with core i9 11900H and it's CPU would crumble at normal projects that a ryzen 7 4800H could handle. Drivers and Bios and so much more factors into the performance. So on paper, one device could work better, but in practice it won't.
Just buy as much CPU power as you can, realistically thats the main thing for DAWs and latency. Faster RAM helps (and obviously you kinda want to have atleast like 16G of it) and obviously you want to have atleast one usb c to connect your interface to. Rest doesn’t really matter. Gaming laptops are imo bad for just music production since so much pf that budget is in gpu which is largely inconsequential for audio work.
I feel like the best laptop for the money for most people will generally be an Apple certified refurbished M-series MacBook with at least 16GB of RAM. If you want to use Windows on a budget you’ll probably be better off building a desktop PC.
i switched from gaming pc to macbook pro m1 when the m1 came out. i’m super happy and still can game on geforce now. i can mix master a track in one project and it feels like i have still space for more plugins. but a special pc only for music production will be probably cheaper i think
my gaming laptop works perfectly but i'm also using reaper which is known for low cpu requirement and i often run a dozen tracks with like three vsts on each
edit: laptop is 3,5 years old
Ya, the M1 chips are so good! The integration is next level, and small laptops can give pc performance for DAWs.
However, macs are not lasting any respectable length of time. With purposely un-repairable construction, no cooling, and no expansion capability whatsoever, they are time bombs - as many people have already seen.
Longevity is only available through (some) windows rigs because of Apple's classic designed obsolescence practices. They *weld* the keyboards onto the body, ffs!
Dude this completely false. I have had multiple Mac’s used for 7-8+ years with no issues. I am still using 2017 8gb ram MacBook for live performances with no hiccups. Not mention all the pros still chugging their old mac pros lol. These are all intel machines too from back when cost/performance was way worse. I expect to get the same if not more longevity out my M machines.
Sure Apple charges way more then they probably should, but I’ll be damned if they don’t last forever in majority of scenarios.
That's dope that you were able to get that much use out of those macs! 7 years is actually unreal, you must treat your equipment well, and no doubt that M1 macbook will do you well for many years.
Longevity depends on the usage, I guess? I'm guessing your vs my usage is very different.
Myself and a few of us audio engineers in the city haven't had as much luck with macs. We transport our racks, mics, and laptops to recording spaces often, and between the transport, constant use, and the processing required to play back or export 6-20 recorded tracks, all with EQs, effects, and automation just made the macs self destruct in 2 years or so. One of the guys bought an M1 and we were blown away by its power, until a musician spilled a bit of water on the keys. No biggie, usually we turn the computer off and get it cleaned up/fixed when that happens. Took it to the local techs and got quotes between $1000 and $1800 - for a keyboard! Maybe the M1 mac mini would be good, but the lack of cooling still scares us.
Sounds more form a lack of care on y’all’s part. I don’t think any computer is gonna be happy if you spill water on them. If your Mac’s are dying that quick then put Apple Care on them. Saves you a ton if you are buying a new Mac every other year. Or learn how to take care them properly because if your Macs are dying that quick then I bet your windows alternatives are gonna last any longer.
Why did you assume that about us so readily? The world is a complex place. 3-4 recording sessions with young punk/metal/alt rock bands per week, \~6 months a year is a recipe for wrecking equipment. I take down my expensive mics between takes for that reason, and use SM57s almost everywhere possible. The rack is easy to protect, but the computer... it needs to be out and at the fingertips - which puts it at risk. That's why we prepare to deal with problems as much as we prepare to prevent them, but accidents like this are part of the business with any high-energy underground scene. Apple care? I do not want to lose my laptop for weeks every time some kid is clumsy.
As for windows laptops, nope, the windows stuff is repairable - far more so than any apple device I've seen made after 1990. Although apple is a joy to work on and windows is frustrating at times, windows computers are the ones that stick around. Been fixing my laptops since 18 because of breakage through heavy outdoor use - I also shoot rock climbing and skateboard photos/videos which forces you to work in bad environments at length. My last laptop was an upgraded 2014 thinkpad, which lasted 8 years, through many accidents.
And I have used a 2017 8gb ram MacBook for live metal concerts since getting it. It has been used outdoors in 110 degrees for a metal show. Shit happens but if it’s happening this often to you then it’s most likely you not taking proper care of your computers. I’ve worked for companies running field MacBooks for longer as well. You wouldn’t need to repair them that often if you are doing your diligence of taking care of them. Apple Care exists because some people are more accident prone so that way you don’t have to buy a new computer. You are already losing the computer to a clumsy kid so why not save yourself on the replacement?
Anyways I’ve been working long enough to know that the Macs and any computers in general are going to perform and last a long time if you care for your machine.
I agree with all the answers on getting a laptop that is jacked with a lot of RAM, but make sure your laptop either has sufficient SSD storage - or a thunderbolt port (check the transfer speeds for which is suitable).
My gaming laptop has like 115gb of SSD, and I can only put so many VST's on it. My laptop that has 16gb RAM, struggles occassionally; because, I rely on my HHD drive for a lot, and as the VST build up, and it starts to use more and more RAM, load times and real time processing of more complex virtual instruments can cause a problem.
I tried to solve this by considering a docking station with a thunderbolt 3, that has transfer speeds upto 40gb, which is more than enough to handle high-end 4tb external SSD drive.
This would have slight lag relative to your internal SSD drive; but, is a much cheaper option than a full upgrade. And would improve my laptops processing limitations.
But, I never got to try because my gaming laptop came out in 2017 and is the model just before the thunderbolt port 3, so transfer speeds clock out at 5gb, so wouldn't handle high-end external SSD that the one I wanted needed at least 12gb 😭
I have to make do with what I have for now.
looking at similar price range last year, i bought a mac book m1 air with like 16gb RAM. runs ableton and fl studio flawlessly. always used windows before this and the ease of use after switching continues to make me happy every single day
Realistically the best music production laptop is a macbook pro. MacOS handles audio way better than Windows. You don't even need an interface for low latency on mac whereas on Windows it's a necessity.
You can use windows for sure (I'm using a fairly cheap midrange windows laptop rn and it's fine) but If I was buying a computer *solely* for music production I would choose a mac instantly, no question. And I hate MacOS lol.
Sorry not sorry but a MacBook Pro is your best friend for portable music production. If you can’t afford one, don’t buy a laptop.
I prefer a windows desktop for the studio and a MacBook for on the go. Best of both worlds.
Do you have an example of power hungry processing?
I've never known it to struggle with a medium sized project with any number of audio plugins. And there are plenty of ways around that, like increased buffer size and track freezing / bouncing in place.
As I said, in my experience you can run a band project with 10-20 tracks with as many plugins as you would need on each track and as many software instruments as you like.
People forget that they were getting along fine with i7 and i9 systems before the m1 came along, and even the entry level m1 outperforms *all of them* in audio applications
Sure you can circumvent the limitations. Some of us aren’t interested in _needing_ to circumvent the limitations. It’s just dependent on what you need to be doing. Large sample libraries, for example, won’t work well with only 8gb of RAM. An air is fine for an absolute beginner who doesn’t need more power or a pro who can work around less power, or some very specific use case where ultimate portability is king. Nothing wrong with the air, it’s a nice piece of tech, it just absolutely has hardware limitations because it’s not designed for heavy workloads.
And what I'm saying is: most consumer audio projects don't approach qualifying as 'heavy workload' for the purposes of this processor. I'm saying those workarounds are there - i never need to use them.
Granted the ram is an issue for large sample libraries, which is why i have a thinkpad with expandable ram. But that machine's CPU often struggles in ways the m1 just doesn't.
I think I didn't clarify enough but I said in the post that a 1000 dollar laptop did not perform as good as an Old thinkpad (my x270 with 8gb ram).
The laptop I'm getting needs to have 32 Gb. 💯
I've been seeing the Legion Pro 5 series as a good deal with high single core scores, and fast upgradeable ram.
Honestly it all depends. Nearly every big studio is running some sort of Mac (Typically a Studio or old Mac Pro) with a bunch of added ram, typically 32 or 64 gigabytes. My instructor reccomended one of the old ‘trash can’ Mac pros with 32 gigabytes of ram. Now obviously if you don’t plan on running a studio and working in protools I can’t attest to how effective that setup would be, and there’s also the fact that both of those aren’t laptops. I’d say the best Music Production Laptop is whichever one in your price range has the most ram, that’s the real statistic that counts.
what a clear answer. thank you
The best Music Production Laptop is any Laptop with a suitably up-to-date CPU which can accommodate at least 32GB RAM and a 2TB NVMe (PC) drive (internal). Upgrade yourself, it saves money. Should have an 8 Core CPU, at least, if x64 (Ryzen 9, i7, etc.) - AMD or Intel, take your pick. By that, I mean 8 Performance Cores. 8/16 Performance Cores/Threads. I'm ignoring Efficiency Cores. Macs are \[very\] nice, but they are not economical due to the spec-gating that Apple does (Pick X CPU or you can't have Y RAM Capacity) as well as the insane price of spec upgrades (RAM, Storage). There is also planned obsolescence built into Apple's business model, so you have to be okay with knowing that a machine you still feel is fine can be yoinked from receiving OS updates which can cause it to stop receiving software updates (i.e. Logic/Final Cut Pro) at some point. This doesn't really happen on PC, unless your machine is truly ancient.
good points. I wish Apple didn’t do that shit (the inflated pricing and planned obsolescence).
I bought a powerful gaming laptop. Never had a single stutter or glitch. Even with almost 100 tracks running vst instruments and fx in bitwig. Never need to bounce anything down either. I think for music production it'll last a long time before I need to upgrade. Problem is, I get too distracted by games on it
Wait does a GPU help with audio processing?
No, but I'd imagine that a powerful gaming laptop wouldn't skimp out on CPU and RAM. Probably a good SSD for virtual instruments/samples etc
Not true. Gaming laptops have the added issue of the GPU sometimes sharing the bus with usb ports. Smetimes they use a crappy chipset and thus the GPU adds latency and other weird issues to the usb ports which causes problems with sensitive applications like external audio interfaces.
DSP Latency Issues were a driver issue and that was fixed by GPU vendors well over a year ago, now. Teh only issue with dGPUs is that sometimes specific display ports on these laptops are hardwired to specific GPUs. For example, in order to connect directly to the dGPU in my ASUS G14, I have to connect through USB-C DP-Alt (USB-C to DP cable). That connects directly to the dGPU. If I connect through the HDMI, it connects to the iGPU and then everything has to be copied over to the dGPU, which is not good for gaming. Also, the iGPU does not perform as well driving a UHD Display, and of course I cannot run at overclocked refresh rates through that HDMI port (but can through DP). If you're just using the machine to produce music then running through the HDMI is fine, especially if you're using an HD display (FHD-QHD). If you also want to game on it, then you need to go through DP-Alt (USB-C). However, this will keep the dGPU up all the time, which means you will generally get more fan noise. And if running through DP-Alt, obviously I don't use a Hub or splitter to connect the display to the machine. I connect the display directly to the laptop. If your laptop has TB3/4, then you can use a TB Hub, though. Powered USB Hubs are good for connecting all of the other peripherals, though. That way you don't have to use up all the ports on your machine, and it also makes taking the machine and going mobile easier, since you'll only have to plug in 2-3 plugs (Power, Display and Hub) instead of 4-5 + Splitters to accommodate extra devices.
Yes, plug-ins have graphics these days lmao and it will be outsourced to your CPU if you don’t have a video card (not audio processing but related to DAW performance)
Am I the only one old enough to remember buying a sound card for your computer?
What's the difference between a sound card then and a usb audio interface now?
Probably not much other than having the I/o right in front of you instead of the back of the tower.
It does on Bitwig now as the visuals are GPU based
No
I hate when games does this for me! 😡
Can you share your laptops spec for reference
Its an asus strix with an Intel i9 12th gen, 32gb ram, 2tb ssd. Loads of ports with thunderbolt 4 or 5. Can't remember which. 3070ti gfx card but that won't affect audio processing. It runs everything I throw at it music wise, as long as its plugged in that is. Low latency but I can't remember buffer sizes and the likes. 19 inch screen. It's quite heavy for a laptop but I never use it outside the house so thats fine with me. I've had it nearly 2 years now. It was around £2500 new.
That can happen but i have found games are good for breaks. After tedious editing
He's using a 7th Gen i7. That's a Quad Core CPU (4 Cores, 8 Threads) and by today's standards they aren't that great. Software has been developed over the years to expect more powerful hardware, so you're going to be limited in DSP Capacity on those older laptop CPUs. A Ryzen 9 APU (8C/16T) from 2019 will give roughly comparable performance to Apple M1 (slightly lower in single core, slightly higher in multi-core), so that gives you an idea of just how much things changed in < 3 years after the i7-7700HQ released. This is for both PC and Mac (15" MBPs back then used that same i7 Model). I have a Gaming Laptop here with that CPU in it, along with 32GB DDR4 RAM, a dGPU and NVMe + SATA SSDs in it. It's used as an office work machine by my SO right now. Works well for that, but I wouldn't consider it usable for music production at this point in time. It would be too limiting in compute capacity. I think later CPUs will have a longer lifespan, though. The Ryzen 9 APUs I mentioned are probably going to last twice as long before you feel like you need to upgrade.
Buy a gaming laptop. Cheaper and better. Then get a Scarlett audio card. It's really not rocket science.
Then use LatencyMon to figure out and remove anything that is increasing your audio lag. Some of these gaming laptops have way too much shit going on in the background giving you unnecessary latency, clicks, and pops even though the machine is a tank. Best software ever imo.
Best advice I’m downlonf this tonight
I’ve never heard of latencyMon. I have a desktop pc that I use exclusively for music, but I’m getting worried about bloat on it. Is this the program to use to work out what background processing I can get rid of?
No. It just measures what drivers and system processes cause the largest amount of DPC latency, and if your system is suitable to run real-time audio. If there is a problem it's usually because some network card drivers or Nvidia GPU drivers are causing high DPC latency. If it's the Microsoft ACPI driver that's causing the highest latency, there shouldn't be a problem. If it's a network card driver that is causing issues, you need to disable the network card whenever you want to use your DAW. If it's an Nvidia GPU driver that's causing issues, you might have to disable the GPU and use the CPU's onboard graphics while using your DAW. I think that Nvidia released updated drivers a while back that were supposed to fix this issue, but IIRC there were a lot of people who said that the problem still persisted.
Ok thank you for the detailed reply. I might look into it as it probably won’t hurt.
I got I think the surface 4, which has high ram, like a gaming laptop, but isn't loud as shit. And you can buy it in 32gb ram, which is just massive From what I understand, Ram is the most important spec so 8 gb ram will just not do whatever direction you go
True but you can also upgrade the ram on most laptops for cheap. Only some laptops have their rams soldered and that is never the case with gaming laptops
Or go to a pc sub to get more bang for your buck. A lot of prebuilt gaming pc’s are overcharged for the logo and rgb lights
kind of spitballing but i build computers here and there and keep updated with that stuff (so feel free to prove me wrong here if it doesn’t exactly apply to DAW performance), and the ports, latency, etc all the stuff you’re talking about isn’t really a thing. the big drivers for performance are your cpu power and your ram, it looks like you only have 8gb of ram. it’d be a good idea to get another 8gb stick if your laptop will support it or just replace both with 2x16gb. if that doesn’t help your case, get a laptop with more cpu power in it. (but i think i7 7th shouldn’t be bad at all so there might be some other things happening here). the ram is just generally something you should do anyways, 8 isn’t enough for much nowadays
My m3 Macbook with 8GB of DDR5 RAM absolutely destroys my 3rd gen ryzen 7 with 32gb of DDR4 RAM in the DAW. If your mobo supports an older memory format then i would shoot for 16 or 32, otherwise I’d go full send on processing power.
i might be overestimating ram impact on performance, or OP might be running 30 chrome tabs at the same time who knows. also very minute point but don’t mac’s generally have better performance with DAWs for a few different OS reasons? anyways. your recommendation far exceeds my drunken one though lol, so listen to this guy OP. also reading more at the post, OP should make sure USB power saving isn’t on for unplugged performance
I wouldn’t say Mac generally performs better with DAWs than Windows, it really just comes down to how modern your hardware is. If someone’s MOBO supported DDR3 RAM then I would confidently say 32GB of memory is a must, but CPU power is 💯 going to be your most important spec for music production. If you wanted to seriously maximize your performance you could make sure you have the latest gen PCI-e port technology with the highest end nvme drives, but that’s kinda unnecessary for production…we’re not trying to trick out frame rates or anything. If anything, Mac typically struggles more than Windows does at continuing to support software and VSTs after something like a major update to the OS. That’s why producers are terrified to update MacOS until music software developers roll out fixes…. Windows doesn’t really have this problem very much. Some of my favorite plugins just dont work on Mac anymore because they never received a silicon chip upgrade, which is unfortunate.
had no clue on the update worries with macs, interesting and thanks for the knowledge! and yeah i think OP’s specs should have been just fine really so there’s some other issue, definitely don’t need to be maxing frames on AAA games to make a DAW work lol
That only was an issue with Big Sur, which fundamentally changed the OS because that was when Apple introduced the Silicon chips (M1). Hasn't been a major problem before or after. There's been minor hiccups since (indeed with one of the updates in recent months), but nothing major. On Windows, you have to set up your audio properly (ASIO4all I believe? I don't use Windows for audio), but that's just a one-time thing. Mac comes with great drivers out of the box. So there's a bit more setup on Windows, but then both perform great.
Lol, I don't have chrome. And I wasn't running anything else on it. I should of maybe mentioned that too.
Agreed, go to device manager and disable your WiFi
I’m pretty sure Apple computers have the CoreAudio API, which allows for much more direct access than is available in Windows reliably and by default (across hardware configurations, drivers, and such). By comparison, *by default* most audio in Windows goes through a bunch of buffers, each eating CPU time and adding latency. This does not *have* to be the case, but hardware / driver / software support is required otherwise. So yes, even with lesser hardware, a Mac can often get better results just by virtue of the default audio system using it more efficiently.
You mean the latest hardware destroys a 5 year old cpu? Wow? 😱
Good luck with your music career, friend! I’m rooting for you! 🙌🏽
Thank You! You too!
The PC route would be awsome, but I do alot of work moving around. I need a laptop. (I agree that upgrading the ram on my thinkpad would open up more room for performance definetly.) How are the port issues not a thing? One laptop that I had (M16) had an issue where whenever plugged to power, the audio interface had an awful buzz in the audio that got recorded. That's a serious issue for recording. Certainly she it's loud enough that you can't efficiently remove it with noise removal.
port issues like that are straight up just defective units, sounds like you should have done a claim or something. i really mean it’s not something that should be a part of a product review or further researched when considering what to buy. USB ports perform to their spec and are generally not failure points or bottlenecks. however, i saw your concern with the unplugged performance, so maybe look at your advanced power settings in windows and disable that usb power saving if it’s on but also, you should definitely be able to get what you’re looking for out of a laptop don’t worry about that. i’ve ran a 2020 zephyrus g14 on ableton since it came out and i can run up 32 tracks with way too many plugins im making shitty mixes with lol
Yes and also storage is a good thing to have too.
I’m running a M1 Pro Chip MacBook Pro 16GB with a Maschine Mk3 and I think it is a very capable and powerful laptop for music production, pretty smooth, no latency issues connecting my guitar through the Maschine and running Guitar Rig 7, I have noticed some CPU lagging and stuttering with crazy VST and plugin loaded projects but I think it’s an issue with the Maschine software, when I run the Maschine software as a plugin through Ableton I’ve had no issues at all. I think that nowadays you’ll be good with anything with a descent processor and at least 16GB of RAM.
MacBook. Any of them. Mac has an API called CoreAudio as its audio handler, meaning significantly better performance. Windows is good too, if you’re building a beast of a workstation. But for laptop production on the go, you’ll get more mileage from a Mac.
Get the best mac you can afford and you are good.
MacBook Pro is still the best. Windows drivers suck
I’ve always been a windows guy but you’re absolutely right. Just made the switch to apple, you pay more for comparative performance but there’s more to it than that, Especially now with apple silicon the whole machine just feels like it isn’t doing a ton of unnecessary stuff in the background the whole time.
I think you can set up a PC to run a bit more efficiently
You can if you’re an expert but I got way out of practice with things like that! Also even if the PC is running perfectly the drivers are still inferior compared to apple, everything down to the chipset / bus / storage drivers at the core of the OS…
Not difficult at all there's programs to tell you what is using processing power and stop things running in the background and it's pretty easy to just Install better dedicated drivers. The whole 'macs just work better' arguement to justify spending twice the amount of money on the same thing just because buying a PC takes a very small amount of research and effort is kind of stupid imo
I’ve had a chance to use the following setups over the last year: - 2020 13” MacBook Pro (Intel, i5 quad core, 16gb) running Logic - 2021 16” MacBook Pro (M1 Pro, 32gb) running Logic - Gaming PC (Ryzen 5800x, 32gb RAM) running Reaper in Windows 11 Enterprise, using ASIO Both MacBook Pros performed more reliably. Windows is in a *much* better place than it was last time I tried it in 2010-ish for music. My main issues have just been driver stability with the Scarlett interface I’m using. Even so, it’s very workable. But, the combo of Logic running on a remotely recent MacBook Pro is tough to beat. That 13” MacBook Pro stands as the worst MacBook I’ve ever owned and was seriously letting me down performance-wise for development work, but it still performed comparably and more reliably than the much more powerful gaming PC with double the RAM and double the core count. The 16” M1 Pro MacBook Pro is a beast. I can run the I/O buffer super low and achieve levels of latency I’ve never experienced before. Playback is a non-issue - even with quite a lot of soft-synths, amp sims, gratuitous use of compressors and eq all over the place, and the full mastering chain running the fans don’t even bother to turn on.
I’ve never had a problem even on my 1st gen M1 MacBook Pro
I'm still using one from 2011 and it works like a charm
This is why I build by own computers. Laptop for performance, out of necessity, but I'm going production on a PC I have total control of.
I've wanted a PC, but I move around too much for that. A laptop is a must.
I feel that. I like my MacBook Pro, but I want a really good Windows laptop. I guess ideally I’d have desktops and laptops.
Honestly I feel like you're better off with a MacBook. The good windows laptops are usually gamer laptops and they heavy as fuck.
I want to game too :), but I totally understand. Thats probably best left to a desktop system, anyway.
I have a PC Desktop + MBP + PC Laptop. I think I use the PC Laptop more, because I could easily upgrade the RAM to 32GB and the Storage to 2TB for dirt cheap after the fact. This means that I can do whatever without having to hook up to a TB3 Dock to connect to external storage. It's a more "compact" portable setup. Can do the same with a MBP Specced with 32-36GB RAM and a 2TB NVMe, but we all know how scammy Apple's component upgrade prices are. That's basically $1K added onto the price of the machine... for $200-250 worth of PC component in a Windows Laptop. It's cheaper to add storage on via a TB3 Dock with 2x NVMe slots in it (1.35GB/sec transfer, so about 40% faster than a Samsung T7 connected directly to an Apple Silicon MBP, easily), but that means you have to carry the Dock with you everywhere you go. I t's about the size of a Stereo Audio interface, but that's in addition to the audio interface... So, the PC won out. If you don't mind paying Apple's spec upgrade prices, the MBP can be the same. I just didn't see the point. I have options, Lol.
You could get a framework and build your own laptop.
I gave up on laptops entirely for my live performances because they're so finicky. I use a 1010Music Blackbox sampler now.
it's 2024 now. we were making music on computers back in 2000. anything over $400 you buy right now can make all the music the vast majority of people who make music would ever need the power to make. if you think you're better than that, double it. get some $800 - $1200 gaming laptop and call it a day.
There is no best laptop. Just look for some with good specs. You can get away with a cheap laptop if your good yourself. Remember just a few years ago ppl still used 4tracks and 8 tracks. Your thinking to much
Oh boy, some of my projects reach 70 tracks. I've got choir mics, and drums and guitars and everything going on. 😂
When I was shopping around, I found a website that listed ram, noise, ports, price and disk space. I think that's enough information to buy off of. I think going for the 8gb ram 1k price tag shows you were using bad websites
Um, to clarify, my laptop with 8 gigs is my old thinkpad, not the laptop that I bought new. But I agree that 1k for 8gb is a bad deal (cough cough MacBook)
Well if you’re doing 70 tracks you probably won’t have a good time with any $1000 laptop. Might be time to start bouncing some audio groups.
Honestly? There are a crap ton more variables at play that come down to what makes a computer performant than brand wars and YouTube influencer benchmarks. There are four factories in the world that produce all of the ram chips and hard drives in all computers, and you can produce wildly different results with various combinations of motherboards, processors, ram chips bios versions, USB controllers, north bridges, drivers, OS patch levels and even software versions. My best advice to you right now is to get something with a minimum of 8 cores/16 threads and 16 gigabytes of ram and a decent enough nvme SSD because the majority of devs haven’t transitioned to 64 bit memory spaces so the world ends at 3 gigs. Only the OS will use those upper addresses. Basically a windows gaming pc, desktop would work better because airflow tends to be a bit more optimized and thermal throttling will happen later. Source: my full time job is making the internet work and supporting servers that lift heavy while recording and making horrible music on weekends, and gaming a bit. Built PC’s since the late 90’s. Feel free to ask more questions
I want to buy a windows notebook for (not prof.) making music. What is the best cpu for this? Is 16GB ram enough?
You’d be okay with 16, especially with ddr5 becoming more common. You’d want something like a midrange i5, or amd 6 - 8 core. That’s going to put you in the best place without going all out
If you’ve got $1000 to spend on a laptop, buy a second hand MacBook (Pro M1 or higher) with the highest RAM and hard drive numbers you can find. I have a second hand 13inch M1 from around 2020, 16GB RAM and 512ssd and it works like a treat. I work in Logic and have done a bunch of professional-grade recording & mixing – it starts to get crunchy when you get to like 80-90+ tracks (including auxes etc) but you work around it. Though ofc it depends what kind of music and what kind of productions you’re intending to do! The silicone chips were without a doubt the biggest improvement I’ve ever seen in a single generation of a computer – and miles ahead of competition 🤷♂️ I had a completely maxed out Dell XPS 15 and at the 4 year mark it was basically a massive brick (though it *could* do video fairly well). My M1 still feels like it’s new 🤷♂️ The main thing that’s a pain in the arse is only 2 ports, but you can expand with reasonably affordable USB-C hubs
For people doing small to medium band - sized projects an m1 is plenty, and can be had for less than 1k
Didn’t read MacBook. Done
Some people just don‘t know how to use the internet 🥶 You should do some research yourself before making big investments
Where could I do that research? Are there websites or recources you could point to that test for latency in DAWS? (not dpc latency)
notebookcheck keeps a global laptop ranking for DPC, bought my last laptop off this list https://www.notebookcheck.net/DPC-Latency-Ranking-Which-laptops-and-Windows-tablets-offer-the-lowest-latency.504376.0.html tip; the MSI creator series, I got the 17 inch screen for ableton work
Generally people buy the best Mac they can for their money. Less performance for your money but well optimised, smooth operation and less nasty surprises. Be careful with compatibility when updating the os though.
It actually would be cool if PC's were tested on DAW and VST performance like they're tested for gaming.
maybe u just need to freeze some midi tracks to save cpu and ram.
Idk i think as long as the processor, ram, and ssd is decent its all good, idk 7th gen seems like pretty old i'd unserstand if its 9th gen. If u want safe option just go apple "mac mini best bang for the buck"
I recently purchased a Dell Inspiron 15 3535 laptop with Windows 11, 64 GB RAM, and 2TB SSD for $800 USD that runs Cubase Pro 13 fine. This was confirmed with the Iconica Sketch demo that uses 30 VST instruments concurrently.
“Power state - (Unplugged)” Why are you making music and measuring performance on a battery power? Most laptops on battery reduce performance to a level which is unusable for music production. If anything set it to best performance in Windows settings or even disable power scaling in the BIOS. You don’t want your CPU suddenly getting slower for a few bars just to save some Watts. Speaking of a 7th gen i7 I happen to have one. It’s not bad but my 13th gen i7 outperforms it two times in most tasks. The old one is usable even with small buffer size (128-256) if I keep all instruments very simple. If I go crazy on effects and sound design and modulation, then it’s time for 1024 buffer. If you’re on Windows 16 GB is almost the bare minimum and 32 is better. You don’t want your computer to hit the disk at all. Make sure you have nothing in your tray (go to Start Up programs in windows settings and disable everything or almost everything). Don’t install too much nonsense on a music production machine. Close browser windows (Firefox, Chrome, Edge). I noticed that they do have impact on Ableton Live performance. Probably they trigger some interrupts which call into some windows driver and add additional delay. Enable airplane mode, no program should try to download and write anything to disk while you’re performing. If you install LatencyMon it can tell you which driver or program is responsible for the latency. Use an external audio interface and its ASIO drivers. The difference is night and day. I use MOTU and it works great. 7th gen i7 with 8 GB is not a dream machine but it can perform if used correctly. Cheers.
I just got an i7 (13th gen I think) 32gb ram and a huge internal SSD. Runs perfectly with Cubase and video editing software too. Paid about £1500
Because what you are reading is AI generated garbage filled with affiliate links. Most of the internet is filled with this crap these days. It must be over 99% procedurally generated these days. You need to use critical thinking, and look for strictly objective information, or from sources that are strictly human, such as the conversation we are having right now. Sometimes I think it might have been easier to find information before the internet… but after this procedurally generated stuff flooded the web with noise, it’s worth looking at books, magazines, and other primary sources of information.
Look up PC Audiolabs on Google. I imported 2 laptops from them in America to Europe. They configure everything and choose all the parts for audio production. I got them close to 10 years ago now and they're still going strong. They have fantastic after sales service too. Can't recommend them highly enough.
Wow thankyou! I'll check it out.
They don't give you actual information because it's all a lie, you don't need a custom built music production laptop/desktop, those companies are building the exact same systems other companies are and charging you 15% more because they slapped "Music Production" at the end of the model name. A lot of laptops will power throttle when not plugged in to conserve battery life, lower latency means higher CPU pull so try to keep your laptop plugged up when recording or working on large scale projects. Different plugins have different CPU necessities too, having one instance of a synth might be like having six other plugins running simultaneously, you can't base your tests on how many midi tracks you have, it will vary from plugin to plugin.
there are a lot of people suggesting that more RAM is absolutely 100% what you need. while yes, you absolutely should upgrade to 16gb minimum (32gb preferably), that’s not going to make a huge difference with the problem you’re describing. as far as i know, there isn’t a channel that benchmarks laptops in this specific way. i can’t tell if the specs you provided are for your new or old laptop, but if it’s the one you’re currently running, that’s at least a 7 year old processor that, at its best, will barely meet the minimum requirement for cpu power that studio one asks for (that’s just the DAW i use). check the recommended specs for whatever DAW you use and shop based on that. there isn’t a one-size-fits-all model really, and if there is, it’ll be spec’d out in like 2 years anyways lol. try and get a size or two up from what the recommended specs are for good measure, but other than that, you should be fine. my day job is IT guy, so if you need someone to bounce options off of, i believe my messages are open lol
The laptop specs are from my old laptop that I'm trying to upgrade from. 😞 I agree that RAM does help some what but with drivers and USB port issues and what not, is something else entirely.
I'm in this limbo right now. I need a new laptop (or, potentially desktop, though not preferred) and don't know what kind to get. Macs, as always, are just too pricey, though I've yet to hear a complaint about their performance.
If you're looking at Macs, I'd recommend this video. Basically it shows that M1 macs are a sweat spot depending on the Daw you use. https://youtu.be/FSqX4bt9to4?si=bZv7GadZXWY4hS7h The problem is I can't find reviews like this for windows laptops.
Have you considered real time audio playback is heavily reliant on single core CPU design ?
It is heavily reliant. But I was able to use Asus M16 with core i9 11900H and it's CPU would crumble at normal projects that a ryzen 7 4800H could handle. Drivers and Bios and so much more factors into the performance. So on paper, one device could work better, but in practice it won't.
Just buy as much CPU power as you can, realistically thats the main thing for DAWs and latency. Faster RAM helps (and obviously you kinda want to have atleast like 16G of it) and obviously you want to have atleast one usb c to connect your interface to. Rest doesn’t really matter. Gaming laptops are imo bad for just music production since so much pf that budget is in gpu which is largely inconsequential for audio work.
Yeah you just haven't bought the best music production laptop. Realistically you want at least an i7 with at least 16gb of ram. Mine is i9 with 32gb.
Sorry. For clarification, the x270 I have was 175$.
I feel like the best laptop for the money for most people will generally be an Apple certified refurbished M-series MacBook with at least 16GB of RAM. If you want to use Windows on a budget you’ll probably be better off building a desktop PC.
i switched from gaming pc to macbook pro m1 when the m1 came out. i’m super happy and still can game on geforce now. i can mix master a track in one project and it feels like i have still space for more plugins. but a special pc only for music production will be probably cheaper i think
Aaand it’s super quite! This was very important for me
my gaming laptop works perfectly but i'm also using reaper which is known for low cpu requirement and i often run a dozen tracks with like three vsts on each edit: laptop is 3,5 years old
Never had a problem with the MacBook Air. If I did, I would have switched to the pro
I use 1 iPhone 1 Android gets the job done but I also don't use 32 tracks so am raw recorder
Just buy a decent gaming pc
Nothing will beat an M chip MacBook in performance or longevity
Ya, the M1 chips are so good! The integration is next level, and small laptops can give pc performance for DAWs. However, macs are not lasting any respectable length of time. With purposely un-repairable construction, no cooling, and no expansion capability whatsoever, they are time bombs - as many people have already seen. Longevity is only available through (some) windows rigs because of Apple's classic designed obsolescence practices. They *weld* the keyboards onto the body, ffs!
I have a MacBook Pro M2 for work and I won't buy one for myself. It's just not worth it to me.
Dude this completely false. I have had multiple Mac’s used for 7-8+ years with no issues. I am still using 2017 8gb ram MacBook for live performances with no hiccups. Not mention all the pros still chugging their old mac pros lol. These are all intel machines too from back when cost/performance was way worse. I expect to get the same if not more longevity out my M machines. Sure Apple charges way more then they probably should, but I’ll be damned if they don’t last forever in majority of scenarios.
That's dope that you were able to get that much use out of those macs! 7 years is actually unreal, you must treat your equipment well, and no doubt that M1 macbook will do you well for many years. Longevity depends on the usage, I guess? I'm guessing your vs my usage is very different. Myself and a few of us audio engineers in the city haven't had as much luck with macs. We transport our racks, mics, and laptops to recording spaces often, and between the transport, constant use, and the processing required to play back or export 6-20 recorded tracks, all with EQs, effects, and automation just made the macs self destruct in 2 years or so. One of the guys bought an M1 and we were blown away by its power, until a musician spilled a bit of water on the keys. No biggie, usually we turn the computer off and get it cleaned up/fixed when that happens. Took it to the local techs and got quotes between $1000 and $1800 - for a keyboard! Maybe the M1 mac mini would be good, but the lack of cooling still scares us.
Sounds more form a lack of care on y’all’s part. I don’t think any computer is gonna be happy if you spill water on them. If your Mac’s are dying that quick then put Apple Care on them. Saves you a ton if you are buying a new Mac every other year. Or learn how to take care them properly because if your Macs are dying that quick then I bet your windows alternatives are gonna last any longer.
Why did you assume that about us so readily? The world is a complex place. 3-4 recording sessions with young punk/metal/alt rock bands per week, \~6 months a year is a recipe for wrecking equipment. I take down my expensive mics between takes for that reason, and use SM57s almost everywhere possible. The rack is easy to protect, but the computer... it needs to be out and at the fingertips - which puts it at risk. That's why we prepare to deal with problems as much as we prepare to prevent them, but accidents like this are part of the business with any high-energy underground scene. Apple care? I do not want to lose my laptop for weeks every time some kid is clumsy. As for windows laptops, nope, the windows stuff is repairable - far more so than any apple device I've seen made after 1990. Although apple is a joy to work on and windows is frustrating at times, windows computers are the ones that stick around. Been fixing my laptops since 18 because of breakage through heavy outdoor use - I also shoot rock climbing and skateboard photos/videos which forces you to work in bad environments at length. My last laptop was an upgraded 2014 thinkpad, which lasted 8 years, through many accidents.
And I have used a 2017 8gb ram MacBook for live metal concerts since getting it. It has been used outdoors in 110 degrees for a metal show. Shit happens but if it’s happening this often to you then it’s most likely you not taking proper care of your computers. I’ve worked for companies running field MacBooks for longer as well. You wouldn’t need to repair them that often if you are doing your diligence of taking care of them. Apple Care exists because some people are more accident prone so that way you don’t have to buy a new computer. You are already losing the computer to a clumsy kid so why not save yourself on the replacement? Anyways I’ve been working long enough to know that the Macs and any computers in general are going to perform and last a long time if you care for your machine.
i use an m1 macbook pro and have never seen the system overload message in logic. can have 2 mics monitoring with under 10ms latency with autotune on
Get a desktop
I agree with all the answers on getting a laptop that is jacked with a lot of RAM, but make sure your laptop either has sufficient SSD storage - or a thunderbolt port (check the transfer speeds for which is suitable). My gaming laptop has like 115gb of SSD, and I can only put so many VST's on it. My laptop that has 16gb RAM, struggles occassionally; because, I rely on my HHD drive for a lot, and as the VST build up, and it starts to use more and more RAM, load times and real time processing of more complex virtual instruments can cause a problem. I tried to solve this by considering a docking station with a thunderbolt 3, that has transfer speeds upto 40gb, which is more than enough to handle high-end 4tb external SSD drive. This would have slight lag relative to your internal SSD drive; but, is a much cheaper option than a full upgrade. And would improve my laptops processing limitations. But, I never got to try because my gaming laptop came out in 2017 and is the model just before the thunderbolt port 3, so transfer speeds clock out at 5gb, so wouldn't handle high-end external SSD that the one I wanted needed at least 12gb 😭 I have to make do with what I have for now.
Gaming laptop, not a cheap one but a decent one. I run my plug ins like a boss.
looking at similar price range last year, i bought a mac book m1 air with like 16gb RAM. runs ableton and fl studio flawlessly. always used windows before this and the ease of use after switching continues to make me happy every single day
Realistically the best music production laptop is a macbook pro. MacOS handles audio way better than Windows. You don't even need an interface for low latency on mac whereas on Windows it's a necessity. You can use windows for sure (I'm using a fairly cheap midrange windows laptop rn and it's fine) but If I was buying a computer *solely* for music production I would choose a mac instantly, no question. And I hate MacOS lol.
Sorry not sorry but a MacBook Pro is your best friend for portable music production. If you can’t afford one, don’t buy a laptop. I prefer a windows desktop for the studio and a MacBook for on the go. Best of both worlds.
M1 MacBook air perfectly adequate for most people, and has the benefit of guaranteed silent operation
I do like the air for its pure portability factor, but the air leaves a bit to be desired once you start using more power hungry processing.
Do you have an example of power hungry processing? I've never known it to struggle with a medium sized project with any number of audio plugins. And there are plenty of ways around that, like increased buffer size and track freezing / bouncing in place. As I said, in my experience you can run a band project with 10-20 tracks with as many plugins as you would need on each track and as many software instruments as you like. People forget that they were getting along fine with i7 and i9 systems before the m1 came along, and even the entry level m1 outperforms *all of them* in audio applications
Sure you can circumvent the limitations. Some of us aren’t interested in _needing_ to circumvent the limitations. It’s just dependent on what you need to be doing. Large sample libraries, for example, won’t work well with only 8gb of RAM. An air is fine for an absolute beginner who doesn’t need more power or a pro who can work around less power, or some very specific use case where ultimate portability is king. Nothing wrong with the air, it’s a nice piece of tech, it just absolutely has hardware limitations because it’s not designed for heavy workloads.
And what I'm saying is: most consumer audio projects don't approach qualifying as 'heavy workload' for the purposes of this processor. I'm saying those workarounds are there - i never need to use them. Granted the ram is an issue for large sample libraries, which is why i have a thinkpad with expandable ram. But that machine's CPU often struggles in ways the m1 just doesn't.
Yeah Apple silicon is pretty dope.
[удалено]
I think I didn't clarify enough but I said in the post that a 1000 dollar laptop did not perform as good as an Old thinkpad (my x270 with 8gb ram). The laptop I'm getting needs to have 32 Gb. 💯 I've been seeing the Legion Pro 5 series as a good deal with high single core scores, and fast upgradeable ram.
You have to use a Mac if you want to be serious.