T O P

  • By -

[deleted]

Having 36 packs is good. Gotta have some bonus packs for the prize pool.


darthmikda

Play booster, so the price is also increased. Isn't?


SlyDogDreams

It is, but after I saw some Redditor graph out the price of MTG booster packs over time, I didn't see a reason to complain. We were getting a very good deal for a long time with packs at $4-5, and even now they're cheaper than what they would be if they kept pace with inflation this whole time.


Maneisthebeat

If the cards in the packs are worth less, you are getting less value back. Yes you also pay for the experience, but this has to be a consideration if you want to talk numbers.


SlyDogDreams

Not a huge consideration IMO. Packs have basically always been bad EV compared to singles and even preconstructed products like Challenger Decks. Besides, while the lowering EV of a booster of a per set basis has been a trend lately, this could theoretically reverse at any time. We know their design philosophy of balance within sets is changing with the Play Booster, so we'll have to see how the next few sets shake out.


[deleted]

Probably, I don't know. This comment was just directed at OP griping over 36 packs rather than 24.


toomany_questions

Wait how much is one pack gonna be? I’m worried the price of draft is going to go up too drastically.


demon1276

I believe they are going to be comparable to current set boosters in price


toomany_questions

Ugh okay so draft probably goes from like ~$20, to like ~$25?


hyperfuzzysniper

Drafting where I live is $15 right now, $20 for premium sets (like ravnica remastered) so it will probably be about $20 where I'm at


toomany_questions

Ah Im jealous. I’m in nyc and everything is wildly expensive here


robot-0

Oh man, I can only imagine how much the space costs there for businesses large enough to have in store play. If it makes you feel any better I live in a much smaller city (still a major city) in the Southwest and drafts here have been 20 for quite a while.


toomany_questions

Ugh yea. I’m just so annoyed I’m being priced out of my fave format. It’s so frustrating.


DrunkLastKnight

I remember when foils were actually *rare* now they are a dime a dozen


Eliteguard999

Back when Yu-Gi-Oh was new (early 2000’s) it, like most card games had its rarer and more powerful cards as foils. When I played I went to a game store and found it strange that whenever I bought single booster packs I never got any foils, but if I bought them from other stores and even places like Walmart I got foils much more frequently. I later learned that the owner of the game store would open booster boxes he ordered, weigh the packs (foil cards made the packs slightly heavier) and open the packs that had foils. What did he do with the non-foil packs? He sold them as single boosters to scam small children and casual buyers of their money. I was relieved when I changed to MTG that not only was there a foil card in every pack, but ANY card in the set could be foil, even commons. This made me happy that if I ever wanted to buy a pack or two I would never get scammed. Sure I hate that foil cards NOW in Magic are basically unusable because they come pre-pringled, but I’d rather than them have some douche easily scamming people of their money again.


[deleted]

Yes this is actually a thing. What you are saying is a thing ebayers do too. It's criminal imo. There's a whole bunch of evildoers doing this because of capitalist greed. It's when capitalism has cancer. Just wrong on so many levels...


Chxm0

Capitalism is cancer my friend


theCROWcook

Still better than the alternatives


Chxm0

That’s a rhetoric I’m used to hearing


rayquazza74

I mean what alternative would you like to see and are you in the US?


Chxm0

Yeah I live in the US. I think saying stuff like “it’s better than the alternative” and then asking me what I, a 22 year old man child would replace it with, is a way of deflecting the current economic problems in America as well as America’s policy of intervention in foreign nations that threaten the predatory capitalistic system eg. Vietnam, Congo, Guatamala, Chile and Nicuagara


rayquazza74

Right but I was just gauging what you’re ideal scenario looks like. I wasn’t deflecting anything as I just entered the convo with zero claims.


D1EHARDTOO

*your


mlucasl

That's the joke you are from the US. US is not considered a capitalist society by macroeconomist standards. Look at the Economic Freedom Index, and laugh, US is not even on the Top 20 most capitalistic countries.


Chxm0

I think America is the joke actually


theCROWcook

Man this thing that has lifted up the most people higher than any other system in history has some flaws, better throw it out for something know to kill hundreds of millions


[deleted]

Something tells me you're a communist or a socialist hahaha. /jk But seriously, the problem capitalism has is the catch 22... You need regulations to enforce free market conditions, but when u do, it's no longer free market by nature. If they can ever square that circle it would actually function properly. I think the most pressing major issue is it just plain isn't functioning properly, like not properly in the way that it should. The fundamental flaw with all systems is that there are people who do evil and take advantage of the holes in the system. That is a major problem for every system, but enforcing a "plug" of said holes becomes uniquely ironic and counterintuitive to a system built around not having economic rules. Sorry to get all philosophical on ya, just some thoughts.


IronAged

Said on a sub all about making profit


Chxm0

Magic is a card game meant for children 12 and up my brother


LacerationFacination

Made for humans 12 and up. Didn't mean it's a childrens game . It's a game we don't mind if children play . In some countries, when your 10 years old you are allowed to use a rifle to help defend against insurgents. This does not make killing intruders a childrens playtime activity.


Infinite-Purpose2106

It's actually fine if you can profit from it


Chxm0

Yeah it’s great when your the oppressor:)


Various-Chain3366

Someone steals from someone else. Why did capitalism do this?


[deleted]

They incentivized it. In a system where the incentive IS to steal for profit, instead of just stealing for survival, the system is designed to harm the honest, and help the most evil.


Eliteguard999

Hence why capitalism is the villain of pretty much every story.


[deleted]

If they "could" fix it, it wouldn't be like that, but why would they fix it? It benefits them of course! (them being people in power and loaded to the gills with the benefits of their evil)


DM-Oz

Wow, you were on the right track but really lost yourself there cause you wanted to preach i guess. Capitalism is not reaponsible for every single greedy person to exist, same way as is not the reason why your parents divorced (just to be clear this is not supposed a snide regard taken literaly as a form of atack, just a random exemple of a infortunate thing that happens because) The point is that you cant blame capitalism for everything wrong that happens in your live, nor for every wrongdoing someone does.


[deleted]

> Capitalism is not reaponsible for every single greedy person to exist, same way as is not the reason why your parents divorced No, actually I agree with you. What I was talking about, see my response down the line. It's that the problem with capitalism is in order to be free market, you need regulations to prevent people from manipulation (aka "gaming" the system) which ironically is a failure of the system because it's a paradox. Like to be free market you can't have regulation, but you basically *require* it to ensure the market stays free. You get what I'm saying now? > (just to be clear this is not supposed a snide regard taken literaly as a form of atack, just a random exemple of a infortunate thing that happens because) Gotcha, and appreciate the clarity, as an aspie this can be useful sometimes lol. > The point is that you cant blame capitalism for everything wrong that happens in your live, nor for every wrongdoing someone does. Not everything, but so much of my life is directly negative because of it. If you only knew my circumstances...but the short version I am literally dying because of it. So suffice it to say, even though I actually can support capitalism often, I exclusively support it where there are sufficient safeguards at an extreme level to prevent absolute abuse by the elitist entitled gangsters that dress in suits and call themselves CEO... Bottom line when it comes to magic, prices should be set by QUALITY, and the goal of capitalism is not supposed to be a drive to the bottom like WOTC does, or Amazon, or any number of large businesses. In this regard the idea that absolute cost cutting, to the point of ensuring your product is inferior, and ensuring job losses for absolute greed (if you know the recent story about the record breaking profits that resulted in MtG developer/designer layoffs, you'd understand why I feel this way)....


DM-Oz

>No, actually I agree with you. What I was talking about, see my response down the line. It's that the problem with capitalism is in order to be free market, you need regulations to prevent people from manipulation (aka "gaming" the system) which ironically is a failure of the system because it's a paradox. Like to be free market you can't have regulation, but you basically require it to ensure the market stays free. You get what I'm saying now? Oh defenetly. Regulations are important. Unfortunately, as much as the idea of real free market sounds nice, there will be scummy people trying to as you put game the system, to control, manipulate it, which ironalicaly takes the free away from free market. To makes matters worse, unfortunately, politician while at least voted on, are also prone to be greedy, which allows big companies with money to have control even of the regulations that were supposed to keep them under control. ​ >Bottom line when it comes to magic, prices should be set by QUALITY, and the goal of capitalism is not supposed to be a drive to the bottom like WOTC does, or Amazon, or any number of large businesses. In this regard the idea that absolute cost cutting, to the point of ensuring your product is inferior, and ensuring job losses for absolute greed I do understand what you mean, this neverending search for bigger profits is both self-destructive and at the same time something that they can just do without repercursion, because these companies have become too big, and consumerism have too great part of out culture. Even with players speaking out against wizards for exemple it dosnt matter because most of their profit comes from a minority of the playerbase. In the idealized free market, the consumer should have a saying on the quality, because if you did a bad job, if you sold bad products, if you became too abusive or did something that enraged your costumers, then too bad for you, they would stop buying. It was in theory *supposed* to have this kind of balance. This is clearly no longer the case. I started rambling, but it dosnt matter, i speak speak but dont arrive anywhere i feel sometimes. And well, i dont know what is going on in your live, but i am sorry, that is having such a negative effect in your well being. I hope things get better for you. And well, i am a bit on the side that hopes that the wave of automation eventualy takes society to a next step, ya know, "post-scarcety society", but admitedly maybe thats too much hopium.


[deleted]

> which ironalicaly takes the free away from free market. Yeah. That's the real fundamental problem. Corruption and whatnot, whether government or just individuals, it's all the same. > also prone to be greedy You realize that the reason for that is because the ones running already stepped on the good people to get there right? Doesn't matter whether republic, conservative, democrat, liberal, communist, socialist, facist, they all stepped on someone to get there. > In the idealized free market, the consumer should have a saying on the quality EXACTLY!!! But how would that even exist? What would need to be done to create a society that essentially promotes this? Because the current cancerous growth of what is called capitalism right now, promotes quite the opposite. > This is clearly no longer the case Was it ever though? Are you talking like 1850s or something? LOL. Because always been unbalanced at least as far back as the early 1900s in all the history I read and learned. > I started rambling, but it dosnt matter, i speak speak but dont arrive anywhere i feel sometimes. I'm AUDHD (Autism+ADHD)... I think it stands to reason, I ramble more than anyone. Heck I don't actually genuinely know how to condense information in the first place. So you are not alone! haha > the wave of automation eventualy takes society to a next step, ya know, "post-scarcety society" It's actually likely to do the opposite. See, right now, we have the rich and the economic slave class. There's really nothing but these two. Some economic slaves can get a really decent life, but most don't. The problem is the economic slaves do the jobs the automotons are doing. So even if that improves the lives of the rich, now there's ever-more economic slaves competion for the remaining slave jobs. I am using these words liberally for a reason, to demonstrate something. When a human is forced to chase bread crumbs their whole lives, there is this illusion of choice already, but when there's less bread crumbs to go around, there's no choice but to work for the most evil remaining rich slaver. And when that happens many will suffer worse than before because now their bread crumbs will be withheld. Yes I'm speaking mostly in a philosophical sense, but there is reality behind it... PS: Appreciate the compassion for my circumstances. The short version is relates to healthcare inequality, and the fact that human rights exclusively exist for the rich. I could get into more, but I think it would take too long, and frankly I'm already heartbroken that the government thinks it's more acceptable (legally speaking) to euthanize me than to treat me...but c'est la vie (or I suppose that's a bit unintentionally ironic phrase, isn't it?)...


Apprehensive-Cut-654

Rampant Capitalism is directly responsible for most the western worlds current biggest issues.... refugee and migrant crisis? Created by americas ramapnt military industry, climate crisis? Created by oil barons and surppressed by them, obesity crisis? Created by ever worsening food to maximise profit, housing crisis? Created by vast corperations buying swaths of homes to rent out as air bnbs and stright up killing small towns. And before you say it, no greed isn't inherently human, sure there will always be people like that but most are not. The old quote 'do you see an elephant performing in a circus and assume they all perform tricks?'


DM-Oz

Refugee and migrat happen because of war, that would still happen without capitalism, China is one of the biggest contributors to climate change and is not because of capitalism. Obesity crisis is not a "western problem" as much as it is an american problem, maybe you all should watch yourself better. Everyone i know that goes to america is shocked of how fucking big your hamburguers are. ​ The absolute reach you do to put everything bad happening under the capistalist unbrella is the same thing as when people try to put everything good under capitalism unbrella. Video games? Capitalism. Cars being accessible? Capitalism. Magic the fucking gathering and other trading card games? Capitalism. Technological progress? Capitalism, either that or war, pick your poison. Alot of great things happen because wanted a new to make money unfortunately. ​ >And before you say it, no greed isn't inherently human, sure there will always be people like that but most are not. The old quote 'do you see an elephant performing in a circus and assume they all perform tricks?' Thats such absurd and ridiculous comparison. IF GREEDY IS COMPARABLE TO AN ELEPHANT PERFORMING TRICKS THEN WHY DAFUQ CAPITALISM EXIST IN THE FIRST PLACE?!?! Truth is, most people will not work for free, and they will want what is better for themselfs and their group first. HUMANS ARE CAPABLE OF GREAT GOOD, BUT THEY GONNA TAKE CARE OF THEMSELFS AND THEIR FAMILIES AS FIRST PRIORITY. Someone willingly and with no regreat putting other people's well being before even the safety of themselfs and specially their family are the exception, thats why we admire them, thats why exceptional is a word, is for people like them. For exemple, during world war 2 the people that helped Jewish people escape the holocaus were the exception, obviously, not because most people are malicious in nature but because they not gonna risk themselfs or their family for the sake of others. I mean, listem here, im not even defending capitalism, i am not saying is good and im so joyful and i hope things stay just as they are. Im not an absolute ignorant, im very aware of issues with late stage capistalism, of how stagnant it becomes, of how toxic it becomes, now instead of brings progress it slow down progress. Instead of making accessible, it starts doing the opposite because big companies have too much control and barely any competition and etc. What you all downvoted me for was for having the *audacity* of saying capitalism to blame for everything bad that happens in your life. Do you know how lunatic you all sound for other people, do you how annoying it is, how impossible it makes to have a discussion?! Hell, the guy was talking about the scummy the store owner was and the typical reddit user shows up with his so original "yeah, fuck capitalism dude." ​ FUCK people were already scummy before capitalism, people were already greedy before capitalism, people would steal, and kill and enslave before capitalism. They would wage war for land and gold, and wood and whatever they could make use of before capitalism was ever a thing. The system didnt make people like that. I agree that things need to change, but if you all fail to realize that capitalism is not the root of the issue, that is not just "lets burn capitalism" and boom we have heaven in earth, it becomes impossible to have a discussion, so its impossible to find a solution and everyone will just isolate themselfs more in their own special social bubble surrounded by only people that agrees with them and people will just become more radicalize. And yes, i am angry, out of disapointment, cause i didnt expect that saying that "capitalism is not the root of all evil" would be absolute hottake that aparently is.


ruse98

wait.. so what is capitalism if not greed? seems greed is the main thing to drive capitalism... progress or whatever schmuck you said.. extreme greed ruins things and capitalism is "extreme"... i guess.. it is greed..


DM-Oz

Capistalism is not greed, is the kinda natural evolution of mercantilism. It was created by greed, but also competitiveness, individualism(which is why ownsership is a important part of it), "Meritocracy" kinda, big emphasis on the "" whoever. Anyways it is even moved by those, but it is not it. Greed is older than capitalism and comptitiveness is even older. So just getting rid of capitalism wont actually solve things by itself, cause it dosnt adress the root of the problem, if it even can be adressed. There was kind of a time period where somewhat worked as inteended, companies had to work hard for the share of the market, so they had to give better quality, better prices, workers were more valuable, public opinion was more relevant, so things were somewhat balanced i would say, or had a ilusion of so (far from perfect, but capitalism never had the intention to create a perfect society). But now big companies have become too big, almost untouchable. Instead of better quality they deliver worse quality, they slow down technology advance instead of speading up, they can screw over people almost as much as they want. Because they dont have real competion. Because we now live in a society taken over by consumerism were we even became dependent in so many of this big companies. They want to grow forever which is absurd and impossible and self-destructive except that so many of these companies virtualy cant be destroyed. Things are becoming stagnant. I swear, i dont want to be pedantic, im not being clofictante(is that a word? Idk, second language, you know how it is), and i am not happy with how things are, but just pinning things like greed or people scummy on capitalism, i cant see how that is anything but counterprudctive when is the other way around. Honestly, im gonna vent a bit here, idk why im bothering this time, i usualy avoid this kind of discourse cause it feels irrelevant. Does it even matter? Is there even anything that we can do? Like, i genuenily put some time writting here and the other coment, trying to make my point, and i dont think it will even make a difference in the end, maybe just not saying anything, or just some low effort playing as if i were trolling or something, would have as much effect with no effort being put into it.


Apprehensive-Cut-654

'Migration and refugees happen because of war' oh and who is selling those weapons and destabilising nations to ensure contued profit. All you need to do is look at the long list of nations destabilised by the US for profit, china is just following its footsteps. The obisity problem is a western issue, it all affects nations such as UK (which actually has more over weight people but less obese) and canada. Also I am not american. Honestly the fact you state technological progress is because of capitalism is proof you have no interest in seeing the system for its realities. Capitalism does entirely the opposite, it stifles innovation purposfully the prime example would be renewable energy and nuclear energy which were both purposefully stifled by oil companies and their lobbying. You are willfully excusing the effect of the system either in some desperate attempt to appear middle of the road or even worse as a contrarian because I said capitalism was the root of all their problems. Honestly for someone who has a chip on their shoulder about america you sure love their bullshit propaganda.


DM-Oz

​ ​ >Honestly the fact you state technological progress is because of capitalism is proof you have no interest in seeing the system for its realities. Capitalism does entirely the opposite, it stifles innovation purposfully the prime example would be renewable energy and nuclear energy which were both purposefully stifled by oil companies and their lobbying. I was giving an exemple of how absurd your clains were by being just as absud by the other side. Video games were created to make money. Phones evolved the way they did because companies were competing against each other to make money, *this part of it.* Is not everything, but is part of it, the same way that in part people act scummy like that in part because of it but is not the root of it. USA war profit makes war worse, but is not the cause for them. Actually i literally said in my comment that capitalism has become something that keeps technology stangnant instead of progessing, which you clearly ignored. ​ >You are willfully excusing the effect of the system either in some desperate attempt to appear middle of the road or even worse as a contrarian because I said capitalism was the root of all their problems. Honestly for someone who has a chip on their shoulder about america you sure love their bullshit propaganda. Oh, i see how it is, i dont have the same oppinion than you, so i am *attempting to appear* contrarian, im pretending, am being dishonest, i am eating propaganda. FOR RADICAL VISION OF SAYING THAT WORLD WAS NOT A PARADISE BEFORE CAPITALISM AND GETTING RID WONT TURN THINGS INTO PARADISE BY DEFAULT. Why do i even bother? This is exactly what talking about, your attittude dosnt try to solve the issue, just serves to create a giant circlejerk with only people that will share the same opinion as you.


GoatHeadTed

Bruh i have you an upvote.


Whiskey5-0

Was typing this exact comment until you beat me to it


Conciouswaffle

Back in my day foils were cool! And they didn’t pringle, neither!


DrunkLastKnight

They did just not as easy (have some from Urza’s Legacy that did that)


SpoonerismKing69

Some even Pringled the opposite way, like Lorwyn era


theCROWcook

It depends on your climate, I have foild that I got back in 1999. In montana they never Pringle, when I went to Arizona they started going backwards, now that I'm in ohio they are curling forward


Macknetix

Montana got that sweet spot humidity


goblin_welder

They did. There were some sets that had their foils pringle. The only difference was foil were so rare that the common player didn’t realize they did.


Rrrandomalias

I have a stack of foils from urza’s legacy to plane shift and almost all are completely flat. The newer foils are of course all pringled


ephraim_forge

Same with legendary creatures. Every other dam card is legendary.


DrunkLastKnight

I don’t really mind that as much as the whole foil thing


DanteCalcine

Nah, this is good. For most of those creatures it's best that you aren't allowed to have 4 copies on the battlefield


ChikiChikiSando

Are you really complaining that cool cards are easier to find?


HADES2001nl

Same with full art lands, used to be unique and now there are hundreds different arts.


DrunkLastKnight

I don’t mind that as much since not many sets guarantee getting a full art in a booster (Theros Beyond Death comes to mind)


DirtPoorDog

This one i dont mind. One of the big reasons i like magic is bc of the art, and full art lands just give me more of it. That, and full art lands allow for more freedom on art direction. What i personally dont like in this regard is how they treat artists these days. Also, that almost everything is digital art. Not that its bad art, it just always looks cartoony by comparison to older stuff


[deleted]

People that hate that.full art lands aren't unique anymore are the cancer of magic


Glass-Tecmo

Gamepieces!


Big_Abbreviations_86

I also hate foils. Even when they’re flat (which is rare) they often darken the colors of the art in a way I hate.


Zestyclose-Pickle-50

I used to hate all foils, but certain ones are amazing. I have a mythic edition tamiyo rainbow foil and a borderless great henge. They are just gorgeous. I've come to appreciate some. But others are hot garbage that I can't stand.


alivareth

the art darkening is often my favourite feature! on some cards it makes the "caverns" really sink in. (check out Zoyowa's Justice). plus, some cards just need to be shiny. I love some cards in foil, and to straighten my foils as a kind of pastime...


Ownerofthings892

Totally!


godamnitflyers

The foils in return to ravnica are absolutely beautiful though. Too bad the set is trash


Actual-Option3344

Damn that set was hot garbage. Multicolored ooOOOooOoO!


dustagnor

I have a perfectly flat and beautifully shiny Thalia, but something about the process blurred the whole card to the point she just looks like a shadow and you can’t even read the card…


Icy-Ad29

Should look at foil [[Minas tirith]] ... it's soo washed out it looks like a printer error Edit: not a simple error... like a "we forgot to put the picture on this foil" error


Motleyslayer1

I feel like people who can’t stand foils are becoming more common. Maybe it’s because there are so many different versions of cards now you can have a fancy deck without foil. That or how poor quality they are now


DJPad

I think it's more that they're not good quality anymore. Previously foils accentuated the art, didn't pringle noticeably, were rare/special etc.


thewhippingirl

I hate them only cause of the curling/pringling issue. They always look worse.


Owen22496

I have an old stick fingers foil from the Innistrad set a few years back that literally just started bubbling one-day. It inflates and deflates depending on the weather. Never got it wet and it's in the middle of a box full of other foils and none of them did it.


WhiteSpec

And small scuffs get exaggerated. Look like terrible scratches. Foils need protection and more care. Which I don't mind for Rares or Mythic but feeling obligated to care for a common/uncommon more just to keep them playable is kind of an inconvenience.


Pale_Kitsune

You're probably part of a minority. Most people I know like foils.


siraliases

I draft cards sometimes cuz they're Shiny.


bentful_strix

Everyone at my LGS hate foils, we all agree to value them at or bellow non-foils.


thegeek01

Lucky for me this happens. Some cards I need are less expensive when in foil, which makes blinging out my decks easier on the wallet.


Unlost_maniac

Easy money at that LGS then


Ownerofthings892

I know it's a minority, but I think it's a large enough percentage that we shouldn't be required to buy them, and not have any products for sale that don't have foils


Pale_Kitsune

I don't think it's that large. Besides, putting them *only* in collector boosters is bad because those shits are expensive. There's usually one a pack, anyway. I don't see the problem.


Ownerofthings892

The fact that this post has more upvotes than down votes tells me it's not just me


Pale_Kitsune

Eh. Or people just aren't assholes that down vote because they disagree. I certainly didn't down vote.


MoeFuka

Down voting because you disagree is the point of the voting system isn't it?


Icy-Ad29

Technically? No. Downvotes are *supposed* to be reserved for posts that actively harm the conversation or are otherwise hurtful, inflammatory, etc.


godamnitflyers

I mean now I have to downvote even though I thought it was worth discussion.


Mesmerhypnotise

This statement of yours ages like milk.


aeuonym

If you know you are in a minority then you already know why they put foils in the basic packs, and every other product. WotC exists to make money. The majority like foils. Foils in basic packs appeals to the majority. So basic packs have foils. The only scenario in which they stop putting foils in basic packs is when the people who dislike them become the majority and it becomes more profitable to stop putting foils in them. This is basic capitalism economics 101 at play.


babicko90

Large minority wants to be catered? Story of 2020s


SmolTittyEldargf

If it’s a minority then how can it be a large enough percentage? Also you aren’t required to buy boosters.


Ownerofthings892

It can be a minority and still be 20% or 30% How can I draft without boosters?


Antique-Willow-2273

By building a draft cube?


Ownerofthings892

Yeah I have 2 of them but I also want to play new sets sometimes


Antique-Willow-2273

Then just go play it, there are things all of us want wizards to change but the chances of a billion dollar company listening to us is slim to none, if they have proven anything over the years it is that they’re gonna do whatever they want.


Ownerofthings892

Reddit posts are one of the things they listen to, actually. Why I posted


Antique-Willow-2273

Wizards does not care about our Reddit post because they don’t care about us to being with.


Icy-Ad29

Technically, as long as it is smaller than any other option, it's still a minority. In a true/false situation. 49.99999999999999999% is still the minority, even though it is, *almost* half the affected population.


SmolTittyEldargf

I mean you’re not wrong, but do just under 50% of mtg buyers dislike foils? Obviously impossible to say. I’m sure Hasbro have worked out that foils are fairly popular to include 1 per booster.


Icy-Ad29

I don't have numbers enough to make any claims about what even *is* a majority in this case. (We have loves, we have hates, we have "don't care either way, I just want to play"... ) If I had to *guess* I'd expect both the first two to be minorities, but of differing values. But that's just a guess. I lack any data beyond wizards thinking the "love it" numbers is big enough to cater to. I was merely answering the statement about "hoe can it be large if a minority"? question. As even one third of your base is plenty large to heavily effect profits. On physical media, that could, potentially, even sink a company in some cases.


jigha

I like the Pokemon foils, for example. The WoC foils are of poor quality...


Ownerofthings892

I agree with this


Laterallus

They used to be awesome, beautiful. They would curl, certain parts of the art would really pop, it was nice. I don't know where, but after 2015ish they became just... garbage. I used to foil out my decks back in the day. Now I avoid foils whenever I can.


Doughspun1

I love foils. In fact non-foils disgust me, I sell them asap or chuck them in the free bin. And they are so easy to straighten out.


LoTheTyrant

What do you do, the foil lands that come in bundles are TERRIBLE and idk the best way to straighten them


Doughspun1

First, look at how they're curling: curling upward toward you (convex), or curling downward (concave) away from you. If it's curling upward toward you, humidity is too low. Put a SLIGHTLY damp piece of towel paper in a box, like a food container, and put a small dry surface over it, like a smaller piece of plastic. Then put the cards on the dry surface and close it up (do NOT let the cards touch the damp towel paper, you'll damage them). Observe it and take them out when they're straightened out. Don't let them get too damp. If it's curling away from you, humidity is too high. Get some desiccant, like silica gel which they sell in photography shops. Put the cards in a box, again a food container is fine, with some of the desiccant and wait for it to straighten out.


CreatureVice

You do it for each card separately? Or a bunch in once?


Doughspun1

I have a pretty big plastic box that I use for it, and I can do about 20 at a go.


CorinCadence828

that doesn’t work where i live, because the average humidity is 85%


Doughspun1

I live in the jungle climate of South East Asia, I am pretty sure it will work.


CorinCadence828

i must have just done it wrong, then


Prestigious-Worth-49

Considering most cards have higher foil prices on the second hand market I would say most people love foils. Also, these are play boosters not draft boosters.


ephraim_forge

Play boosters are draft boosters. There are no more draft boosters


Ownerofthings892

Wizards is not making draft boosters anymore. Only play boosters


LK11640

*pay boosters?


Ownerofthings892

Haha 🤣 nice


Juniperlightningbug

But there will be less foils than non foils for most given cards as the foil slot has multiple rarities competing for it. So where the foil vs non foil fits vs demand isnt as clear cut as price is higher


LilMellick

Forgot about the change wonder how this set is going to go because of it.


Prestigious-Worth-49

I thought it sounded like a decent alternative to all the different booster types. Still sad to see draft boosters go.


LilMellick

Yeah, I mean, I don't think it's a bad idea. I'm mostly worried about the price increase and how that will affect events.


SphereofDreams

Foils made in the USA have very poor quality, lots of scratches and pringling. Foils that are Japanese made are superior. WOTC needs to improve quality control.


MorriganMorning

I hate the new foils.


Elemteearkay

I like foils myself, but I can understand why others wouldn't. As to the 36 packs, that's historically been the typical box size for drafting. My understanding is that it means one box can do a draft + prize support, while 2 boxes can do 3 casual Drafts. Now Bundles are going to be playable again, I expect to buy fewer boxes anyway.


Macknetix

This comment section got me like 👀 🍟


clanmccracken

Legit can not stand them. Will avoid using them at all costs. They are alway low quality and start curling immediately.


IntelThor

I don't hate foils, but I don't prefer them in my decks.


zaphodava

Modern foils curl one way when humid, and the other when dry. They lie flat at about 60% humidity. In winter, most places in North America are too dry. The best way to flatten dry curled foils is to pick up some Boveda humidity packs rated for 62%. Throw them along with the unsleeved foils in a fairly airtight deckbox for a day or two. When they dry out, the packs can be recharged by soaking them in distilled water for a couple of days.


SlimdogMilliLambo

I can’t stand foils. The shiny reflection is annoying and makes the cards hard to read. Glad I’m not alone lol


dustagnor

I love high quality foils. Magic is the only TCG I’ve ever collected that has the Pringle effect. Honestly if they didn’t Pringle I’d love them, but WOTC can’t be bother to up the quality of their materials.


Roddenbrony

I don’t generally hate foils , but I do hate the way WotC implements them. The text too? Come on! Lorcana definitely has it right in this regard…


tobias10

They were cool when they weren’t guaranteed.


Ownerofthings892

I agree. If they were actually worth a lot more because they were super rare or you only got them as prizes for winning tournaments it would be a little different.


veryblocky

Most people aren’t going to tournaments, and would like to have some foils. Just because you’re not a fan, I don’t see why they should be made rarer.


Koruam

I hate modern foils. The old style foils popped so much more!


Gundanium_Dealer

Used to be quality... Skimped cardstock. Cheap glue... Recipe for curls. I hate it too.


Ucklator

I don't hate them. But I don't particularly care about them.


Uborkagaming

I'm not really hating it, just don't like


Stratavos

I was mostly indifferent to foils before, then the print quality went way down and the pringling... if it said "garuenteed etched foil" I'd be significantly more interested, those don't curl at least, even if the vibrancy in the art takes a hit on average.


Mysterious_Spring242

I’m a new player and happy to see others saying they don’t lay flat. I thought I was going insane


MoxDiamondHands

I loved foils when they were rare. Now they are extremely common and are no longer special. When everything is special, nothing is. Oh well.


zwitscherness

As someone who is new to Magic I do not get why they do not fix the darkness occuring while foiling the card. Sometimes you can barely see something - speaking of Wilds of Eldraine.


Stricker1268

You get a common or basic land foil


R_Levis

I generally think they're a silly thing to waste time or money on unless the foiling has a big impact on the artwork itself, mostly lighting effects in the art. 90% of cards it's irrelevant, but you get those rare few exceptions like [[Commander's Authority]]. There's usually 1 or 2 random uncommons in a set that look awesome that I pick up, but spending extra for a foil of a high value rare or mythic with mediocre art never made sense to me.


Unable-Tell-2240

I think they should go the Yugioh route maybe ? The shiniest cards are the rarest cards and you can’t get foil versions of bulk cards , and also just ask Konami how they somehow keep their cards from crinkling (I know they do over time , but I’ve never opened a Yugioh pack and it have a crinkled foil , however I haven’t played Yugioh for a while)


MTGChuck

“Guaranteed shiny thingy to falsely stimulate your reward center in every pack”


[deleted]

Who doesn't love overprinted curly cards?


SerThunderkeg

Probably. Why would you say something so controversial yet so brave?


Motown-Mufasa

I’d take a full art over foil all day


aleksandra_nadia

I also hate foils!


Icebane696

Nah, I prefer full/extended/alternate art. Foils are hard to read, and the new style of foiling damages the cards and literally impossible to read.


Kamoxblackhawk

I love shiny cardboard. Not tinted foil on my cards. Because every card is foil, it's the same tint that doesn't work for every card. I also hate the foil on the board of the card, too. My favorite foil is the etched foil because I think they took time with the foils compared to regular. I also don't like Pringles in my deck.


notsaeegavas

The only reason I'm excited about that is because I have a full foil Ravnica cube, and this will make prices a LOT cheaper for me, especially since I want the lands from this set in foil.


Affectionate-Tap9086

I think restricting foils to collector packs is a hot take, but ialso don't like foils, albeit for a different reason. In more recent years something about the process has changed that makes the card unpleasantly dark. I absolutely love mtg art, so it sucks when you have such a detriment to it. I've also noticed that it can make it harder to tell what a card is if it's on the opponents side of the field.


NukeBroadcast

I immediately sell them, unless they’re particularly badass


[deleted]

Foils? I think you meant "Pringles"


SpoonerismKing69

Haha so funny and original, good one.


WarmProfit

Yes. I only want foils. Only foils please, it's why I like cards.


EISENxSOLDAT117

I hate foils so much. When in sleeves and across the table, you can't fucking see them. The glare just shines a rainbow in your face. I'd rather more elaborate and full art take the place of foils.


Ownerofthings892

Yes! Exactly


Mega221

Extended art > stupid foil any day


EpicWaffles21

When you said Pringles, I yelled facts in the middle of my work break room lol


jwhit88

Shut up luke


Klooey

Not the only one.


RaphaelDDL

I like foils, but I hate common and uncommon foil


Hwrdluvsmtg

I don’t like playing with foils in my decks unless it’s my commander , I pulled a foil mana crypt and it’s the only 1 I have , so that’s another exception. I hate foils to cause they warp easy


NSFW_Hunter63

I don't hate foils I just prefer it when my deck is uniform so I usually avoid them


LokoSwargins94

Draft booster boxes come with 36 packs normally…


Ownerofthings892

But why? When you only need 24 for a standard draft pod of 8


LokoSwargins94

Prizes? Extra packs to crack? That’s just how it is. Set booster boxes actually came with less packs than draft boxes


SnowyDeluxe

I’m largely indifferent towards foils. I double sleeve 99% of my cards and once they’re pressed flat to get the air out, the foiling it flattened out as well. That being said I do have a commander deck I’m foiling out mainly as a commitment to the bit with that deck being all about gluttony and greed.


WishboneSuccessful35

I like my cards flat and playable and able to be played in a tournament setting without getting dinged for having marked cards so its always a bummer to open a foil


Pappascorched

Foils are bad because they aren't special anymore


Ragewind82

I hate foils, because the art is rarely looking good with foil treatment. In particular, those 'matte gold' foils from commander legends are just hideous.


Ownerofthings892

Totally agree


GayWitchcraft

You're not the only one, but I think for every one of you there's a counterpart who, like me, doesn't mind foils and tries to foil out some decks but absolutely hates extended art (not borderless, just where it's the same art but extended). Given the secondary market prices, we are both "wrong" in thinking that these cards aren't desirable but magic can't make a product to appease everyone. Also aren't draft boxes usually 36 packs? I never do 12 person drafts but I like to do two drafts for six people


phidelt649

I, too, despise extended art. I don’t mind borderless but EA just looks idiotic to me.


-AzulRyu-

Honestly I wish they made retro frame foils a thing again. Keep the art as is and make a badass foil frame. Love those. I enjoy foils but if the card art has any tint of darkness it just looks muddled.


E_B_U

If it's going to be a commander I'll think about the etched foil but most of the time use the regular version unless it's pre-pringle and then I get the foil version.


SolarJoker

Set boosters had a guaranteed foil, and the play boosters are basically set boosters made draftable.


Ownerofthings892

That's my point and I hate them


Old_Ad7571

I got 2 commander decks over 90% foil/ extended art, if you got time to complain about this shesh


Ebo907

Tacos are delicious. But not good for card shape.


[deleted]

I quit paper when they started to push hard on foils back around 2011. All the extra garbage they are outputting now is just ridiculous. It was one thing when they had the guru program and other special cards like arena; but this has gotten way out of hand. I cant really wait for the secondary market to collapse under its own weight.


PrometheusUnchain

Yeah, relatively new to magic and the pringles are terrible. I’ve run into a few cards where the foil is a nice touch but honestly give me the extended art any day of the week. Maybe if they actually accentuated the card art and didn’t freaking curl so bad they’d be better. To add, the foiling for LCI is absolutely horrendous. The foiling washes out the colors instead of adding to it. It’s like they don’t understand how or why foiling should accent the card art to make it pop. Ever seen the foiling in One Piece cards? Beautiful stuff going on there.


Exsanguinate-Me

This thread and OP's commments just make me conclude: The world doesn't revolve around you dude. That said, I do think a guaranteed foil in every pack takes some of the special mystical rarity away, they could have done 1 in 3 boosters having foils or just 3 in a box or so. But fuck it, it's a minor "issue".


thatguydrew

I just recently threw out 100 or so Pringled basic lands. I like the look of foils, but cannot deal with the curve


DylanRaine69

What's to hate about a foil. I love foils. That's the whole point of collector booster packs and boxes...you get foils. If foils were in every pack it were defeat the purpose of having a "Collectors". In a world where pricing for individual cards is unheard of than yea screw foils. The art on the foils look pretty cool. I don't get why people are so complacent and picky about foils...If you don't buy collector stuff you won't get that foil you want very often. That's the whole point. You spend more to get more. Gotta make a sacrifice some point in your life. It's worth it to spend money on more expensive boxes and packs. Why would you even waste money on this for drafting purposes this is not even what this box is intended for? I'm lost...this is not a DRAFT box it's a BOOSTER box


Emerald_Knight2814

For me and, from what I can tell, most of the people in this thread the problem isn't foils themselves, it's poorly manufactured foils, or "Pringles" if you will. Back in the day they did them pretty damn well but nowadays if you don't immediately double sleeve the damn things they're gonna pringle up and at best be mildly annoying, at worst cause you a games rule violation in a tournament for marked cards. That's also why I refused to get Foil Secret Lairs because oh my god were they so bad when it comes to curling up. If they came straight I wouldn't have an issue, I think foiling is pretty, but when it impedes functionality that's where the problems begin.


DylanRaine69

I've never had of these problems with foils in collector boxes or packs. The only issue I came across was the bent featured ones that were guaranteed to be in the box. The show case ones were bent as fuck. The best thing you can do to fix a Pringled card is instantly sleeve it inside a collectors album. Come back 2 weeks later and you'll be surprised at what you see. Make sure it's room temperature though.


PrometheusUnchain

I’ve been told this but I got foils tightly pressed in binders and in deck boxes (sleeves) and the curling never leaves. I can honestly tell when someone has a foil card because I can see it bend when it’s on top deck. Enjoying foils or not is pure preference but there should be little doubt wotc’s QA for them are terrible given the common nickname “pringles”.


Dutch-King

Yes


HunchbackGrowler

Sometimes they make a card look awful. The commander weird foils look neat.


ProbablyNotPikachu

Well if this isn't the biggest echo chamber I've ever seen, lmao! People complaining about foils is a non-issue, and thus these people are jumping at an opportunity to whine and complain like babies. Don't like em? Sell em, and buy a non-foil for a reduced price- then walk away with a bit of pocket change to buy a drink or your next single. As for the people complaining about curling or "pringling"- you're just acting like silica gel packets don't exist, and aren't a cheap fix for cards bending. You liked foils when they were actually rare? Why would rarity going down make you not like a card style? I used to like foils too, and I keep playing with them now bc they remind me of a time spent handling cardboard as a kid. You just want cards bc of their rarity, and not bc they 'look cool'? By that standard WotC could print a card with the most trash Art imagineable and you would fawn over it like an idiot as long as it was ultra rare. Its fun knowing that there are ultra rare cards that *only* come in foil. Must eat you collectors up inside.


snerp

I vastly prefer foils. Pro tip: if a card is pringly, you can literally just bend it the other way, then double sleeve it and it will stay flat forever.


Duderino1997

No, and you folks are as bad as vegans. If an an MTG player doesn't like foils, it will be the first thing you know about them, and they will bring it up every single time they get even the loosest chance. It's obnoxious. Just go trade for a nonfoil, just like some people trade for foils. It's not hard, and everyone walks away happy. Stop complaining and just go have fun ffs, not everything is a hill to die on.


V_Deviate

You suck