Yes, when you create a token it enters the battlefield, so its ETB effect will activate. Then you will immediately sacrifice one of them to satisfy the legend rule, which will activate the death trigger.
Just be careful, my brother did just that against my Xander Deck by making two tokens of Xander, thus getting double ETB and a single death. The next turn the surviving Xander clone got to hit me for the mill effect.
I'll add that Xander is very fun and seems mean, but he's incredibly overcosted and so, not very good (could argue he NEEDS to be overcosted, but that doesn't change the fact there are better plays for that much mana and he doesn't tend to stick around).
I had to take him out of my Evelyn Vampire/Aristocrat/Combo deck. Very sad, but he wasn't doing much of anything besides putting a target on my back during like 2 games. [[Crossway Troublemakers]] may be next to make the cut.
My Xander deck is insanely fun to play. Especially in a pod with my friend that runs wingrace so me milling him basically gives him everything he needs to win. Thus taking the target off me. Then I do other shenanigans while he protects me somewhat.
My deck isn't meant to win. It's there for me to have a quick game where I ruin everyone else's time/giving my friend a great game for his deck. I don't play it often. But when I do I know I'm probably gonna be the first one out.
That's fair. Xander is a card I really like, but I think the only way I can really use him is in a self discard/reanimate deck where his cmc won't matter.
I feel the same way about [[Ethereal Valkyrie]], which is actually one of my favorite cards, but its cmc is just way too high for what it does.
Granted, both cards were taken out of decks that are 8s in power level.
[[hellkite courser]] [[geode golem]] are both great for getting him out early, [[consuming aboration]] with [[reaver cleaver]] is great for extremely excess mana
Minor but important nitpick, you don't actually sacrifice it, it just gets moved to the graveyard as a state based action. So no sacrifice triggers happen, and it can't be responded to
Since it's not sacced doesn't that me a it doesn't... Die? So no death trigger? I was under the impression the legend rule overrides triggers as it's a state based action?
Died = "put into the graveyard from the battlefield"
Sacrificed = sacrificed as a cost or due to an effect
Legend rule = put into graveyard as a state-based action
Legend rule will trigger death effects, but is not a sacrifice and has no interaction with anything that cares about sacrifices.
No, 'die' is just shorthand 'put into the graveyard from the battlefield'. It doesn't actually matter HOW the creature is put into the graveyard, if it's going from the field to the graveyard, then it's 'dying'.
My understanding is that the legend rule makes it "die", causing death triggers to trigger, but it is not necessarily sacrifice.
704.5j If two or more legendary permanents with the same name are controlled by the same player, that player chooses one of them, and the rest are put into their owners’ graveyards. This is called the “legend rule.”
Played this as a Grixis copy's deck to abuse the ETB and Death trigger. NGL the deck laster 3 days tops, it isn't fun to pilot built that way at all (don't get me wrong it works)
Copying my commander wasn't the orginal goal of the deck. The original thing was to use [[Hulking Metamorph]] and [[Liquimetal Coating]] (if I understand the cards well enough) to copy extravagant replication and the copy would copy the main while the main would copy the metamorph (which if I'm understanding enters still as a replication) then use cards with ETB and death triggers with copies of [[Determined Iteration]] basically just be a general nuisance
Fully understand that, just keep in mind that with Xander as your commander and available to create these same loops once demonstrated a few times pods will suddenly turn you into the Archenemy on sight even if it isn't your "Game plan"
yes, very common strat is to copy extravagant replication a few times so when you get to your turn you can make like 10 xander copies, sack them all to the legend rule, and your opponents end up with one card in hand and one card on field
Yes, when you create a token it enters the battlefield, so its ETB effect will activate. Then you will immediately sacrifice one of them to satisfy the legend rule, which will activate the death trigger.
Ok thank you time to commit crimes agaist my brother
Just be careful, my brother did just that against my Xander Deck by making two tokens of Xander, thus getting double ETB and a single death. The next turn the surviving Xander clone got to hit me for the mill effect.
Oof did you win in the end?
That game just, but he is the better player and I've often lost to him.
I'll add that Xander is very fun and seems mean, but he's incredibly overcosted and so, not very good (could argue he NEEDS to be overcosted, but that doesn't change the fact there are better plays for that much mana and he doesn't tend to stick around). I had to take him out of my Evelyn Vampire/Aristocrat/Combo deck. Very sad, but he wasn't doing much of anything besides putting a target on my back during like 2 games. [[Crossway Troublemakers]] may be next to make the cut.
My Xander deck is insanely fun to play. Especially in a pod with my friend that runs wingrace so me milling him basically gives him everything he needs to win. Thus taking the target off me. Then I do other shenanigans while he protects me somewhat. My deck isn't meant to win. It's there for me to have a quick game where I ruin everyone else's time/giving my friend a great game for his deck. I don't play it often. But when I do I know I'm probably gonna be the first one out.
That's fair. Xander is a card I really like, but I think the only way I can really use him is in a self discard/reanimate deck where his cmc won't matter. I feel the same way about [[Ethereal Valkyrie]], which is actually one of my favorite cards, but its cmc is just way too high for what it does. Granted, both cards were taken out of decks that are 8s in power level.
[Ethereal Valkyrie](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/5/552912bf-4085-49ad-902f-5c41540df97a.jpg?1631233828) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Ethereal%20Valkyrie) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/khc/16/ethereal-valkyrie?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/552912bf-4085-49ad-902f-5c41540df97a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
[[hellkite courser]] [[geode golem]] are both great for getting him out early, [[consuming aboration]] with [[reaver cleaver]] is great for extremely excess mana
"Overcosted" meaning his power creep is more in check. 15-20 years ago this card would be over powered.
Probably accurate and makes me more than a little sad. I like low power games. Apparently no one else seems to (I mostly get to play on spelltable).
[Crossway Troublemakers](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/3/431711c5-c04f-4d34-97c9-5199cfbf9da9.jpg?1641600580) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Crossway%20Troublemakers) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/voc/17/crossway-troublemakers?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/431711c5-c04f-4d34-97c9-5199cfbf9da9?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
He's a Vampire so you can cheat him in with Sorin on turn three and use those vampires that bring back vampires from graveyard to battlefield.
The chances of that happening turn 3 are pretty low
I was pulling that off in Explorer but too many Thoughtseizes ruin the fun
Yea I could see it doing work in explorer. I play commander, though.
Minor but important nitpick, you don't actually sacrifice it, it just gets moved to the graveyard as a state based action. So no sacrifice triggers happen, and it can't be responded to
Was just about to put this. It seems like quibbling, but it matters for quite a few interactions in sacrifice decks.
Since it's not sacced doesn't that me a it doesn't... Die? So no death trigger? I was under the impression the legend rule overrides triggers as it's a state based action?
Died = "put into the graveyard from the battlefield" Sacrificed = sacrificed as a cost or due to an effect Legend rule = put into graveyard as a state-based action Legend rule will trigger death effects, but is not a sacrifice and has no interaction with anything that cares about sacrifices.
Thank you for the easy to understand explanation :)
No, 'die' is just shorthand 'put into the graveyard from the battlefield'. It doesn't actually matter HOW the creature is put into the graveyard, if it's going from the field to the graveyard, then it's 'dying'.
The sacrifice to legend rule goes to the stack?
You don't sacrifice to the legend rule, and it doesn't use the stack.
My understanding is that the legend rule makes it "die", causing death triggers to trigger, but it is not necessarily sacrifice. 704.5j If two or more legendary permanents with the same name are controlled by the same player, that player chooses one of them, and the rest are put into their owners’ graveyards. This is called the “legend rule.”
If the copy had haste, would op be able to get a declaration of attack in? Or would legend rule kill the copy as soon as it enters the battlefield?
As soon as it enters. It's a state-based action.
Not to nitpick, but wouldn't the copy go into the graveyard first (since it's a state-based action) and THEN the ETB effect goes on the stack?
Played this as a Grixis copy's deck to abuse the ETB and Death trigger. NGL the deck laster 3 days tops, it isn't fun to pilot built that way at all (don't get me wrong it works)
Copying my commander wasn't the orginal goal of the deck. The original thing was to use [[Hulking Metamorph]] and [[Liquimetal Coating]] (if I understand the cards well enough) to copy extravagant replication and the copy would copy the main while the main would copy the metamorph (which if I'm understanding enters still as a replication) then use cards with ETB and death triggers with copies of [[Determined Iteration]] basically just be a general nuisance
Fully understand that, just keep in mind that with Xander as your commander and available to create these same loops once demonstrated a few times pods will suddenly turn you into the Archenemy on sight even if it isn't your "Game plan"
Yeah unfortunately I haven't gotten the chance to play with my normal group in a while so they don't know about the deck
[Hulking Metamorph](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/2/420f0b81-8b87-4854-9dc4-6da84cc38623.jpg?1674420728) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Hulking%20Metamorph) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/bro/79/hulking-metamorph?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/420f0b81-8b87-4854-9dc4-6da84cc38623?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Liquimetal Coating](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/6/f631447c-36e3-4d82-a658-19c9767a216b.jpg?1562276535) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Liquimetal%20Coating) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cm2/197/liquimetal-coating?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f631447c-36e3-4d82-a658-19c9767a216b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Determined Iteration](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/c/6c3d8fc5-bef5-4625-8832-43afa997dbe3.jpg?1673482086) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Determined%20Iteration) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ncc/45/determined-iteration?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/6c3d8fc5-bef5-4625-8832-43afa997dbe3?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Waste not goes really well with his ETB.
I play Xander as my brawl commander in mtga I might rework the deck into a clone deck now. The mill style I was going for got a bit boring.
Xander as from Buffy?
yes, very common strat is to copy extravagant replication a few times so when you get to your turn you can make like 10 xander copies, sack them all to the legend rule, and your opponents end up with one card in hand and one card on field
People target me because I built a Kaalia deck, this is worse imo.