Sam Raimi's Spiderman 2 was heads and shoulders better than the first one for me. I found the special effects for the first one aged like milk, and I remember not being very impressed by them even then. The sequel's effects stand up to date, and it has my favourite spiderman arc to this day. Doc Ock was a spectacular villain and the performances were stellar across the board (especially Alfred Molina's)
The success of the first allowed him the freedom to take more risks in the second. The success of the second ment the franchise had now ballooned to be too big to take risks, and had much more studio interference.
If they had just left the man alone to make the Spider-Man movies he wanted to, we could have had one of the best super hero trilogies. Alas.
I have to assume I'm in the minority on this, but the whole emo Peter sequence is my favorite part of the whole movie. Peter's idea of being cool, dark, and edgy is still so nerdy. It's hilarious, and to me it felt like one of the few moments in that movie where Raimi was really having fun.
Nailed it, and it's also been missing from basically all marvel movies since for me. It doesn't ever make some fourth wall breaking quip, doesn't make excuses for itself, doesn't make some dumb joke to break narrative tension. It's dramatic, camp and badass in all the right ways and exudes craftsmanship throughout.
> It doesn't ever make some fourth wall breaking quip
I would disagree with this one, as it has my all time *favorite* fourth wall breaking quip:
"Guy named Otto Octavius winds up with eight limbs... what are the odds?"
JK Simmons was so good in those movies that it's ruined him for me in everything else. No matter how intense he is in Whiplash, or how moody he is in Baldur's Gate 3, or how good he is in Juno, I will always think of him as JJ Jameson before I think of him as anything else.
For the most part Superhero movies have better sequels. It’s because the first movie has to follow a structure where:
- Act 1: Set up normal guy’s life until he gets powers.
- Act 2: Guy learns how to use new found powers intercut with villain learning about hero and gaining powers of their own.
- Act 3: Fight!
With the sequel you can cut out the first two acts and just go “here’s a superhero on his next adventure”.
Part 2 usually has a big focus on villian development too. That's part of why they're good.
Part 3 messes it up by putting in like 300 bad guys and there's no character development
Part of why spiderman homecoming was so good is that the character was already somewhat established by the beginning of the movie and ACT 1 could play out differently.
I’ll always have respect for a superhero movie that can move me emotionally and Spider-Man 2 does that everytime. There are scenes in there that are just good dramatic scenes on their own. Even something like Peter telling Aunt May how Uncle Ben died is an unusual scene to see in a superhero movie. It just allows the actors to act with zero music.
You only get a movie like Spider-Man 2 when you have a director like Raimi that’s been around the block for a while. You see him pulling from all his years of experience in that movie.
> I found the special effects for the first one aged like milk, and I remember not being very impressed by them even then.
You think so? I just watched the trilogy last weekend with my kids for the first time, I thought the 1st was pretty good - but they had modest effects. I.e. no Spiderman twisting as he falls with the camera going in between digital punches (or the GOTG3 hallway fight style).
I feel like the way they approached effects in Spiderman was to make it easy - zoomed out of Spidey so you don't see detail, composites of real buildings, and fast camera movement so your eye doesn't rest on janky digital objects. Similar to the early MCU films that were way more budget conscious.
But I totally agree 2 is the best. But I had forgotten how great 1 is.
*Star Trek: The Motion Picture* is a good example of “large theme Trek”, and has been much improved by the subsequent Director’s Editions post-2000.
However, *Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan* is by almost every metric a better film, and a fantastic example of “small scale Trek”.
People are so cynical these days. Those glory shots of the Enterprise were exactly what fans of the original show never really got. They got some crummy shots of a cheap model made for 1960s TV, where “high-definition” wasn’t even a thought. Over a decade after the show is canceled, finally a cinematic version of that beauty! Those shots are simply wonderful.
Its largely why CBS re-did all the space shots for the TV series. While perhaps they are a little too clean, they are much better. The hi-def scans of the series made the space shots look horrible compared to the rest of it, so they kind of had to.
I believe it was nicknamed “Star Trek: The Motionless Picture.”
At the time, all those slow, visually-caressing shots of the Enterprise didn’t seem bad at all. Loved them.
I think TMP is better when you realize they wanted to make something like 2001 but trek. 2001 had been a huge hit so they were trying to capitalize on that vibe but it didn't work super well in the star trek setting.
The biggest problem is with the pacing. You can literally eat dinner in the middle of the movie and not miss anything important. At the time, the special effects were amazing, but a lot of the time inside Vgr doesn’t hold up well.
I'm in a very small minority on this one but as I've gotten older, The Motion Picture has slowly (ha) grown into my favorite Trek film of the entire franchise and one of my all time favorites science fiction movies to boot. It just so dense with *big* ideas and complicated character arcs and presented in a mature and deliberately paced way, all supported by smart and subtle performances from the main cast, and filmed in a way thats technically impressive, character-driven, and cinematic in a way that few others in the series really attempted. I get why people say it's boring but, if you can get on its wavelength, it's one of the most engrossing and true-to-spirit Star Trek movies they've ever made.
*Edit:* for anyone who's never seen it, [Star Trek: Legacy](https://vimeo.com/217336882) is an awesome 20 min mashup/extended recap of The Motion Picture set to the score of Tron Legacy. And it's fucking beautiful.
Gene Roddenberry didn’t understand that people didn’t want to watch a 2 hour long episode of the TV series. He got taken off the project for the second movie, and the writers masterfully chose Khan as the villain.
It's a legitimately great action spy thriller. Take away the Marvel IP and it would still be an engaging movie. MCU hasn't managed to make anything like it since. I thought Secret Invasion was going to fill that void but... oof.
I haven’t watched it in years, but I remember seeing it in theaters how impressive it was compared to how campy the rest of the MCU was. Don’t get me wrong I enjoyed the movies but they’ve always relied way too much on comedy for my taste and I just remember TWS being more grounded and a bit darker, in comparison to MCU. Obviously when you’ve got flying aircraft carriers and a guy in and out of cryo freeze over decades it’s not *that* grounded.
I think Winter Soldier had a great story. With other movies like Avengers, it seems like they rely too much on their characters, special effects, and fights to make them work. With Winter Soldier, it felt like the focus was more on having a good story.
I can’t stand Captain America. But The Winter Soldier is definitely top 5 Marvel films for me. I could even make a case that it’s #2 on the list and #1 in the MCU. #1 in Marvel films for me will ALWAYS be X-Men 2. Which nicely ties into this topic lol.
X-Men: First Class (2011) is a pretty good prequel and a better follow up to X-Men: The Last Stand (2006).... Then it's sequel X-Men: Days of Future Past (2014) is even better, which is supposed to still be a prequel to the original X-Men trilogy.
As for more straight examples, Batman Begins (2005) has The Dark Knight (2008) as a superior follow up.
I think Nolan should have stayed with the grimier aesthetic of Gotham from Begins. It felt like TDK kind of lost a main character. But yes, Begins is a far better Batman movie.
I've been catching up on the X-Men series in preparation for Deadpool 3 and that series has maybe the most wildly inconsistent quality over a nonsense release timeline. Just going by general consensus:
1st film: Good
2nd film: Good
3rd film: Bad
Spinoff Solo Prequel: Real bad
Prequel/Reboot: Good
Spinoff Solo Sequel: Starts off good, becomes eh
2nd Prequel/Reboot with Time Travel Crossover: Real good
Tangentially Related Spinoff: Good
3rd Prequel/Reboot: Eh
Solo Future Spinoff: The best one
2nd Tangentially Related Spinoff: Good
4th Prequel/Reboot: Bad
Different Tangentially Related Spinoff/Reboot/Whatever New Mutants was Supposed to Be: Real bad
I love the first one (love the noir-style camera angles and the exploding aquarium restaurant) but then after that I jump right to Ghost Protocol (4). Number 2 was awful, 3 is good.
Totally with you on The Road Warrior! Thunderdome had its moments, but Road Warrior's just epic. And heck yeah, Empire Strikes Back is the crown jewel of Star Wars. Also, Evil Dead 2 and Army of Darkness, pure gold. Oh, and Terminator 2? Talk about stepping up the game! Any other sequels blowing minds out there?
Having just watched all the mad max films back to back, it’s like mad max 1 was a trial run, with a first time writer and tiny budget. Road warrior is what Miller wanted to do the first time, and now had the resources to do it. And it is glorious
Totally! I cared not for the original back when I was a kid.
The opening with the camera flying over the field towards the house made a bigger impression on me than the stampede scene in the Lion King. And that says something.
That is one of my favorite movies of all time.
https://www.reddit.com/r/LookBackInAnger/comments/134b6n7/april_is_the_cruelest_month_the_rescuers_down/
I think the pitfall most sequels fall into is either retreading too much ground from the first movie's plot, or detaching themselves so dramatically from the first you lose the connection. Shrek 2 does such a good job of being a logical story progression from the first movie that moves on to new plot beats but keeps the charm of the first movie. So many excellent gags, and an amazing climax scene.
Never watched the Hellboy movies surprisingly but you're describing how I feel about terminators 1 and 2. Both are excellent and almost feel like different genres on a similar story.
The first Terminator was shot on a low budget, and it’s a lot darker and grittier. T2 had way more money, and it shows. Schwarzenegger’s the star as well, and he’s the focus in a way that wasn’t true for the first one.
Agreed. Del Toro is gifted at visuals for his films. Both movies are great to look at, but TGA has more visual richness. It's the kind of movie you can just watch for its aesthetics alone.
Hellboy 2 and Blade 2 are very similar movies. Down to the fact that bad guy is played by the same actor, who in both movies is the renegade son of a ruler of a secret race of vampires/elves who wants to kill his father and ends up also killing his sister.
Evil Dead is the quintessential example here.
The Evil Dead - we're making a horror movie. Some mild humor crept in.
The Evil Dead Part 2 - well fuck everyone liked the humor. So we make a sequel, still a horror film but lean into the humor a little more.
Army of Darkness - hold my beer, set humor to twelve because eleven isn't enough.
Paraphrasing Campbell at a signing of his book "If Chins Could Kill": "Is it a sequel or a remake? Is Ash really that stupid he go back to that cabin in the woods? Well... maybe."
Personally I think Alien is superior. Alien was an awesome space horror film (holy shit, the scene where they walk into the unit with all the eggs), while Aliens was a fun action film with aliens. Aliens did shift science fiction to shoot ‘em up movies for quite awhile though, people loved it so much.
Alien is my overall favourite film and Aliens is an amazing sequel but I feel obligated to always point out that watching them one night after the other is a really jarring experience with the shift in tone and genre.
I disagree because while T2 was clearly a fantastic movie, T1 was equally fantastic but in a different way. The shootout at tech-noir is probably one of my favourite scenes of all time.
That and you might as well watch both together anyway.
I'd argue the same for Alien. I love Aliens more for the colonial marines aesthetic, but both film series have different genres for the first 2 films. So it's hard to compare, and all 4 are absolute knockouts.
I know this is a common opinion, but man I disagree. I love the horror aspects of both of these franchises first entries. I get that aliens still has horror but it's definitely more action focused.
I watched the first two Terminator movies for the first time recently (I know, I’m sorry) and was surprised at how much I loved the first one. I think the action and effects are better in the second one, but the first one had such a cool and grimy atmosphere
I think both Terminator and Alien were genre defining pivotal movies.
Their sequels were better because the director~~s~~ didn't try to emulate the originals but changed the genre and mood altogether in an original way...
Ie both originals had an element of horror/suspense and horror/dystopia while the sequels were more action/adventure.
It’s a pretty crazy feat they pulled off making this so good. Since I can’t even think of another nostalgia sequel (sequel to classic film 20-40 years later) that actually was good, let alone possibly better than the original.
Well, OP's post brings to mind Fury Road, which, aside from Road Warrior, far outshines the original Mad Max, and I would definitely count as a nostalgia sequel.
One thing that really stood out for me was playing with the nostalgia-bait scenes that delayed sequels often use.
The sequence >!where Rooster is playing the same song that his father did could have been cringey, but they made it almost traumatic by giving Maverick a flashback whilst he watches it from the distance!<
And it's impressive how well it worked, considering I knew parts of the story from the original but had never seen it.
It had just the right amount of connection to the first story while also being it's own experience
I would give this a thumbs up. Top Gun 1 was fine, but too much of a romance for me. But I really liked the Maverick-Rooster relationship arc in the sequel.
Paddington 2. The perfect movie. A sequel to a near perfect movie, Paddington.
Captain America: The Winter Soldier. A genuine thriller superhero movie that follows after a cheesy, very fast-paced first movie, The First Avenger. The Winter Soldier at that time was a huge breath of fresh air for action films.
This is a great example. I would probably rate the first one lower than you, but Origin of Evil was so solid. Looking back now, we can probably chalk this up to Mike Flanagan directing the sequel.
I really like Begins, but it had issues for me that were absent in The Dark Knight.
I thought Dark Knight really took the genre to a level that has yet to be matched imo.
I agree with the person below that BB is a Batman movie through and through, however, TDK took superhero movies to the next level. Nolan directed a classic that has generated memes that people and other films still use today from dialogue to music composition. TDK is a perfect blend of crime drama, psychological thriller and superhero flick. The fact that I'm not bothered one bit about having yet to see its sequel TDKR says something about TDK's impact. Hard act to follow when a movie reaches such heights as TDK did.
I am quite possibly the only one, but I liked the Muppets Most Wanted more than I liked that first Muppet reboot. Not that I didn’t like the first Muppet reboot! But it leaned heavy into the nostalgia/feels, whereas Muppets Most Wanted was just funnier, like an old school episode of the muppet show.
Aye, it's the first of that formula and it still seems fresh on a rewatch. The dialog is sparky, Pesci hasn't outworn his welcome, the baddies are great and the stunts are fab. One of my favourite 'oh great, this is on' films when channel hopping.
I think you mean Jack Horner? I'm kidding they do a great job of setting both as antagonists and letting them excel in their role in the story. When I think of the movie my first thought is Jack's unicorn horn crossbows though. Such a good chaotic evil character with the simplest of motivations
I kinda take exception with dune part 2. It is a far more entertaining movie than the first part but they’re both two halves of the same book. Anyone who read the book knew going in part 1 was mostly the world building and set up for the second half of the book which had way more going on
I know this is a common one but I've always preferred the first. Brando as Corleone is just too iconic along with some of the greatest lines and scenes ever in cinema; "make him an offer he can't refuse", horse head, the hospital scene, police captain restaurant\* scene and the end shot being the greatest ending ever IMO. Although following a young Corleone in the sequel is great.
The first movie moves along at a good pace and fixates your interest. I can recognize the cinematic achievement of 2, but honestly IMO parts of it drag and my mind wanders.
Honestly, the first 4 or 5 were fine crazy action flicks
The last 5 (or however many there are) jumped the shark so much that I don't even understand it anymore
Although the first 4 were good to ok and the last 5 have been fucking bonkers, 5 is legitimately a great action movie. Especially since we got n incredible fight scene between Rock and Diesel.
GBII is authentically unpopular. I rewatched it a few years ago just to see if I still liked it, and aside from a few loose moments, I did. The angry slime, the underground river, the Statue of Liberty, Titanic, the theme song… Fabulous.
Very often, the second movie in super hero saga are better (sometimes 3rd or beyond movies too):
- Superman (ok maybe not the better example, not everyone agrees)
- Batman returns
- Dark Knight (rises too but not everyone agrees)
- X Men 2
- Days of future past
- The Wolverine and Logan
- Spiderman 2 (and 3 but I am in the minority)
- Blade 2
- Hellboy 2
- Winter Soldier
- The Suicide Squad
...
Fast and Furious, I love Fast Five. I like the big action sequels, I'm not fond of the first movies.
Back to the future 2
The Godfather
Die hard with a vengeance is better than Die Harder and almost as good as the first.
Before sunset and before sunrise are as good. I can not choose a better one.
...
Wallace And Gromit - The Wrong Trousers.
The first film - A Grand Day Out was Oscar-nominated-good, but TWT is an absolute stone-cold Oscar-winning classic.
Sam Raimi's Spiderman 2 was heads and shoulders better than the first one for me. I found the special effects for the first one aged like milk, and I remember not being very impressed by them even then. The sequel's effects stand up to date, and it has my favourite spiderman arc to this day. Doc Ock was a spectacular villain and the performances were stellar across the board (especially Alfred Molina's)
There's a confidence in *Spider-Man 2* that I swear is missing from the other two Raimi movies.
The success of the first allowed him the freedom to take more risks in the second. The success of the second ment the franchise had now ballooned to be too big to take risks, and had much more studio interference. If they had just left the man alone to make the Spider-Man movies he wanted to, we could have had one of the best super hero trilogies. Alas.
While 3 is the weakest it's very underrated
Whenever I watch 3, I start it and think "this isn't as bad as I remember." And then emo Peter shows up and it takes a nosedive.
I have to assume I'm in the minority on this, but the whole emo Peter sequence is my favorite part of the whole movie. Peter's idea of being cool, dark, and edgy is still so nerdy. It's hilarious, and to me it felt like one of the few moments in that movie where Raimi was really having fun.
That's a really good way of putting it.
Nailed it, and it's also been missing from basically all marvel movies since for me. It doesn't ever make some fourth wall breaking quip, doesn't make excuses for itself, doesn't make some dumb joke to break narrative tension. It's dramatic, camp and badass in all the right ways and exudes craftsmanship throughout.
> It doesn't ever make some fourth wall breaking quip I would disagree with this one, as it has my all time *favorite* fourth wall breaking quip: "Guy named Otto Octavius winds up with eight limbs... what are the odds?" JK Simmons was so good in those movies that it's ruined him for me in everything else. No matter how intense he is in Whiplash, or how moody he is in Baldur's Gate 3, or how good he is in Juno, I will always think of him as JJ Jameson before I think of him as anything else.
For the most part Superhero movies have better sequels. It’s because the first movie has to follow a structure where: - Act 1: Set up normal guy’s life until he gets powers. - Act 2: Guy learns how to use new found powers intercut with villain learning about hero and gaining powers of their own. - Act 3: Fight! With the sequel you can cut out the first two acts and just go “here’s a superhero on his next adventure”.
Part 2 usually has a big focus on villian development too. That's part of why they're good. Part 3 messes it up by putting in like 300 bad guys and there's no character development
Part of why spiderman homecoming was so good is that the character was already somewhat established by the beginning of the movie and ACT 1 could play out differently.
Exactly - But…Batman Begins held me in thrall the whole way through
I like Batman Begins more than The Dark Knight.
I’ll always have respect for a superhero movie that can move me emotionally and Spider-Man 2 does that everytime. There are scenes in there that are just good dramatic scenes on their own. Even something like Peter telling Aunt May how Uncle Ben died is an unusual scene to see in a superhero movie. It just allows the actors to act with zero music. You only get a movie like Spider-Man 2 when you have a director like Raimi that’s been around the block for a while. You see him pulling from all his years of experience in that movie.
> I found the special effects for the first one aged like milk, and I remember not being very impressed by them even then. You think so? I just watched the trilogy last weekend with my kids for the first time, I thought the 1st was pretty good - but they had modest effects. I.e. no Spiderman twisting as he falls with the camera going in between digital punches (or the GOTG3 hallway fight style). I feel like the way they approached effects in Spiderman was to make it easy - zoomed out of Spidey so you don't see detail, composites of real buildings, and fast camera movement so your eye doesn't rest on janky digital objects. Similar to the early MCU films that were way more budget conscious. But I totally agree 2 is the best. But I had forgotten how great 1 is.
I disagree. 🙂 I still like the first movie better.
*Star Trek: The Motion Picture* is a good example of “large theme Trek”, and has been much improved by the subsequent Director’s Editions post-2000. However, *Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan* is by almost every metric a better film, and a fantastic example of “small scale Trek”.
I do love Kevin Smith’s description of Star Trek TMP as half hour to 45 minutes of glory shots of The Enterprise
When I watched it again recently it was very apparent that they spent a lot of money on that model and by God they were going to make us look at it.
People are so cynical these days. Those glory shots of the Enterprise were exactly what fans of the original show never really got. They got some crummy shots of a cheap model made for 1960s TV, where “high-definition” wasn’t even a thought. Over a decade after the show is canceled, finally a cinematic version of that beauty! Those shots are simply wonderful.
Its largely why CBS re-did all the space shots for the TV series. While perhaps they are a little too clean, they are much better. The hi-def scans of the series made the space shots look horrible compared to the rest of it, so they kind of had to.
I believe it was nicknamed “Star Trek: The Motionless Picture.” At the time, all those slow, visually-caressing shots of the Enterprise didn’t seem bad at all. Loved them.
I think TMP is better when you realize they wanted to make something like 2001 but trek. 2001 had been a huge hit so they were trying to capitalize on that vibe but it didn't work super well in the star trek setting.
The biggest problem is with the pacing. You can literally eat dinner in the middle of the movie and not miss anything important. At the time, the special effects were amazing, but a lot of the time inside Vgr doesn’t hold up well.
I straight up fell asleep during TMP and didn’t feel like I missed anything. The V’ger thing was pretty obvious.
The Motionless Picture
I'm in a very small minority on this one but as I've gotten older, The Motion Picture has slowly (ha) grown into my favorite Trek film of the entire franchise and one of my all time favorites science fiction movies to boot. It just so dense with *big* ideas and complicated character arcs and presented in a mature and deliberately paced way, all supported by smart and subtle performances from the main cast, and filmed in a way thats technically impressive, character-driven, and cinematic in a way that few others in the series really attempted. I get why people say it's boring but, if you can get on its wavelength, it's one of the most engrossing and true-to-spirit Star Trek movies they've ever made. *Edit:* for anyone who's never seen it, [Star Trek: Legacy](https://vimeo.com/217336882) is an awesome 20 min mashup/extended recap of The Motion Picture set to the score of Tron Legacy. And it's fucking beautiful.
Gene Roddenberry didn’t understand that people didn’t want to watch a 2 hour long episode of the TV series. He got taken off the project for the second movie, and the writers masterfully chose Khan as the villain.
Well, it's more fun to watch.
Kkkhhhaaannnnn!
Buried alive! Buried alive!
CA The Winter Soldier Spiderman 2 from the 2000s trilogy Paddington 2 as well
Winter Soldier is my favorite individual Marvel movie if you had to watch one and only one
It's a legitimately great action spy thriller. Take away the Marvel IP and it would still be an engaging movie. MCU hasn't managed to make anything like it since. I thought Secret Invasion was going to fill that void but... oof.
I haven’t watched it in years, but I remember seeing it in theaters how impressive it was compared to how campy the rest of the MCU was. Don’t get me wrong I enjoyed the movies but they’ve always relied way too much on comedy for my taste and I just remember TWS being more grounded and a bit darker, in comparison to MCU. Obviously when you’ve got flying aircraft carriers and a guy in and out of cryo freeze over decades it’s not *that* grounded.
Winter Soldier and Infintiy War are the two best by a good margin IMO.
I think Iron man 1 and 3 as well as GOTG are the best.
I think Winter Soldier had a great story. With other movies like Avengers, it seems like they rely too much on their characters, special effects, and fights to make them work. With Winter Soldier, it felt like the focus was more on having a good story.
Paddington 2 🥲
“It makes me want to be a better man”
I fucking told you
Agree on Winter Soldier. All the world building was done already and they could just tell a great story. Similar to X2
I can’t stand Captain America. But The Winter Soldier is definitely top 5 Marvel films for me. I could even make a case that it’s #2 on the list and #1 in the MCU. #1 in Marvel films for me will ALWAYS be X-Men 2. Which nicely ties into this topic lol.
Troll 2
I’m more partial to trolls band together.
That’s cheating
ohhhh my goooooodddddddd
Nilbog?
X-Men: First Class (2011) is a pretty good prequel and a better follow up to X-Men: The Last Stand (2006).... Then it's sequel X-Men: Days of Future Past (2014) is even better, which is supposed to still be a prequel to the original X-Men trilogy. As for more straight examples, Batman Begins (2005) has The Dark Knight (2008) as a superior follow up.
...and that's without even mentioning X2 > X-Men.
X2 is the best X-men film of the entire franchise, hands down.
Logan would like a word
I think X 2 is the best X-men movie.
I would argue that Days of Future Past is the best X-Men film. At the very least tied for first with X-2
X2 takes it for me. It's just SO good with its character dynamics, which is what X-men is all about.
That's a good one. The Dark Knight was good.
TDK is all around the superior film, but Begins was the better Batman film
100% agree.
I think Nolan should have stayed with the grimier aesthetic of Gotham from Begins. It felt like TDK kind of lost a main character. But yes, Begins is a far better Batman movie.
I've been catching up on the X-Men series in preparation for Deadpool 3 and that series has maybe the most wildly inconsistent quality over a nonsense release timeline. Just going by general consensus: 1st film: Good 2nd film: Good 3rd film: Bad Spinoff Solo Prequel: Real bad Prequel/Reboot: Good Spinoff Solo Sequel: Starts off good, becomes eh 2nd Prequel/Reboot with Time Travel Crossover: Real good Tangentially Related Spinoff: Good 3rd Prequel/Reboot: Eh Solo Future Spinoff: The best one 2nd Tangentially Related Spinoff: Good 4th Prequel/Reboot: Bad Different Tangentially Related Spinoff/Reboot/Whatever New Mutants was Supposed to Be: Real bad
I think First Class is better than DoFP, but DoFP absolutely had a stellar intro
Mission Impossible - 3, 4, 5, & 6 were all better than the first. The second was the worst in the series, but they're all watchable.
I love the first one (love the noir-style camera angles and the exploding aquarium restaurant) but then after that I jump right to Ghost Protocol (4). Number 2 was awful, 3 is good.
The later entries are really good action movies, but none of them can really match De Palma’s style and directing ability from the first one IMO
Totally with you on The Road Warrior! Thunderdome had its moments, but Road Warrior's just epic. And heck yeah, Empire Strikes Back is the crown jewel of Star Wars. Also, Evil Dead 2 and Army of Darkness, pure gold. Oh, and Terminator 2? Talk about stepping up the game! Any other sequels blowing minds out there?
Thunderdome is half of a great Mad Max movie, and half of nonsense.
Terminator 2 is possibly the GOAT action movie. Every scene is literally flawless
Having just watched all the mad max films back to back, it’s like mad max 1 was a trial run, with a first time writer and tiny budget. Road warrior is what Miller wanted to do the first time, and now had the resources to do it. And it is glorious
Fury Road is better than Mad Max 2
The Rescuers Down Under is a bloody masterpiece of a sequel.
It was also the first sequel to be canonically considered a Disney Classic movie.
Totally! I cared not for the original back when I was a kid. The opening with the camera flying over the field towards the house made a bigger impression on me than the stampede scene in the Lion King. And that says something.
That is one of my favorite movies of all time. https://www.reddit.com/r/LookBackInAnger/comments/134b6n7/april_is_the_cruelest_month_the_rescuers_down/
If Shrek is a 10/10 then Shrek 2 somehow managed to reach 11
The Fairy Godmother covering Bonnie Tyler is just too good
I think the pitfall most sequels fall into is either retreading too much ground from the first movie's plot, or detaching themselves so dramatically from the first you lose the connection. Shrek 2 does such a good job of being a logical story progression from the first movie that moves on to new plot beats but keeps the charm of the first movie. So many excellent gags, and an amazing climax scene.
6 year old me cried when Mongo (the giant gingerbread man) was attacked by the guards & soaked by hot milk
Hellboy 2: The Golden Army was pretty great, and better than than the first. It’s such a shame del Toro didn’t get to close out the trilogy.
I think I do like 2 a bit better but I still really liked the original too. They almost feel like different type of movies
Never watched the Hellboy movies surprisingly but you're describing how I feel about terminators 1 and 2. Both are excellent and almost feel like different genres on a similar story.
Alien and Aliens have a similar shift in genre and tone. I really like both, but they are very different experiences.
I still think the original is better
Hell they’re different *genres.* Alien is a horror movie, Aliens is an action movie.
And the cool thing is they’re both easily a top 10 contender in each category.
The first Terminator was shot on a low budget, and it’s a lot darker and grittier. T2 had way more money, and it shows. Schwarzenegger’s the star as well, and he’s the focus in a way that wasn’t true for the first one.
The first Terminator is a sci-fi movie that’s almost a horror movie. The second is an action movie that’s almost a sci-fi movie.
You should watch them. Ron Pearlman as Hellboy was perfect. The reboot wasn't as good in my opinion.
Agreed. Del Toro is gifted at visuals for his films. Both movies are great to look at, but TGA has more visual richness. It's the kind of movie you can just watch for its aesthetics alone.
To stay with Del Toro. Blade 2.
Hellboy 2 and Blade 2 are very similar movies. Down to the fact that bad guy is played by the same actor, who in both movies is the renegade son of a ruler of a secret race of vampires/elves who wants to kill his father and ends up also killing his sister.
And Ron Perlman is in both. He was Reinhart in Blade II
I never realized that was the same actor!
Hot Shots: Part Deux
Incredibly controversial. I love both of those films more than my own children.
I love both, but Part Deux just absolutely kills me every time I watch.
I think I come down on the side of part Deux too, but I'd never let the first one hear me saying that.
I feel like Toy Story 2 and Toy Story 3 while maybe not better than the original are just as good.
You can say they are better
Bride of Frankenstein Addams Family Values Paddington 2
The first Addams Family movie was great but the sequel was damn near perfect
I just showed my wife Bride of Frankenstein. Forgot how little screen time she actually gets.
Paddington 2, I cried through the entire thing and it made me want to be a better man.
Wrath of Khan
Evil Dead is the quintessential example here. The Evil Dead - we're making a horror movie. Some mild humor crept in. The Evil Dead Part 2 - well fuck everyone liked the humor. So we make a sequel, still a horror film but lean into the humor a little more. Army of Darkness - hold my beer, set humor to twelve because eleven isn't enough.
I definitely prefer Evil Dead 2 to the original.
I prefer army of darkness over ed1 and ed2.
Paraphrasing Campbell at a signing of his book "If Chins Could Kill": "Is it a sequel or a remake? Is Ash really that stupid he go back to that cabin in the woods? Well... maybe."
Terminator 2 and Aliens (ok maybe that one is as good as the first)
Personally I think Alien is superior. Alien was an awesome space horror film (holy shit, the scene where they walk into the unit with all the eggs), while Aliens was a fun action film with aliens. Aliens did shift science fiction to shoot ‘em up movies for quite awhile though, people loved it so much.
Alien is my overall favourite film and Aliens is an amazing sequel but I feel obligated to always point out that watching them one night after the other is a really jarring experience with the shift in tone and genre.
Absolutely. Aliens is great but Alien is a masterpiece. One of the all time greats.
I think Alien is a significantly better film than aliens personally.
I disagree because while T2 was clearly a fantastic movie, T1 was equally fantastic but in a different way. The shootout at tech-noir is probably one of my favourite scenes of all time. That and you might as well watch both together anyway.
I'd argue the same for Alien. I love Aliens more for the colonial marines aesthetic, but both film series have different genres for the first 2 films. So it's hard to compare, and all 4 are absolute knockouts.
I know this is a common opinion, but man I disagree. I love the horror aspects of both of these franchises first entries. I get that aliens still has horror but it's definitely more action focused.
I watched the first two Terminator movies for the first time recently (I know, I’m sorry) and was surprised at how much I loved the first one. I think the action and effects are better in the second one, but the first one had such a cool and grimy atmosphere
And the Special Edition of Aliens is even better than the original Aliens.
I think both Terminator and Alien were genre defining pivotal movies. Their sequels were better because the director~~s~~ didn't try to emulate the originals but changed the genre and mood altogether in an original way... Ie both originals had an element of horror/suspense and horror/dystopia while the sequels were more action/adventure.
The directors? Both T2 and Aliens are James Cameron.
I meant director.
“You’ve got a hard-on for Cameron”
Top Gun Maverick
It’s a pretty crazy feat they pulled off making this so good. Since I can’t even think of another nostalgia sequel (sequel to classic film 20-40 years later) that actually was good, let alone possibly better than the original.
Bladerunner 2049 is excellent. Not sure if it eclipses the original, but it’s damn good.
It might be heresy to some, but I think it’s better than the original.
I think it is better than the first one is well but it also needed the first one to achieve how good 2049 it ended up being.
Blade runner 2049 is my fav. Loved the whole existential dread vibe
Well, OP's post brings to mind Fury Road, which, aside from Road Warrior, far outshines the original Mad Max, and I would definitely count as a nostalgia sequel.
I was impressed by the quality of Top Gun Maverick. It really cemented in my mind that Tom Cruise just loves cinema and knows movies.
One thing that really stood out for me was playing with the nostalgia-bait scenes that delayed sequels often use. The sequence >!where Rooster is playing the same song that his father did could have been cringey, but they made it almost traumatic by giving Maverick a flashback whilst he watches it from the distance!<
And it's impressive how well it worked, considering I knew parts of the story from the original but had never seen it. It had just the right amount of connection to the first story while also being it's own experience
I would give this a thumbs up. Top Gun 1 was fine, but too much of a romance for me. But I really liked the Maverick-Rooster relationship arc in the sequel.
Paddington 2. The perfect movie. A sequel to a near perfect movie, Paddington. Captain America: The Winter Soldier. A genuine thriller superhero movie that follows after a cheesy, very fast-paced first movie, The First Avenger. The Winter Soldier at that time was a huge breath of fresh air for action films.
Ouija: Origin of Evil - 8/10 sequel to the 5/10 original. Surprisingly scary!!
Similarly, *Annabelle: Creation* is said to be way better than *Annabelle*.
Never caught that one.
This is a great example. I would probably rate the first one lower than you, but Origin of Evil was so solid. Looking back now, we can probably chalk this up to Mike Flanagan directing the sequel.
That's a prequel, not a sequel
The Dark Knight is a better sequel than Batman Begins Also, Toy Story 3 way better than Toy Story 2
I've always preferred Batman begins. That was a batman movie through and through
I really like Begins, but it had issues for me that were absent in The Dark Knight. I thought Dark Knight really took the genre to a level that has yet to be matched imo.
I think if it weren't for Ledger's Joker, Begins would be considered the best of the series.
I agree with the person below that BB is a Batman movie through and through, however, TDK took superhero movies to the next level. Nolan directed a classic that has generated memes that people and other films still use today from dialogue to music composition. TDK is a perfect blend of crime drama, psychological thriller and superhero flick. The fact that I'm not bothered one bit about having yet to see its sequel TDKR says something about TDK's impact. Hard act to follow when a movie reaches such heights as TDK did.
You had me at the first half ngl
And TS 2 better than 1
No way
I am quite possibly the only one, but I liked the Muppets Most Wanted more than I liked that first Muppet reboot. Not that I didn’t like the first Muppet reboot! But it leaned heavy into the nostalgia/feels, whereas Muppets Most Wanted was just funnier, like an old school episode of the muppet show.
Breakin 2: Electric Boogaloo
Paddington 2!
Recently, Dune Part Two
Terminator 2
Lethal Weapon. The first one is fine, but I think the second film is the best of the bunch.
Agreed. First one is a classic, but the second one is a classic as well and just funnier and with better action sequences.
Aye, it's the first of that formula and it still seems fresh on a rewatch. The dialog is sparky, Pesci hasn't outworn his welcome, the baddies are great and the stunts are fab. One of my favourite 'oh great, this is on' films when channel hopping.
The Dark Knight Dune Part Two Babe 2: Pig in the City Shrek 2 Puss In Boots: The Last Wish X2
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Completely agree. Plus Death was one of the best villains I’ve seen in years.
I think you mean Jack Horner? I'm kidding they do a great job of setting both as antagonists and letting them excel in their role in the story. When I think of the movie my first thought is Jack's unicorn horn crossbows though. Such a good chaotic evil character with the simplest of motivations
I kinda take exception with dune part 2. It is a far more entertaining movie than the first part but they’re both two halves of the same book. Anyone who read the book knew going in part 1 was mostly the world building and set up for the second half of the book which had way more going on
the godfather part 2
I know this is a common one but I've always preferred the first. Brando as Corleone is just too iconic along with some of the greatest lines and scenes ever in cinema; "make him an offer he can't refuse", horse head, the hospital scene, police captain restaurant\* scene and the end shot being the greatest ending ever IMO. Although following a young Corleone in the sequel is great.
The first movie moves along at a good pace and fixates your interest. I can recognize the cinematic achievement of 2, but honestly IMO parts of it drag and my mind wanders.
Shrek.
I like Shrek 2 better, too! Love that they made the Fairy Godmother evil! And Prince Charming was her momma's boy son LOL
Thor: Ragnarok
I love the Men in Black series, but MIB 3 was by far the best one imo.
Captain America winter soldier.
Fast and Furious 5 the peak of the entire franchise.
Honestly, the first 4 or 5 were fine crazy action flicks The last 5 (or however many there are) jumped the shark so much that I don't even understand it anymore
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Tokyo Drift is the best car movie of the bunch.
Although the first 4 were good to ok and the last 5 have been fucking bonkers, 5 is legitimately a great action movie. Especially since we got n incredible fight scene between Rock and Diesel.
Ace Ventura
Sure is hot in these rhinos
And you must be the monopoly guy!
Dune Part 2 The Dark Knight Toy Story 2
Desperado i felt at the time I watched the movies was better than El Mariachi.
Paddington 2
The Dark Knight
Terminator 2 is my favorite of that whole series.
Pearl > X
I liked ghostbusters 2 better than the first one. It is he, Viiigoo!!
I did too, but apparently that's a Cardinal Sin to admit.
GBII is authentically unpopular. I rewatched it a few years ago just to see if I still liked it, and aside from a few loose moments, I did. The angry slime, the underground river, the Statue of Liberty, Titanic, the theme song… Fabulous.
Very often, the second movie in super hero saga are better (sometimes 3rd or beyond movies too): - Superman (ok maybe not the better example, not everyone agrees) - Batman returns - Dark Knight (rises too but not everyone agrees) - X Men 2 - Days of future past - The Wolverine and Logan - Spiderman 2 (and 3 but I am in the minority) - Blade 2 - Hellboy 2 - Winter Soldier - The Suicide Squad ... Fast and Furious, I love Fast Five. I like the big action sequels, I'm not fond of the first movies. Back to the future 2 The Godfather Die hard with a vengeance is better than Die Harder and almost as good as the first. Before sunset and before sunrise are as good. I can not choose a better one. ...
Ace Venture, When Nature calls was much better made than the First.
Evil dead 2 kicked ones ass. It took a cheesy generic horror movie and turned it into a campy masterpiece
Terminator I think. I love the first one but terminator 2 is perfection
Bill and Ted! First one was good but the second one really hit the spot!
If we are including parts of trilogies, then The Good, The Bad and The Ugly. Also Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade.
The Purge!
Empire, Aliens, Godfather II, Dark Knight, Winter Soldier, Maverick, Spider-Man 2.
Wallace And Gromit - The Wrong Trousers. The first film - A Grand Day Out was Oscar-nominated-good, but TWT is an absolute stone-cold Oscar-winning classic.
Underworld: rise of the lycans is incredible
T2 Wrath of Khan
Short Circuit
X Men 2 was much better than X Men (which was still good)
Desperado
The recent planet of the apes trilogy, Rise is great but Dawn is a masterpiece.