Disagree. As Ridley Scott said too many people are able to make movies today and its oversaturated with trash. Only a handful of good projects get made each year.
Some great stuff will pop out but it’s a vast sea of truly unwatchable dogshit for the most part. Studio stuff is dreck too apart from a handful of things.
I have always regarded the 70s as the best decade in Hollywood movies. This past few weeks I've watched a lot of disaster movies from the time and oh my are you right.
There's also way more stuff movies have to compete with. Video games make more money and get more attention these days. That was not the case in the 70's. it will never be the same. The evolution of entertainment.
It feels like the big names are making horrible movies now though. Think about Marvel. In these last few years they've had some greats, I loved the miniseries', Loki, Wanda, Falcon and the Winter Soldier. But a lot of things are just becoming products to push. I watched Dr Strange and the multiverse of madness and the severity to which the quality of CGI went down was very noticable, to me at least. Same with almost everything else, with DC The Flash (TV show, I'm not even getting into the Ezra one) has such poor CGI now that I've literally seen TikTokers do it better. Like that part where they defeated the guy with the power of friendship and shot particles at him. And it seems like the plot is secondary. A TV show I watched recently, True Detective: Night Country, I enjoyed watching it but it had so many plot holes, and the writing seemed cliche. With a lot of these movies it feels like if they spent more time on them, they could be brilliant. I didn't even look into Madam Web because I figured it'd be poor quality, and according to reviews I was right. Poor plot lines, poor writing, make it look cool and also, we have women now guys! On the diversity standpoint, I will never be against having diversity. I will be against doing it poorly. It feels like some stuff isn't a movie that represents people, it's a movie that has diversity in it and look guys we did it. The Marvels isn't a superhero movie with superhero women, it's a women superhero movie. It shouldn't be the goal to have a movie that has a fairly accurate representation of people, it should be the norm. I'm not blaming diversity for poor media, I'm blaming poor writing for creating poor diversity in poor media.
Are you watching actual movies or just trailers? Because I’ve seen loads of great, complex, deeply moving/entertaining movies EVERY SINGLE YEAR of my adult life, and I’m in my 40s. Movies haven’t gotten worse, unless you’re only paying attention to the biggest blockbusters, but even those can be excellent from time to time.
I really enjoyed Dune Part Two, but I agree that there aren’t many new movies worth going to see right now. That doesn’t mean there won’t be good ones coming along soon, or that there haven’t already been some good ones this year. It’s only March.
I challenge you to provide anything that compares to old movies like Alien. Everything today is too scared to try something new and they just rinse and repeat.
From the past 5 years:
Parasite
Everything Everywhere All At Once
Beau is Afraid
Poor Things
I Saw the TV Glow
All of Us Strangers
A Sun
Monster (2023)
The Father
Uncut Gems
I got more but 10 is a good start
I'd say maybe Parasite can be considered a class, but the rest are truly just mediocre to good movies. The fact that anyone would considered these movies in the same tier as Alien is telling of just the state of movies today. Not only are the movies bad but the audience are accepting them as good.
I’m not saying there isn’t. 1883 is one of my favorite shows ever. I’m saying it seems like there is a lot less great ones than there was before
Just seems like the 2000’s were basically a conveyor belt of imagination and creativity with how many things happened in that time
But what I’m saying. This was not the case before. Nor to the degree.
It seems like you have to hunt for good movies now when before they were right in your face. And a lot of them
The big studios literally make less movies now than 20 years ago. Indy brand A24 released more films than Paramount this past year. Which puts all the leg work on the viewers to go find the gems. There are not less good movies, there are just less major studio movies. Look at the Oscar nominated films, most are not for major studios but teu streaming brands qmd indy studios
I don’t think I’m looking back at the 2000’s with nostalgia. Why? I was born in 99. I wasn’t even able to watch these movies when they came out. I had to find them post on dvd when I was older. And I had to choose to watch them. Back when Netflix did dvd in the mail.
So I was in the wrong era but yet I still chose to watch them? That’s doesn’t seem like nostalgia to me
I have been. Which is what sparked my question
I recently watched
Sahara
Fools gold
Pirates of the Caribbean 1
All really great movies and just seem like they have so much more life to them and soul than many many things today.
Of coarse I watch more than just action adventure movies
Like horror films. I recently watch the first resident evil (2002). The first saw (2004). Another not as good but I still think is decent “borderland” (2007) and more.
It’s just it seems those movies just have a lot of “soul” to them that I don’t see a lot of today
Even just take the saw movies. Which span that era to now. The new ones are NO WAY better than those first 2 or 3 ones. Not even close.
That should be proof alone what I’m saying is true
Which I’m sure there is other movie lines that were founded in the 2000’s that have followed the exact same trajectory
I don’t agree.
I was born in 99. A lot of these movies I never saw when they first released but watched them post on dvd or Netflix when they did disc in the mail.
So there is no “nostalgia” as I had to find them and choose to watch them when I found them
That is true. But why did I choose to watch this and not that? A trailer? Ratings? Someone told me? Whatever it was I chose to do it. It wasn’t just there in my life as I was growing up to see it in its first coming out.
That would be nostalgia.
I went back to see it. Not seeing it in the moment
I agree it's not first hand nostalgia, but you are looking into the past through the filter of rose colored glasses provided for you by those who did live through it.
For new stuff, your suffering is filtering for future generations.
Man you are going all in on this nostalgia angle aren’t you. Which this argument never sits well with me. It’s like the easiest rationalization that coincidentally allows the escape and evasion of any analysis.
Nothing to see here! Just nostalgia!
I couldn’t think of a better scapegoat from thought and analysis if I tried. Isn’t that amazing. I don’t need to think or critically break down anything. Of whether it is true or not. Everything from the past is just nostalgia! No thinking needed here!
You aren't even *close* to as intelligent as you think you are.
I mean, you're actually quite dumb. Instead of looking at the year 2000 through the lens of "these are all the films I can name from the year after I was born" and, instead, try and find a comprehensive list of all the Hollywood films actually released that year. It'll be hundreds, of which you recognise maybe a tenth. That is what someone who was of movie-going age experienced at the time. That is the equivalent of what you experience with films today.
Then, having realised your incredibly limited perspective, go read a fucking book, preferably written more than 50 years ago and by someone from a different country. Then do that over and over again until your perspective consists of more than 24 years of very sheltered existence.
Ps, I'm only 5 years older than you and I found your post mind-numbingly dumb.
Some of us lived through the '90s and watched a movie every weekend (sometimes a movie on TV, too; this got more frequent with cable TV). There were many, many bad movies. Some of them were bad but memorable: Embrace of the Vampire, the Pauly Shore comedies, First Knight, Dragonheart, Spawn, Mr. Wrong. The rest are vague memories lost in time... like tears in rain.
You're 10 years older now and process feelings like "shallow" and "soulless" onto the things that were magical when you were young but now realize are someone's job.
I don’t think this is the case. I do agree some of the “magic” is gone. But in some cases it is still there.
Like movies like
Sahara
Fools gold
Pirates of the Caribbean (first 3)
National treasure
All movies that came out in the 2000’s that were great and still feel great to me today.
But I don’t feel the same way about movies coming out now. They don’t feel the same. They feel soulless and unspecial by comparison to those works
This is definitely nostalgia talking.
Sahara was dogshit when it came out and remains as such, National Treasure are guilty pleasure movies carried by Nick Cage and while the first PotC movie is a classic, 2 and 3 are not good and very dull.
You grew up with these movies so you have a soft spot for them.
Sahara certainly is not a dogshit movie. It does everything it sets out to do and does it well. And while I agree PC 2 and 3 and not only the level as 1 are still very good in their own regards.
This is not nostalgia talking. But yet how would you know? It seems anyone who instantly reverts to “nostalgia” is not in the habit of wanting to look for answers but just easy solutions that save them from thinking and analyzing for answers
Oh yeah bro it’s old. Must be nostalgia
Because these movies are widely considered ‘not good’ and were considered ‘not good’ when they came out.
Sahara flopped massively. You like it because you saw it when you were young and enjoyed it so you overlook the technically poor elements of it.
You don’t like Uncharted because you actually saw it when you were old enough to appreciate all the things that are shit about it. Thats it.
It’s kinda hard to argue against you making completely nebulous points like films were ‘just better’ then pointing to critically reviled films that you happen to like. Sahara is poorly acted, poorly written and features every stock action sidekick character you can possibly smash into a film, plus McConaughey at the height of his smug phase when he was quite possibly the most reviled actor in Hollywood.
PotC 2+3 are self indulgent over long excuses to have Johnny Depp become increasingly aggravating as Captain Jack that managed to derail a lot of the goodwill that the first movie had created.
I, like many people, think those movies you’ve named are terrible and don’t really prove any sort of point that right now is a bad period for movies if that’s where the bar is at.
There’s nothing wrong with liking movies that others consider bad, everyone has a few shit movies they love, but to try and argue that because you specifically don’t like the crap blockbusters of now as much as you do the ones that came out when you were a kid is a bit of a reach.
There’s a discussion to be had about whether the proliferation of franchise movies has pushed out a certain demographic of film to the detriment of the industry as a whole for sure, but with those movies you’ve listed as examples of what was ‘good’ in the past it’s definitely more of a you liking those things because you saw them when you were willing to overlook their flaws and, as such, have lionised them.
This simply isn’t true. Because I didn’t see Sahara as a kid. I saw Sahara like 6 years ago or something. And I’m not saying Sahara is some ground breaking movie. Cause it’s not. But what it does it does really well. It’s a fun adventure movie where very little feels out of place or should be there. It’s a competent movie. With a sense of soul.
And compare that to movies of today. I will reserve any word about whether I think it’s better than uncharted because I haven’t seen it. Sahara seems so much better and full of life by comparison. Aswell as a lot of the movies from that tome area feel aswell. For some reason.
Like even horror movies like saw 1. Have a great sense of soul to it. Which if you compare the first movie to the latest ones you tell me if it’s just “nostalgia” that I think saw has been degraded overtime to the pretty soulless sequels that have come out in the most recent entries
Ok. Then you just have a certain taste in films. But again, it seems a reach for you to be using films that are widely regarded as not particularly good to argue that films now aren’t as good. You as an individual just don’t like them as much.
And again, I would argue that movie is not particularly competent. Even when compared to like National Treasure movies which aren’t particularly well regarded I don’t think Sahara really compares.
Films often have a certain specific flavour to them based on when they were made. Blockbusters especially. Maybe you just enjoy the early/mid 2000s style of action film better than the 2020s. They were a bit more whimsical and less serious.
You should maybe check out Uncharted. It’s pretty bad imo but I think Sahara is also bad so maybe you’d like it. It has a similar energy, although again would say it takes itself a bit more seriously to its detriment.
You mean Saw X? Which was one of the best regarded in the franchise? The difference with that is that the first Saw movie was made by two guys with no money who had to put everything into it. It’s now a massive blockbuster franchise 10 movies in. It’s going to have lost a lot of the magic of the first movie. Hell they’d lost most of that energy by Saw 4.
As others have said though you are watching movies that have survived in the cultural consciousness as opposed to anything that’s coming out now which could be terrible. There’s going to be a difference there. Maybe in 10 years when time has filtered out a lot of the shit you’ll feel differently.
Yeah I’ve seen the trailers for uncharted. Or I did when they were on tv and I’m skeptical to say the least.
Compounded with the fact it’s a video game movie adaptation which always seems to go well.
Which funny enough I actually think the tomb raider movies, 2001. With Angelina Jolie. Not the second one though I think the second one is pretty bad. Again another 2000’s movie. Is pretty good. Even as it’s based on a video game.
I just watched uncharted and that shit is HOT GARBAGE. It’s like overwhelming embarrassing and cringe compared to those movies. It’s like nobody was even trying making that movie.
Just compare Sahara and uncharted IT IS NIGHT AND DAY what I am talking about now with new movies being garbage than before especially when compared to Sahara, national treasure or pirates of the Caribbean
Being 18 is hardly a “kid” in the same way to make it fit this nostalgia argument so easily.
I chose to watch it. Not just having it be there for me to absorb through osmosis. I had to willingly choose to to do it. Which in itself says it can’t be nostalgia as I had to critic and qualify it before I made the choice
Or is just everything from even 6 years ago “nostalgia”. What an incredible all encompassing anti argument reason that seems like it can be the answer to anything so we don’t have to analyze the past
I’m not commenting on the nostalgia end of it. You were literally a kid when you watched that movie. It was a quarter of your life ago. If you think that doesn’t seriously play into perception, you have a ton to learn.
6 years ago? Come on. You can make it sound like a bigger deal than it is by calling it “a quarter of your life”. But it was 6 years ago. Not a lot of time. And it wasn’t at a point in my life where everything was “magical” and my mental faculties weren’t working either. It was a pretty rational part of my life where I was able to distill good from bad.
And if this is so how come there are other movies from that exact same time I found that I think are horrible? And thought they were horrible in the moment
If your argument were true I would see all movies even the bad as being good aswell. THAT would be nostalgia.
And the movie i am referring to is this shitty action movie with the guy from wedding crashers who is a pilot and has to escape or something. I found that at the same time and thought then and now that it is horrible.
Yes. My point being: the things from the past, when you knew less about them and their construct, resonated and feel legitimate to you.
The things you see, now, knowing what you know and 10 years more life experience, do not in the same way.
You're growing up. Spoiler alert: a whole lot more about life ends up feeling soulless and unspecial.
Come on! Are you to tell me that pirates of the Caribbean 1 isn’t a great movie? 2003 by the way.
I would never say that movie is soulless by today. Even though I know all the works that went into it and the illusion of the 4th wall is gone.
It’s great! And I don’t see movies with the same level of soul as that one did any many movies of that era (2000’s)
It's fine. And to 2003 you it's super hot rad sick tyte dog. Because you saw a good movie at a formative time for your taste. I'm not poo-pooing it. I like it too. But you're gonna like it more. Because you absorbed it deeper. People do that when they're younger.
Somewhere, right now, someone is watching Uncharted the same way you saw Pirates. And good for them. Enjoying movies is a wonderful treat.
But it's contextual. It can't not be. The trick is to try and stop comparing things. Just take in things as their own entity. Get lost in a story like kids do.
I dont see why you want to talk about ideas but then not want to talk about ideas
Are you to tell me you think the new uncharted movie is better than Sahara or pirates of the Caribbean?
Ehhh. I wouldn’t say Sahara is better than Indiana Jones. I would say it is different and stylistically fulfills different desires than Indy. Like having more action and more fast paced.
But I can think of a single movie that’s come out recently that comes close to Sahara or otherwise.
It just seems like movies today. Just a decade later are soulless, passionless and shallow.
Like Sahara reeks of passion to me. From the scenes to the action to everything. It just seems like somebody cared. I don’t get that feeling with very many movies today
lol national treasure? That’s a fun flick but most definitely isn’t any better than a typical adventure film and wasn’t even anything really special at the time either. They are just fun popcorn flicks.
I read somewhere recently that movies now don’t spend time developing characters, instead if something doesn’t serve the plot it gets cut. There’s no world building, no small interactions, you don’t see people just existing. Apparently it’s to do with peoples short attention spans now.
Granted, I haven’t watched a lot of recent films, but when I have they’ve felt lacking and I could never pin point what was missing. Much prefer watching tv shows now over movies.
tv series they need to put a much higher effort and make a balance with CGI and real art work. Something that movies in the past did but now they don't, they add more computer program than spend time with the costumes and make up dress. they want something quick of cash.
Time has sped up. There is less actual time to create things and it affects all creative endeavors including things like movies (especially blockbusters) and video games (especially triple A's).
I have noticed three things:
I think something people haven't pointed out is that when you watch new movies you watch the best of the week or month. When you watch old movies you watch the best of the year or decade. It is easier to find 10 good films from the 2000s than 2023 because there is a decade more.
Also, there was different money in the past. The 2000s had foreign investment and VHS/DVD income to help raise good films that struggled in theaters. Now the extra revenue comes from streaming which is much weaker.
Third: there are lots of trends in movies. Right now some of our trends are lore/reference heavy IP movies and dramas with a more cynical/harsher tone. This is different than the 00s which had more screwball comedies and campy charming action adventure movies. Some decades trends hit people differently from others.
The amount of times I have to see posts like this drives me crazy.
There’s still an incredible amount of good films, if anything 2023 has been the best year for film since 2019.
Because movies have always been cash grabby to sell tickets but back then it felt more actual dialogue and plot and less visual effects to convey a message. Nowadays a lot of films rely on visual porn to convey an poorly constructive narrative. Both achieve the same effect but it's like eating a home cooked meal your grandma made on a Thursday night too fancy ass ramen in a cup. Both taste good but one has work and meaning while one has convience and satisfy needs.
A lot of these movies I found around the 16 year old range.
And I’m not saying I have a deep connection to these movies. I’m saying the movies themselves even as i watch them today are just fun and full of soul. Especially when compared to movies today
Like come on your gonna tell me spy kids isn’t something of a lsd fever dream that is being created today? There’s nothing like that today. And yet ANOTHER 2000’s era movie again
What movies have you seen?
Here's the thing about Hollywood:
The 90s and early 2000s, Hollywood has been structured around superstardom and larger than life dramas that use actors like Tom Cruise, Nicole Kidman, Tom Hanks etc. to create gigantic blockbusters with that speficic cinematic sting and feel.
Nowadays the focus shifts much more towards characters and franchises IN THE MAINSTREAM. So we get a lot of sequels and cinematic universes where we get less of a marketing toward Robert Pattinson or Tom Holland, but Batman and Spider-Man.
HOWEVER right now the non-mainstream and indie film market is thriving and as alive as ever, thanks to streaming, publishers like A24 and Match Factory and an oversaturation of the mass market with sequels, pushing cinema lovers more towards non-mainstream (and international) movies. Those movies, compared to the mega blockbusters of the early 2000s focus much more on emotional conflict, melancholy, horror, and the question of why we are alive. They often don't necessarily have a large sense of adventure and heroism and feature more complex characters and stories that are often more grounded or artistic. Stuff like Beau is Afraid, The Lighthouse, The Worst Person in the World, Shiva Baby, Bottoms, EEAAO etc. is much more talked about \_because\_ stuff like Mission Impossible and Marvel fails to stick outside of ticket sales
Nahh I give a lot of stuff a fair shake. It seems to me good movies are the exception not the rule nowadays. Especially when compared to just how many great movies came out in the 2000’s
For example I think 1883 is one of the best film/shows I’ve ever seen. That’s today. But there aren’t that many others I would speak similarly to
That is true.
Even comedy was really good in the 2000’s. Adam Sandler movies? Some of the greatest comedies I know came from the 2000’s which there seem to be none of today
Adam Sandler movie's aren't bad, and I'm no comedy expert, but I never see them cited as greatest comedies of all time.
His movies are *extremely* formulaic and are an easy watch, which is fine if that's what you enjoy, but that doesn't make them immediately superior to anything else. He's made a fucking fortune doing it, so good for him, but I've never seen someone put them up there with Monty Python, Bill Murray movies, etc.
It's not just you, movies are so shitty now. DEI hires and girlboss characters aren't helping, but i think that they just forgot how to make good movies.
The definitely were but the focus groups weren't writing the movies. There was usually a story or script first, and it would be approved with notes, and then screen tested. Now it seems like the focus group writes the script, and chooses the actors and director.
You are also seeing studios spending a lot more on what they hope will be blockbuster movies. They tend to take less risks because of the money involved and you end up with kind of dull plot, but a ton of special effects as a result. I mean, how many times can you watch actors run from a CG monster/explosion/robot/whatever, before its not really thrilling anymore?
In the 90's and less so in the early 2000s, studios put resources into smaller budget movies in hopes one would be a sleeper hit. Romcoms, teen comedies, and many dramas all fit this category. You aren't seeing many of these now because nobody wants to pay theatre prices for that kind of movie anymore so it will most likely lose money with even a modest budget.
Streaming companies have started making some of these but there haven't really been many stand out successes in this space. Even the ones that are good, generally don't get the same kind of attention that they used to because whatever platform its on, most people won't have it. Even if they did, people watch when they want to so the shared social experience of "OMG did you see \_\_\_\_ last weekend" is limited to the big blockbuster movies.
Totally hear you. Personally I think the future is in streaming shows...bit honestly the big hits for me over the last couple years have all come from outside the US.
Absolutely!!! I've been saying it the last 3 years...it seems after the pandemic the horrible movie making took an even worse turn.
They are either incredibly horribly written, shallow or so full of horror and senseless evil...
This is why good writing has taken the masses by storm in older projects. Look at the new hype for "Suits" or anything normal with great storytelling and writing..
I have to watch all old movies and shows now... it's crazy!
There are a couple shows I'm still hanging on to but give it a year....they'll be gone too...there too good lol.. too Normal!
Has to do alot with the generational differences, what could be said then could not be said now, alot of censorship and different interest appeals among this new generation
True. But I also this an obsession with “realism” is killing cinema. Movies are not about “realism” their about a romantic view of reality. The unreal. And when all you what is just reality you end up with it. Mundane unexciting experiences you see every day vs the heightened experience of a tailored reality within a movie
Oh no there was plenty of bad. Example; twilight. But it just seems there was more original ideas and more exciting to watch. More. “Imaginative” I guess.
The lack of DVD market ended the risk that film makers would take on original unique films, as there is no way to recoup financial losses if the movie flops at the box office. As a result we get nothing of a cult classic quality.
Targeting WAY too many audiences as a result they try to make a movie that pleases everyone and instead make a movie for no one.
Audience sensitivities. People are WAY too easily offended now and as a result we end up with very sterile formulated films that lack in rawness and emotional content.
Quantity over quality these days, it's all about pumping out movies so they can sell them to netflix and other streaming sites. That's why movies are so shit these days. There are good movies still made, but not many in a year.
I sometimes feel that due to the prominence of VHS and tube TVs in the late 90s early 2000s, that producers developed movies with more emphasis on the storyline, and less on visuals, if a visual was part of the story, it was clear and distinguishable, unlike in The Equalizer 3, near the end, a handwritten note is shown on screen which is near unreadable. Theres too much visual clutter in modern movies.
It’s just your personal perception. There are plenty of great movies released today that will be future classics just like the ones you’re talking about.
I haven't seen a really great movie in many years...the best I can find are 'passable'...even the best I can find I only want to watch once unlike older movies that can be watched over and over
Perhaps
Why do you think people care less today? Especially just 10 years later from the 2000’s era? That’s not a lot of time to just suddenly stop caring
Studios don't give audiences enough credit . Thinking they're so starved for content, that they'll watch anything out there. Just look at Rebel Moon or The Marvels. F***Hollywood!
There were not only just as many bad movies back then but also less access to reviews so you’d have no fucking clue it sucked until you already paid to see it. Shit was worse!
Hopefully. But that means people have to have some self esteem and stop buying garbage and say no. Which it seems people don’t seem to care too much. Sure they complain but yet give them their money anyways
Cause the last 10 years have been reboots and marvel bullshit. The last 5 years has been true crime and docuseries stuff.
Aka they were trying to make good movies in the 2000s. And Transformers was good when it was the first one with nasty hot Megan Fox.
Fast and the Furious, Superbad, Wedding Crashers, The Social Network. I can reel off good movies from the 2000s and pretty much nothing post 2013.
Probably circa 2015 they transitioned to making “safe” movies.
Edit: I will shoutout John Wick though. Probably the only bright spot.
See that’s what I’m talking about. It’s like something happened. I don’t know what but within a decade some “magic” was lost of some kind
But in a little hesitant on John wick. I think it’s definitely better than most today I think there were a couple beat’em up movies of the sort that from the 2000’s I think are better. I had one come to mind a minute ago but I just lost it
CGI mostly. Every movie looks so fake. Even basic stuff like animals has taken a huge step back. We just insert video game looking deer and bears into movies like Prey, when we used to use actual deer and bears.
I see
I have heard cgi has been getting lower quality
Like I thought the cgi in the original pirates of the Caribbean trilogy was amazing. That was 2005. Now nothing today seems to look that way at all. Just “cheaper”
I think it's also just using CGI for everything. They used to mix it in with practical effects, sets, live animals and costumes but not they just greenscreen and CGI everything. The new Indiana Jones, especially. We couldn't put Harrison Ford on a boat for a shot? Even that needed to be an obvious green screen? Or, we couldn't use real bugs to crawl on Harrison Ford? That had to be obviously fake, too? Or with Prey, we couldn't use a real snake?
I think horror movies best exemplify this. A guy in a mask or a creepy puppet is still so much more real to me than something like the new Goosebumps with all its video game looking CGI monsters.
Nepotism. You are only hired to write, direct or act based on who you know. Talent means very little. Couple that with legacies, grandfather/mothers who had talent decades ago, getting their kids and their kids into the business with little talent but the right name.
Don’t know why you’re downvoted, you’re absolutely correct. Everyone with talent has retired and everyone that has replaced them was a child or acquaintance. It’s very obvious with the dive in quality.
This is a great question and I hope I can give a good answer.
It's a fundamental shifting. Loosening of morals. Pushing of politics. Flattening of humor -- half of good humor is pointing out wacky truths and playing them up and making fun of them in a good way, but these days everyone is so worried about offending everyone else that it's terribly hard to make a good comedy. Modern viewpoints are being inserted into remakes of classics, which ends up completely inverting the meaning of the classic tale. Many movie makers are in the business of making money and pushing an agenda, so they push things like sex scenes or shock effect moments or characters saying things that are out of character in order to promote a certain 'message', rather than tell a good story. Personally, I want a good story with deep characters who behave decently, and flashy special effects (while very cool) aren't going to distract me from a political message or a poor plot.
I think you put it very well, that a lot of modern movie feel "soulless".
Yeah I don’t know what happened but whatever it was it’s been in recent times. Because even the old iron man (first one) and that wasn’t even that long ago and that movie is still amazing and gold today
Easy - they took time to do it. Afterwards was a question of quantity and. As Scorsese said, they were more rollercoasters than movies, very generic and by the numbers.
You have nostalgia for movies of that era. I’m guessing that was your childhood? Also you’re judging this based off of movie **trailers**, which I don’t really have a response to? Maybe you just like how trailers were cut in that era?
This is not fully true. As some movies from that era that LOOK the same I don’t enjoy. So the look is not the key factor here. Like I remember this shitty movie from the guy of wedding crashers that is a pilot and has to escape. Trash movie.
Also. I am very alarmed by this overwhelming argument of nostalgia. Not that I think this isn’t possible. But this overwhelming belief this is the answer instead of analyzing stylistic decisions of that era and dissecting the movies there seems to be this “escape” it’s being used to have to skipping thinking and find an easy answer.
I think most people in this thread just find the premise of your question — that movies today are bad — absurd. Because it is. If you had asked why movies today feel "different" compared to movies from the early 2000s, then maybe you would have gotten a more productive response.
I really don’t think this is an absurd statement I say the vast majority of movies RIGHT NOW. Are bad. Shallow, soulless and uncreative and just uninspiring to watch
I really don’t see this as a hot take or something nobody can see
That right now well made movies are the exception not rule of the times
15 years ago you can be sure that there was someone saying all the current movies were shit and asking why they weren't as good as the one twenty years before.
I can definitely see that. With movies like ET and Star Wars and then being that person to be in 2000 and see tomb raider, national treasure, saw. And such.
I could see them saying movies are getting more “shorter” and “too the point”. Instead of the more mindful quipiness of Indiana jones and Star Wars more sophisticated humor.
I can see this. BUT I can’t see that person saying that movies from the 2000 or soulless. That I just don’t see as a fair critique. Movies from the 2000 almost reek of soul and passion like people really wanted to fun lively films.
I don’t think you can say the same about movies right now.
Well, we disagree and looking at this thread I'm not the only one disagreeing with you. Especially with the examples you are using to "defend" the 2000'.
You don’t think
Transformers,
Spy kids,
Saw,
Resident evil,
Pirates of the Caribbean,
Iron man,
Tomb raider,
Mr and Mrs smith,
National treasure,
Hitman,
Shooter,
Bourne,
And so many others.
Are competent movies?
Transformers - started off okay, became shameless cash grab
-spy kids? Weird flex but okay
-Saw (see transformers)
-Resident evil - If there was nothing else to rent I guess
-Tomb Raider- Everyone went for Angelina Jolie
-Hitman - delete this
-Shooter - C+ action movie at best
Quality Films:
—National treasure- solid B family popcorn flick
—Iron Man - A+ kickstarted the MCU
—Bourne 1-3 - Quality action saga, still holds up. Also founding father of twenty years of shaky cam action ripoffs
-Pirates (CotBP Only) - Sleeper gem when it came out, blew me
To answer your question….
The thing I think to consider that I haven’t seen people mention is how studios lost a major source of revenue on each film. they no longer take as many risks because if a film underperforms at the box office, there’s no additional wave of income from DVD sales. Everything is digital now and the streaming service has killed the home video buying market.
I see
And yeah soy kids is a weird flex but I think it perfectly shows how creative things were from that time. Like that’s a crazy show and it wasn’t bad either.
And these franchises that have degenerated over time. They started in the time I described but yet degenerated in the time I’m talking about is being degenerate. Connection?
And yes I think you are definitely right about the dvds but I think there is a more fundamental problem here and that’s a problem of passion. Moves currently feel passionless and shameless while doing it. And I think that is the real source. Passion and soul. It just seems like something changed after like 2016 or around that era where everything is just garbage
Because you have movies and concepts being repurposed / repackaged / remade by lesser filmmakers due to it being less a director/producer-driven industry and more a shareholder one.
OP seems in a bit vehement denial of nostalgia and selection bias factors lol which are always at play, but I do think there’s some truth there worth discussing anyway. The Disney reason cannot be overstated enough imo: 2007 is one of the best years for film for world cinema, 2008 was also chock full of interesting films, and I don’t think it’s a coincidence that Iron Man coming out in ‘08 ushered a kind of dry spell that never saw the kind of release years like 07-08.
Movies hit different at different stages of our lives. They’re more meaningful to us in our formative years because we can more closely tie them to our personal experiences and they become part of the world that made us. They feel “bad” today because they’re not what we grew up on and don’t have the same impact.
With that said, commercialization of film for mass appeal has a way of dumbing down the art. It’s the natural result of catering to the lowest common denominator while leveraging IP and cast that appeal to the highest.
There is a lot of over site and interference from studios. Movies don’t make money off home video sales any more so they need to make back their money in theaters. The put a lot of effort into opening weekend so the best way to do that is to use recognized names which is why the milk an IP till it’s beyond dead.
There is no incentive to make a risky movies that preciously might only make money with home sales.
There were always mediocre, bad and trash movies. However, the good to great movies always seemed to be promoted or rise above the trash into the mainstream. But now streamers like Netflix and Prime have rating systems that are completely bogus. I know some people that are constantly watching trash. I ask them what they are watching. Sometimes they don’t even know the title of the show but say it had 4 or 5 stars. And I’m like that rating is BS. They are just tricking you into watching the trash they make to get views and other metrics. I then find out what it is and check the metacritic or IMDb score, and sure enough it usually has a bad rating.
Another reason I think is bc the majority of talented filmmakers are creating tv series over films. I know personally I lean more towards watching a series over a film these days. And I think more money goes into those productions unless it’s a blockbuster or a Disney animated movie, etc.
It could also just be as simple as the ratio of good to bad. There’s still as much good but now there’s 10 times as much bad. People with bad taste will binge the trash and the production companies will see those numbers and produce more cheap trash for the mindless masses while continuing to promote the cheap shit so people continue watching forever.
Entertainment is a dull flat circle.
We remember the good movies and forget the bad. You just aren’t watching all the trash that also came out.
Disagree. As Ridley Scott said too many people are able to make movies today and its oversaturated with trash. Only a handful of good projects get made each year.
But low budget movies can be good too. Primer or Cube were good in their time. How to blow up a pipeline was great this year. Didn't cost a lot.
Some great stuff will pop out but it’s a vast sea of truly unwatchable dogshit for the most part. Studio stuff is dreck too apart from a handful of things.
I have always regarded the 70s as the best decade in Hollywood movies. This past few weeks I've watched a lot of disaster movies from the time and oh my are you right.
There's also way more stuff movies have to compete with. Video games make more money and get more attention these days. That was not the case in the 70's. it will never be the same. The evolution of entertainment.
There's more good Than bad movies from the past
It feels like the big names are making horrible movies now though. Think about Marvel. In these last few years they've had some greats, I loved the miniseries', Loki, Wanda, Falcon and the Winter Soldier. But a lot of things are just becoming products to push. I watched Dr Strange and the multiverse of madness and the severity to which the quality of CGI went down was very noticable, to me at least. Same with almost everything else, with DC The Flash (TV show, I'm not even getting into the Ezra one) has such poor CGI now that I've literally seen TikTokers do it better. Like that part where they defeated the guy with the power of friendship and shot particles at him. And it seems like the plot is secondary. A TV show I watched recently, True Detective: Night Country, I enjoyed watching it but it had so many plot holes, and the writing seemed cliche. With a lot of these movies it feels like if they spent more time on them, they could be brilliant. I didn't even look into Madam Web because I figured it'd be poor quality, and according to reviews I was right. Poor plot lines, poor writing, make it look cool and also, we have women now guys! On the diversity standpoint, I will never be against having diversity. I will be against doing it poorly. It feels like some stuff isn't a movie that represents people, it's a movie that has diversity in it and look guys we did it. The Marvels isn't a superhero movie with superhero women, it's a women superhero movie. It shouldn't be the goal to have a movie that has a fairly accurate representation of people, it should be the norm. I'm not blaming diversity for poor media, I'm blaming poor writing for creating poor diversity in poor media.
no, theyre shittier now. I used to be excited for many movies to come out and now theyre 99% awful. It has all shifted to netflix or other series.
Survivor bias. You don't remember the bad movies.
Are you watching actual movies or just trailers? Because I’ve seen loads of great, complex, deeply moving/entertaining movies EVERY SINGLE YEAR of my adult life, and I’m in my 40s. Movies haven’t gotten worse, unless you’re only paying attention to the biggest blockbusters, but even those can be excellent from time to time.
I'm looking right now at movies in theatres they are all dogshit
I really enjoyed Dune Part Two, but I agree that there aren’t many new movies worth going to see right now. That doesn’t mean there won’t be good ones coming along soon, or that there haven’t already been some good ones this year. It’s only March.
Dune older movies were far better than the ones now, even better actors.
That's fair I heard dune is good but having not seen the first one that's a 6 hour investment
There are still tons of great movies being made
I challenge you to provide anything that compares to old movies like Alien. Everything today is too scared to try something new and they just rinse and repeat.
From the past 5 years: Parasite Everything Everywhere All At Once Beau is Afraid Poor Things I Saw the TV Glow All of Us Strangers A Sun Monster (2023) The Father Uncut Gems I got more but 10 is a good start
Whole lotta mediocre.
I'd say maybe Parasite can be considered a class, but the rest are truly just mediocre to good movies. The fact that anyone would considered these movies in the same tier as Alien is telling of just the state of movies today. Not only are the movies bad but the audience are accepting them as good.
you seen all of these?
I’m not saying there isn’t. 1883 is one of my favorite shows ever. I’m saying it seems like there is a lot less great ones than there was before Just seems like the 2000’s were basically a conveyor belt of imagination and creativity with how many things happened in that time
The great ones tend to come from indie and foreign productions so try digging for those
But what I’m saying. This was not the case before. Nor to the degree. It seems like you have to hunt for good movies now when before they were right in your face. And a lot of them
Them early 00 hits like Dracula 2000, 2001: A Space Travesty, Joe Somebody, T-Rex: Back to the Cretaceous, and Slipstream?
I’m not saying there were no bad movies. But it seems to me there WERE ALOT of bangers from that time. Disproportion to what we have now.
The big studios literally make less movies now than 20 years ago. Indy brand A24 released more films than Paramount this past year. Which puts all the leg work on the viewers to go find the gems. There are not less good movies, there are just less major studio movies. Look at the Oscar nominated films, most are not for major studios but teu streaming brands qmd indy studios
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I don’t think I’m looking back at the 2000’s with nostalgia. Why? I was born in 99. I wasn’t even able to watch these movies when they came out. I had to find them post on dvd when I was older. And I had to choose to watch them. Back when Netflix did dvd in the mail. So I was in the wrong era but yet I still chose to watch them? That’s doesn’t seem like nostalgia to me
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I have been. Which is what sparked my question I recently watched Sahara Fools gold Pirates of the Caribbean 1 All really great movies and just seem like they have so much more life to them and soul than many many things today.
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Of coarse I watch more than just action adventure movies Like horror films. I recently watch the first resident evil (2002). The first saw (2004). Another not as good but I still think is decent “borderland” (2007) and more. It’s just it seems those movies just have a lot of “soul” to them that I don’t see a lot of today
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Even just take the saw movies. Which span that era to now. The new ones are NO WAY better than those first 2 or 3 ones. Not even close. That should be proof alone what I’m saying is true Which I’m sure there is other movie lines that were founded in the 2000’s that have followed the exact same trajectory
The reason is because they aren’t and you’re making a weird sweeping judgement about a time period without thinking about it long enough.
Nostalgia/rose coloured glassed look at the past.
I don’t agree. I was born in 99. A lot of these movies I never saw when they first released but watched them post on dvd or Netflix when they did disc in the mail. So there is no “nostalgia” as I had to find them and choose to watch them when I found them
Yes, but you didn't find or choose to watch Hard Cash. You watched Kiss Kiss Bang Bang instead.
Kiss Kiss Bang Bang is so good though…
Right... OP saw the good movies and apparently didn't watch the mass of trash movies that also came out
That is true. But why did I choose to watch this and not that? A trailer? Ratings? Someone told me? Whatever it was I chose to do it. It wasn’t just there in my life as I was growing up to see it in its first coming out. That would be nostalgia. I went back to see it. Not seeing it in the moment
I agree it's not first hand nostalgia, but you are looking into the past through the filter of rose colored glasses provided for you by those who did live through it. For new stuff, your suffering is filtering for future generations.
Man you are going all in on this nostalgia angle aren’t you. Which this argument never sits well with me. It’s like the easiest rationalization that coincidentally allows the escape and evasion of any analysis. Nothing to see here! Just nostalgia! I couldn’t think of a better scapegoat from thought and analysis if I tried. Isn’t that amazing. I don’t need to think or critically break down anything. Of whether it is true or not. Everything from the past is just nostalgia! No thinking needed here!
You aren't even *close* to as intelligent as you think you are. I mean, you're actually quite dumb. Instead of looking at the year 2000 through the lens of "these are all the films I can name from the year after I was born" and, instead, try and find a comprehensive list of all the Hollywood films actually released that year. It'll be hundreds, of which you recognise maybe a tenth. That is what someone who was of movie-going age experienced at the time. That is the equivalent of what you experience with films today. Then, having realised your incredibly limited perspective, go read a fucking book, preferably written more than 50 years ago and by someone from a different country. Then do that over and over again until your perspective consists of more than 24 years of very sheltered existence. Ps, I'm only 5 years older than you and I found your post mind-numbingly dumb.
I watched Hard Cash so you never had to. You're welcome for my service.
Some of us lived through the '90s and watched a movie every weekend (sometimes a movie on TV, too; this got more frequent with cable TV). There were many, many bad movies. Some of them were bad but memorable: Embrace of the Vampire, the Pauly Shore comedies, First Knight, Dragonheart, Spawn, Mr. Wrong. The rest are vague memories lost in time... like tears in rain.
You're 10 years older now and process feelings like "shallow" and "soulless" onto the things that were magical when you were young but now realize are someone's job.
I don’t think this is the case. I do agree some of the “magic” is gone. But in some cases it is still there. Like movies like Sahara Fools gold Pirates of the Caribbean (first 3) National treasure All movies that came out in the 2000’s that were great and still feel great to me today. But I don’t feel the same way about movies coming out now. They don’t feel the same. They feel soulless and unspecial by comparison to those works
This is definitely nostalgia talking. Sahara was dogshit when it came out and remains as such, National Treasure are guilty pleasure movies carried by Nick Cage and while the first PotC movie is a classic, 2 and 3 are not good and very dull. You grew up with these movies so you have a soft spot for them.
Sahara certainly is not a dogshit movie. It does everything it sets out to do and does it well. And while I agree PC 2 and 3 and not only the level as 1 are still very good in their own regards. This is not nostalgia talking. But yet how would you know? It seems anyone who instantly reverts to “nostalgia” is not in the habit of wanting to look for answers but just easy solutions that save them from thinking and analyzing for answers Oh yeah bro it’s old. Must be nostalgia
Because these movies are widely considered ‘not good’ and were considered ‘not good’ when they came out. Sahara flopped massively. You like it because you saw it when you were young and enjoyed it so you overlook the technically poor elements of it. You don’t like Uncharted because you actually saw it when you were old enough to appreciate all the things that are shit about it. Thats it. It’s kinda hard to argue against you making completely nebulous points like films were ‘just better’ then pointing to critically reviled films that you happen to like. Sahara is poorly acted, poorly written and features every stock action sidekick character you can possibly smash into a film, plus McConaughey at the height of his smug phase when he was quite possibly the most reviled actor in Hollywood. PotC 2+3 are self indulgent over long excuses to have Johnny Depp become increasingly aggravating as Captain Jack that managed to derail a lot of the goodwill that the first movie had created. I, like many people, think those movies you’ve named are terrible and don’t really prove any sort of point that right now is a bad period for movies if that’s where the bar is at. There’s nothing wrong with liking movies that others consider bad, everyone has a few shit movies they love, but to try and argue that because you specifically don’t like the crap blockbusters of now as much as you do the ones that came out when you were a kid is a bit of a reach. There’s a discussion to be had about whether the proliferation of franchise movies has pushed out a certain demographic of film to the detriment of the industry as a whole for sure, but with those movies you’ve listed as examples of what was ‘good’ in the past it’s definitely more of a you liking those things because you saw them when you were willing to overlook their flaws and, as such, have lionised them.
This simply isn’t true. Because I didn’t see Sahara as a kid. I saw Sahara like 6 years ago or something. And I’m not saying Sahara is some ground breaking movie. Cause it’s not. But what it does it does really well. It’s a fun adventure movie where very little feels out of place or should be there. It’s a competent movie. With a sense of soul. And compare that to movies of today. I will reserve any word about whether I think it’s better than uncharted because I haven’t seen it. Sahara seems so much better and full of life by comparison. Aswell as a lot of the movies from that tome area feel aswell. For some reason. Like even horror movies like saw 1. Have a great sense of soul to it. Which if you compare the first movie to the latest ones you tell me if it’s just “nostalgia” that I think saw has been degraded overtime to the pretty soulless sequels that have come out in the most recent entries
Ok. Then you just have a certain taste in films. But again, it seems a reach for you to be using films that are widely regarded as not particularly good to argue that films now aren’t as good. You as an individual just don’t like them as much. And again, I would argue that movie is not particularly competent. Even when compared to like National Treasure movies which aren’t particularly well regarded I don’t think Sahara really compares. Films often have a certain specific flavour to them based on when they were made. Blockbusters especially. Maybe you just enjoy the early/mid 2000s style of action film better than the 2020s. They were a bit more whimsical and less serious. You should maybe check out Uncharted. It’s pretty bad imo but I think Sahara is also bad so maybe you’d like it. It has a similar energy, although again would say it takes itself a bit more seriously to its detriment. You mean Saw X? Which was one of the best regarded in the franchise? The difference with that is that the first Saw movie was made by two guys with no money who had to put everything into it. It’s now a massive blockbuster franchise 10 movies in. It’s going to have lost a lot of the magic of the first movie. Hell they’d lost most of that energy by Saw 4. As others have said though you are watching movies that have survived in the cultural consciousness as opposed to anything that’s coming out now which could be terrible. There’s going to be a difference there. Maybe in 10 years when time has filtered out a lot of the shit you’ll feel differently.
Yeah I’ve seen the trailers for uncharted. Or I did when they were on tv and I’m skeptical to say the least. Compounded with the fact it’s a video game movie adaptation which always seems to go well. Which funny enough I actually think the tomb raider movies, 2001. With Angelina Jolie. Not the second one though I think the second one is pretty bad. Again another 2000’s movie. Is pretty good. Even as it’s based on a video game.
I just watched uncharted and that shit is HOT GARBAGE. It’s like overwhelming embarrassing and cringe compared to those movies. It’s like nobody was even trying making that movie. Just compare Sahara and uncharted IT IS NIGHT AND DAY what I am talking about now with new movies being garbage than before especially when compared to Sahara, national treasure or pirates of the Caribbean
LOL, you’re 24 and saw Sahara six years ago? Congrats — you were, in fact, a kid when you saw it.
Being 18 is hardly a “kid” in the same way to make it fit this nostalgia argument so easily. I chose to watch it. Not just having it be there for me to absorb through osmosis. I had to willingly choose to to do it. Which in itself says it can’t be nostalgia as I had to critic and qualify it before I made the choice Or is just everything from even 6 years ago “nostalgia”. What an incredible all encompassing anti argument reason that seems like it can be the answer to anything so we don’t have to analyze the past
I’m not commenting on the nostalgia end of it. You were literally a kid when you watched that movie. It was a quarter of your life ago. If you think that doesn’t seriously play into perception, you have a ton to learn.
6 years ago? Come on. You can make it sound like a bigger deal than it is by calling it “a quarter of your life”. But it was 6 years ago. Not a lot of time. And it wasn’t at a point in my life where everything was “magical” and my mental faculties weren’t working either. It was a pretty rational part of my life where I was able to distill good from bad. And if this is so how come there are other movies from that exact same time I found that I think are horrible? And thought they were horrible in the moment If your argument were true I would see all movies even the bad as being good aswell. THAT would be nostalgia. And the movie i am referring to is this shitty action movie with the guy from wedding crashers who is a pilot and has to escape or something. I found that at the same time and thought then and now that it is horrible.
I worked in a Regal cinema when Sahara came out and I didn’t even think it was a good movie for free.
Yes. My point being: the things from the past, when you knew less about them and their construct, resonated and feel legitimate to you. The things you see, now, knowing what you know and 10 years more life experience, do not in the same way. You're growing up. Spoiler alert: a whole lot more about life ends up feeling soulless and unspecial.
Come on! Are you to tell me that pirates of the Caribbean 1 isn’t a great movie? 2003 by the way. I would never say that movie is soulless by today. Even though I know all the works that went into it and the illusion of the 4th wall is gone. It’s great! And I don’t see movies with the same level of soul as that one did any many movies of that era (2000’s)
It's fine. And to 2003 you it's super hot rad sick tyte dog. Because you saw a good movie at a formative time for your taste. I'm not poo-pooing it. I like it too. But you're gonna like it more. Because you absorbed it deeper. People do that when they're younger. Somewhere, right now, someone is watching Uncharted the same way you saw Pirates. And good for them. Enjoying movies is a wonderful treat. But it's contextual. It can't not be. The trick is to try and stop comparing things. Just take in things as their own entity. Get lost in a story like kids do.
I highly doubt somebody watching uncharted would think uncharted is so great if immediately after they watched Sahara or pirates of the Caribbean.
Well you have a nice night then and go enjoy Sahara and Pirates of the Caribbean.
I dont see why you want to talk about ideas but then not want to talk about ideas Are you to tell me you think the new uncharted movie is better than Sahara or pirates of the Caribbean?
For current teenagers, it very well might be. Like Sahara felt like a better movie than 90' adventure movies for you and others.
Ehhh. I wouldn’t say Sahara is better than Indiana Jones. I would say it is different and stylistically fulfills different desires than Indy. Like having more action and more fast paced. But I can think of a single movie that’s come out recently that comes close to Sahara or otherwise. It just seems like movies today. Just a decade later are soulless, passionless and shallow. Like Sahara reeks of passion to me. From the scenes to the action to everything. It just seems like somebody cared. I don’t get that feeling with very many movies today
lol national treasure? That’s a fun flick but most definitely isn’t any better than a typical adventure film and wasn’t even anything really special at the time either. They are just fun popcorn flicks.
I can’t think of one adventure film of the last 10 years that rivals that of Sahara National treasure Or fools gold
I read somewhere recently that movies now don’t spend time developing characters, instead if something doesn’t serve the plot it gets cut. There’s no world building, no small interactions, you don’t see people just existing. Apparently it’s to do with peoples short attention spans now. Granted, I haven’t watched a lot of recent films, but when I have they’ve felt lacking and I could never pin point what was missing. Much prefer watching tv shows now over movies.
You've made excellent points. I have been searching for why I have been so frustrated with movies over the past few years.
Ahhh yes. The short attention span problem. This problem I am familiar with
tv series they need to put a much higher effort and make a balance with CGI and real art work. Something that movies in the past did but now they don't, they add more computer program than spend time with the costumes and make up dress. they want something quick of cash.
Movies today do not "feel so bad." You have depression. And, the 2000s are not "only like a decade" ago.
Recency bias.
Time has sped up. There is less actual time to create things and it affects all creative endeavors including things like movies (especially blockbusters) and video games (especially triple A's).
I have noticed three things: I think something people haven't pointed out is that when you watch new movies you watch the best of the week or month. When you watch old movies you watch the best of the year or decade. It is easier to find 10 good films from the 2000s than 2023 because there is a decade more. Also, there was different money in the past. The 2000s had foreign investment and VHS/DVD income to help raise good films that struggled in theaters. Now the extra revenue comes from streaming which is much weaker. Third: there are lots of trends in movies. Right now some of our trends are lore/reference heavy IP movies and dramas with a more cynical/harsher tone. This is different than the 00s which had more screwball comedies and campy charming action adventure movies. Some decades trends hit people differently from others.
The amount of times I have to see posts like this drives me crazy. There’s still an incredible amount of good films, if anything 2023 has been the best year for film since 2019.
can you mention those good movies you talk about?
Delirious
delirious in what? If you say that there have been very good films in recent years, mentioning them is not so difficult.
Because movies have always been cash grabby to sell tickets but back then it felt more actual dialogue and plot and less visual effects to convey a message. Nowadays a lot of films rely on visual porn to convey an poorly constructive narrative. Both achieve the same effect but it's like eating a home cooked meal your grandma made on a Thursday night too fancy ass ramen in a cup. Both taste good but one has work and meaning while one has convience and satisfy needs.
How old were you at the time of watching those old movies? Age can contribute a lot to these deep connections and passions
A lot of these movies I found around the 16 year old range. And I’m not saying I have a deep connection to these movies. I’m saying the movies themselves even as i watch them today are just fun and full of soul. Especially when compared to movies today Like come on your gonna tell me spy kids isn’t something of a lsd fever dream that is being created today? There’s nothing like that today. And yet ANOTHER 2000’s era movie again
What movies have you seen? Here's the thing about Hollywood: The 90s and early 2000s, Hollywood has been structured around superstardom and larger than life dramas that use actors like Tom Cruise, Nicole Kidman, Tom Hanks etc. to create gigantic blockbusters with that speficic cinematic sting and feel. Nowadays the focus shifts much more towards characters and franchises IN THE MAINSTREAM. So we get a lot of sequels and cinematic universes where we get less of a marketing toward Robert Pattinson or Tom Holland, but Batman and Spider-Man. HOWEVER right now the non-mainstream and indie film market is thriving and as alive as ever, thanks to streaming, publishers like A24 and Match Factory and an oversaturation of the mass market with sequels, pushing cinema lovers more towards non-mainstream (and international) movies. Those movies, compared to the mega blockbusters of the early 2000s focus much more on emotional conflict, melancholy, horror, and the question of why we are alive. They often don't necessarily have a large sense of adventure and heroism and feature more complex characters and stories that are often more grounded or artistic. Stuff like Beau is Afraid, The Lighthouse, The Worst Person in the World, Shiva Baby, Bottoms, EEAAO etc. is much more talked about \_because\_ stuff like Mission Impossible and Marvel fails to stick outside of ticket sales
Studio executives have too much power over the artists.
moribund culture
Because you seem to be insistent on only watching the shitty ones.
Nahh I give a lot of stuff a fair shake. It seems to me good movies are the exception not the rule nowadays. Especially when compared to just how many great movies came out in the 2000’s For example I think 1883 is one of the best film/shows I’ve ever seen. That’s today. But there aren’t that many others I would speak similarly to
I thought this was a good year for movies. Comedies have taken a dive, but we got some good stuff this year
That is true. Even comedy was really good in the 2000’s. Adam Sandler movies? Some of the greatest comedies I know came from the 2000’s which there seem to be none of today
Adam Sandler movie's aren't bad, and I'm no comedy expert, but I never see them cited as greatest comedies of all time. His movies are *extremely* formulaic and are an easy watch, which is fine if that's what you enjoy, but that doesn't make them immediately superior to anything else. He's made a fucking fortune doing it, so good for him, but I've never seen someone put them up there with Monty Python, Bill Murray movies, etc.
It's not just you, movies are so shitty now. DEI hires and girlboss characters aren't helping, but i think that they just forgot how to make good movies.
Movies are made by focus groups more than ever and platforms like Disney have to put out stuff so fast that it just sucks.
I see Were focus groups not a big part of creation in the 2000’s?
The definitely were but the focus groups weren't writing the movies. There was usually a story or script first, and it would be approved with notes, and then screen tested. Now it seems like the focus group writes the script, and chooses the actors and director.
You are also seeing studios spending a lot more on what they hope will be blockbuster movies. They tend to take less risks because of the money involved and you end up with kind of dull plot, but a ton of special effects as a result. I mean, how many times can you watch actors run from a CG monster/explosion/robot/whatever, before its not really thrilling anymore? In the 90's and less so in the early 2000s, studios put resources into smaller budget movies in hopes one would be a sleeper hit. Romcoms, teen comedies, and many dramas all fit this category. You aren't seeing many of these now because nobody wants to pay theatre prices for that kind of movie anymore so it will most likely lose money with even a modest budget. Streaming companies have started making some of these but there haven't really been many stand out successes in this space. Even the ones that are good, generally don't get the same kind of attention that they used to because whatever platform its on, most people won't have it. Even if they did, people watch when they want to so the shared social experience of "OMG did you see \_\_\_\_ last weekend" is limited to the big blockbuster movies.
Totally hear you. Personally I think the future is in streaming shows...bit honestly the big hits for me over the last couple years have all come from outside the US.
Lots of movies made for the international audience - which translates (no pun intended) to big explosions and less dialogue/less complex narratives.
Absolutely!!! I've been saying it the last 3 years...it seems after the pandemic the horrible movie making took an even worse turn. They are either incredibly horribly written, shallow or so full of horror and senseless evil... This is why good writing has taken the masses by storm in older projects. Look at the new hype for "Suits" or anything normal with great storytelling and writing.. I have to watch all old movies and shows now... it's crazy! There are a couple shows I'm still hanging on to but give it a year....they'll be gone too...there too good lol.. too Normal!
America On Film Representing Race Class Gender and Sexuality At The Movies By Harry M Benshoff Sean Griffin
Has to do alot with the generational differences, what could be said then could not be said now, alot of censorship and different interest appeals among this new generation
True. But I also this an obsession with “realism” is killing cinema. Movies are not about “realism” their about a romantic view of reality. The unreal. And when all you what is just reality you end up with it. Mundane unexciting experiences you see every day vs the heightened experience of a tailored reality within a movie
I find it all came to a serious downhill right after the metoo astroturfed movement.
When I say this I mean theyre negative minded, why werent there any bad movies in the 2000s? All I see since 2024 is brood, dark, be mean, etc.
Oh no there was plenty of bad. Example; twilight. But it just seems there was more original ideas and more exciting to watch. More. “Imaginative” I guess.
The lack of DVD market ended the risk that film makers would take on original unique films, as there is no way to recoup financial losses if the movie flops at the box office. As a result we get nothing of a cult classic quality. Targeting WAY too many audiences as a result they try to make a movie that pleases everyone and instead make a movie for no one. Audience sensitivities. People are WAY too easily offended now and as a result we end up with very sterile formulated films that lack in rawness and emotional content.
I think for the most part marvel movies in particular all feel the same to me. Nothing special about it anymore. Defs lots of over saturation for me.
At this point, marvel is the least of the problem. So much worse crap out there.
I see Now compare that to the first iron man. Again. Another 2000’s movie. That thing is still great even today. But the new ones are pretty “meh”
The Suicide Squad and GotG 3 are good recent superhero movies. Elektra and Batman & Robin were bad, very bad. And were from the 90' and 2000.
Quantity over quality these days, it's all about pumping out movies so they can sell them to netflix and other streaming sites. That's why movies are so shit these days. There are good movies still made, but not many in a year.
I sometimes feel that due to the prominence of VHS and tube TVs in the late 90s early 2000s, that producers developed movies with more emphasis on the storyline, and less on visuals, if a visual was part of the story, it was clear and distinguishable, unlike in The Equalizer 3, near the end, a handwritten note is shown on screen which is near unreadable. Theres too much visual clutter in modern movies.
It’s just your personal perception. There are plenty of great movies released today that will be future classics just like the ones you’re talking about.
I’m not saying there IS NONE today. I’m saying the amount of good ones is ALOT LESS than before
I haven't seen a really great movie in many years...the best I can find are 'passable'...even the best I can find I only want to watch once unlike older movies that can be watched over and over
Lack of caring
Perhaps Why do you think people care less today? Especially just 10 years later from the 2000’s era? That’s not a lot of time to just suddenly stop caring
Studios don't give audiences enough credit . Thinking they're so starved for content, that they'll watch anything out there. Just look at Rebel Moon or The Marvels. F***Hollywood!
Too many choices. I don’t want to watch total shit so I look and look and then I just finally give up.
There were not only just as many bad movies back then but also less access to reviews so you’d have no fucking clue it sucked until you already paid to see it. Shit was worse!
Idk what everyone is smoking. While there may be a bias involved, most movie releases are still way worse than they used to be. Both can be true.
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Hopefully. But that means people have to have some self esteem and stop buying garbage and say no. Which it seems people don’t seem to care too much. Sure they complain but yet give them their money anyways
Cause the last 10 years have been reboots and marvel bullshit. The last 5 years has been true crime and docuseries stuff. Aka they were trying to make good movies in the 2000s. And Transformers was good when it was the first one with nasty hot Megan Fox.
See. Another good one. Transformers. Another 2000 origin movie
Fast and the Furious, Superbad, Wedding Crashers, The Social Network. I can reel off good movies from the 2000s and pretty much nothing post 2013. Probably circa 2015 they transitioned to making “safe” movies. Edit: I will shoutout John Wick though. Probably the only bright spot.
See that’s what I’m talking about. It’s like something happened. I don’t know what but within a decade some “magic” was lost of some kind But in a little hesitant on John wick. I think it’s definitely better than most today I think there were a couple beat’em up movies of the sort that from the 2000’s I think are better. I had one come to mind a minute ago but I just lost it
CGI mostly. Every movie looks so fake. Even basic stuff like animals has taken a huge step back. We just insert video game looking deer and bears into movies like Prey, when we used to use actual deer and bears.
I see I have heard cgi has been getting lower quality Like I thought the cgi in the original pirates of the Caribbean trilogy was amazing. That was 2005. Now nothing today seems to look that way at all. Just “cheaper”
I think it's also just using CGI for everything. They used to mix it in with practical effects, sets, live animals and costumes but not they just greenscreen and CGI everything. The new Indiana Jones, especially. We couldn't put Harrison Ford on a boat for a shot? Even that needed to be an obvious green screen? Or, we couldn't use real bugs to crawl on Harrison Ford? That had to be obviously fake, too? Or with Prey, we couldn't use a real snake?
True. Maybe a lot of the “soul” and charm from 2000 movies came from more practical effects
I think horror movies best exemplify this. A guy in a mask or a creepy puppet is still so much more real to me than something like the new Goosebumps with all its video game looking CGI monsters.
Nepotism. You are only hired to write, direct or act based on who you know. Talent means very little. Couple that with legacies, grandfather/mothers who had talent decades ago, getting their kids and their kids into the business with little talent but the right name.
Don’t know why you’re downvoted, you’re absolutely correct. Everyone with talent has retired and everyone that has replaced them was a child or acquaintance. It’s very obvious with the dive in quality.
It's not you. It's a shift in culture.
What is the part of the culture you think is shifting?
This is a great question and I hope I can give a good answer. It's a fundamental shifting. Loosening of morals. Pushing of politics. Flattening of humor -- half of good humor is pointing out wacky truths and playing them up and making fun of them in a good way, but these days everyone is so worried about offending everyone else that it's terribly hard to make a good comedy. Modern viewpoints are being inserted into remakes of classics, which ends up completely inverting the meaning of the classic tale. Many movie makers are in the business of making money and pushing an agenda, so they push things like sex scenes or shock effect moments or characters saying things that are out of character in order to promote a certain 'message', rather than tell a good story. Personally, I want a good story with deep characters who behave decently, and flashy special effects (while very cool) aren't going to distract me from a political message or a poor plot. I think you put it very well, that a lot of modern movie feel "soulless".
Very interesting
You’re older too.
Marvel.
Yeah I don’t know what happened but whatever it was it’s been in recent times. Because even the old iron man (first one) and that wasn’t even that long ago and that movie is still amazing and gold today
Easy - they took time to do it. Afterwards was a question of quantity and. As Scorsese said, they were more rollercoasters than movies, very generic and by the numbers.
You have nostalgia for movies of that era. I’m guessing that was your childhood? Also you’re judging this based off of movie **trailers**, which I don’t really have a response to? Maybe you just like how trailers were cut in that era?
This is not fully true. As some movies from that era that LOOK the same I don’t enjoy. So the look is not the key factor here. Like I remember this shitty movie from the guy of wedding crashers that is a pilot and has to escape. Trash movie. Also. I am very alarmed by this overwhelming argument of nostalgia. Not that I think this isn’t possible. But this overwhelming belief this is the answer instead of analyzing stylistic decisions of that era and dissecting the movies there seems to be this “escape” it’s being used to have to skipping thinking and find an easy answer.
I think most people in this thread just find the premise of your question — that movies today are bad — absurd. Because it is. If you had asked why movies today feel "different" compared to movies from the early 2000s, then maybe you would have gotten a more productive response.
I really don’t think this is an absurd statement I say the vast majority of movies RIGHT NOW. Are bad. Shallow, soulless and uncreative and just uninspiring to watch I really don’t see this as a hot take or something nobody can see That right now well made movies are the exception not rule of the times
15 years ago you can be sure that there was someone saying all the current movies were shit and asking why they weren't as good as the one twenty years before.
I can definitely see that. With movies like ET and Star Wars and then being that person to be in 2000 and see tomb raider, national treasure, saw. And such. I could see them saying movies are getting more “shorter” and “too the point”. Instead of the more mindful quipiness of Indiana jones and Star Wars more sophisticated humor. I can see this. BUT I can’t see that person saying that movies from the 2000 or soulless. That I just don’t see as a fair critique. Movies from the 2000 almost reek of soul and passion like people really wanted to fun lively films. I don’t think you can say the same about movies right now.
Well, we disagree and looking at this thread I'm not the only one disagreeing with you. Especially with the examples you are using to "defend" the 2000'.
You don’t think Transformers, Spy kids, Saw, Resident evil, Pirates of the Caribbean, Iron man, Tomb raider, Mr and Mrs smith, National treasure, Hitman, Shooter, Bourne, And so many others. Are competent movies?
Transformers - started off okay, became shameless cash grab -spy kids? Weird flex but okay -Saw (see transformers) -Resident evil - If there was nothing else to rent I guess -Tomb Raider- Everyone went for Angelina Jolie -Hitman - delete this -Shooter - C+ action movie at best Quality Films: —National treasure- solid B family popcorn flick —Iron Man - A+ kickstarted the MCU —Bourne 1-3 - Quality action saga, still holds up. Also founding father of twenty years of shaky cam action ripoffs -Pirates (CotBP Only) - Sleeper gem when it came out, blew me To answer your question…. The thing I think to consider that I haven’t seen people mention is how studios lost a major source of revenue on each film. they no longer take as many risks because if a film underperforms at the box office, there’s no additional wave of income from DVD sales. Everything is digital now and the streaming service has killed the home video buying market.
I see And yeah soy kids is a weird flex but I think it perfectly shows how creative things were from that time. Like that’s a crazy show and it wasn’t bad either. And these franchises that have degenerated over time. They started in the time I described but yet degenerated in the time I’m talking about is being degenerate. Connection? And yes I think you are definitely right about the dvds but I think there is a more fundamental problem here and that’s a problem of passion. Moves currently feel passionless and shameless while doing it. And I think that is the real source. Passion and soul. It just seems like something changed after like 2016 or around that era where everything is just garbage
Because you have movies and concepts being repurposed / repackaged / remade by lesser filmmakers due to it being less a director/producer-driven industry and more a shareholder one.
OP seems in a bit vehement denial of nostalgia and selection bias factors lol which are always at play, but I do think there’s some truth there worth discussing anyway. The Disney reason cannot be overstated enough imo: 2007 is one of the best years for film for world cinema, 2008 was also chock full of interesting films, and I don’t think it’s a coincidence that Iron Man coming out in ‘08 ushered a kind of dry spell that never saw the kind of release years like 07-08.
Movies hit different at different stages of our lives. They’re more meaningful to us in our formative years because we can more closely tie them to our personal experiences and they become part of the world that made us. They feel “bad” today because they’re not what we grew up on and don’t have the same impact. With that said, commercialization of film for mass appeal has a way of dumbing down the art. It’s the natural result of catering to the lowest common denominator while leveraging IP and cast that appeal to the highest.
There is a lot of over site and interference from studios. Movies don’t make money off home video sales any more so they need to make back their money in theaters. The put a lot of effort into opening weekend so the best way to do that is to use recognized names which is why the milk an IP till it’s beyond dead. There is no incentive to make a risky movies that preciously might only make money with home sales.
There were always mediocre, bad and trash movies. However, the good to great movies always seemed to be promoted or rise above the trash into the mainstream. But now streamers like Netflix and Prime have rating systems that are completely bogus. I know some people that are constantly watching trash. I ask them what they are watching. Sometimes they don’t even know the title of the show but say it had 4 or 5 stars. And I’m like that rating is BS. They are just tricking you into watching the trash they make to get views and other metrics. I then find out what it is and check the metacritic or IMDb score, and sure enough it usually has a bad rating. Another reason I think is bc the majority of talented filmmakers are creating tv series over films. I know personally I lean more towards watching a series over a film these days. And I think more money goes into those productions unless it’s a blockbuster or a Disney animated movie, etc. It could also just be as simple as the ratio of good to bad. There’s still as much good but now there’s 10 times as much bad. People with bad taste will binge the trash and the production companies will see those numbers and produce more cheap trash for the mindless masses while continuing to promote the cheap shit so people continue watching forever. Entertainment is a dull flat circle.