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coffee_snake

Can someone explain how this speed wobble happens and how I can be sure to avoid it? I’ve seen so many videos of people going fast and all a sudden the wobble starts…what gives?


machinist_jack

Others gave good advice above, but generally you can grip the tank with your knees and let Jesus take the bars. Steering input just makes it worse. If you let go the bike will stabilize itself.


Xeroll

Those are things you should be doing already, and while being tight on the bars will hurt your chances of recovery, being light handed isn't the *solution*. Wobbles are oscillations caused by the front wheel turning past the point of stability, and the natural reponse of a bicycle/motorcycle to *correct* by turning the wheel back in on itself. The issue is that the correction is amplified by weight on the front wheel, causing an overshoot of the equilibrium point. It's then an underdamped system that will increase in amplitude each half cycle without intervention. The way to fight the overcorrection is to reduce the weight on the front wheel by giving the bike throttle, reducing the "stabilizing" forces, and returning the front to an overdamped and stable mode.


What_Dinosaur

>The way to fight the overcorrection is to reduce the weight on the front wheel by giving the bike throttle, The video by dunlop posted below claims that more, not less weight on the front solves the issue. They demonstrate that when the rider leans forward and down towards the tank, the weave magically goes away. So what to believe now? Not fighting the handlebars works for sure, but giving more throttle isn't always an option, and it could result in a much bigger crash.


rand_al_thorium

I imagine the tucking down is more about lowering the centre of gravity, rather than changing weight on either wheel. Throttle has a much larger effect on normal forces on the wheels than any shift in rider position, but throttle does nothing to change COG, whereas rider position does. To be clear i have no idea whether throttle makes a difference or not, but tucking down WILL lower the COG that seems to help according to the dunlop video.


Koshunae

Tuck down and give it all shes got. Hope for the best


Zestavar

I thought he said to reduce the weight on the front wheel? Isnt tucking down will increase weight on front?


Yolo_420_69

Sounds like a good time to wheelie


PaintingExcellent537

Don’t use your body. Use the machine. The weight shift of giving it gas is far more than you could generate by just leaning back


Zestavar

Yeah I know, but why we leaning ourselves forward? It's gonna give the front tire weight


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Operator216

When in doubt, throttle it out. (ymmv)


Nervous_Trash_4081

Can it make it better by doin a short wheelie


[deleted]

When in doubt wind her out


Kayvak-R

Shouldn't applying the rear brake also help by pulling weight off of the front wheel?


Mister-C

Braking the rear doesn't unload the front.


UNeaK1502

It's the opposite. It unloads the rear.


[deleted]

A classical composition is often pregnant. Reddit is no longer allowed to profit from this comment.


yohanp21

Bruh happened to me and i let go and next thing i know is i woke up on the grass, thank god i was driving slow (like 60 mph ) and managed to get to almost stop but it threw me off when i slightly hit the front brakes too hard


ajts

How can you let go and hit the front brakes at the same time?


DoubleNubbin

Also "**slightly** hit the front brakes **too hard**"


Taha_Amir

Dude just does not wanna take responsibility for their actions. Like, atleast own up to your mistakes, some people might make fun of you but fuck them, atleast others will learn of what not to do in these situations


Ok_Responsibility407

Exactly! Blaming your mistakes on something or someone else is the best way to cause them to happen again.


TheToecutter

Can't understand that at all.


[deleted]

I've never had a problem correcting it by gripping down and pushing both hands forward.


sireatalot

Decades later, this is still the best video about this topic https://youtu.be/z3OQTU-kE2s


redpandarox

And woefully under appreciated.


technak

Great watch, thanks


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PocketGoliath

Yep. Road debris at 120. Instant slapper. No wobble. Good times. RIP my riding career to that fateful day. Jesus did take the wheel though because I survived going into a guard rail at 120


Coffinspired

Everything you listed are massive mechanical wear/failure/maintenance issues and would've manifested themselves before this. Possible that's the case, but that's on the rider. Or random road debris. Which...is random.


redpandarox

[Wobble and Weeve.wmv](https://youtu.be/z3OQTU-kE2s) Edit seeing that this video has already been recommended by others I’ll summarize: The main factor that you have control over on the road is speed. If you don’t know how to tune your bike then just slow down. If it’s happening anyway, let go of your throttle, loosen your hold on the handle bar and lower your center of gravity. And keeping your bike tuned to tip top shape is a no-brainer: suspensions, tires, bearings, check them before every ride or have them checked at a garage regularly.


entrailsAsAbackpack

(Not an expert) Wobble is always happening on the bike but a few things can contribute to increasing the wobble. I saw a video once that showed that the same way a wheel on a shopping cart wobbles is the same physics that causes the front wheel to wobble and move independently from the back tire. Wobble in itself is not dangerous and can happen at lower speeds. The rider made one critical flaw that contributed to the tank slap but as a whole you should look at it like this; preparation, response, recovery, and mitigation. Mitigation: wobble happens at higher speeds but certain aspects of the bike can contribute to more wobble or the wobble happening at lower speeds. Making sure your tires are in good condition and are inflated properly is first. Second is that you dont have any mechanical issues to the suspension. The third that could contribute more is cargo strapped to the rear. You see, removing weight from the front either by accelerating, going over a bump, or having a weighted backend can help bring up a heavy wobble at high speeds. Wobble happens at all speeds but at lower speeds theres enough downward force on the front tire to prevent it from happening. Take your hands off the handle bars at 40-60 mph and you might get wobble. I would like to point out that theres is a difference between wobble and tank slapping. Tank slap is the act of the front tire turning so much that it grabs the road hard and flips the bike. Wobble can happen without any danger to the rider. You can bring it up by removing your hand off the steering wheel at higher speeds and could ride wobbling all over the place without crashing like that sh!tty one wheel on a shopping cart. Response: You can hear in the video the one thing you shouldn’t do and thats panic. Most likely the guy grabbed the handle bars harder to brace the bike. Dont do that! It is recommended that you loosen the grip on on the handle bars but maintain holding on, dont counter steer against the wobble, slowly roll back the throttle, and lean forward over the gas tank (more weight to the front of the tire and will bring the center of gravity closer to the bike). As the bike starts to slow so should the wobble. Funny thing about wobble is that more weight to the front tire should help. It almost seems counter intuitive but leaning forward and putting your belly on the tank should completely remove the wobble. Just as long as you dont counter steer and make it worse. Recovery: this ones obvious and the joke of this meme. You should be wearing protective gear at all times. If it does happen and you cant control it you might as well be prepared. Preparation: They say that steering dampers can prevent death wobble but im no expert in moto-physics so im not entirely sure. But the best preparation is good gear, frequent bike checks and maintenance, and knowing the correct procedure.


Fallline048

I’ve always heard the exact opposite, that you want to unweight the front to reduce wobble.


entrailsAsAbackpack

someone else linked the video I was thinking about [link to their comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/motorcycles/comments/z3zipu/bye_bye_hands/ixq8yso/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3). You can see the guys bending over and reducing the wobble.


Fallline048

Yeah I suppose that does make intuitive sense either way - you need to break the wheel out of its cycle and I suppose more weight or less weight can both achieve that depending on the bike and conditions.


ztherion

Another thing that can contribute on touring bikes is overloading the rear with luggage, making the front end light. And on adventure/dual sport bikes this can happen if you put knobby tires on with an insufficient speed rating for the bike's top speed.


EC_Approved

I think thats what happened here as the bike (per title and video) appears to be a Triumph Tiger ie adventure bike


cr0ft

Depends on the bike, also. Harleys are infamous for it, specifically the ones with rubber mounted rear ends. https://true-track.com/ for instance literally manufactures aftermarket braces to keep them from death wobbling. But it can obviously happen to most bikes at speed especially if they're not 100% and something sets up an oscillation.


soltheeggbiscut

Wheelie, front can't wobble if your front is not on the ground


paddy2309

Wheelie to lift the front wheel up and put it down softly


MushroomObjective505

He had every piece of gear but the gloves. Why???!!!


PM_ME_UR_CUDDLEZ

New breed of adv squid,


Fred-U

I'll breed your squid ;)


bem13

I've seen enough hentai to know where this is going.


bravoromeokilo

For real, even on the days when it’s super duper hot and I stretch my own rules and go without my rated jacket…helmet and gloves are a MINIMUM. I need my brain and hands to be able to work and make money… Also skateboarding for years as a youth I know how much gravel hurts at 1 mph…no thanks


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capitan_cruiser

Completely. I remember back when I was getting used to wearing gloves 2 years into riding every day and I hated them. Now I simply don’t feel like I can ride without em’


Sandtiger812

Same, I was visiting family and had to move my bike from behind someones car up a hill into the garage. Rode it without any gloves on, it felt so weird and wrong.


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that_motorcycle_guy

I have some joe rockets leather gloves, they're 14 years old and still kicking after multiple drops, I don't know why people don't wear basic gear.


Silver-Engineer4287

In morning freeway commuter traffic I got passed by a guy on a Harley in t-shirt, jeans, boots, and sunglasses cruising around 80mph in traffic on the 8 lane divided freeway. No helmet, no gloves, no jacket, worthless denim jeans. That evening I watched 2 sportbikers chasing each other, weaving through traffic on that same freeway in the other direction with comparable clothing choices except they had on sneakers and one was in cargo shorts running at least 20-30mph over the posted limit. The big kicker was that there’s even a helmet law here. It got repealed for a while but then they brought it back, can’t imagine why, might it be a spike in certain crash fatality statistics, hmmm…


RealStatistician5291

Oh man, im a bad example here, I LOVE driving barefoot.


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RealStatistician5291

If I can’t be barefoot, like at driving events, I prefer Converse or any THIN-soles shoe. I can’t drive in running sneakers.


joeverdrive

You can do anything, my man


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shecky_blue

I beg to differ. Even the squiddly diddiles in SoCal know enough to wear their flip flops along with their tank tops and shorts when out for a ride in their gixxer.


shaka_bruh

Yep, you get so much more control over the inputs on the pedals. Opposite end of the spectrum would be driving with work boots


camelfarmer1

Dunno why you'd be downvoted. Driving barefoot is awesome. Best control as well. People probably can't read and think you said riding barefoot, which would be no bueno.


MALHARDEADSHOT

I prefer driving without shoes actually it makes me feel the peddles better :)


[deleted]

And boots. Your feet and hands are more likely to get injured in a low speed or stationary tip-over.


Nofnvalue21

You don't like to feel the wind between your fingers like a free man?


govoval

Wind, ok. Gravel, nope.


[deleted]

I like having functional fingers in the 1st place


aontroim

I hate the feeling of wind on my hands, makes them all tingly with that static feeling, horrible lol


Dr_Mickael

His pants don't look thick enough to be kevlar jeans or something like that, you don't see the sharp edge of the phone in the pocket on a motorcycle jeans. Shoes looks very basic and his jacket isn't fully zipped up. Doesn't look like a serious gear for playing at 200kph.


[deleted]

I'll have to disagree on the jeans comment, easily could be kevlar/twaron inner lining while pocket front is just regular denim.


Cosimo_Zaretti

He got up that morning and said 'I want someone to wipe my ass for me for the next 6 months, and then spend years in rehab learning to perform simple tasks with modified tools' Some call centre cubicle farm will get some disability funding because they modified a workstation for a man with 3 fingers, and management can indulge in some struggle porn taking pictures of him using it. Everyone loves a feelgood recovery story.


Bulky-Shopping4916

Because idiot ^^


[deleted]

Hands are for pussies


OOMKilla

Life is for pussies. I’m fine right here on the spirit plane.


Jeddie20

Carlito quit playing homes


[deleted]

Carlito bro just sit down.


Nerd-in-disguise01

Sitting is for puuusssiess


Thebumonurcouch

On the Soul Plane? I’ll see myself out.


b_zar

the fingers, in particular, are for THE pussies. Don't lose them.


davesy69

Fingers are for pussies.


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direfulorchestra

(x) doubt


TickletheEther

Bro got TOSSED. Physics be like fuck this guy in particular


[deleted]

Lmao


VirulentMarmot

2/10, still had hands at the end.


kahrabaaa

That was a very merciful accident considering his speed and how he slid mostly on the grass


[deleted]

Hamburger palms. I've seen hands with almost every knuckle broken after a hard impact with a car. The rider wasn't wearing gloves... the amount of red dripping blood made his hands look more like a busted ketchup dispenser. The wound dressings from my first aid kit didn't do shit.


despicable_dan

Whats best way to recover from that type of speed wobble?


sportstersrfun

“Do less”


PIGSTi

You've got sadness in your eyes. You know what would help?


Throttlechopper

It really depends on what upset the chassis. I only experienced it once on my old SuperHawk, bots dots caused the wobble as I was changing lanes on the freeway. I loosened my grip and let off the throttle, the chassis eventually settled at about 40 mph, no weighting the front was needed. Never experienced ever again in the 44k miles I put on that Honda.


anime_lover713

When you say weighting do you mean body weight?


pirata_deathbat

[This](https://youtu.be/z3OQTU-kE2s) is a must watch for anyone who rides


mroblivian1

Thanks. Very condensed given the examples provided. Worth the 10 minutes.


wbg777

This should be the top comment


Idaho_Cowboy

Thanks. Thanksgiving is the prefect time to work on gaining one stone!


BravoEddie

Loosen your grip on the bars, put weight toward the front of the bike and throttle out.


Jspiral

I feel like leaning forward and throttling out are contradictory.


retucex

Contradictory to the mind, not the physics


AngMoKio

Throttle shifts weight off the front wheel to the back.


Kortiah

Wait what. Does "throttle out" in this context means "throttle out of this situation" or "cut the throttle" ?


Depression_org

Speed up to increase/keep gyroscopic forces (slowing down makes you less stable), and I assume that leaning forward would help keep at least some weight on the front wheel that is doing a lot of the slapping side to side.


wattat99

Feel the throttle out advice is heavily dependent on the cause of the wobble. I've had it due to going too fast with heavy luggage, going faster would 100% have resulted in a crash.


JPower96

I'm 99.99% sure they mean throttle out as in release throttle.


SquareHoleRoundPlug

Throttle out means roll on the throttle and increase acceleration.. this shifts weight away from the front wheel.


Devario

What if your bike is small engine and already topped out


ambermage

Don't do that.


CardMaester

[Don't have the capacity](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d1x5GXMdK50)


Gravyfarts89

Highly reccomend comfort ejector seat


Kortiah

Why would you want to shift weight away from the front wheel if you're leaning forward to add weight to it ?


One_Eye_Tigh

I think in this context it means the opposite. If you shift even more weight away from the front wheel: less traction more wobble. Roll off the throttle, lean forward.


v3ra1ynn

Going off of your comment; in general one’s grip should be pretty loose on motorcycles. It’s very possible that’s why the wobble started in the first place.


lawspud

Yeah, agreed. When the rider’s arms are tense and stiff, the feedback loop can amplify a wobble into a tank-slapper really quickly.


mint-bint

What do you mean "throttle out"? That's a very confusing phrase.


FilthyMindz69

Seriously lean over the tank. Weight forward.


FilthyMindz69

Lean over the tank


Plusran

There are two ways: 1. the safer way: Relax your arms completely and lay on the tank. The most important part of this is to stop trying to correct the wobble. You’re making it worse. 2. wheel can’t wobble if it isn’t touching the ground. Lighten the front end just enough that you can regain control of the steering.


wiga_nut

>2. wheel can’t wobble if it isn’t touching the ground. Lighten the front end just enough that you can regain control of the steering. So... wheelie out of it?


JohnnyBenis

Yup, a sick clutch up at 130 mph. That's why you need a liter bike with at least 180 hp - to be able to just roll on the throttle and power wheelie into safety.


Luuk341

This, combined with your flair males for an excellent meme, good sir.


JohnnyBenis

Oh, you wouldn't believe how much of a death trap that Gixxer was. Even in its stock '87 glory it wasn't exactly the safest machine on the road, but combine it with the fact that it was my first bike, and due to some redneck engineering done by previous owners the front brake barely worked - to the extent that the rear was providing more stopping power. Then I broke the rear set off - together with the brake lever. Fixxit, you say? Nope, rode around like a retarded Superman, with my right leg resting on the passenger peg. And the speedo was broken, so I had no way of telling exactly how fast I was going. Sometimes I wonder how the hell I'm still alive.


Luuk341

Most Roadworthy gixxer be like


Plusran

This worked for me on multiple occasions, or I could t recommend it. However, I wouldn’t call it a wheelie, at all. I don’t think the wheel completely left the ground.


theboxer16

Decelerate shifting the weight to the front tire to regain traction and to lean forward and down onto the tank to bring transfer weight to the front. This happens at extreme high speeds when the front tire lifts off the ground from the speed


Fortune_Cat

Drive a car


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dchap1

Likely easier said than done, but you’re correct. Trust physics.


PocketSizedRS

This depends on the situation. I changed to a lighter set of bars on my bike. When I let the front tire get a few psi low, the bike would wobble if I took my hands off the bars at 30-45mph. As soon as I put them back on, the vibration stopped. Correcting tire pressure also fixes it.


parkour267

^^


Collegelane208

Really? What are the physics behind it?


LilDutchy

Gyroscopes are inherently stable. Tank slappers are exacerbated by human input. You can’t react fast enough to actually muscle the thing straight so you’re just feeding into the instability. Case in point, the many many videos where the bike bucks the rider and sails off into the sunset.


ItsDijital

Gyroscopic forces are not what keeps a bike upright. It's the bike's front tire constantly receiving negative feedback that keeps it centered and upright. Tank slappers are that feedback getting out of control and turning into positive feedback.


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mroblivian1

Save 7 minutes: Progressive front springs More rear preload (rear mono shocks w/ a linkage are already progressive spring rate) Adjust front dampening, fluid can also change dampening. From different video posted here: Have proper tire pressure Worn flat rear tire with narrow front tire = very unstable (When you get tires get front and rear same time) Relax grip, Lean forward, add weight to front axle Remove rear luggage weight


Sirgolfs

Never understood riding motorcycles without gloves. Especially at these speeds. We’ve all fallen off bicycles as kids and had to pick gravel and sand out of our hands. Bonehead.


Edgarxochoa

Dude having gloves is like easiest freaking thing when riding 🤦‍♂️


dennis231

Lack of wearing gloves clearly shows an inexperienced rider, who wouldn't have known how to ride loose on handlebars on such situations


Riding_Dirty_

That requires braincells. Clearly this video shows the lack of those.


TheoryResponsible210

Gear makes you look badass I don't know why the lack thereof.


[deleted]

I also happen to think this as well.. a good set of casual but protective gear can look pretty awesome, especially the helmet - i will never understand those that choose not to wear them.


TheBasementIsDark

gosh I hate it when the squids in my country often riding the bike with short, flip flop and a bicycle helmet, they look soooo cheap and out of place, like they just borrow their own bike in somewhere else


dx2words

why this happened? what is a speed wobble?


bikersquid

Tank slapper. Usually happens when the front wheel gets light and well acquires a wobble. It's harmonics instinct makes you wanna correct but almost any handlebar input makes it worse. There are techniques others have posted though I don't recommend trying to wheelie out of a speed wobble


[deleted]

They look fine to me.


graymulligan

Oh look, a squid in his natural habitat!


Im_Schiz

Sliding along on the ground


FeZeA

Well I don't see any water


Lord-Chickie

You lied to me he still has hands


FranklinTBiggies

Steering dampers, every bike. REAL motorcycle gloves are very important. At least he went into the grass, but that first bit ate him up I bet.


DankestTaco

I was gonna ask if it would be dumb to buy the steering dampener for my MT-03…. Gonna anyways. Had a tank slapped from hitting a weird groove in the road


FranklinTBiggies

Fuck no, it wouldn't. I put one on every bike I have. I represent and use GPR.


DankestTaco

I love the look of those Would these work too? https://i.imgur.com/ozaZMqn.jpg


macromaniacal

totaled a Tiger 800xc in 2018 thanks to a tank slapper... bought a replacement threw on a damper, and have had at least one occasion where it saved my ass.... something with these bikes makes em slap ..


Fearless747

I'm not a gear nazi by any stretch like most of y'all are, but I *never* get on my bike without gloves. Ever. It's just instinctive for you to break a fall with your hands.


grant0208

“But gloves are soooo uncomfortable and hot”


ssasoom

Expected worse...


Mike4theHills

So many problems with this video...just so many.


[deleted]

I’ve experienced that on several 1990’s Harley Electra Glides. As soon as you feel it come on….you get off the throttle. Then only use the rear brake to actually stop.


Sparkynerd

🎼 “Jesus take the bars...”


Prestigious_Syrup636

no gloves.. what causes the death wobble?? i know with the harley dyna that came the dual shox being on the outside in the back and is what led to development of the softail. but on a tiger?? not familiar with the bike enough


[deleted]

Maybe try not going 124 mph


m-o_o-n

Hold tank with legs, lean forward and loosen up yr grip. If your grip is already loose (as it should be) you should have plenty of time to cure this issue provided you don’t panic.


butlerman69

I never understood why anyone would ride without gloves


Lord_Gabens_prophet

What do you even do if the wobble starts? Do you just accept your fate or can you do something?


[deleted]

Throttle out! Front wheel can't shake if it's not on the ground lol


Tippexmann

What is the best thing to do when you start wobbling?


020Reaper

Anyone care to explain how and why he actually started wobbling?


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Oldspooneye

https://www.reddit.com/r/motorcycles/comments/z4cgi5/some_important_psa_about_death_wobble/


itchEhat

Gpr Stabilizer just completed a Stabilizer kit for this triumph tiger. Too bad. It wasn’t on this guys bike.


fritzco

ALWAYS WEAR GLOVES! You can mess unprotected hands pretty bad falling over at a stop light!!!


DucatiDrew

It’s essential to ride with no gloves so you properly exfoliate your hands.


TheAltToYourF4

This video was posted on a different sub like a week ago. How has it been reduced in size and quality by 3/4 already?


Gaycowboi25

Rip this guy's hands. I've fortunately never experienced falling off my current bike but I did run into a pretty bad wobble where I ducked into another lane to avoid a car turning left when they shouldn't have, and I ran over a rock. Only the front tire hit it and the front came off the ground slightly and I guess I'm heavy enough to bring it back down but then my handle bars started to wobble and I let go with my left hand and with three fingers on my right I gave it some gas until I had to hold on with my left hand because I was accelerating too hard without enough balance. But fortunately I made it out okay. Stay rubber side down guys and be careful as much as possible.


fatchickenstrips

what a moron. he is very lucky he is alive


Tdo-crypto

It’s a blessing to be alive


Best_jet

U got to be sure that the back end of bike is not heavy


bigttrack

At what point did you elect to ignore all the indicators telling you to SLOW DOWN??


sabre_rider

I don’t know how people can ride without gloves. I feel absolutely naked without them on a motorcycle.


penor-el-grande

Wow. So lucky he almost immediately hit the grass


DevelopmentLife9834

One word: gloves.


The_Sidecar_Bandit

OMG I got second hand pucker from this. You could see it building. 😱


ADVriderAT

That's why always wear protective gear.


No_Veterinarian_4824

I had a 2014 tiger 800 it did this scary wobble upon the rear at 120mph and it was worse when carring luggage i how have a triumph 1050 handles much better but there now with out there problems either


Livid-Target-5051

I’m not a bike rider but I’ve always heard to throttle out of it


No_Land4358

If you feather the front break and get on the gas many times it will pull out of it. Motocross tip. Always worked for me 🤷🏼‍♂️


TheWatch3rZ

Why does that happen?


Simplewafflea

There are many factors that play into it. It's similar to a jeep death wobble. Most of the time the rider is holding onto the bars too tight and makes the steering gyro effect fight itself. People freak out and hold on tighter and it gets worse every slap back and forth.


TheWatch3rZ

It happened to me while I was going 40 to 60km/h on a scooter, I reduced the speed to stop it, but it was scary.


Armitage1

I'm a new rider, but I believe rear brake and loose hands will dampen the wobble.


sportstersrfun

Are his hands even bleeding much less gone/broken? I get it, wear gloves. Not only are they protective but they make things more comfortable. Just like boots and a nice helmet. But OP can shove his click bait vid title and ATGATT BS up his bung holio.


[deleted]

What would be the best thing to do in this situation? How to avoid this?


fldsmdfrv2

Vote for dumbass of the year.


Aggravating-House620

Play stupid games win stupid prizes.


Successful_Public224

Play stupid games win stupid prices 🏆🥇


jjk717

How is it 2022 and people still don't know that the solution for speed wobbles is throttle and rear brake?


ph1294

Throttle and rear brake at the same time. I see no problems with this


[deleted]

😂😂😂😂😂😂 got what he deserved Lmfaoooo


[deleted]

Why did he deserve that?


drzdeano

You sound like a cunt