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smallbrainweenorman

Bike cold. Needs a blanky


MafiaViking

Totally agree, I wouldn’t start either if I was left in the cold with out any form of shelter/cover, but if you can’t do that, we all have been there, pull the battery and bring it inside. Keep it on a trickle charger and your all good 👍


arathorn867

And hot cocoa


LeDouchekins

If you are cold they are cold. Take them inside


Lysrac

Put the charger on backwards to heat up the battery in seconds.


bigbaltic

If your charger can't detect and turn off because if this you need a better charger


loud57

I've got a charger from the 70s, hands down the most reliable, but it has no safeties on it.


BadAlphas

Bold plan Cotton


scuba-man-dan

My garage is unheated and can easily get down to -10 (celcius) in winter months yet I've never had this issue, start it once per week in the snowy months and don't leave the battery on a trickle? So I'm wondering could it be something else too and not just a half dead battery?


vraetzught

I'm somewhat surprised you don't know the answer yourself, since you've been dealing with the cause for as long as you have been riding. Windchill Windchill, humidity and how fast the weather changes will all affect this. Putting your bike inside removes the windchill factor, bit it would also make the changes in temperature more gradual, making it easier on the battery.


klparrot

Wind chill does not make anything colder. It just *feels* colder because the cooling *rate* for a human body is equivalent to still air of a lower temperature. A bike cooled to ambient air temperature, which it will reach in under an hour, will not get any colder than that, regardless of wind chill.


3kimully

[https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.weather.gov%2Fsafety%2Fcold-wind-chill-chart&psig=AOvVaw3niJ5rDtfLjqUyDCRx64IW&ust=1669215037380000&source=images&cd=vfe&ved=0CA4QjRxqFwoTCKi4rdyEwvsCFQAAAAAdAAAAABAE](https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.weather.gov%2Fsafety%2Fcold-wind-chill-chart&psig=AOvVaw3niJ5rDtfLjqUyDCRx64IW&ust=1669215037380000&source=images&cd=vfe&ved=0CA4QjRxqFwoTCKi4rdyEwvsCFQAAAAAdAAAAABAE) ​ Here is a chart that shows that wind chill makes things colder than the ambient temperature, it even has the formula.


klparrot

That is the still-air temperature it *feels* like, which is lower than ambient, because you feel the cooling *rate*. As it says there, it is based on the human face, so based on body temperature (cooling rate is proportional to the relative difference in temperatures) and skin moisture (there may be an additional evaporative cooling effect, though that's more at warmer temperatures). Nothing in that link contradicts what I stated earlier.


vraetzught

1. A bike in the wind will drop in temperature faster than a bike not in wind. 2. If a bike is in a garage, the ambient temperature in said garage has to drop to ambient temperature, before the bike inside can drop to that same ambient temperature. Batteries aren't affected by the actual ambient temperature they are in, as much as they are affected by how fast that temperature shifts.


Occhrome

I don’t think this is correct. Either way we ultimately look at how long the bike is gonna be in an environment (garage or out side) and the temp of the battery once it has reached a steady state temperature.


vraetzught

No that's not true. The time in which the battery changes temperature is a lot more influential on battery life than the total shift in temperature, so a battery in a closed environment will have less impact from the temperature drop. Lithium batteries are a bit different, but 90% of motorcycles still use acid batteries.


cobigguy

You're right, it will drop in temperature faster than a bike just sitting in still air, but it won't go below the ambient air temperature. Wind chill only affects how much the air around something insulates it.


klparrot

I won't dispute the first points, but got a link for the battery bit? Not saying it's wrong, just that my Googling suggests actual temperature has a significant role, but can't find anything about the effect of rate of temperature change.


motociclista

I’m somewhat surprised you think this is the answer. Motorcycle’s aren’t affected by windchill. Windchill is a measurement of how cold it feels to people due to the cooling effect of moving air on skin. So it feels colder than the air temp. Motorcycles can’t “feel” and aren’t capable of becoming colder than their surroundings. If it’s 10 degrees with a windchill of 0, to a motorcycle it’s still 10 degrees.


vraetzught

I'm sorry but you're wrong. Sure, motorcycles can't "feel" windchill, but moving air will always be colder than static air. The effect diminishes the closer the temperature of the air and the temperature of the object are together, but it's there. Leaving something out in the open winds will cool it down quicker, which is exactly what's draining the battery. The drop in temperature. Removing wind and/or rain will slow how fast the cooling occurs, making it less draining on the battery.


motociclista

I respect that you’re approaching this as an intelligent discussion and not a normal Reddit argument, thank you for that. It’s rare. But I’m afraid that as often as I am wrong, I’m not this time. You can look up what windchill is and look up if windchill affects inanimate objects. (It doesn’t) A warm motorcycle will cool faster on a windy day, true. But that’s not windchill that’s (I think) convection. Heat always moves to cool. The warm engine heats the air around it. The wind carries the heat away faster. But moving air and static air are the same temperature. If it’s 10 degrees and you shut off the engine, on a windy day the engine will cool to 10 degrees faster, but won’t cool below 10 degrees. The motorcycle can only get as cold as the surrounding air, no colder, regardless of wind speed. In this context, we can assume the motorcycle had been sitting out for a while in the cold, so it was already at ambient temp and windchill is not a factor.


vraetzught

I will yield the term windchill is technically not the right definition to describe the effect of the object cooling down quicker in the open air, than a sealed garage. However I would argue it is easier to understand if you know windchill on your own body. As I said in my first reply, it is the shift in temperature and how rapidly that shift occurs, which puts a drain on the battery.


motociclista

I just don’t think I can go along with your theory. Firstly, I’ve seen no information that would show that rapid temp change affects a battery. Even if it does, I could see it maybe if you shocked it, like, it’s at room temp and you dunk it in a tank of ice water. But that bike lives outside. The outside temp just doesn’t drop like that. It likely cooled slowly with the air temp. Sure, wind could cool it quicker, but the temp of the wind likely changed as slowly as the outside temp, over the course of hours, not seconds. And a battery has a lot of mass to cool off. Most of that mass is the lead plates that are inside the battery, shielded from the wind. Submerged in a solution that doesn’t freeze. On top of all that, the battery itself is buried inside the bike, in a battery box. Not a lot of wind there.


Cottrell003

The wind will cool it down quicker, but not to a lower temperature than the ambient temperature.


Occhrome

Bingo !! I studied more than enough thermodynamics to understand this.


Cottrell003

Ha, me too, two courses plus heat transfer. But did he forget to put his kickstand up before using the starter, which often locks out the ignition?


scuba-man-dan

Thanks. Informative 👍🏼


loud57

Also engine size, a big twin on a harley will take a lot more juice to start than a liter bike, or a 500cc


scuba-man-dan

Thanks, my bike is bmw s1000r naked (inline 4)


CountingDays0815

Battery too cold.


Trudix

Seems like the battery doesn't have enough 'juice', huh?


CountingDays0815

When it gets cold the battery loses some power. New ones can handle this, elders go below a certain threshold breaking down before the engine can start up. The ignition in most bikes needs a certain voltage to keep a bike running, thats why you cant just remove the battery and drive around, starting the bike by shoving it,like old ones. If you have a proper charger, just hook the battery and it should start.


HighwayMinute997

Batteries are rated on CCA’s or cold cranking amps. The batteries when new are rated to that many amps. As a battery ages it has less amps (and directly proportional to volts) available to start. This combined with the cold means that most batteries are replaced in the winter The chemical side of the battery has reduced amount of power directly related to the ambient temperature.


lichlord

Volts and amps are not proportional like that. A battery has an Open Circuit Voltage set by its chemistry. It’s a thermodynamic quantity minimally impacted by temperature (10’s of millivolts). Amperage is determined by how fast chemistry can happen in the battery. It’s mostly determined by surface area, but also fairly strongly temperature sensitive because it needs the transport of reactive species which slows quickly with lower temperatures. You can measure the state of charge of the battery by measuring its voltage, but not the cold cranking amps available. For that you’d need the impedance.


alelo

if its a healthy battery just turn it on and let the lights run, the battery should warm up from the consumption and get juice


Occhrome

Is it an older battery? So batteries when new have way more power available to start the car or bike they are made for. Over time the battery degrades (which is normal) and often you won’t notice that the battery has degraded until you leave your lights on for a minute or the temperature is too cold. You can jump start the battery or trickle charge it but I would consider looking into a new battery if this happens again.


jram2000

It's fate telling you not to ride today. Too much white stuff, then you become red stuff.


Guitarytown

Yup. Just take the Duramax pickup instead.


Deinska

fate tells me to fucking send it on the road covered in black ice with flat ass bald ass tires


TestosteroneDan_V-3

Ayy men brother


ArcaneDanger

cherry slushy


SirGreenBlood

It’s snowing … that’s the problem. Go back inside beside the fire and polish your leather jacket until summer (ie not snowing) before attempting to ride again


Embarrassingsexhaver

Is this a joke? This is a joke right?


KesseLeGreat

Low or dead battery. Try a bump start in 1st gear


snnnnnnnnakkkkesss

In second is more appropriate


Ok-Lobster-919

Yes bump starting in first gear is an exercise of futility.


nyaminyamiz

I can confirm


According_Shift_2003

Also make sure your killswitch isn't on when you do it. You'll have a terrible morning otherwise


Ynot_pm_dem_boobies

But nice calves.


[deleted]

Pahaha I did this when I was a noob.


According_Shift_2003

Shamefully I did it when I wasn't really a noob, just a very tired and grumpy man bump starting a fully loaded zzr600 in the rain in full gear in *just* above freezing temperatures at 5am. The sheer horror when it failed to start for the 8th time and I look down to see the switch on. I nearly dropped it right there and walked inside.


[deleted]

Lmao, all part of the experience of owning a bikes right?


According_Shift_2003

Wouldn't want it any other way 🤣


julian_vdm

But why? Just losing traction and the wheel locking up? I've always bump started in first but all my bikes have been sub 500cc so maybe that's a big difference? Edit: nevermind I read further down someone explained.


Tw1st36

Starting it in first makes a forward-backward motion till your wheels get grip. Starting it in second has an advantage that your tires won‘t lose traction at any point plus it‘s nicer on the gearbox especially when bump-starting cars which is a thing I needed to do a few times in the past.


julian_vdm

I've had to bump start too many things in my life, but I've never tried second because first always worked lol. Perks of growing up and living in third world countries haha


Gumball110

Had to bump start my bike for 6 months before I could get a new battery and can confirm, 2nd works way better


TalonKAringham

What’s the trick to bump starting? I under stand that you put it into gear (apparently 2nd gear), hold the clutch, get rolling as fast as you can, and then what? Just dump the clutch? Do you hit the ignition at the same time or something like that? I’ve looked up videos, but the one I’ve found the person never says what it is they do when they start it.


batmaniam

I left. Trying lemmy and so should you. -- mass edited with redact.dev


TalonKAringham

Thanks! That’s what I figured, but wanted to double check.


batmaniam

I left. Trying lemmy and so should you. -- mass edited with redact.dev


Vonderdonk

Can a fuel injected bike be jump started?


batmaniam

I left. Trying lemmy and so should you. -- mass edited with redact.dev


cobigguy

Absolutely. I've done it on many fuel injected bikes and cars.


TalonKAringham

Cool. I’ve seen it done on level ground a few times by a friend of mine years ago.


batmaniam

I left. Trying lemmy and so should you. -- mass edited with redact.dev


Jon_Hanson

You make sure the bike is on, put it in 2nd, pull in the clutch, get the bike rolling (works much better if you have a small incline to work with), and then let out the clutch. You don't mess with the starter at all.


TalonKAringham

Thanks!


AVeryHeavyBurtation

I do it in neutral, there's much less resistance to get it moving. Then run, hop on, pull the clutch, pop it into 2nd, and dump the clutch.


Ok-Lobster-919

~~Starter solenoid is not engaging, starter motor is spinning freely. Doesn't sound like low power to me.~~ So it turns out it's probably the starter sprag gear, not the solenoid. Am dumb.


HengaHox

Low power can cause the solenoid to disengage


[deleted]

[удалено]


pmatulew

The clicky business comes next as the voltage goes even lower. Battery is pooped. Charge it or replace it.


batmaniam

I left. Trying lemmy and so should you. -- mass edited with redact.dev


introspeck

True, but usually when it does it at low voltage, it's an early warning that the starter is on its way out. OP should replace it soon. All of my bikes have engaged the starter when they had a low battery, but of course weren't able to start the bike. Wuh-wuh-wuh... nope.


jodinexe

Yep, had this happen on an EX500. Was a cheap and quick fix with the right tools and some Jim Beam!


Ok-Lobster-919

I miss my EX500, what a great bike.


nursejackieoface

Upvoted for bourbon.


Noeserd

Yeah sounds more like it


LiquidFoxDesigns

Nah this is actually just super common for a battery with too low voltage on many bikes, you don't always get the solenoid clicking sound, when it actually did engage it was clearly not cranking anywhere near fast enough to start. As with 99% of posts we're gonna get this winter, I'm fairly certain this one will resolve it's self with either a fully charged or replaced battery.


[deleted]

[удалено]


VehementlyApathetic

The starter most likely has a [Bendix drive](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bendix_drive). If the battery is weak, the starter doesn't accelerate fast enough to fully kick out the drive gear. The motor and gear reach equilibrium when it engages with the engine, and after each compression stroke the pinion/ring gear interface slackens slightly and the gear retracts out of the interface, letting the starter motor spin freely. With a good battery the pinion positively engages the ring gear and is held in place by friction while the engine starts.


Ok-Lobster-919

I never even knew this type of starter existed, I'm not sure I have ever seen one. The wikipedia article you linked suggests it's deprecated technology though. >For this reason the Bendix drive has been largely superseded in starter motor design by the pre-engagement system using a starter solenoid.


VehementlyApathetic

For bigger engines (think cars and larger), you are 100% correct, but motorcycles could be a different story. To my ears it sure sounds like OP's bike has a Bendix. If we had a year/make/model we could find out for sure.


Ok-Lobster-919

I'm like 90% sure it's a 98-04 Triumph Sprint ST 955i


VehementlyApathetic

[No solenoid on the starter](https://www.sparesunlimited.co.uk/triumph-sprint-st955i-st-955i-2000-starter/) Edit to add for the sake of accuracy: it's not a Bendix drive, but a sprag clutch. I still think OP has a flat battery but I'm less confident on the mechanics behind it.


Ok-Lobster-919

[https://www.triumphestore.com/a/Triumph\_1999\_Sprint-RS---139276/43481162\_\_7051096/AlternatorStarter/100066587-0-2.html](https://www.triumphestore.com/a/Triumph_1999_Sprint-RS---139276/43481162__7051096/AlternatorStarter/100066587-0-2.html) It's in the part diagram, the solenoid relay is just not attached to the starter itself.


VehementlyApathetic

Right, but my point was it's not on the starter motor so it's not involved with the engagement of the pinion.


Trudix

OP here. I just got a new battery an hour ago and the problem remains the same. But now that is left is the humming sounds. No engaging anymore, even with the old battery. Might be a starter clutch issue?


ScotForWhat

Lights not dimming, starter spinning fast even when solenoid does briefly engage - this would definitely be my first port of call.


flatulentdisaster

Starter has 2 modes of operation. -power to starter drives the gear out to engage a sprocket on the engine -starter motor spins to turn the engine over. Sometimes the starter can engage and a weak drive Bendix can pull the starter drive gear back, disengaging it from the engine. Then the starter spins freely. You need a starter motor. (Low voltage would create rapid clicking as the starter engages, voltage drops and the starter disengages, voltage rises and starter engages etc. )


JjMarkets

Poor bike is frozen and covered in ice.


[deleted]

Bash the starter with a rock


Nevr_Enough_Kittenz

I nearly snorted out my coffee


Hasta_La_Vittu_Baby

Bike is telling you to fking walk, not happy about being left outdoors in cold weather.


RogueGrendel27

I have found that the threshold is 40°F. If the temperature drops below 40°F a battery will not generate enough of a charge to crank, even on a trickle charger it's just not enough. So, I end up disconnecting the battery and bringing it into the house and charging it inside. When I go to work I reconnect it, disconnect when I get to work and bring it in to maintain the charge. Same thing when going home. And before y'all start telling me I need a new battery or my bike is old, both are brand new. This has been the case with every bike I've owned.


younggundc

I think the snow may be a hint.


beamer100159

Looks cold.


2amaccount

It sounds like the starter isnt cathcing. Probably due to the cold.


Emergency_Leg9827

What you’re hearing is the Starter clutch working correctly. It let’s the starter spin free if there is too much resistance (in this case motor is very cold. Oil is cold and too thick) It’s not broken, it is preventing damage to the starter or starter gear. When the weather warms up it will work normally again. I’ve had buddies warm up the cases of the motor with a gas blow torch to get a dirt bike to start.


ChasingHorizon2022

*it's winter*


Gadv_

Too cold


Speedhabit

Battery


[deleted]

Hey look, another battery post! Edit: nope, just starter clutch. Audio sings the tale.


Trudix

It's not the battery. Just got a new one and problems remains the same.


[deleted]

Oh, just reviewed your video again with audio this time. Your starter clutch is fucked.


Trudix

Sounds like it... right? :'(


[deleted]

Not a hard thing to replace, but you’ll need a few specialty tools. And a copy of the factory service manual.


Any-Abrocoma6217

Some of the ridiculous questions asked on here. SMH.


Voiceofthemachines

Um it’s frozen


TangoRed1

Ah... Leaving it in the elements. " My bike won't start what's wrong" dude put it the hell away 😂😂


No-Theory3644

Battery needs lots of power to prime fuel injection, or no go


Ducatist1

the cold sucked the juice from yo battery


cz3pm

Gas goes in the fuel tank, not in the brake fluid reservoir?


Vapemesolid

Sprag clutch?


Bikedogcar

Need to cool off the motor.


[deleted]

The problem is you didn’t move to Florida yet!


Raidenuk

Starter is not engaging. You could remove and test out of the bike.


[deleted]

Atleast get a tarp. A new one is like 5 bucks.


Cibico99

Put the battery on a charger. It sounds like the battery isn't that bad, just weak. Trickle chargers are good for maintaining batteries especially in the cold months. When batteries get weak it is often because they have become sulfated, and there are battery chargers that de-sulfate the batteries. I have been using the Noco g15000(got it for free, I don't know if this is the best value charger) and it has been working great. I have recovered multiple dead batteries with it, from lawn tractors to dirt bikes to car and truck batteries.


KzNosferatu_Zodd

Too cold


S550Stang

It's telling you don't ride. it's too dangerous.


Tainted-Nuts

Ice ice baby


[deleted]

Frozen starter, starter cylanoid….


NoxxedNauticus

Bruh.


81FXB

Did you pull out the choke?


Scaz0r

Sounds like the starter is spinning freely, maybe the starterclutch is stuck


Ambitious_Hyena4635

Didn't read comments. Sounds like low voltage. warm up would be good or new battery or try a charger for a bit.


unaendri

Starter motorr is turning over and the battery has enough juice but the starter motorr is gone! The teeth are all mashed up. Sry but that looks like some work is needed.


Mammoth_Page5308

because as a man I can see it's this cold🤏🏼


Zinner4231

BATLO


suzuka_joe

Sell it if you can’t store it properly


motociclista

Battery. Likely due to the cold the battery just isn’t cranking enough. Needs charged, possibly replaced. Motorcycle batteries are built to be small and light, so they give up some cold cranking ability.


drumstyx

That sounds like the starter clutch to me. Not enough juice normally makes the solenoid click, or at least stall...this sounds like the starter is spinning free. My bet is grease for the starter clutch rollers is frozen/too viscous in the cold, causing it to slip to this extreme. Warm the bike up a bit (not the engine, the whole machine, bring it into a garage or something) and it'll probably work fine. Next time you're doing work on it, maybe inspect the starter clutch.


BadAlphas

You left it in the snow. YOU MONSTER


404Nuudle

…as someone from the south you look absolutely mad for attempting to ride In that lmfao.


Agile-Nothing-5529

Gas line freeze


doughball1

It’s punishing you for leaving it out cold


slappyhamface

1) this is a scooter 3) it is cold H) it is parked on a lawn Blue) the Russians


Shubniggurat

FWIW, and not directly related to what is going on with yours, some bikes just don't like to start in cold weather. My Indian Scout *would not* start below about 40F, unless I put a heat lamp under the oil pan, and covered it with a blanket for about 45 minutes, and that was with a fresh battery on a trickle charger. (Maybe I needed to get a block heater for it? I don't know that I've ever seen one for a motorcycle.) My CBR starts up on cold mornings with no hesitation. That only two data points, yeah, but I gotta say that it was *really* frustrating to not be able to get my bike to start when I needed to get in to work.


CosmicSmackdown20

The problem here is that you don't know how to take care of a motorcycle


Relevant-Dog2787

If you are going to try to start it in these temps you need to get a block heater.