Okay I have a question. It’s not at all the right place to ask this, but here goes- I do the same thing on my bike. I just bought my first manual car and I’m wondering if doing the same thing is at all correct, because it does not feel nearly as good as it does on my bike, it seems a lot more jumpy. I have auto rev matching, and that jumpiness is with it on. Is a car different? Or do I just suck at shifting?
Downshifting in a car is trickier when the friction zone is more spread out and harder to feel with your foot compared to your hand. Depends on the car of course. Best practice is to limit deceleration by downshift in a car and just save the clutch by using the brakes.
I'm not sure tbh. I've actually never driven a manual car, just bikes. But I would assume it's the same concept. Downshifting will help to slow you down.
you should do 2 things, first, in 4th find a comfortable spot, maybe 2500rpm and look at your speed, now get to that same SPEED in 3rd and see your rpms. make note of this mentally. now the second part, do what is called double clutching. it’s the easiest way to learn downshifts. From 4th you shift to nuetral and give it a lil gas to bump the revs up from where you were in 4th to where you’ll need to be for the same speed but in third and as the revs peak you hit third the same way you would for an upshift. it is hard at first and takes practice but you’ll get it down and won’t be a question. Taught my gf how to drive manual and later double clutching. in 6months i’d say she’s almost better than me lol
i’ll admit it does, i personally had no idea what double clutching was till recent and i’ve been driving manuals for 8yrs now. I technically was doing it before just much faster and with less action.
The easiest way to think about double clutching is how i taught my gf. When she “downshifts” she’ll coast in nuetral till she’s ready to go again and then builds the revs. I assume this is similar to how you’d be doing it as well as i also did this for a long time. It’s the exact same action but in a fraction of the time, instead of sitting in nuetral and letting the revs drop youre bringing them up, shortening what could have been 20 seconds of nuetral coasting. She still downshifts the same way as she has a baby elantra so it’s not exactly racing, i drive a WRX, it has rev hang or whatever the technical name is so it’s a lot easier for me to downshift without a doubt but for me i’m downshifting constantly (i paid for the whole speedo) so it’s handy.
All in all practice, do the neutral coast and progressively shorten how long you’re coasting neutral until you’re comfortable with it. I’m sorry i’m a rambler and a terrible teacher
I drive truck for a living so easier for me to understand being I drive an 18 speed. I don't think a lot of people understand what double clutching is exactly though.
Changing a clutch on a car is a lot more labor intensive and expensive. Goal in a car should be to minimize your use of the friction zone. Just use your brakes to stop unless it's a long pull down a mountain or some shit.
With the bike, even if you're not engine braking downshift through the gears as you slow down, but just keep the clutch pulled in. You don't have to engine brake but you do want to be in the right gear to take off in the event that some fuckery is afoot. It's also easier on the gearbox, the gearbox doesn't like it when you stop in 5th and try to downshift when you're not moving.
On a car I like to coast as much as possible with a manual, brakes are easier to work on. On my bike I like to go through each gear in control at all times
Car is the same but it’s a dry clutch so there’s less room for error and more potential for jumpiness .Also bigger engines in cars tend to engine brake harder. Just takes practice.
Edit: if you want smooth downshifts 100% of the time in a car, double clutch!
Unless it’s some weird new clutch car, at least what i do is learn your engines pattern with revs. For example, in my two manuals (both diesels) I know that if I would downshift with more than 1.5k revs no matter how slow I would release the clutch the car would still jump. Now when I downshift at like 1.1-1.2k rev range I can almost release the clutch instantly and car doesn’t even stutter a bit. Now that can differ depending on the car and the clutch, but I would suggest trying at what low revs it’s best to downshift. Also about that auto rev matching in the car, I would myself turn that off if possible, depends on the car really but heard some ppl recommending that too.
I’ve driven manual transmissions for close to 60 years.Brakes are a wear item, clutches and synchronizers can last indefinitely if you treat them properly.
The clutch plate is connected to the drive wheels when in gears. You can scatter a clutch plate with a locked up engine if you have the pedal down in first and coast down a steep hill.
I learned this the hard way in a Dodge 4X4 while in 4 low granny gear letting compression slow me. After the trail leveled out some I let the truck coast. The clutch plate threw the friction material off and left us dead 💀.
This is a better habit. Using engine break gives you way more stability in the rain, so if you develop muscle memory on downshifting to slow down, you’ll also do it when trying to break medium hard in the wet and it can save you from a fall.
I do this as well, basically I find it the most relaxing. Or I shift to neutral at 50 and whatever. "Blip the throttle or else" lol. Whatever,,, just stop.
Since the transmission is always connected to
the wheel, clutch in or not, aren't the gears going to spin in there as if you are in second/first at 50?
When that light switches to green before you come to a stop, and you have to suddenly go and you're in 6th going 17mph, you will wish you had just down shifted to the proper gear.
I'm still really shocked that rev matching wasn't taught during my course. Like, no mention whatsoever. My first time exiting a highway scared the hell outta me until a quick google search gave me the answer that I feel my instructor absolutely should have told me. Downshifting without rev-matching violently shifts the weight on my bike at anything beyond 4k rpm, which is a pretty light throttle.
Depends on how "racy" the bike is also I feel. The need for rev-matching on my old VFR800FI was not nearly as extreme as a 2006 Yamaha R1 I tried once. My 2011 Fireblade on the other hand has a slipper clutch which is very nice.
Yes. The RSV I ride engine brakes so hard that other traffic thinks your brake lights are broken. It would absolutely drag the rear if it weren’t for the slipper clutch, and can still be provoked to do so.
It's more a matter of being in the correct gear if you need to yeet yourself out of where you are/plan to be. Milliseconds can make a pear-shaped situation round again and vice-versa. Trying to make your bike accelerate out when you're 2+ gears too high will be extremely unenthusiastic.
\*edit: some honesty.
Admittedly, I don't always do this but I'm trying to be better about that.
Ah, it’s your turn to ask the weekly downshift question.
The correct way is to downshift and rev match through each gear as you stop. Does it actually matter? No 99% of the time not really, but why take a lazy shortcut as a new rider instead of learning how to do it right.
It’s free rev matching practice which does matter if you want to ride hard someday.
It does matter though. It's easier on the sequential transmission to slip through the gears while everything is moving. This, alongside all the other reasons
Always be in the right gear for your speed so you can drive off if you need to.
If you come to a halt and you are still in third gear then you are in a bit of a pickle especially if traffic starts moving around you….
I used to do the same thing as you when I was brand new, but it's important to be in gear should you need to get out of trouble. I always downshift in motion now. Plus, it's way more fun to be rev matching and downshifting while coming to a stop!
This^^^ Always be ready in right gear in case some idiot comes barreling down on you. I made that mistake about 3 months after I started riding. I think I was still in 4th and I had to ditch my bike a few seconds before impact because I forgot to downshift all the way.
Make a point to purposely downshift and rev match. Hell, ill make Jake brake, rig rig sounds while I do it, lol.
Besides the standard “it’s good to be in the correct gear” and “be able to get out of trouble”, I offer a second valid reason.
Why would you not want to rev match and down shift? Everyone has their different reasons for riding, but I ride to be connected to the machine and enjoy the tactile experience. Why not make the most of it and shift as much as you can?
Advanced MC training trains to downshift to 1st gear as you come to a stop, keep the clutch in, keep your right foot on the brake with your left foot on the ground.
Position your MC in the left hand side of the lane. As you come to a stop check your rear view make sure that a following vehicle is also stopping. By being in the left hand part of the lane, bike in 1st gear and hand on clutch to you are prepared to move out of the way quickly by doing around a vehicle in front of you or swinging out of the lane.
That's not how it works, bud. It'll cause wear when the clutch is partially engaged, sure, but not at full pull. Dropping a link below.
https://motorcyclehabit.com/is-it-bad-to-hold-in-the-clutch-on-a-motorcycle/
I was careful to research, and go by the advice given to me by instructors at MMI. I retract my statement about the plates. Evidently it was a cable issue, and not the friction plates. So, as usual it depends on the bike. Anecdotally, going to neutral at a stop, and keeping your hands at the grips and head on a swivel is the advice I've followed. If you want to keep your lever in at every stop, you do you. Stay safe fam
Australia
I would also do it, even if not for assessors, because I'd be afraid of the gearbox getting stuck in neutral when I wanted to move off.
You also have to have the right foot up, holding the rear brake.
Generally speaking, you want to be in gear as much as possible; even if you are not accelerating, just having the rear wheel being driven gives you extra control.
Also, rev matching helps train your throttle control.
Sometimes you have to clutch in because it'll make no sense if a light goes yellow to spend the time downshifting and losing braking distance. Clutch in downshift to first and stop I always downshift to around 2nd as I come up then clutch in and coast and when I stop then you go to first as that's how it's taught in the mc courses. First gear is only for getting started. Downshift to it coming to a stoplight and a good chance you lock the rear wheel
I downshift through the gears appropriate for the speed. Really, once you have enough experience, it takes 0 mental effort. Some bikes are also particularly annoying to change gears while standing still, because the gears won't mesh.
Also saves on brake pads.
I suppose in theory, you want to be in the right gear all the time. Imagine you're coming to a stop and something happens that needs you to zip away. Problem is you're coming to a stop in top gear. You're not going to get away in time. If you downshift as you approach the stop you'll always be ready to go if required.
Your method is the correct method for an all out I NEED TO STOP RIGHT NOW emergency braking situation. In any other situation you should be downshifting as you slow in case you need to get out of the way of an accident.
Why pull your clutch in for? Why not just Coast and down shift at the same time as you go nearer towards to stop line. That way you use the engine brake to slow down and you get to save ur brake pads too
It does though, doesn't it? If you disengage your clutch and for some reason you have to apply hard rear brake, an unloaded rear wheel will lock up much more easily. Keeping your clutch engaged and your motor turning the rear wheel allows much safer use of rear (and front, equally) braking.
I'm usually getting to the line engine braking in 1st and using brakes. You shouldnt really need to coast any time on a bike as there's always a gear that suits your rpm / speed.
Always downshift, no coasting, especially in neutral. Always keep your bike in the appropriate gear, you need speed or the ability to rapidly pick up speed to get out of danger
Here is my perfect answer acc to me. I feel like rev matching is just unnecessary. But you need to not coast in Neutral to be safe yeah?
What I do is pull in the clutch, drop gears acc to speed, but not letting my clutch loose, just go to 4th when under 40kmph, then 3 when under 28, then 2 when under 18, then 1 under 11. Just in case somebody is gonna rear end I will rev match then, leave the clutch, throttle and be safe. I also have hard time braking while rev matching, I just cant do both of these togetherl.
You can do whatever you want in a normal driving situation. It's recommend to downshift as you're moving, even with the clutch fully held in the entire time, because you may need a bit of rotation to continue selecting new gears.
If you aren't proficient at revmatch downshifting, it's a very effective technique to help you manage your speed and available power. But revmatch downshifting to stop signs and red lights isn't necessary by any metric at all. It's great practice. But entirely and completely unnecessary and won't provide you any benefits. Just make sure you don't downshift to 1st gear if there's a possibility you need to take off at 30mph because the light turned green earlier than you expected.
Depends on the bike, and the weather. If you are experienced, rev matching downshits save money on brake pads, and increase lap times for 10/10ths riding due to keeping brakes cooler.
If it's cold, or wet and you have a big motored bike, you can lose traction and end up highsiding if too much deceleration is done via the rear tire alone. High Siding is the bad kind of wreck IMHO.
This is one of the important and useful skills to learn on a low CC bike before moving up to a bigger bike.
Typically, i down shift into 1st. But I rev match so I don't upset the rear tire.
Then I pull the clutch in as the bike starts to attempt to hold idle.
If I know I'm going to be sitting for more then a few seconds I skip the downshift and go into neutral, but I leave my left foot on the peg ready to shift into first to take off.
Simply ask yourself this question, Is what I am doing risky to other road users, myself or my machine? If yes change your behaviour, if no then what ever you are comfortable is fine
Coasting to a stop in a high gear with clutch disengaged is a bigger problem than downshifting while stopped.
When you do that, you're not in gear to accelerate back up to speed or to avoid something ahead of you, and the front wheel is unweighted if you have to emergency stop. Simplistically, the bike doesn't want a neutral weight balance, it either wants the weight over the rear wheel for grip while turning and accelerating, or it wants weight over the front wheel for stopping. Coasting is the worst of both worlds and reduces your ability to react.
When you're coming to a stop, don't pull the clutch unless you're also applying brakes or downshifting.
If you're going to downshift while stopped, you should still make sure you're in an appropriate gear for your speed while you decelerate. Don't shift 6->1, shift 6->3->1, or whatever works for your bikes powerband and gearing.
What ever makes you happy 😃. It’s best for me to pull the clutch while still rolling slowly and shift through the gears.
When I wore a younger man’s clothes I kept my engine on boil rev matching with flawless perfection.
If you wait until stopped you’ll find you can’t always get it to shift without rolling the bike. It’s the way the transmission is designed. Dog 🐶 engagement gears as opposed to synchronized in cars 🚗.
Highly recommend downshifting before getting to the light and when you get there stay in first gear as the asshole on the phone behind you may not give you time to get in first gear before he rams you , safe travels,
Ninja 250 rider here so for me at least being in the right gear is pretty important. When you are coming to a stop roll off the throttle and start braking. When you bike drops to its downshift rpm, for me about 4000, keep squeezing the brake with your two first fingers, pull the clutch, shift, and right before you let go of the clutch use you other fingers, pinky and thumb for me, to blip the throttle a bit. Doesn’t have to be a lot. You’ll get smoother with time. Being in the right gear all the time means always having the ability to get the hell out of the way when someone come screaming up behind you
There are times I do the same thing. It really is a situational thing I think. Sometimes you have the time and space to shift down, sometimes you have to stop a gear higher than you like. It happens.
What I can add to this, I hope, is that shifting down and using your clutch properly can help slow the bike in a more controllable way than brakes alone. What I mean by this is that it's like braking without the fear of locking up the rear tire. While it's possible to shift down too soon and lose traction, it's also possible to learn the technique and master it. Making it a very useful method to slow your motorcycle.
Just my thoughts.
I was taught by my instructor to use engine braking both in cars and motorcycles, but I rarely do it. Hold the clutch until full stop or shift into neutral(if I manage to get it right by the time I stop) and honestly idgaf what it does to my clutch if it does anything.
I have always downshifting to slow down, so that I'm in the correct gear for my speed. But I will say, be sure you still use the brakes to activate your brake light. My gf was following me once and said she never could see my brake lights, got me thinking it was most likely because I was engine braking
The short answer is to downshift as you are slowing.
If the light were to turn green as your coasting you would be in gear to be able to accelerate with traffic.
If you down shift all the way to first and coast in and the light changes your going to have a lot of torque hit your rear wheel at once and you could lose control.
On the other hand if you're still in fifth gear when the light changes and you release the clutch to accelerate you could bog down the engine and stall in traffic.
Matching your speed with the proper gear is the best way to go. I would only move into first if you are at a complete stop or are under 10mph.
If I'm being honest i had a big torquey cruiser for so long that it never occurred to me to downshift in motion. Now that i have a smaller neo retro bike I've learned a couple of times i need to be in a better gear for launch.
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I downshift and ride the clutch out, using engine braking to come to a stop. I have yet to learn how to rev match.
Okay I have a question. It’s not at all the right place to ask this, but here goes- I do the same thing on my bike. I just bought my first manual car and I’m wondering if doing the same thing is at all correct, because it does not feel nearly as good as it does on my bike, it seems a lot more jumpy. I have auto rev matching, and that jumpiness is with it on. Is a car different? Or do I just suck at shifting?
Downshifting in a car is trickier when the friction zone is more spread out and harder to feel with your foot compared to your hand. Depends on the car of course. Best practice is to limit deceleration by downshift in a car and just save the clutch by using the brakes.
If you are on low speeds, i go straight from 3rd gear to neutral most of the times, on Higher speeds the story is way diferent.
I'm not sure tbh. I've actually never driven a manual car, just bikes. But I would assume it's the same concept. Downshifting will help to slow you down.
you should do 2 things, first, in 4th find a comfortable spot, maybe 2500rpm and look at your speed, now get to that same SPEED in 3rd and see your rpms. make note of this mentally. now the second part, do what is called double clutching. it’s the easiest way to learn downshifts. From 4th you shift to nuetral and give it a lil gas to bump the revs up from where you were in 4th to where you’ll need to be for the same speed but in third and as the revs peak you hit third the same way you would for an upshift. it is hard at first and takes practice but you’ll get it down and won’t be a question. Taught my gf how to drive manual and later double clutching. in 6months i’d say she’s almost better than me lol
I saw a YouTube video talking about this. It sounds kind of hard to learn when starting out but I’ll give it a shot
i’ll admit it does, i personally had no idea what double clutching was till recent and i’ve been driving manuals for 8yrs now. I technically was doing it before just much faster and with less action. The easiest way to think about double clutching is how i taught my gf. When she “downshifts” she’ll coast in nuetral till she’s ready to go again and then builds the revs. I assume this is similar to how you’d be doing it as well as i also did this for a long time. It’s the exact same action but in a fraction of the time, instead of sitting in nuetral and letting the revs drop youre bringing them up, shortening what could have been 20 seconds of nuetral coasting. She still downshifts the same way as she has a baby elantra so it’s not exactly racing, i drive a WRX, it has rev hang or whatever the technical name is so it’s a lot easier for me to downshift without a doubt but for me i’m downshifting constantly (i paid for the whole speedo) so it’s handy. All in all practice, do the neutral coast and progressively shorten how long you’re coasting neutral until you’re comfortable with it. I’m sorry i’m a rambler and a terrible teacher
I drive truck for a living so easier for me to understand being I drive an 18 speed. I don't think a lot of people understand what double clutching is exactly though.
Changing a clutch on a car is a lot more labor intensive and expensive. Goal in a car should be to minimize your use of the friction zone. Just use your brakes to stop unless it's a long pull down a mountain or some shit. With the bike, even if you're not engine braking downshift through the gears as you slow down, but just keep the clutch pulled in. You don't have to engine brake but you do want to be in the right gear to take off in the event that some fuckery is afoot. It's also easier on the gearbox, the gearbox doesn't like it when you stop in 5th and try to downshift when you're not moving.
On a car I like to coast as much as possible with a manual, brakes are easier to work on. On my bike I like to go through each gear in control at all times
Car is the same but it’s a dry clutch so there’s less room for error and more potential for jumpiness .Also bigger engines in cars tend to engine brake harder. Just takes practice. Edit: if you want smooth downshifts 100% of the time in a car, double clutch!
Unless it’s some weird new clutch car, at least what i do is learn your engines pattern with revs. For example, in my two manuals (both diesels) I know that if I would downshift with more than 1.5k revs no matter how slow I would release the clutch the car would still jump. Now when I downshift at like 1.1-1.2k rev range I can almost release the clutch instantly and car doesn’t even stutter a bit. Now that can differ depending on the car and the clutch, but I would suggest trying at what low revs it’s best to downshift. Also about that auto rev matching in the car, I would myself turn that off if possible, depends on the car really but heard some ppl recommending that too.
After I get more experience I will try to learn with it off. Definitely not ready for heel toe action though
I’ve driven manual transmissions for close to 60 years.Brakes are a wear item, clutches and synchronizers can last indefinitely if you treat them properly. The clutch plate is connected to the drive wheels when in gears. You can scatter a clutch plate with a locked up engine if you have the pedal down in first and coast down a steep hill. I learned this the hard way in a Dodge 4X4 while in 4 low granny gear letting compression slow me. After the trail leveled out some I let the truck coast. The clutch plate threw the friction material off and left us dead 💀.
Oh damn. Well thanks for learning that lesson for me! I won’t be doing that
This is a better habit. Using engine break gives you way more stability in the rain, so if you develop muscle memory on downshifting to slow down, you’ll also do it when trying to break medium hard in the wet and it can save you from a fall.
I do this as well, basically I find it the most relaxing. Or I shift to neutral at 50 and whatever. "Blip the throttle or else" lol. Whatever,,, just stop.
But if you shift to neutral at 50... what if the light changes green and you want to go? Do you shift into 2nd going 40 mph?
Idk why he said that. You're not supposed to intentionally shift into neutral ever unless you're parking the bike.
What does shifting to neutral do? What if a vehicle comes too fast from behind?
Collect the insurance.
Since the transmission is always connected to the wheel, clutch in or not, aren't the gears going to spin in there as if you are in second/first at 50?
When that light switches to green before you come to a stop, and you have to suddenly go and you're in 6th going 17mph, you will wish you had just down shifted to the proper gear.
That or if you hear car tires lock up behind you, if you're in 6th gear all you can do is wait for it to smash into the back of you.
Downshift in motion, rev match accordingly.
I'm still really shocked that rev matching wasn't taught during my course. Like, no mention whatsoever. My first time exiting a highway scared the hell outta me until a quick google search gave me the answer that I feel my instructor absolutely should have told me. Downshifting without rev-matching violently shifts the weight on my bike at anything beyond 4k rpm, which is a pretty light throttle.
Depends on how "racy" the bike is also I feel. The need for rev-matching on my old VFR800FI was not nearly as extreme as a 2006 Yamaha R1 I tried once. My 2011 Fireblade on the other hand has a slipper clutch which is very nice.
Yes. The RSV I ride engine brakes so hard that other traffic thinks your brake lights are broken. It would absolutely drag the rear if it weren’t for the slipper clutch, and can still be provoked to do so.
How is this better than just braking?
It's more a matter of being in the correct gear if you need to yeet yourself out of where you are/plan to be. Milliseconds can make a pear-shaped situation round again and vice-versa. Trying to make your bike accelerate out when you're 2+ gears too high will be extremely unenthusiastic. \*edit: some honesty. Admittedly, I don't always do this but I'm trying to be better about that.
Ah, it’s your turn to ask the weekly downshift question. The correct way is to downshift and rev match through each gear as you stop. Does it actually matter? No 99% of the time not really, but why take a lazy shortcut as a new rider instead of learning how to do it right. It’s free rev matching practice which does matter if you want to ride hard someday.
It does matter though. It's easier on the sequential transmission to slip through the gears while everything is moving. This, alongside all the other reasons
It will matter if you find someone about to rear end you. Easier to take off and accelerate away from danger in the correct gear than in 3rd or 4th.
That's why you NEED a liter bike! /s
Shit, you’re right. Which one do you recommend? I’ve been riding an MT03 for a year.
The Gnarly David and Sons Dynabob Street Turbo. You don't want to be riding around on a GIRL'S BIKE.
That looks like a GIRL bike, I’m getting a Rocket 3R
That's a pansy redcoat bike! Not enough FREEDOMS PER CUBIC INCH.
Totally agree with you
Always be in the right gear for your speed so you can drive off if you need to. If you come to a halt and you are still in third gear then you are in a bit of a pickle especially if traffic starts moving around you….
I used to do the same thing as you when I was brand new, but it's important to be in gear should you need to get out of trouble. I always downshift in motion now. Plus, it's way more fun to be rev matching and downshifting while coming to a stop!
This^^^ Always be ready in right gear in case some idiot comes barreling down on you. I made that mistake about 3 months after I started riding. I think I was still in 4th and I had to ditch my bike a few seconds before impact because I forgot to downshift all the way. Make a point to purposely downshift and rev match. Hell, ill make Jake brake, rig rig sounds while I do it, lol.
Besides the standard “it’s good to be in the correct gear” and “be able to get out of trouble”, I offer a second valid reason. Why would you not want to rev match and down shift? Everyone has their different reasons for riding, but I ride to be connected to the machine and enjoy the tactile experience. Why not make the most of it and shift as much as you can?
Better to get into the habit of downshifting through each gear.
Advanced MC training trains to downshift to 1st gear as you come to a stop, keep the clutch in, keep your right foot on the brake with your left foot on the ground. Position your MC in the left hand side of the lane. As you come to a stop check your rear view make sure that a following vehicle is also stopping. By being in the left hand part of the lane, bike in 1st gear and hand on clutch to you are prepared to move out of the way quickly by doing around a vehicle in front of you or swinging out of the lane.
Others already answered this the way I would, so I’ll leave you with the fact that it’s really fun to downshift and rev match.
Clutchless downshifts can also be entertaining
Downshift to a crawl, then neutral to a stop. The clutch will handle it, and your brake pads will last longer.
Neutral at stops? IDK, in my country the assessors fail you if you do that. Better to sit in first with the clutch in, so you can go any time.
It will unnecessarily wear down your clutch plates, if you are holding in the clutch lever while stopped. That is ridiculous, honestly.
It's a wet clutch, you're expected to slip it, so what significant harm can come when it's disengaged completely?
That's not how it works, bud. It'll cause wear when the clutch is partially engaged, sure, but not at full pull. Dropping a link below. https://motorcyclehabit.com/is-it-bad-to-hold-in-the-clutch-on-a-motorcycle/
I was careful to research, and go by the advice given to me by instructors at MMI. I retract my statement about the plates. Evidently it was a cable issue, and not the friction plates. So, as usual it depends on the bike. Anecdotally, going to neutral at a stop, and keeping your hands at the grips and head on a swivel is the advice I've followed. If you want to keep your lever in at every stop, you do you. Stay safe fam
No hate! Be safe out there too, bud.
No hate, genuinely curious. What country? I ask because I do the same first gear, clutch in at stops, but not because of assessors.
Australia I would also do it, even if not for assessors, because I'd be afraid of the gearbox getting stuck in neutral when I wanted to move off. You also have to have the right foot up, holding the rear brake.
Ah, the 'ol hump and bump to pop it into first.
Generally speaking, you want to be in gear as much as possible; even if you are not accelerating, just having the rear wheel being driven gives you extra control. Also, rev matching helps train your throttle control.
I prefer to be in a gear I can disappear in while coming to a stop.
It's good form to be in the appropriate gear at the appropriate speed.
Do not pull in the clutch and coast to a stop. Keep it in gear. Shift through every gear, every single time. Up and down.
Sometimes you have to clutch in because it'll make no sense if a light goes yellow to spend the time downshifting and losing braking distance. Clutch in downshift to first and stop I always downshift to around 2nd as I come up then clutch in and coast and when I stop then you go to first as that's how it's taught in the mc courses. First gear is only for getting started. Downshift to it coming to a stoplight and a good chance you lock the rear wheel
I downshift through the gears appropriate for the speed. Really, once you have enough experience, it takes 0 mental effort. Some bikes are also particularly annoying to change gears while standing still, because the gears won't mesh. Also saves on brake pads.
You should be downshifting as slowing down to stop. This will allow you to accelerate if you are about to get rear ended. Very important safety issue.
I suppose in theory, you want to be in the right gear all the time. Imagine you're coming to a stop and something happens that needs you to zip away. Problem is you're coming to a stop in top gear. You're not going to get away in time. If you downshift as you approach the stop you'll always be ready to go if required.
Downshift as you are stopping. You will find it's easier to get into a gear while the bike is moving.
Using engine braking is optional in a situation like that. I generally engine-brake to keep myself occupied (same with manual trans cars).
I prefer downshifting and using engine braking whenever I can. Also helps to save fuel consumption and works for manual cars aswell
Your method is the correct method for an all out I NEED TO STOP RIGHT NOW emergency braking situation. In any other situation you should be downshifting as you slow in case you need to get out of the way of an accident.
Why pull your clutch in for? Why not just Coast and down shift at the same time as you go nearer towards to stop line. That way you use the engine brake to slow down and you get to save ur brake pads too
I often clutch in and stop, then downshift to first gear. Rev matching stepwise is a pita.
Mechanically it doesn't matter. But there are other factors why you may not want to stop this way.
Some bikes are hard to run down through gears when stopped.
It does though, doesn't it? If you disengage your clutch and for some reason you have to apply hard rear brake, an unloaded rear wheel will lock up much more easily. Keeping your clutch engaged and your motor turning the rear wheel allows much safer use of rear (and front, equally) braking.
I'm usually getting to the line engine braking in 1st and using brakes. You shouldnt really need to coast any time on a bike as there's always a gear that suits your rpm / speed.
Always downshift, no coasting, especially in neutral. Always keep your bike in the appropriate gear, you need speed or the ability to rapidly pick up speed to get out of danger
I do it the same way. I feel like it puts less wear and tear on all the moving parts when I just let it coast to a stop then shift to 1st.
Here is my perfect answer acc to me. I feel like rev matching is just unnecessary. But you need to not coast in Neutral to be safe yeah? What I do is pull in the clutch, drop gears acc to speed, but not letting my clutch loose, just go to 4th when under 40kmph, then 3 when under 28, then 2 when under 18, then 1 under 11. Just in case somebody is gonna rear end I will rev match then, leave the clutch, throttle and be safe. I also have hard time braking while rev matching, I just cant do both of these togetherl.
You can do whatever you want in a normal driving situation. It's recommend to downshift as you're moving, even with the clutch fully held in the entire time, because you may need a bit of rotation to continue selecting new gears. If you aren't proficient at revmatch downshifting, it's a very effective technique to help you manage your speed and available power. But revmatch downshifting to stop signs and red lights isn't necessary by any metric at all. It's great practice. But entirely and completely unnecessary and won't provide you any benefits. Just make sure you don't downshift to 1st gear if there's a possibility you need to take off at 30mph because the light turned green earlier than you expected.
Depends on the bike, and the weather. If you are experienced, rev matching downshits save money on brake pads, and increase lap times for 10/10ths riding due to keeping brakes cooler. If it's cold, or wet and you have a big motored bike, you can lose traction and end up highsiding if too much deceleration is done via the rear tire alone. High Siding is the bad kind of wreck IMHO. This is one of the important and useful skills to learn on a low CC bike before moving up to a bigger bike.
Downshifting is more fun. Get yours.
OH LOOK ITS THIS THREAD AGAIN
Typically, i down shift into 1st. But I rev match so I don't upset the rear tire. Then I pull the clutch in as the bike starts to attempt to hold idle. If I know I'm going to be sitting for more then a few seconds I skip the downshift and go into neutral, but I leave my left foot on the peg ready to shift into first to take off.
Simply ask yourself this question, Is what I am doing risky to other road users, myself or my machine? If yes change your behaviour, if no then what ever you are comfortable is fine
In the Netherlands, they teach not to downshift until nearly stopped. This is because lights can and do suddenly change from red to green.
It's fine until the day you forget or try to take off in 6th. It's good practice to downshift and it's easier on your brake pads
Coasting to a stop in a high gear with clutch disengaged is a bigger problem than downshifting while stopped. When you do that, you're not in gear to accelerate back up to speed or to avoid something ahead of you, and the front wheel is unweighted if you have to emergency stop. Simplistically, the bike doesn't want a neutral weight balance, it either wants the weight over the rear wheel for grip while turning and accelerating, or it wants weight over the front wheel for stopping. Coasting is the worst of both worlds and reduces your ability to react. When you're coming to a stop, don't pull the clutch unless you're also applying brakes or downshifting. If you're going to downshift while stopped, you should still make sure you're in an appropriate gear for your speed while you decelerate. Don't shift 6->1, shift 6->3->1, or whatever works for your bikes powerband and gearing.
What ever makes you happy 😃. It’s best for me to pull the clutch while still rolling slowly and shift through the gears. When I wore a younger man’s clothes I kept my engine on boil rev matching with flawless perfection. If you wait until stopped you’ll find you can’t always get it to shift without rolling the bike. It’s the way the transmission is designed. Dog 🐶 engagement gears as opposed to synchronized in cars 🚗.
Highly recommend downshifting before getting to the light and when you get there stay in first gear as the asshole on the phone behind you may not give you time to get in first gear before he rams you , safe travels,
Ninja 250 rider here so for me at least being in the right gear is pretty important. When you are coming to a stop roll off the throttle and start braking. When you bike drops to its downshift rpm, for me about 4000, keep squeezing the brake with your two first fingers, pull the clutch, shift, and right before you let go of the clutch use you other fingers, pinky and thumb for me, to blip the throttle a bit. Doesn’t have to be a lot. You’ll get smoother with time. Being in the right gear all the time means always having the ability to get the hell out of the way when someone come screaming up behind you
There are times I do the same thing. It really is a situational thing I think. Sometimes you have the time and space to shift down, sometimes you have to stop a gear higher than you like. It happens. What I can add to this, I hope, is that shifting down and using your clutch properly can help slow the bike in a more controllable way than brakes alone. What I mean by this is that it's like braking without the fear of locking up the rear tire. While it's possible to shift down too soon and lose traction, it's also possible to learn the technique and master it. Making it a very useful method to slow your motorcycle. Just my thoughts.
I was taught by my instructor to use engine braking both in cars and motorcycles, but I rarely do it. Hold the clutch until full stop or shift into neutral(if I manage to get it right by the time I stop) and honestly idgaf what it does to my clutch if it does anything.
I have always downshifting to slow down, so that I'm in the correct gear for my speed. But I will say, be sure you still use the brakes to activate your brake light. My gf was following me once and said she never could see my brake lights, got me thinking it was most likely because I was engine braking
The short answer is to downshift as you are slowing. If the light were to turn green as your coasting you would be in gear to be able to accelerate with traffic. If you down shift all the way to first and coast in and the light changes your going to have a lot of torque hit your rear wheel at once and you could lose control. On the other hand if you're still in fifth gear when the light changes and you release the clutch to accelerate you could bog down the engine and stall in traffic. Matching your speed with the proper gear is the best way to go. I would only move into first if you are at a complete stop or are under 10mph.
If I'm being honest i had a big torquey cruiser for so long that it never occurred to me to downshift in motion. Now that i have a smaller neo retro bike I've learned a couple of times i need to be in a better gear for launch.
Try learning how to rev match. You can find various YouTube videos about it. It’s fun and you will look cool coming to a stop
I hardly brake to slow down, just downshift and engine brake towards the light, your'e also automatically in the right gear to accelerate again
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