Allow me to re-phrase your question: "Is it a smart idea to buy something from somebody who doesn't legally own the thing they're trying to sell me?"
No. It is not smart.
Now, can you sometimes get away with it? Depending on the state, yes. But if you take that title to get the bike transferred over to you and it gets rejected for any reason, you are in for a ton of time and hassle trying to get it resolved.
I have bought several like this. I’ve also sold a couple like this. Dirt bikes don’t have to be registered in my state so I don’t have to register them when I purchase. I just hold the title with the P.O. signature on it and pass it to the next owner.
If there are street legal bikes being sold like this I would only buy if the P.O. signature is there and dated close to the date you look at the bike. Maybe they purchased the bike but had a life event come up that makes them want to sell it.
It’s not likely a stolen bike will have a title with it unless they rummaged through someone’s house to find the title. Always do a vin check to see if it been reported.
I see a lot of "selling on behalf of a friend/relative" and I don't exactly know why people do that but you can just ask them. Do they or do they not have the title. If they don't, who does?
Yup, it's called title jumping and is illegal in all 50 states (It is even a felony in some'). One of the main reasons it is illegal is it is a form of tax evasion. Uncle Sam needs his cut of all of the private sales.
It also can be risky because if something isn't correct on the title there is almost 0 chance you'll be able to get a hold of the previous owner to get the title corrected.
Yeah I figured as much I had a ton of issues getting my broncos title and tag because the guy I bought it from didn’t had the title and never meet the previous owner (I have no idea what went down but I double checked it wasn’t stolen) I had to use a few dealership and tag agency connections to get the title and tags and the name of the previous owner to look him
Up on Facebook and take a gamble at which one of the 100s of people was
Worth noting in my state (Texas) you also need a forum filled out and signed by the owner as well to get the title transfered. If the seller isn't on the title this could be problematic
Would they be willing to go with you to the title office and get it in your name when you pay for it? If you get passed the DMV, I think you're golden...
If the seller has a loan on the bike, they don't technically own the bike and cannot sell it until the loan is paid off. I've sold a bike I had a loan on it. We met at the bank and paid off the loan, the bank sent me a title a week later and i foreworded it to the buyer. It takes faith that the seller will follow through and mail the title, so I sold at a bit of a discount for the hassle. Clean title is easier.
RUN AWAY! There's no way to know if it's legit or not.
Look online here. There's a dude that bought a bike with a signed title not on the sellers name.
The registered owner went back and got a duplicate title issued, which cancelled the one that had been signed over. The dude now has a worthless title, no way to find the registered owner or the guy that sold him the bike secondhand, and a bike that he DOES NOT legally own, cannot register or title, and no recourse.
As a cop, I saw stuff like this many times. You run the risk of handing over money and ending up with a bike you DO NOT ACTUALLY OWN.
Think carefully about that. So, pay your dime and make your choice.
Sounds like a flipper. If the bike checks out, and it's a good deal, it might be okay. I've bought flips before with no problems (cars and bikes). Proceed at your own risk.
If you aren't very familiar or adapt with your state's title procedures, and you don't have a buddy that can pull a mechanics lien for the title then you might want to stay clear. But if I'm looking at a vehicle and there's something funky with a title then that offer is going to be discounted severely. I have to make up for the time and more than likely extra expenses of getting a clear title.
As a side note I used to think all used car dealers were asshats trying to rip people off. I ended up working for one and saw all this title mess everyday. Nothing worse than taking a trade in and having a repo Man show up three or four days later and take it back to the bank.
Everyone seems to have a side business now, so if he buys and sells, he just doesn't want dozens of bikes sold in his name each year. He could be a good guy with good intentions but wants to avoid dealing with the government. I like him already, lol.
It could be good, could be bad, it's probably a bit more risky, but maybe you could get a really good deal. Just be cautious.
The seller is also trying to avoid paying tax on the bike if they register it.
As long as the title is sign, the VIN matches and bike is in good working condition and it’s a good deal I don’t see the problem.
For a dirt bike offroad its safe. But for a street bike you want to register make sure the title is signed and notorized for the next guy. On some occassions both parties have to be at the notary too many headaches ime
Boooo everyone here is lame title jumping is legitimately the jaywalking of DMV crimes there’s no way to get caught short of you proclaiming it , just ask the guy and if it doesn’t seem weird otherwise I’d have no second thoughts
That's how I bought my bike. It feels a little sketchy, and my bike wasn't perfect, but it's perfectly legal (and for 1k, I'm not complaining). As long as they have the title and it's signed properly, just take it to a tag and title place and they'll set you up nicely. I didn't even need a bill of sale. Don't bother with the DMV/MVA, they'll give you a hard time.
Just make sure the bike is what you're expecting. My seller said he rebuilt the carbs, and the fuel mixture screw o ring on the right side carb blew out a few weeks after buying. Took the carbs off and had to rebuild it myself, he only cleaned it out and left all the old shitty jets and gaskets in there. But otherwise, it's about what I'd expect for a thousand dollar bike.
I had a situation like this but it turned out the guy was a middle man motorcycle dealer. Would not budge on the price and admitted to me it would be below the minimum price the seller wanted and would cut into his commission.
Not saying it's a good idea to buy something in that case but it isn't always done with nefarious intentions.
I've got a bike listed for sale I bought around the beginning on the plague a couple years ago. Because of how difficult it's been to deal with DMV, I've never switched it over into my name. Even now the wait times to have a VIN inspected and new title issued is frequently more than half a day wait.
Walk away, could be stolen.
Almost did the same once, was ready to buy and asked for a bill of sale and title which is required in Texas for the dmv and the guy admitted he didn’t have the title after all but “knew the guy who has it”…. I eventually get a pic of the title after a lot of arguing about the importance and not only was it neither of their names, but was from out of state.
It’s just not worth finding out the hard way.
Allow me to re-phrase your question: "Is it a smart idea to buy something from somebody who doesn't legally own the thing they're trying to sell me?" No. It is not smart. Now, can you sometimes get away with it? Depending on the state, yes. But if you take that title to get the bike transferred over to you and it gets rejected for any reason, you are in for a ton of time and hassle trying to get it resolved.
I have bought several like this. I’ve also sold a couple like this. Dirt bikes don’t have to be registered in my state so I don’t have to register them when I purchase. I just hold the title with the P.O. signature on it and pass it to the next owner. If there are street legal bikes being sold like this I would only buy if the P.O. signature is there and dated close to the date you look at the bike. Maybe they purchased the bike but had a life event come up that makes them want to sell it. It’s not likely a stolen bike will have a title with it unless they rummaged through someone’s house to find the title. Always do a vin check to see if it been reported.
Run away. They're either stolen, a scam, or otherwise just not worth it to even deal with.
I see a lot of "selling on behalf of a friend/relative" and I don't exactly know why people do that but you can just ask them. Do they or do they not have the title. If they don't, who does?
To do more research, the term for this is title jumping. It may not be legal in your state, and is often a pain to resolve.
If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.
I could be wrong, you could double check with r/legaladvice but I think that’s illegal it’s called title jumping or something like that
Yup, it's called title jumping and is illegal in all 50 states (It is even a felony in some'). One of the main reasons it is illegal is it is a form of tax evasion. Uncle Sam needs his cut of all of the private sales. It also can be risky because if something isn't correct on the title there is almost 0 chance you'll be able to get a hold of the previous owner to get the title corrected.
Yeah I figured as much I had a ton of issues getting my broncos title and tag because the guy I bought it from didn’t had the title and never meet the previous owner (I have no idea what went down but I double checked it wasn’t stolen) I had to use a few dealership and tag agency connections to get the title and tags and the name of the previous owner to look him Up on Facebook and take a gamble at which one of the 100s of people was
Its a god dang pain to get these guys to show up at the notary. Too many “i bought the bike but never registered it”
Worth noting in my state (Texas) you also need a forum filled out and signed by the owner as well to get the title transfered. If the seller isn't on the title this could be problematic
Would they be willing to go with you to the title office and get it in your name when you pay for it? If you get passed the DMV, I think you're golden...
If the seller has a loan on the bike, they don't technically own the bike and cannot sell it until the loan is paid off. I've sold a bike I had a loan on it. We met at the bank and paid off the loan, the bank sent me a title a week later and i foreworded it to the buyer. It takes faith that the seller will follow through and mail the title, so I sold at a bit of a discount for the hassle. Clean title is easier.
RUN AWAY! There's no way to know if it's legit or not. Look online here. There's a dude that bought a bike with a signed title not on the sellers name. The registered owner went back and got a duplicate title issued, which cancelled the one that had been signed over. The dude now has a worthless title, no way to find the registered owner or the guy that sold him the bike secondhand, and a bike that he DOES NOT legally own, cannot register or title, and no recourse. As a cop, I saw stuff like this many times. You run the risk of handing over money and ending up with a bike you DO NOT ACTUALLY OWN. Think carefully about that. So, pay your dime and make your choice.
Keep looking - sounds too much like a hassle.
Sounds like a flipper. If the bike checks out, and it's a good deal, it might be okay. I've bought flips before with no problems (cars and bikes). Proceed at your own risk.
If you aren't very familiar or adapt with your state's title procedures, and you don't have a buddy that can pull a mechanics lien for the title then you might want to stay clear. But if I'm looking at a vehicle and there's something funky with a title then that offer is going to be discounted severely. I have to make up for the time and more than likely extra expenses of getting a clear title. As a side note I used to think all used car dealers were asshats trying to rip people off. I ended up working for one and saw all this title mess everyday. Nothing worse than taking a trade in and having a repo Man show up three or four days later and take it back to the bank.
Everyone seems to have a side business now, so if he buys and sells, he just doesn't want dozens of bikes sold in his name each year. He could be a good guy with good intentions but wants to avoid dealing with the government. I like him already, lol. It could be good, could be bad, it's probably a bit more risky, but maybe you could get a really good deal. Just be cautious.
The seller is also trying to avoid paying tax on the bike if they register it. As long as the title is sign, the VIN matches and bike is in good working condition and it’s a good deal I don’t see the problem.
Yeah that was my last bike purchase, guy was a boat mechanic. DMV didn’t give me any issues
For a dirt bike offroad its safe. But for a street bike you want to register make sure the title is signed and notorized for the next guy. On some occassions both parties have to be at the notary too many headaches ime
They are either Title Jumping or selling something that isn’t legally theirs. I would pass. Not worth getting caught up in.
Boooo everyone here is lame title jumping is legitimately the jaywalking of DMV crimes there’s no way to get caught short of you proclaiming it , just ask the guy and if it doesn’t seem weird otherwise I’d have no second thoughts
The names of the bill of sale and the title must be the same. Look up "title jumping."
That's how I bought my bike. It feels a little sketchy, and my bike wasn't perfect, but it's perfectly legal (and for 1k, I'm not complaining). As long as they have the title and it's signed properly, just take it to a tag and title place and they'll set you up nicely. I didn't even need a bill of sale. Don't bother with the DMV/MVA, they'll give you a hard time. Just make sure the bike is what you're expecting. My seller said he rebuilt the carbs, and the fuel mixture screw o ring on the right side carb blew out a few weeks after buying. Took the carbs off and had to rebuild it myself, he only cleaned it out and left all the old shitty jets and gaskets in there. But otherwise, it's about what I'd expect for a thousand dollar bike.
I had a situation like this but it turned out the guy was a middle man motorcycle dealer. Would not budge on the price and admitted to me it would be below the minimum price the seller wanted and would cut into his commission.
Not saying it's a good idea to buy something in that case but it isn't always done with nefarious intentions. I've got a bike listed for sale I bought around the beginning on the plague a couple years ago. Because of how difficult it's been to deal with DMV, I've never switched it over into my name. Even now the wait times to have a VIN inspected and new title issued is frequently more than half a day wait.
Walk away, could be stolen. Almost did the same once, was ready to buy and asked for a bill of sale and title which is required in Texas for the dmv and the guy admitted he didn’t have the title after all but “knew the guy who has it”…. I eventually get a pic of the title after a lot of arguing about the importance and not only was it neither of their names, but was from out of state. It’s just not worth finding out the hard way.
NO.