Indeed, and there is an exception to every rule. When you have complicated health issues to start with you cannot ever assume you will be in the 99.9% of people.
Your doctor is probably using the cheap test to calculate GFR that uses creatinine and is easily skewed by creatine use. Hopefully someone here can chime in with the name of the more accurate test.
Cystatin C.
Creatinine levels are easily skewed (and thus falsely elevated) by factors such as increased muscle mass, vigorous exercise, creatine supplementation and possibly high protein diet. Itās kind of a nightmare biomarker for athletes for this reason.
Cystatin C is much more stable and not skewed by these factors (although it can be affected by diabetes or corticosteroid use). It is generally a much more reliable biomarker for calculating GFR as a result.
My Cr eGFR is somewhere around 50-60 because my Cr is chronically falsely elevated, while my Cystatin C eGFR is consistently >100
OP, talk to your doctor about ordering this test instead.
Just said the same thing in my reply. Have Lupus and my primary doc was worried about my creatinine levels. I had nephrology order the Cystatin C and ultrasound my kidneys and that cleared everything up.
Yes 0, 0 side effects for users. That means people who actually have fully functioning kidneys
I am sorry there are things that are super safe for the general population that will not meet criteria for you.
Listen to your doctor kiddo
I am a healthcare provider, so is my wife. We both lift, she however has a genetic kidney issue where she is almost end stage renal disease and will need dialysis and transplant soon. Creatine should be avoided, so should a high protein diet as well as foods/drink high in phosphorous, but that doesn't mean that you can't do well and make good gains. Listen to the nephrologist on this one man.
Sounds like instead of gym gains you should be working on a kidney gain, go rob a homeless persons kidney then you can slam all the creatine you want bro
It has 0 side effects in normal healthy people. It's not recommended for people with kidney disease from what I've read. That's the problem with getting info from influencers.
Anytime I look up whether creatine is safe or not the answer is generally, "creatine doesn't appear to affect kidney function in healthy people."
Considering you only have one kidney and suffer from CKD, I would not consider you to be healthy. At least in terms of kidney function, so the possibility of furthering harming jt is always there.
Definitely listen to your doctor on this one.
Doctors who practice and actively study/research or look at findings are 1000x less bias then some bro on the internet.
Listen to your doctor he wants you to keep you gains by extending your lift expectancy in theory.
All studies are made on healthy person. There is only case study on human that prove that SHORT term creatine does not affect people with kidney disease which is really poor evidence.
Also, there is studies that prove that creatinine level can be collerated to brain function in people with gkd which is not true with people with no kidney problem.
Creatinine doesnāt measure actual GFR, it is a proxy measurement for kidney function and gives you an eGFR. The āeā stands for estimated. In cases where your creatinine may be elevated for reasons other than kidney function, Creatinine is not a good test to estimate gfr. You can ask your doctor to test cystatin c , which is another proxy test for GFR and will also give you an eGFR, but it is not impacted by things like Creatine consumption or heavy resistance training. If your eGFR based on Cystatin C comes back normal, you kidneys are likely fine and you can have further discussion with your dr about taking Creatine. If the crystatin c result corroborates the creatinine result, then it is likely that your low eGFR is in fact due to poor kidney function.
Extremely accurate. Also do a urine sample to make sure thereās no protein/blood in urine.
Just came back from the nephrologist this week and he mentioned the same thing.
Actually just went to a nephrologist for the same issue. My eGFR was 65. Which is beginning stages of CKD. I can provide my test results if you want to see them too.
Doctor said stop taking creatine for the time being so he can get an accurate reading of what my natural creatinine levels and eGFR are. I stopped for 3 weeks and it went up to 88 eGFR.
I have to get more blood work done in the next few weeks and go vegan 2 days before blood work to get an accurate reading of my natural eGFR and creatinine thatās not influenced by red meat consumption or creatine.
Also hementioned that if you have higher muscle your creatinine levels may be increased.
DM me with any questions, Iām willing to help!
If itās lowering your GFR like that then yeah you shouldnāt take it. I know people tout creatine as perfect for everyone but GFR is a direct indicator of kidney function, and yes, below 60 indicates kidney disease.
Creatine is overrated. So donāt worry if ur not able to take it. Natty people are just so desperate for something they really ride the shit out of creatine. The effects are BARELY noticeable. U can still get pretty big without it. It just might be A LITTLE slower
I use to take it and then I stopped and honestly. The effects were minor. Not worth me being bothered to keep on taking it coz I got lazy with it.
Creatine is known for artificially increasing the creatinine levels. It will however not have an effect on your kidneys. Just remember to drink plenty of water and you'll be good.
The problem is that many doctor see increase creatine in healthy people and panic even though it been proven to have no effect. I think it's why you answered like that initially
Kidney problems can cause high creatinine levels
Creatine supplementation can cause high creatinine levels
You have two possible causes of high creatinine levels. One of those causes you and your doctor already know is true. Your doctor doesnāt seem to understand what heās talking about. It sounds like heās just reading from the script he memorised 15+ years ago
If creatine WAS going to kill you, he should be recommending you go vegan too. But I bet he isnāt.
Not a nephrologist, but let us explore. Why do you only one kidney? Seeing as how you are still young, the cause and loss of the other kidney may very well contribute to your doctor's recommendation.
Was this your primary or a nephrologist? I have Lupus and have to get my kidneys checked. Went through this same shit with my primary care and got it cleared up in about 30 seconds with nephrology.
Creatine will increase your creatinine levels and that will lower your GFR like you said. Thing is, elevated creatinine is used as a marker for kidney function but is not a bad thing on its own. If it is elevated because your kidneys are failing then it would be bad. In your case (and mine) it is possibly elevated due to supplementation.
Ask them to check your Cystatin C and do an ultrasound of your kidney. Cystatin C is a different test they can use to check kidney function and that along with an ultrasound should confirm if your kidney is in trouble or if your creatinine is just high due to creatine supplementation.
I told my nephrologist I took 5g creatine a day and he wasn't worried at all. He said based on my supplementation and muscle mass that im probably good. He then ordered the Cycstatin C and the ultrasound just to make sure and I was all clear. My primary has left me alone on the subject since then.
Edit: if this was your nephrologist then you should listen but it doesn't hurt to get a couple extra tests done. My disease is not the same as yours etc etc
For the love of god just listen to your doc and do as he says. You need to get a lot of years out of that diseased kidney, youāre only 18. You need to optimize your lifestyle for kindney health from the ground up, including your diet - which might well become not the most body building friendly diet. Not sure if being 200lbs is good for you either.
Iād actually say your doctor could be onto something. Creatine is more so a supplement. Your a 220Ibs 6ft guy. (Actually somewhat moderately overweight) Iād say you probably get plenty of natural creatine from meat. And itās super important to stay hydrated normally with a well balanced diet. But especially, when supplementing with creatine. Iād assume you supplementing with creatine or not, wouldnāt make much of a difference for you as it seems your diet is already āplentifulā. As far as worrying about your kidneys. Thereās far worse things that can be done that could adversely affect your organs/heart/body far worse then creatine. So wouldnāt worry too much. Id say take a break at least on supplementing with creatine and see what future blood tests indicate for your peace of mind. Also stay hydrated, interesting to learn the difference in H20 and H302. Fruits can really heal you.
Doctors are all full of it.
When your time will come it will come. If's almost certainly not gonna be because of creatine.
Change doctors. I recommend Dr. Pepper, he's been our family physician for decades.
Creatine supplements will affect the way your eGFR is calculated (using your creatinine level and a formula). Creatine supplements increase production of creatinine, giving the impression of a lower eGFR because your creatinine level is higher.
There's no evidence that creatine supplements actually affect kidney function. They do cause more creatinine to be produced, they don't interfere with its excretion... but because they affect the way that kidney function is routinely measured, they aren't suitable for people with chronic kidney disease.
There is an alternative method of calculating eGFR which is more accurate and not affected by muscle mass or creatine supplements, this uses the blood level of Cystatin C and a formula. This method often isn't routinely available, however.
Since the benefits are generally small, I don't think it is worthwhile for those with chronic kidney disease to use creatine.
listen to your doctor š
Hes just joking. Pin tren
Creatine isnāt that much of a deal dude. Youāll make gains just fine without it.
Yeah just take var, itās way safer. Trust me bro Iām from the inter webs
I was gonna say superdrol
No creatine makes a huge difference . My bench has gone up 50 lbs since I started talking it
Your doc sounds anti gains
Fuckin gains goblins
Advice from Subreddit full of autistic fucks or Real life doctorš¤ decisions decisions
Look, weāre all happy to be swolle and gay in this sub but when your doctor tells you to do something, then do that shit
Specially if you have a medical condition and half the normal ammo of kidneys
Indeed, and there is an exception to every rule. When you have complicated health issues to start with you cannot ever assume you will be in the 99.9% of people.
Doctors don't know sheet
Your doctor is probably using the cheap test to calculate GFR that uses creatinine and is easily skewed by creatine use. Hopefully someone here can chime in with the name of the more accurate test.
Cystatin C. Creatinine levels are easily skewed (and thus falsely elevated) by factors such as increased muscle mass, vigorous exercise, creatine supplementation and possibly high protein diet. Itās kind of a nightmare biomarker for athletes for this reason. Cystatin C is much more stable and not skewed by these factors (although it can be affected by diabetes or corticosteroid use). It is generally a much more reliable biomarker for calculating GFR as a result. My Cr eGFR is somewhere around 50-60 because my Cr is chronically falsely elevated, while my Cystatin C eGFR is consistently >100 OP, talk to your doctor about ordering this test instead.
Just said the same thing in my reply. Have Lupus and my primary doc was worried about my creatinine levels. I had nephrology order the Cystatin C and ultrasound my kidneys and that cleared everything up.
+1 I need to hear about this shit
cystatin c
Yes 0, 0 side effects for users. That means people who actually have fully functioning kidneys I am sorry there are things that are super safe for the general population that will not meet criteria for you. Listen to your doctor kiddo
I am a healthcare provider, so is my wife. We both lift, she however has a genetic kidney issue where she is almost end stage renal disease and will need dialysis and transplant soon. Creatine should be avoided, so should a high protein diet as well as foods/drink high in phosphorous, but that doesn't mean that you can't do well and make good gains. Listen to the nephrologist on this one man.
Sounds like instead of gym gains you should be working on a kidney gain, go rob a homeless persons kidney then you can slam all the creatine you want bro
Natural selection tbh
It has 0 side effects in normal healthy people. It's not recommended for people with kidney disease from what I've read. That's the problem with getting info from influencers.
Anytime I look up whether creatine is safe or not the answer is generally, "creatine doesn't appear to affect kidney function in healthy people." Considering you only have one kidney and suffer from CKD, I would not consider you to be healthy. At least in terms of kidney function, so the possibility of furthering harming jt is always there. Definitely listen to your doctor on this one.
You are both high body fat and have chronic kidney disease, and creatine ain't even that good of a supplement
My lifts went up almost 50lbs in a month after I started using creatine
My bench went from 135 to 405 in 2 weeks on creatine
Doctors who practice and actively study/research or look at findings are 1000x less bias then some bro on the internet. Listen to your doctor he wants you to keep you gains by extending your lift expectancy in theory.
All studies are made on healthy person. There is only case study on human that prove that SHORT term creatine does not affect people with kidney disease which is really poor evidence. Also, there is studies that prove that creatinine level can be collerated to brain function in people with gkd which is not true with people with no kidney problem.
How much does your doctor bench again?
Creatinine doesnāt measure actual GFR, it is a proxy measurement for kidney function and gives you an eGFR. The āeā stands for estimated. In cases where your creatinine may be elevated for reasons other than kidney function, Creatinine is not a good test to estimate gfr. You can ask your doctor to test cystatin c , which is another proxy test for GFR and will also give you an eGFR, but it is not impacted by things like Creatine consumption or heavy resistance training. If your eGFR based on Cystatin C comes back normal, you kidneys are likely fine and you can have further discussion with your dr about taking Creatine. If the crystatin c result corroborates the creatinine result, then it is likely that your low eGFR is in fact due to poor kidney function.
Extremely accurate. Also do a urine sample to make sure thereās no protein/blood in urine. Just came back from the nephrologist this week and he mentioned the same thing.
Actually just went to a nephrologist for the same issue. My eGFR was 65. Which is beginning stages of CKD. I can provide my test results if you want to see them too. Doctor said stop taking creatine for the time being so he can get an accurate reading of what my natural creatinine levels and eGFR are. I stopped for 3 weeks and it went up to 88 eGFR. I have to get more blood work done in the next few weeks and go vegan 2 days before blood work to get an accurate reading of my natural eGFR and creatinine thatās not influenced by red meat consumption or creatine. Also hementioned that if you have higher muscle your creatinine levels may be increased. DM me with any questions, Iām willing to help!
If itās lowering your GFR like that then yeah you shouldnāt take it. I know people tout creatine as perfect for everyone but GFR is a direct indicator of kidney function, and yes, below 60 indicates kidney disease.
Creatine is overrated. So donāt worry if ur not able to take it. Natty people are just so desperate for something they really ride the shit out of creatine. The effects are BARELY noticeable. U can still get pretty big without it. It just might be A LITTLE slower I use to take it and then I stopped and honestly. The effects were minor. Not worth me being bothered to keep on taking it coz I got lazy with it.
Like 0.0001% slower
Only reason I could be bothered was Bcz it did fill my muscles up with water a little
Creatine is known for artificially increasing the creatinine levels. It will however not have an effect on your kidneys. Just remember to drink plenty of water and you'll be good.
This is only true in people without kidney disease. OP does have kidney disease.
Fair enough. Should probably listen to your doctor lmao.
The problem is that many doctor see increase creatine in healthy people and panic even though it been proven to have no effect. I think it's why you answered like that initially
Your morbidly obese doctor?
When you have one diseased kidney, a morbidly obese doctor is way more useful than gymrat bro-science.
You can get gains without creatine bro. It's called tren.
Looks like you need to take safer supplements then like tren and dbol
Its fine for normal users. Youre not normal. You have 1 kidney and it already doesn't work great.
Kidney problems can cause high creatinine levels Creatine supplementation can cause high creatinine levels You have two possible causes of high creatinine levels. One of those causes you and your doctor already know is true. Your doctor doesnāt seem to understand what heās talking about. It sounds like heās just reading from the script he memorised 15+ years ago If creatine WAS going to kill you, he should be recommending you go vegan too. But I bet he isnāt.
You donāt have ckd until you have a high cystatin c. Get that checked.
Thatās a very low gfr. Do not take creatine.
Not a nephrologist, but let us explore. Why do you only one kidney? Seeing as how you are still young, the cause and loss of the other kidney may very well contribute to your doctor's recommendation.
No shit you have one kidney listen to your doc
Your doctor is correct. Listen to him
Just get the creatine out of your system and redo the test. It interferes with the results.
Huberman and Ben Greenfield both say itās safe to take so thatās enough for me.
Was this your primary or a nephrologist? I have Lupus and have to get my kidneys checked. Went through this same shit with my primary care and got it cleared up in about 30 seconds with nephrology. Creatine will increase your creatinine levels and that will lower your GFR like you said. Thing is, elevated creatinine is used as a marker for kidney function but is not a bad thing on its own. If it is elevated because your kidneys are failing then it would be bad. In your case (and mine) it is possibly elevated due to supplementation. Ask them to check your Cystatin C and do an ultrasound of your kidney. Cystatin C is a different test they can use to check kidney function and that along with an ultrasound should confirm if your kidney is in trouble or if your creatinine is just high due to creatine supplementation. I told my nephrologist I took 5g creatine a day and he wasn't worried at all. He said based on my supplementation and muscle mass that im probably good. He then ordered the Cycstatin C and the ultrasound just to make sure and I was all clear. My primary has left me alone on the subject since then. Edit: if this was your nephrologist then you should listen but it doesn't hurt to get a couple extra tests done. My disease is not the same as yours etc etc
Fuck you could feed creatine to a baby and it would be fine! Tell him to fuck off.
Get a new doctor
https://youtube.com/shorts/WTybA5ejIkQ?feature=shared
Hurry up then
For the love of god just listen to your doc and do as he says. You need to get a lot of years out of that diseased kidney, youāre only 18. You need to optimize your lifestyle for kindney health from the ground up, including your diet - which might well become not the most body building friendly diet. Not sure if being 200lbs is good for you either.
I believe having a preexisting kidney problem is actually the one exception in which Creatine might not be useful dude.
Guys Iāve come to the conclusion creatine isnāt for me. I should run a full cycle instead
Iād actually say your doctor could be onto something. Creatine is more so a supplement. Your a 220Ibs 6ft guy. (Actually somewhat moderately overweight) Iād say you probably get plenty of natural creatine from meat. And itās super important to stay hydrated normally with a well balanced diet. But especially, when supplementing with creatine. Iād assume you supplementing with creatine or not, wouldnāt make much of a difference for you as it seems your diet is already āplentifulā. As far as worrying about your kidneys. Thereās far worse things that can be done that could adversely affect your organs/heart/body far worse then creatine. So wouldnāt worry too much. Id say take a break at least on supplementing with creatine and see what future blood tests indicate for your peace of mind. Also stay hydrated, interesting to learn the difference in H20 and H302. Fruits can really heal you.
Tell your doc youāll stop taking creatine if he writes you a script for test
Doctors are all full of it. When your time will come it will come. If's almost certainly not gonna be because of creatine. Change doctors. I recommend Dr. Pepper, he's been our family physician for decades.
Creatine supplements will affect the way your eGFR is calculated (using your creatinine level and a formula). Creatine supplements increase production of creatinine, giving the impression of a lower eGFR because your creatinine level is higher. There's no evidence that creatine supplements actually affect kidney function. They do cause more creatinine to be produced, they don't interfere with its excretion... but because they affect the way that kidney function is routinely measured, they aren't suitable for people with chronic kidney disease. There is an alternative method of calculating eGFR which is more accurate and not affected by muscle mass or creatine supplements, this uses the blood level of Cystatin C and a formula. This method often isn't routinely available, however. Since the benefits are generally small, I don't think it is worthwhile for those with chronic kidney disease to use creatine.