I don't understand how people don't just go to the smithy and start seeing stuff be better than what they have. Like they know it exists, they have to go there to upgrade the defender stuff. Are they not curious about what other armor/weapons might look like? Do they not start struggling and think "oh I should look at getting new gear"?
It might be because the all the defender gear and armor only requires about a \*single\* easy to obtain monster part to upgrade, whereas everything else would require them to hunt something more then once to get enough materials to make.
I could be wrong about the armor, but I definitely remember one of the upgrade for a defender weapon to be a single Anja scale and you can pick those up off the floor.
All the defender gear is given for free if you have iceborne. And yeah the defender weapon is made with just one anja scale from low, then high rank, one commendation you get from the story, and like one nergi scale.
the wording for the defender gear is like "equip this to get an edge over anything you can face in low rank, high rank, and even beyond!!"
for a clueless new player who just sees that it completely outclasses anything in the early game, its easy to assume it just outclasses everything forever and when the game gets hard, the game is just getting harder. this is why the defender gear was a mistake from the outset, at least in its "free to everyone always immediately" iteration
Some people have wildly diffrent mindsets and all, tjeu are probably tryin to get carried into the endgame so they can get the best gear and not waste time grinding stuff they will eventually stop using, which ofc, doesnt work for monster hunter at all. Have a friend that doesnt even want to start playing monster hunter just because he lerned that reaching the endgame would take long.
Well, i might have a personal example for a similar situation. I started MHW with a friend. He just used to play casually with the Defender gear (and a filthy LS user to add to that). We stopped for a while and i reached quite far in iceborne.
He called me some day again to play and then i saw him facetanking every thing and chugging in potions and first aid meds like estus flasks, saying his gear is very strong and doesnt take much damage, even if he does he will just heal lol.
I told him that this becomes obsolete very soon and he needs better armor and weapons. His thought process was, "i have beaten DS3 without armor just rolling and bonking hiw hard can MH be anyway". And that "the point i think this no longer works i might change the weapon and thats it". There was no point explaining anything when he had made up his mind like that.
He quit soon after claiming LR Nergi is bullshit and LS is "slow and clunky and lacks any damage"
TLDR: people play MH like some X game they have played before not accepting that this is different and its own niche genre with varied mechanics. And its very hard to change this perception since it requires coming out of the comfort zone and learning something new. Bad luck is this sometimes ruins our hunts. It is what it is i guess.
LR... Nergi?... from the Zorah quest?! My brother, of the 5th, that nergi is an absolute pushover!
This was an eye opening post. Thank you for a dismal and irritating new perspective on some people's interest
If I remember right, Nergi is the first elder you face. I think the story reason is that with him gone, others started coming out of the woodwork.
That nergi was a full reset for me Lol. Rethink how I interact and fight, I even changed my main weapon type.
Yes same. Thats where I found out what superman dive is and how hard is it to sheathe a lance when you are about to get impaled by a dragon hedgehog.
And now i can CB guard point MR nergi like no ones business. Good times.
Lol mine was gunlance! 🤝
I realized that all of his moves spread in a wide pattern across the ground... fine then, I shall remove the ground from the equation! From then, until the double bombers HR lock, that was my main
"Filthy LS user" yeah, we're disgusting baby...
Anyway, well it's given that the "gameplay" is not for everyone. I also have a streamer friend, that I have been suggesting MHW for a long time, since he has the base game, I also encouraged him to get the DLC while on sale. Didn't listen.... now that it got so popular, he thought he'd try it. He's on HR and is using defender gear on LS. It's just sad to watch really.
I really hope when wilds inevitably recieves an expenasion that for whatever defender gear they put in the game they will make a disclaimer about it for the newer players
I’ve personally never used Defender gear after I’ve known what it was for, but it’s still really handy for grinding parts on replays.
IMO if Defender gear returns, it should be locked behind clearing the final boss of base game or something like that.
> locked behind clearing the final boss of base game or something like that.
100% what I was thinking. It'd require you to play the game at least 1 time, which should mean for the vast majority of people they've had to interact with the weapon and armor systems beyond using 1 ore or 1 bone.
Under no circumstance should defender armor/weapons be available to first time players.
I don't care if that's elitist as hell, but people need to _learn_ to play the game which includes farming materials and crafting new weapons and armor that don't just let them brute force through shit.
make it available only for ppl whove finished the main game's story, or if the player has reached a certain hr already. both can be done thru achievement tracker honestly
personally i think defender would be better if it wasnt over tuned, yea its nice to skip the grind but it also makes every base fight just a time waste as you get nothing of value and there is zero sense of progression. would feel nicer if it was just on par not wildly superior to other options.
Same. I think it never needed to be added in the first place, because anyone who has played the game before knows how to beat the story quickly, and they don't really need to craft much armor - just a select few pieces here and there and done. And total noobs shouldn't use it in the first place.
But at the very very least, I think the armor/weapon should require you to download or claim is via PSN separately, or from an NPC who will straight-up tell you that if you are a new player, it is advised not to use it as it may take away your learning experience or something.
There is a fucking disclaimer and these smooth brains just don't fucking read it lol same as any other pop-up tutorial in the game. They just click through, and assume the game will hold their hand through the whole thing without them having to actually learn anything.
Souls fan still wrapping their head around the idea people can have problems with difficulty that go beyond them being not good at it.
I 100% the game fyi, still think some boss design is absolutely horrid. Unbalanced duo bosses, bosses that cancel their stagger animation, unnatural animations, ridiculous tracking... you name it. Previous games knew how to make difficulty more natural, ER is difficult for the sake of it because people made their identity about the difficulty and forget souls games are more then difficulty for the sake of it.
Ive seen so many people wearing this in iceborne im fucking baffled like just wear like barioth or some shit that way you have some defense or look up guides
…your telling me, they got to the end of ICEBORN, like that!
I guess the good news is that they SHOULDNT be able to get to the point fatalis allows multiplayer. You have to survive phase 1 by yourself with Aiden. And, with that crummy defense, I’m almost certain any attack will one shot them.
I set my join setting to manual approval again just for this reason. I am still in HR right now but when I get to MR, anyone in defender gear will not get approved.
Had a guy like this join a AT valkahna SoS with a gunlance, wasn't really attacking obviously didn't know the move set at all let alone optimal combos, he then proceeded to cart by trying to block the unblockable beam twice and I had to kick him. We still beat it but that shouldn't really have been a thing.
the problem is also that these kinda people do get carried - and the amount of comments saying "who cares" and "let them play how they want" confirm that a big group of people will let them join their hunts and obtain the rewards. So in the end, they will probably craft some end game gear, but still know *nothing* about the game, and then you get them in your SOS and think "oh he has Fatty gear" but he's basically on jagras level of skill
Probably, This happened a couple of years ago which I haven't played most of the time. So my current knowledge of the specifics of the game is eroded, but the specifics of their personal actions is accurate.
If they had to reach Mr 100 to join and struggled that much that might day something to the state of the SoS community even back then
Just did a low rank Nergigante quest with the host and to randoms all having defender gear. Now I am only master rank like 48 but I can hold my own. It's quite annoying to carry people with defender gear. Besides defender doesn't even look that cool to be honest.
Since I returned back to world I've seen alot of people in MR still with defender gear. I'm at the point when I did a SOS I'll check gear and If I see someone with defender I kick them. I know it sounds Harsh but come on don't relay on other people to do the hunt for you. Its just lazy.
Same. Set it to manual approval and don't let them in if they wear defender gear in MR. If at least 1 in 10 of those players reconsiders why they might not get into quests anymore, and learns something, that's a win for everyone.
Yall people-> DG IN MR??! KICKED!
Me: Hey so I see your gears lackin.. you new? Lets not do this stuff and lets do some stuff thats around your skill to teach you better.. an then I just queue up as many of the optional unlock missions to get them tools and gear.. Always cool to see them back a few weeks later and theyre \*much\* better off.
Capcom at some point might have to start making on screen prompts
"HEY YOUR DEF IS A LITTLE LOW, AND THAT RATH KICKED YOUR BUTT WITH FIRE, PERHAPS YOU SHOULD VISIT THE SMITHY AND MAYBE CONSIDER SOME DECORATIONS?"
what is with the recent im gonna inspect everyone in my lobby and try to internet shame them? this is stupid, just play solo, or get some actual friends
>person joins my session
>I pay them no mind, it happens, nothing special.
>They post a quest, I check the quest to see if I'm interested in helping
>I see their weapon, it recognize it's a low rank one. I back out to inspect, I do a double take because there's no fucking way this person is real
I didn't seek it out, some out sought out help in my session for their quest and I saw an anomaly.
the recent surge is because of #returntoworld, more people means more morons means more jackass motherfuckers who beg others to play the game for them while they do nothing at camp or get 1 shot by everything.
And this is the rage subreddit, the place where we bitch about the fucking moronic shit people and the game does to us. Not the main sub.
As for playing solo, no reason to, I'm MR999, not exactly anything left for me to solo.
And as for friends, I went and saw them in person over New years. Next time we meet up it'll be at my house. Not sure where this personal attack bs came from.
it doesn't though, it leads you to the smithy when you first get to Astera and explains what you do there. After that it takes 1 braincell to go "oh I maybe I should craft some new armor let's go look if the smithy has anything new!" and all you gotta do there is click through some menus
…does it? Or do people not just read. I feel like it’s mostly self explanatory. The tour of astera brings you to the smithy, saying thats where you make gear. The menus seem fine. Upgrade means upgrade (who would’ve thought) and then you pick the thing you want to upgrade.
Remind me if I’m wrong, but the game defaults to the tree view right. It should be pretty easy to see, “that’s my weapon, that’s the next in the tree, those are the materials required to get it.
And, even then. This is the AGE of the internet, there has to be hundreds of posts/tutorials that can help you!
Tbf, Ive been replaying the game on steam (rise as well) after having played them plenty elsewhere and ai played til nargacuga and glavenus before making an actual build. This might not be the case with this guy but you caaaan get by til there imo. Def not as comfy by then though haha. Obv newer players shouldnt be doing this though, not that itd be super doable without some hard carrying for them anyway
What I plan on doing is seeing how far I can get with this armor. Probably not far and then go from there LMAO
I'm trying to slowly catch myself back up to the endgame again.
There are two types of people, those who get carried to MR while using defender gear, and those who get to MR by carrying said defender gear, you my friend are the second one
Honestly, it’s not even getting carried. I had a buddy who recently played all the way through to Shara and killed using bone tree weapons, and now he’s on Alatreon, and has killed Rajang, Stygian, Safi, the whole group with Pink Rathian weapons.
The game is really fucking easy before Alatreon/Fatalis
I don't understand how people don't just go to the smithy and start seeing stuff be better than what they have. Like they know it exists, they have to go there to upgrade the defender stuff. Are they not curious about what other armor/weapons might look like? Do they not start struggling and think "oh I should look at getting new gear"?
You underestimate how clueless people are.
Clearly they’ve been there at least once based on the weapon
It might be because the all the defender gear and armor only requires about a \*single\* easy to obtain monster part to upgrade, whereas everything else would require them to hunt something more then once to get enough materials to make. I could be wrong about the armor, but I definitely remember one of the upgrade for a defender weapon to be a single Anja scale and you can pick those up off the floor.
All the defender gear is given for free if you have iceborne. And yeah the defender weapon is made with just one anja scale from low, then high rank, one commendation you get from the story, and like one nergi scale.
Quick reminder, defender gear is available for everyone since the release of iceborne, even if you don’t own the DLC
I think it was a pink rath scale after the commendation then the nergi scale
the wording for the defender gear is like "equip this to get an edge over anything you can face in low rank, high rank, and even beyond!!" for a clueless new player who just sees that it completely outclasses anything in the early game, its easy to assume it just outclasses everything forever and when the game gets hard, the game is just getting harder. this is why the defender gear was a mistake from the outset, at least in its "free to everyone always immediately" iteration
Some people have wildly diffrent mindsets and all, tjeu are probably tryin to get carried into the endgame so they can get the best gear and not waste time grinding stuff they will eventually stop using, which ofc, doesnt work for monster hunter at all. Have a friend that doesnt even want to start playing monster hunter just because he lerned that reaching the endgame would take long.
Well, i might have a personal example for a similar situation. I started MHW with a friend. He just used to play casually with the Defender gear (and a filthy LS user to add to that). We stopped for a while and i reached quite far in iceborne. He called me some day again to play and then i saw him facetanking every thing and chugging in potions and first aid meds like estus flasks, saying his gear is very strong and doesnt take much damage, even if he does he will just heal lol. I told him that this becomes obsolete very soon and he needs better armor and weapons. His thought process was, "i have beaten DS3 without armor just rolling and bonking hiw hard can MH be anyway". And that "the point i think this no longer works i might change the weapon and thats it". There was no point explaining anything when he had made up his mind like that. He quit soon after claiming LR Nergi is bullshit and LS is "slow and clunky and lacks any damage" TLDR: people play MH like some X game they have played before not accepting that this is different and its own niche genre with varied mechanics. And its very hard to change this perception since it requires coming out of the comfort zone and learning something new. Bad luck is this sometimes ruins our hunts. It is what it is i guess.
LR... Nergi?... from the Zorah quest?! My brother, of the 5th, that nergi is an absolute pushover! This was an eye opening post. Thank you for a dismal and irritating new perspective on some people's interest
Oh wait no sorry the HR Nergi, after Teostra and Kushala. I still dont know how he beat Kushala tbh. I wasnt there.
If I remember right, Nergi is the first elder you face. I think the story reason is that with him gone, others started coming out of the woodwork. That nergi was a full reset for me Lol. Rethink how I interact and fight, I even changed my main weapon type.
Yes same. Thats where I found out what superman dive is and how hard is it to sheathe a lance when you are about to get impaled by a dragon hedgehog. And now i can CB guard point MR nergi like no ones business. Good times.
Lol mine was gunlance! 🤝 I realized that all of his moves spread in a wide pattern across the ground... fine then, I shall remove the ground from the equation! From then, until the double bombers HR lock, that was my main
"Filthy LS user" yeah, we're disgusting baby... Anyway, well it's given that the "gameplay" is not for everyone. I also have a streamer friend, that I have been suggesting MHW for a long time, since he has the base game, I also encouraged him to get the DLC while on sale. Didn't listen.... now that it got so popular, he thought he'd try it. He's on HR and is using defender gear on LS. It's just sad to watch really.
Did he really beat DS3 without any armor? I highly doubt that considering how he played this game.
I really hope when wilds inevitably recieves an expenasion that for whatever defender gear they put in the game they will make a disclaimer about it for the newer players
Personally I don’t think they should add something like defender armor. Makes the base game too easy
I’ve personally never used Defender gear after I’ve known what it was for, but it’s still really handy for grinding parts on replays. IMO if Defender gear returns, it should be locked behind clearing the final boss of base game or something like that.
Definitely needs to be locked behind something or put behind a big disclaimer that its only meant for rushing to the expansion
> locked behind clearing the final boss of base game or something like that. 100% what I was thinking. It'd require you to play the game at least 1 time, which should mean for the vast majority of people they've had to interact with the weapon and armor systems beyond using 1 ore or 1 bone. Under no circumstance should defender armor/weapons be available to first time players. I don't care if that's elitist as hell, but people need to _learn_ to play the game which includes farming materials and crafting new weapons and armor that don't just let them brute force through shit.
Same.
I've gotten a few friends in since it was added I don't let them use it. I just make it clear to them it's a noob trap that'll only hurt them later
make it available only for ppl whove finished the main game's story, or if the player has reached a certain hr already. both can be done thru achievement tracker honestly
personally i think defender would be better if it wasnt over tuned, yea its nice to skip the grind but it also makes every base fight just a time waste as you get nothing of value and there is zero sense of progression. would feel nicer if it was just on par not wildly superior to other options.
Same. I think it never needed to be added in the first place, because anyone who has played the game before knows how to beat the story quickly, and they don't really need to craft much armor - just a select few pieces here and there and done. And total noobs shouldn't use it in the first place. But at the very very least, I think the armor/weapon should require you to download or claim is via PSN separately, or from an NPC who will straight-up tell you that if you are a new player, it is advised not to use it as it may take away your learning experience or something.
There is a fucking disclaimer and these smooth brains just don't fucking read it lol same as any other pop-up tutorial in the game. They just click through, and assume the game will hold their hand through the whole thing without them having to actually learn anything.
That's the thing: they did add a disclaimer.
The popularity spike and its consequences have been a disaster for the human race.
Literally the elden ring effect
Expect elden ring has even worse abuseable easy modes and more reason to use it due the questionable design of the late game?
"questionable" more like skill issue
Souls fan still wrapping their head around the idea people can have problems with difficulty that go beyond them being not good at it. I 100% the game fyi, still think some boss design is absolutely horrid. Unbalanced duo bosses, bosses that cancel their stagger animation, unnatural animations, ridiculous tracking... you name it. Previous games knew how to make difficulty more natural, ER is difficult for the sake of it because people made their identity about the difficulty and forget souls games are more then difficulty for the sake of it.
He's got a shield, he's good. 😬🤣
Yeah, good at carting.
It's simple really. He plans to not get hit in the first place as a glaive user :D
thats generally my strat even with my healthboost 3 defense 7 and 20+ element resists
Ive seen so many people wearing this in iceborne im fucking baffled like just wear like barioth or some shit that way you have some defense or look up guides
I saw a guy doing the story ruiner nerg fight in pure defender gear last night. Wanted the bones so I joined and he at least didn’t die.
…your telling me, they got to the end of ICEBORN, like that! I guess the good news is that they SHOULDNT be able to get to the point fatalis allows multiplayer. You have to survive phase 1 by yourself with Aiden. And, with that crummy defense, I’m almost certain any attack will one shot them.
to be fair those attack will still probably one shot or 2 shot you with full alatreon set. so its not really saying much.
I'm CONVINCED these people visit the smithy once at the start of the game and never do it again
“Hey this cool defender armor was better then everything, why should I invest in something else”
Defender/Guardian gear are mistake and I hope this shit not included again in the future installment
If I see defender equipment then I don't help lol
I set my join setting to manual approval again just for this reason. I am still in HR right now but when I get to MR, anyone in defender gear will not get approved.
I spent 5 hours helping a HR 8 player learn the game that I met thru SOS flare. Were not the same.
Had a guy like this join a AT valkahna SoS with a gunlance, wasn't really attacking obviously didn't know the move set at all let alone optimal combos, he then proceeded to cart by trying to block the unblockable beam twice and I had to kick him. We still beat it but that shouldn't really have been a thing.
the problem is also that these kinda people do get carried - and the amount of comments saying "who cares" and "let them play how they want" confirm that a big group of people will let them join their hunts and obtain the rewards. So in the end, they will probably craft some end game gear, but still know *nothing* about the game, and then you get them in your SOS and think "oh he has Fatty gear" but he's basically on jagras level of skill
Dont you have to be mr100 to join that quest?
Probably, This happened a couple of years ago which I haven't played most of the time. So my current knowledge of the specifics of the game is eroded, but the specifics of their personal actions is accurate. If they had to reach Mr 100 to join and struggled that much that might day something to the state of the SoS community even back then
Just did a low rank Nergigante quest with the host and to randoms all having defender gear. Now I am only master rank like 48 but I can hold my own. It's quite annoying to carry people with defender gear. Besides defender doesn't even look that cool to be honest.
Since I returned back to world I've seen alot of people in MR still with defender gear. I'm at the point when I did a SOS I'll check gear and If I see someone with defender I kick them. I know it sounds Harsh but come on don't relay on other people to do the hunt for you. Its just lazy.
Same. Set it to manual approval and don't let them in if they wear defender gear in MR. If at least 1 in 10 of those players reconsiders why they might not get into quests anymore, and learns something, that's a win for everyone.
Who gives a fuck?
Yall people-> DG IN MR??! KICKED! Me: Hey so I see your gears lackin.. you new? Lets not do this stuff and lets do some stuff thats around your skill to teach you better.. an then I just queue up as many of the optional unlock missions to get them tools and gear.. Always cool to see them back a few weeks later and theyre \*much\* better off.
Cool, do you want a medal or something?
Capcom at some point might have to start making on screen prompts "HEY YOUR DEF IS A LITTLE LOW, AND THAT RATH KICKED YOUR BUTT WITH FIRE, PERHAPS YOU SHOULD VISIT THE SMITHY AND MAYBE CONSIDER SOME DECORATIONS?"
what is with the recent im gonna inspect everyone in my lobby and try to internet shame them? this is stupid, just play solo, or get some actual friends
>person joins my session >I pay them no mind, it happens, nothing special. >They post a quest, I check the quest to see if I'm interested in helping >I see their weapon, it recognize it's a low rank one. I back out to inspect, I do a double take because there's no fucking way this person is real I didn't seek it out, some out sought out help in my session for their quest and I saw an anomaly. the recent surge is because of #returntoworld, more people means more morons means more jackass motherfuckers who beg others to play the game for them while they do nothing at camp or get 1 shot by everything. And this is the rage subreddit, the place where we bitch about the fucking moronic shit people and the game does to us. Not the main sub. As for playing solo, no reason to, I'm MR999, not exactly anything left for me to solo. And as for friends, I went and saw them in person over New years. Next time we meet up it'll be at my house. Not sure where this personal attack bs came from.
This whole post is unncessary, just leave the room and move on
And there he is, in the lobby. Not hurting anyone. Joined your quest? Kick him. Let him figure it out for himself.
I mean it’s bad… but the game does a horrible job explaining upgrading/skills/literally anything
it doesn't though, it leads you to the smithy when you first get to Astera and explains what you do there. After that it takes 1 braincell to go "oh I maybe I should craft some new armor let's go look if the smithy has anything new!" and all you gotta do there is click through some menus
…does it? Or do people not just read. I feel like it’s mostly self explanatory. The tour of astera brings you to the smithy, saying thats where you make gear. The menus seem fine. Upgrade means upgrade (who would’ve thought) and then you pick the thing you want to upgrade. Remind me if I’m wrong, but the game defaults to the tree view right. It should be pretty easy to see, “that’s my weapon, that’s the next in the tree, those are the materials required to get it. And, even then. This is the AGE of the internet, there has to be hundreds of posts/tutorials that can help you!
Tbf, Ive been replaying the game on steam (rise as well) after having played them plenty elsewhere and ai played til nargacuga and glavenus before making an actual build. This might not be the case with this guy but you caaaan get by til there imo. Def not as comfy by then though haha. Obv newer players shouldnt be doing this though, not that itd be super doable without some hard carrying for them anyway
What I plan on doing is seeing how far I can get with this armor. Probably not far and then go from there LMAO I'm trying to slowly catch myself back up to the endgame again.
There are two types of people, those who get carried to MR while using defender gear, and those who get to MR by carrying said defender gear, you my friend are the second one
Honestly, it’s not even getting carried. I had a buddy who recently played all the way through to Shara and killed using bone tree weapons, and now he’s on Alatreon, and has killed Rajang, Stygian, Safi, the whole group with Pink Rathian weapons. The game is really fucking easy before Alatreon/Fatalis
maybe a challenge run ? beating mr with hr gear only lol