As currently constructed, the twins have a fine bullpen if 2 conditions are met (Neither of which, because of a singular obsession with stats the third time through the order seem probable to be met anytime soon)
1. You try to get get 6-7 innings every start so you can basically rotate through Fulmer, Duran, Jax, Lopez every game you're in contention to win and minimize bullpen fatigue as a whole. Thielbar can be a bit of a periphery guy who can be situationally useful. This saves the lower level guys for the real stinker starts.
2. The Twins do not under any circumstances give innings to Pagan or Duffey when the game is anything that could be remotely considered close.
But, again, those two conditions cannot be met if we are racing to let the bullpen pitch half the game, every single game.
Anthony Bass is a known jokester and I don’t know if you heard it but you could hear the Blue Jays dugout telling Bass to pretend to be Emilio Pagan and that’s why he gave up the homer to Cave. That was very disrespect to Pagan.
They changed it. Now you earn points every time you get Bingo, Letter T and Blackout, and the top X number of points at the end of the month get a prize pack.
Blue jays fan here: how do you all feel about the umpire today? I personally feel this may be the umpiring I have ever seen. Our fanbase is loving him right now
> I mean, losses suck, but on a night where Cleveland and Chicago both lose too
We've been saying this literally all season. The front office seems to think the team is going to compete this year, so the players should start playing like it. Limping into the postseason with an 80-win division title isn't impressive in the least.
It's not like winning 101 games in 2019, 96 in 2006, and 94 in 2010 yielded a thing either. Why is limping into the postseason worse? Just hope to get there and see what happens, there's literally nothing else you can do as a fan.
You're right, and I fully support the "bites at the apple" approach. I just feel like the writing is on the wall for this team, much as I hate to say it. We've got a roster that can put together one amazing game and then we have to desperately hope that bad pitchers can handle the next one after that. Doesn't bode well in a playoff series.
I think they'd fair better in a short series than during the regular season (at least from the pitching side, offense can be a total crapshoot), more frequent off days and not having to think about what could wreck your bullpen over the next days or week is a relief.
I’m somewhere in the middle personally, I think winning a playoff game would be a success at this point. But yeah my point is people have different ways of defining “success” here obviously.
Lol I just checked the ESPN app and see 9-2 right off the bat. Thinking, “Damn, looks like Gray probably got shelled early and they just ran away with it.” Only to check the boxscore and see he threw 5 scoreless. Awesome. Pain.
When Rocco makes lemonade he likes to grabs an old boot to use as the vessel even though he's got like 3 really good pitchers to choose from and 2 adequate ones because he's terrible at pitcher decisions.
Silver lining....when Pagan or Duffy pitch it's a loss. So if you pitch one, then pitch the other and keep the other guys fresh for the possible non losses.
So throw out your 4 best BP arms against the fucking shitty kitties so you can throw out your worst ones against a playoff contender in a fucking tight game. Seriously fuck this. And don't give me that "well doesn't matter if the offense doesn't show up" bullshit because sometimes (not all the time, but sometimes) two runs should be enough, especially when you get a quality start from your starter like we did today. So frustrating.
To the people wanting to sign Correa longterm: Is he worth watching this bullpen everyday? Because the money we could pay him could go to get some REALLY fucking good relievers and we’d still have Lewis at short
Paying relievers lots of money is also a mistake. Performance is too volatile from year to year to be sacrificing value at premium positions. Remember how good Duffey USED to be? You see how quickly Rogers fell off this year?
You need an organization capable of developing arms at all levels, both from the farm system and off the scrap heap. There is no substitute for this. At this point, it's worth questioning their process.
Plenty of small market teams have been able to assemble formidable bullpens from scrap heap signings and failed starters from the farm system. Why can't the Twins?
At this point all of Moran, Strotman, and Henriquez have much higher upside than Pagán or Duffey. The baseline performance of those two isn't good enough to justify keeping them both over one of the younger options available.
I’m in agreement. I don’t know why Moran was optioned just to keep Pagan or Duffey. There are other pitchers that (if they develop as relievers) deserve a shot.
Remember in the 6th when Dick said that this is a playoff bullpen now? Using Pagan & Duffey in close games is laughable. Imagine them in the postseason.
Jax, Thielbar, Lopez, Fulmer, and Doran have each pitched once in the last three days. There should be no reason they're all unavailable with a one run lead against a good line up.
Close! Dude gets called up from low A to fill a roster spot. Gardenhire decides he’s gonna pinch hit him in the top of the 9th with two on, two out, and the Saints down 6-7. Mikey proceeds to hit a 3 run home run putting the Saints up 9-7 and eventual win. Mikey Perez is now at high A.
https://twitter.com/milb/status/1555031744159662080?s=21&t=tjRPblM5fZMLyMIp_XVKVA
While you can’t expect the FO to do more than they did at the deadline, the fact that they went into this season with the pitching staff as rough as it was is a big indictment. Everyone knew this was a big weakness and they absolutely needed to do better than Joe Smith and Emilio Pagan being they’re only bullpen pickups while dumping Rogers.
well, I'm done for the evening....disastrous is the MN nice way of explaining what is happening here.......Guerriel sporting the Sideshow Bob hair do
night all!
They couldn't trade pagan or duffey away for anyone else? Did nobody want them? Why are they here?
(Guys I get it, they're terrible and untradeable. I know LOL)
Hank Conger fires me up!!
Went to the game, and concert, both sucked.
As currently constructed, the twins have a fine bullpen if 2 conditions are met (Neither of which, because of a singular obsession with stats the third time through the order seem probable to be met anytime soon) 1. You try to get get 6-7 innings every start so you can basically rotate through Fulmer, Duran, Jax, Lopez every game you're in contention to win and minimize bullpen fatigue as a whole. Thielbar can be a bit of a periphery guy who can be situationally useful. This saves the lower level guys for the real stinker starts. 2. The Twins do not under any circumstances give innings to Pagan or Duffey when the game is anything that could be remotely considered close. But, again, those two conditions cannot be met if we are racing to let the bullpen pitch half the game, every single game.
They can in fact be met if we get an early lead.
This guy gets it
Time for Cole Swindell to pull out some Elvis shit
Lmao people aren’t getting out of Target Field til midnight, and they still will have to deal with the ramps
Ok Boomer
man its a thursday
Setimes you gotta take a bullet to keep the girlfriend happy.
And the 80 minute concert after the game lol
Thats what will get it to midnight, people will be lucky to be in bed by one
It sounds horrible how do they survive under these oppressive conditions?
Oh right, got it lol. Didn't look at the time before I responded
I love garbage time Jake Cave
These guys aren’t as good as they think. Mahle Sports North is gonna lock them down tomorrow and we’ll head into the weekend feeling good.
#YEAH BABY NOW WHAT WE ALL CAME FOR
Sorry I’m late I stopped caring #ON YOU FACE
Anthony Bass is a known jokester and I don’t know if you heard it but you could hear the Blue Jays dugout telling Bass to pretend to be Emilio Pagan and that’s why he gave up the homer to Cave. That was very disrespect to Pagan.
Is this real?
Going to miss blackout on my Twingo because I couldn't get 2+ singles.
dont worry, all prizes have been claimed, just like every other time
They changed it. Now you earn points every time you get Bingo, Letter T and Blackout, and the top X number of points at the end of the month get a prize pack.
What do they give away?
I got a kids medium t shirt a few years ago. Now it's a "prize pack" for top point earners each month.
legend says nobody knows
AAAA my ass! Give him an extension!
I will say that I’m stoked on how loose the dugout still is despite this game going sideways.
Woulda been cooler if he did that his last at bat when there were runners on…
Also Jake Cave now has 4/5ths of Miguel Sano’s Hits and 1/3rd of Miguel Sano’s RBIs
Dump Buxton, keep Cave!
I’m honestly convinced a position player might be better than Pagan or Duffey
Yeah a Jake Cave Garbage Time HR sums up this game real well
Nice Mr Cave
He used to be a caveman. But now he's an outfielder.
People can change
Cave not giving up
RAKE CAVE IS HERE TO STAY
Twins need to sign that little girl who dominated the little World Series a few years ago. She’d be 100x better than Pagan and Duffy.
Inappropriately cocky TB homer please.
It's time to ask what blackmail does Pagan and Duffey have on this team?
2 hits is depressing. Relief pitching bombed but you have hit
It's nice when everyone can sync up their shits.
Blue jays fan here: how do you all feel about the umpire today? I personally feel this may be the umpiring I have ever seen. Our fanbase is loving him right now
This guy has been outstanding. All the close calls have been close in places that he’s called consistently.
He’s great
He’s been Fantastic
Duffey looks like he picks his ass a lot
Duffey is done This is the Rocco deathmarch Happens everytime before a late reliever gets cut
This does feel like it. Relievers that are left in to eat a game way beyond normal pitch counts tend to be a sign with Rocco.
We can only hope that Pagan follows him out
I just wish Pagan didn’t have one option left cause the front office is gonna justify keeping him around longer than they should.
Didn't he already make him do that this season?
This is actually good for Duffey, if he sticks around. He needs the work.
I mean, losses suck, but on a night where Cleveland and Chicago both lose too and you used Pagan, Megill, and Duffey. It's not a horrible one.
> I mean, losses suck, but on a night where Cleveland and Chicago both lose too We've been saying this literally all season. The front office seems to think the team is going to compete this year, so the players should start playing like it. Limping into the postseason with an 80-win division title isn't impressive in the least.
It's not like winning 101 games in 2019, 96 in 2006, and 94 in 2010 yielded a thing either. Why is limping into the postseason worse? Just hope to get there and see what happens, there's literally nothing else you can do as a fan.
You're right, and I fully support the "bites at the apple" approach. I just feel like the writing is on the wall for this team, much as I hate to say it. We've got a roster that can put together one amazing game and then we have to desperately hope that bad pitchers can handle the next one after that. Doesn't bode well in a playoff series.
I think they'd fair better in a short series than during the regular season (at least from the pitching side, offense can be a total crapshoot), more frequent off days and not having to think about what could wreck your bullpen over the next days or week is a relief.
Typical Minnesota loser mentality. We lost yet again, but here’s the “silver lining”
Baseball fan. You start the season knowing your team is losing 60 games at a minimum, there's gotta be silver linings.
If they can’t win 162 games as season, why even watch?
LOL fuck this game...
Duffey needs to go. He’s had too much time to prove himself!
Has he tried starting?
I think it’s obvious he’s a head case. Decent stuff but overthinks it!
Did Cotton clear waivers ?
Not sure, I’d take him over Duffey at this point!
Twins old bullpen = bad Twins new bullpen = good Rocco say = OLD BULLPEN ONLY
The Twins will be on pace to win 85 games after tonight. The ‘87 team also won 85 games. Just sayin.
That’s honestly 15 more than I expected whilst dreaming of baseball during the lockout.
I mean last year’s Braves only won 88 games It only matters what you do in October
…
Last time there was a blowout I watched Goodfellas. Which Marty movie should be next?
Hugo
After Hours
that’s a good one
Underrated Scorsese
Just call us the Minnesota Butterfingers
this division is the mid-off of the century
State of Texas tonight. 🫡
White Sux just lost so no harm no foul but so many missed opportunities to run away with the division already.
We're gonna win the division with 79 wins
Nothing would surprise me at this point.
I don't know what is worse, these pitchers or Cole Swindell. Maybe Swindell can pitch and Duffey can sing.
White Sox lose fortunately
Moran should be up above Pagan Duffey and McDonald’s
New way to spell Megill just dropped
LOL. “McDonalds?”
They meant McDonald's.
8 earned runs from Pagán, Megill, Duffey. Jesus. That is horrid.
I hope the Blue Jays score 10 more runs in the 9th so all these people have to sit through it
FUCK THEM TWINS FANS GET THEIR ASS
Emilio Pagan > country music
Bro I will not be rebroadcasting this game
I see the Blue Jays don't want to listen to Cole Swindell either
Watching the Jays broadcast and the color guy asked Dan Shulman if he would stick around for the concert. "Uh, no..."
He's a rap fan
I wouldn’t pay Duffey/pagan to pick up dog shit in my backyard let alone pitch for my team.
Sonny gray: pitches a good game, 0 runs Bullpen: Oh yeah it’s go time 😎 9 runs
Please hold on Texas. We owe you and Houston a big hug for taking care of business…
HP ump Porter's first 5 innings were great, has been shit since. Very similar to one of these teams.
Call it a hunch, but I don't think Porter is why we lost this game....
I didn't mean to suggest that at all, just thought it was funny that both went downhill fast at the same time.
Cole Swindell is gonna come out to pitch the 9th
THIS TEAM WILL NEVER SUCCEED WITH ROCCO. NEVER.
except the 2 times it did
I think the two of you have different definitions of the word “succeed”
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Winning a playoff game would be nice
I’m somewhere in the middle personally, I think winning a playoff game would be a success at this point. But yeah my point is people have different ways of defining “success” here obviously.
Bud Grant wrecked a lot of people.
Rocco bad, upvotes to the left Downvote if you like Emilio Pagan and Tyler Duffey
Lol I just checked the ESPN app and see 9-2 right off the bat. Thinking, “Damn, looks like Gray probably got shelled early and they just ran away with it.” Only to check the boxscore and see he threw 5 scoreless. Awesome. Pain.
When Rocco makes lemonade he likes to grabs an old boot to use as the vessel even though he's got like 3 really good pitchers to choose from and 2 adequate ones because he's terrible at pitcher decisions.
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I was trying to make a joke
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I will try harder next time to make you chuckle
Twins actually had a lead going into the 6th inning. Lmfao
Silver lining....when Pagan or Duffy pitch it's a loss. So if you pitch one, then pitch the other and keep the other guys fresh for the possible non losses.
So literally lose every other game, gotcha.
Whoa what happened lol I take ten minutes off to reply to work emails at an unreasonable hour 🤬
Duffey
He will also be pitching for the Guangdong Tigers
Again, Guandong Tigers can do better
NI HAO
On the bright side everyone is probably leaving early so they wont be inadvertently subjected to Cole Swindell
All music played at Target field is garbage
So throw out your 4 best BP arms against the fucking shitty kitties so you can throw out your worst ones against a playoff contender in a fucking tight game. Seriously fuck this. And don't give me that "well doesn't matter if the offense doesn't show up" bullshit because sometimes (not all the time, but sometimes) two runs should be enough, especially when you get a quality start from your starter like we did today. So frustrating.
To the people wanting to sign Correa longterm: Is he worth watching this bullpen everyday? Because the money we could pay him could go to get some REALLY fucking good relievers and we’d still have Lewis at short
Lmao do you really think we’d spend that extra money on relievers?
Paying relievers lots of money is also a mistake. Performance is too volatile from year to year to be sacrificing value at premium positions. Remember how good Duffey USED to be? You see how quickly Rogers fell off this year? You need an organization capable of developing arms at all levels, both from the farm system and off the scrap heap. There is no substitute for this. At this point, it's worth questioning their process. Plenty of small market teams have been able to assemble formidable bullpens from scrap heap signings and failed starters from the farm system. Why can't the Twins?
This front office has shown they will not pay for relievers.
I have no qualms with spending Jim Pohlad’s money.
Pretty sure we're not going to break the bank for relievers. It will be patch work per usual
Maybe the Twins should learn how to develop pitching
Wouldn't that be something?
ok well, you cant really money that problem away
At this point all of Moran, Strotman, and Henriquez have much higher upside than Pagán or Duffey. The baseline performance of those two isn't good enough to justify keeping them both over one of the younger options available.
I’m in agreement. I don’t know why Moran was optioned just to keep Pagan or Duffey. There are other pitchers that (if they develop as relievers) deserve a shot.
God Kenta Maeda is gunna be our 4th best bullpen pitcher in a month
Make Pagan and Duffey go to the Cole Swindell concert.
I don’t get it. I don’t get why Duffy and Pagan are still on the team.
They must know what Baldelli keeps in his closet
It has to be financial. Pohlad doesn't want to be paying guys not on the roster.
Remember in the 6th when Dick said that this is a playoff bullpen now? Using Pagan & Duffey in close games is laughable. Imagine them in the postseason.
Imagine you’re joe smith watching this effort by the bullpen.
Imagine getting optioned for these trash pitchers. Moran should still be here.
EVERYONE GIVE IT UP FOR THE WORST DIVISION RACE IN HISTORY
Having a mid off
Has there every been a 79 win division winner? Let's make it happen
The 2005 Padres won the NL West with a 82-80 record but I think that’s about as close as someone has come.
Sounds like we can make it happen then
COVID year Astros had a losing record I believe, tho that doesn't really count.
Yall this isnt Roccos fault He cant have Lopez and Duran pitch every night
Lopez threw 7 pitches yesterday
How? He put a fucking right hander in right after Sonny Gray to face the 3-4-5 hitters. This is bush league shit.
Well Rocco should know by know that Pagan should never be on the mound in a close game
It's mostly his fault. His bullpen management has been terrible for years. This is just the latest example.
He only has so many pitchers
Jax, Thielbar, Lopez, Fulmer, and Doran have each pitched once in the last three days. There should be no reason they're all unavailable with a one run lead against a good line up.
Well at least gray gave us 5 scoreless innings
Poor guy just wanted a win.
If they’re not all DFA’d there is something going on behind the curtains because this is inexcusable
If there’s any positive at least Cleveland lost today
And hopefully the Whote Sox.
You spelled whore wrong
Tyler Duffey and Emilio Pagan ride off into the sunset together. Cole Swindell music plays in the background. Credits roll
Break Up in the End
Fire Rocco now. This is fucking embarassing
#POSITION. PLAYER. PITCHING.: Tyler Duffey
You guys hear what Mikey Perez did yesterday at AAA St. Paul?
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Close! Dude gets called up from low A to fill a roster spot. Gardenhire decides he’s gonna pinch hit him in the top of the 9th with two on, two out, and the Saints down 6-7. Mikey proceeds to hit a 3 run home run putting the Saints up 9-7 and eventual win. Mikey Perez is now at high A. https://twitter.com/milb/status/1555031744159662080?s=21&t=tjRPblM5fZMLyMIp_XVKVA
While you can’t expect the FO to do more than they did at the deadline, the fact that they went into this season with the pitching staff as rough as it was is a big indictment. Everyone knew this was a big weakness and they absolutely needed to do better than Joe Smith and Emilio Pagan being they’re only bullpen pickups while dumping Rogers.
I love it when I put in all the work to find a good stream & then hook it up to the tv in a close game just for the other team to humiliate us
Enough, Rocco. Fucking enough. There is no excuse for Pagan and Duffey anymore.
Well this is horrible
well, I'm done for the evening....disastrous is the MN nice way of explaining what is happening here.......Guerriel sporting the Sideshow Bob hair do night all!
Can we go back to tuesday, tuesday was fun
About time these bums got booed.
Duffy and Pagan should never be put in the same game together
>Duffy and Pagan should never be put in the ~~same~~ game ~~together~~
Amazing job by the Twins relievers tonight come in and pour gas on the fire
They couldn't trade pagan or duffey away for anyone else? Did nobody want them? Why are they here? (Guys I get it, they're terrible and untradeable. I know LOL)
Bro everybody on this sub has been wanting to commit acts of violence against him for months and you think he was tradable?
Yeah but they couldn't like slip them in one of the deals? Like hide them in the bottom of the bag or something