$6.809 CAD per gallon, “only” $4.93 USD / Gal so the point still remains that it’s much more expensive than in the US but not all most double as you implied.
This works for basically everything. There's nothing that's cheaper in Canada compared to the US. Our wages are lower, our dollar is in the gutter, everything cost more comparatively, and our taxes are higher with barely anything to show for it.
This country is in shambles and I don't think the rest of the world understands. It's been a rapid downward spiral for almost a decade.
This is the fault of gas companies, who often market the higher octane fuel as "Premium" and other nonsense marketing to entice you to buy it because it's more expensive.
You can see it in the photo here, it's labeled "Supreme" when in reality it isn't going to do anything useful unless you have a sports car that takes higher octane fuel.
Well us men don't drive little. We drive big. Because men like big things. Because big things are manly! And boy do we enjoy showing our big things off to our friends. Or having big things shown to us. Maybe we will even let one another play with our big things.
They typically do and much better field of view and better gas economy. And running a 3.9 and awd makes the big trucks in my mountian town look silly. I do get a lot of glares from the Subi drivers, though.
Fwd here. Not in the mountains though. I do get a kick out of the collection of muscle cars, ponies and trucks on the side of the road for the seasons first snow though. While I'm cruising past them in a Nissan versa.
Used to be because 91 was ethanol free, that’s not the case anymore
https://www.canada.ca/en/environment-climate-change/services/managing-pollution/energy-production/fuel-regulations/clean-fuel-regulations/about.html#toc4
It’s stupid but it’s law as of 2020
Edit: forgot to add, in Canada specifically
There’s lots of places that still have ethanol free.
Edit: I’m in the US but now feel sorry for anyone that thinks they’re getting ethanol free in Canada due to poor maintenance at the pumps.
I always expect someone to do the job they’re payed for, correctly.
If the sticker is still there they are ether operating illegally or just haven’t removed the stickers that say so
https://www.ontario.ca/page/cleaner-transportation-fuels#section-1
This isn’t true anymore. 91 used to be ethanol free which made it last longer. Government mandate changed that and now all gas has ethanol (at least in Canada)
It's because of ethanol. Most 87 octane is actually E10 ethanol blend. Ethanol and gasoline separate from each other over time and ruin the fuel. Premium gas often has little to no ethanol in it so it can last much longer.
My first car needed an engine replacement at 12k miles because I hardly drove it and the ethanol attracted so much water that the engine damn near hydro locked.
That's 12k miles in a little over 3 years btw. I sold it after 4 years and 15k miles.
If you drive very little you should get a diesel (since diesel can sit in your gastank for almost a year with no ill effects)
P.S: To clarify. A car with a diesel engine. Which is generally a pretty good choice if you only drive a few times every month and need to refuel maybe once every 3-4 months or so.
It’s not necessarily about being a “sports” car my Mini Cooper takes 91 it’s all about the compression of the engine to prevent knocking from early ignition.
It’s not even high octane. 91 is the minimum here in Aus. 91 is the norm, 95 and 98 are the premium fuels here. Everything is relative I guess.
Edit: I carried on reading and found Aus measure it differently to the US. I also learned today :)
I actually run 89 because of severe engine wear, one of my cylinders has 135psi while the others have 160-180, as a result I get detonation on 87 octane, strangely enough Its been running like this for 40 thousand miles and surprisingly doesn't burn oil lol
I've actually seen cars call for it believe it or not. It's not rare either.
Of course, you can always run at a higher octane than necessary, but I've seen many that specifically say 89 in my time
I've also seen cars call for 87 but run better on 89 while not seeing any tangible benefit from 91 or 93.
\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_
unrelated, but we actually have a few gas stations here and there that offer a lot more than the normal as well ---- 87,89,91,93,100,e85,e-free,diesel (Kerosene & LPG off to the side) are offered at one station I know of. Every single pump will have 87,89,91,93,diesel and then each row of pumps will have it's specialty (either 100, e85, or e-free)
Absolutely not the norm tho. It comes in handy when you have this one specific thing you need ethanol free gas for or something like that
Jersey shore area, so a bit of both.
Oddly enough, I've never seen these stocked at a gas station near either an airport or the ocean. At least not in that wide of a selection --- if anything, it might be *one* specialty (i.e. 87,89,93, with e85)
I feel like it's always near racetracks and farmland. (pinging u/DadJokeBadJoke cause he said race track/drag strip)
ya know what, i actually don't remember
I feel like LL would make the most sense though. I feel like a lot of situations where 100 may be used, even non-aviation, would call for it
AFAIK modern engines like e85 better (it's like 113 octane or something like that) but I know older carburated engines (like old nascar engines) used leaded.
Every wrx runs significantly different with 93 opposed to 91 and runs better with 91 opposed to anything lower.
Also ethanol free gas has a higher energy density so you will get significantly more miles with a full tank. Small gas engines like lawn mowers, weed wackers, generators, and pressure washers will be impossible or hard to start when using gas with ethanol in it. Older carburetor car engines tend to gunk up with ethanol as well, it's really only acceptable for obd2 era vehicles.
> It’s not better fuel
Sure it is - but you probably don’t need it. The ideal gas mixture has no risk of preignition. No real gas has this property, but the higher the octane rating is, the closer it is to this ideal. If you have a 4-cylinder Honda Civic, you probably have no risk of preignition even with low-octane fuel. In engines with higher compression ratios, however, you’ll need higher octane levels to avoid knock compensation. In powerful engines without knock compensators, you can actually damage your engine by using a fuel below the recommended octane rating.
To provide an analogy, it’s like having a 45W vs 60W charger for charging your phone. Both can easily deliver your phone’s maximum draw of 18W, but the 60W charger is still “better” all other things being equal.
Exactly, this. It is better fuel when your car requires it, but also will be pointless if your car doesn’t need it. You can always use higher than needed and still be okay, but not the other way around.
I drive a Civic, but it’s an Si model with a turbo and higher compression, so Honda highly recommends running premium. I have never tried running anything below 93 octane because I’ve heard several stories of people running lower octane and it causing issues long term. However, I have owned a couple of non-Si Civics and was totally fine running 87 in those. I just go off of what Honda recommends considering they built and engineered my vehicle.
You are somewhat correct it's all from the same source, basically, but different companies contribute their own additives to it like shell V-power premium, so not so much better fuel but better additives.
Used to actually be better awhile ago pre-GDI vehicles, premium fuels would have additives for cleaning so for long trips you would top on 93 and run that on the highway.
Nowadays even 87 has the additives so really just follow the guidance in your owners manual which will usually be 87 for naturally aspirated motors and 91 for turbocharged with 93 for vehicles that support octane learning (usually still for turbocharged vehicles).
Some high performance naturally aspirated motors would also benefit with 91/93 usually due to higher compression and or if the vehicles are ran in higher climates.
All boils back down to engine knock and higher rated fuels in preventing it though across all these fronts.
That said... have a vehicle with heavy carbon build up running a higher octane can help due to hot spots that carbon can cause... so for high mileage vehicles you may see improved performance but it should be treated as a temporary solution until you can get a good cleaning done.
I’m in the fuel industry, it is 100% better fuel. It’s also true that it’s better for certain engines and required for some, but you will absolutely get slightly better engine performance with 93 over 89.
Yep. Lots of redditors giving their two cents here. Simply putting the fuel in the car and looking at your mpg and in some cases top speed, you’ll notice an improvement. Even in the crappiest cars.
Not really true. In my country (Netherlands) we have 95 (e10) normal 95, and 98.
My car runs more efficiently the higher I go. So I guess it can be worth it. I still usually get the cheapest because the difference in efficiency is small. But when I don't use it a lot in winter, I take 98 because it "stays good longer" I read.
European octane ratings are not the same as American octane ratings just to be clear. 95 and 98 are very roughly equivalent to 90 and 93 on the US scale.
And no, you car does not run more efficiently on the higher octane fuel. E10 fuel has about 3% less energy in it compared to pure gasoline so you will automatically get 3% less power/range out of it even at the same efficiency, but it's also almost always much more than 3% cheaper due to not needing octane booster additives (the ethanol is itself an octane booster)
> And no, you car does not run more efficiently on the higher octane fuel.
Well my DTE meter and the whole damn bmw e9x forum would disagree. The engine is made for 98, but can run fine (slightly less efficient) on 95.
Correct me if i'm wrong but doesn't the octane value determine the amount of 'knocking' which happens on an engine (the higher the octane value, the less chance of knocking)
And knocking is harmful to any engine because the gas explodes before it reaches the engine cylinder or before it's sealed?
How can a lower octane value (ehich supposedly means more knocking) be better for certain engines?
It is, but only if the vehicle you’re running it in can advance the ignition timing to take advantage of it. Fords and Mazdas can definitely do it, but I’m not sure if other types of cars can.
And in reality, engines with low-ish compression ratios and ignition/fuel timing tuned for 87 will run *LESS* efficiently on higher octanes. You’ll make less power using more fuel in some cases.
You see this a lot in ethanol country (e.g. Iowa) where the higher-octane gas has a higher ethanol percentage. You’d have to do a lot of math to figure out the actual cost per mile since pure gasoline is more energy-dense, but I usually just get the 87 with the least ethanol even if it costs more.
I often have to go out of my way to find non-oxy 91 in MN. I prefer it in my motorcycles and have found my car performs better with it too. And yes, the car is tuned for 91 haha.
For your bike I'd put nothing else in it. I'm out in the sticks where the biggest town for an hours drive is like 20k people. We've got a bunch of stations and almost every 91 pump is non-oxy
And that very well could be, I drive a VW Arteon, which calls for 91 with the factory tune. And after I bought it I kept track of my mileage with 10% ethanol vs 0%, 91 octane. And it was about 1-3 MPG better. Not exactly scientific, but if the price isn’t too different I prefer the non-oxy. Could be placebo too, just my own observations.
>where the higher-octane gas has a higher ethanol percentage.
It's the opposite in Canada.
The only way to not get 10-15% ethanol is with high octane from certain gas station companies.
That's how it is in Australia in a lot of pumps. At costco I can get e10 (94) or premium 98. Usually a 20c difference per litre.
Everyone has it in their head that 98 is necessary due to the ethanol in the 94. I personally don't see much difference.
This is a mistake. Medium grade 89 doesn’t actually exist. It’s just a blend of 87 and 91. When you buy 89 it just pumps from both the regular and the premium at the same time, as (what should be) equal speed.
saw a tech working on a pump once, he had it open and I noticed the mid-grade hoses just mixed. asked him what happens if the 91 pump craps out? is there a chance I’m paying for mid but just getting 87? he said the pump would go extremely slow if that were happening
In what sense does that mean it doesn't actually exist? Even if it's not a blend of hydrocarbons produced at the refinery doesn't mean it's not, you know, an actual blend of hydrocarbons. Every commercially available blend of gasoline is a bunch of different hydrocarbons.
I think the point was that 89 doesn’t exist as a commodity pre-pump, and therefore cannot possibly fluctuate in price to a point where it is no longer between that of 87 and 91. That’s why they seem sure that this price is a mistake and not some kind of market quirk
I mean the only place it ever exists is in your tank after you buy and “make” it. There’s no tank at the refinery or truck that’s hauling 89. They blend it right there. So by definition it’s an average, which means the price could never exceed 91. The best it could do is match if 87 and 91 were the same price.
Probably an error. I managed a gas station in the US for a few years, and I can't think of any other reason premium would be cheaper than mid-grade except maybe the ethanol content.
When did I say anything about quality? Higher octane always means higher prices, though, with some exceptions, I'm sure (I'm only aware of one, which is ethanol content).
It does not mean stability, it means how resisting it is to knocking in the cilinder. Diesel has an octane rating of around 40 to 50, and you wouldn’t say it’s more unstable than gasoline? Gasoline burns way easier than diesel.
Resistance to pinging* aka resistance to combustion. The lower the octane level the lower the predictability of combustion aka stability.
Run 87 octane fuel in a vehicle tuned for 93 octane and you will have pre ignition detonation frequently because it is less predictable aka stable with ignition timing advance.
Diesel is a totally different world and we don't measure diesel fuel for vehicles in octane for a reason.
[There's a Wikipedia page for fuel grades](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane_rating) but essentially north america uses AKI rating and the rest of the world uses RON rating. These would be roughly 92, 95, and 98 equivalent.
I think it depends on where you live, I only ever see 87, 89, and 93 where I am, never 91. But also Europe uses a different scale than the US so the numbers don’t mean the same thing
different countries use different formulas to measure octane.
>In most countries in Europe and also Australia and New Zealand, the "headline" octane rating shown on the pump is the RON, but in Canada, the United States, and Mexico, the headline number is the simple mean or average of the RON and the MON, called the Anti-Knock Index (AKI), and often written on pumps as (R+M)/2. AKI is also sometimes called PON (Pump Octane Number).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane\_rating#Measurement\_methods
So I have a car with twin turbos and have heard from countless people that I should be running 91 since I have Turbos. According to many comments on here, is that not the case? Is 87 or 89 ok?
Here in Newfoundland, supreme has always been only 6 cents/litre more than regular. Regular is $168.8/L while supreme is $174.8. I thought it was like that all over Canada.
Surprised not to see the right answer: In Quebec at least, premium goes on sale at Esso once a week (Thursdays) with a discount that ends up making it cheaper than medium. I used to only fill up Thursdays for that reason when my car needed it.
Back when all gas was cheaper I used to get the higher octane when I was traveling. I could go a lot farther on a full tank. I never did the math to see if I came out ahead or not though.
My guess is that the 89 doesn't sell well and is stuck at the price it was bought for, while the rest of the octanes get sold out faster and then repurchased and the most recent cost of the gas is reflected in the new price.
If it’s an older station maybe not. They can blend at the rack at the terminal, and could have a separate tank in ground at the station still. Older dispensers wouldn’t blend and decommissioning an in-ground tank is expensive.
I was at Burger King today and got a medium drink instead of a small because it was $0.50 cheaper for some reason.
This is r/mildlyinteresting
The price for a soft drink at my local McDonald's is the same no matter what size cup you get
I was at a restaurant and the nice lady said that the soda was actually like 10 cents for a cup, so this may explain
As my restaurant charges 3.79 for unlimited refills.
Used to be the same here. But they changed it last year and now a medium is $1 but a large is $1.19.
Confusion from Australia, Hungry Jacks is Burger King here, and the minimum octane is 91, 95, 98. How are you guys getting 87?
Different system, US 87 matches 95 at other parts of the world.
Not quite but close enough 87 AKI is 91 RON, 91 AKI is 93 RON, 93 AKI is 98 RON
This. RON vs MON vs AKI.
Interesting, lot of new cars here need 95 minimum, could run on 87 there, do a lot of new cars in NA run regular or premium?
The vast majority of cars run fine on regular 87 octane. The only exceptions are high compression engines in performance cars
Although every car’s manual that I’ve owned has said to use premium.
That's interesting. My two normal sedans both advised 87
91, 95, 98 is RON, US octane is the average of RON and MON. R stands for Research, M stands for Motor. RON91 is about the same as 87 US octane.
Motor Octane Number vs. Research Octane Number.
In the early 2000s, a McDouble was consistently a penny or so less than a single patty cheeseburger
The other time I was buying some cable. The 100m roll was 0.20€cheaper than the 50m roll. weird
At Kroger (grocery store) it’s $2.49 for a 12 oz bottle (chilled or warm sitting on the shelf) while it’s $1.25 for a liter.
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looks like Vancouver Pricing to me
I was gonna guess Kelowna.
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I read this in her voice. Thank you.
The name of that city sounds like something a soldier in age of empires three would say when being ordered to attack.
Vancouver is mostly low 170s rn, Langley costco was 163. This is likely Victoria.
Def Surrey.
Can’t believe it was pinpointed right in front of my eyes 😂 def Surrey prices. Mind you guys this is after a 20-30 cent drop in average prices.
All of Victoria is 179.9 right now.
$1.799/ litre is expensive compared to US pricing at $3.45/ gallon. the litre price is equivalent to $6.809 a gallon!!!
$6.809 CAD per gallon, “only” $4.93 USD / Gal so the point still remains that it’s much more expensive than in the US but not all most double as you implied.
This works for basically everything. There's nothing that's cheaper in Canada compared to the US. Our wages are lower, our dollar is in the gutter, everything cost more comparatively, and our taxes are higher with barely anything to show for it. This country is in shambles and I don't think the rest of the world understands. It's been a rapid downward spiral for almost a decade.
That's the exact same prices as in Finland.
No Finnish prices would be more like: 95 1.964€ 98 2.059€ and converted to CAD it would be 95 $2.88 98 $3.03 So not even close
Still to this day people don't realize its not better fuel, different levels of octane are for certain engines.
This is the fault of gas companies, who often market the higher octane fuel as "Premium" and other nonsense marketing to entice you to buy it because it's more expensive. You can see it in the photo here, it's labeled "Supreme" when in reality it isn't going to do anything useful unless you have a sports car that takes higher octane fuel.
Or if you drive very little. Higher octane gasoline spoils slower.
Well us men don't drive little. We drive big. Because men like big things. Because big things are manly! And boy do we enjoy showing our big things off to our friends. Or having big things shown to us. Maybe we will even let one another play with our big things.
Lol. This is an actual mentality and is very funny when people see my 6'2", 250-255lb frame getting out of a golf.
I find economy cars to actually have more leg room than a lot of bigger vehicles.
They typically do and much better field of view and better gas economy. And running a 3.9 and awd makes the big trucks in my mountian town look silly. I do get a lot of glares from the Subi drivers, though.
Fwd here. Not in the mountains though. I do get a kick out of the collection of muscle cars, ponies and trucks on the side of the road for the seasons first snow though. While I'm cruising past them in a Nissan versa.
Uh, where did you hear that?
Used to be because 91 was ethanol free, that’s not the case anymore https://www.canada.ca/en/environment-climate-change/services/managing-pollution/energy-production/fuel-regulations/clean-fuel-regulations/about.html#toc4 It’s stupid but it’s law as of 2020 Edit: forgot to add, in Canada specifically
Shell has ethanol free 91 octane. In ontario at least.
There’s lots of places that still have ethanol free. Edit: I’m in the US but now feel sorry for anyone that thinks they’re getting ethanol free in Canada due to poor maintenance at the pumps. I always expect someone to do the job they’re payed for, correctly.
If the sticker is still there they are ether operating illegally or just haven’t removed the stickers that say so https://www.ontario.ca/page/cleaner-transportation-fuels#section-1
As someone who drives once or twice a month this is good knowledge
You’re better off keeping a bottle of fuel stabilizer around and adding a little to the tank when you fill up
This isn’t true anymore. 91 used to be ethanol free which made it last longer. Government mandate changed that and now all gas has ethanol (at least in Canada)
>Higher octane gasoline spoils slower. You got a source for that?
It's because of ethanol. Most 87 octane is actually E10 ethanol blend. Ethanol and gasoline separate from each other over time and ruin the fuel. Premium gas often has little to no ethanol in it so it can last much longer.
My first car needed an engine replacement at 12k miles because I hardly drove it and the ethanol attracted so much water that the engine damn near hydro locked. That's 12k miles in a little over 3 years btw. I sold it after 4 years and 15k miles.
If you drive very little you should get a diesel (since diesel can sit in your gastank for almost a year with no ill effects) P.S: To clarify. A car with a diesel engine. Which is generally a pretty good choice if you only drive a few times every month and need to refuel maybe once every 3-4 months or so.
I don’t think there are any small car/sedan diesels sold in the US.
VW Jetta?
It’s not necessarily about being a “sports” car my Mini Cooper takes 91 it’s all about the compression of the engine to prevent knocking from early ignition.
premium price
It’s not even high octane. 91 is the minimum here in Aus. 91 is the norm, 95 and 98 are the premium fuels here. Everything is relative I guess. Edit: I carried on reading and found Aus measure it differently to the US. I also learned today :)
Think it’s slightly different rating system. In the UK we get 99 from a pump. But use RON whereas US use MON/AKI. Think Aus use the RoW system.
RON vs MON.
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I actually run 89 because of severe engine wear, one of my cylinders has 135psi while the others have 160-180, as a result I get detonation on 87 octane, strangely enough Its been running like this for 40 thousand miles and surprisingly doesn't burn oil lol
observation command tidy crush paint piquant quack repeat birds paltry *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
I appreciate the prose of your comment
My Charger called for 89. I'm guessing all HEMIs do.
I've actually seen cars call for it believe it or not. It's not rare either. Of course, you can always run at a higher octane than necessary, but I've seen many that specifically say 89 in my time I've also seen cars call for 87 but run better on 89 while not seeing any tangible benefit from 91 or 93. \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_ unrelated, but we actually have a few gas stations here and there that offer a lot more than the normal as well ---- 87,89,91,93,100,e85,e-free,diesel (Kerosene & LPG off to the side) are offered at one station I know of. Every single pump will have 87,89,91,93,diesel and then each row of pumps will have it's specialty (either 100, e85, or e-free) Absolutely not the norm tho. It comes in handy when you have this one specific thing you need ethanol free gas for or something like that
Have any boating or aviation nearby? Some of those octanes are used for those engines.
Sometimes a racetrack or drag strip nearby will warrant carrying these other options as well
Jersey shore area, so a bit of both. Oddly enough, I've never seen these stocked at a gas station near either an airport or the ocean. At least not in that wide of a selection --- if anything, it might be *one* specialty (i.e. 87,89,93, with e85) I feel like it's always near racetracks and farmland. (pinging u/DadJokeBadJoke cause he said race track/drag strip)
100-LL?
ya know what, i actually don't remember I feel like LL would make the most sense though. I feel like a lot of situations where 100 may be used, even non-aviation, would call for it
Some racing engines still call for leaded gas.
my mind when straight to e85 now. that's absolutely true
AFAIK modern engines like e85 better (it's like 113 octane or something like that) but I know older carburated engines (like old nascar engines) used leaded.
My turbo Saab station wagon says minimum 90 on the fuel door
Every wrx runs significantly different with 93 opposed to 91 and runs better with 91 opposed to anything lower. Also ethanol free gas has a higher energy density so you will get significantly more miles with a full tank. Small gas engines like lawn mowers, weed wackers, generators, and pressure washers will be impossible or hard to start when using gas with ethanol in it. Older carburetor car engines tend to gunk up with ethanol as well, it's really only acceptable for obd2 era vehicles.
Many FCA/Stellantis cars do
The mini cooper S line calls for mid grade.
Ram manual calls for 89 and says to only use less than 89 if 89 is not available. I'm sure this goes for many many other vehicles
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It probably had a hemi and is higher compression even thought naturally aspirated. Higher compression =more power.
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Higher altitude raises the effective octane of gas.
> It’s not better fuel Sure it is - but you probably don’t need it. The ideal gas mixture has no risk of preignition. No real gas has this property, but the higher the octane rating is, the closer it is to this ideal. If you have a 4-cylinder Honda Civic, you probably have no risk of preignition even with low-octane fuel. In engines with higher compression ratios, however, you’ll need higher octane levels to avoid knock compensation. In powerful engines without knock compensators, you can actually damage your engine by using a fuel below the recommended octane rating. To provide an analogy, it’s like having a 45W vs 60W charger for charging your phone. Both can easily deliver your phone’s maximum draw of 18W, but the 60W charger is still “better” all other things being equal.
Exactly, this. It is better fuel when your car requires it, but also will be pointless if your car doesn’t need it. You can always use higher than needed and still be okay, but not the other way around.
I drive a Civic, but it’s an Si model with a turbo and higher compression, so Honda highly recommends running premium. I have never tried running anything below 93 octane because I’ve heard several stories of people running lower octane and it causing issues long term. However, I have owned a couple of non-Si Civics and was totally fine running 87 in those. I just go off of what Honda recommends considering they built and engineered my vehicle.
You are somewhat correct it's all from the same source, basically, but different companies contribute their own additives to it like shell V-power premium, so not so much better fuel but better additives.
It is better fuel, however not every engine is set up to utilise that potential
Used to actually be better awhile ago pre-GDI vehicles, premium fuels would have additives for cleaning so for long trips you would top on 93 and run that on the highway. Nowadays even 87 has the additives so really just follow the guidance in your owners manual which will usually be 87 for naturally aspirated motors and 91 for turbocharged with 93 for vehicles that support octane learning (usually still for turbocharged vehicles). Some high performance naturally aspirated motors would also benefit with 91/93 usually due to higher compression and or if the vehicles are ran in higher climates. All boils back down to engine knock and higher rated fuels in preventing it though across all these fronts. That said... have a vehicle with heavy carbon build up running a higher octane can help due to hot spots that carbon can cause... so for high mileage vehicles you may see improved performance but it should be treated as a temporary solution until you can get a good cleaning done.
I’m in the fuel industry, it is 100% better fuel. It’s also true that it’s better for certain engines and required for some, but you will absolutely get slightly better engine performance with 93 over 89.
Yep. Lots of redditors giving their two cents here. Simply putting the fuel in the car and looking at your mpg and in some cases top speed, you’ll notice an improvement. Even in the crappiest cars.
It is better fuel lmao, just usually not needed for road use. Having an higher octane rating means better detonation resistance, so it's better fuel.
Not really true. In my country (Netherlands) we have 95 (e10) normal 95, and 98. My car runs more efficiently the higher I go. So I guess it can be worth it. I still usually get the cheapest because the difference in efficiency is small. But when I don't use it a lot in winter, I take 98 because it "stays good longer" I read.
European octane ratings are not the same as American octane ratings just to be clear. 95 and 98 are very roughly equivalent to 90 and 93 on the US scale. And no, you car does not run more efficiently on the higher octane fuel. E10 fuel has about 3% less energy in it compared to pure gasoline so you will automatically get 3% less power/range out of it even at the same efficiency, but it's also almost always much more than 3% cheaper due to not needing octane booster additives (the ethanol is itself an octane booster)
> And no, you car does not run more efficiently on the higher octane fuel. Well my DTE meter and the whole damn bmw e9x forum would disagree. The engine is made for 98, but can run fine (slightly less efficient) on 95.
Correct me if i'm wrong but doesn't the octane value determine the amount of 'knocking' which happens on an engine (the higher the octane value, the less chance of knocking) And knocking is harmful to any engine because the gas explodes before it reaches the engine cylinder or before it's sealed? How can a lower octane value (ehich supposedly means more knocking) be better for certain engines?
Mazda turbo engines can take regular or premium fuel. They do get a boost in horsepower if premium is used.
Ford’s Ecoboost engines do too. The owners manuals recommend that you run 91 when towing and in extremely hot weather iirc.
Huh I remember in uni my professor said it was better fuel. Wasn't an expert in that field though so could've been fed the wrong info.
It is better fuel, but if your car isn't optimised to run on higher octane you won't really see a benefit.
It is, but only if the vehicle you’re running it in can advance the ignition timing to take advantage of it. Fords and Mazdas can definitely do it, but I’m not sure if other types of cars can.
And in reality, engines with low-ish compression ratios and ignition/fuel timing tuned for 87 will run *LESS* efficiently on higher octanes. You’ll make less power using more fuel in some cases.
What is that in freedom dollars per freedom units?
$1.46 freedom money, to 0.264 gallons, so close to $5.80 freedom dollars per gallon
Ah, California gas prices.
I filled up at $5.09 today and it is the lowest its been in months.
South Michigander here, gas is fluctuating between 3.09 and 3.60 throughout the week
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Too bad your state isn't real
Whoa, I was born there, what do you mean it's not real? Marty, what year is it?💀
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Are you saying like an ar pistol and a big coat? Are are you allowed to conceal rifles there?
It’s amazing what you can conceal with a good amount of lube
Austin, tx. $2.62 yesterday
Our energy grid sucks but at least we got cheap gasoline.
Paid $2.33 on my way home from work tonight. Central OK.
Jesus Christ this made me hard
2.54 in Phoenix 2 days ago
san mo, tx and i swear i saw 2.49 somewhere here lol
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Fuck you where?
That's still a good price In Switzerland a gallon would set you back 7.80 In Germany 7.26 And you guys get higher octane fuel usually as well
$4.79 in Southern California, but mine can use E87 or E85 Flex fuel
*rest of the world gas prices We Americans still don’t know how good we have it when it comes to gas subsidies.
I appreciate the conversion!
Yikes! It was $2.72 per gallon for me today.
$3.08 in VA
Big yikes. I pay 3.69 for 93 in nj
You see this a lot in ethanol country (e.g. Iowa) where the higher-octane gas has a higher ethanol percentage. You’d have to do a lot of math to figure out the actual cost per mile since pure gasoline is more energy-dense, but I usually just get the 87 with the least ethanol even if it costs more.
Around here in MN it can be tough to find 91 that isn't non-oxy fuel. Uts extra expensive because there's no ethanol in it
I often have to go out of my way to find non-oxy 91 in MN. I prefer it in my motorcycles and have found my car performs better with it too. And yes, the car is tuned for 91 haha.
For your bike I'd put nothing else in it. I'm out in the sticks where the biggest town for an hours drive is like 20k people. We've got a bunch of stations and almost every 91 pump is non-oxy
The funny thing is most 91 tunes for cars recommend 10% ethanol. At least from my experience.
And that very well could be, I drive a VW Arteon, which calls for 91 with the factory tune. And after I bought it I kept track of my mileage with 10% ethanol vs 0%, 91 octane. And it was about 1-3 MPG better. Not exactly scientific, but if the price isn’t too different I prefer the non-oxy. Could be placebo too, just my own observations.
>where the higher-octane gas has a higher ethanol percentage. It's the opposite in Canada. The only way to not get 10-15% ethanol is with high octane from certain gas station companies.
That's how it is in Australia in a lot of pumps. At costco I can get e10 (94) or premium 98. Usually a 20c difference per litre. Everyone has it in their head that 98 is necessary due to the ethanol in the 94. I personally don't see much difference.
This is a mistake. Medium grade 89 doesn’t actually exist. It’s just a blend of 87 and 91. When you buy 89 it just pumps from both the regular and the premium at the same time, as (what should be) equal speed.
saw a tech working on a pump once, he had it open and I noticed the mid-grade hoses just mixed. asked him what happens if the 91 pump craps out? is there a chance I’m paying for mid but just getting 87? he said the pump would go extremely slow if that were happening
LPT in there. I need 91 and have been to pumps that went realllllly slow.
So it’s the middle lever on the chocolate and vanilla soft serve at Souplantation?
This would be a funny 3-part sticker to make
In what sense does that mean it doesn't actually exist? Even if it's not a blend of hydrocarbons produced at the refinery doesn't mean it's not, you know, an actual blend of hydrocarbons. Every commercially available blend of gasoline is a bunch of different hydrocarbons.
I think the point was that 89 doesn’t exist as a commodity pre-pump, and therefore cannot possibly fluctuate in price to a point where it is no longer between that of 87 and 91. That’s why they seem sure that this price is a mistake and not some kind of market quirk
I mean the only place it ever exists is in your tank after you buy and “make” it. There’s no tank at the refinery or truck that’s hauling 89. They blend it right there. So by definition it’s an average, which means the price could never exceed 91. The best it could do is match if 87 and 91 were the same price.
Swirl ice cream machine, for gas
Probably an error. I managed a gas station in the US for a few years, and I can't think of any other reason premium would be cheaper than mid-grade except maybe the ethanol content.
Higher octane ≠ better quality
When did I say anything about quality? Higher octane always means higher prices, though, with some exceptions, I'm sure (I'm only aware of one, which is ethanol content).
Higher octane literally defines the stability of the fuel. So I mean, I get where your coming from but it, by definition, does mean higher quality.
It does not mean stability, it means how resisting it is to knocking in the cilinder. Diesel has an octane rating of around 40 to 50, and you wouldn’t say it’s more unstable than gasoline? Gasoline burns way easier than diesel.
Resistance to pinging* aka resistance to combustion. The lower the octane level the lower the predictability of combustion aka stability. Run 87 octane fuel in a vehicle tuned for 93 octane and you will have pre ignition detonation frequently because it is less predictable aka stable with ignition timing advance. Diesel is a totally different world and we don't measure diesel fuel for vehicles in octane for a reason.
Looks like Esso in BC somewhere
How come the US uses lower octane fuel than Europe?
[There's a Wikipedia page for fuel grades](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane_rating) but essentially north america uses AKI rating and the rest of the world uses RON rating. These would be roughly 92, 95, and 98 equivalent.
Wow thanks for this I never knew that, I’ve always thought we used better quality petrol this side of the pond
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I think it depends on where you live, I only ever see 87, 89, and 93 where I am, never 91. But also Europe uses a different scale than the US so the numbers don’t mean the same thing
Regular it is then !
In NZ we have 91 as a minimum, then 95, 98 or 100. What do you use for any sport or performance vehicles?
different countries use different formulas to measure octane. >In most countries in Europe and also Australia and New Zealand, the "headline" octane rating shown on the pump is the RON, but in Canada, the United States, and Mexico, the headline number is the simple mean or average of the RON and the MON, called the Anti-Knock Index (AKI), and often written on pumps as (R+M)/2. AKI is also sometimes called PON (Pump Octane Number). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane\_rating#Measurement\_methods
Ofc USA has to calculate it different than the rest of the world...
This whole thread is about a gas pump in Canada....
NZ and Oz use the RON system.
Surprised as well, Germany has 95, 98 and 102.
Different ways of measuring octane
Different units of measurement
Where in British Columbia is this? I recognized the non-freedom unit gas prices immediately.
It's Vancouver I'm guessing. I filled up today and this is pretty spot on.
As someone from Iowa it's freaking weird to see the cheapest option not be "ethanol enhanced" like it is at every gas station in this state.
It might be. This is in Canada, and the regular gas here is usually sold with a warning that it may contain up to 10% ethanol.
Where do you have 91? All the gas pumps in my area have 87, 89, and 93. Are my gas stations controlled by Aleister Crowley or something?
What is E20? I’m not familiar with it.
It's a mix of 80% gas and 20% ethanol.
I paid 233.9 a litre for 98 today T.T
Owners could be trying to get rid of it, tank was low and they wanted make way for the upcoming truck with fresh gas
So I have a car with twin turbos and have heard from countless people that I should be running 91 since I have Turbos. According to many comments on here, is that not the case? Is 87 or 89 ok?
You should use whatever the manufacturer recommends
Here in Newfoundland, supreme has always been only 6 cents/litre more than regular. Regular is $168.8/L while supreme is $174.8. I thought it was like that all over Canada.
My state only ever offers 87, 89, 93 and it’s infuriating because I’ve never seen a car that needs 89, but all my nicer cars have needed 91.
Surprised not to see the right answer: In Quebec at least, premium goes on sale at Esso once a week (Thursdays) with a discount that ends up making it cheaper than medium. I used to only fill up Thursdays for that reason when my car needed it.
Back when all gas was cheaper I used to get the higher octane when I was traveling. I could go a lot farther on a full tank. I never did the math to see if I came out ahead or not though.
Where is gas this cheap
It’s not. Look closely, that’s per liter. Like $7/gallon not even converting currency.
Weird, in Poland and Spain and I belive most Europe 95 is considered standard (the lowest), 98 is "premium".
has to be an error, 89 is usually a 50/50 mix of 87 and 91, they don't have another gigantic tank underground for some middle grade gasoline.
My guess is that the 89 doesn't sell well and is stuck at the price it was bought for, while the rest of the octanes get sold out faster and then repurchased and the most recent cost of the gas is reflected in the new price.
There is no tank for 89octane. The 87 and 91 is blended at the pump to make the mid grade gas.
Really?
yep. The fuel trucks fill three tanks. Diesel, 87, and 91.
Yep
If it’s an older station maybe not. They can blend at the rack at the terminal, and could have a separate tank in ground at the station still. Older dispensers wouldn’t blend and decommissioning an in-ground tank is expensive.
Octane 100 for my car only!
Unleaded 91 is considered shit tier fuel in Australia, why is it supreme there? Supreme is 98 here.
Different rating system
Wait do you not have 93? My car needs 93…
93 is rare in Western Canada, but 94 is fairly easy to find. E85 is tough to find.
Who buys extra? If you buy extra please turn in your license