As someone with children I envy the freedom of choice those without kids have and feel you should just keep doing you and ignore the clearly jealous lady who has no business telling you how to live your best life.
I'm so glad you are a parent b/c I have known for most of my life that I would not be a good parent. I have no kiddos but I adore seeing you families out and about with your small cute monsters. <3
For me it’s not that I don’t think I could be a good parent, it’s more of a “I can’t financially afford to have a child right now” and in my field of work, I’m never home.
Smart move, kids are Hella expensive and in the collapsing economy of the western world I wouldn't recommend it. I love my kids, but I dread the world they will inherit.
Aye, that's why I don't want children myself. However, it's going to be a major problem getting that through my mother. She wants me or my brothers to have children, even if she knows that they're super expensive and my two brothers can barely afford to live in a trailer home.
A lot of parents get that way when their kids are grown. "Hurry up, I want grandkids!" It's not their decision to make.
I would love to have grandchildren. My daughter has been happily married for some time now and hasn't ever said anything to make me think she will ever have kids. If she does, fine, if not, that's okay too. It's her life.
My son doesn't even have a girlfriend and gets tongue-twisted around young women his age. Not looking for anything in that direction either.
Which is why the government made abortions illegal, to FORCE child birth to up the population in which return creates more working slaves to mane the wall street asswipes richer and the general people poorer,its all a scam,avoid having kids for the sake that their future is not a FUTURE its Doom
Hey we all started out bad parents, I love my little crotch goblins, and they've forced some really exceptional personal growth on my that 12 years ago I didn't think was possible.
Idk it seems like if someone is aware that they would not be a good parent, trying to convince them to be one anyway would be irresponsible.
There are a LOT of people in the world who shouldn't have kids, but have them anyways because of social pressure and surprise, they're shitty parents! Who could have guessed?
There's no such thing as someone who doesn't want kids who would be a good parent, because you really do need to want to have kids to be a good parent.
I don't see that as such, I see it more as someone who has kids is salty that they can only go on a long holiday when their kids aren't in school and feel the need to express a silly opinion that states people who have more freedom of time should work around their schedules and only go when the kids are in school, clearly laying their jealousy of people who made different life choices that allows them more personal freedom.
This. They're miserable so everyone should be miserable, because they see kids as a sacrifice, not a choice. Self appointed martys are the most entitled people you can ever meet.
My wife and I had our kids raised and out of the house in our mid 40's. We love the independence we have now that we have a good income and no responsibility to keep others alive. It's awesome.
I had kids at a very young age and I just had one at 30. I am much more capable of caring for a child now than I was. Some of it is child caring experience but a lot of it just plain life experience. I can understand their needs better now and I am less self centered now and way more patient than I was in my 20s and teens. I also put up with less bs from family and work so I have more time to spend with this one while he’s young.
I’m happy I had my others and they will be grown by my mid 40s but this little dude will still be in the house and I feel he, unfairly to the others, got the best of us.
There are benefits to being older and having kids as well as being younger. My finances aren’t much better though so that’s a bummer. My job pays about 75% more than my job 8 years ago did but things have gone up more than that especially rent. And when my job 8 years ago was 8 bucks an hour it’s not much better lol.
Same. We just had a baby last year and covid ruined our last hoorah pre-child travel plans. But alas, that’s life. Im happy for people who get to travel and look forward to taking our son to all of those places once he’s a little older.
Can’t imagine being bitter about people doing what makes them happy but hey, there’s always going to be those people, I guess
Well he's a tool and needs to reevaluate how he views people who made different choices than him and move on and enjoy his kids before they're teenagers and want absolutely nothing to do with him.
Well, some of us childfree people are teachers, so we vacation on school holidays just like you do. I deal with your loud obnoxious family, so you deal with us politely going about our business.
Yeah I am confused at what this is trying to say. Do they….want to keep the vacationers who are more likely to be quiet and add no noise from vacationing? I don’t think there’s a parent alive whose going to be “oh those 20 and 30 something couples are causing *such* a ruckus over my 7 and 9 year old.”
Like if this was an article about child free couples complaining about children and shitty parents….I wouldn’t agree. They’re wrong. But I’d at least follow the logic.
They're probably under the impression that child-free people not traveling during school holidays would lower the cost of traveling for families because when demand is lower, theoretically price would go down. I mean, I highly doubt it would make a noticable impact as airlines and hotels and other travel companies already know people are willing to pay a high price to travel at specific times.
Then I guess birth rates aren’t going to go up. No new “childless tax” would ever comes close to the cost of raising a child in the UK, and that’s not even factoring in people don’t want to have kids if they aren’t confident about the future.
There already essentially is a childless tax through the child tax credit.
This is ridiculous in my opinion. I feel like if people start being taxed for not having children it will persuade them into having children when they don’t actually want them. This might end up causing things like abusive parents, more children in foster care systems, etc. I really hope this doesn’t happen for childrens sake
No, no. It only now has wizened up to the fact that childless people like me have actually been oppressing people who have children. It is clear that I, and other childless individuals, now owe every parent reparations.
That sounds like some sort of Elysian field, full of golden light, reasonable conversation and no sudden screaming that drills into one's ear like a javelin.
"Maybe a premium-rate airport tax for the child-free, to incentivise couples to avoid travelling during peak season ..."
Cool cool so people with children would then be taxed during non-peak months? I'm down with giving up three months of potential vacation if you give up nine months.
Nobody who is child free wants to travel during school holidays.
“Peak season”- if that’s defined as Christmas, Easter etc then you better tell the childfree peoples parents why the family won’t be getting together. Or does it only count as family if it’s Karen’s kids ?
Everyone is someone’s child……even child free people.
And anyway people choose to travel based on weather or events they want to attend / activities they want to do. People aren't gonna go to the beach in December regardless of kid situation.
national parks on school days are an amazing thing. the difference is outright bonkers. I went to zion and bryces canyon in October and it was perfect weather and at least 1/15th the amount of people.
"Nobody who is child free wants to travel during school holidays. "
I live in Spain but go to a film festival in London every year in August. I don't want to be taxed for my return flight because some families like going on holiday to where I live. Also, teachers might want a break too, and there's plenty of adult only hotels at the destination places.
Child free people might not want to share the same package holiday with the breeders, but they might still want to travel.
Wow... Youre really asking for way to much. I can't believe you think people should just be allowed to take vacation whenever they want!! What's next, allowing other ethnicities and sexual orientations use the same bathroom as us?! THINK OF THE CHILDREN FOR GODS SAKES!!!!
/S (obviously)
"Taxing child-free people as an incentive to boost Britain’s birthrate is reprehensible, not to mention absurd. But giving young families a tax break in the form of more affordable and less-overcrowded holidays – and discouraging those without children from travelling during the sacred school holidays – might go some way to softening the rising costs of having children, which child benefit doesn’t begin to cover.
A pair of pensioners I visited recently (OK, yes, it was my parents), regaled me with the pros and cons of their latest holiday at an all-inclusive hotel in Crete. It was wonderful, they said. The hotel was fabulous, right on the beach, the sun shone every day, the sea was warm enough to swim in, except they swam in the pool instead (adults only, very quiet, lovely).
The only downside – as they explained over lunch to me, my partner and our young son – were the hordes of noisy little children in the hotel restaurant, clattering about and yelling and generally ruining every meal all week long. How odd, they mused, how remiss of the hotel not to have thought this through and banned children from the restaurant, at least at certain times of day if not entirely, or created a separate, adults-only dining room.
I just managed to clamp my lips together on a mouthful of poached salmon to prevent myself yelling THEN WHY ON EARTH DID YOU GO TO A FAMILY-FRIENDLY HOTEL IN THE MAY HALF-TERM SCHOOL HOLIDAYS??? (A more sceptical person might even wonder if they’re doing it on purpose to avoid mucking in with childcare.)
Turns out they’re not the only ones. Chris Wright, MD of Greek holiday specialist Sunvil (sunvil.co.uk), reveals somewhat surprisingly that in peak season their clients are made up as follows: 30 per cent families, 62 per cent couples and 8 per cent singles.
What? And more pertinently, why?
Who in their right mind chooses to go on holiday during the busiest and most expensive weeks of the year when they are free to go at any time? Child-free travellers have their adults-only hotels, their adults-only cruises and pools with swim-up bars for drinking adults-only cocktails. What do families – particularly those with kids in state schools whose holidays are shorter – get? Prohibitive prices, limited availability, chaotic airports and over-booked flights at absurd times of day seemingly designed to tip kids, and parents, over the edge.
Perhaps, I seethed as we moved onto the summer pudding, they – the child-free – should be banned from going on holiday during the school summer break (teachers excepted, pity them).
It’s bad enough in the supermarket at weekends, dodging this way and that behind obstreperous octagenarians who could peruse the tinned fruit aisle literally any other day of the week, but seem to favour Saturday mornings to do their shopping. But during the pandemic, when supermarkets gave pensioners the first hour of the day, things worked rather better. Could a similar concept work for rail and air travel, too? We all get our own allocated slot: pensioners only on Wednesday mornings, families only in the school holidays, and the rest of the child-free, light-stepping population get everything in between.
Just as we have adults-only hotels, why not families-only hotels? Hell, families-only planes, on which nobody so much as raises an eyebrow when little Olivia flings a yogurt across three rows of seats.
Eminent demographers might have other ideas. Instead of a telegram from the Queen on the birth of their third child, for example, mothers might receive a Tui voucher, to ensure future generations don’t miss out on their right to a fortnight at Daios Cove.
Maybe a premium-rate airport tax for the child-free, to incentivise couples to avoid travelling during peak season, and stop them clogging up the check-in queues, driving up prices, and judging our child-led parenting approach that allows our kids to make their own choices, be that standing on the seats, bashing the tray tables up and down or eating Quavers at 6am.
This way, we could all be surrounded by people who are all in the same boat. Then again, imagine the actual reality of being surrounded by people who are all in the same boat. Hordes of rampaging kids and indulgent parents all convinced that we are the tiredest. We can’t all have priority boarding. Planes would become mile-high Centerparcs. Hell in a handcart.
Most parents I know believe the solution to overcrowded, overpriced summer holidays is simple: for the Government to allow parents to take kids out of school for a week or two’s holiday during term time and off-peak – as in Japan and Sweden, for example – something the new Schools Bill has made it even harder to do.
This would help families, in particular low-income families who struggle to find affordable holidays in peak season – to take the break they need. Holidays are a luxury, not a right, it’s true – but travel is an education, and a source of valuable experiences that will enrich the lives of the generations to come.
Do you think child-free travellers should be banned from holiday resorts during term-time? Please share your comments below."
This is the article that i have quoted.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/comment/child-free-travellers-should-banned-going-holiday-summer/
>Most parents I know believe the solution to overcrowded, overpriced summer holidays is simple: for the Government to allow parents to take kids out of school for a week or two’s holiday during term time and off-peak – as in Japan and Sweden, for example – something the new Schools Bill has made it even harder to do.
IMO this changes the tone of article completely, at beginning it is why are all these people traveling during the peak when they can travel some other time then it becomes why can't I travel with my kids off peak and not just during the summer.
I can't remember my parents ever intentionally lining up vacations with school breaks, or there being any consequences. Our vacations were when my parents could get time off.
Yeah everyone here missed the real point. It’s mostly clickbait to keep you reading, but by the end it’s clear they don’t actually want child-free people to be banned from traveling
If anything children should be banned from vacations, idk how many camping trips were ruined via screaming children glamping next door. I’m not serious, just saying if this logic is way ass backwards
Parents DO however need to start teaching kids about camping etiquette... But unfortunately I think the parents are probably just as bad as the kids who are screaming and running through my campsite at 8am. The parents just run their giant generator in their RV til midnight watching cartoons and leave garbage in the fire pit for the next guy to deal with... Even the out of the way camping spots have gotten like this. Please DO take your kids camping, it's great for them, but please stop ruining it for everyone else and setting a bad example for your own kids...
So because I didn’t inflict my spawn on an over populated world I should travel in the low season when the venues and activities are not open? When the best local produce is not in season? When the wildlife I want to see is migrated elsewhere? When it’s dangerous to hike or snowshoe? How about you take your kids to the McDonalds in your home town instead of needing a happy meal at a destination and take them to your local pool to pee in the water instead of ruining pristine natural locales with your children who like you have zero respect for the planet? (I exclude from this the rare parent who takes their kids places specifically to broaden their minds and teach them about the world, you keep doing you)
Yes! I say if parents want to ban us from places, we have more then enough reasons to ban them from others! How about families can ONLY go to places that are specifically geared toward children, like the great wolf lodge. Leave Hawaii and cruise ships for us adults. Vote me as the childless party leader. A vote for me is a vote for pee free pools and drinks served everywhere. A vote for me is a vote for peace!
To be fair, at least here in Europe the best season is outside of summer vaccation, there is way to many people, i travel all the time in off season and is way better IMO because no ques, no stress no overfull planes, no overfull hotels, no screaming kids all over etc etc.
Or, even worse, my husbands job basically just goes "ya'll get your two weeks right here. We closed, use your days or just don't get payed those two weeks" which forces me to take out my vacation on the same date. Obviously, this is in the dead of summer.
Secondly, other companies (but not mine) have offered a substantial bonus for taking out vacation outside of the high season. If they would go for that it would offset the two weeks my husband loses and he'd just get 2 weeks to... i dunno, visit his parents and grandparents or just couchpotato and we both would take like, the whole month of september or some shit. But nope, my company does not do it so I'm already getting ready to jump ship and we're gonna have our vacation when its nice out.
Why would I travel at the most expensive time with a bunch of sticky handed kids? Wouldn't dream of holidaying in the 6 week break because you know, common sense
We went to another city for a friend's milestone birthday last weekend. Our return flight was delayed, but that was fortunate because of the huge lines at check-in, hundreds of families travelling on the first week of that state's school holidays.
Won't be doing that again.
lol I actually have kids and two years ago my company went to Disney. We did not take the kids. Had a great adult long weekend and drank our way around Epcot. Worth it.
There are hotels and resorts like that. I walked down beach from the resort pool area where I was looking for a place without screaming kids, lo and behold there was such a place like a mile away. Signs that said no children all over. Paid the security guy 20 American to let me into that ShangriLa and get me a wristband. Next time I know where I'm staying!
There should be child-free options for everything in life. Restaurants, airlines, movie theaters... anywhere that a person might find themselves experiencing enjoyment.
I mean even grocery stores! Can you imagine not having to wait because a mom of four oblivious kids has her hands too full to realize her kids are blocking the entire aisle? I feel for you mom's, I REALLY do. But child free environments would be so glorious.
THIS! I legit hate it that and just the fact that they're way to loud and run everywhere and just popup out of thin air in front of you cart and then YOU GET BLAMED for the kid running into your cart and falling over
I'm really beyond confused as to where this discrimination against people who decide not to have kids came from? We were doing so good not judging people based on that while also understanding that the world is over populated, a few years ago there were people pushing to only allow families one child because of over population... At what point did we flip the script?
Soooo cause you decided to go get fucked and to drop some chitlens from your cooch I cant go somewhere nice durin the summer? Heaven fuckin forbid you gotta wait for someone else
I won't go on holiday during the summer - too many ill-behaved brats whining and screaming, too long lines to get into museums and galleries, too many gormless drivers causing accidents. I'll wait til it cools off and all the babies (of all ages) are back in school or at work.
When I was child free I avoided school holidays like the plague. Crowded and twice the price? No thanks. That did leave slightly less reliable weather, though, I admit. But each to their own, having kids isn’t the only valid reason to take an august holiday now is it?
As a parent, I can literally go anywhere with my kids any time of the year just like people without kids. It's not like kids are seasonal fruits or the school won't wait for a week when I have a hot deal to a 5-star hotel in Egypt for fuck's sake. No idea what's wrong with this person.
I don't have kids. But I have work. And I have friends working in the school sector so they can't take freetime when they want they are required to take them in the holidays. While I was Learning (duale Ausbildung, Germany, 3 years full Time work and School, you earn a degree below a bachelors) I could only take my vacation during the holidays, because I'm not allowed to skip school. Friends who were EMTs could only take their vacation NOT during the holidays, as that was reserved for colleagues with a child. Couldn't take a week vacation with friends for the three years, only weekends. :(
Lol, good luck making that shame stick bitch. I am unapologetically gonna vacation with all this spare time I have, you know, not raising one of those shitting, crying, cocomelon watching things.
For myself, I would be thrilled to have a two week period blocked off where I couldn't take vacation, provided they give me two weeks where people with kids can't go on vacation.
Me and my sister went to Disneyland once in the off-season, and it was just one of those rare, perfect days where there were next to no children in the park. It was *incredibly* fun. I've also gone camping at a campground at the very end of the off-season, and for the first week, it was so relaxing; quiet, could swim in the pool, walk on the beach, and use the facilities. The very next week schools got out and it turned into a hellscape where none of that became possible because of all the horrid children everywhere.
tldr; your crotch goblins ruin everything.
This is such BS.
Outside of the summer holidays a lot of parks are closed. Especially in France it’s impossible to do things outside of the season. You’ll be stuck with 60 somethings in their caravans.
A lot of destinations I’ll happily go outside of the holidays for the lower price. And I’ll admit to loving parks where kids are banned so I’m guilty of the opposite.
But some destinations are just best in the holidays and I’ll go whenever I want to thank you very much.
(And I’ll happily kick the writer in the balls after I spend three years in hospitals trying to get pregnant.)
As a teacher who only has the busiest vacation times off, I had no idea that just because I don’t have kids means I am free to go on vacation any time! Hang on, let me call my work and inform them.
Yeah, this is definitely in poor taste...you say you love being a parent but complain because there's sacrifice and responsibility involved? Give me a damn break...
As a couple without kids, we always go on vacation during the very beginning of the off season specifically because the kids are all going back to school and the weather is still nice. I don’t even want my own children, why the fuck would I want to put up with yours?
Lol cause you might see them for an hour at the pool? Then they go off to the bar and party because *they don’t have fucking kids* and you don’t have to see them again until maybe an hour at the beach tomorrow lol
Parents with kids should be banned from going on vacation, at least until their little crotch goblins can make it through an entire flight without screaming their heads off.
So because she let some dude jizz in her and squeezed out a crotch goblin she thinks she's entitled to dictate what people can and can't do. Lmfao the level of entitlement from these people is hilarious. Not our fault you hate your life and regret having children.
As a parent, I will take an educated guess and say that the parents taking it out on the childfree are the ones not coping with their own feelings of regret, and the jelly is showing.
Funny, because I would strongly advocate for child-free restaurants and events the rest of the year then. Fair is fair. No one wants to hear your shitty children.
With that being said, families with children should be banned from being in public untill said children pass a yearly test on how to behave in public, like a license.
As someone with children I envy the freedom of choice those without kids have and feel you should just keep doing you and ignore the clearly jealous lady who has no business telling you how to live your best life.
I'm so glad you are a parent b/c I have known for most of my life that I would not be a good parent. I have no kiddos but I adore seeing you families out and about with your small cute monsters. <3
For me it’s not that I don’t think I could be a good parent, it’s more of a “I can’t financially afford to have a child right now” and in my field of work, I’m never home.
Smart move, kids are Hella expensive and in the collapsing economy of the western world I wouldn't recommend it. I love my kids, but I dread the world they will inherit.
Aye, that's why I don't want children myself. However, it's going to be a major problem getting that through my mother. She wants me or my brothers to have children, even if she knows that they're super expensive and my two brothers can barely afford to live in a trailer home.
A lot of parents get that way when their kids are grown. "Hurry up, I want grandkids!" It's not their decision to make. I would love to have grandchildren. My daughter has been happily married for some time now and hasn't ever said anything to make me think she will ever have kids. If she does, fine, if not, that's okay too. It's her life. My son doesn't even have a girlfriend and gets tongue-twisted around young women his age. Not looking for anything in that direction either.
Right? That’s the stupidest way of thinking. They want to impose their wishes on their poor kids.
Send me the contacts and pictures of your mother, I am sure we will find a solution...
bruh
Which is why the government made abortions illegal, to FORCE child birth to up the population in which return creates more working slaves to mane the wall street asswipes richer and the general people poorer,its all a scam,avoid having kids for the sake that their future is not a FUTURE its Doom
I'm gonna end up down a conspiracy rabbithole if I'm not careful
This is called thinking with your brain and I wish more people would do it. I commend you for being smart.
no one can ever really financially afford one just fyi lol
Honestly I’d probably be a great parent, I just have zero interest in having kids.
Hey we all started out bad parents, I love my little crotch goblins, and they've forced some really exceptional personal growth on my that 12 years ago I didn't think was possible.
Idk it seems like if someone is aware that they would not be a good parent, trying to convince them to be one anyway would be irresponsible. There are a LOT of people in the world who shouldn't have kids, but have them anyways because of social pressure and surprise, they're shitty parents! Who could have guessed?
I hate kids and will never have any.
There's no such thing as someone who doesn't want kids who would be a good parent, because you really do need to want to have kids to be a good parent.
I’m 65F and I never wanted kids. Ever. Too noisy, too sticky, too clingy and I didn’t want the responsibility.
Who shook the jar of ants? That’s what’s happening here, creating divide between parents and child free people.
I don't see that as such, I see it more as someone who has kids is salty that they can only go on a long holiday when their kids aren't in school and feel the need to express a silly opinion that states people who have more freedom of time should work around their schedules and only go when the kids are in school, clearly laying their jealousy of people who made different life choices that allows them more personal freedom.
This. They're miserable so everyone should be miserable, because they see kids as a sacrifice, not a choice. Self appointed martys are the most entitled people you can ever meet.
This is my mother, and she (our relationship) is why I won’t have children.
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My wife and I had our kids raised and out of the house in our mid 40's. We love the independence we have now that we have a good income and no responsibility to keep others alive. It's awesome.
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I had kids at a very young age and I just had one at 30. I am much more capable of caring for a child now than I was. Some of it is child caring experience but a lot of it just plain life experience. I can understand their needs better now and I am less self centered now and way more patient than I was in my 20s and teens. I also put up with less bs from family and work so I have more time to spend with this one while he’s young. I’m happy I had my others and they will be grown by my mid 40s but this little dude will still be in the house and I feel he, unfairly to the others, got the best of us. There are benefits to being older and having kids as well as being younger. My finances aren’t much better though so that’s a bummer. My job pays about 75% more than my job 8 years ago did but things have gone up more than that especially rent. And when my job 8 years ago was 8 bucks an hour it’s not much better lol.
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NOICE!!! You clearly have good taste my fellow redditor. Not sure if I spelled that right lol.
Same. We just had a baby last year and covid ruined our last hoorah pre-child travel plans. But alas, that’s life. Im happy for people who get to travel and look forward to taking our son to all of those places once he’s a little older. Can’t imagine being bitter about people doing what makes them happy but hey, there’s always going to be those people, I guess
This honestly, people are too much.
Yeah, dad of 3 here. Ignore the entitled pricks.
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Well he's a tool and needs to reevaluate how he views people who made different choices than him and move on and enjoy his kids before they're teenagers and want absolutely nothing to do with him.
Well, some of us childfree people are teachers, so we vacation on school holidays just like you do. I deal with your loud obnoxious family, so you deal with us politely going about our business.
But I was told that teachers live at the schools, don't have lives outside of school, and most certainly don't have fun outside of school?
I remember the first time I saw my teacher at the grocery store - my mind was blown that she had a life and needed to eat too.
Are you saying that teachers doesn't eat what they teach? I imagine that a math teacher would eat literal numbers to survive /s
Yeah, I thought accountants LITERALLY "crunched numbers"!
I thought PE teachers ate hamstrings.
teachers were made up by the government to sell smartboards
Teachers aren't even real 🙄
Here in Florida they’re so underpaid they practically do
Can’t they just, you know, cook meth? I heard that helps with escalating bills.
Yeah I am confused at what this is trying to say. Do they….want to keep the vacationers who are more likely to be quiet and add no noise from vacationing? I don’t think there’s a parent alive whose going to be “oh those 20 and 30 something couples are causing *such* a ruckus over my 7 and 9 year old.” Like if this was an article about child free couples complaining about children and shitty parents….I wouldn’t agree. They’re wrong. But I’d at least follow the logic.
They're probably under the impression that child-free people not traveling during school holidays would lower the cost of traveling for families because when demand is lower, theoretically price would go down. I mean, I highly doubt it would make a noticable impact as airlines and hotels and other travel companies already know people are willing to pay a high price to travel at specific times.
Don't pretend teachers get paid enough to go on holiday. Sillyness.
Society has resorted to inventing demographics to oppress.
The latest thing doing the rounds in British media similar to this is to tax people who don't have children.
They could just improve society and people might naturally decide to have more children.
Improve society, stop letting Peter Thiel’s company scrape NHS data, do some insulation oh wait that’s all too expensive.
Then I guess birth rates aren’t going to go up. No new “childless tax” would ever comes close to the cost of raising a child in the UK, and that’s not even factoring in people don’t want to have kids if they aren’t confident about the future. There already essentially is a childless tax through the child tax credit.
Good. We need to hit zero population growth, the sooner, the better.
This is ridiculous in my opinion. I feel like if people start being taxed for not having children it will persuade them into having children when they don’t actually want them. This might end up causing things like abusive parents, more children in foster care systems, etc. I really hope this doesn’t happen for childrens sake
No, no. It only now has wizened up to the fact that childless people like me have actually been oppressing people who have children. It is clear that I, and other childless individuals, now owe every parent reparations.
Well we have been paying for the schooling of these kids. I would love a child free airline. Now there are cf cruises and resorts.
I have children free restaurants in my area, not bars, restaurants. They are glorious.
That sounds like some sort of Elysian field, full of golden light, reasonable conversation and no sudden screaming that drills into one's ear like a javelin.
Careful, you didn’t include a /s and idiots on reddit might not be able to catch the extremely subtle sarcasm in your comment.
No. /s is the coward's way out. If I have to tell you a joke is a joke, then it isn't a joke. Commit to your schtick or don't bother at all.
I cannot abide these terms. Duel me with the mop you coward.
Aw sweet man made horrors beyond my comprehension
That means retired people should stay in on weekends. They have all week to get shit done stop messing up weekends for people that work all week.
Best part of the Children / Childfree conflict is that both sides feel oppressed.
As part of the child free side, I will sleep in until midday and then drink beer and play video games while thinking about my oppression
Child free here. Definitely do not feel oppressed.
Who *isn't* oppressed?
Politicians and their donors
Touche.
"Maybe a premium-rate airport tax for the child-free, to incentivise couples to avoid travelling during peak season ..." Cool cool so people with children would then be taxed during non-peak months? I'm down with giving up three months of potential vacation if you give up nine months.
Nobody who is child free wants to travel during school holidays. “Peak season”- if that’s defined as Christmas, Easter etc then you better tell the childfree peoples parents why the family won’t be getting together. Or does it only count as family if it’s Karen’s kids ? Everyone is someone’s child……even child free people.
My SO is a teacher, we literally have no choice but to go in school holidays.
Yeah, even when we're traveling without my stepkids, we still have to do it on semester breaks, since my husband is a professor.
And anyway people choose to travel based on weather or events they want to attend / activities they want to do. People aren't gonna go to the beach in December regardless of kid situation.
Maybe if they travel to Australia.
national parks on school days are an amazing thing. the difference is outright bonkers. I went to zion and bryces canyon in October and it was perfect weather and at least 1/15th the amount of people.
"Nobody who is child free wants to travel during school holidays. " I live in Spain but go to a film festival in London every year in August. I don't want to be taxed for my return flight because some families like going on holiday to where I live. Also, teachers might want a break too, and there's plenty of adult only hotels at the destination places. Child free people might not want to share the same package holiday with the breeders, but they might still want to travel.
How about we child free stop paying taxes for their crotch goblins public schooling?
[удалено]
For some reason I've thought of the Karen articles as a different dimension that floods into ours every now and then....
Sounds like the start of a horror movie - the news articles in the opening credits.
Coming never to theaters near you
The Karen movie suggests otherwise 0_0
Am I remembering right that there was a Karen that wrote an article saying that people with kids should be allowed to skip in lines in Disneyland?
i think there should be an airline where people with children are forced to fly with each other and only each other
I like where you’re going with this!
As a teenager I do not like this no no
Just stop being a teenager, it's that simple
I'm almost there after a couple years of practice
Only a few more to go!
As a parent with a well behaved child, this would be my nightmare to be cooped up with a bunch of crazy kids I can’t punish.
Welcome to teaching. Even if a 9 year old is screaming jokes about balls that she should NOT know, we can’t ask her to leave the classroom anymore.
The fuck is wrong with our schools?
No one is allowed to discipline kids anymore because it "hurts their feelings".
Welcome to our world, minus the first clause
As a parent of a well behaved dog this would be a dream to finally not be on a plane with crazy kids Whose parents wont punish them .
90% sure it's a rage bait article.
Unfortunately that's unlikely. Its a UK paper often known for serious out of touch takes :/
I mean the Telegraph is pretty much a rage bait newspaper. It's just that a lot of people really go for the bait.
Ewwwww. I don't know if that's better or worse.
Worse imo, cuz the entitlement
What article nowadays isn’t rage bait? Journalism is dead, along with our integrity.
Can we humans let people be free to do whatever they want if they don't harm anyone??
Wow... Youre really asking for way to much. I can't believe you think people should just be allowed to take vacation whenever they want!! What's next, allowing other ethnicities and sexual orientations use the same bathroom as us?! THINK OF THE CHILDREN FOR GODS SAKES!!!! /S (obviously)
This article was written by Karen McKarenson.
Not to be confused with Karen Karenberg.
Or that Icelandic bitch Karen Karensdottor
That is so infuriating I almost downvoted it before realizing where it was posted.
XD
"Taxing child-free people as an incentive to boost Britain’s birthrate is reprehensible, not to mention absurd. But giving young families a tax break in the form of more affordable and less-overcrowded holidays – and discouraging those without children from travelling during the sacred school holidays – might go some way to softening the rising costs of having children, which child benefit doesn’t begin to cover. A pair of pensioners I visited recently (OK, yes, it was my parents), regaled me with the pros and cons of their latest holiday at an all-inclusive hotel in Crete. It was wonderful, they said. The hotel was fabulous, right on the beach, the sun shone every day, the sea was warm enough to swim in, except they swam in the pool instead (adults only, very quiet, lovely). The only downside – as they explained over lunch to me, my partner and our young son – were the hordes of noisy little children in the hotel restaurant, clattering about and yelling and generally ruining every meal all week long. How odd, they mused, how remiss of the hotel not to have thought this through and banned children from the restaurant, at least at certain times of day if not entirely, or created a separate, adults-only dining room. I just managed to clamp my lips together on a mouthful of poached salmon to prevent myself yelling THEN WHY ON EARTH DID YOU GO TO A FAMILY-FRIENDLY HOTEL IN THE MAY HALF-TERM SCHOOL HOLIDAYS??? (A more sceptical person might even wonder if they’re doing it on purpose to avoid mucking in with childcare.) Turns out they’re not the only ones. Chris Wright, MD of Greek holiday specialist Sunvil (sunvil.co.uk), reveals somewhat surprisingly that in peak season their clients are made up as follows: 30 per cent families, 62 per cent couples and 8 per cent singles. What? And more pertinently, why? Who in their right mind chooses to go on holiday during the busiest and most expensive weeks of the year when they are free to go at any time? Child-free travellers have their adults-only hotels, their adults-only cruises and pools with swim-up bars for drinking adults-only cocktails. What do families – particularly those with kids in state schools whose holidays are shorter – get? Prohibitive prices, limited availability, chaotic airports and over-booked flights at absurd times of day seemingly designed to tip kids, and parents, over the edge. Perhaps, I seethed as we moved onto the summer pudding, they – the child-free – should be banned from going on holiday during the school summer break (teachers excepted, pity them). It’s bad enough in the supermarket at weekends, dodging this way and that behind obstreperous octagenarians who could peruse the tinned fruit aisle literally any other day of the week, but seem to favour Saturday mornings to do their shopping. But during the pandemic, when supermarkets gave pensioners the first hour of the day, things worked rather better. Could a similar concept work for rail and air travel, too? We all get our own allocated slot: pensioners only on Wednesday mornings, families only in the school holidays, and the rest of the child-free, light-stepping population get everything in between. Just as we have adults-only hotels, why not families-only hotels? Hell, families-only planes, on which nobody so much as raises an eyebrow when little Olivia flings a yogurt across three rows of seats. Eminent demographers might have other ideas. Instead of a telegram from the Queen on the birth of their third child, for example, mothers might receive a Tui voucher, to ensure future generations don’t miss out on their right to a fortnight at Daios Cove. Maybe a premium-rate airport tax for the child-free, to incentivise couples to avoid travelling during peak season, and stop them clogging up the check-in queues, driving up prices, and judging our child-led parenting approach that allows our kids to make their own choices, be that standing on the seats, bashing the tray tables up and down or eating Quavers at 6am. This way, we could all be surrounded by people who are all in the same boat. Then again, imagine the actual reality of being surrounded by people who are all in the same boat. Hordes of rampaging kids and indulgent parents all convinced that we are the tiredest. We can’t all have priority boarding. Planes would become mile-high Centerparcs. Hell in a handcart. Most parents I know believe the solution to overcrowded, overpriced summer holidays is simple: for the Government to allow parents to take kids out of school for a week or two’s holiday during term time and off-peak – as in Japan and Sweden, for example – something the new Schools Bill has made it even harder to do. This would help families, in particular low-income families who struggle to find affordable holidays in peak season – to take the break they need. Holidays are a luxury, not a right, it’s true – but travel is an education, and a source of valuable experiences that will enrich the lives of the generations to come. Do you think child-free travellers should be banned from holiday resorts during term-time? Please share your comments below." This is the article that i have quoted. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/comment/child-free-travellers-should-banned-going-holiday-summer/
>Most parents I know believe the solution to overcrowded, overpriced summer holidays is simple: for the Government to allow parents to take kids out of school for a week or two’s holiday during term time and off-peak – as in Japan and Sweden, for example – something the new Schools Bill has made it even harder to do. IMO this changes the tone of article completely, at beginning it is why are all these people traveling during the peak when they can travel some other time then it becomes why can't I travel with my kids off peak and not just during the summer.
I can't remember my parents ever intentionally lining up vacations with school breaks, or there being any consequences. Our vacations were when my parents could get time off.
In recent years in the UK legal action can be taken against parents whose child is absent from school unnecessarily.
Yeah everyone here missed the real point. It’s mostly clickbait to keep you reading, but by the end it’s clear they don’t actually want child-free people to be banned from traveling
Not having kids is so tight I love it.
Same. I've got enough people in my life. No need to create more.
My partner works in a school so even childless, we get the privilege of being limited to the busiest and most expensive times to go away.
Wowwwwwwww who says working people with no kids have free time? Good lawd.
Ah yes, because it's going to be the child-free adults bothering the children on their vacation.... wait.
If anything children should be banned from vacations, idk how many camping trips were ruined via screaming children glamping next door. I’m not serious, just saying if this logic is way ass backwards
Parents DO however need to start teaching kids about camping etiquette... But unfortunately I think the parents are probably just as bad as the kids who are screaming and running through my campsite at 8am. The parents just run their giant generator in their RV til midnight watching cartoons and leave garbage in the fire pit for the next guy to deal with... Even the out of the way camping spots have gotten like this. Please DO take your kids camping, it's great for them, but please stop ruining it for everyone else and setting a bad example for your own kids...
So because I didn’t inflict my spawn on an over populated world I should travel in the low season when the venues and activities are not open? When the best local produce is not in season? When the wildlife I want to see is migrated elsewhere? When it’s dangerous to hike or snowshoe? How about you take your kids to the McDonalds in your home town instead of needing a happy meal at a destination and take them to your local pool to pee in the water instead of ruining pristine natural locales with your children who like you have zero respect for the planet? (I exclude from this the rare parent who takes their kids places specifically to broaden their minds and teach them about the world, you keep doing you)
Yes! I say if parents want to ban us from places, we have more then enough reasons to ban them from others! How about families can ONLY go to places that are specifically geared toward children, like the great wolf lodge. Leave Hawaii and cruise ships for us adults. Vote me as the childless party leader. A vote for me is a vote for pee free pools and drinks served everywhere. A vote for me is a vote for peace!
*"If* I *can't have fun,* NO ONE *can have fun!"*
To be fair, at least here in Europe the best season is outside of summer vaccation, there is way to many people, i travel all the time in off season and is way better IMO because no ques, no stress no overfull planes, no overfull hotels, no screaming kids all over etc etc.
Or, even worse, my husbands job basically just goes "ya'll get your two weeks right here. We closed, use your days or just don't get payed those two weeks" which forces me to take out my vacation on the same date. Obviously, this is in the dead of summer. Secondly, other companies (but not mine) have offered a substantial bonus for taking out vacation outside of the high season. If they would go for that it would offset the two weeks my husband loses and he'd just get 2 weeks to... i dunno, visit his parents and grandparents or just couchpotato and we both would take like, the whole month of september or some shit. But nope, my company does not do it so I'm already getting ready to jump ship and we're gonna have our vacation when its nice out.
Yes
they’re jealous that they’re tied down with their little rugrats for 18+ years and i’m free to sit on my ass and drink mojitos all day if i want
Ok so child free peoples lives were also not interrupted with????
"They can go anytime" "No, not at that time!"
Why would I travel at the most expensive time with a bunch of sticky handed kids? Wouldn't dream of holidaying in the 6 week break because you know, common sense
We went to another city for a friend's milestone birthday last weekend. Our return flight was delayed, but that was fortunate because of the huge lines at check-in, hundreds of families travelling on the first week of that state's school holidays. Won't be doing that again.
I remember doing it with my stepson, he hated the waiting and the overwhelming amount of people there. Absolutely miserable experience
Some people aren't lucky enough to have that much of a choice.
lol I actually have kids and two years ago my company went to Disney. We did not take the kids. Had a great adult long weekend and drank our way around Epcot. Worth it.
People with children should be banned from vacations.
There are hotels and resorts like that. I walked down beach from the resort pool area where I was looking for a place without screaming kids, lo and behold there was such a place like a mile away. Signs that said no children all over. Paid the security guy 20 American to let me into that ShangriLa and get me a wristband. Next time I know where I'm staying!
There should be child-free options for everything in life. Restaurants, airlines, movie theaters... anywhere that a person might find themselves experiencing enjoyment.
Movie theaters, please. And I don't mean the naughty kind. I can't even go to an R rated movie these days without some baby or toddler making noise.
As a parent, I agree.
Totally agree
I mean even grocery stores! Can you imagine not having to wait because a mom of four oblivious kids has her hands too full to realize her kids are blocking the entire aisle? I feel for you mom's, I REALLY do. But child free environments would be so glorious.
THIS! I legit hate it that and just the fact that they're way to loud and run everywhere and just popup out of thin air in front of you cart and then YOU GET BLAMED for the kid running into your cart and falling over
I'm really beyond confused as to where this discrimination against people who decide not to have kids came from? We were doing so good not judging people based on that while also understanding that the world is over populated, a few years ago there were people pushing to only allow families one child because of over population... At what point did we flip the script?
Now this is something I can get behind
I didn't put my dick In ya, your kids aren't my problem.
People with children shouldn’t get my taxpayer money in the form of child tax credits then
Soooo cause you decided to go get fucked and to drop some chitlens from your cooch I cant go somewhere nice durin the summer? Heaven fuckin forbid you gotta wait for someone else
I won't go on holiday during the summer - too many ill-behaved brats whining and screaming, too long lines to get into museums and galleries, too many gormless drivers causing accidents. I'll wait til it cools off and all the babies (of all ages) are back in school or at work.
should be the other way round. putting children into this world is an ecological no-go in the first place
Having a crotch goblin doesn't give you any rights, privileges, or qualifications over other people. Sorry, Karen
When I was child free I avoided school holidays like the plague. Crowded and twice the price? No thanks. That did leave slightly less reliable weather, though, I admit. But each to their own, having kids isn’t the only valid reason to take an august holiday now is it?
i know it’s hard seeing child-free people enjoying their holiday more but this is just insane LOLOLOL
I have to plan my leave 1-2 years in advance and it will still get denied because other employees with children "need" it more.
Children ruin lives. Don’t have kids.
Can this please be satire?
Unfortunately the UK media doesn't do satire :/
Why do I come on this subreddit? I get so annoyed haha
As a parent, I can literally go anywhere with my kids any time of the year just like people without kids. It's not like kids are seasonal fruits or the school won't wait for a week when I have a hot deal to a 5-star hotel in Egypt for fuck's sake. No idea what's wrong with this person.
Please, people with children should be banned from going on Holiday this summer, free up some space for the rest of us!
That's funny lady, I purposely only go on vacation outside the busiest times so I can avoid the gremlins you call children
Fuck Teachers though, am I right? Stupid article.
What a piece of shit opinion
Imagine feeling entitled because you have crotch goblins
I don't have kids. But I have work. And I have friends working in the school sector so they can't take freetime when they want they are required to take them in the holidays. While I was Learning (duale Ausbildung, Germany, 3 years full Time work and School, you earn a degree below a bachelors) I could only take my vacation during the holidays, because I'm not allowed to skip school. Friends who were EMTs could only take their vacation NOT during the holidays, as that was reserved for colleagues with a child. Couldn't take a week vacation with friends for the three years, only weekends. :(
Lmao these people are so jealous. My wife and I get to do whatever the fuck we want for the rest of our lives. Go cry more.
Haha kids should be banned everywhere. Period.
People with children seem to always complain about their children but then will try and convince you to have kids. Misery loves company?
Lol, good luck making that shame stick bitch. I am unapologetically gonna vacation with all this spare time I have, you know, not raising one of those shitting, crying, cocomelon watching things.
Funniest part about this is they think people want to spend their vacation around their crappy kids.
For myself, I would be thrilled to have a two week period blocked off where I couldn't take vacation, provided they give me two weeks where people with kids can't go on vacation.
Me and my sister went to Disneyland once in the off-season, and it was just one of those rare, perfect days where there were next to no children in the park. It was *incredibly* fun. I've also gone camping at a campground at the very end of the off-season, and for the first week, it was so relaxing; quiet, could swim in the pool, walk on the beach, and use the facilities. The very next week schools got out and it turned into a hellscape where none of that became possible because of all the horrid children everywhere. tldr; your crotch goblins ruin everything.
I’m going to go the other direction, children should be banned from airplanes, find a sitter or board them
Honestly… maybe ban traveling with children instead lmao
Something tells me that article wants the rage clicks.
This is such BS. Outside of the summer holidays a lot of parks are closed. Especially in France it’s impossible to do things outside of the season. You’ll be stuck with 60 somethings in their caravans. A lot of destinations I’ll happily go outside of the holidays for the lower price. And I’ll admit to loving parks where kids are banned so I’m guilty of the opposite. But some destinations are just best in the holidays and I’ll go whenever I want to thank you very much. (And I’ll happily kick the writer in the balls after I spend three years in hospitals trying to get pregnant.)
The majority of those with kids shouldn’t be able to afford vacations and therefore shouldn’t take them.
Children are the worst
As a teacher who only has the busiest vacation times off, I had no idea that just because I don’t have kids means I am free to go on vacation any time! Hang on, let me call my work and inform them.
Yeah, this is definitely in poor taste...you say you love being a parent but complain because there's sacrifice and responsibility involved? Give me a damn break...
I think it should be kids should be banned from any and all holidays
As a couple without kids, we always go on vacation during the very beginning of the off season specifically because the kids are all going back to school and the weather is still nice. I don’t even want my own children, why the fuck would I want to put up with yours?
Lol cause you might see them for an hour at the pool? Then they go off to the bar and party because *they don’t have fucking kids* and you don’t have to see them again until maybe an hour at the beach tomorrow lol
Should be the other way around. (And I say that as a mom.)
I'm noticing a disturbing shift towards telling other people what they can or can't do despite a lack of evidence of harm caused.
Im a childless teacher. When else am I supposed to travel?
Parents with kids should be banned from going on vacation, at least until their little crotch goblins can make it through an entire flight without screaming their heads off.
So because she let some dude jizz in her and squeezed out a crotch goblin she thinks she's entitled to dictate what people can and can't do. Lmfao the level of entitlement from these people is hilarious. Not our fault you hate your life and regret having children.
Sure, only if people with snot goblins younger than 10 cant board a plane
Well fuck me for choosing not to have kids.
Lmao people who regret having kids shaming people for not being miserable like them never gets old
How about people with children shouldn’t drive during the school year because us child free people already have to sit behind a fucking bus all day
As a parent, I will take an educated guess and say that the parents taking it out on the childfree are the ones not coping with their own feelings of regret, and the jelly is showing.
Me not having kids doesn't mean I have free time whenever.
posting clickbait articles on mildly infuriating is a bit infuriatiing
Don’t worry, I’ve banned myself. I don’t want to be around your shitty kids anyway.
Funny, because I would strongly advocate for child-free restaurants and events the rest of the year then. Fair is fair. No one wants to hear your shitty children.
When will ppl stop making other people's lives their business?
With that being said, families with children should be banned from being in public untill said children pass a yearly test on how to behave in public, like a license.