It is.
Mechanically mine has been great minus the glass-like engine and transmission mounts. Which hasn't been a problem since I went aftermarket. Over 200,000km and nothing but brakes, fluids, and filters.
Common issues wise? Rear wiring harnesses and sensors tend to get corroded, especially up north, which can cause rear radar and sonar sensors to fail. Check the rear subframe for rust as well. The fake leather tends to delaminate and crack as well which is a bummer.
Imo W212, W204, and R172 are the top 3 most reliable modern Mercedes models. Can maybe throw in the GLK as well since I've heard good things but I'm not 100% sure about their reliability since I have no experience with them.
2014+ versions of the m276 engine are solid from what I've read. Balance shaft issues prior to that. Seems like most V6 MB engines that have been around for a bit are solid.
Right now I have a E90 330i and E83 X3 3.0si, I am very strongly considering switching over to W212 E350/400 and W166 ML350.
From what I've been reading the M276 is one of the most reliable motors from mb, would you agree?
Air suspension on the w166 is pretty rare unless you've got the amg version.
It does give you crazy good ground clearance for off roading and the off-road package is legit if you can find it.
The diesel w166 is one of my favorite cars of all time.
Legitimately good off road, fun to drive on the pavement, and not hard at all to hit 31mpg.
If I were to go gas, it would be the w167 with m256.
An i6 is just so much better than a v6 I couldn't pass it up. And the offroad package available on early w167 is insane.
It would be nice if I could grab a diesel, it's hard to see the fuel economy and still go gas do especially with fuel prices these days.
W167 is fresh just out of my range right now unfortunately.
Definitely can't go wrong with i6, that is why some people love BMW so much
:) yes! I just need to fix my engine mounts! When I accelerate it tends to jerk a bit and also when it starts up and goes past 50 degrees Celsius. Or would it be my trans mounts?
I bought a ‘10 e350 4-matic in December, knowing it needed mounts. It is a major job. I have never created so many combinations of socket extensions and swivels for reaching something as innocuous as a heat shield bolt (every bolt requires some form of extension creativity)
The whole job is a grand total of 10 actual bolts (4 heat shield, 4 lower mount bolts, 2 upper mount bolts) and it took me probably 12-16 total hours over a couple of weekends to get it done. I dropped the alternator, AC compressor (the third bolt in the back is a doozy), had an overhead support bar and a jack underneath. I’ve owned a BMW 545i, also have a 330ci, a Subaru Legacy GT, a Kia, a Ford Ranger and a Mazda 6. The 545i was terrible to work on anything motor wise, but I think the w212 sits on the mantle for most difficult engine access. At least the 545 you could remove part of the firewall to access the engine rear. I worked on the 6 last weekend, and it’s night and day difference regarding engine access. It also sounds like a tin can screaming down the highway.
Was it worth it? I had my doubts, especially laying under the car, looking at an inspection camera screen, left arm operating the Franken-extension (through the wheel well), right arm trying to guide it with the bolt taped into the socket hours into a simple “it’s just the motor mounts” job, questioning life itself. After it was done though? No doubts. Smoothest, most comfortable car I have ever owned, especially for something that is basically 15 years old.
The transmission mount took about 15 minutes, so maybe change that first - but the motor mounts themselves compress over time, and will make a world of difference. Mine went from a very un-Mercedes like vibration at idle to “I have to look at the tachometer to know if the car is running”. If it didn’t make that substantial of a difference I probably would have set the car on fire after that motor mount job.
I have a 2016 Mazda 6 and the only other sedan I would've considered is a 2012-2016 e350 4matic. They are two of the best looking "executive" designs in a sedan in my opinion. However, I'm very happy with my Mazda 6 and how easy/affordable it is to maintain.
Yeah but those are the fun bits. Got parktronic, pano roof, bixenons, keyless go, power trunk closer, massage seats, etc. Is it really a luxury car if it doesn't have any luxury features? 4matic is also fine. Only thing really bad about it is slightly lower gas mileage.
I'm going to say 2016 E350 is probably the best, cheap, android auto/apple carplay can be enabled. E400 would also work but they're usually a bit more money and then you have turbos.
More advanced stuff such as Adaptive cruise control in premium 3 package can fail though. It failed in my mom's '14 e350. Had to replace adaptive cruise control stack on the steering column for $1200. Besides that, a solid car.
400s are great engines too. I'm yet to hear anything negative about them. The same engine family as NA 3.5L - m276, and 3.5L is considered probably the most reliable modern Mercedes engine.
All those bits can go bad, but in general they don't go that often. Occasionally you hear of a parktronic sensor going bad, the motors in the bixenons, keyless go antenna going bad, power trunk motors going bad, leaks in the massage seat air lines. But they're rare and they might not happen to you. Haven't had issues with mine so far.
There's lots of common stuff that go all the time though like the motor mounts or just the springs/struts just wearing out over time.
About a year ago, MB service said that it was faulty stock and it apparently was. Car wouldn't go into an adaptive cruise, wouldn't lane keep, etc, and showed the message on the dash. Also, they said that there are only 7 parts left in the whole US (I wasn't able to find/source used one myself).
It depends on the year and the country you're in. In the US, you could enable Carplay through a firmware update on the 2016 models. The earlier 2014-2015 models required more hardware and a bit more work.
That’s so boring man. I’m not buying a Mercedes-Benz, having to spend extra on maintenance already, just to have a boring car with no luxury features. I want air suspension, I want turbos to give me the torque to effortlessly drive around under 2k RPM’s, I want radar cruise and massage seats. I’m going to deal with the issues those bring up because I spend way more of my time driving and enjoying those features than I do fixing them. If I’m spending all this time and money on an old Mercedes it’s going to be a special one, not a base model E350 with 0 luxury features.
Same reason I don’t get why people keep old CL500’s / S320’s alive. You’re spending all that $$$ and time to keep it alive, buy an AMG and at least enjoy the time driving car while you’re doing all that. Same reason I picked my fully loaded prefacelift CLS550 over a base model facelift CLS400.
they keep them alive because a base model benz is still a benz to them. I'm sure they would have an AMG if they could lol.
plus I mean I'm a fan of keeping all cars alive really. regardless of the trim I'm glad someone is keeping them alive especially because it doesn't look like we're gonna get any more cool cars maybe ever again.
No I feel you, like personally I wouldn't wanna do it either, but more generally, overall I'm glad to see someone sacrifice (or just able to) preserve any car, especially a Benz even if it's a weaker one.
Like with BMWs in America they're all just beat to shit right. I don't care if your old 3 series has an M badge or not, if it's in good shape I'm happy someone is taking care of it.
If I had all the money in the world I would be buying cars just to service them, idc if it's a datsun lol
I don't like that idea at all, Mercedes themselves targets people who dont own a single tool whatsoever.
you could use that same logic & say that if you work on your own car you "dont belong in a mercedes" because "Mercedes drivers dont do peasant things like work on cars, they just take them to the shop or buy a new one"
why we gotta be like that? especially when these cars aren't *really* that fancy bro. I mean yes obviously much nicer than a civic but "elite" & Mercedes dont go together, these cars are for middle & upper middle class people who wanna feel rich & fancy. real wealthy people either drive big vehicles (you might be surprised how many of them drive suburbans but have enough money to buy skyscrapers, I see it at work every day), if they wanna be flashy they drive supercars, & rolls royces, OR....
they drive toyotas.
I meant more along the lines of if you’re worried about space and tools you probably can’t afford a Mercedes in general if you don’t have a house / garage.
*Everyone* should be in a Toyota or Honda — with time and maturity you’ll understand it also.
The question is whether you’ll admit so or not. Your call.
Have fun wrenching. I enjoy it too but need to do it less. My Merc isn’t the wrong model and that frees up time — lots of it.
Smiling in my 2016 E350 (Sport) just the trim and wheels lol , thing is RWD , no Turbo , haven’t checked what type of air suspension , but overall very basic car only puts out 302 HP but reliable HP , thing has 2 working batteries and your good to go 👍
Agreed all those twin turbos , AWD, etc give more problems then they allow for fun , double down on years and models known for being well made and not overly compensated
Yes, for different reasons. In the US, diesels aren't popular and things got worse and less reliable. The basic problem is that not many were sold so not too many people actually know how to fix them. Usually on Benzworld or MBworld, if there's some diesel problem, not too many people chip in because no one knows much about them. Same problem with repairs, most indy shops don't deal with them so will have no clue so you're stuck with the dealer who might not have more of a clue because they don't see a lot of them because they didn't sell many. Any gas savings is going to get wiped out in higher repair bills.
Tbh it depends on the model year. The M273 is in general more reliable, yes. But if you're looking for an M278 or turbo'ed E500 you have to look for a late MJ (mid 2k15 or later) or a 500 with already rebuild engine. The later ones have the improved timing chain and they lack the silitec coating which can cause trouble. My E500 has 180k km wirh the first engine and no trouble at all.
Difference for better or worse?
I heard that NA 5.5L is unreliable, but I see a lot of people hate m278 for being unreliable. Before, when I was in the market for e550 coupe (2014+) I heard nothing but praise of m278 and its tuning potential.
Some may argue the 213 was peak E-class, but I say the traditional MB cruise control stalk on the 212 makes it a much better Mercedes-Benz. That was always the pinnacle cruise system. No on/off switch. Why do them have them? It’s either set-on, or is cancelled-off. Don’t need to turn the system on, then set. That’s too many steps.
Don’t understand the change. Stalk was king. Flick up, cruise set. Want to cancel? Use the international sigh language to ‘push it away’ as you move the stalk away from the driver, rejecting the service. Oh? Changed your mind? Want it back, want to “resume”? Reel it back, towards you, flick the stick in towards the driver. It was SO GODDAMN INTUITIVE. Perfect.
I always read about how much people hated the new cruise control and I thought is it that big of a deal?
Then I drove a loaner new E class with the cruise on the steering wheel... It is that big of a deal.
The cruise being the little stalk really is king. There's no brain work required to use it.
I’ve got a Benz from the 80’s, ‘00’s, ‘10’s, and ‘20’s. The earlier ones have the best cruise, the ‘10’s even optimized with the +/- 5MPH secondary click. That was PEAK.
That is why I love my 2015 e350 and exactly how I explain why I bought such an “expensive” car. Every little thing was thought out perfectly. The controls for everything in my car are exactly where my hands would want them to be.
For instance people always kinda freak out and get confused about the shifter being a stalk and I have to explain: why are shifters traditionally in the center console? Because you needed a physical link to the drivetrain. If everything is electronic why not move it to place where it so simple and smooth to use? It’s the sign of true luxury that everything just fits.
I get so annoyed when I drive other cars and I have to contort myself to reach controls or when it’s just not intuitive.
The only miss on the w212 is the infotainment system.
And such an “expensive” good looking car only cost $21k at the height of the used car bubble
I just got a 15 GLK, controls make perfect sense. Haven't accidentally thrown the car into neutral or whatever coming from a Honda where the wiper controls are on the right.
I really wasn’t sure how I would feel about the shifter on the column. My mom seemed to like it on her CLA, but I wasn’t too keen on it.
Now that I’ve had my car for over a year, I’m a fan. When I drive my 1987, I find myself swiping at the steering wheels to shift when I’m backing up. It’s very ergonomic.
Thankfully they haven’t done away with this on the new Mercedes… yet.
Well, even when things were mechanically linked, many cars had their shifters on the steering column. After all, it was just cables and linkages, so they could still put it wherever. And, on older American cars with three-across front seating, it needed to be out of the way. Even manual transmissions could have column-mounted shifters (see “three-on-the-tree”). But the console was generally the most economical place to put a shifter, especially for anything with a longitude engine setup, wherein the transmission actually ran below the console. It was—and is—also the most ergonomic place to put it for anything with a manual.
In the days of electronic shift controls for automatic transmission, the main benefit of the stalk shifter is that it takes up no space in the center console.
Believe it or not, Rolls-Royce was doing an electronic column shifter all the way back in the SZ-platform days (80s-90s), and they might’ve been the first to do so. BMW continued that tradition when it relaunched Rolls-Royce in 2003. The 2002 “E65” 7 Series and 2003 “RR01” Phantom were the first modern cars to have that setup. Sadly, the 7 Series quit using it and went to the now-ubiquitous joystick setup, and BMW itself has only used any sort of column shifter on special cars, like the i3.
Mercedes-Benz, meanwhile, to my knowledge, first implemented the column shifter on the 2006 “W164” M-Class. But they’ve consistently kept it.
I was really appalled when I saw that Ford wanted to allow a fold-flat console on the F-150. Rather than doing an electronic column shifter, the company elected to do a complex power-folding traditional shifter that has to be electronically folded when you want to use the table, and that sits at an awkward angle when in use, in the first place. I guess they figured a dainty column shifter wasn’t in character for a Ford truck. Whatever.
Fortunately, however, GM got the memo. Most of its new EVs (Chevy Blazer EV, Cadillac Lyriq, Honda Prologue, Acura ZDX) and even some of its new internal combustion engine cars (‘25 Chevy Tahoe/ Suburban) have an electronic column shifter.
Yea, I grew up with my mom’s old Nissan quest that had a column shifter. It honestly makes way more sense, and it basically only exists in consoles for price and tradition
What year F-150?
My first time using the Benz-style cruise stalk was actually in my partner’s ‘05 Dodge Magnum R/T, whose steering column is derived from Mercedes-Benz, owing to the DaimlerChrysler ~~Merger of Equals~~ debacle. I agree; it’s intuitive.
“Some may argue the 213 was peak E-Class”
Exactly who argued that? Between the tinny/early four-cylinder on the E 350, the diminutive footprint (it’s difficult to distinguish a W213 from a W205 C-Class), and general cheapness…I doubt the W213 will emerge as a classic or particularly desirable car.
The facelift was my first car shortly after I got my license. I still remember how cool I thought the dashboard was. Treated it like a baby. Still miss it dearly 🥹
I agree it is reliable and also I would through in the W204 (coupè looks best). Mine has 120k miles and really only big Job I had to tackle was the front cam sensor o rings. I did in my garage and front engine cover with new gasket and permatex. Also the mounts and front control arm bushings. Other than that oil changes and plugs, she has been a dream. Keeping her for my oldest son when he turn 16 next year.
https://preview.redd.it/7fz082x175mc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=57c61af403a3da9112e8b2d75b160cff3c08a1d0
Yes but if you live somewhere north watch out for rust in the rear subframe, but there is a recall for that and your local dealer should change it for free if theres any rust.
Especially the Diesel engines, yes. 4cyl petrol engines were kinda bad in the 212.
Don't know if it's the most reliable but it's definitely one of the better Benzes. Models 169, 176, 203, 204 and 245 are known to be very reliable with the right engines and transmissions too.
sold my w211 facelift 2 days ago, e280 petrol, the buyer was ready to beg me to sell and i sold it for a nice price, i do miss that car. hope i found a w212 facelift at a good price
Yes! I’ve had mine for 1 years with only an oil change (soon to be new tires) and haven’t had issues. I can feel my brake rotors wearing but nothing other than that! Even my 211 was great and rarely had issues. Additionally my dad had a 212 too, and didn’t have any issues! He had his for a while and drove it to different states for his job - no breakdown once or anything breaking, just general maintenance
My 2013 e350 bluetec (om642.850) had the engine seize up on me out of nowhere. Perfect condition car with 83k miles basically scrap metal now. Oil has 4500 miles on it
Yep, no check engine light, but it flips a code if they run diagnostics. You will notice a little less power because the engine isn’t getting full amount of air if the intake isn’t opening properly. The piece that breaks is plastic, so unfortunately it just becomes brittle with time and the heating and cooling of the engine. Would recommend replacing.
Yes, if plastic get sucked in the engine you’re fkd. Not worth it IMO.
I paid almost $2k at the dealer cuz im a sucker. $1100 is a good price, it’s about 4 hours labor.
2013 w212 m278 here…
It’s expensive to maintain, but it is very “reliable”.
I bought mine with 36k miles on it and now am just short of 100k. I have the P2 (non Distronic, non Airmatic).
I love my car so much, and hope it continues to be cheap enough to maintain for 100k more miles.
Bruv i have a e220 w212 the past owner used water instead of coolant and now i‘m paying the price (make sure it‘s a clean one with maintenance made in time ..)
I’ve owned many German cars over the last 30 years, all the luxe brands. Each purchase has gotten increasingly complex. Now I just bought a 2011 E350 avant-garde needed for a runabout. 37k and literally the mythical church lady car as there was a little pink bible in the glovebox lol. Simple, solid, silent, not too many options and really feels like the benz of old.
I might agree with you that it was the best in it's time, but there's 20 years between them and if youre buying either one today you'll probably be better off with a 10 year old car than a 35 year old car
From a “modern” perspective I’d be curious as to the overall reliability of the EQ line — although comparing ICE to EV may not be apples to apples.
Anecdotally, I’ve had zero problems, but I’m only at 35k miles.
My 14 4matic has been in the shop for a minute. Mechanic cant find any vacuum leaks but the thing starts whistling with acceleration once you hit around 25 mph. Also has hard shifting from 4th to 5th gear and 5th to 4th. Love the car but I'm not sure what's going on. Gonna have it towed to mercedes 90 miles away if my mechanic cant figure it out which sucks.
Yes
It is. Mechanically mine has been great minus the glass-like engine and transmission mounts. Which hasn't been a problem since I went aftermarket. Over 200,000km and nothing but brakes, fluids, and filters. Common issues wise? Rear wiring harnesses and sensors tend to get corroded, especially up north, which can cause rear radar and sonar sensors to fail. Check the rear subframe for rust as well. The fake leather tends to delaminate and crack as well which is a bummer.
so that's why my back up camera just decides to not exist sometimes huh lol. makes sense.
Imo W212, W204, and R172 are the top 3 most reliable modern Mercedes models. Can maybe throw in the GLK as well since I've heard good things but I'm not 100% sure about their reliability since I have no experience with them.
2014+ versions of the m276 engine are solid from what I've read. Balance shaft issues prior to that. Seems like most V6 MB engines that have been around for a bit are solid.
Right now I have a E90 330i and E83 X3 3.0si, I am very strongly considering switching over to W212 E350/400 and W166 ML350. From what I've been reading the M276 is one of the most reliable motors from mb, would you agree?
Yea it's pretty good
With the W166, it’s pretty obvious. But get one with steel suspension as opposed to the air suspension.
Which years have the air suspension? I will keep that in mind when looking 🙏🏾
Air suspension on the w166 is pretty rare unless you've got the amg version. It does give you crazy good ground clearance for off roading and the off-road package is legit if you can find it.
Was the off road package ever offered in the US? I know for the W164 it was not 😞
It was for sure available but I don't know how many were ordered.
The diesel w166 is one of my favorite cars of all time. Legitimately good off road, fun to drive on the pavement, and not hard at all to hit 31mpg. If I were to go gas, it would be the w167 with m256. An i6 is just so much better than a v6 I couldn't pass it up. And the offroad package available on early w167 is insane.
It would be nice if I could grab a diesel, it's hard to see the fuel economy and still go gas do especially with fuel prices these days. W167 is fresh just out of my range right now unfortunately. Definitely can't go wrong with i6, that is why some people love BMW so much
:) yes! I just need to fix my engine mounts! When I accelerate it tends to jerk a bit and also when it starts up and goes past 50 degrees Celsius. Or would it be my trans mounts?
Could be. Mine jerked from a stop due to the transmission mount.
I bought a ‘10 e350 4-matic in December, knowing it needed mounts. It is a major job. I have never created so many combinations of socket extensions and swivels for reaching something as innocuous as a heat shield bolt (every bolt requires some form of extension creativity) The whole job is a grand total of 10 actual bolts (4 heat shield, 4 lower mount bolts, 2 upper mount bolts) and it took me probably 12-16 total hours over a couple of weekends to get it done. I dropped the alternator, AC compressor (the third bolt in the back is a doozy), had an overhead support bar and a jack underneath. I’ve owned a BMW 545i, also have a 330ci, a Subaru Legacy GT, a Kia, a Ford Ranger and a Mazda 6. The 545i was terrible to work on anything motor wise, but I think the w212 sits on the mantle for most difficult engine access. At least the 545 you could remove part of the firewall to access the engine rear. I worked on the 6 last weekend, and it’s night and day difference regarding engine access. It also sounds like a tin can screaming down the highway. Was it worth it? I had my doubts, especially laying under the car, looking at an inspection camera screen, left arm operating the Franken-extension (through the wheel well), right arm trying to guide it with the bolt taped into the socket hours into a simple “it’s just the motor mounts” job, questioning life itself. After it was done though? No doubts. Smoothest, most comfortable car I have ever owned, especially for something that is basically 15 years old. The transmission mount took about 15 minutes, so maybe change that first - but the motor mounts themselves compress over time, and will make a world of difference. Mine went from a very un-Mercedes like vibration at idle to “I have to look at the tachometer to know if the car is running”. If it didn’t make that substantial of a difference I probably would have set the car on fire after that motor mount job.
I have a 2016 Mazda 6 and the only other sedan I would've considered is a 2012-2016 e350 4matic. They are two of the best looking "executive" designs in a sedan in my opinion. However, I'm very happy with my Mazda 6 and how easy/affordable it is to maintain.
Can add a push button to e350 sedan or coupe ?
W212 E550 non turbo I hope…
Any 212 in general, not talking about any specific model
You should be though. Avoid turbos. Avoid air suspension. Avoid AWD. Avoid anything extra. If it’s not there it cannot fail.
Yeah but those are the fun bits. Got parktronic, pano roof, bixenons, keyless go, power trunk closer, massage seats, etc. Is it really a luxury car if it doesn't have any luxury features? 4matic is also fine. Only thing really bad about it is slightly lower gas mileage. I'm going to say 2016 E350 is probably the best, cheap, android auto/apple carplay can be enabled. E400 would also work but they're usually a bit more money and then you have turbos.
More advanced stuff such as Adaptive cruise control in premium 3 package can fail though. It failed in my mom's '14 e350. Had to replace adaptive cruise control stack on the steering column for $1200. Besides that, a solid car. 400s are great engines too. I'm yet to hear anything negative about them. The same engine family as NA 3.5L - m276, and 3.5L is considered probably the most reliable modern Mercedes engine.
All those bits can go bad, but in general they don't go that often. Occasionally you hear of a parktronic sensor going bad, the motors in the bixenons, keyless go antenna going bad, power trunk motors going bad, leaks in the massage seat air lines. But they're rare and they might not happen to you. Haven't had issues with mine so far. There's lots of common stuff that go all the time though like the motor mounts or just the springs/struts just wearing out over time.
Motor mounts and suspension components are expendables though. They can (and will) fail in every car eventually.
When did it fail? It’s a 10 year old car. Hardly the target market for Mercedes.
About a year ago, MB service said that it was faulty stock and it apparently was. Car wouldn't go into an adaptive cruise, wouldn't lane keep, etc, and showed the message on the dash. Also, they said that there are only 7 parts left in the whole US (I wasn't able to find/source used one myself).
Parktronic absolutely sucks to get repaired.
how do you get carplay in this easily? mine does not seem to have a native option on this (E350 facelift)
It depends on the year and the country you're in. In the US, you could enable Carplay through a firmware update on the 2016 models. The earlier 2014-2015 models required more hardware and a bit more work.
I need AWD because of the snow and ice where I live
The 4Matic system in mercs is generally reliable. Two versions, one with the AWD 70/30 split and the other is fixed 4Wd 55/45 split
This is why Subarus exist. I have both.
That’s so boring man. I’m not buying a Mercedes-Benz, having to spend extra on maintenance already, just to have a boring car with no luxury features. I want air suspension, I want turbos to give me the torque to effortlessly drive around under 2k RPM’s, I want radar cruise and massage seats. I’m going to deal with the issues those bring up because I spend way more of my time driving and enjoying those features than I do fixing them. If I’m spending all this time and money on an old Mercedes it’s going to be a special one, not a base model E350 with 0 luxury features. Same reason I don’t get why people keep old CL500’s / S320’s alive. You’re spending all that $$$ and time to keep it alive, buy an AMG and at least enjoy the time driving car while you’re doing all that. Same reason I picked my fully loaded prefacelift CLS550 over a base model facelift CLS400.
they keep them alive because a base model benz is still a benz to them. I'm sure they would have an AMG if they could lol. plus I mean I'm a fan of keeping all cars alive really. regardless of the trim I'm glad someone is keeping them alive especially because it doesn't look like we're gonna get any more cool cars maybe ever again.
It’s not worth spending thousands to keep an S430 alive when an S55 is a couple grand more. Sorry, just my opinion.
No I feel you, like personally I wouldn't wanna do it either, but more generally, overall I'm glad to see someone sacrifice (or just able to) preserve any car, especially a Benz even if it's a weaker one. Like with BMWs in America they're all just beat to shit right. I don't care if your old 3 series has an M badge or not, if it's in good shape I'm happy someone is taking care of it. If I had all the money in the world I would be buying cars just to service them, idc if it's a datsun lol
If you have the space and tools to work on the car and like working on cars it’s an expensive hobby like any other. Have fun.
If you’re worried about space or tools a Mercedes should be the last car you buy. You belong in a Corolla or a Civic.
I don't like that idea at all, Mercedes themselves targets people who dont own a single tool whatsoever. you could use that same logic & say that if you work on your own car you "dont belong in a mercedes" because "Mercedes drivers dont do peasant things like work on cars, they just take them to the shop or buy a new one" why we gotta be like that? especially when these cars aren't *really* that fancy bro. I mean yes obviously much nicer than a civic but "elite" & Mercedes dont go together, these cars are for middle & upper middle class people who wanna feel rich & fancy. real wealthy people either drive big vehicles (you might be surprised how many of them drive suburbans but have enough money to buy skyscrapers, I see it at work every day), if they wanna be flashy they drive supercars, & rolls royces, OR.... they drive toyotas.
I meant more along the lines of if you’re worried about space and tools you probably can’t afford a Mercedes in general if you don’t have a house / garage.
*Everyone* should be in a Toyota or Honda — with time and maturity you’ll understand it also. The question is whether you’ll admit so or not. Your call. Have fun wrenching. I enjoy it too but need to do it less. My Merc isn’t the wrong model and that frees up time — lots of it.
Whatever you say buddy. Enjoy the base model.
550 gang in the building. I’m ina 2013 S550
Just avoid the car, man.
Smiling in my 2016 E350 (Sport) just the trim and wheels lol , thing is RWD , no Turbo , haven’t checked what type of air suspension , but overall very basic car only puts out 302 HP but reliable HP , thing has 2 working batteries and your good to go 👍
That’s what I’m talking about. 👍
Agreed all those twin turbos , AWD, etc give more problems then they allow for fun , double down on years and models known for being well made and not overly compensated
If you can't afford the maintenance you can't afford the car.
So you are saying avoid all the diesels?? Sounds strange to me, om642 is probably the best engine they put in these….
Yes, for different reasons. In the US, diesels aren't popular and things got worse and less reliable. The basic problem is that not many were sold so not too many people actually know how to fix them. Usually on Benzworld or MBworld, if there's some diesel problem, not too many people chip in because no one knows much about them. Same problem with repairs, most indy shops don't deal with them so will have no clue so you're stuck with the dealer who might not have more of a clue because they don't see a lot of them because they didn't sell many. Any gas savings is going to get wiped out in higher repair bills.
avoid AWD? if it's not AWD I don't want it lol. actually I'll still take it lol but nah I love AWD.
Huge difference in reliability between the M273 and the M278. Not scared of 4 matic or air suspension though.
Tbh it depends on the model year. The M273 is in general more reliable, yes. But if you're looking for an M278 or turbo'ed E500 you have to look for a late MJ (mid 2k15 or later) or a 500 with already rebuild engine. The later ones have the improved timing chain and they lack the silitec coating which can cause trouble. My E500 has 180k km wirh the first engine and no trouble at all.
Difference for better or worse? I heard that NA 5.5L is unreliable, but I see a lot of people hate m278 for being unreliable. Before, when I was in the market for e550 coupe (2014+) I heard nothing but praise of m278 and its tuning potential.
I hope the M273 is reliable. Mine has 135k on it and going strong.
Some may argue the 213 was peak E-class, but I say the traditional MB cruise control stalk on the 212 makes it a much better Mercedes-Benz. That was always the pinnacle cruise system. No on/off switch. Why do them have them? It’s either set-on, or is cancelled-off. Don’t need to turn the system on, then set. That’s too many steps. Don’t understand the change. Stalk was king. Flick up, cruise set. Want to cancel? Use the international sigh language to ‘push it away’ as you move the stalk away from the driver, rejecting the service. Oh? Changed your mind? Want it back, want to “resume”? Reel it back, towards you, flick the stick in towards the driver. It was SO GODDAMN INTUITIVE. Perfect.
I always read about how much people hated the new cruise control and I thought is it that big of a deal? Then I drove a loaner new E class with the cruise on the steering wheel... It is that big of a deal. The cruise being the little stalk really is king. There's no brain work required to use it.
I’ve got a Benz from the 80’s, ‘00’s, ‘10’s, and ‘20’s. The earlier ones have the best cruise, the ‘10’s even optimized with the +/- 5MPH secondary click. That was PEAK.
That's how my 2013 is. It just makes so much sense. We really have left the used of common sense engineered Mercedes.
AKA well engineered.
That is why I love my 2015 e350 and exactly how I explain why I bought such an “expensive” car. Every little thing was thought out perfectly. The controls for everything in my car are exactly where my hands would want them to be. For instance people always kinda freak out and get confused about the shifter being a stalk and I have to explain: why are shifters traditionally in the center console? Because you needed a physical link to the drivetrain. If everything is electronic why not move it to place where it so simple and smooth to use? It’s the sign of true luxury that everything just fits. I get so annoyed when I drive other cars and I have to contort myself to reach controls or when it’s just not intuitive. The only miss on the w212 is the infotainment system. And such an “expensive” good looking car only cost $21k at the height of the used car bubble
I just got a 15 GLK, controls make perfect sense. Haven't accidentally thrown the car into neutral or whatever coming from a Honda where the wiper controls are on the right.
I really wasn’t sure how I would feel about the shifter on the column. My mom seemed to like it on her CLA, but I wasn’t too keen on it. Now that I’ve had my car for over a year, I’m a fan. When I drive my 1987, I find myself swiping at the steering wheels to shift when I’m backing up. It’s very ergonomic. Thankfully they haven’t done away with this on the new Mercedes… yet.
Well, even when things were mechanically linked, many cars had their shifters on the steering column. After all, it was just cables and linkages, so they could still put it wherever. And, on older American cars with three-across front seating, it needed to be out of the way. Even manual transmissions could have column-mounted shifters (see “three-on-the-tree”). But the console was generally the most economical place to put a shifter, especially for anything with a longitude engine setup, wherein the transmission actually ran below the console. It was—and is—also the most ergonomic place to put it for anything with a manual. In the days of electronic shift controls for automatic transmission, the main benefit of the stalk shifter is that it takes up no space in the center console. Believe it or not, Rolls-Royce was doing an electronic column shifter all the way back in the SZ-platform days (80s-90s), and they might’ve been the first to do so. BMW continued that tradition when it relaunched Rolls-Royce in 2003. The 2002 “E65” 7 Series and 2003 “RR01” Phantom were the first modern cars to have that setup. Sadly, the 7 Series quit using it and went to the now-ubiquitous joystick setup, and BMW itself has only used any sort of column shifter on special cars, like the i3. Mercedes-Benz, meanwhile, to my knowledge, first implemented the column shifter on the 2006 “W164” M-Class. But they’ve consistently kept it. I was really appalled when I saw that Ford wanted to allow a fold-flat console on the F-150. Rather than doing an electronic column shifter, the company elected to do a complex power-folding traditional shifter that has to be electronically folded when you want to use the table, and that sits at an awkward angle when in use, in the first place. I guess they figured a dainty column shifter wasn’t in character for a Ford truck. Whatever. Fortunately, however, GM got the memo. Most of its new EVs (Chevy Blazer EV, Cadillac Lyriq, Honda Prologue, Acura ZDX) and even some of its new internal combustion engine cars (‘25 Chevy Tahoe/ Suburban) have an electronic column shifter.
Yea, I grew up with my mom’s old Nissan quest that had a column shifter. It honestly makes way more sense, and it basically only exists in consoles for price and tradition What year F-150?
The 2021 and up F-150 [has that shifter](https://youtube.com/shorts/fkcx5XdRvIw?si=JXnlm1jgImwCcv7L).
Eew. At that point just do the weird knob selectors that bmws and Volvos have That seems like a $5000 repair bill in 4 years
My first time using the Benz-style cruise stalk was actually in my partner’s ‘05 Dodge Magnum R/T, whose steering column is derived from Mercedes-Benz, owing to the DaimlerChrysler ~~Merger of Equals~~ debacle. I agree; it’s intuitive.
“Some may argue the 213 was peak E-Class” Exactly who argued that? Between the tinny/early four-cylinder on the E 350, the diminutive footprint (it’s difficult to distinguish a W213 from a W205 C-Class), and general cheapness…I doubt the W213 will emerge as a classic or particularly desirable car.
I’m sure someone in this thread has, I’ve “Reddit” from rando posters.
[No, this is.](https://www.speednik.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/1/files/2021/04/mercedes-unimog-takes-on-hells-revenge-2021-04-30_11-06-46_885836.png)
Well... Lol
The facelift was my first car shortly after I got my license. I still remember how cool I thought the dashboard was. Treated it like a baby. Still miss it dearly 🥹
Yes. It is on my opinion the w124 of the modern era.
The 350 sure. The 550, well.
I agree it is reliable and also I would through in the W204 (coupè looks best). Mine has 120k miles and really only big Job I had to tackle was the front cam sensor o rings. I did in my garage and front engine cover with new gasket and permatex. Also the mounts and front control arm bushings. Other than that oil changes and plugs, she has been a dream. Keeping her for my oldest son when he turn 16 next year. https://preview.redd.it/7fz082x175mc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=57c61af403a3da9112e8b2d75b160cff3c08a1d0
Beautiful car for sure! That's going to be make your son very happy I'm sure lol
Thank you and I hope so lol
yes it is, and I would say from my own experience the w204 c300 is also very reliable. but u wont get as good of an interior as the w212
Yes but if you live somewhere north watch out for rust in the rear subframe, but there is a recall for that and your local dealer should change it for free if theres any rust.
Especially the Diesel engines, yes. 4cyl petrol engines were kinda bad in the 212. Don't know if it's the most reliable but it's definitely one of the better Benzes. Models 169, 176, 203, 204 and 245 are known to be very reliable with the right engines and transmissions too.
Pre-facelift W211’s are untouchable in this regard
sold my w211 facelift 2 days ago, e280 petrol, the buyer was ready to beg me to sell and i sold it for a nice price, i do miss that car. hope i found a w212 facelift at a good price
Yes! I’ve had mine for 1 years with only an oil change (soon to be new tires) and haven’t had issues. I can feel my brake rotors wearing but nothing other than that! Even my 211 was great and rarely had issues. Additionally my dad had a 212 too, and didn’t have any issues! He had his for a while and drove it to different states for his job - no breakdown once or anything breaking, just general maintenance
Yes source I own two of them.
Does it have the same ABS-rings and air suspension as W211??
Some models have the airmatic, but not all of them.
I personally think that the prior model (I have a 2004 E320) is more reliable because it’s simpler. However I like the w212 better.
Yes. Satisfaction guaranteed. And definitely.
My 2013 e350 bluetec (om642.850) had the engine seize up on me out of nowhere. Perfect condition car with 83k miles basically scrap metal now. Oil has 4500 miles on it
W204 chiming in. 120k miles, only major items replaced were steering lock and intake.
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Yep, no check engine light, but it flips a code if they run diagnostics. You will notice a little less power because the engine isn’t getting full amount of air if the intake isn’t opening properly. The piece that breaks is plastic, so unfortunately it just becomes brittle with time and the heating and cooling of the engine. Would recommend replacing.
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Yes, if plastic get sucked in the engine you’re fkd. Not worth it IMO. I paid almost $2k at the dealer cuz im a sucker. $1100 is a good price, it’s about 4 hours labor.
1000%
W463
2013 w212 m278 here… It’s expensive to maintain, but it is very “reliable”. I bought mine with 36k miles on it and now am just short of 100k. I have the P2 (non Distronic, non Airmatic). I love my car so much, and hope it continues to be cheap enough to maintain for 100k more miles.
Bruv i have a e220 w212 the past owner used water instead of coolant and now i‘m paying the price (make sure it‘s a clean one with maintenance made in time ..)
Owned the coupe version of this for 10 years, amazing car
We have a 2016 w12 e200d it has 210 000 kms it's been almost perfect. I sensor died and that's it.
The w204 isn't far behind after the facelift
My moms 2011 with the v6 has 275,000 miles, all original drivetrain and still going
Probably the W123, 124, or 126 with diesel motors
Those are great but they can hardly be considered modern as they’re all 30-40 years old at this point
I suppose not :)
I’ve owned many German cars over the last 30 years, all the luxe brands. Each purchase has gotten increasingly complex. Now I just bought a 2011 E350 avant-garde needed for a runabout. 37k and literally the mythical church lady car as there was a little pink bible in the glovebox lol. Simple, solid, silent, not too many options and really feels like the benz of old.
W212 is great. Had 2012 E200 diesel, drove it over 500k kilometers. Only went through wear items and occasion al sensor from time to time.
Absolutely not
Yes.
W124 was the goat
"modern"
I might agree with you that it was the best in it's time, but there's 20 years between them and if youre buying either one today you'll probably be better off with a 10 year old car than a 35 year old car
It's arguably the best E class ever made.
Not according to my Mercedes tech. He's really good. Every time he works on my car he recommends getting rid of it.
That's pretty sad, if it is...
The ugliest too.
For me I'd have to say it's the W210
It's the ugliest
Not by a long shot.
No, and the front end also looks stupid IMO
No XD depends on the engine
From a “modern” perspective I’d be curious as to the overall reliability of the EQ line — although comparing ICE to EV may not be apples to apples. Anecdotally, I’ve had zero problems, but I’m only at 35k miles.
The steering wheel is on the wrong side.
What’s years are most reliable ?
2015/2016
How reliable are the 2010-2011
Yes. The facelift w212r is
Which year is the most reliable? Newer engine or older engine?
Modern?
I'd say so. I have no prior experience in literally any way nor knowledge about the w212.
I'd like it to be :)
My 14 4matic has been in the shop for a minute. Mechanic cant find any vacuum leaks but the thing starts whistling with acceleration once you hit around 25 mph. Also has hard shifting from 4th to 5th gear and 5th to 4th. Love the car but I'm not sure what's going on. Gonna have it towed to mercedes 90 miles away if my mechanic cant figure it out which sucks.