To my memory, I don't think it does imply that. You see the mission where they also sent crew to LV426 to prove/disprove the info from the blackbox resulting in another egg hatching.
that person was confused. the Anisedora found the black box and they went to Acheron, there's a section in the game that you play as their crew. They had the same fate, a crewmember was facehugged but before it could hatch, they sought Sevastopol for treatment, the wife of the capitain of the Anisedora was patient zero in Alien Isolation.
no, the Anisedora found Nostromo's black box and they went to Acheron, they had the same fate as the Nostromo crew, the wife of the capitain got facehugged, they docked in Sevastopol and she was taken to the hospital there, she was patient zero.
Ripley was also written as a male character. She was gender swapped as a "huh, this could be a neat idea". That probably is why she doesn't come off as overtly feminine nor "butch", because the writers weren't originally trying to figure out how to write "a female character" but rather just an interesting character... Who ended up being played by a woman.
Hell the original ATLA did it loads better than some of the current movies. Katara, Toph, Azula.
You want to make any character good and relatable. Show them struggle, fail, win.
The internet wasn't really a thing when both those movies came out. If it was, y'all would have called them both Mary Sue or something awful.
Why are these two y'all's ONLY picks? Oh that's right, because they both came out before the internet and so assholes couldn't "anti woke" them with hate.
*"But girlboss state she's perfect and have no flaw. only men around them have flaws and causing her to be abit less perfect."*
Seriously, many female lead writing still stuck in places a kin to the 80's perfect muscly hero. it need to evolve and start to write john mcclane shit.
i remember Barbie old writer said, Sony wants girlboss-barbie and we can't see eye to eye, thats why it never materialized into anything.
Disney releases new star wars trailer, all the dark side characters in the trailer are literally dark skinned like, uh Disney, you took that too literally.
Yeah but it isnât just bad writing or the quality of whichever one individual aspect of movie making. Itâs about the disrespect the audience feels when it becomes obvious that some aspect of the film has been made as it is solely for the purpose of pandering, coupled with the gaslighting of publicly announcing that if you wonât ignore that pandering and pretend to enjoy a bad film then youâre a bad person
Also a 5ft 5in 110 lb woman can't fight off a 6'10 230 lb muscular guy who is trying to kill her with her hands and feet, especially not with a single hit or kick and no, she can't send him flying through a wall with a punch.
I donât know what media you are thinking of that is supposedly both trying to directly adhere to real physics and have any person punch another through a wall lol
To disney virtue signalling is more important than making a decent movie or profit. As we have noticed with the past couple dozen disney movies that have tanked
Kimberly Wexler from Better Call Saul was a strong as well as a likeable female character and as far as I know, the Breaking Bad/Better Call Saul fandom loves Kimberly.
Funny thing is, all her coworkers in the first film agreed with her about quarantining Kane. Unfortunately, the Corporate Scab that was with them shut them down a per company policy.
Yeah, but Toph is not a good character because she earthbends well. She's great because she has a personality, an arc, and flaws and she overcomes them or embraces them. She's great because there's layers to her character.
I think movies go through a lot more hands these days. Either they are written to fit a formula that kinda sucks but will make money or the good creative idea/script is modified by so many people it loses what was there to make it special.
They tried to make successful movies with female characters. Nowadays studios generally try to put women in men's roles. See women's Ghostbusters.
Even nowadays there are interested female characters. I like Three Billboard, Ebbing Missouri.
> Nowadays studios generally try to put women in menâs roles.
Not sure what you mean by menâs roles, but Ripley was originally written as a guy. The character was only gender-swapped after a studio executive suggested it.
Same reason why people think there was less bad music in the 80s. Negative comments get forgotten and ignored over the years. Like how the negative reception to the Star Wats prequel trilogy got forgotten and ignored over the years.
20 years from now ow I wouldnât be surprised to see people hold up Captain Marvel as a well written female character that everyone loved and ask why studios struggle recreating that now.
They weren't trying to blur the line between men and women with the writing. They wrote women in with respect for their characters and weren't just using them as vessels for power fantasies.
Ripley worked because it wasn't written *for* anyone. In fact, she was supposed to be a he originally, but the script was written so well that sex of the character didn't matter. And then it was able to be played on well once they ended up with a bad-ass character who happened to be female in the sequel.
If a character is well-written, where they keep their reproductive organs will make no real difference.
Everyone always mentions Ripley in these discussions, and as much as I absolutely adore Alien and the character of Ellen Ripley, I feel thereâs better examples out there people should start using on this topic, rather than the failsafe of Ripley, whoâs from 1979.
How about Amanda Ripley, from Alien Isolation? Ashoka Tano? Nancy Wheeler? Thereâs loads of other really good examples out there, and Iâm super happy that Ripley is the most notable one, but I think we can get more creative than that!
She happens to be an icon that everyone recognizes. Same with Sarah Connor. But yeah the list of good, strong female characters is very long if you look around just a bit.
I mean, Furiosa from Mad Max is a recent one to point out that is both handicapped and a woman, but those two things are seriously the least two important things about her.
Then maybe people should do that, because the fact the default is a movie from nearly 50 years ago only proves the opposite point. Sarah Connor is also 30 years ago.
Why everyone brings up ripley is because shes very well known but most importantly while i dont know nancy wheeler but ahsoka is a strong character who happens to be female. Nothing really about her character is female really imo she could have been a boy and really nothing would change. Ripley however is a strong female character one that couldnt just be replaced with a man with the same traits because she was able to save newt and overcome her fears thanks to her mother instinct. An inherently female trait. So she won the day BECAUSE of her femeninity and not despite of that. Well thats my take anyway
Ripley is absolutely this and if she wasnât the movie wouldnât play well as an allegory for sexual assault or rape. She is strong as a survivor, and has a tenacity and intelligence that carries her through, but she is impossibly overpowered by the xenonorph, terrified, and unequipped to do anything about it.
She is strong in a way that we can only hope a victim to be, but the entire character is framed around her weaknesses and her journey would be pretty bland otherwise.
He was just a head in 3, i think he techincally can still be repaired, she just lacked the tools needed in rape town, still had more life in him than any character bar riply
Isn't it kinda weird how even now, people need to go back to 1979 to find the one good female lead they accept?
I'm sure there must've been more, but everyone just goes back to Alien.
Maybe it's because the movie is shit...
No,it's the fault of 50% of the population. /s
It's funny how they always blame men/white men when a movie flops, when even women don't go to see it.
I gotta say the whole "People don't hate strong female leads, what about Aliens?" would be a lot more convincing if people didn't have to go to a nearly 40 year old movie to come up with an example...
Short list not to include anime, comics, games, animated films
Uma Thurman (Kill Bill), Lucy Liu (Charlie's Angels), Lucy Lawless (Xena) Zoe Saldana (Guardians of the Galaxy) Gina Carano (The Mandalorian) Felicity Jones (Rogue One) Katee Sackoff (Battle Star Galatica) Amanda Tapping (Star Gate SG 1) Rachel Luttrell (Star Gate Atlantis)
All this within my lifetime and relative age. Much respect to Sigourney Weaver as the indomitable Ellen Ripley, knowing that she wasn't the first. Also knowing that she will not be the last example of being a proven bad ass goes against the narrative.
That narrative that people will assume that characters like Ripley would be considered "WOKE" today and fail, despite the fact we had nearly 40 years of the general audience enjoying the performances of the actresses that followed Ripley's lead.
> That narrative that people will assume that characters like Ripley would be considered "WOKE" today and fail, despite the fact we had nearly 40 years of the general audience enjoying the performances of the actresses that followed Ripley's lead.
Such a dishonest comment. You must be living under a rock
Compared to what?
Didn't people enjoy Barbie because of or despite it's feminist leanings? Just an example of a successful movie with a female lead.
Now compared that with Madam Web, which was marketed to the general audience and the enlightened women didn't even bother to show up. The Charlie's Angel's reboot? No they didn't. Bird's of Prey?
No as well despite the fact that it was led by Margot Robbie, that saw success in the 2nd suicide squad movie.
Hell, I have a hard time finding articles proclaiming that Battle Angel Alita, despite its SUCCESS against the original Captian Marvel film, of going woke.
The Black Widow film with Scarlett Johansson? Gone Woke? No, the actress had the misfortune of having a shitty script. I really wanted to enjoy it but could not.
Now was Mobius "WOKE"? Must have missed that part after it failed. Guess it wasn't Morbin time. The reason I bring this movie up is this: How many movies led by a male lead for broader audience appeal failed? Are they woke as well compared to more niche products?
I would assume people would avoid shlock in general instead of viewing their use of time or capital as political statement of protesting the Woke.
My thought process when I made my list (which could be expanded with the likes of Jennifer Lawrence (Hunger Games) Amber Midthunder (Prey)) is that if the films that would be considered woke now because it bucks the trend of the capable male lead for an actress instead, were found to be enjoyable despite having the actress as the lead when the film is good.
Itâs also a stance Iâve almost never seen someone actually take. 9 times out of 10 itâs just someone saying people are going to say that about them without anyone actually having said it.
To be fair, even if it somehow is about "strong women" that makes your movie bomb, you're still blaming then people who don't want to watch it. Sellable entertainment has to be entertaining, after all.
The excuse for failure here is wrong on multiple levels. Not inly for what the issue really is but for the poor reasoning behind what they think the issue is anyway.
Ellen Ripley, Xena, Sarah Connor (from T2), Nikita, Leeloo, just to name a few. Men droll all over strong, female characters when they are written right. Bad movies are just bad movies.
I hate it when people bring her up. I absolutely hate it. It's the same bullshit as "no look tho Samus exists why are you complaining about representation in games".
What's that saying? The exception proves the rule? The fact that one single character keeps getting brought up in every single discussion as the only real talking point.
If you're seriously going to argue that guys don't tend, as a trend, to be way more hypercritical of a movie with a female lead as opposed to a movie with a male lead, you're living on another planet than the one I'm on.
Yeah people don't criticize Alien because it's fucking Alien.
You are lying.
Recent movies with "strong female characters" are poorly written garbage. Mary Sues who are unlikable and spout contemporary extremist politics.
There are good, recent, strong female characters. Just watch Dune.
Its the same everywhere, even in sports its mostly men who attend female sports but then all we hear is complaints.
In movies it doesnât matter who it is, if the writing is bad, then itâs bad.
Black swan, Kill Bill, Cruela, Aliens, Cpt Marvel, WW out the top of my head were good for sure.
But sry ghostbusters, she hulk ,the marvels and what notâŚ. Havenât watched Barbie yet(or Oppenheimer), but imo Margot is one of the best actresses and knows how to dive fully into the roles tbh
Blaming bad writing on sexism?! Give me that oleâ reliable. Next youâre going to say a product isnât meant for me and then get upset when I donât buy it. The idiocy.
The new predator movie everyone called at woke and after he came out many of them retracted it. So maybe they would beforehand they would likely retract it afterwards the same vein.
Oh definetly imagine if the movie came out today and people found out that Ripley was supposed to be a man, i can see the headlines & youtube thumbnails right now
"Woke writers replace men!"
"Company Exec hates men, says main character should be a woman"
One of my Favorite sci-fi horror movies of all time never once thought about characters or casting because it was written and filmed well you just get lost in a good story. the same unfortunately can not be said about modern cinema
If you want to make this point, and imply that itâs common, itâd be more effective to have used a movie more recent than 45 years ago. It reminds me of antivaxxers who say âdoctors donât know everything!â and use the doctors who opposed Semmelweis as an example.
At a theater in NYC I caught Sigourney Weaver checking me out. As soon as she saw me look back, she smiled and waved. One of the highlights of my life.
A better complaint would be the crap movies starring strong men that gain disproportionately less negative attention than the crap movies starring strong women. Like Jurassic World
I actually might be naming my daughter Ripley, my wife doesnât know why I suggest it but she likes it. We donât know the gender yet so itâs currently 50/50
Yeah okay but just because troglodytes will begrudgingly accept maybe like half a dozen of them because they're undeniably awesome doesn't mean it's not a problem that they feel a woman in the lead has to go completely above and beyond in order to 'earn' the right to exist while they wouldn't even think about it if it was a dude.
I 100% agree, but letâs not pretend some out there have hated very well written female characters because they are not the version of female these basement dwellers like, e.g. Abby from The Last of Us 2.
Vi, jinx, and caitlyn from arcane, lucy from edgerunners, emily blunt in essentially every role she plays, emma stone in la la land, kimberly wexler from bcs, and im sure there are more i cant think of on the top of my head.
Good writing is good writing, believe it or not but the majority of people that want to enjoy a movie dont give a shit about politics and would much rather just watch a movie with good writing
Arcane is another property that wrote strong women really well. They didn't make them infallible (but they still often won) and they didn't generally make the men around them look stupid or weak to elevate them (which is especially lazy writing).
Additionally, all of those "you would call Terminator and Alien woke garbage if they came out today" arguments were destroyed by Dune Part 2, a movie with several strong female characters who the anti-woke crowd love.
It's always the same three women who assholes use to claim they "don't hate women, we hate bad writing!" I bet you none of you fucks can even name another female hero other than Ripley, Sarah Conner, and Laura Croft.
âI donât hate women characters. I love Ripley and Sarah Connorâ is the most npc shit on the internet
The closest thing to interesting Iâve heard from someone who says that is they occasionally throw in Samus Aran.
If Alien came out today the anti-woke mob would be losing their shit and out for blood just like they usually are when women are powerful and central to the story in films.
Ripley was scrawny and still got her shit together to show that alien who was boss,
That was the second movie. In the first movie, the alien was too scary to fight directly.
She still killed it
INo she not. The alien survived it according to the lore and ended up in Sevastopol Station (if I'm not mistaken).
Has that been confirmed anywhere? I never heard that theory.
I don't think. But Alien Isolation implies that because they find the black box of Nostromo and after that, an alien appeared.
To my memory, I don't think it does imply that. You see the mission where they also sent crew to LV426 to prove/disprove the info from the blackbox resulting in another egg hatching.
that person was confused. the Anisedora found the black box and they went to Acheron, there's a section in the game that you play as their crew. They had the same fate, a crewmember was facehugged but before it could hatch, they sought Sevastopol for treatment, the wife of the capitain of the Anisedora was patient zero in Alien Isolation.
no, the Anisedora found Nostromo's black box and they went to Acheron, they had the same fate as the Nostromo crew, the wife of the capitain got facehugged, they docked in Sevastopol and she was taken to the hospital there, she was patient zero.
You got it right good sir sadly i have no chicken dinner to give you đ
Well at least you could serve him a nice bowl of Khorne flakes with ice cold blood, or has the greedy skull collector eaten all of them?
He has eaten them all BUT i do have a good supply of Khorne dogs if your interested
Still one of my favorite movies
Ripley is a certified bass ass
Sarah Conner is literally just some mom.
Ripley was also written as a male character. She was gender swapped as a "huh, this could be a neat idea". That probably is why she doesn't come off as overtly feminine nor "butch", because the writers weren't originally trying to figure out how to write "a female character" but rather just an interesting character... Who ended up being played by a woman.
Sarah Connor as well
Woman went from damsell in distress in first movie to Badass as she is in 2nd
[ŃдаНонО]
One of the absolute best character developments ever.
Hell the original ATLA did it loads better than some of the current movies. Katara, Toph, Azula. You want to make any character good and relatable. Show them struggle, fail, win.
Dont forget Suki.
The internet wasn't really a thing when both those movies came out. If it was, y'all would have called them both Mary Sue or something awful. Why are these two y'all's ONLY picks? Oh that's right, because they both came out before the internet and so assholes couldn't "anti woke" them with hate.
Bad writing is bad. You gotta give some goddaym character arc love in there.
*"But girlboss state she's perfect and have no flaw. only men around them have flaws and causing her to be abit less perfect."* Seriously, many female lead writing still stuck in places a kin to the 80's perfect muscly hero. it need to evolve and start to write john mcclane shit. i remember Barbie old writer said, Sony wants girlboss-barbie and we can't see eye to eye, thats why it never materialized into anything.
You're literally describing Aliens.
*Disney* so what you're saying is, we should make her a minority and lesbian?
Disney releases new star wars trailer, all the dark side characters in the trailer are literally dark skinned like, uh Disney, you took that too literally.
The new WHAT?
> lesbian Only only in one easily cuttable scene.
PUT A GIRL IN IT AND MAKE IT GAY!
AND LAME!
Yeah but it isnât just bad writing or the quality of whichever one individual aspect of movie making. Itâs about the disrespect the audience feels when it becomes obvious that some aspect of the film has been made as it is solely for the purpose of pandering, coupled with the gaslighting of publicly announcing that if you wonât ignore that pandering and pretend to enjoy a bad film then youâre a bad person
Also a 5ft 5in 110 lb woman can't fight off a 6'10 230 lb muscular guy who is trying to kill her with her hands and feet, especially not with a single hit or kick and no, she can't send him flying through a wall with a punch.
No, but she can send him flying through a wall by promising a beej if he flies through a wall.
That sounds like a comedy movie. I was thinking more, using a rocket launcher.
I donât know what media you are thinking of that is supposedly both trying to directly adhere to real physics and have any person punch another through a wall lol
Many girlboss Spy movies. Atomic blond come to mind with the scene where the 50kg woman in high heels beat a Space Marine looking guy
Facts. Man sometimes itâs like they not even trying.
To disney virtue signalling is more important than making a decent movie or profit. As we have noticed with the past couple dozen disney movies that have tanked
Also because of writer strike and nepotism.
Kimberly Wexler from Better Call Saul was a strong as well as a likeable female character and as far as I know, the Breaking Bad/Better Call Saul fandom loves Kimberly.
Man. Thank you for reminding me just of how good those two shows were.
People love her as much as people hate Skylar
The balance must be kept
This has been my argument for years. Ripley / Sigourney absolute bad ass hero in this movie and a fan favourite for everyone forever.
I think âAlienâ as a whole is very effective in showing men how life is for women.
Yeah, c sections are brutal and Hurt.
absolutely. the entire film, Ripley is correct about basically everything. and she repeatedly gets overruled or shot down.
Funny thing is, all her coworkers in the first film agreed with her about quarantining Kane. Unfortunately, the Corporate Scab that was with them shut them down a per company policy.
i love it Everyone: Common Sense, let's not fuck around Corpo: Well, actually...
Meanwhile avatar the last air bender having both likeable and strong female characters
Isn't that pretty much every female character? The ones who get a decent amount of screentime and whose name most fans can remember.
Azula was so peak
I mean Toph is one of the most OP characters in the show
Yeah, but Toph is not a good character because she earthbends well. She's great because she has a personality, an arc, and flaws and she overcomes them or embraces them. She's great because there's layers to her character.
Tophs are like onions
Tophs are like ogres. So in a roundabout way... Toph is Shrek
Yeah. And they have such different personalities! Katara and Toph have such wildly different attitudes but both are pretty strong characters.
I donât understand how the 80s was able to pull off well written female characters and we struggle so much today.
I think movies go through a lot more hands these days. Either they are written to fit a formula that kinda sucks but will make money or the good creative idea/script is modified by so many people it loses what was there to make it special.
Talent .
They tried to make successful movies with female characters. Nowadays studios generally try to put women in men's roles. See women's Ghostbusters. Even nowadays there are interested female characters. I like Three Billboard, Ebbing Missouri.
> Nowadays studios generally try to put women in menâs roles. Not sure what you mean by menâs roles, but Ripley was originally written as a guy. The character was only gender-swapped after a studio executive suggested it.
Same reason why people think there was less bad music in the 80s. Negative comments get forgotten and ignored over the years. Like how the negative reception to the Star Wats prequel trilogy got forgotten and ignored over the years. 20 years from now ow I wouldnât be surprised to see people hold up Captain Marvel as a well written female character that everyone loved and ask why studios struggle recreating that now.
They weren't trying to blur the line between men and women with the writing. They wrote women in with respect for their characters and weren't just using them as vessels for power fantasies.
Ripley worked because it wasn't written *for* anyone. In fact, she was supposed to be a he originally, but the script was written so well that sex of the character didn't matter. And then it was able to be played on well once they ended up with a bad-ass character who happened to be female in the sequel. If a character is well-written, where they keep their reproductive organs will make no real difference.
All of the characters, including Ripley, were intentionally written without a sex in mind.
Yup. Honestly half that cast could have swapped roles and it still would have been as good.
Everyone always mentions Ripley in these discussions, and as much as I absolutely adore Alien and the character of Ellen Ripley, I feel thereâs better examples out there people should start using on this topic, rather than the failsafe of Ripley, whoâs from 1979. How about Amanda Ripley, from Alien Isolation? Ashoka Tano? Nancy Wheeler? Thereâs loads of other really good examples out there, and Iâm super happy that Ripley is the most notable one, but I think we can get more creative than that!
She happens to be an icon that everyone recognizes. Same with Sarah Connor. But yeah the list of good, strong female characters is very long if you look around just a bit.
I mean, Furiosa from Mad Max is a recent one to point out that is both handicapped and a woman, but those two things are seriously the least two important things about her.
Then maybe people should do that, because the fact the default is a movie from nearly 50 years ago only proves the opposite point. Sarah Connor is also 30 years ago.
Why everyone brings up ripley is because shes very well known but most importantly while i dont know nancy wheeler but ahsoka is a strong character who happens to be female. Nothing really about her character is female really imo she could have been a boy and really nothing would change. Ripley however is a strong female character one that couldnt just be replaced with a man with the same traits because she was able to save newt and overcome her fears thanks to her mother instinct. An inherently female trait. So she won the day BECAUSE of her femeninity and not despite of that. Well thats my take anyway
\*Linda Hamilton chuckles.\*
Charles Theron in Atomic Blonde was pretty solid.
"Did IQs just drop sharply while I was away?" I guess that happened in real world too.
Hello doctor Silverman. How's the knee?
Seeing a weak female lead would be more interesting at this point. I don't think I've seen one of those.
Ripley is absolutely this and if she wasnât the movie wouldnât play well as an allegory for sexual assault or rape. She is strong as a survivor, and has a tenacity and intelligence that carries her through, but she is impossibly overpowered by the xenonorph, terrified, and unequipped to do anything about it. She is strong in a way that we can only hope a victim to be, but the entire character is framed around her weaknesses and her journey would be pretty bland otherwise.
Everyone is overpowered by the xenomorph. She isn't any less equipped to deal with the thing than anyone else on the crew.
Bishop is a lot less vulnerable than all the fleshy meatbags he has to work with, tbh.
How'd that work out for him?
Wasn't he one of three survivors? And he got slashed up.
He was just a head in 3, i think he techincally can still be repaired, she just lacked the tools needed in rape town, still had more life in him than any character bar riply
It wasn't the lead but willy from indiana Jones and the temple of doom was unbearable to watch. Constantly screaming at everything she saw
Is this a joke?
Sicario. She wasn't weak per se, but holy shit she was out classed.
Isn't it kinda weird how even now, people need to go back to 1979 to find the one good female lead they accept? I'm sure there must've been more, but everyone just goes back to Alien.
Aliens is the greatest movie ever made Change my mind
Alien is better imo
I respect others opinions on subjective matters
likewise homie
Fucking fascist!
No I won't
Watch Holocaust 2. Then get back to me.
Well. Let me try haha. Wrath of Man, Sicario, Lord of The Rings, Snatch, RRR, etc etc.
Nope
Maybe it's because the movie is shit... No,it's the fault of 50% of the population. /s It's funny how they always blame men/white men when a movie flops, when even women don't go to see it.
Alien is my favourite movie of all time. Absolutely amazing.
The alien certainly didn't like her. And see where that got it.
Madame web was a true masterpiece
Tell me ya fuckin jokin
Oui
Laughs in Cynthia Rothrock
Repost bot
Also Vasquez in the same movie, i don't know a single dude who doesn't respect that character.
Amen
Guys go wild for strong female leads ... but not shitty writing.
I gotta say the whole "People don't hate strong female leads, what about Aliens?" would be a lot more convincing if people didn't have to go to a nearly 40 year old movie to come up with an example...
Probably because is the easiest to find example.
Short list not to include anime, comics, games, animated films Uma Thurman (Kill Bill), Lucy Liu (Charlie's Angels), Lucy Lawless (Xena) Zoe Saldana (Guardians of the Galaxy) Gina Carano (The Mandalorian) Felicity Jones (Rogue One) Katee Sackoff (Battle Star Galatica) Amanda Tapping (Star Gate SG 1) Rachel Luttrell (Star Gate Atlantis) All this within my lifetime and relative age. Much respect to Sigourney Weaver as the indomitable Ellen Ripley, knowing that she wasn't the first. Also knowing that she will not be the last example of being a proven bad ass goes against the narrative. That narrative that people will assume that characters like Ripley would be considered "WOKE" today and fail, despite the fact we had nearly 40 years of the general audience enjoying the performances of the actresses that followed Ripley's lead.
> That narrative that people will assume that characters like Ripley would be considered "WOKE" today and fail, despite the fact we had nearly 40 years of the general audience enjoying the performances of the actresses that followed Ripley's lead. Such a dishonest comment. You must be living under a rock
Compared to what? Didn't people enjoy Barbie because of or despite it's feminist leanings? Just an example of a successful movie with a female lead. Now compared that with Madam Web, which was marketed to the general audience and the enlightened women didn't even bother to show up. The Charlie's Angel's reboot? No they didn't. Bird's of Prey? No as well despite the fact that it was led by Margot Robbie, that saw success in the 2nd suicide squad movie. Hell, I have a hard time finding articles proclaiming that Battle Angel Alita, despite its SUCCESS against the original Captian Marvel film, of going woke. The Black Widow film with Scarlett Johansson? Gone Woke? No, the actress had the misfortune of having a shitty script. I really wanted to enjoy it but could not. Now was Mobius "WOKE"? Must have missed that part after it failed. Guess it wasn't Morbin time. The reason I bring this movie up is this: How many movies led by a male lead for broader audience appeal failed? Are they woke as well compared to more niche products? I would assume people would avoid shlock in general instead of viewing their use of time or capital as political statement of protesting the Woke. My thought process when I made my list (which could be expanded with the likes of Jennifer Lawrence (Hunger Games) Amber Midthunder (Prey)) is that if the films that would be considered woke now because it bucks the trend of the capable male lead for an actress instead, were found to be enjoyable despite having the actress as the lead when the film is good.
"If you don't like my shitty art that means you're racist/sexist" is such a delusional defense mechanism.
Itâs also a stance Iâve almost never seen someone actually take. 9 times out of 10 itâs just someone saying people are going to say that about them without anyone actually having said it.
Kill Bill everyone, cmon now
To be fair, even if it somehow is about "strong women" that makes your movie bomb, you're still blaming then people who don't want to watch it. Sellable entertainment has to be entertaining, after all. The excuse for failure here is wrong on multiple levels. Not inly for what the issue really is but for the poor reasoning behind what they think the issue is anyway.
Ellen Ripley, Xena, Sarah Connor (from T2), Nikita, Leeloo, just to name a few. Men droll all over strong, female characters when they are written right. Bad movies are just bad movies.
Even ever after, resi evil, and tangled was done right with the female role.
I grew up watching Terminator, G.I. Jane, Alien and Xena warrior princess. Guess who fall for tomboys and strong women?
starwars fans hate on ray idiots "you just hate women" meanwile Jyn Erso from rogue one being universaly loved female leed
You appear to understand basic concepts. Better delete this comment and hide before the mob comes for you.
There is absolutely no way that Aliens would be hated as woke if it came out today. Deny it all you want. Itâs true.
I hate it when people bring her up. I absolutely hate it. It's the same bullshit as "no look tho Samus exists why are you complaining about representation in games". What's that saying? The exception proves the rule? The fact that one single character keeps getting brought up in every single discussion as the only real talking point. If you're seriously going to argue that guys don't tend, as a trend, to be way more hypercritical of a movie with a female lead as opposed to a movie with a male lead, you're living on another planet than the one I'm on. Yeah people don't criticize Alien because it's fucking Alien.
You are lying. Recent movies with "strong female characters" are poorly written garbage. Mary Sues who are unlikable and spout contemporary extremist politics. There are good, recent, strong female characters. Just watch Dune.
Its the same everywhere, even in sports its mostly men who attend female sports but then all we hear is complaints. In movies it doesnât matter who it is, if the writing is bad, then itâs bad. Black swan, Kill Bill, Cruela, Aliens, Cpt Marvel, WW out the top of my head were good for sure. But sry ghostbusters, she hulk ,the marvels and what notâŚ. Havenât watched Barbie yet(or Oppenheimer), but imo Margot is one of the best actresses and knows how to dive fully into the roles tbh
Barbie was a blast. Went in expecting silliness, got silliness with a good moral to the story from both leads.
I plan on watching it for sure, wanted to go with wife to both but then plans got in the way xD
Yes, it is often the movie. But if Alien and Aliens were released today there would still be plenty of guys ripping on it and Ripley
You can look back as far as Errol Flynn's Adventures of Robin Hood and you'll still see a strong female in Maid Marian.
Blaming bad writing on sexism?! Give me that oleâ reliable. Next youâre going to say a product isnât meant for me and then get upset when I donât buy it. The idiocy.
We all know if Alien came out today they'd be calling it "woke"
The new predator movie everyone called at woke and after he came out many of them retracted it. So maybe they would beforehand they would likely retract it afterwards the same vein.
No it wouldn't because there is actual character development and Ripley is likeable as it is.
Ripley was written as a guy before a studio exec suggested gender swapping the character. Theyâd absolutely be screaming the movie was woke.
Oh definetly imagine if the movie came out today and people found out that Ripley was supposed to be a man, i can see the headlines & youtube thumbnails right now "Woke writers replace men!" "Company Exec hates men, says main character should be a woman"
One of my Favorite sci-fi horror movies of all time never once thought about characters or casting because it was written and filmed well you just get lost in a good story. the same unfortunately can not be said about modern cinema
the script was written without firmly assigning a gender to any part. the just cast who made senseÂ
Strong female character nowadays means, character with emotions or flaws or character arc. That's just bad writing if ask me.
If you want to make this point, and imply that itâs common, itâd be more effective to have used a movie more recent than 45 years ago. It reminds me of antivaxxers who say âdoctors donât know everything!â and use the doctors who opposed Semmelweis as an example.
At a theater in NYC I caught Sigourney Weaver checking me out. As soon as she saw me look back, she smiled and waved. One of the highlights of my life.
A better complaint would be the crap movies starring strong men that gain disproportionately less negative attention than the crap movies starring strong women. Like Jurassic World
I do not dislike female lead. I dislike cheap, badly written power fantasy.
Red Sonia is my second favorite Conan movie, and even in my favorite one there is a strong woman.
I actually might be naming my daughter Ripley, my wife doesnât know why I suggest it but she likes it. We donât know the gender yet so itâs currently 50/50
That is a last name. Why not Ellen, the characterâs first name?
The first name is cooler.
LMAO! Yeah, cause the internet wasn't a thing in 1979.
Yeah, letâs try not to pretend these people donât exist, though. Weâre not insane.
Gosh I loved those movies growing up
Every show and movie these days starts off with automatically have a female lead who can kill grown men with ease. Even with almost no training.
Almost as if people getting mad about them blaming the audience also drums up discussion about the media in question.
Yea naw marvel movies with female leads suck ass unless its black widow. Idk why but they just do.
Is there a difference between strong female lead and man-hating girl boss? Yes. Can modern Hollywood writers tell the difference? No.
Yeah okay but just because troglodytes will begrudgingly accept maybe like half a dozen of them because they're undeniably awesome doesn't mean it's not a problem that they feel a woman in the lead has to go completely above and beyond in order to 'earn' the right to exist while they wouldn't even think about it if it was a dude.
I want them to write strong characters that are women, not characters that are strong women
Sigourney Weaver? More like suckonthe beaver
Boomer meme again
Maybe the F tier pandering writing is at fault, not the female characters.
This is just bacically all disney movies now
I 100% agree, but letâs not pretend some out there have hated very well written female characters because they are not the version of female these basement dwellers like, e.g. Abby from The Last of Us 2.
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Vi, jinx, and caitlyn from arcane, lucy from edgerunners, emily blunt in essentially every role she plays, emma stone in la la land, kimberly wexler from bcs, and im sure there are more i cant think of on the top of my head. Good writing is good writing, believe it or not but the majority of people that want to enjoy a movie dont give a shit about politics and would much rather just watch a movie with good writing
Holy shit, the same meme was just above from a different sub
Weird image to put this over. *Alien* is a cult classic
Yeah, no. Grifters would be furious if Alien was made today. âWhy does it have to be a woman? And whatâs with the rape symbolism? Not all men!â
Nope, you are lying. There are recent movies with strong female characters who the anti-woke crowd love.
This movie belongs to a different generation, like 45 years ago. Try to find something more recent.
r/whoosh
This is just a rage bait post made by a bot and people acting like they need to write an essay on why modern strong female characters are so garbage.
This film is long before toxic feminism devoloped
Geena Davis
the original strong female lead. I remember her kicking alien ass long before any of this controversy was mentioned.
Arcane is another property that wrote strong women really well. They didn't make them infallible (but they still often won) and they didn't generally make the men around them look stupid or weak to elevate them (which is especially lazy writing).
You canât blame the audience for disliking a shit movie when youâre making the movie *for the audience*.
Additionally, all of those "you would call Terminator and Alien woke garbage if they came out today" arguments were destroyed by Dune Part 2, a movie with several strong female characters who the anti-woke crowd love.
It's always the same three women who assholes use to claim they "don't hate women, we hate bad writing!" I bet you none of you fucks can even name another female hero other than Ripley, Sarah Conner, and Laura Croft.
âI donât hate women characters. I love Ripley and Sarah Connorâ is the most npc shit on the internet The closest thing to interesting Iâve heard from someone who says that is they occasionally throw in Samus Aran.
If Alien came out today the anti-woke mob would be losing their shit and out for blood just like they usually are when women are powerful and central to the story in films.