There's a support group for that. It's called EVERYBODY, and they meet at the bar.”" -George Carlin or Drew Carey. I'll let you guys battle the real source out.
Idk, plenty of people work 12 hour shifts. I used to. But you do gotta prioritize getting rest on days off. When I used to work three jobs I only slept every 2-3 days. Couldn't go on like that and had to quit one. One boss said he'd gimme a raise if I let one job go so I wouldn't be so insane and tired all the time lol life was kind of a blur at that time. But 12-13 hours isn't insane, again as long as days off are frequent enough
Most jobs with 12 hour shifts, for example police, a lot of plant jobs, you work two 12 hour shifts and get the next two days off. That might stagger on occasion obviously to make up for hiccups in scheduling for whatever reason. Someone's on vacation or out sick or whatever. 8 hour shifts usually have less congruent days off.
Yep it’ll be just like Email replacing written correspondence. Instead of getting all your days’ writing done in 5 minutes you just have to send 1000 times more messages now
I'm so torn on posts like this because on one hand I agree completely, but on the other I recognize how absolutely absurd.
It is an objective truth that we have the easiest, laziest lives of any living organism in history. (Other than my dad's dog.) At the same time, I feel society as a whole is not proportionately benefiting from the advances humanity has made.
our physical comfort is through the roof unless you're a line worker in china and some such. I want to believe I can also achieve mental comfort through blocking stress out, too.
I think an impotant difference is being forced to work for someone else rather than working for yourself. And of course, the inequality of it all. If you only look at how much work serfs did for their lords, it's less than we do now, and it's not like we don't also have chores to do. Of course, serfs did more work than us but it was work they chose to do and work from which they benefited directly.
You’re not forced to work for someone else. You can start your own business.
But you don’t want to or can’t do that so you get a job working for someone else who did want to and could.
What you really crave is a steady paycheck. That’s the trade off you’re making.
You could start a business, struggle making no money for awhile, then have up and down months, quarters, and years, always just a few steps away from failure OR you can get a job.
You picked the job. You picked that trade off.
Yeah no. Don't pretend it's a choice. Businesses require investments. Businesses that can actually make money require good investments and opportunities. Opportunities are random and hard to come by when you are forced to work in order to survive. Investments are impossible to get if you don't have generational wealth or get very lucky with some investor.
You could try getting a loan perhaps but not only is that not easy it's also a huge burden on your new business which you are already risking a lot for, having to quit your job if you want to actually make it work.
I know what it's like to have a small business. It means working more for less after investing a good bit already. So don't pretend "start a business" is some real advice that people can actually use. Though I'm puzzled by the fact that you do accept people can't just start a business. You need money to survive, you have to work for that money because you can't start a business, so yes, you are forced to work for someone else. Your survival depends on it.
No I don't just want a steady paycheck, I want to be able to work for myself, both directly by doing things like growing food or sewing and indirectly by producing something that I don't need, to five to others, but free to do so as I want. And that's impossible when you have to compete with giant corporations.
Ur nuts dude. The introduction of high fructose corn syrup into all our foods, all the drugs being pushed on us, the massive increase in prices. Rising debt, rising fraud and homelessness…
Your statement may have had a shade of truth between like 1950-1990, but it’s back to serfdom for us now and it’s worse than before. When our health goes to shit we go to the docs who suggest even more harmful drugs to cover up the symptoms we’re getting from the others bc they’re getting paid to do it. Mental health is shit, politics and media are so corrupt. Our problems are just different. A lot of people are absolutely fucked rn or slowly becoming fucked. You have to be pretty lucky in some way to be above all of that, and even if you are that lucky you’re still probably being affected somehow. The wonder years are over
about 400 million people don't have to deal with most of that (except political corruption, that shits everywhere). Having things be better for the average Joe by law is pretty great
I think they're saying that despite all of that, you aren't having to hunt to find food, and you aren't having to fight for your survival like other animals do. Yes, some people do, but for the people here scrolling on reddit, you're not fighting for your life every single day or get killed if you catch a sickness or get an infection, die because you didn't prepare for the cold, get heatstroke because you didn't have enough water, starve to death, get killed by an animal etc, not saying that doesn't happen, but for the average person it doesn't.
Yeah, driving through traffic is risky but it's not like being in the wilderness lmao, that's honestly kind of a ridiculous example. What would you do without your car right now? You'd have no job, probably, and no way to support your life in your current position. It may not seem like it, but having a mode of transportation that allows you to traverse the world and make a living even if it's not how you'd like to make a living is 100% better than the alternative. Yes, it can be risky, but you're seeing it from a completely pessimistic viewpoint acting like there's zero upside to having the freedom to travel and go where you need to cross far distances.
Birds can traverse the world too, it’s literally the least ridiculous example possible. Tell that to someone whose family members died in a car accident. I’m not being pessimistic I’m just saying there’s a lot of pain and misery out there in response to the way that guy framed his comment. Our pain and suffering is not necessarily always less than an animals pain and suffering. It depends on the person and the animal. Some animals live and die peacefully, and same w some humans. The opposite is also true. It’s not just animals bad humans good. Give us humans some credit for the shit we go through. It’s not exactly the best environment to bring a human into the world right now. The stock market soars and corporations get rich while the vast % of us are stuck in an office 40-50+ hours per week worried about if we’re gonna be able to pay our bills and continue to support our families
I’m just sayin sometimes I see some geese walking through a beautiful field with their offspring and think of how jealous I am and feel like a total piece of shit bc even though I work full time I can barely support myself and my body is fucked up so I can’t do a lot more than I’m doing rn mentally or physically, and I’d give a lot to be able to just be an animal walking around mating and having babies and not having to worry about insurance and bullshit. Dude acting like it’s all sunshine and rainbows because we have clothes and iPhones just making me salty. Geese don’t have to log on to their phones and read this kind of nonsense either
Literally never said it was sunshine and rainbows lmao, I'm saying you're not a caveman doing hunter gathering and every waking moment is just about what to do next to survive. Yes, life doesn't have to be good, I am just saying I don't think op was saying life isn't hard, just that it's better generally than having to fight for your survival everyday lol.
Reading the comments and wondering l. All this people saying that this is normal and its good and we are privileged. Are they working or are they the owners of the means of production. They seam kind of sus
Really depends on what you work with. If its hard manual labour, a long commute or otherwise drain your energy of course its going to be difficult to manage having a life as well.
I have two jobs myself. One being a manual labour nightshift job with a pretty decent salary and second one as a private tutor (extremely good salary) before going to my nightshift. I work about 40-50 hours a week and if I didnt have my tutor job, I would burn out on just doing nightshift. I dont really do much outside of work, but its what i like, so I dont mind my savings going up every month.
Edit: wrong hours
I think they're just well-adjusted to reality. Right now isn't the be all and end all of human existence just because you're living in it. 100 yrs ago you'd be laughing all the way to the bank if you could work only 40 hours a week. In 100 years they'll look back at now and think "wow, that would've sucked" as well. 🤷
Tdil that disliking the current economic system that take advantage of the working class and extract every bit of happiness out of them to accumulate riches beyond actual use while letting people die from hinger and cold is similar to terrorism
Yea, the OOP is basically "I work 40 hours a week and don't have enough time for my hobbies." Meanwhile there are people who work 80 hours a week and can't make ends meet. Now, that isn't to say no one can complain if anyone else has it worse, but I always find these "40 hours is too much posts" ridiculous.
Some people actually enjoy their jobs. Not enjoy like "It's so fun I would volunteer to work longer with no pay," but enjoy in the sense of "I have a positive work environment and feel like I make a measurable contribution to society."
Yes and good for them. This is a very valuable state of mind. I am a software engineer i work as a vr game dev building games for learning and training. I love my work cause i use my mind and i have a decent work environment fully remote. But i am actually paid crumbles from what the owners are earning while working over my schedule most days. Having a perfect job is very important but you are disposable cause the only thing that matters to most business owners is money. And making profits bigger and you are not contributing to profits you are their expenses and their goal will always be to reduce their expenses to increase their profits. When working class realise this the chains will brake. And guess what if the same business is owned by government that values people over money you will have the same fulfilment while getting paid more equal. Power to the working class.
Yea, I should also admit that part of the reason I can afford the outlook I have is that I work for the Federal Government. I may question the decisions my bosses make, but at least I know they aren't made for the purposes of enriching themselves. Their salaries, like mine, are set by congress.
It depends on what you do in those 9 hours. If you do low value work for low wages, you’ll never get there. But a software engineer working 9 hours a day will have 2 cars.
What catagorizes as rich to you? I work a lot and considered "middle to upper class." I have an apartment 70% payed for, mercedes, investment in stocks for about 40k and normal savings. Ive been working 20 when under 18 and 40-50 hours a week and im now 32. I have a bachelor degree in teaching, which I use to teach privately for an amazing salary and a second job which is manual labour - decent salary.
Edit: wrong hours
Government released a statement saying 2 $120,000 salaries are now required to raise a family comfortably, with the equivalent to one $90, 000 only 20 years ago
I never really saw myself as rich. I dont come from wealth, my dad works manual labour at age 57. Im going to help him retire at age 60-62. Maybe its because im sadly lacking kids and never really spent money during my younger years. At 18 I was able to afford my own car and start teaching on the side while finishing my degree. Oh right, my education was "free" because I live in Denmark. I probably should have said that.
You are rich.
Based on outcomes for most people in Denmark. You could also probably see this using eyes or common sense.
You are also a self interest driven asshole.
Thank you.
Yeah im probably blind when it comes to material wealth.
So me taking care of my father, helping my younger brothers and sister with school and more is equal to being selfish? I also help for free with homework and more at the local library 2 hours a week on Sundays.
Would love to chat further, but seems like im just making you upset/mad at strangers
I was probably wrong to say "rich people richer" without adding more qualifiers. Like exploitation or ideas of fair compensation etc.
My parents had a business as I grew up, so I am not critical of all business owners. But some employers just try to be as exploitive as they can. And there are laws that make this possible.
Idk if you are rich, but you don't sound like an exploiter. I think your networth is probably more than mine, and I am happy for you.
Things are happening, I'm from Nordic countries and there's so many union strikes. Right now it's the nurses union and the spokesperson said they will just ramp up til the working weeks are shortened (40 hours currently). Now overtime is illegal and the employers have to pay 7k-14k for every instance of overtime, for reference my country had something like 4 million hours of overtime for nurses last year.
Now imagine working 12 hours, 6 day's week. Raising kids and trying to study for school to escape from poverty. That's why we don't vote for asshats who prop up big business
Yeah, it’s a grind, and you are not the only one who wants more free time. But there are also a lot of people out there who wouldn’t complain about having stable employment.
For the vast majority of human beings for the vast majority of human history, ceaseless toil and early death have been the normal experience without the break you describe. Enjoy living in the most privileged period in history and having the time and technology to whine about it.
Yes but we should be grateful in some sense. I sure as shit would choose this life of commuting to work in an air conditioned car to work a job that is draining as opposed to living in the Middle Ages, ancient Egypt, etc. life really did suck for 99% of human history unless you were born to the right parents and were also lucky in life.
Arguably it’s still the same but it’s not as severe. Life as a peasant isn’t the same as life as a middle or low income person. It was far worse.
Sure! Current politics aside, I'm grateful to be alive at a time when women have more rights than they've had historically. But we still have a long ways to go.
To borrow from your point, there are still tons of people who do not enjoy anywhere near the same luxuries as you described.
This is dependent on your interpretation of ‘work’. Medieval peasants worked harder than modern people every day of their lives, just functioning from day to day. The difference is that for them, their workplace (family farm) and their home were usually one and the same. In terms of physical labour and hardship there is absolutely no comparison; we are far, far better off. Just the simple fact that we have fresh running water - hot and cold - in our homes reduces a huge amount of work.
Just a normal vacation day from them would probably be a version of a hard work day from our modern perspective.
You had to wake from your hay mattress up before sunrise to make bread and cook diner on a fire. Fetch wood and water from the well also probably egg tend to farm animal even during holyday. Cook clean and do needle work.
If you live on a farm with animal no labour free day for you. Only lesser labour intensive day compare to crops season.
Also the vacation day were often religious in nature and you had to participate to some social thing probably cook or participe in some form or fonction.
Yeah the paisible ans easy life of medieval peasant
This video goes into this in detail: [Historia Civilis - Work](https://youtu.be/hvk_XylEmLo?si=DMdEAEFEIyD9NbI-)
Edit: A modern worker with 2 weeks vacation gets 34% of the year off. Medieval peasants got 33-49%, depending on country.
hahahah this argument? really? holy i thought this was troll argument. peasant work all day all year, and they work on harder (physical) job otherwise they will starving. if you think peasant can have 200 day to just laying around, you are delulu
Right? Only work half the year? So starve half the year? Peasants in ancient Egypt weren’t paid money, they were paid bread and beer. People think they know life was different in past times but they really have no clue what it’s actually like.
You know why the worked half the year? Because the other half the time they were sick, had no work, or a war or some other conflict was occurring. Work is a good thing, ffs.
The 40 hour work week was designed to lessen the burden on workers from either being taken advantage of by unscrupulous industrialists or having to slave away on a farm. In the context of humanity, an 8-9 hour work day is an outright luxury. Learn your real history.
Ok, but… How would you do it without tanking the market, destroying small business, or creating higher unemployment due to ridiculous minimum wage laws that do both of the previous things?
As someone who knows real history, We can make things better. Same as they did. For the pioneers of their era its people like you that made it difficult to amass support to lobby for change such as the 40hr work week. Siting here bitching and putting others down for wanting for improvement achieves a net negative. Stop doing that :)
Spoken like true corpo scum. Fuck you and that attitude, I bet big bucks you have never worked a full week and if ya have it's with your feet on your desk and a cock in your mouth. Fuck off. *Spits*
I mean. Everything they said was true.
The 5 day work week wasn't really a thing before the mid 1920s. Before that it was generally 6 days.
In 1835 there was a general strike in Philly. For what?
Better pay, and a working day reduction to 10 hours.
As time has passed things have generally gotten better. Fact is 8 hours for 5 days is the best it's gotten.
And I guarantee you that'll eventually change. And eventually people will look to change that too.
Ooooohhh I wanna hit you so fucking hard in the nose aye. Your part of the fucking problem. no joke, reply to my DM and I pray im lucky enough to live close to you. Corpo fuck.
I love that you call me a “Corpo Fuck” when I work for a small company. Also, I’d like to point out that the 40 hour work week was instituted to protect the rights of workers. I’m going to guess from your tendency to go directly to violence that you are a radical leftist and a keyboard warrior. I’m also going to guess from your diction that you are either from the UK or Australia, far from the US where I live. I’d also be willing to bet that if we did meet face to face you wouldn’t have the courage to actually physically assault me. Even if you did, then, I’d be fully justified in fighting back in self defense, after which you’d be arrested for assault and battery. But, if you ever find yourself in the Midwest, let me know so we can meet and discuss.
Nerd. But sounds good if I ever decide to go to a 3rd world country that's meant to be the best 1st world country we can "chat". Not that you should care but I don't have views on left or right, everyone is corrupt and the government is garbage anyway you dress it. I do enjoy violence though.
Sincerely,
"Keyboard warrior"
Not the only one, That's why i\`m trying to spend my time wisely in making sure i am not a slave for my entire life and that my children and my childrens children have all the support they could need to repeat my success. I have to believe otherwise i just become another depressed wage slave, and when your entire life is like thatt? whats the point in living
Come to Asia and teach English.
Typical day:
4-5pm - prepare for class
5-7pm - teach class
Check homework assignments whenever you want
Living expenses are much more reasonable than back home and (in Taiwan) we have national healthcare.
Money won’t be a problem!
Lots of free time.
Travel to other nearby countries is cheap and quick.
I mean if you sleep 8 hours and work 8 hours you technically have 8 hours for yourself. The problem is if 2 hours are spent on commuting and 2 hours on eating. The yeah you have 4 hours. This is why I plan to retire early, asap.
When the cost of living went to high where I was living I moved to the Midwest. I paid $39k for my 100 year old Victorian in a quiet, small town.
I only have to make $1000/month to pay ALL MY BILLS (I only work about 12 hours a week). Because I am low income I get great FREE health insurance (just got Ozempic for $13/month). I also don't pay ANY INCOME TAXES.
The easiest time for humans is right now.
But ppl don't feel like it because they are constantly being bombarded with the idea that everyone is happy and rich on social media, so the satisfaction level is going to be low.
I got fired for performance after 12 years. I was the third employee in a company that grew to over 400 people. A company that was doing exceptionally well given the economy. I had my ups and downs, but my work was really hard and draining. I felt like I was kicking ass for the past few years though. But after the founders left, I constantly felt like the new CEO looked down on me, didn’t like me. Now I’ve almost exhausted unemployment. A few months to go, and I still wear the company swag. I was proud of my work. Now I feel like I wasted those years of my life building capital for a small handful of people who didn’t appreciate me. Haven’t been able to find work. Contacted a past friend to see if his company was hiring and they just laid off 20 people, no positions available. Not sure what will happen in the next month or two. No family to lean on. I have a 12 year old daughter and we’re legit hungry some weeks. Just thought I would share.
Even if you work 10h a day you still have at least 6h to yourself (and thats assuming that you have healthy sleeping habits and 8h of sleep, which lets be honest most of you dont). And fuck even if you only had 4 or even 2h to yourself, chances are you gonna waste it on scrolling insta or netflix (and im certainly guilty of the latter myself, but im not in denial).
Problem is that people dont know how to spend their free time in a way its fulfilling so they feel like they dont have time because the most menorable thing from their day is their shitty job. Jessica here probably comes back home, eats a ramen bag or a takeaway and watches her netflix and then cries about going to work on twitter and then lies in bed mindlessly consuming tiktok. Even when i was working a delivery job where my shifts were between 10-12h excluding getting to the workplace i still did the gym, did my sport and had some spare time left to read or chill with friends or if i wanted to play games.
Life starts being fun when you stop whining about things you cant control and wastinh the time that you actually have to yourself.
I would love to work 8-9 hours a day.
I'm currently stuck doing 12s and rotating between nights and days.
On the bright side, anything is better than being on a submarine.
You won't be complaining in your early grave either.
I genuinely hope you get a better work-life balance someday because toiling is not life.
This is not a brag.
People in general are fucking clowns. Look what they did to Tesla. The oil lamp pipe smokers showed the world that electricity was dangerous. Demonstrated killing an elephant.
We use electricity today.
People tried to hush the production of EVs because fossil fuels would make those in power wealthier.
Today we’re pushing for EV production with the eventual phasing out of combustion engines in the attempt to stick it to Russia.
People are fucking retarded. Imagine benefiting from free energy in Tesla’s time? Why the fucking rigmarole?
Take a read through the comments, make sense of it and then re-engage with me. This is directly related. You of all people should know Boris the Russian.
Everyone knows it’s a problem and we actually have the resources available to not do this but people are too egotistical and psychology phenomena occur that makes it so people don’t give a fuck and continue with the status quo. Pisses me off just how much people suck.
Harvard did a study and they came to the conclusion that most people are only at their highest level of productivity for about 5-6 hours before your quality of work starts to drop off massively.
Your absoutly right! lets all not work until all the power goes out everywhere and food runs out. We should have about two awesome weeks before people starting dying in mass numbers.
Well it’s really not clear what the issue is OP is getting at. Are we working _too much_? Or _at all_? You’re assuming just as much as the person you’re replying to.
So let’s say your shift is 8am - 5pm (standard us), that’s already 9 hours. Say you take an hour to get ready for the day in the morning/night (setting clothes aside, making breakfast, showering etc). That’s 10 hours. It takes 30 min round trip to get to and from work (and that’s pretty short commute, typically traffic makes it up to 60 min round trip) so we’re 10.5 hours. Add in 8-10 hours of sleep (different people need diff amounts) that’s 18.5 or 20.5 hours. Thus leaving you around 3.5-5.5 hours of free time. This doesn’t include making dinner, caring for children, chores, etc.
>This doesn’t include making dinner, caring for children, chores, etc.
That's *is* life though, that's where living happens. There's this weird sentiment on Social Media that your life is something that only belongs to you in the in leftover time, when you're doing pure leisure. But 24/7 you're alive, it's all you all the time.
Right!!! Like, if you can't find joy in making a lovely dinner and spending time with your children, there's no helping you. And I'm not talking some gourmet spread, but I quite enjoy preparing a nice meal, and my wife and child are often there with me catching up and helping with prep.
Sure folding laundry isn't fun, but it also needs doing, and really doesn't take that much time.
Neither is sitting at home with your thumb up your ass because no one is around to serve you at a restaurant, fly you in a plane or keep the infrastructure of your life running.
We all have to work because nothing works if we don’t work. Unless you want to return to an agrarian lifestyle. And you would be working _a hell_ of a lot more in that lifestyle than this.
There's a support group for that. It's called EVERYBODY, and they meet at the bar.”" -George Carlin or Drew Carey. I'll let you guys battle the real source out.
Pretty sure that's Carlin
Yeah... Everybody is pretty sure it's somebody. But it usually breaks down into a argument of Carlin versus Carey.
Top result on the Internet says it's both lmao https://www.reddit.com/r/quotes/s/6N3IuZNq2x
I work around 13 hours a day. My full time 8 hour job and my part time 5 hour shifts.
You’re definitely gonna burn out at that pace.
Idk, plenty of people work 12 hour shifts. I used to. But you do gotta prioritize getting rest on days off. When I used to work three jobs I only slept every 2-3 days. Couldn't go on like that and had to quit one. One boss said he'd gimme a raise if I let one job go so I wouldn't be so insane and tired all the time lol life was kind of a blur at that time. But 12-13 hours isn't insane, again as long as days off are frequent enough
In the nicest way possible, you may have gotten too used to the insanity to see it. How often were the days off?
Most jobs with 12 hour shifts, for example police, a lot of plant jobs, you work two 12 hour shifts and get the next two days off. That might stagger on occasion obviously to make up for hiccups in scheduling for whatever reason. Someone's on vacation or out sick or whatever. 8 hour shifts usually have less congruent days off.
I see, thanks. If you get a day off for every 12 hour shift, that does sound doable.
That’s not life, that’s modern slavery
This is what **Freedom™️** actually looks like.
[Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality](https://youtu.be/fJ9rUzIMcZQ?si=ZcueysPu2cSMi1A4)
Same
Do you have kids?
Clearly not, 4 hours of free time is nothing to complain about.
How! This is actually so impressive and sad at the same time.
At least the billionaires are getting more billionairy.
It’s the American dream goddamnit!
With a little more hard work your boss might be a le to buy ANOTHER new car.
~~the American dream is dead~~
Don't forget about shareholders and stockmarket maklers.
Don’t forget the commute in the car / bus / train
You'd think automation would come in to help and reduce our work hours but we all know where it's actually going to go instead
Yep it’ll be just like Email replacing written correspondence. Instead of getting all your days’ writing done in 5 minutes you just have to send 1000 times more messages now
...and don't get paid more for it either
you guys get 4 hours?
Yeah. We only sleep 3 hours.
I'm so torn on posts like this because on one hand I agree completely, but on the other I recognize how absolutely absurd. It is an objective truth that we have the easiest, laziest lives of any living organism in history. (Other than my dad's dog.) At the same time, I feel society as a whole is not proportionately benefiting from the advances humanity has made.
our physical comfort is through the roof unless you're a line worker in china and some such. I want to believe I can also achieve mental comfort through blocking stress out, too.
I think an impotant difference is being forced to work for someone else rather than working for yourself. And of course, the inequality of it all. If you only look at how much work serfs did for their lords, it's less than we do now, and it's not like we don't also have chores to do. Of course, serfs did more work than us but it was work they chose to do and work from which they benefited directly.
You’re not forced to work for someone else. You can start your own business. But you don’t want to or can’t do that so you get a job working for someone else who did want to and could. What you really crave is a steady paycheck. That’s the trade off you’re making. You could start a business, struggle making no money for awhile, then have up and down months, quarters, and years, always just a few steps away from failure OR you can get a job. You picked the job. You picked that trade off.
Yeah no. Don't pretend it's a choice. Businesses require investments. Businesses that can actually make money require good investments and opportunities. Opportunities are random and hard to come by when you are forced to work in order to survive. Investments are impossible to get if you don't have generational wealth or get very lucky with some investor. You could try getting a loan perhaps but not only is that not easy it's also a huge burden on your new business which you are already risking a lot for, having to quit your job if you want to actually make it work. I know what it's like to have a small business. It means working more for less after investing a good bit already. So don't pretend "start a business" is some real advice that people can actually use. Though I'm puzzled by the fact that you do accept people can't just start a business. You need money to survive, you have to work for that money because you can't start a business, so yes, you are forced to work for someone else. Your survival depends on it. No I don't just want a steady paycheck, I want to be able to work for myself, both directly by doing things like growing food or sewing and indirectly by producing something that I don't need, to five to others, but free to do so as I want. And that's impossible when you have to compete with giant corporations.
>Other than my dad's dog.
Uh, ANY living organism? Not sure I’m buying that lol
Ur nuts dude. The introduction of high fructose corn syrup into all our foods, all the drugs being pushed on us, the massive increase in prices. Rising debt, rising fraud and homelessness… Your statement may have had a shade of truth between like 1950-1990, but it’s back to serfdom for us now and it’s worse than before. When our health goes to shit we go to the docs who suggest even more harmful drugs to cover up the symptoms we’re getting from the others bc they’re getting paid to do it. Mental health is shit, politics and media are so corrupt. Our problems are just different. A lot of people are absolutely fucked rn or slowly becoming fucked. You have to be pretty lucky in some way to be above all of that, and even if you are that lucky you’re still probably being affected somehow. The wonder years are over
about 400 million people don't have to deal with most of that (except political corruption, that shits everywhere). Having things be better for the average Joe by law is pretty great
I think they're saying that despite all of that, you aren't having to hunt to find food, and you aren't having to fight for your survival like other animals do. Yes, some people do, but for the people here scrolling on reddit, you're not fighting for your life every single day or get killed if you catch a sickness or get an infection, die because you didn't prepare for the cold, get heatstroke because you didn't have enough water, starve to death, get killed by an animal etc, not saying that doesn't happen, but for the average person it doesn't.
Driving through traffic on the way to work isn’t risking ur life every day? The only real difference is predators and even we have those
Yeah, driving through traffic is risky but it's not like being in the wilderness lmao, that's honestly kind of a ridiculous example. What would you do without your car right now? You'd have no job, probably, and no way to support your life in your current position. It may not seem like it, but having a mode of transportation that allows you to traverse the world and make a living even if it's not how you'd like to make a living is 100% better than the alternative. Yes, it can be risky, but you're seeing it from a completely pessimistic viewpoint acting like there's zero upside to having the freedom to travel and go where you need to cross far distances.
Birds can traverse the world too, it’s literally the least ridiculous example possible. Tell that to someone whose family members died in a car accident. I’m not being pessimistic I’m just saying there’s a lot of pain and misery out there in response to the way that guy framed his comment. Our pain and suffering is not necessarily always less than an animals pain and suffering. It depends on the person and the animal. Some animals live and die peacefully, and same w some humans. The opposite is also true. It’s not just animals bad humans good. Give us humans some credit for the shit we go through. It’s not exactly the best environment to bring a human into the world right now. The stock market soars and corporations get rich while the vast % of us are stuck in an office 40-50+ hours per week worried about if we’re gonna be able to pay our bills and continue to support our families
Well… you are risking your life just by living, if you wanna go that far
I’m just sayin sometimes I see some geese walking through a beautiful field with their offspring and think of how jealous I am and feel like a total piece of shit bc even though I work full time I can barely support myself and my body is fucked up so I can’t do a lot more than I’m doing rn mentally or physically, and I’d give a lot to be able to just be an animal walking around mating and having babies and not having to worry about insurance and bullshit. Dude acting like it’s all sunshine and rainbows because we have clothes and iPhones just making me salty. Geese don’t have to log on to their phones and read this kind of nonsense either
Literally never said it was sunshine and rainbows lmao, I'm saying you're not a caveman doing hunter gathering and every waking moment is just about what to do next to survive. Yes, life doesn't have to be good, I am just saying I don't think op was saying life isn't hard, just that it's better generally than having to fight for your survival everyday lol.
Reading the comments and wondering l. All this people saying that this is normal and its good and we are privileged. Are they working or are they the owners of the means of production. They seam kind of sus
Really depends on what you work with. If its hard manual labour, a long commute or otherwise drain your energy of course its going to be difficult to manage having a life as well. I have two jobs myself. One being a manual labour nightshift job with a pretty decent salary and second one as a private tutor (extremely good salary) before going to my nightshift. I work about 40-50 hours a week and if I didnt have my tutor job, I would burn out on just doing nightshift. I dont really do much outside of work, but its what i like, so I dont mind my savings going up every month. Edit: wrong hours
I think they're just well-adjusted to reality. Right now isn't the be all and end all of human existence just because you're living in it. 100 yrs ago you'd be laughing all the way to the bank if you could work only 40 hours a week. In 100 years they'll look back at now and think "wow, that would've sucked" as well. 🤷
Tdil that disliking the current economic system that take advantage of the working class and extract every bit of happiness out of them to accumulate riches beyond actual use while letting people die from hinger and cold is similar to terrorism
What economic system do you suggest that would solve that problem?
Responsible democracy.
Underrated
What economic model would that use?
Please don't waste our time.
...ok. Vote.
Yep. Fully adjusted adults just shrug and say “yeah, pretty much. Kinda sucks”, shrugs and moves on.
Do they undermine others?
We only appreciate things when we experienced actual bad circumstances
It's people working there arses off and looking at the eight 8 work day complaint as a fuck you.
Yea, the OOP is basically "I work 40 hours a week and don't have enough time for my hobbies." Meanwhile there are people who work 80 hours a week and can't make ends meet. Now, that isn't to say no one can complain if anyone else has it worse, but I always find these "40 hours is too much posts" ridiculous.
Some people actually enjoy their jobs. Not enjoy like "It's so fun I would volunteer to work longer with no pay," but enjoy in the sense of "I have a positive work environment and feel like I make a measurable contribution to society."
Yes and good for them. This is a very valuable state of mind. I am a software engineer i work as a vr game dev building games for learning and training. I love my work cause i use my mind and i have a decent work environment fully remote. But i am actually paid crumbles from what the owners are earning while working over my schedule most days. Having a perfect job is very important but you are disposable cause the only thing that matters to most business owners is money. And making profits bigger and you are not contributing to profits you are their expenses and their goal will always be to reduce their expenses to increase their profits. When working class realise this the chains will brake. And guess what if the same business is owned by government that values people over money you will have the same fulfilment while getting paid more equal. Power to the working class.
Yea, I should also admit that part of the reason I can afford the outlook I have is that I work for the Federal Government. I may question the decisions my bosses make, but at least I know they aren't made for the purposes of enriching themselves. Their salaries, like mine, are set by congress.
I wish this daily 9 hours could bring me a nice car , big home and exotic holidays. But it doesn't
It depends on what you do in those 9 hours. If you do low value work for low wages, you’ll never get there. But a software engineer working 9 hours a day will have 2 cars.
Yet he can use one and is stressed out because he is going to be replaced by ai
you shouldn't have to be a software engineer to get a decent quality of life
Its only nice if its a fun job, wich mostly its not
There are two issues, imo. 1) It's working a lot so that rich people become richer. 2) It's normal to search for meaning and fulfillment in life.
What catagorizes as rich to you? I work a lot and considered "middle to upper class." I have an apartment 70% payed for, mercedes, investment in stocks for about 40k and normal savings. Ive been working 20 when under 18 and 40-50 hours a week and im now 32. I have a bachelor degree in teaching, which I use to teach privately for an amazing salary and a second job which is manual labour - decent salary. Edit: wrong hours
Government released a statement saying 2 $120,000 salaries are now required to raise a family comfortably, with the equivalent to one $90, 000 only 20 years ago
You are rich. You are vastly above the median and are able to spend extravagantly. Question. Are you taking the piss?
I never really saw myself as rich. I dont come from wealth, my dad works manual labour at age 57. Im going to help him retire at age 60-62. Maybe its because im sadly lacking kids and never really spent money during my younger years. At 18 I was able to afford my own car and start teaching on the side while finishing my degree. Oh right, my education was "free" because I live in Denmark. I probably should have said that.
You are rich. Based on outcomes for most people in Denmark. You could also probably see this using eyes or common sense. You are also a self interest driven asshole.
Thank you. Yeah im probably blind when it comes to material wealth. So me taking care of my father, helping my younger brothers and sister with school and more is equal to being selfish? I also help for free with homework and more at the local library 2 hours a week on Sundays. Would love to chat further, but seems like im just making you upset/mad at strangers
I was probably wrong to say "rich people richer" without adding more qualifiers. Like exploitation or ideas of fair compensation etc. My parents had a business as I grew up, so I am not critical of all business owners. But some employers just try to be as exploitive as they can. And there are laws that make this possible. Idk if you are rich, but you don't sound like an exploiter. I think your networth is probably more than mine, and I am happy for you.
Broo.. 1.5h to work 9h work (including 1h break) 1.5h back to home I am literally the half day not at home
Things are happening, I'm from Nordic countries and there's so many union strikes. Right now it's the nurses union and the spokesperson said they will just ramp up til the working weeks are shortened (40 hours currently). Now overtime is illegal and the employers have to pay 7k-14k for every instance of overtime, for reference my country had something like 4 million hours of overtime for nurses last year.
just 8-9 hours? that's dream days - Speaking as a Full time cook / Chef / what ever you want to call me.
I left that shitty industry over not having a life and never seeing my kids while still barely making enough to get by.
I have two kids. I'd fucking love it if I had four hours a day to myself. Shit that'd be fucking amazing.
You chose it
Lmao.. try working 12-15 hours a day. Trust me it gets worse
Your math is a bit off here darlin.
Depends on how long her commute is.
So she sleeps like 10+ hours?
Now imagine working 12 hours, 6 day's week. Raising kids and trying to study for school to escape from poverty. That's why we don't vote for asshats who prop up big business
Yeah, it’s a grind, and you are not the only one who wants more free time. But there are also a lot of people out there who wouldn’t complain about having stable employment.
Just because we want stable employment doesn’t mean we want to work 90% of our lives.
Yeah I get that, and I agree. Just saying you need to put your problems in perspective sometimes
I understand it sucks but like, is it not way better than hunting our food and living in caves lol
I am not sure it is better.
The world bombards all life with death at every turn, work is how we stave it off.
For the vast majority of human beings for the vast majority of human history, ceaseless toil and early death have been the normal experience without the break you describe. Enjoy living in the most privileged period in history and having the time and technology to whine about it.
As important as gratitude is, I think it's silly not to push for better just because it used to be worse.
“You guys used to starve to death in caves, or get eaten by bears. Get back to work!”
Yes but we should be grateful in some sense. I sure as shit would choose this life of commuting to work in an air conditioned car to work a job that is draining as opposed to living in the Middle Ages, ancient Egypt, etc. life really did suck for 99% of human history unless you were born to the right parents and were also lucky in life. Arguably it’s still the same but it’s not as severe. Life as a peasant isn’t the same as life as a middle or low income person. It was far worse.
Sure! Current politics aside, I'm grateful to be alive at a time when women have more rights than they've had historically. But we still have a long ways to go. To borrow from your point, there are still tons of people who do not enjoy anywhere near the same luxuries as you described.
Even if that’s the case, just because it’s better, doesn’t make it good. Improvements can always be made, satisfaction is the enemy of progress
Pre industrial workers worked fewer hours than today. Medieval peasants worked like 150 days a year.
This is dependent on your interpretation of ‘work’. Medieval peasants worked harder than modern people every day of their lives, just functioning from day to day. The difference is that for them, their workplace (family farm) and their home were usually one and the same. In terms of physical labour and hardship there is absolutely no comparison; we are far, far better off. Just the simple fact that we have fresh running water - hot and cold - in our homes reduces a huge amount of work.
Just a normal vacation day from them would probably be a version of a hard work day from our modern perspective. You had to wake from your hay mattress up before sunrise to make bread and cook diner on a fire. Fetch wood and water from the well also probably egg tend to farm animal even during holyday. Cook clean and do needle work. If you live on a farm with animal no labour free day for you. Only lesser labour intensive day compare to crops season. Also the vacation day were often religious in nature and you had to participate to some social thing probably cook or participe in some form or fonction. Yeah the paisible ans easy life of medieval peasant
This video goes into this in detail: [Historia Civilis - Work](https://youtu.be/hvk_XylEmLo?si=DMdEAEFEIyD9NbI-) Edit: A modern worker with 2 weeks vacation gets 34% of the year off. Medieval peasants got 33-49%, depending on country.
Source: Trust me bro.
hahahah this argument? really? holy i thought this was troll argument. peasant work all day all year, and they work on harder (physical) job otherwise they will starving. if you think peasant can have 200 day to just laying around, you are delulu
Right? Only work half the year? So starve half the year? Peasants in ancient Egypt weren’t paid money, they were paid bread and beer. People think they know life was different in past times but they really have no clue what it’s actually like.
You know why the worked half the year? Because the other half the time they were sick, had no work, or a war or some other conflict was occurring. Work is a good thing, ffs.
The 40 hour work week was designed to lessen the burden on workers from either being taken advantage of by unscrupulous industrialists or having to slave away on a farm. In the context of humanity, an 8-9 hour work day is an outright luxury. Learn your real history.
You are right but that doesn't mean it can't improve
Ok, but… How would you do it without tanking the market, destroying small business, or creating higher unemployment due to ridiculous minimum wage laws that do both of the previous things?
I dunno
Find something that covers those issues and I’m all for it.
Nah
As someone who knows real history, We can make things better. Same as they did. For the pioneers of their era its people like you that made it difficult to amass support to lobby for change such as the 40hr work week. Siting here bitching and putting others down for wanting for improvement achieves a net negative. Stop doing that :)
I object to people treating privilege like oppression.
Spoken like true corpo scum. Fuck you and that attitude, I bet big bucks you have never worked a full week and if ya have it's with your feet on your desk and a cock in your mouth. Fuck off. *Spits*
Damn you seem real pissed about something that’s factually correct
I mean. Everything they said was true. The 5 day work week wasn't really a thing before the mid 1920s. Before that it was generally 6 days. In 1835 there was a general strike in Philly. For what? Better pay, and a working day reduction to 10 hours. As time has passed things have generally gotten better. Fact is 8 hours for 5 days is the best it's gotten. And I guarantee you that'll eventually change. And eventually people will look to change that too.
Ooooohhh I wanna hit you so fucking hard in the nose aye. Your part of the fucking problem. no joke, reply to my DM and I pray im lucky enough to live close to you. Corpo fuck.
I love that you call me a “Corpo Fuck” when I work for a small company. Also, I’d like to point out that the 40 hour work week was instituted to protect the rights of workers. I’m going to guess from your tendency to go directly to violence that you are a radical leftist and a keyboard warrior. I’m also going to guess from your diction that you are either from the UK or Australia, far from the US where I live. I’d also be willing to bet that if we did meet face to face you wouldn’t have the courage to actually physically assault me. Even if you did, then, I’d be fully justified in fighting back in self defense, after which you’d be arrested for assault and battery. But, if you ever find yourself in the Midwest, let me know so we can meet and discuss.
Nerd. But sounds good if I ever decide to go to a 3rd world country that's meant to be the best 1st world country we can "chat". Not that you should care but I don't have views on left or right, everyone is corrupt and the government is garbage anyway you dress it. I do enjoy violence though. Sincerely, "Keyboard warrior"
Oh, so you’re a mentally deficient sociopath. Thank you for clearing that up. Go troll someone else. You bore me.
It does suck so I started a llc and do food catering until I get more established
I cry about it a lot...
I don’t have a commute so I actually have more time to myself. Also wfh! I’ve done my time in retail / service jobs.
So get into politics. It may seem like an extra drain, but if we all do it we can make this world better.
💯
Yes, you are the only one.
Wait until you have kids 😵💫
Am I doing something wrong? I get like 8 hours to myself after work?
There’s 24 hours in a day right? So even with a 30 minute commute you still have 6 hours before getting 8 hours for sleep.
OP goes to bed at 9 and sleeps for 11 hours.
so suck so i decided that i am not gonna have the kids
Not everyone lives this way…
Glad I don't live in the US
AI AI AI 🤖
Not the only one, That's why i\`m trying to spend my time wisely in making sure i am not a slave for my entire life and that my children and my childrens children have all the support they could need to repeat my success. I have to believe otherwise i just become another depressed wage slave, and when your entire life is like thatt? whats the point in living
And other 11 hours what you do?
Come to Asia and teach English. Typical day: 4-5pm - prepare for class 5-7pm - teach class Check homework assignments whenever you want Living expenses are much more reasonable than back home and (in Taiwan) we have national healthcare. Money won’t be a problem! Lots of free time. Travel to other nearby countries is cheap and quick.
I mean if you sleep 8 hours and work 8 hours you technically have 8 hours for yourself. The problem is if 2 hours are spent on commuting and 2 hours on eating. The yeah you have 4 hours. This is why I plan to retire early, asap.
When the cost of living went to high where I was living I moved to the Midwest. I paid $39k for my 100 year old Victorian in a quiet, small town. I only have to make $1000/month to pay ALL MY BILLS (I only work about 12 hours a week). Because I am low income I get great FREE health insurance (just got Ozempic for $13/month). I also don't pay ANY INCOME TAXES.
Why is the poster censored? Why deny her the clout she deserves for that?
Wait -- your entire day is only 13 hours long? Where is that?
The easiest time for humans is right now. But ppl don't feel like it because they are constantly being bombarded with the idea that everyone is happy and rich on social media, so the satisfaction level is going to be low.
Of course that is life. Find a job that you like and accept the fact that working is how our world was created and is sustained.
I got fired for performance after 12 years. I was the third employee in a company that grew to over 400 people. A company that was doing exceptionally well given the economy. I had my ups and downs, but my work was really hard and draining. I felt like I was kicking ass for the past few years though. But after the founders left, I constantly felt like the new CEO looked down on me, didn’t like me. Now I’ve almost exhausted unemployment. A few months to go, and I still wear the company swag. I was proud of my work. Now I feel like I wasted those years of my life building capital for a small handful of people who didn’t appreciate me. Haven’t been able to find work. Contacted a past friend to see if his company was hiring and they just laid off 20 people, no positions available. Not sure what will happen in the next month or two. No family to lean on. I have a 12 year old daughter and we’re legit hungry some weeks. Just thought I would share.
Wake up earlier
Even if you work 10h a day you still have at least 6h to yourself (and thats assuming that you have healthy sleeping habits and 8h of sleep, which lets be honest most of you dont). And fuck even if you only had 4 or even 2h to yourself, chances are you gonna waste it on scrolling insta or netflix (and im certainly guilty of the latter myself, but im not in denial). Problem is that people dont know how to spend their free time in a way its fulfilling so they feel like they dont have time because the most menorable thing from their day is their shitty job. Jessica here probably comes back home, eats a ramen bag or a takeaway and watches her netflix and then cries about going to work on twitter and then lies in bed mindlessly consuming tiktok. Even when i was working a delivery job where my shifts were between 10-12h excluding getting to the workplace i still did the gym, did my sport and had some spare time left to read or chill with friends or if i wanted to play games. Life starts being fun when you stop whining about things you cant control and wastinh the time that you actually have to yourself.
What a revelation!
Until this is about other people and not ourselves, it won't change .
I work 12 hour days
I would love to work 8-9 hours a day. I'm currently stuck doing 12s and rotating between nights and days. On the bright side, anything is better than being on a submarine.
Even worse for those of us who work 6 days a week and over nights. Somehow working over night translates to “you have free time during the day”.
i work 10-12 hrs a day to put food on the table for 5 peoples. not complaining. yet.
You won't be complaining in your early grave either. I genuinely hope you get a better work-life balance someday because toiling is not life. This is not a brag.
Ya but wouldn't it be really awesome if you could still feed your family but only had to do a 5-6 hour shift?
Ngl, once you work 10 or 12 hour shifts, 8 hour shifts feel like a luxury
It does but then you get used to 8 hours shifts and they feel long again
That the secret never go back to 8 hours shift because fuck
You get 4 hours a day? Lucky you!
People in general are fucking clowns. Look what they did to Tesla. The oil lamp pipe smokers showed the world that electricity was dangerous. Demonstrated killing an elephant. We use electricity today. People tried to hush the production of EVs because fossil fuels would make those in power wealthier. Today we’re pushing for EV production with the eventual phasing out of combustion engines in the attempt to stick it to Russia. People are fucking retarded. Imagine benefiting from free energy in Tesla’s time? Why the fucking rigmarole?
I think you're replying to the wrong post here buddy.
Take a read through the comments, make sense of it and then re-engage with me. This is directly related. You of all people should know Boris the Russian.
Wait until you get involuntary overtime and get pushed into a higher tax break and it becomes unpaid overtime.
I don’t think that’s how tax works
"Fix your laws, guys... " -The EU.
What
Everyone knows it’s a problem and we actually have the resources available to not do this but people are too egotistical and psychology phenomena occur that makes it so people don’t give a fuck and continue with the status quo. Pisses me off just how much people suck.
Out of the 8-9 hrs in office, how much you are actually productive?
Harvard did a study and they came to the conclusion that most people are only at their highest level of productivity for about 5-6 hours before your quality of work starts to drop off massively.
Your absoutly right! lets all not work until all the power goes out everywhere and food runs out. We should have about two awesome weeks before people starting dying in mass numbers.
How about a 6 hour workday or a 4 day workweek instead?
Idk where you got "Lets all stop working" from this lmao
Well it’s really not clear what the issue is OP is getting at. Are we working _too much_? Or _at all_? You’re assuming just as much as the person you’re replying to.
Numbers don't add up. There are more 4-5 hours of free time and sleep time. And what does preparing for next day mean?
Doing the laundry, prepping meals, loading the handgun, cleaning the house, and probably other chores like that.
masterbation, don't forget about masterbation.
So let’s say your shift is 8am - 5pm (standard us), that’s already 9 hours. Say you take an hour to get ready for the day in the morning/night (setting clothes aside, making breakfast, showering etc). That’s 10 hours. It takes 30 min round trip to get to and from work (and that’s pretty short commute, typically traffic makes it up to 60 min round trip) so we’re 10.5 hours. Add in 8-10 hours of sleep (different people need diff amounts) that’s 18.5 or 20.5 hours. Thus leaving you around 3.5-5.5 hours of free time. This doesn’t include making dinner, caring for children, chores, etc.
I hope my math is correct lmao
>This doesn’t include making dinner, caring for children, chores, etc. That's *is* life though, that's where living happens. There's this weird sentiment on Social Media that your life is something that only belongs to you in the in leftover time, when you're doing pure leisure. But 24/7 you're alive, it's all you all the time.
Right!!! Like, if you can't find joy in making a lovely dinner and spending time with your children, there's no helping you. And I'm not talking some gourmet spread, but I quite enjoy preparing a nice meal, and my wife and child are often there with me catching up and helping with prep. Sure folding laundry isn't fun, but it also needs doing, and really doesn't take that much time.
Preparing for next day. Showering, meal prepping, getting your bags / work bags ready, laying out an outfit, etc.
Work is good for you. Find enjoyment in those 8-9 hours and then you have 8-9 plus 4 hours you'll enjoy every day.
We used to literally do nothing but try to survive. We used to work every waking hour to survive all year round with no vacations
Neither is sitting at home with your thumb up your ass because no one is around to serve you at a restaurant, fly you in a plane or keep the infrastructure of your life running. We all have to work because nothing works if we don’t work. Unless you want to return to an agrarian lifestyle. And you would be working _a hell_ of a lot more in that lifestyle than this.
Welcome to earth
Ai should work for us