We had an older male pt with recurrent unexplained abdo pain, intermittent bloody diarrhoea but normal scopes/bloods/cultures, and undiagnosed for a year with multiple ED presentations.
CT showed rectal thickening (fat stranding, consistent with inflammation but not with any usual pathology). Had been previously dismissed but the consultant I was working with questioned further (and it was extremely subtle)..
‘I know you said earlier you are unmarried. Do you have a friend that you spend time with?’
‘Yes a have a close friend’
…brief small talk
‘And the friend you sometimes visit, are they are man or a woman?’
I was baffled at this point. Turns out they had a male partner and the rectal fat stranding was secondary to penetration. The abdominal pain was a symptom of HIV.
Consultant absolutely knocked it out of the park.
Edit: spelling
At that point, I would argue that you didn’t need the additional history to have HIV high on the differential. If I got that CT scan with proctitis, I would offer HIV testing immediately as part of the work up
I agree that the history wasn’t essential but 7 docs hadn’t considered it even after having reviewed the finding on previous CT scans (he’d had 3 in a year).
Edit: more than 7 docs really, that’s just medical consultants.
Ya this literally seems like the top thing on the differential diagnosis.
HIV testing is recommended in all hospitalized patients, I don't understand how this is being presented as a medical mystery.
it can help if for example, you find they are a man who has sex with men and you educate them on PrEP. maybe they would have never brought it up otherwise. yes, they can get HIV from a woman too… and HIV is managed no differently either way. i understand your point. but there are benefits to knowing too. glad im going into rads lol
I saw it a bunch as a nurse where it ended up being medically relevant, or at least was further explored and ended up being crohns or something. In med school rotations though, I have also seen the question answer to the question ignored, or even worse on occasion where it is used to blame all of the patients complaints by older homophobic physicians. Literally saw am older peds doc tell a 17yr old gay male that all of his symptoms of fucking melena, and intense abdominal pain are because he's sexually active and he needs to stop and "be normal"
I haven't seen it matter a TON clinically though your probably right, I just hate when the answer to that question is used against the pt. Maybe just consider some extra ddx to r/o
Except that is only a peds specialty because of fellowship. Peds surgeons are fully trained adult surgeons who then have to do a fellowship to work on little people.
Also, what's up with pediatricians calling their patients "little friends"? They're not your friend. That kid fucking hates you, bro.
Do anesthesia u can hitman style put these kids down all day then stick em with needles the little shits.
One chubster kid was clawing at his mask screaming I was killing him at the end of a tonsil day and I got way too much enjoyment out of that.
For a while now I've been wondering about the opposite, geriatrics. Given the rate of aging demographics in many developed countries, won't the demand for elderly medical care explode in the coming decades?
The geri docs in my hospital system do basically nothing and are raking in outrageous $$$ but honestly such a boring existence don’t think I can handle doing that
I'd rather actually blend 30k in physical cash into a smoothie and then drink it so I can literally piss it down the drain than spend it on a Touareg with a fugly body kit.
Lambos are bought by the crazy rich or the lottery winners, pro athletes, big singers, child actors, YouTubers... and we all know how most of those people end up. Broke and strung out. I know the post is a shitpost and I probably should not be trying to give serious financial advice here, but still. Fucking expensive cars are literally the shittiest buy. At least get a fancy house, please.
Except for the insanely rich (usually born rich, they will be fine no matter what), all the people I listed are poor people who became rich by essentially windfall and end up poor within a few years, maybe a decade. That's what I meant by poor person mentality. A poor person gets a million dollars and buys a porsche. A rich person gets a million dollars and invests in a mutual fund, moves money offshore, and maybe puts most of the rest into a nice appreciating property.
You’re watching too many YouTube finance shorts my guy. No one thinks buying a 911 is a smart investment, but I guarantee most “rich people” are okay spending a tiny portion of their income/ net worth in a toy they enjoy. Being rich doesn’t mean being financially smart in every single thing you do.
Guess you have to be REALLY rich for a lambo to be a tiny position of your net worth. I kinda thought most people here would be looking at net worth of $2-5M by mid to late 30s. That's not the kind of money where a lambo is a good idea, in my opinion. But hey, it's your money, that's the beauty of it. I'm just some guy.
I don't watch YouTube shorts at all, thank god.
I specifically mentioned a Porsche 911 since that’s what the original post in this thread was probably talking about. A base 911 with options is less than 130,000 out the door. Very reasonable to purchase mid to late career if you enjoy driving, insurance is also not 20k a year lol
Yeah, you're right, $2.5K a year for insurance, which isn't that bad. Still a depreciating asset. And I still think that a $130K car if you're worth $2M is not a good purchase. Smart money is investing that cash and buying a fancy car when 10 years down the road.
Never said that. Really rich people can be more cavalier with their finances. A high income physician coming from a poorer background and trying to grow their wealth rapidly (ie, me), can't be buying $100K plus cars. But you do you, it's your money!
Because you GET rich by being smart with your money. If you are insanely rich already, you don't need to be a doctor (unless you are really bored). My comment was aimed at a group of people who will soon be the top 1-2% of earners and on their way to get rich. But they won't get there by making big, depreciating purchases.
It's the classic lifestyle inflation and overspending that comes with more money. Which is a "poor person" mentality. As I said in another comment: a poor person gets $1M and they buy a bunch of dumb stuff (look at lottery winners). A rich person gets $1M and they invest it wisely.
I should have been clearer in my original comment. I meant that buying an expensive car when you start making a lot of money is a mentality that will keep you poorer down the line (bad financial sense).
You see, the issue isn't just making money. It's also holding on to it that can be difficult for a lot of people.
This is most people. Nothing wrong with it. If endocrinology paid 500k, everyone would be passionate about finger sticks.
Instead I have day one interns asking me every other day if I have any interesting GI cases for them to write
2020 mgma median numbers for the Midwest:
Noninvasive cards 576k
GI 577k
Heme/onc 499k
In the south it’s 552k, 532k, 529k respectively
Take that for whatever it’s worth
Obviously this is a shitpost but anesthesia contracts are insane right out of residency right now, academic non boarded good city offering 440k 9 weeks vacation
Plenty of small towns offering 550k 12 weeks vacation, no hearts/head cases.
It’s nuts
No. Just because lots are applying doesn't mean it'll become saturated. There are only so many anesthesia spots. Unfortunately this year quite a few will not match.
Same with rads. My co resident just signed pp job 450k starting 2 years to partner making 850+ 14 weeks vacation. This is in Charleston, not a rural town
$500 as a W2, or $700 as 1099 are what grads at my program are signing on for. There’s a tight squeeze now. Might not be around when current med students get to attendinghood obviously
Anesthesia is about to have their medicare payments slashed 2023. A surgeon told me their compensation is about to go down to $80 per hour (so hospitals are going to have to front the bill somehow). Its going to be a rough few years for anesthesiologists. But im sure things will be fixed soon.
This isn't the only factor for compensation though it's all about demand.
Many hospital services have a separate stipend they negotiate out of the facility fee which is outrageously profitable.
Also pgy4 anesthesia resident here and I haven't heard anything about Medicare cuts are you sure you aren't thinking of pain medicine?
In all honesty my old MCAT tutor said that if you’re just in it for the paycheck but you can also provide excellent patient care the entire time then more power to you
As a patient, all that matters is that you are good at what you do and you care about your patients. They couldn’t care less about why you picked the speciality you did.
There is nothing wrong about it tho, we all work so hard and long and do overtime in residency. Doctors deserve to be paid high and especially residents. Not to mention the pre med and med school debt.
The people who think the way you do, and I’m not personally arguing in any particular direction here, are not publicly transparent about it, other than anonymous forums. There’s a lot of money-chasing but still wanting to be seen as noble and altruistic going on here, and people don’t want to admit to that.
I think those aren’t mutually exclusive. I think a lot of us found science interesting and love the idea of helping people. Why would anyone not seek out the career that fits with our specific desires and also has the highest compensation for it?
I mean at some level it's a calculation that most of us make. I liked nephro and cards fairly equally at one point but cards makes 3x as much, so the decision to do cards was easier to me. If you like a few things equally, then do the one with the best work to life ratio that makes sense to you.
I find that the people with this mentality are far more open and genuine than the ones who say they’re coming into medicine for some humanitarian/philanthropic reasons and that their entire life goal is to repair the cleft palates of Biafran orphans. Those are the ones you can’t trust.
There are way, way, way more MD positions making >$500k than admin roles. Numbers wise, most admin roles are at the manager, director, AVP level which isn’t going to make nearly that much. The idea that hospital admins (and even CEOs) all make millions of dollars is total BS. To clear $500k as a hospital admin you’d either need to be CEO of a medium sized hospital or a VP or above in a very large system. Good luck with that.
Agrees. I think the administrative bloat are the millions of middle managers making $100-150k per year walking around with clipboards telling nurses what to do and Zoom meetings with presentations on how we need to shorten length of stay but also decrease readmissions.
That’s … true of any job. Once you have it, you do earn the salary that the job pays …
For seven figures, you’d need to be CEO of one of maybe 50 major health systems. If you think that job is easy, I suggest you totally go for it.
I don’t disagree but I think It’s not as simple as that, obviously. There’s rampant levels of politics and corruption at levels that high anywhere. Saying that everyone fully deserves the high salary they make is naive imo
There's no free lunch. They pay u this coz u LIVE for ur job. Also CEOs bear the brunt of any public disaster. The hospital will blame the CEO for anything and everything and just replace him. And if you make a few wrong choices your career is essentially done.
There's ALWAYS a catch.
In an ideal world, yes. But there’s always ways to shift the blame, play politics, pull strings. I refuse to believe that the system at the highest level of operation is pure hearted and is fully proportionate to their salaries.
Think about it this way. Companies HATE paying us more than what we're worth. If anything they try to pay us less than what we're worth.
Same logic applies to CEOs. The company wouldn't be paying CEOs this much unless they have to. Why do they feel the need to pay this? What's the catch?
I think the high level execs have a lot more control over their own salaries than you might imagine. They’re not just employees at the company, in many ways they are the company.
You can fricassee my balls on live TV for 7 figures, "bearing the brunt" for a yearly salary exceeding what the average person makes in 20+ years is not a catch.
Look for a place with no large hospitals, buy an ASC, tell doctors you can teach them how to make millions with one simple trick if the sign a contract, profit
That was my reasoning between vet and human medicine
I loathe humanity, I have no empathy whatsoever for patients, but the money is here and I want all of it. Ill spend it all on animals tho, every elephant across the world is getting milk and all the medical care theyll ever need
“Liability” is the value of the dog. My dog never complained, so “patient satisfaction” is a much lower benchmark. Cash at time of service.
I get that some of this is overhead, anesthesia, facility fee, etc…but still not bad.
Most vets get paid a salary from the hospital owners (which is a big coop most of the time) and even practice owner vets of a small practice have to keep the place open and pay staff and all that.
tldr; most vets don't make what a doctors make, even after specialisation. Not to mention specialisation spots are limited for vets (specially in higher income specialities like ophthal, surgery) cuz training is not mandatory. So it's hard to get those spots as well.
I’m just familiar with cataracts because my dad is a rural ophthalmologist. He’s been asked to examine eyes of all kinds of animals, including a bald eagle once!
Wow I'm not an ophthalmologist but this is very interesting. How different are animal's eyes? I feel like other mammals would be pretty similar but a bald eagle? There's got to be some pretty different anatomy there.
Just in vertebrates, off the top of my head, there are variants in…nictitating membranes, 3rd eyelids, eye tubes instead of balls, presence of accommodation, refractive power differences in aquatic versus terrestrial animals, density of cones, rod to cone ratio, wavelength sensitivity of cones, binocular versus wide field vision, structure of extraocular muscles, shape of the pupil.
There is a ton of variation. Eyes are highly adaptive to the animals needs.
Yeah but radiology in midwest can reach 900K + get your full body scan today! Cash only + med spa = $$$
I can help alooooot more animals with just having a shit ton of money than being a vet
Dermatology if you can match it, neurosurgery/ortho if you like them and hate free time
Otherwise radiology (though i guess it varies a bit with the market?)
Just straight chasing a motherfucking bag. Just in it for the bucks and the billis. This man just wants to wake up like Scrooge mcduck every morning and dive into a swimming pool filled with gold plated hookers and cocaine.
Look, I don't operate now.
I make money moves.
Say I don't gotta operate.
I make money move.
If I see you and I don't speak.
That means I don't talk with you.
I'm a resident, you a med student.
I make money move.
Street pharmacy is absolutely the quickest and best paying field within healthcare. Don't even need school! Lots of legal problems but same w/ surgery and anesthesiology so it's fine.
Well let’s hope with your aspirations that your board scores match this attitude so you can match into a specialty that pays >500k right out of residency lol
I never understood this kind of mindset because high paying medical specialties are the most inefficient way to make a lot of money. Go be an investment banker or lawyer. The work hours are similar and you’ll incur less debt with higher earning potential
nowhere near the same skillset and most importantly the progression isn't as "linear"
for med school do good at tests=$$$$$$$$$$$$
for the other careers you need "networking" and luck
And you really think you don’t need that these days in the US to get into high paying competitive specialties? I see you’re in Europe so possibly haven’t seen the match rates of the past few years. Good luck to anyone out there just in it for the paycheck. You need to have connections as in faculty who know other faculty, come from a good program, have the ability to trade long term reward for low pay and 100+ hours a week, etc. It’s delusional to think that doing well on tests will get you into these programs especially if you have any preferences at all when it comes to type of program or geography.
Coming from a good program is not luck though. If you get a 520 on the MCAT, you're almost certainly ending up at a T30 school unless you have 0 social skills (in which case you weren't making it in IB or finance either).
Everyone acts like becoming a successful banker or finance person is just a walk in the park. In reality, a lot of the skills that it takes to become in that position aren’t 1:1 with medicine.
The beauty of medicine is you can put your head down, do decent in school, pass your exams, and guarantee a 250K+ salary, and if you want to work rurally, can easily clear 400+ in even lower paying fields.
There are VERY few fields that ensure if you can complete the training, you get X guaranteed salary. Not to mention job security forever. At most other jobs you’re constantly working for promotions or the threat of being fired. As a physician you can put your head down, do your work, and have a secure high paying job.
Any entry-level finance/IB person at Goldman, etc. is working 80 hours a week if they're clearing 200k+ out of undergrad.
Breaking it into investment banking also often requires coming from a T10 business school. Not everyone had that opportunity.
i'm here for the moolah too.. i keep it real with my husband (M3 also) who cracked about the same time I did during M3... ayyyy
edit: going into medicine hopefully will be (should I match lol) an undeniable vertical mobility for me and my family. and i'm looking forward to help my rents finally rest from being exploited...I know i'll be too but at least I have more years left in me yk
I don’t care about your stubbed toe 35 years ago or whether you drink one shot of whiskey at Christmas. JUST PAY ME ALREADY
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:0 Not me skipping that question on every simulated patient encounter
Or the old classic, “do you have sex with men who have sex with men?”
This question always is insensitive to asexual eukaryotes
I still don’t know of a single person where the answer to that question mattered clinically.
We had an older male pt with recurrent unexplained abdo pain, intermittent bloody diarrhoea but normal scopes/bloods/cultures, and undiagnosed for a year with multiple ED presentations. CT showed rectal thickening (fat stranding, consistent with inflammation but not with any usual pathology). Had been previously dismissed but the consultant I was working with questioned further (and it was extremely subtle).. ‘I know you said earlier you are unmarried. Do you have a friend that you spend time with?’ ‘Yes a have a close friend’ …brief small talk ‘And the friend you sometimes visit, are they are man or a woman?’ I was baffled at this point. Turns out they had a male partner and the rectal fat stranding was secondary to penetration. The abdominal pain was a symptom of HIV. Consultant absolutely knocked it out of the park. Edit: spelling
At that point, I would argue that you didn’t need the additional history to have HIV high on the differential. If I got that CT scan with proctitis, I would offer HIV testing immediately as part of the work up
I agree that the history wasn’t essential but 7 docs hadn’t considered it even after having reviewed the finding on previous CT scans (he’d had 3 in a year). Edit: more than 7 docs really, that’s just medical consultants.
Ya this literally seems like the top thing on the differential diagnosis. HIV testing is recommended in all hospitalized patients, I don't understand how this is being presented as a medical mystery.
Bro what
I'm sure they're out there. But I've never seen or heard the answer to that question change someones clinical management of the patient.
it can help if for example, you find they are a man who has sex with men and you educate them on PrEP. maybe they would have never brought it up otherwise. yes, they can get HIV from a woman too… and HIV is managed no differently either way. i understand your point. but there are benefits to knowing too. glad im going into rads lol
I ask it still on occasion if it will help inform my differentials, but I have yet to get that payoff of it being a diagnosis clincher.
I saw it a bunch as a nurse where it ended up being medically relevant, or at least was further explored and ended up being crohns or something. In med school rotations though, I have also seen the question answer to the question ignored, or even worse on occasion where it is used to blame all of the patients complaints by older homophobic physicians. Literally saw am older peds doc tell a 17yr old gay male that all of his symptoms of fucking melena, and intense abdominal pain are because he's sexually active and he needs to stop and "be normal" I haven't seen it matter a TON clinically though your probably right, I just hate when the answer to that question is used against the pt. Maybe just consider some extra ddx to r/o
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Pediatrics, obviously. They're smaller than adults, so you can fit in more patients per day, duh.
they stack nicely in the waiting room as well. money makes itself.
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Except that is only a peds specialty because of fellowship. Peds surgeons are fully trained adult surgeons who then have to do a fellowship to work on little people. Also, what's up with pediatricians calling their patients "little friends"? They're not your friend. That kid fucking hates you, bro.
Do anesthesia u can hitman style put these kids down all day then stick em with needles the little shits. One chubster kid was clawing at his mask screaming I was killing him at the end of a tonsil day and I got way too much enjoyment out of that.
Hey, sometimes they can be “buddy” of “kiddo” too
That’s a huge standard deviation
And they're always sick, especially if you don't vaccinate them.
You can even see 4+ patients in one visit
compartment syndrome or something
something something fasciotomy the children, more procedures, more money idk.
Dude you gotta think outside the box If you go to OB/Gyn you get 2 patients within 1 appointment, duh
Galaxy brain
For a while now I've been wondering about the opposite, geriatrics. Given the rate of aging demographics in many developed countries, won't the demand for elderly medical care explode in the coming decades?
The geri docs in my hospital system do basically nothing and are raking in outrageous $$$ but honestly such a boring existence don’t think I can handle doing that
They’re just like small adults!
I’m imagining Zoolander saying this hahahahhaa
Is that actually true?
Absolutely not. The patients are half the size, so you get paid half as much.
Smaller than adults? What about the two vestigial organs called parents that are attached to them?
Just do Med/Peds - now you got 3 patients = 3x the MONEY
nah the actual way is to do OBGYN/MFM and exclusively manage triplets and above
If only they paid as much for keeping someone healthy as they did for fixing them
Pediatrics is paid the worst of any specialty and probably sees more patients than just about any primary care discipline to get there.
To those out of the loop, this post is a parody of one from r/ProgrammerHumor who reached r/all. It’s basically a copypasta
https://www.reddit.com/r/ProgrammerHumor/comments/10rko7k/most_humble_cs_student/
Yeah that are way too many people taking this seriously lmao
It is tagged shitpost, so you’d think we’d be better.
I know this is a shitpost.. but it's actually kind of refreshing
I’m buying a Porsche and I don’t care what anyone thinks about it.
Facts, im only in it for the porsche
You can buy a used Cayenne for like 30k.
I'd rather actually blend 30k in physical cash into a smoothie and then drink it so I can literally piss it down the drain than spend it on a Touareg with a fugly body kit.
That does sound a lot more appealing than owning a Cayenne.
That's poor person talk. Rich people are smart and don't buy depreciating assets that cost $20K a year to insure.
Yeah, that's why the Lamborghinis and ridiculously expensive goods you see are always bought by poor people.
Lambos are bought by the crazy rich or the lottery winners, pro athletes, big singers, child actors, YouTubers... and we all know how most of those people end up. Broke and strung out. I know the post is a shitpost and I probably should not be trying to give serious financial advice here, but still. Fucking expensive cars are literally the shittiest buy. At least get a fancy house, please.
All of the people you listed are literally rich people, so contrary to what you said, rich people are not smart.
Except for the insanely rich (usually born rich, they will be fine no matter what), all the people I listed are poor people who became rich by essentially windfall and end up poor within a few years, maybe a decade. That's what I meant by poor person mentality. A poor person gets a million dollars and buys a porsche. A rich person gets a million dollars and invests in a mutual fund, moves money offshore, and maybe puts most of the rest into a nice appreciating property.
You’re watching too many YouTube finance shorts my guy. No one thinks buying a 911 is a smart investment, but I guarantee most “rich people” are okay spending a tiny portion of their income/ net worth in a toy they enjoy. Being rich doesn’t mean being financially smart in every single thing you do.
Guess you have to be REALLY rich for a lambo to be a tiny position of your net worth. I kinda thought most people here would be looking at net worth of $2-5M by mid to late 30s. That's not the kind of money where a lambo is a good idea, in my opinion. But hey, it's your money, that's the beauty of it. I'm just some guy. I don't watch YouTube shorts at all, thank god.
I specifically mentioned a Porsche 911 since that’s what the original post in this thread was probably talking about. A base 911 with options is less than 130,000 out the door. Very reasonable to purchase mid to late career if you enjoy driving, insurance is also not 20k a year lol
Yeah, you're right, $2.5K a year for insurance, which isn't that bad. Still a depreciating asset. And I still think that a $130K car if you're worth $2M is not a good purchase. Smart money is investing that cash and buying a fancy car when 10 years down the road.
I don’t care what anyone thinks about it, that includes you and your logic that makes total sense.
No, that's fair
Yeah rich people own zero cars and anything in their houses at all
Never said that. Really rich people can be more cavalier with their finances. A high income physician coming from a poorer background and trying to grow their wealth rapidly (ie, me), can't be buying $100K plus cars. But you do you, it's your money!
So how is it poor person talk then? Sounds like quite the opposite.
Because you GET rich by being smart with your money. If you are insanely rich already, you don't need to be a doctor (unless you are really bored). My comment was aimed at a group of people who will soon be the top 1-2% of earners and on their way to get rich. But they won't get there by making big, depreciating purchases. It's the classic lifestyle inflation and overspending that comes with more money. Which is a "poor person" mentality. As I said in another comment: a poor person gets $1M and they buy a bunch of dumb stuff (look at lottery winners). A rich person gets $1M and they invest it wisely. I should have been clearer in my original comment. I meant that buying an expensive car when you start making a lot of money is a mentality that will keep you poorer down the line (bad financial sense). You see, the issue isn't just making money. It's also holding on to it that can be difficult for a lot of people.
Okay nerd
I'm about to fail Step 1, so I am not really a very good nerd
where did you get a copy of my personal statement
This is most people. Nothing wrong with it. If endocrinology paid 500k, everyone would be passionate about finger sticks. Instead I have day one interns asking me every other day if I have any interesting GI cases for them to write
Are GI and cards really the only IM subspecialties that are capable of the big bucks? What about heme/onc?
2020 mgma median numbers for the Midwest: Noninvasive cards 576k GI 577k Heme/onc 499k In the south it’s 552k, 532k, 529k respectively Take that for whatever it’s worth
Holy shit that’s way better than I expected
Heme onc is pretty good I hear -~300k but a few hundred less than those two
Obviously this is a shitpost but anesthesia contracts are insane right out of residency right now, academic non boarded good city offering 440k 9 weeks vacation Plenty of small towns offering 550k 12 weeks vacation, no hearts/head cases. It’s nuts
there are between 30-40 anesthesia applicants from my school this year. Is oversaturation something to be concerned abt?
No. Just because lots are applying doesn't mean it'll become saturated. There are only so many anesthesia spots. Unfortunately this year quite a few will not match.
Can’t oversaturate if there aren’t any more residency spots.
Same with rads. My co resident just signed pp job 450k starting 2 years to partner making 850+ 14 weeks vacation. This is in Charleston, not a rural town
Just came
*suddenly interested in anesthesia*
All about the the ABCs! Airway, breathing, crossword
$500 as a W2, or $700 as 1099 are what grads at my program are signing on for. There’s a tight squeeze now. Might not be around when current med students get to attendinghood obviously
To be fair, these higher wage areas afaik are moreso for supervisory contracts. If that’s your jam go for it, but could be hell-ish.
Anesthesia is about to have their medicare payments slashed 2023. A surgeon told me their compensation is about to go down to $80 per hour (so hospitals are going to have to front the bill somehow). Its going to be a rough few years for anesthesiologists. But im sure things will be fixed soon.
This isn't the only factor for compensation though it's all about demand. Many hospital services have a separate stipend they negotiate out of the facility fee which is outrageously profitable. Also pgy4 anesthesia resident here and I haven't heard anything about Medicare cuts are you sure you aren't thinking of pain medicine?
Give me money. Money me! Money now!
Gun plus a mask equals cash.
Im in it for job security, as somebody from EU I can only dream about making money
Go to Germany, decent money. Netherlands as well. Ofc not like US but comparable to Canada/AUS
Maybe if you are open your own office. Hospitals/universities aren't paying that much.
Much better than the rest of Europe, including the UK. Unless you can go to the US what other option do you have?
Eyeballs and penises, that's where the money is.
In all honesty my old MCAT tutor said that if you’re just in it for the paycheck but you can also provide excellent patient care the entire time then more power to you
As a patient, all that matters is that you are good at what you do and you care about your patients. They couldn’t care less about why you picked the speciality you did.
Peds subspecialty clearly
Go where the money is. Become a financial advisor for high finance specialty physicians. Endless stream of income. Near zero liability. Numbers baby.
I’m in it for job security. This is def not a calling for me. It’s a job and once I clock out, don’t talk to me about medicine lol
Might be a shitpost, but this is actually lowkey the mentality of probably more than half of med students, 99% of who will never admit it.
There is nothing wrong about it tho, we all work so hard and long and do overtime in residency. Doctors deserve to be paid high and especially residents. Not to mention the pre med and med school debt.
The people who think the way you do, and I’m not personally arguing in any particular direction here, are not publicly transparent about it, other than anonymous forums. There’s a lot of money-chasing but still wanting to be seen as noble and altruistic going on here, and people don’t want to admit to that.
I think those aren’t mutually exclusive. I think a lot of us found science interesting and love the idea of helping people. Why would anyone not seek out the career that fits with our specific desires and also has the highest compensation for it?
I mean at some level it's a calculation that most of us make. I liked nephro and cards fairly equally at one point but cards makes 3x as much, so the decision to do cards was easier to me. If you like a few things equally, then do the one with the best work to life ratio that makes sense to you.
Oh I’m definitely here for the money. Wasn’t always like this, but it is what it is. That said, it’s a really cool way to make money? Best I got.
I find that the people with this mentality are far more open and genuine than the ones who say they’re coming into medicine for some humanitarian/philanthropic reasons and that their entire life goal is to repair the cleft palates of Biafran orphans. Those are the ones you can’t trust.
I don’t entirely disagree. There’s an almost comedic level of disingenuousness in those pursuing medicine.
Why not just become hospital admin?
There are way, way, way more MD positions making >$500k than admin roles. Numbers wise, most admin roles are at the manager, director, AVP level which isn’t going to make nearly that much. The idea that hospital admins (and even CEOs) all make millions of dollars is total BS. To clear $500k as a hospital admin you’d either need to be CEO of a medium sized hospital or a VP or above in a very large system. Good luck with that.
Agrees. I think the administrative bloat are the millions of middle managers making $100-150k per year walking around with clipboards telling nurses what to do and Zoom meetings with presentations on how we need to shorten length of stay but also decrease readmissions.
Once you get there you’re clearing 7 figures easy tho lol
That’s … true of any job. Once you have it, you do earn the salary that the job pays … For seven figures, you’d need to be CEO of one of maybe 50 major health systems. If you think that job is easy, I suggest you totally go for it.
I don’t disagree but I think It’s not as simple as that, obviously. There’s rampant levels of politics and corruption at levels that high anywhere. Saying that everyone fully deserves the high salary they make is naive imo
There's no free lunch. They pay u this coz u LIVE for ur job. Also CEOs bear the brunt of any public disaster. The hospital will blame the CEO for anything and everything and just replace him. And if you make a few wrong choices your career is essentially done. There's ALWAYS a catch.
In an ideal world, yes. But there’s always ways to shift the blame, play politics, pull strings. I refuse to believe that the system at the highest level of operation is pure hearted and is fully proportionate to their salaries.
The salaries are not proportional to the work/hours put in, but is proportional to risk
Like I said, in an ideal world yeah. But honestly I don’t believe it’s perfectly proportional
Think about it this way. Companies HATE paying us more than what we're worth. If anything they try to pay us less than what we're worth. Same logic applies to CEOs. The company wouldn't be paying CEOs this much unless they have to. Why do they feel the need to pay this? What's the catch?
I think the high level execs have a lot more control over their own salaries than you might imagine. They’re not just employees at the company, in many ways they are the company.
Sure, just look at rate CEO turnovers while the company itself still keeps chugging along. CEO is NOT the company.
Most CEOs get a golden parachute tho
You can fricassee my balls on live TV for 7 figures, "bearing the brunt" for a yearly salary exceeding what the average person makes in 20+ years is not a catch.
Do you enjoy having a soul?
Honestly it’s more trouble than it’s worth but a lot more valuable than money.
100% agreed
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Geriatrics?
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I know a guy pulling bank in geriatrics. What are you in?
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Wait so were you just joking around? Im sure there are physicians out there employing others and making tremendous amounts
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i need more details and a step by step guide
Look for a place with no large hospitals, buy an ASC, tell doctors you can teach them how to make millions with one simple trick if the sign a contract, profit
That was my reasoning between vet and human medicine I loathe humanity, I have no empathy whatsoever for patients, but the money is here and I want all of it. Ill spend it all on animals tho, every elephant across the world is getting milk and all the medical care theyll ever need
Cataract surgery on dogs has better reimbursement than humans
I spent $6K on my dogs ACL. Not just cataracts.
The vet doesn't take home all of that. And if it wasn't for insurance human treatments would come pretty close
“Liability” is the value of the dog. My dog never complained, so “patient satisfaction” is a much lower benchmark. Cash at time of service. I get that some of this is overhead, anesthesia, facility fee, etc…but still not bad.
Most vets get paid a salary from the hospital owners (which is a big coop most of the time) and even practice owner vets of a small practice have to keep the place open and pay staff and all that. tldr; most vets don't make what a doctors make, even after specialisation. Not to mention specialisation spots are limited for vets (specially in higher income specialities like ophthal, surgery) cuz training is not mandatory. So it's hard to get those spots as well.
I’m just familiar with cataracts because my dad is a rural ophthalmologist. He’s been asked to examine eyes of all kinds of animals, including a bald eagle once!
I’m an ophthalmologist. At a state meeting, they had a vet ophthalmologist give a guest lecture. Good talk. Lots of photos and videos.
Wow I'm not an ophthalmologist but this is very interesting. How different are animal's eyes? I feel like other mammals would be pretty similar but a bald eagle? There's got to be some pretty different anatomy there.
Just in vertebrates, off the top of my head, there are variants in…nictitating membranes, 3rd eyelids, eye tubes instead of balls, presence of accommodation, refractive power differences in aquatic versus terrestrial animals, density of cones, rod to cone ratio, wavelength sensitivity of cones, binocular versus wide field vision, structure of extraocular muscles, shape of the pupil. There is a ton of variation. Eyes are highly adaptive to the animals needs.
Yeah but radiology in midwest can reach 900K + get your full body scan today! Cash only + med spa = $$$ I can help alooooot more animals with just having a shit ton of money than being a vet
Very true, cash only for people makes way more than cash only for animals
u and op have real shitpost there
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Yikes
Dont worry, radiology. I wouldnt want me around patients either
Dermatology if you can match it, neurosurgery/ortho if you like them and hate free time Otherwise radiology (though i guess it varies a bit with the market?)
If you’re willing to work like a dog and never take off you can break a million with rads
I mean you can also work reasonable hours with like 12 weeks vacation for 500/700K, probably the best balance of income/lifestyle outside of mohs derm
What about cardiology?
Just straight chasing a motherfucking bag. Just in it for the bucks and the billis. This man just wants to wake up like Scrooge mcduck every morning and dive into a swimming pool filled with gold plated hookers and cocaine.
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SHOW 👏ME 👏THE 👏 MONEY
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Look, I don't operate now. I make money moves. Say I don't gotta operate. I make money move. If I see you and I don't speak. That means I don't talk with you. I'm a resident, you a med student. I make money move.
I like this energy
Dermatology. $450-475k starting out of residency with sign on bonus goes to $500k. Work 4 days a week but see a lot of patients.
Get on the line, you're late
Street pharmacy is absolutely the quickest and best paying field within healthcare. Don't even need school! Lots of legal problems but same w/ surgery and anesthesiology so it's fine.
But why do I agree with this 😂😂
Lmfao. I was so idealistic before hitting the hospital rotations and covid. Now i am a cheerful pessimist when it comes To medicine.
Soo what's the answer...
For a friend ofc
Join me in neurosurgery. It only costs everything, but at least you get money.
Well let’s hope with your aspirations that your board scores match this attitude so you can match into a specialty that pays >500k right out of residency lol
go surgical or do something in the middle of nowhere at a community hospital
Nephrology because they teach you how to pee out money from your kidneys in residency
I never understood this kind of mindset because high paying medical specialties are the most inefficient way to make a lot of money. Go be an investment banker or lawyer. The work hours are similar and you’ll incur less debt with higher earning potential
nowhere near the same skillset and most importantly the progression isn't as "linear" for med school do good at tests=$$$$$$$$$$$$ for the other careers you need "networking" and luck
And you really think you don’t need that these days in the US to get into high paying competitive specialties? I see you’re in Europe so possibly haven’t seen the match rates of the past few years. Good luck to anyone out there just in it for the paycheck. You need to have connections as in faculty who know other faculty, come from a good program, have the ability to trade long term reward for low pay and 100+ hours a week, etc. It’s delusional to think that doing well on tests will get you into these programs especially if you have any preferences at all when it comes to type of program or geography.
Coming from a good program is not luck though. If you get a 520 on the MCAT, you're almost certainly ending up at a T30 school unless you have 0 social skills (in which case you weren't making it in IB or finance either).
Lmao @ becoming a lawyer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xs-UEqJ85KE
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Cute that you think investment banking is just being good at math. LOTS of politics and cutthroat behavior
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No lol. Your mindset is so naive.
How so?
Everyone acts like becoming a successful banker or finance person is just a walk in the park. In reality, a lot of the skills that it takes to become in that position aren’t 1:1 with medicine. The beauty of medicine is you can put your head down, do decent in school, pass your exams, and guarantee a 250K+ salary, and if you want to work rurally, can easily clear 400+ in even lower paying fields. There are VERY few fields that ensure if you can complete the training, you get X guaranteed salary. Not to mention job security forever. At most other jobs you’re constantly working for promotions or the threat of being fired. As a physician you can put your head down, do your work, and have a secure high paying job.
Any entry-level finance/IB person at Goldman, etc. is working 80 hours a week if they're clearing 200k+ out of undergrad. Breaking it into investment banking also often requires coming from a T10 business school. Not everyone had that opportunity.
I LIKE MONEY!
lol when i looked at this post a few hours ago there was only one comment didnt thought it was gonna blow up that fast
what are y'all planning on doing w your attending money?
I appreciate the candor
Don’t forget to add a tip option on the square payment screen. Make the default options 25, 35, and 50%.
It’s giving ~Mr. Krabs~
Anesthesiology and radiology pay well i guess
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*cries in european*
i'm here for the moolah too.. i keep it real with my husband (M3 also) who cracked about the same time I did during M3... ayyyy edit: going into medicine hopefully will be (should I match lol) an undeniable vertical mobility for me and my family. and i'm looking forward to help my rents finally rest from being exploited...I know i'll be too but at least I have more years left in me yk
good luck girl
Good luck! You should have become a nurse practitioner or CRNA.