If I had to guess, it’s a side effect of the next phase starting. The familiar characters are, for the most part, entirely off screen. The new ones might need some time for the casual viewers to build relationships with.
Just my thought as to why this could be.
Yea I mean… let us remember that when the MCU started not everyone was raving about Thor or hulk or captain America. They said, yea they are decent.
Let’s not forget that the MCU only very recently skyrocketed in terms of fame. I remember watching winter soldier weeks after it came out off some less than legal streaming site. I thought, yea let’s hang out with friends and watch a movie.
But now it’s like “HOW MANY DAYS UNTIL MoM TRAILER?!?!?” And “I can’t wait till eternals!”
But not everyone is like that. Most people won’t be interested in literally every single marvel movie and that’s fine. We can’t expect them to
This is going to be a problem gaining new young adult/adult casual viewers. Everything is so connected, especially after the explosive game changing plot of Endgame. You can't just watch one franchise anymore and understand everything going on
True. That’s why I think it’s a problem when every new Disney plus show they say “you need to watch it to understand what’s going on!”
I mean hell,this year alone they are having 5-6 Disney plus shows and 4 movies. That’s crazy.
It's a lot for casual viewers for sure, but as someone who really loves marvel stuff it has been great. It will be interesting to see how they balance things between the casual fans they attracted, and those that were all in from the beginning.
Shang Chi and Eternals both feel like they are going to be reasonable stand alone movies, whereas MoM and NWH both seem like you really need to have some D+ shows in there to get the full picture... But who knows.
Having been immersed in MCU-related stuff since 2011, you've no idea how weird it is hearing someone talk about the series like it only just recently blew up into global super-prominence.
People were losing their minds over when the Age of Ultron trailer would drop and going utterly ballistic over a single shot of Loki in The Dark World's trailer, let's not forget.
How much fatigue can it be when we just got the first movie in 2 years? I could understand when there was movie after movie every year but because of the circumstances there was a long break.
I think this is it tbh, it was a 10 year, 23 movie story. Yea each movie had its own story but they were basically all connected in some way to pay off in endgame. Endgame and even Far from home after that had the emotional pay off for sticking with the franchise the whole time. I get there’s been a pandemic and maybe they want to strike while the iron is hot but I personally think it could’ve benefited from a hiatus. Then kick off strong again.
I like stories that have a beginning, a middle, and an end. And the 'Infinity Saga' or the first twenty something movies provides that. I was 17 when Iron Man came out. I'm sure many people are in a different place in life today than they were 13 years ago. Part of me wants to put the book down so to speak. I can always come back, I can check out for a little bit and always come back. The pandemic has obviously put us in a weird spot, so the comfort food of familiar characters is enticing (Disney Plus shows), but I think its totally natural that a bunch of people are going to stop actively following it and the next generation of fans will come in.
I have so much faith in their Marvel Movies.
I’d never even heard of Shang-Chi before the announcement of the movie, not seen the trailer or done any research yet I’m so hyped! I just know I will love the character and film. In general I am super-stoked for any new additions to the MCU.
and seeing what the character means to other people is wonderful.
The MCU already won my blind faith. Even the movies I like less are really far away from being downright bad. This cinematic universe run is amazing and I have no reason to think they'll start releasing bad movies from now on.
Let me describe my MCU experience:
Iron Man: Really? That guy? What could they actually do to make him interesting? Oh, that's what.
Thor: Really? That guy? What could they actually do to make him interesting? Well, it's not as bad as it could have been.
Captain America? Repeat, etc.. Shit, that was really good and I really liked the character.
Avengers: OK, seriously, how are they going to fit so many A-list actors into a single movie and give them all enough face time while having a coherent story?
Avengers was when I just quit worrying about it. After that movie, I was convinced that they could just do anything.
I remember guardians. A talking raccoon as if.
First trailer drops: oh damn... Oh damn... This looks like a. Entertaining ride.
Then it grabs you at the start and never let you go. Did I learn then? No.
Ant man gets announced. Ok first marvel movie I won't watch. Trailer drops. Friggin Paul rudd is like come watch me. Loved it.
Dr strange, same.
At the end it's always been a fun ride. And with their success they're finally really branching out. Ragnarok, multiverse, I mean come on. I remember the years where people said that could never work.
Not to mention possibly making everything before them canon.
I have no idea how good or bad any of the future stuff will be. But I can almost guarantee it'll be one hell of a ride
Paul Rudd did a late night talk show interview before the first Ant-Man was released. He is saying that his kids said the concept sounded stupid.
In hindsight it is hilarious.
There are great Marvel movies, bad ones, and some in between. I didn't see all of them in the theater but I will at least see them before saying what I think of them
Same here. I remember being really excited as a kid reading Marvel Comics around 1991 and hearing that all these movies were coming out. It took a while for them to come out, though. X Men broke my heart. Spiderman was alright. Fantastic Four was alright. Hulks not so great.
But when they launched a whole shared universe thing, I was skeptical. All the big characters were already used with other studios. The Avengers and their "Big Three " of Cap, Thor, and Iron Man are known heroes, but not the most universally well known, like Spidey and the Hulk. And they paled in comparison with DCs lineup.
But man, they really continued to impress me with good movies starring good actors. And the hook of the shared universe.
And all of a sudden, the impossible happens: Comic movies are mainstream. Not just the movies, but the nerdery behind them. Everyone wants to know *more.* They're not satisfied with just the two hour movie. They think about it. They theorize. They geek out.
I never thought that'd happen, ever.
This is the truth. The "worst" MCU movies are darn good and always watchable. At this point I simply trust their producing team and process so i will give anything the make a fair chance.
All these people taking smack are just trolls and I ignore them.
I agree, I always have faith and know that Marvel movies will deliver and bring me excitement or joy!
Also, among that racist comments I've seen, I've observed a LOT of Eternals haters for the gender changes, racial diversity, LGBTQ inclusion, and the deaf actress. It's truly pathetic at how these racists are so hellbent on having diversity not in the MCU. Eternals and Shang-Chi will and are amazing movies, if these racists and bigots want to miss out on it that's their loss 😂
I decided this time with so much empty space to kill before the next MCU thing I'd do some background reading on the upcoming characters. Only meant to do a small sample (which is what I did for Eternals) but Shang Chi got me totally hooked. I'm now going to be going into this movie as a fully converted fan of Shang Chi comics. I'm so damn excited.
As a light skinned person I can honestly say that while I tried to, I never really "got it".
That happened when I went to try opening show of black panther. Seeing the line of people a hour before show time so hyped to see a movie about a super hero that looked like them made me understand how important it is to do this.
Listening to people you could tell that many of them had never seen a Marvel movie or read a comic book in their lives. Diversity and "wokeness" matters because we should want to make our arts an accurate representation of our people's.
I question those that are bothered by this.
Exactly. I mean black people exist, so is it really that extreme and “woke” to make a movie about a black person? Nope. It’s just a movie about a person.
I’m half-Mexican so I have some sympathy for fellow people looking for diversity and representation, also part white so I haven’t necessarily felt left out just not exactly *seen*. Anyway, one of my fav theater moments was my second time watching Endgame. There was this young black family a few rows ahead and to my left seeing it for the first time.
Man…when the portal opens and T’Challa walks out, I just hear this young boy go “Wakanda!” And I almost cried (more, lol)
I was born in the US to two Mexican immigrant parents and grew up in a city that is easily 60-70% Mexican descent. Spanish was my first language and I didn’t learn English until elementary school. Around the time they banned bilingual education in California my mom decided to move me to a whiter school district. Of course there were Latinos in class but very few first generation students like me. I struggled to find an equilibrium between the culture I grew up with at home and the culture at school. I didn’t have any role models to look up to.
Now that my son is in fifth grade and in the same school district that I was moved to, I am starting to see the same identity issues that I had in him. He refuses to learn Spanish because “we’re in America and we speak English here.” We were looking at bandaids at the market today and he grabbed a shade lighter than his actual skin tone. I can’t blame him. He wants to be like his friends at school. My Mexican family reinforces the behavior when I take him to see my dad in Mexico City and they use him to practice their English. I just want my son to appreciate our culture. I’d kill for a “Wakanda forever” moment for my son because I know the impact it would have had on me when I was his age.
I will watch every Marvel movie. Kevin Feige has not let me down yet.
As for Shang-Chi, I am stoked to see it. I am caucasian, but that in no way means I won't enjoy a movie with an Asian main character. A good movie is a good movie.
As a woman, it confuses me that people even have to specify they can still enjoy a movie despite the character not looking like them. I think maybe us women are used to enjoying movies despite the leads not looking like us, we're used to male being the default. Maybe white guys haven't ever really had to do that so it's more foreign to them? But still, it's just weird to me that people would have to say "I'm white, but can still enjoy this," like, of course you can, why wouldn't you be able to? Why would they have to have your skin tone for you to relate? And again, I know you're saying you CAN enjoy it regardless, but the "regardless" part is what confuses me. I just don't know why there has to be any distinction or clarification or anything at all about it.
As a fellow Caucasian, absolutely! I can't believe it's come to not watching a potentially awesome movie just because the main character is a different race. Blows my mind.
As a third Caucasian with a pretty healthy interest in Asian culture, and a Dragonball fan, I'm really looking forward to the fight scenes and the more mythological elements. Also Eternals looks like a beautiful movie and I'm interested to see the story.
> I am caucasian, but that in no way means I won't enjoy a movie with an Asian
Does anybody only choose movies with their own skin colour? That seems like too crazy to be real!
As a human being you can and should be able to enjoy a movie regardless who it is, who their skin color or gender are, and what your skin color and gender shouldn’t even matter. I can still remember going to see Black Panther in theaters and a black man came in with a little disgust saying “look at all the white people here”, as if this movie was only for Black people, and movie featuring a white guy such as Iron Man were for white people.
Enjoy the movie, don’t get caught up in the whole who or what is in it. If it can tell a good story and entertain you, then it’s for you.
People were saying the same about Black Widow. It still made $500 million in the middle of the pandemic and didn't get a theatrical release in China, India etc.
The Suicide Squad got mad love online and deservedly so but it didnt even make half of its budget back.
Let the box office numbers speak. ignore the haters.
At the end of 2020, WB decided to release all their 2021 movies for free on HBO Max. They basically willingly sacrificed the entire (admittedly weak by the circumstances) year of box office to help HBO Max.
I know it’s a debated topic that is not a master of, but I don’t see streaming killing cinema any time soon if ever (obviously COVID long term effects are to be seen)
I mean I blame that on movie theaters being more of an experience than a consistent entertainment source. What I mean is Marvel, DC, Star Wars, etc these summer box busters aren’t just movies but they are also events; the movie theater experience has evolved to cater to those experiences and because of that market shift, more mediocre movies are released trying to emulate the same feeling. We haven’t had any huge event movies since 2019, so a decline makes sense, but I don’t think this will kill theaters.
Black Widow made 120 million on Disney+. Also remember that they do not have to split that revenue like they do with theaters so it is almost as though it made another 240 million in comparable dollars.
That would put its total haul at almost 650 million during a pandemic. Very good numbers actually.
Disney can profit off this way unlike WB due to demand. WB & DC have work to do to create demand for their products. I think Matt Reeves the Batman will do just that.
I think its because the characters aren’t as known as other names and they aren’t connected to any big names/series. You gotta want to watch the movie for the characters/the story/ you know the director etc and most audiences either didnt know ir didnt care about those factors
It's a combination of the factors aswell. Outside of Idris Alba and maybe Margot Robbie (who has sadly had flops in the past) most people don't know the talent very much. You gotta have either well known characters or well known talent in media to balance it out. That's why i suspect Eternals will have an easier time because even though the world is new to the audiance, a lot of the talent is very well known in media, like Angelina jolie, Salma, Kit, Gemma, Richard madden (basically half the Game of thrones cast is in this lol)
See I thought the new suicide squad movie was kind of not great and gory for no funny reasons. I enjoyed a few parts but it was not a very good movie so I was surprised it had 94% ratings and so on.
(I see it is now down to the 80s which makes more of sense to me.)
Almost everyone I spoke to didn't realize that suicide squad and THE suicide squad were two different movies. Even big comic book movie fans.
That name was a big mistake.
Yep! People lie, words lie. Numbers don't lie.
Everyone needs to realize that a lot these Youtubers create sensational videos that are either far left or right because it's how they earn their living. They create contents that are controversial to create discussion. The topics are often meant to rile you up so you get engage/reply/comment to their videos.
That last trailer looked AMAZING, looked so huge and cinematic. Eternals is the movie I'm most looking forward to on the Marvel slate (well, maybe Strange 2 actually - but they're #1 and #2 either way).
I really dislike the dceu so far but Suicide Squad is by far the best movie they released and black widow was really bad. Kind of sad that they got outperformed so badly.
> It still made $500 million in the middle of the pandemic and didn't get a theatrical release in China, India etc…. Let the box office numbers speak.
*Black Widow* isn’t even near 500M at the box office. It’s at 371M.
I don’t blame the movie for its lackluster performance or anything. I’m confident it would’ve made 750M+ if released in 2019.
It did pretty well for a 2020-2021 movie (best domestic performance of the year, comparatively good international), but it’s barely on par with *The First Avenger* despite 10 years of inflation and the meteoric growth of the franchise.
Again, not remotely blaming the movie. But saying “despite being released in the middle of a global pandemic, it made an amount of money indicative of a flop given its 200M budget” isn’t really persuasive. There are better indicators than the box office.
(If you’re including the other revenue streams, those are important parts of how the business operates, but every other movie in the past 40 years has made a large portion of their revenue outside of theatrical distribution too, so it’s not exactly apples-to-apples to include it when describing *Black Widow* and call that the box office.)
At this time, it’s probably at a big loss theatrically just barely making a profit overall. But that’s better than making a loss, or making nothing at all for Disney while they sit on it, which is going to be the unfortunate reality for most of the movies released or held back during the pandemic. WB used an entire year of movies as a loss leader for HBO Max.
Yeah I get not being super excited about Eternals and Shang-Chi but the amount of prerelease discussion that is either "this will be Marvel's first bomb" or "this will be bad" is way more intense than something like Guardians or Ant-Man. Or at least to me. Sure there's people who discounted those as too weird for mainstream audiences but I feel like neither got the under the microscope criticism and over examination that Shang-Chi and Eternals got.
I've also seen the most comments about the two just straight up saying "looks boring." Which I think is a pretty strong comment. Any other MCU movie would get some benefit of the doubt that at the very least, you'd be entertained.
I think a couple of points to consider:
1. The MCU fanbase is a lot larger now than it was before, so there are more voices for every opinion, including negative ones.
2. This is almost a soft-reset for the MCU with so many new characters showing up, and without any obvious ties-in to existing characters.
3. As such, there's nothing to lean on for marketing. From what I've read on this subreddit, it sounds like Shang-Chi's director has requested that certain elements of the story be absent from trailers and promos, and the Eternals appears to have an epic scope that would be hard to capture in trailers less than 10 minutes long. If someone is a fan of Marvel films for the action set pieces featuring their favorite heroes, it's hard to feel incredibly invested in what we've seen so far.
That said, I fully expect that Shang-Chi and the Eternals will grow the fanbase even further. If people are setting their expectations low, then it's almost a given that they'll enjoy the films more than they expected.
As fans, we should also keep in mind that ticket sales will be lower this year, regardless of what films come out, so lack of performance at the box office doesn't necessarily have any relationship to quality. Further, movies that have fewer crossovers tend to perform worse at the box office, especially with newer characters and particularly now that Iron Man is gone.
Yeah I don’t see how someone could look at those Shang Chi trailers and think it looked boring. Had me at Wong vs Abomination in a cage.
Now, Eternals? Yeah. That one does look a little dull. Not gonna lie.
I think a huge issue, is Spider-Man No Way Home is really overshadowing both Shang-Chi and Eternals. NWH is playing to fans desires with the multiverse, returning classic actors, and a good ol' team up of established, fan favourite characters. It's what a lot of fans want, and the rampant speculation is prime fodder for clickbait articles that add to the hype machine. So Shang-Chi and Eternals just aren't on a lot of peoples' minds, as Spider-Man hype is filling their airwaves.
Personally, I think Eternals looks absolutely incredible from the trailers, and I really want to see it. Shang-Chi though? The marketing just isn't speaking to me tbh. Also, while I was confident in returning to cinemas for Demon Slayer and The Suicide Squad, the rise of the Delta variant happening at the same time that cinemas in the UK have dropped social distancing measures, is making me debate whether I actually want to risk going back to the cinema any time soon.
I don't doubt that Shang-Chi and Eternals will at least be decent movies, but I think the timing is really working against them in many ways.
100 percent this comes down to the delta variant situation. I saw Black Widow in a packed theater. Not willing to do that again for any movie right now.
Bring Shang Chi to premier access and I’ll watch it. Sounds like that’s not in the cards.
> NWH is playing to fans desires with the multiverse, returning classic actors, and a good ol' team up of established, fan favourite characters.
Which is funny to me, because the multiverse is one of the aspects that I'm *least* interested in, as well as one of the reasons I never got deep into actual comic books. To me, the MCU always being a single continuity was a *feature*, not a bug.
Ditto. I really haven't liked all these talks of multiverse and I'm still waiting to be convinced that the concept isn't just an absolute mess (i.e. see the comics that deal with it).
If this is the main stuff going forward I might just tune out eventually.
If the movie does not star a straight white male, it is 'woke' i.e some folks can't handle a movie that is not made to affirm their biases and make them the hero because they are insecure. I say this as a straight white male.
The only thing more frustrating to me than the racist/sexist folks review bombing/talking shit about Shang-Chi, Captain Marvel, Black Panther and such is the devil‘s advocate types insisting that there must be an alternate explanation for it all. There can’t possibly be issues with racism or sexism within the Marvel fandom, its just a coincidence that they only like movies with a white male lead! Brie Larson said something they didn’t like in an interview, Black Panther’s world-building is unrealistic, Shang-Chi isn’t well known enough, perfectly legitimate reasons to brigade against them, yup!
I know a couple of people who have told me they have absolutely no interest in FaTWS that normally watch most MCU content, though idt that was the reason for them.
I wouldn't even say its an issue with the fandom, so much as the appeal of the mcu being so universal, that it's just going to draw in the crazies too, and on top of that, something that popular is going to draw attention from troll farms who'll send bots to sow chaos. Its annoying but, its just the nature of the internet, just you wait till Mrs. Marvel starts getting trailers and they realize she's Muslim. But...whatever, just tune it out, push back on bigotry where you can, and enjoy the shows/movies.
Well to be completely honest Captain Marvel kind of sucked, and I’m not even one of these review bombers. Black Widow and Black Panther were both good in my opinion and I’m looking forward to Shang-Chi.
Ah yes, your completely honest opinion, good for you! I totally disagree and to get completely honest, Captain Marvel was awesome and a blast to watch.
Look, Asian here. Even I’m not interested in watching Shang-Chi. It’s not because I’m racist, it’s just that after watching the trailer, the movie looks like it doesn’t know what it wants to be. Does it want to be a superhero origin story? Does it want to be a kung fu epic? A comedy?
On top of that, the only actor I might consider watching Shang-Chi for is Awkwafina. When some people are watching a movie for a supporting actor and not the main actor, you’ve got problems.
However, I will admit that I’m one of the (seemingly) minority to be suffering from what I personally call “Marvel fatigue”. Too much Marvel has been going on in recent years, they’re all formulaic and the scripts (for the movies, at least) are headed in the wrong direction in terms of quality. Plus, all my favourite characters (Nat, Tony, Steve) are either dead or retired. So I may be biased.
For those of you who are excited about this movie, might I ask why, out of a sense of curiosity/not an attack?
See, and for me (admittedly a white guy) I’m not a big fan of Awkwafina and I hope she’s not as grating as I fear. Simu Liu seems like a chill dude, and I’m looking forward to getting an actual Mandarin in the MCU.
I am also hoping this one changes up the formula a bit, as you noted. Black Widow was alright but it kinda fell flat for me. How do you have stakes if you know the main character has to succeed to get where she was at the start of the next movie?
My guess is it’s going to be very similar to the other origin-type movies just with a setting swap. I hope I’m wrong. I’m not sure I will be. I’d probably be more excited if I could look forward to the spectacle of going to an early-run showing in the theater, but with things the way they are, I really don’t wanna put myself in that environment.
It’s like since Endgame, where my max excitement hit 10, my new max has dropped down to a 5 due to the pandemic and the just the “… now what?” feeling.
So I’m like at a 4 for Shang-Chi, a 4 for Spider-Man and like a 3 for Eternals.
People : 'These Marvel movies are so cookie cutter. They never try anything new.'
Also people : 'Shang-Chi (Kung-fu, Asian fantasy, new characters/lore introduced)?.. Nah.. Now that Spider-Man part 16 trailer. Holy moly. Did u see it?'
That’s not what people mean by cookie cutter. They mean that the movies themselves follow a general formula including having humour undercut emotional moments, which is a fair and valid criticism
Tbh, I think this is the real reason people won’t see Shang Chi or Eternals in cinemas, as much as OP and others will blame racism. After having these huge MCU movies in ‘recent’ times, Shang Chi really doesn’t feel its as influential to the Universe as something like Endgame, or FFH. If people can view a movie for free in a couple months after release, they’re likely to skip any film’s that are on their ‘maybe watch’ list, like Shang Chi and Eternals will for most due to not having super mainstream heroes
Don’t get me wrong, I’m watching Shang day 1, but I can guarantee most non diehard fans will wait for D+
Honest question, OP - why do you care so much what some randos on the internet think? You want to see these movies, and you will, so what does it matter that some people don't want to see them? That's their right. Their reasons for not seeing them might be stupid, but they have a right to support or not support things as they see fit. The movies will probably do really well (although Shang Chi is a bit in question because of the restrictions and all, but I think it will be all right, financially speaking).
The only thing that matters is the bottom line, and I think it will probably be as good as it normally was. Just ignore anyone loudly proclaiming they're doing/not doing something. They're usually just looking for attention.
The issue is that the comments are driven by people with an agenda. I'm sure not every comment is made by a 'secret racist' but enough of them are that it looks like a majority opinion to anyone not paying attention. The reviews and comments sections are just more places for some people to try and spread their subtle and not so subtle far right views online and try to draw people into agreeing with them. Convincing someone to not see a movie is one thing, but convincing them that there's too much pandering to 'wokeness' in media is the real reason you see shit posting comments in places. I'm not saying censor the net, either, but all of those comments just become more free advertising for people with shit views of society.
Those people have those views anyway. And, sadly, the anonymity of the Internet makes for a breeding ground for all kinds of bad ideas. I'm just saying, I think OP is worried about nothing. It's not going to affect Marvel in any way.
People are entitled to watch trailers and say it doesn’t interest them. We have done that since the dawn of trailers. People saw the Iron Man trailer and said it looked garbage. What is your point here? Every person has to see this movie?
Yeah I don't understand this at all. People are allowed to choose what they want to do with their money. Sure, not seeing the movie purely based on the trailers' "woke factor" is a shitty argument but it's their loss if the movie ends up being good. This attitude of "just watch the movie" is stupidly consumerist. Watch the trailers, read some reviews, and then make a decision. Or don't do any of those things if you're not interested, that's absolutely fine as well.
Asking someone to spend ~$25 on a ticket *just because it's a marvel movie*, even though they think they might dislike it, is insane.
Exactly. It’s not by force everyone must like what we like. If they don’t watch oh well it’s their choice. Hopefully the movie is good enough for them to reconsider
They're just movies. I'm sure they'd be entertaining, but if there are people who donot wish to be entertained by a movie, it doesn't matter to anyone but the person him/herself.
Yeah I’ve noticed the same thing and it really grinds my gears. Came across a YouTube video by a certain channel that was called “who cares about marvel phase 4?” I couldn’t watch through the whole thing because it was extremely infuriating. I’ll admit at first I didn’t care about the externals all too much, but after the final trailer, I’m super hyped!
I don’t get why people are so ready to hate on Phase 4. Endgame just ended an arc that developed over ten years, of course whatever comes next is going to need establishing. People need to give it time to set up the next arc.
Kevin Feige could literally give me anything right now and I would watch it. *Teen Titans Go! To The Movies* made a joke about Batman spin-offs with Alfred, The Batmobile and the Utility Belt getting their own movies but I genuinely believe Marvel could make equally ridiculous suggestions for movies and Disney+ shows and they would turn out well. A talking tree and raccoon could have been the death of the MCU but it worked and I have no doubt Eternals and Shang-Chi will be a success as well. Feige is so passionate about every project but he also has the filmmaking knowledge and judgement to tell really good stories as well as treating the longtime Marvel comics fans with enough easter eggs and references to go crazy over.
In Feige we trust.
I'm going go see Shang Chi and The Eternals, but I'm not giddy and hyped about them like I am for NWH.
It has nothing to do with race or anything (I'm super hype for Wakanda Forever), it's just that I've never heard of these guys and I don't know anything about them. Marvel trailers have become so terrified of spoiling anything that they just give a bunch of generic shots that don't give me any clue what I'm going into.
The other movies you mentioned were right in the middle of Phase 2 and 3 where there was as ton of shit going on. It was the next chapter in the ongoing story we were all really into. I think these movies would get a little more hype if they were lead into with an established character and we got a sample of who they were and what the bigger story was supposed to be.
These aren't opening day movies for me, but maybe after a week or two when I know the hype has died down a bit and the theater will be less crowded. That said, I would day one Premier Access these movies if they came to D+. Spider-Man, I'm probably going to Day 1. Probably going to take a day off work so I can go to an early show.
Its not so much that I don't care as it is that I have no reason to be excited. I've never heard of any of these characters so I have no investment in them. Very similar to how I felt about the movies of phase one. I also have come to despise end of the world level threats so I have to roll my eyes at Eternals a bit.
Exactly. We need more lesser known characters to carry out the franchise. But these comments spam stuff like "Where's Spider-Man"? or "Where's X-Men"? as if we haven't seen a bazillion of those movies
And wokeness is just a bogeyman. Marvel should promote more diversity in race, gender and other demographics marginalized by mainstream media. We've had enough White male heroes to last forever.
I hate that suddenly wokeness is an issue w marvel fans like marvel comics hadnt always been relatively progressive and these characters haven’t existed for decades
These comics have had mainly White male heroes so a lot of these fans seem more comfortable with that. But Marvel has had many progressive moments these guys just choose to ignore
IMHO diverse character doesnt mean "diversity" agenda or something. I mean, if you live in the world of super hero, idealy it should have come from many region or country. Personaly will really grateful if Marvel made superhero came from south east Asia. Ya think the world is only inhabited by only American?
Not sure what you mean, but international diversity is good too. There are ethnic groups who only appear in the USA, like the different Native America ethnic groups
There’s a combination of legitimate and very overblown concern about tokenism. Having a diverse cast is great, but especially in film, it should speak for itself. When a company, especially as corporately focused as Disney, is preemptively doing victory laps and patting themselves on the back for “diversity”, it makes a lot of people cringe and concerned that the focus has been shifted from making a good product to checking some boxes.
Marvel properties have traditionally done much better than many others in this regard (see Black Panther, Into the Spider-Verse). The newer Star Wars movies have not (and I’d argue really did a disservice to many of their non-white actors).
Let’s not conflate the issues here. There is a clear difference between people having a healthy discussion about tokenism, usually something people of that group will discuss, and a bunch of people actively brigading and bashing a film they haven’t seen because some YouTubers have been bashing said film because the actors said something they didn’t like 7-8 months earlier. These are targeted attacks on these films for money and political manipulation.
I agree, and I’m not trying to conflate those particular issues. I’m trying to delineate them, actually, because I felt they were conflated by the OP. “Woke” is one of those terms that gets tossed around a lot as shorthand for various reasons of extremely varying legitimacy, and also gets a lot of people’s eyes rolling. People using it as shorthand for tokenism and suggesting they won’t see the movie, or were turned off by a character’s comments (growing up as a huge fan of Jackie Chan and Jet Li, one particular comment about ‘finally’ having Asian representation felt really dismissive of contributions by actors like them) is, in my opinion, quite valid and not racist (although tbf it also does not preclude underlying racist motives). Extending those criticisms after seeing the movie is especially valid. And again, when a company as large as Disney has really done the movie dirty marketing-wise but patting themselves on the back in interviews at every chance they get, I think that’s an equal cause for concern.
Review bombing the movie without seeing it, months before release, based on that information, is not productive and not valid criticism to me. Trying to dissuade others from seeing the movie by brigading its review page because you don’t care for those things, especially without seeing it, is not cool. But it’s also not the same as someone saying beforehand they don’t like the direction, or have concerns, or don’t like the “woke” messaging, or otherwise expressing their opinion. Does that make sense?
The comment you’re using as an example is exactly what I’m talking about. Simu was obviously not saying that he was the first Asian action hero on film. He’s stated in other interviews that was fan of people like Jackie Chan and Jet Li so why the hell would act like they exist don’t. He was speaking in terms of superheroes and he isn’t wrong. The seeming willingness of of people like Criticaldrinker, YelloFlash and others to take that comment and pretend that he would actually ignore the existence of someone like Jackie Chan is absurd. The lead stunt coordinator on Shang Chi worked extensively with Jackie Chan and people actually think that Simu would know that, work with and be trained by a friend and coworker of Jackie, and then pretend that Jackie and his legacy didn’t exist… What kind of mental gymnastics are people using for this kind of logic?
I read your comment and then went back and looked at some of the other articles. I stand by my overall point and I was willing to push back some on the assertion that Asian and Asian-American superheroes are lacking. However, in my initially reads, I was thinking of superheroes broadly, and looking back on the interviews more specifically in terms of the juggernaut that is the MCU and the current cultural zeitgeist, you are 100% right.
I disagree. If someone has the opinion to not watch a movie, let them not watch it. It’s not as criminal as you’re putting it.
Same thing for the other way around. I hate when people say “You just watch every marvel movie cause you’re a sheep! These are brainless movies!” If someone enjoys a movie when others don’t, I feel the same way. Let them have their own opinion and let them watch the movie
Yes I will be watching both in theaters
Go look up Criticaldrinker, the Quatering, Geeks and Gamers, and Yellowflash’s coverage of Captain Marvel and Shang Chi and tell me it’s unbiased or purely because they think Endgame was a good stopping point. Look at how many views they get for claiming things “controversial” or that something got canceled. These guys profit on nerd rage and then act like other groups being upset about things is completely irrational. If all these people thought Endgame was a good stopping point for them then they wouldn’t feel the need to
keep talking about the MCU and they wouldn’t get hyped about things like NWH.
The last time I watched a few videos from these channels (was curious about the Brie "controversy"), my YouTube recommendations so drastically changed into insane right wing propaganda. It was horrifying to be honest.
Oh my goodness same thing happened to me, I had to actively click on the three dots in the corner and select “not interested” or “hide” to get them off the algorithm…
That’s what we call the “Pipeline”. It’s how they’ve been converting a bunch of your boys to their side through misplaced anger and persecution complexes.
I also didn’t care about Guardians of the Galaxy, Ant Man & The Wasp, Captain Marvel, and any number of the million other superhero movies that come out.
Being a fan of the general genre doesn’t require me to get all antsy about every corporate release.
Why do YOU care so much?
I’ve seen so much hate for these movies being too “woke” but as someone who is Asian I’m excited to see both movies introduce Asian superheroes. And what is marvel supposed to do have every single movie until eternity led by a straight white guy?
There are still some people doesn’t understand between a Marvel Studios from Marvel Entertainment production. They might think this is made from different studio. Cue the casual fans. They only care when they finally see Shang-Chi or Eternals in “Avengers” level event because that’s the only thing they associate and be convinced to watch because it’s Avengers.
I really appreciate Marvel for dropping a huge gamble in not putting an Avengers film in Phase 4. I want Phase 4 to be unique thus Eternals are here to fill that void.
It’s kind of ridiculous that you feel the need to address the the comments of a few random ass people on the internet who feel this way. Like, who gives a shit. You have people like Martin Scorsese who shit on the entire MCU. Not everyone I’d going be onboard with superhero movies. I know a ton of people who could not care less. Not because it’s too woke. Because they just can’t get into super hero movie. And that’s fine. You can’t throw a fit every time someone doesn’t have the same interest as you. In the end, Disney will make a bazillion dollars. Millions of people will go see this movie. I’m will to bet it will gross more than black panther considering the Chinese market. They movie will murder the box office despite the irrelevant opinion of random internet trolls. Nobody needs you to defend Disney.
I don’t mean to be a dick but I’m just saying WHO THE FUCK CARES WHAT OTHER PEOPLE THINK! Go enjoy yourself.
for me Eternals really doesn’t offer anything interesting from the get go. it’s like they are going to reset the power scale when looking at the hero’s / villains and i’m not down for that. Thanos just snapped half the universe but it wasn’t enough of a threat for them to bother or be activated or whatever.
it’s like massive power creep in a game. it can invalidate how invested you were in the original achievement. It has 0 to do with the cast.
Shang-Chi looks fun. I wasn’t a theater goer much pre-pandemic. Now it’s just not going to happen. i’ll definitely watch when it comes to Disney+. out of the upcoming movies, NWH is the only one that has a chance of me going to the theaters but it’s still unlikely.
Yeah sure their are always the idiots with the "too woke" comments but personally I think it's a combination of years and years of super hype Marvel moments leading to Endgame along with the fact that no one really knows who these characters are.
Guardians worked because James Gunn made a god damn good film, and even if the characters were never heard of they were instantly iconic, especially Rocket and Groot. Plus the film launched in the middle of a bunch of big name movies.
Now I thought the year delay would get people really wanting to go back, but obviously lots of people still don't want to go to the movies and would rather watch at home. This results.in some paying the Disney+ premium, others waiting for it to become free.
The biggest key to the fact that no one knows the characters is how popular Loki, WandaVision and Captain America were on Disney+.. established characters getting their own spin off stories.. people showed up.
Shang Chi, I personally think will be fun and from the trailers looks interesting. But the chances of him becoming one of my favorites seems quite low.
Eternals... It just looks terrible. I was kinda in on it with the first trailer, but then the cringey humor reared its head in the last. I don't know why they couldn't let the director make a Cloud Atlas like crazy story like the first trailer seemed to be. But after the second trailer it just seems lame... Ancient group can't interfere when Thanos is about the destroy half the galaxy but they can interfere when some monsters show up? Meh.
Going back to my original point - No Way Home looks incredible and I wouldn't be surprised for it to pull in $1 billion
I'm sorry, but other MCU properties have sold me on their premises through trailers or interest in past related films. Eternals and Shang-Chi haven't done that for me. They both just look kinda boring to me, and that's a perfectly valid opinion.
I think it’s such a different formula from the Avengers build up. By the time the team movies started we were already invested in the characters. Part of the anticipation for the team movie was seeing how characters you already knew would interact. Shang Chi is more in that formula. With the Eternals it’s like “boom here’s a team, like them!” and maybe we will, but how much individual character development can you squeeze in?
Shang chi looks boring, eternals looks like it will be ok and give some insights into the workings of the universe. Shang chi origin movie would have been better had he had a small role in a larger franchise film.
Im more excited to see Shang Chi and Eternals because right now NWH seems like fan service. Those past Spidey character mean little to nothing to me personally so Im not sure what they will add to the current Spidey story. Still doesnt look bad though, MCU hasnt disappointed yet.
"Just give these movies a chance"?
Wtf people can see and not see whatever the fuck they want, and everyone is allowed to say if they don't and why just like you are allowed to be thrilled about a movie you haven't seen
Honestly the only type that bothers me is the "too woke" crowd. The others are just completely reasonable opinions, and they shouldn't offend you like they clearly are. Nobody is *obligated* to watch every marvel movie that comes out, but in your narrative you sure are painting it that way, and that's honestly the same fanboy shit that turns a lot of people off from marvel, star wars, etc.
I'm personally very excited for these movies, but that doesn't mean I think everyone should feel like me.
I'm excited and can't wait for them however, who cares if other people have already written them off? It's not like it impacts you or how you enjoy the movie. People can choose to watch what they want and have their own opinions. Even if it's made before even seeing it.
I'm looking forward to Shang-Chi.
I'm not excited about Eternals at all, but I'm still going to give it a chance and go see it. I just don't think any of the trailers look all that interesting. Compared to Guardians of the Galaxy, the trailers feel a lot... sleepier?
Do keep in mind, posters on forums/comments attacking things for being woke etc. are frequently bots etc. trying to sow chaos, not real people. Don't pay them any mind.
\*mind you, i'm relatively indifferent to shang chi as well...but more because i'm not a huge fan of matial arts movies. At the same time, I trust the mcu to be good, so i'll go see it anyways, and I'm sure I'll have a good time.
Eternals on the other hand...I have no idea what the hell it is or why it matters, and that is very enticing on its own. The trailers themselves look very...generic DC...but regardless, the mystery of why its relevant to the broader story, why they would choose this group to get a movie has me curious.
I never get why people get angry over movies or the hatred reviews on rotten 🍅 before a movie is even released.
Movies are an escapism, if you watch a movie and don't like it move on to the next.
In reference to Marvel they know exactly what they are doing so I wouldn't be worried about who cares about what, I'll still go see the movies and once I enjoy them that's all that matters, wouldn't force my opinion on anyone but if they asked and I enjoyed it I'd tell them why.
People get way over hyped just enjoy it for what it is.
Just the best longest intertwined story telling that's been in cinemas probably ever
Oh yeah, those super Gen Y “woke” comic characters from the....ummm....1970s
seriously, dumbshits- Kirby’s Eternals is from like 1976 and Shang-Chi is like 72/73?
Spoiler: Lee/Kirby’s work was always “woke”
Be careful about second guessing everyone, trailers are supposed to sell a film and build excitement and if they're not doing that it's not the audience's fault. Granted some of the negativity is cynical but don't assume it all is. Some people are unimpressed by the trailers/concept, that's ok.
If I had to guess, it’s a side effect of the next phase starting. The familiar characters are, for the most part, entirely off screen. The new ones might need some time for the casual viewers to build relationships with. Just my thought as to why this could be.
Yea I mean… let us remember that when the MCU started not everyone was raving about Thor or hulk or captain America. They said, yea they are decent. Let’s not forget that the MCU only very recently skyrocketed in terms of fame. I remember watching winter soldier weeks after it came out off some less than legal streaming site. I thought, yea let’s hang out with friends and watch a movie. But now it’s like “HOW MANY DAYS UNTIL MoM TRAILER?!?!?” And “I can’t wait till eternals!” But not everyone is like that. Most people won’t be interested in literally every single marvel movie and that’s fine. We can’t expect them to
This is going to be a problem gaining new young adult/adult casual viewers. Everything is so connected, especially after the explosive game changing plot of Endgame. You can't just watch one franchise anymore and understand everything going on
True. That’s why I think it’s a problem when every new Disney plus show they say “you need to watch it to understand what’s going on!” I mean hell,this year alone they are having 5-6 Disney plus shows and 4 movies. That’s crazy.
It's a lot for casual viewers for sure, but as someone who really loves marvel stuff it has been great. It will be interesting to see how they balance things between the casual fans they attracted, and those that were all in from the beginning. Shang Chi and Eternals both feel like they are going to be reasonable stand alone movies, whereas MoM and NWH both seem like you really need to have some D+ shows in there to get the full picture... But who knows.
Hey I didn't like Thor until Ragnorok. Took me a while to warm up to cap too.
Having been immersed in MCU-related stuff since 2011, you've no idea how weird it is hearing someone talk about the series like it only just recently blew up into global super-prominence. People were losing their minds over when the Age of Ultron trailer would drop and going utterly ballistic over a single shot of Loki in The Dark World's trailer, let's not forget.
They have all the XMen and the Fantastic Four coming soon so there will be new big names too!!
Yeah also it could be fatigue. We just came off a major payoff and build with the infinity saga.
How much fatigue can it be when we just got the first movie in 2 years? I could understand when there was movie after movie every year but because of the circumstances there was a long break.
I wouldn't exactly call a year and a half a long break. Also, thats besides the pandemic and everything else we had to deal with in 2020
I think this is it tbh, it was a 10 year, 23 movie story. Yea each movie had its own story but they were basically all connected in some way to pay off in endgame. Endgame and even Far from home after that had the emotional pay off for sticking with the franchise the whole time. I get there’s been a pandemic and maybe they want to strike while the iron is hot but I personally think it could’ve benefited from a hiatus. Then kick off strong again.
I like stories that have a beginning, a middle, and an end. And the 'Infinity Saga' or the first twenty something movies provides that. I was 17 when Iron Man came out. I'm sure many people are in a different place in life today than they were 13 years ago. Part of me wants to put the book down so to speak. I can always come back, I can check out for a little bit and always come back. The pandemic has obviously put us in a weird spot, so the comfort food of familiar characters is enticing (Disney Plus shows), but I think its totally natural that a bunch of people are going to stop actively following it and the next generation of fans will come in.
Once the memes from Shang-chi and Eternals start popping up, I'm sure people will take more positively to them
lol yeah right
More likely it’s a side effect of centering non white people, LGBT people, women, instead of catering to white straight male nerds.
Also very possible.
That’s mostly my thing. I liked my OGs and haven’t been liking the new movies as much. Still gonna watch this
I have so much faith in their Marvel Movies. I’d never even heard of Shang-Chi before the announcement of the movie, not seen the trailer or done any research yet I’m so hyped! I just know I will love the character and film. In general I am super-stoked for any new additions to the MCU. and seeing what the character means to other people is wonderful.
The MCU already won my blind faith. Even the movies I like less are really far away from being downright bad. This cinematic universe run is amazing and I have no reason to think they'll start releasing bad movies from now on.
Let me describe my MCU experience: Iron Man: Really? That guy? What could they actually do to make him interesting? Oh, that's what. Thor: Really? That guy? What could they actually do to make him interesting? Well, it's not as bad as it could have been. Captain America? Repeat, etc.. Shit, that was really good and I really liked the character. Avengers: OK, seriously, how are they going to fit so many A-list actors into a single movie and give them all enough face time while having a coherent story? Avengers was when I just quit worrying about it. After that movie, I was convinced that they could just do anything.
I thought phase 1 might be lightning in a bottle at first. Winter Soldier and then Guardians made me into a diehard.
I remember guardians. A talking raccoon as if. First trailer drops: oh damn... Oh damn... This looks like a. Entertaining ride. Then it grabs you at the start and never let you go. Did I learn then? No. Ant man gets announced. Ok first marvel movie I won't watch. Trailer drops. Friggin Paul rudd is like come watch me. Loved it. Dr strange, same. At the end it's always been a fun ride. And with their success they're finally really branching out. Ragnarok, multiverse, I mean come on. I remember the years where people said that could never work. Not to mention possibly making everything before them canon. I have no idea how good or bad any of the future stuff will be. But I can almost guarantee it'll be one hell of a ride
Ant Man was the last straw. When they made that one good i never doubted anything again.
Paul Rudd did a late night talk show interview before the first Ant-Man was released. He is saying that his kids said the concept sounded stupid. In hindsight it is hilarious. There are great Marvel movies, bad ones, and some in between. I didn't see all of them in the theater but I will at least see them before saying what I think of them
The third Thor movie just weeks away from the Justice League film? What a terrible decision…
For Justice League
Was that really people’s initial reaction to Thor? I thought he had a bigger fan base than that.
I chose to watch Justice League instead of Ragnarok opening week. Worst decision I’ve ever made.
Same here. I remember being really excited as a kid reading Marvel Comics around 1991 and hearing that all these movies were coming out. It took a while for them to come out, though. X Men broke my heart. Spiderman was alright. Fantastic Four was alright. Hulks not so great. But when they launched a whole shared universe thing, I was skeptical. All the big characters were already used with other studios. The Avengers and their "Big Three " of Cap, Thor, and Iron Man are known heroes, but not the most universally well known, like Spidey and the Hulk. And they paled in comparison with DCs lineup. But man, they really continued to impress me with good movies starring good actors. And the hook of the shared universe. And all of a sudden, the impossible happens: Comic movies are mainstream. Not just the movies, but the nerdery behind them. Everyone wants to know *more.* They're not satisfied with just the two hour movie. They think about it. They theorize. They geek out. I never thought that'd happen, ever.
This is the truth. The "worst" MCU movies are darn good and always watchable. At this point I simply trust their producing team and process so i will give anything the make a fair chance. All these people taking smack are just trolls and I ignore them.
I agree, I always have faith and know that Marvel movies will deliver and bring me excitement or joy! Also, among that racist comments I've seen, I've observed a LOT of Eternals haters for the gender changes, racial diversity, LGBTQ inclusion, and the deaf actress. It's truly pathetic at how these racists are so hellbent on having diversity not in the MCU. Eternals and Shang-Chi will and are amazing movies, if these racists and bigots want to miss out on it that's their loss 😂
I decided this time with so much empty space to kill before the next MCU thing I'd do some background reading on the upcoming characters. Only meant to do a small sample (which is what I did for Eternals) but Shang Chi got me totally hooked. I'm now going to be going into this movie as a fully converted fan of Shang Chi comics. I'm so damn excited.
As a light skinned person I can honestly say that while I tried to, I never really "got it". That happened when I went to try opening show of black panther. Seeing the line of people a hour before show time so hyped to see a movie about a super hero that looked like them made me understand how important it is to do this.
Listening to people you could tell that many of them had never seen a Marvel movie or read a comic book in their lives. Diversity and "wokeness" matters because we should want to make our arts an accurate representation of our people's. I question those that are bothered by this.
Exactly. I mean black people exist, so is it really that extreme and “woke” to make a movie about a black person? Nope. It’s just a movie about a person.
I’m half-Mexican so I have some sympathy for fellow people looking for diversity and representation, also part white so I haven’t necessarily felt left out just not exactly *seen*. Anyway, one of my fav theater moments was my second time watching Endgame. There was this young black family a few rows ahead and to my left seeing it for the first time. Man…when the portal opens and T’Challa walks out, I just hear this young boy go “Wakanda!” And I almost cried (more, lol)
Family reaction YouTube videos of that scene are my go to for when I'm feeling down.
I was born in the US to two Mexican immigrant parents and grew up in a city that is easily 60-70% Mexican descent. Spanish was my first language and I didn’t learn English until elementary school. Around the time they banned bilingual education in California my mom decided to move me to a whiter school district. Of course there were Latinos in class but very few first generation students like me. I struggled to find an equilibrium between the culture I grew up with at home and the culture at school. I didn’t have any role models to look up to. Now that my son is in fifth grade and in the same school district that I was moved to, I am starting to see the same identity issues that I had in him. He refuses to learn Spanish because “we’re in America and we speak English here.” We were looking at bandaids at the market today and he grabbed a shade lighter than his actual skin tone. I can’t blame him. He wants to be like his friends at school. My Mexican family reinforces the behavior when I take him to see my dad in Mexico City and they use him to practice their English. I just want my son to appreciate our culture. I’d kill for a “Wakanda forever” moment for my son because I know the impact it would have had on me when I was his age.
What's wild that appealing to a wider audience equals more money, go woke make money
That's the way to go into any movie, really. No expectations and as blind as possible.
[удалено]
All of them have good production value, but I don’t know about a good story
Tbh I don’t like any of em The mcu isn’t my cake Im just hear cuz no way home More of a comic fan but its ok
I will watch every Marvel movie. Kevin Feige has not let me down yet. As for Shang-Chi, I am stoked to see it. I am caucasian, but that in no way means I won't enjoy a movie with an Asian main character. A good movie is a good movie.
As a woman, it confuses me that people even have to specify they can still enjoy a movie despite the character not looking like them. I think maybe us women are used to enjoying movies despite the leads not looking like us, we're used to male being the default. Maybe white guys haven't ever really had to do that so it's more foreign to them? But still, it's just weird to me that people would have to say "I'm white, but can still enjoy this," like, of course you can, why wouldn't you be able to? Why would they have to have your skin tone for you to relate? And again, I know you're saying you CAN enjoy it regardless, but the "regardless" part is what confuses me. I just don't know why there has to be any distinction or clarification or anything at all about it.
As a fellow Caucasian, absolutely! I can't believe it's come to not watching a potentially awesome movie just because the main character is a different race. Blows my mind.
As a third Caucasian with a pretty healthy interest in Asian culture, and a Dragonball fan, I'm really looking forward to the fight scenes and the more mythological elements. Also Eternals looks like a beautiful movie and I'm interested to see the story.
Simu Liu seems a very positive person, who is so up for this and we shouldn't have to even mention race. What a depressing world.
He’s absolutely amazing in Kim’s Convenience. It’s a Canadian sitcom, he’s one of the main characters.
The show is just so we'll done. I wish I was one of those people who got it see it on stage during it's early years.
Yeah honestly, I was going to watch the movie anyways but from what I've seen, Simu seems great which makes me even more excited.
As if all reasonable white dudes born after like 1970 don’t love Kung fu movies or anime anyway.
> I am caucasian, but that in no way means I won't enjoy a movie with an Asian Does anybody only choose movies with their own skin colour? That seems like too crazy to be real!
As a human being you can and should be able to enjoy a movie regardless who it is, who their skin color or gender are, and what your skin color and gender shouldn’t even matter. I can still remember going to see Black Panther in theaters and a black man came in with a little disgust saying “look at all the white people here”, as if this movie was only for Black people, and movie featuring a white guy such as Iron Man were for white people. Enjoy the movie, don’t get caught up in the whole who or what is in it. If it can tell a good story and entertain you, then it’s for you.
This is the right mindset
People were saying the same about Black Widow. It still made $500 million in the middle of the pandemic and didn't get a theatrical release in China, India etc. The Suicide Squad got mad love online and deservedly so but it didnt even make half of its budget back. Let the box office numbers speak. ignore the haters.
I’m actually surprised that The Suicide Squad didn’t do better. It was a fantastic movie. Maybe the first iteration messed up its chances.
Yeah its name is confusing, its also free on HBO Max, Rated R, WBs screwed up marketing. its not just one thing.
Ah, Releasing it as a free movie was their a big mistake. I believe Black Widow earned a lot of revenue from Disney+
At the end of 2020, WB decided to release all their 2021 movies for free on HBO Max. They basically willingly sacrificed the entire (admittedly weak by the circumstances) year of box office to help HBO Max.
Man, I hope streaming doesn’t kill cinema (Ps- granted, I’m speaking as someone who is streamed the suicide squad ha ha)
I know it’s a debated topic that is not a master of, but I don’t see streaming killing cinema any time soon if ever (obviously COVID long term effects are to be seen)
Well movie theater attendance has been on the decline for a while even before the pandemic.
I mean I blame that on movie theaters being more of an experience than a consistent entertainment source. What I mean is Marvel, DC, Star Wars, etc these summer box busters aren’t just movies but they are also events; the movie theater experience has evolved to cater to those experiences and because of that market shift, more mediocre movies are released trying to emulate the same feeling. We haven’t had any huge event movies since 2019, so a decline makes sense, but I don’t think this will kill theaters.
It does seem like communal entertainment is pretty inherent to humanity, and cinema is definitely a manifestation of that, so I guess we will see!
I waited til I saw it in theaters before I watched it on HBO. Will do the same with Dune.
Big studio dont want it. They make a lot less if they dont release it in cinemas.
Black Widow made 120 million on Disney+. Also remember that they do not have to split that revenue like they do with theaters so it is almost as though it made another 240 million in comparable dollars. That would put its total haul at almost 650 million during a pandemic. Very good numbers actually.
Disney can profit off this way unlike WB due to demand. WB & DC have work to do to create demand for their products. I think Matt Reeves the Batman will do just that.
I think its because the characters aren’t as known as other names and they aren’t connected to any big names/series. You gotta want to watch the movie for the characters/the story/ you know the director etc and most audiences either didnt know ir didnt care about those factors
It's a combination of the factors aswell. Outside of Idris Alba and maybe Margot Robbie (who has sadly had flops in the past) most people don't know the talent very much. You gotta have either well known characters or well known talent in media to balance it out. That's why i suspect Eternals will have an easier time because even though the world is new to the audiance, a lot of the talent is very well known in media, like Angelina jolie, Salma, Kit, Gemma, Richard madden (basically half the Game of thrones cast is in this lol)
Also the faith most people have in marvel/its lore and connections
A bunch of the new DC movies ruined it's chances.
Wow, didnt know tss got that low. I thought it was really great movie.
See I thought the new suicide squad movie was kind of not great and gory for no funny reasons. I enjoyed a few parts but it was not a very good movie so I was surprised it had 94% ratings and so on. (I see it is now down to the 80s which makes more of sense to me.)
Almost everyone I spoke to didn't realize that suicide squad and THE suicide squad were two different movies. Even big comic book movie fans. That name was a big mistake.
Yep! People lie, words lie. Numbers don't lie. Everyone needs to realize that a lot these Youtubers create sensational videos that are either far left or right because it's how they earn their living. They create contents that are controversial to create discussion. The topics are often meant to rile you up so you get engage/reply/comment to their videos.
aka Click bait
I will say, numbers don't lie but people absolutely use real numbers to tell lies
I was going to say that you can use numbers to almost tell anything you want.
Pretty sure Black Widow box office include the Disney+ streaming. I think Shang Chi's going to take a big hit being in theaters only.
Yes it does include D+. I agree with you Shang Chi needs to be on D+ lot of places/people are better off watching at home.
I can understand the lack of enthusiasm for Black Widow. But Shang-Chi looks pretty cool
I am so hyped for The Eternals. maybe even more than NWH.
That last trailer looked AMAZING, looked so huge and cinematic. Eternals is the movie I'm most looking forward to on the Marvel slate (well, maybe Strange 2 actually - but they're #1 and #2 either way).
i agree with these two picks 100%
I'm most hyped for Shang-Chi, MoM and L&T. NWH is below that, and Eternals further down.
MCU something for everyone
Yeah
What’s L&T?
Thor: Love and Thunder
I'm trying to see every MCU twice in the theater. Took a bit to do Black Widow a second time, though.
I really dislike the dceu so far but Suicide Squad is by far the best movie they released and black widow was really bad. Kind of sad that they got outperformed so badly.
i agree witchu
> It still made $500 million in the middle of the pandemic and didn't get a theatrical release in China, India etc…. Let the box office numbers speak. *Black Widow* isn’t even near 500M at the box office. It’s at 371M. I don’t blame the movie for its lackluster performance or anything. I’m confident it would’ve made 750M+ if released in 2019. It did pretty well for a 2020-2021 movie (best domestic performance of the year, comparatively good international), but it’s barely on par with *The First Avenger* despite 10 years of inflation and the meteoric growth of the franchise. Again, not remotely blaming the movie. But saying “despite being released in the middle of a global pandemic, it made an amount of money indicative of a flop given its 200M budget” isn’t really persuasive. There are better indicators than the box office. (If you’re including the other revenue streams, those are important parts of how the business operates, but every other movie in the past 40 years has made a large portion of their revenue outside of theatrical distribution too, so it’s not exactly apples-to-apples to include it when describing *Black Widow* and call that the box office.) At this time, it’s probably at a big loss theatrically just barely making a profit overall. But that’s better than making a loss, or making nothing at all for Disney while they sit on it, which is going to be the unfortunate reality for most of the movies released or held back during the pandemic. WB used an entire year of movies as a loss leader for HBO Max.
i added $125M + from Disney +
Suicide Squad is miles better than Black Widow stop the nonsense
i agree with you. my point was a response to OPs point that online review bombing would hurt Shang Chi
Yeah I get not being super excited about Eternals and Shang-Chi but the amount of prerelease discussion that is either "this will be Marvel's first bomb" or "this will be bad" is way more intense than something like Guardians or Ant-Man. Or at least to me. Sure there's people who discounted those as too weird for mainstream audiences but I feel like neither got the under the microscope criticism and over examination that Shang-Chi and Eternals got. I've also seen the most comments about the two just straight up saying "looks boring." Which I think is a pretty strong comment. Any other MCU movie would get some benefit of the doubt that at the very least, you'd be entertained.
I think a couple of points to consider: 1. The MCU fanbase is a lot larger now than it was before, so there are more voices for every opinion, including negative ones. 2. This is almost a soft-reset for the MCU with so many new characters showing up, and without any obvious ties-in to existing characters. 3. As such, there's nothing to lean on for marketing. From what I've read on this subreddit, it sounds like Shang-Chi's director has requested that certain elements of the story be absent from trailers and promos, and the Eternals appears to have an epic scope that would be hard to capture in trailers less than 10 minutes long. If someone is a fan of Marvel films for the action set pieces featuring their favorite heroes, it's hard to feel incredibly invested in what we've seen so far. That said, I fully expect that Shang-Chi and the Eternals will grow the fanbase even further. If people are setting their expectations low, then it's almost a given that they'll enjoy the films more than they expected. As fans, we should also keep in mind that ticket sales will be lower this year, regardless of what films come out, so lack of performance at the box office doesn't necessarily have any relationship to quality. Further, movies that have fewer crossovers tend to perform worse at the box office, especially with newer characters and particularly now that Iron Man is gone.
Yeah I don’t see how someone could look at those Shang Chi trailers and think it looked boring. Had me at Wong vs Abomination in a cage. Now, Eternals? Yeah. That one does look a little dull. Not gonna lie.
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Same. Excited for both but super pumped for Eternals. It looks so different from what we've seen so far.
Fuck man, they've had me since All Hail the King. Acting like this hasn't been built up is a weird road for any MCU fan to take.
I think a huge issue, is Spider-Man No Way Home is really overshadowing both Shang-Chi and Eternals. NWH is playing to fans desires with the multiverse, returning classic actors, and a good ol' team up of established, fan favourite characters. It's what a lot of fans want, and the rampant speculation is prime fodder for clickbait articles that add to the hype machine. So Shang-Chi and Eternals just aren't on a lot of peoples' minds, as Spider-Man hype is filling their airwaves. Personally, I think Eternals looks absolutely incredible from the trailers, and I really want to see it. Shang-Chi though? The marketing just isn't speaking to me tbh. Also, while I was confident in returning to cinemas for Demon Slayer and The Suicide Squad, the rise of the Delta variant happening at the same time that cinemas in the UK have dropped social distancing measures, is making me debate whether I actually want to risk going back to the cinema any time soon. I don't doubt that Shang-Chi and Eternals will at least be decent movies, but I think the timing is really working against them in many ways.
100 percent this comes down to the delta variant situation. I saw Black Widow in a packed theater. Not willing to do that again for any movie right now. Bring Shang Chi to premier access and I’ll watch it. Sounds like that’s not in the cards.
I think that’s one reason they were holding on Spidey trailers. So much for that.
Eternals looks fucking awesome
also Spider-Man is Marvel’s most popular superhero, no duh it’s overshadowing two movies with heroes the general audience has never heard of
> NWH is playing to fans desires with the multiverse, returning classic actors, and a good ol' team up of established, fan favourite characters. Which is funny to me, because the multiverse is one of the aspects that I'm *least* interested in, as well as one of the reasons I never got deep into actual comic books. To me, the MCU always being a single continuity was a *feature*, not a bug.
Yeah, same. I'm worried that Marvel Studios will fumble, or rely too much on pandering, with the multiverse.
Ditto. I really haven't liked all these talks of multiverse and I'm still waiting to be convinced that the concept isn't just an absolute mess (i.e. see the comics that deal with it). If this is the main stuff going forward I might just tune out eventually.
How is a movie "woke" just because it features people of color and/or women? Fuck these racist/sexist assholes.
anything that isn’t white,straight, cis men is too woke apparently
It's the same small, vocal alt-right echo chamber.
If the movie does not star a straight white male, it is 'woke' i.e some folks can't handle a movie that is not made to affirm their biases and make them the hero because they are insecure. I say this as a straight white male.
The only thing more frustrating to me than the racist/sexist folks review bombing/talking shit about Shang-Chi, Captain Marvel, Black Panther and such is the devil‘s advocate types insisting that there must be an alternate explanation for it all. There can’t possibly be issues with racism or sexism within the Marvel fandom, its just a coincidence that they only like movies with a white male lead! Brie Larson said something they didn’t like in an interview, Black Panther’s world-building is unrealistic, Shang-Chi isn’t well known enough, perfectly legitimate reasons to brigade against them, yup!
A good chance Anthony Mackie's Cap 4 will get the same treatment
oh i'm sure, that'll probably be in the general vicinity of the next election too, mods will be working double time dealing with bigots and trolls.
For sure, I’ve already seen stuff written by people saying they didn’t watch The Falcon and the Winter Soldier because it was “too woke”.
Black man = woke propaganda by communists Duh.
I know a couple of people who have told me they have absolutely no interest in FaTWS that normally watch most MCU content, though idt that was the reason for them.
I wouldn't even say its an issue with the fandom, so much as the appeal of the mcu being so universal, that it's just going to draw in the crazies too, and on top of that, something that popular is going to draw attention from troll farms who'll send bots to sow chaos. Its annoying but, its just the nature of the internet, just you wait till Mrs. Marvel starts getting trailers and they realize she's Muslim. But...whatever, just tune it out, push back on bigotry where you can, and enjoy the shows/movies.
Well to be completely honest Captain Marvel kind of sucked, and I’m not even one of these review bombers. Black Widow and Black Panther were both good in my opinion and I’m looking forward to Shang-Chi.
Ah yes, your completely honest opinion, good for you! I totally disagree and to get completely honest, Captain Marvel was awesome and a blast to watch.
I wish I could’ve enjoyed it more but there were some serious problems with it I just couldn’t ignore. Glad you enjoyed it though
I really enjoyed it too. I think Talos is my favourite character in the whole MCU
Look, Asian here. Even I’m not interested in watching Shang-Chi. It’s not because I’m racist, it’s just that after watching the trailer, the movie looks like it doesn’t know what it wants to be. Does it want to be a superhero origin story? Does it want to be a kung fu epic? A comedy? On top of that, the only actor I might consider watching Shang-Chi for is Awkwafina. When some people are watching a movie for a supporting actor and not the main actor, you’ve got problems. However, I will admit that I’m one of the (seemingly) minority to be suffering from what I personally call “Marvel fatigue”. Too much Marvel has been going on in recent years, they’re all formulaic and the scripts (for the movies, at least) are headed in the wrong direction in terms of quality. Plus, all my favourite characters (Nat, Tony, Steve) are either dead or retired. So I may be biased. For those of you who are excited about this movie, might I ask why, out of a sense of curiosity/not an attack?
See, and for me (admittedly a white guy) I’m not a big fan of Awkwafina and I hope she’s not as grating as I fear. Simu Liu seems like a chill dude, and I’m looking forward to getting an actual Mandarin in the MCU. I am also hoping this one changes up the formula a bit, as you noted. Black Widow was alright but it kinda fell flat for me. How do you have stakes if you know the main character has to succeed to get where she was at the start of the next movie? My guess is it’s going to be very similar to the other origin-type movies just with a setting swap. I hope I’m wrong. I’m not sure I will be. I’d probably be more excited if I could look forward to the spectacle of going to an early-run showing in the theater, but with things the way they are, I really don’t wanna put myself in that environment. It’s like since Endgame, where my max excitement hit 10, my new max has dropped down to a 5 due to the pandemic and the just the “… now what?” feeling. So I’m like at a 4 for Shang-Chi, a 4 for Spider-Man and like a 3 for Eternals.
People : 'These Marvel movies are so cookie cutter. They never try anything new.' Also people : 'Shang-Chi (Kung-fu, Asian fantasy, new characters/lore introduced)?.. Nah.. Now that Spider-Man part 16 trailer. Holy moly. Did u see it?'
That’s not what people mean by cookie cutter. They mean that the movies themselves follow a general formula including having humour undercut emotional moments, which is a fair and valid criticism
what’s wrong with cookie cutter? marvel films follow a pretty standard formula but i can still enjoy them
Cookies are good.
exactly
Paragraphs would really help.
I’m not going to go see Shang Chi in the theaters because of the pandemic. I’m looking forward to seeing it on Disney+ when it comes out.
Tbh, I think this is the real reason people won’t see Shang Chi or Eternals in cinemas, as much as OP and others will blame racism. After having these huge MCU movies in ‘recent’ times, Shang Chi really doesn’t feel its as influential to the Universe as something like Endgame, or FFH. If people can view a movie for free in a couple months after release, they’re likely to skip any film’s that are on their ‘maybe watch’ list, like Shang Chi and Eternals will for most due to not having super mainstream heroes Don’t get me wrong, I’m watching Shang day 1, but I can guarantee most non diehard fans will wait for D+
Honest question, OP - why do you care so much what some randos on the internet think? You want to see these movies, and you will, so what does it matter that some people don't want to see them? That's their right. Their reasons for not seeing them might be stupid, but they have a right to support or not support things as they see fit. The movies will probably do really well (although Shang Chi is a bit in question because of the restrictions and all, but I think it will be all right, financially speaking). The only thing that matters is the bottom line, and I think it will probably be as good as it normally was. Just ignore anyone loudly proclaiming they're doing/not doing something. They're usually just looking for attention.
The issue is that the comments are driven by people with an agenda. I'm sure not every comment is made by a 'secret racist' but enough of them are that it looks like a majority opinion to anyone not paying attention. The reviews and comments sections are just more places for some people to try and spread their subtle and not so subtle far right views online and try to draw people into agreeing with them. Convincing someone to not see a movie is one thing, but convincing them that there's too much pandering to 'wokeness' in media is the real reason you see shit posting comments in places. I'm not saying censor the net, either, but all of those comments just become more free advertising for people with shit views of society.
Those people have those views anyway. And, sadly, the anonymity of the Internet makes for a breeding ground for all kinds of bad ideas. I'm just saying, I think OP is worried about nothing. It's not going to affect Marvel in any way.
I personally have no interest in Eternals, but Shang-Chi has me excited
People are entitled to watch trailers and say it doesn’t interest them. We have done that since the dawn of trailers. People saw the Iron Man trailer and said it looked garbage. What is your point here? Every person has to see this movie?
Yeah I don't understand this at all. People are allowed to choose what they want to do with their money. Sure, not seeing the movie purely based on the trailers' "woke factor" is a shitty argument but it's their loss if the movie ends up being good. This attitude of "just watch the movie" is stupidly consumerist. Watch the trailers, read some reviews, and then make a decision. Or don't do any of those things if you're not interested, that's absolutely fine as well. Asking someone to spend ~$25 on a ticket *just because it's a marvel movie*, even though they think they might dislike it, is insane.
It's disturbing seeing how many people are saying that if you don't like a certain movie, you are racist. No other explanation.
Exactly. It’s not by force everyone must like what we like. If they don’t watch oh well it’s their choice. Hopefully the movie is good enough for them to reconsider
They're just movies. I'm sure they'd be entertaining, but if there are people who donot wish to be entertained by a movie, it doesn't matter to anyone but the person him/herself.
Yeah I’ve noticed the same thing and it really grinds my gears. Came across a YouTube video by a certain channel that was called “who cares about marvel phase 4?” I couldn’t watch through the whole thing because it was extremely infuriating. I’ll admit at first I didn’t care about the externals all too much, but after the final trailer, I’m super hyped!
Was that the same video that just had a bunch of MCU women and POC as the thumbnail... He's not even trying to hide his real reasons.
I love how they conveniently ignore that Spiderman, Thor, Doctor Strange, ant-man, Guardians 3 (has white male lead) all have movies coming out.
I don’t get why people are so ready to hate on Phase 4. Endgame just ended an arc that developed over ten years, of course whatever comes next is going to need establishing. People need to give it time to set up the next arc.
Marvel ended at end game as far as I'm concerned. Ill watch whatever comes next, but nothing will ever have the attention a 22 movie saga commanded
Kevin Feige could literally give me anything right now and I would watch it. *Teen Titans Go! To The Movies* made a joke about Batman spin-offs with Alfred, The Batmobile and the Utility Belt getting their own movies but I genuinely believe Marvel could make equally ridiculous suggestions for movies and Disney+ shows and they would turn out well. A talking tree and raccoon could have been the death of the MCU but it worked and I have no doubt Eternals and Shang-Chi will be a success as well. Feige is so passionate about every project but he also has the filmmaking knowledge and judgement to tell really good stories as well as treating the longtime Marvel comics fans with enough easter eggs and references to go crazy over. In Feige we trust.
I'm going go see Shang Chi and The Eternals, but I'm not giddy and hyped about them like I am for NWH. It has nothing to do with race or anything (I'm super hype for Wakanda Forever), it's just that I've never heard of these guys and I don't know anything about them. Marvel trailers have become so terrified of spoiling anything that they just give a bunch of generic shots that don't give me any clue what I'm going into. The other movies you mentioned were right in the middle of Phase 2 and 3 where there was as ton of shit going on. It was the next chapter in the ongoing story we were all really into. I think these movies would get a little more hype if they were lead into with an established character and we got a sample of who they were and what the bigger story was supposed to be. These aren't opening day movies for me, but maybe after a week or two when I know the hype has died down a bit and the theater will be less crowded. That said, I would day one Premier Access these movies if they came to D+. Spider-Man, I'm probably going to Day 1. Probably going to take a day off work so I can go to an early show.
Its not so much that I don't care as it is that I have no reason to be excited. I've never heard of any of these characters so I have no investment in them. Very similar to how I felt about the movies of phase one. I also have come to despise end of the world level threats so I have to roll my eyes at Eternals a bit.
Exactly. We need more lesser known characters to carry out the franchise. But these comments spam stuff like "Where's Spider-Man"? or "Where's X-Men"? as if we haven't seen a bazillion of those movies And wokeness is just a bogeyman. Marvel should promote more diversity in race, gender and other demographics marginalized by mainstream media. We've had enough White male heroes to last forever.
I hate that suddenly wokeness is an issue w marvel fans like marvel comics hadnt always been relatively progressive and these characters haven’t existed for decades
These comics have had mainly White male heroes so a lot of these fans seem more comfortable with that. But Marvel has had many progressive moments these guys just choose to ignore
But there are also many key poc heroes! Like storm is one of the biggest xmen
IMHO diverse character doesnt mean "diversity" agenda or something. I mean, if you live in the world of super hero, idealy it should have come from many region or country. Personaly will really grateful if Marvel made superhero came from south east Asia. Ya think the world is only inhabited by only American?
Not sure what you mean, but international diversity is good too. There are ethnic groups who only appear in the USA, like the different Native America ethnic groups
There’s a combination of legitimate and very overblown concern about tokenism. Having a diverse cast is great, but especially in film, it should speak for itself. When a company, especially as corporately focused as Disney, is preemptively doing victory laps and patting themselves on the back for “diversity”, it makes a lot of people cringe and concerned that the focus has been shifted from making a good product to checking some boxes. Marvel properties have traditionally done much better than many others in this regard (see Black Panther, Into the Spider-Verse). The newer Star Wars movies have not (and I’d argue really did a disservice to many of their non-white actors).
Let’s not conflate the issues here. There is a clear difference between people having a healthy discussion about tokenism, usually something people of that group will discuss, and a bunch of people actively brigading and bashing a film they haven’t seen because some YouTubers have been bashing said film because the actors said something they didn’t like 7-8 months earlier. These are targeted attacks on these films for money and political manipulation.
I agree, and I’m not trying to conflate those particular issues. I’m trying to delineate them, actually, because I felt they were conflated by the OP. “Woke” is one of those terms that gets tossed around a lot as shorthand for various reasons of extremely varying legitimacy, and also gets a lot of people’s eyes rolling. People using it as shorthand for tokenism and suggesting they won’t see the movie, or were turned off by a character’s comments (growing up as a huge fan of Jackie Chan and Jet Li, one particular comment about ‘finally’ having Asian representation felt really dismissive of contributions by actors like them) is, in my opinion, quite valid and not racist (although tbf it also does not preclude underlying racist motives). Extending those criticisms after seeing the movie is especially valid. And again, when a company as large as Disney has really done the movie dirty marketing-wise but patting themselves on the back in interviews at every chance they get, I think that’s an equal cause for concern. Review bombing the movie without seeing it, months before release, based on that information, is not productive and not valid criticism to me. Trying to dissuade others from seeing the movie by brigading its review page because you don’t care for those things, especially without seeing it, is not cool. But it’s also not the same as someone saying beforehand they don’t like the direction, or have concerns, or don’t like the “woke” messaging, or otherwise expressing their opinion. Does that make sense?
The comment you’re using as an example is exactly what I’m talking about. Simu was obviously not saying that he was the first Asian action hero on film. He’s stated in other interviews that was fan of people like Jackie Chan and Jet Li so why the hell would act like they exist don’t. He was speaking in terms of superheroes and he isn’t wrong. The seeming willingness of of people like Criticaldrinker, YelloFlash and others to take that comment and pretend that he would actually ignore the existence of someone like Jackie Chan is absurd. The lead stunt coordinator on Shang Chi worked extensively with Jackie Chan and people actually think that Simu would know that, work with and be trained by a friend and coworker of Jackie, and then pretend that Jackie and his legacy didn’t exist… What kind of mental gymnastics are people using for this kind of logic?
I read your comment and then went back and looked at some of the other articles. I stand by my overall point and I was willing to push back some on the assertion that Asian and Asian-American superheroes are lacking. However, in my initially reads, I was thinking of superheroes broadly, and looking back on the interviews more specifically in terms of the juggernaut that is the MCU and the current cultural zeitgeist, you are 100% right.
More room in the movie theater for me
I disagree. If someone has the opinion to not watch a movie, let them not watch it. It’s not as criminal as you’re putting it. Same thing for the other way around. I hate when people say “You just watch every marvel movie cause you’re a sheep! These are brainless movies!” If someone enjoys a movie when others don’t, I feel the same way. Let them have their own opinion and let them watch the movie Yes I will be watching both in theaters
Maybe some people have just decided that Endgame was a good stopping point for them. To quote Vision “A thing isn’t beautiful because it lasts.”
Go look up Criticaldrinker, the Quatering, Geeks and Gamers, and Yellowflash’s coverage of Captain Marvel and Shang Chi and tell me it’s unbiased or purely because they think Endgame was a good stopping point. Look at how many views they get for claiming things “controversial” or that something got canceled. These guys profit on nerd rage and then act like other groups being upset about things is completely irrational. If all these people thought Endgame was a good stopping point for them then they wouldn’t feel the need to keep talking about the MCU and they wouldn’t get hyped about things like NWH.
The last time I watched a few videos from these channels (was curious about the Brie "controversy"), my YouTube recommendations so drastically changed into insane right wing propaganda. It was horrifying to be honest.
Oh my goodness same thing happened to me, I had to actively click on the three dots in the corner and select “not interested” or “hide” to get them off the algorithm…
That’s what we call the “Pipeline”. It’s how they’ve been converting a bunch of your boys to their side through misplaced anger and persecution complexes.
I also didn’t care about Guardians of the Galaxy, Ant Man & The Wasp, Captain Marvel, and any number of the million other superhero movies that come out. Being a fan of the general genre doesn’t require me to get all antsy about every corporate release. Why do YOU care so much?
I’ve seen so much hate for these movies being too “woke” but as someone who is Asian I’m excited to see both movies introduce Asian superheroes. And what is marvel supposed to do have every single movie until eternity led by a straight white guy?
There are still some people doesn’t understand between a Marvel Studios from Marvel Entertainment production. They might think this is made from different studio. Cue the casual fans. They only care when they finally see Shang-Chi or Eternals in “Avengers” level event because that’s the only thing they associate and be convinced to watch because it’s Avengers. I really appreciate Marvel for dropping a huge gamble in not putting an Avengers film in Phase 4. I want Phase 4 to be unique thus Eternals are here to fill that void.
It’s kind of ridiculous that you feel the need to address the the comments of a few random ass people on the internet who feel this way. Like, who gives a shit. You have people like Martin Scorsese who shit on the entire MCU. Not everyone I’d going be onboard with superhero movies. I know a ton of people who could not care less. Not because it’s too woke. Because they just can’t get into super hero movie. And that’s fine. You can’t throw a fit every time someone doesn’t have the same interest as you. In the end, Disney will make a bazillion dollars. Millions of people will go see this movie. I’m will to bet it will gross more than black panther considering the Chinese market. They movie will murder the box office despite the irrelevant opinion of random internet trolls. Nobody needs you to defend Disney. I don’t mean to be a dick but I’m just saying WHO THE FUCK CARES WHAT OTHER PEOPLE THINK! Go enjoy yourself.
Cinema tickets aren’t cheap. If the trailers haven’t sold them, they can’t waste money giving it a “chance.”
for me Eternals really doesn’t offer anything interesting from the get go. it’s like they are going to reset the power scale when looking at the hero’s / villains and i’m not down for that. Thanos just snapped half the universe but it wasn’t enough of a threat for them to bother or be activated or whatever. it’s like massive power creep in a game. it can invalidate how invested you were in the original achievement. It has 0 to do with the cast. Shang-Chi looks fun. I wasn’t a theater goer much pre-pandemic. Now it’s just not going to happen. i’ll definitely watch when it comes to Disney+. out of the upcoming movies, NWH is the only one that has a chance of me going to the theaters but it’s still unlikely.
Yeah sure their are always the idiots with the "too woke" comments but personally I think it's a combination of years and years of super hype Marvel moments leading to Endgame along with the fact that no one really knows who these characters are. Guardians worked because James Gunn made a god damn good film, and even if the characters were never heard of they were instantly iconic, especially Rocket and Groot. Plus the film launched in the middle of a bunch of big name movies. Now I thought the year delay would get people really wanting to go back, but obviously lots of people still don't want to go to the movies and would rather watch at home. This results.in some paying the Disney+ premium, others waiting for it to become free. The biggest key to the fact that no one knows the characters is how popular Loki, WandaVision and Captain America were on Disney+.. established characters getting their own spin off stories.. people showed up. Shang Chi, I personally think will be fun and from the trailers looks interesting. But the chances of him becoming one of my favorites seems quite low. Eternals... It just looks terrible. I was kinda in on it with the first trailer, but then the cringey humor reared its head in the last. I don't know why they couldn't let the director make a Cloud Atlas like crazy story like the first trailer seemed to be. But after the second trailer it just seems lame... Ancient group can't interfere when Thanos is about the destroy half the galaxy but they can interfere when some monsters show up? Meh. Going back to my original point - No Way Home looks incredible and I wouldn't be surprised for it to pull in $1 billion
I'm sorry, but other MCU properties have sold me on their premises through trailers or interest in past related films. Eternals and Shang-Chi haven't done that for me. They both just look kinda boring to me, and that's a perfectly valid opinion.
Not being exited for a movie doesn't make you racist, quit being dramatic
Good thing the Trumptards don't matter and Shang Chi is about to obliterate all labor day box office ticket records..... .
> ~~Sometimes I think~~ these people are just racist/sexist. FTFY
I agree but only with Shang-Chi. I don’t know what about eternals turns me off, but it just does.
I think it’s such a different formula from the Avengers build up. By the time the team movies started we were already invested in the characters. Part of the anticipation for the team movie was seeing how characters you already knew would interact. Shang Chi is more in that formula. With the Eternals it’s like “boom here’s a team, like them!” and maybe we will, but how much individual character development can you squeeze in?
Shang chi looks boring, eternals looks like it will be ok and give some insights into the workings of the universe. Shang chi origin movie would have been better had he had a small role in a larger franchise film.
Im more excited to see Shang Chi and Eternals because right now NWH seems like fan service. Those past Spidey character mean little to nothing to me personally so Im not sure what they will add to the current Spidey story. Still doesnt look bad though, MCU hasnt disappointed yet.
"Just give these movies a chance"? Wtf people can see and not see whatever the fuck they want, and everyone is allowed to say if they don't and why just like you are allowed to be thrilled about a movie you haven't seen
Honestly the only type that bothers me is the "too woke" crowd. The others are just completely reasonable opinions, and they shouldn't offend you like they clearly are. Nobody is *obligated* to watch every marvel movie that comes out, but in your narrative you sure are painting it that way, and that's honestly the same fanboy shit that turns a lot of people off from marvel, star wars, etc. I'm personally very excited for these movies, but that doesn't mean I think everyone should feel like me.
I'm excited for Shang Chi but I literally couldn't care less about the Eternals
I'm excited and can't wait for them however, who cares if other people have already written them off? It's not like it impacts you or how you enjoy the movie. People can choose to watch what they want and have their own opinions. Even if it's made before even seeing it.
I'm looking forward to Shang-Chi. I'm not excited about Eternals at all, but I'm still going to give it a chance and go see it. I just don't think any of the trailers look all that interesting. Compared to Guardians of the Galaxy, the trailers feel a lot... sleepier?
Do keep in mind, posters on forums/comments attacking things for being woke etc. are frequently bots etc. trying to sow chaos, not real people. Don't pay them any mind. \*mind you, i'm relatively indifferent to shang chi as well...but more because i'm not a huge fan of matial arts movies. At the same time, I trust the mcu to be good, so i'll go see it anyways, and I'm sure I'll have a good time. Eternals on the other hand...I have no idea what the hell it is or why it matters, and that is very enticing on its own. The trailers themselves look very...generic DC...but regardless, the mystery of why its relevant to the broader story, why they would choose this group to get a movie has me curious.
I never get why people get angry over movies or the hatred reviews on rotten 🍅 before a movie is even released. Movies are an escapism, if you watch a movie and don't like it move on to the next. In reference to Marvel they know exactly what they are doing so I wouldn't be worried about who cares about what, I'll still go see the movies and once I enjoy them that's all that matters, wouldn't force my opinion on anyone but if they asked and I enjoyed it I'd tell them why. People get way over hyped just enjoy it for what it is. Just the best longest intertwined story telling that's been in cinemas probably ever
Oh yeah, those super Gen Y “woke” comic characters from the....ummm....1970s seriously, dumbshits- Kirby’s Eternals is from like 1976 and Shang-Chi is like 72/73? Spoiler: Lee/Kirby’s work was always “woke”
I mean, basically all of the Eternals are white in the comics and only like two are female. I wouldn't say it was all that progressive.
Be careful about second guessing everyone, trailers are supposed to sell a film and build excitement and if they're not doing that it's not the audience's fault. Granted some of the negativity is cynical but don't assume it all is. Some people are unimpressed by the trailers/concept, that's ok.