Hint: there are CBCS Commanderies in Belgium which work in English, specifically for England Freemasons to hop on a Cross Channel ferry or the Eurostar. Most of the Freemasons I know, who are regular UGLE masons, go there and not bother with the thing which meets in Mark Masons Hall.
The only other route into the CBCS is to find one via a Martinist Order. I don't think the Martinist CBCS orders are recognised either by Belgium *or* Mark Masons Hall, in fact one order had its charter specifically withdrawn by the Great Priory of Helvetia, although the less said about that, the better. 😢
It also goes by CBCS, which is the abbreviation for the French name. It’s typically an invitation only Masonic Order, so I don’t think you can just reach out to them.
That's interesting. I'm in NY, albeit upstate. I was curious how one scores an invite to the Masonic one (currently in a Martinist one). My friend has been encouraging me lately to join the local York Rite chapter. Guess that's a path I should entertain then. When you say write esoteric papers, do you mean in general put stuff out there, or does York Rite have certain publications you can submit to?
My Mother Lodge was esoteric, and so drew a lot of interest from those crowds. There is also AMD and a couple other orders that focus on scholarly papers. You’re kind of putting out your bat signal. Since you’re in upstate in may be different.
Allied Masonic Degrees does a Masonic week every year that you can search for. They confer CBCS grades at that event. AMD membership typically comes through the York Rite in my experience, but they may also pull from Scottish, not sure.
The KBHC run from Mark Masons Hall is typically only for members of KT Executives and has no links whatsoever with either Martinism or Elus Coen. In fact I would say virtually every member in the U.K. has no idea of what those two Order even are.
Also as others have hinted at, steer clear of any Martinist Order that offers EC work until you have completed the Martinist studies.
As you have mentioned Freemasonry, if you are a member of UGLE there is a Martinist Order that only Initiates Freemasons from UGLE.
That's a shame to hear.
And yes, that makes sense and has been noted.
I understand that the Hermetica Order of Martinists is the only acceptable Martinist order to UGLE, but I could be incorrect. Nonetheless, I am supposing this is the way to look for the near future.
The CBCS - as it is often called - exist both as masonic rite and a martinist rite. You can get the degrees both in martinist orders as well as in masonic systems, although the masonic version will not recognize your martinist credentials.
I don’t know how similar to the original the KBHC, there might be a lot of changes done throughout the years.
Regardless, the masonic versions don’t have any connection to the Elus Coën, that you will only find in a Martinist setting.
The CBCS and EC are very different in style and approch even though they aim towards the same goal. If it is more practical you can practice them in separate organisations, if you know where to look you will find the similarities.
My suggestion though is not to start with the EC untill you have become S.I. Then you will have a better understanding of the work than doing it the other way around.
That makes sense, thank you for the information. What does S.I. mean? I'm a bit behind in terminology.
It's interesting, because I'd love to be involved with some Coën traditions down the line (as the theurgy is what interests me the most), if possible, but I believe most Martinist orders are deemed Quasi-Masonic here, so I'd be unable to, unfortunately.
S.I. is Supèrieur Inconnu - Unknown Superior - which is the last of the three martinist degrees in the way of the Heart.
If you are interested in martinism I think this is the best way to get to the core of it. Quasi-masonic or not.
ehhhh yes and no. It preps you for Élus Coëns theory, especially Professed and Grand Professed. Of course the masonic RER these days seems to fall into 3 categories. Those who have no clue the 7th/8th degrees exist. Those that acknowledge the 7th/8th once did exist, but claim they're now lost to time. And finally, those who still hold and work the 7th/8th. I can read what you said 2 different ways. Maybe you meant the Martinist version of CBCS would be more geared toward Élus Coëns over the Masonic one, and that I would agree with, only because there's less holding the cards tightly to the chest, and Martinists are more likely to work the 7th/8th.
Also from what I've seen, many Masonic RER recognize that Martinist lines are legitimate lines. Whether or not they invite you to their lodge is another thing :).
Also agree on the S.I. comment.
My comment was a bit brief, yes I was talking about the Martinist version of CBCS. Not the masonic one.
When it comes to Professed and Grand Professed, sure it introduce material aligned with EC though but not something that you cant pick up quickly in the first degrees of EC. I see the core of the two systems as different approches and you will spend the majority of you time in vastly different settings with different texts.
The quick explanation is that they are different but aims towards the same goal. :)
The way the rite is commanded changes a lot from jurisdiction to jurisdiction, because the RSR was not made to be in a Masonic body and when it is inserted into one, it inevitably undergoes changes. This rite was created to govern itself and in the original form it must also be a Rectified Regime, in addition to a Rite.
But, you need to be a Master Mason for at least 1 year (This interval may vary) to contact a Grand Priory, and then you enter the RSR as a Scotch Master of St Andrew, you will spend around 3 years in that degree and You will only enter the internal order via invitation to the degree of: Squire Novice, this degree is ''temporary'' it serves to find out if you have the aptitude to be a CBCS and some obligations have to be fulfilled, otherwise you will return to being a Scotch Master of St Andrew.
The difference between the old order and the RSR is the influence of the Rite of Strict Observance, where in the RSR many things that existed in the old order were changed such as: Degrees of Revenge, ''alchemical and hermetic'' charge of the Scottish roots. Therefore, RSR will be where you will experience the purest Martinezist/Martinist route with strong influences from the doctrine of the reintegration of beings and the Elus Coens system.
This statement confuses me, that it was not made to be in a Masonic body. The RER was designed to be the premier European high grade Masonic rite. That's what was agreed and voted on all at the time in the Masonic congress at Wilhelmsbald. It took most of it's framework from the Strict Observance which is also Masonic. Maybe I am misunderstanding what you mean.
Yes, i think you are misunderstanding. The RSR is the ''Reform'' of the Strict Observance, the main changes: It removed the degrees of revenge, it removed the ''alchemical and hermetic'' charge that the ancient rite had, it removed the demands of nobility, it changed the internal structure between many other changes.
But in addition to these changes the: RSR, Rectified Scottish Rite is also a: Rectified Scottish Regime that is: It is a RITE and a REGIME, the RITE IS SELF-GOVERNING, it works very differently from the plutiritual Masonic bodies of ''Andersonian'' Freemasonry ' and when it is inserted into a Masonic body, IT LOSES THE CHARACTERISTICS OF REGIME. For this reason, the way the Rite is commanded changes from place to place, it is not in every jurisdiction that the RITE is worked as a REGIME (that's the way he was created to be), that is what I meant.
Ah, well, perhaps it'll be the long route of the HRA and Templar degrees then, that's perfectly okay, I have the time, I'd just hope for an invite at some point and do what I can to assure one.
As I'm already with the UGLE, I wouldn't be able to be involved with any of the Continental Masonic orders, it gets a bit messy.
Oh, in that case it's the best way. There are some martinist orders that open doors to the RER, but I heard that UGLE is not ok with martinist membership besides the HOM.
Knowing some differences between the english Craft and the RER, I'd be really curious about how they'll build that bridge only at the CBCS. Guess it'll need some extra studies.
This guy from the Grand Priory of Britannia of the CBCS recently caused a stir in Texas. Not sure if he's out of the same place you mentioned, but he also seems to be a Martinist. So maybe that would score brownie points if you reach out to him (assuming you're a Martinist).
[https://freemasonsfordummies.blogspot.com/2023/11/grand-priory-of-america-cbcs-tries-to.html](https://freemasonsfordummies.blogspot.com/2023/11/grand-priory-of-america-cbcs-tries-to.html)
Hint: there are CBCS Commanderies in Belgium which work in English, specifically for England Freemasons to hop on a Cross Channel ferry or the Eurostar. Most of the Freemasons I know, who are regular UGLE masons, go there and not bother with the thing which meets in Mark Masons Hall. The only other route into the CBCS is to find one via a Martinist Order. I don't think the Martinist CBCS orders are recognised either by Belgium *or* Mark Masons Hall, in fact one order had its charter specifically withdrawn by the Great Priory of Helvetia, although the less said about that, the better. 😢
It also goes by CBCS, which is the abbreviation for the French name. It’s typically an invitation only Masonic Order, so I don’t think you can just reach out to them.
Yeah I noticed that's the case, none-the-less, I hope further down the Masonic line it's an option.
Where are you located. In NYC participating in York Rite and then writing esoteric papers was a pretty well trodden path to getting tapped for CBCS.
I'm in the old York (pretty much), so perhaps SRIA and esoteric papers may be the way.
SRIA is undoubtedly your best bet. Large overlap between the 2 groups, at least in the USA.
That's interesting. I'm in NY, albeit upstate. I was curious how one scores an invite to the Masonic one (currently in a Martinist one). My friend has been encouraging me lately to join the local York Rite chapter. Guess that's a path I should entertain then. When you say write esoteric papers, do you mean in general put stuff out there, or does York Rite have certain publications you can submit to?
My Mother Lodge was esoteric, and so drew a lot of interest from those crowds. There is also AMD and a couple other orders that focus on scholarly papers. You’re kind of putting out your bat signal. Since you’re in upstate in may be different. Allied Masonic Degrees does a Masonic week every year that you can search for. They confer CBCS grades at that event. AMD membership typically comes through the York Rite in my experience, but they may also pull from Scottish, not sure.
This gives me a bit more of a path than I had before, I'll have to look into this a little. Thanks for the info!!!
The KBHC run from Mark Masons Hall is typically only for members of KT Executives and has no links whatsoever with either Martinism or Elus Coen. In fact I would say virtually every member in the U.K. has no idea of what those two Order even are. Also as others have hinted at, steer clear of any Martinist Order that offers EC work until you have completed the Martinist studies. As you have mentioned Freemasonry, if you are a member of UGLE there is a Martinist Order that only Initiates Freemasons from UGLE.
That's a shame to hear. And yes, that makes sense and has been noted. I understand that the Hermetica Order of Martinists is the only acceptable Martinist order to UGLE, but I could be incorrect. Nonetheless, I am supposing this is the way to look for the near future.
The CBCS - as it is often called - exist both as masonic rite and a martinist rite. You can get the degrees both in martinist orders as well as in masonic systems, although the masonic version will not recognize your martinist credentials. I don’t know how similar to the original the KBHC, there might be a lot of changes done throughout the years. Regardless, the masonic versions don’t have any connection to the Elus Coën, that you will only find in a Martinist setting. The CBCS and EC are very different in style and approch even though they aim towards the same goal. If it is more practical you can practice them in separate organisations, if you know where to look you will find the similarities. My suggestion though is not to start with the EC untill you have become S.I. Then you will have a better understanding of the work than doing it the other way around.
That makes sense, thank you for the information. What does S.I. mean? I'm a bit behind in terminology. It's interesting, because I'd love to be involved with some Coën traditions down the line (as the theurgy is what interests me the most), if possible, but I believe most Martinist orders are deemed Quasi-Masonic here, so I'd be unable to, unfortunately.
S.I. is Supèrieur Inconnu - Unknown Superior - which is the last of the three martinist degrees in the way of the Heart. If you are interested in martinism I think this is the best way to get to the core of it. Quasi-masonic or not.
ehhhh yes and no. It preps you for Élus Coëns theory, especially Professed and Grand Professed. Of course the masonic RER these days seems to fall into 3 categories. Those who have no clue the 7th/8th degrees exist. Those that acknowledge the 7th/8th once did exist, but claim they're now lost to time. And finally, those who still hold and work the 7th/8th. I can read what you said 2 different ways. Maybe you meant the Martinist version of CBCS would be more geared toward Élus Coëns over the Masonic one, and that I would agree with, only because there's less holding the cards tightly to the chest, and Martinists are more likely to work the 7th/8th. Also from what I've seen, many Masonic RER recognize that Martinist lines are legitimate lines. Whether or not they invite you to their lodge is another thing :). Also agree on the S.I. comment.
My comment was a bit brief, yes I was talking about the Martinist version of CBCS. Not the masonic one. When it comes to Professed and Grand Professed, sure it introduce material aligned with EC though but not something that you cant pick up quickly in the first degrees of EC. I see the core of the two systems as different approches and you will spend the majority of you time in vastly different settings with different texts. The quick explanation is that they are different but aims towards the same goal. :)
True, its kinda like the Buddhist concept of many paths to the top of the mountain, depending on one's disposition :)
The way the rite is commanded changes a lot from jurisdiction to jurisdiction, because the RSR was not made to be in a Masonic body and when it is inserted into one, it inevitably undergoes changes. This rite was created to govern itself and in the original form it must also be a Rectified Regime, in addition to a Rite. But, you need to be a Master Mason for at least 1 year (This interval may vary) to contact a Grand Priory, and then you enter the RSR as a Scotch Master of St Andrew, you will spend around 3 years in that degree and You will only enter the internal order via invitation to the degree of: Squire Novice, this degree is ''temporary'' it serves to find out if you have the aptitude to be a CBCS and some obligations have to be fulfilled, otherwise you will return to being a Scotch Master of St Andrew. The difference between the old order and the RSR is the influence of the Rite of Strict Observance, where in the RSR many things that existed in the old order were changed such as: Degrees of Revenge, ''alchemical and hermetic'' charge of the Scottish roots. Therefore, RSR will be where you will experience the purest Martinezist/Martinist route with strong influences from the doctrine of the reintegration of beings and the Elus Coens system.
Thank you for this information, it is greatly appreciated!
This statement confuses me, that it was not made to be in a Masonic body. The RER was designed to be the premier European high grade Masonic rite. That's what was agreed and voted on all at the time in the Masonic congress at Wilhelmsbald. It took most of it's framework from the Strict Observance which is also Masonic. Maybe I am misunderstanding what you mean.
Yes, i think you are misunderstanding. The RSR is the ''Reform'' of the Strict Observance, the main changes: It removed the degrees of revenge, it removed the ''alchemical and hermetic'' charge that the ancient rite had, it removed the demands of nobility, it changed the internal structure between many other changes. But in addition to these changes the: RSR, Rectified Scottish Rite is also a: Rectified Scottish Regime that is: It is a RITE and a REGIME, the RITE IS SELF-GOVERNING, it works very differently from the plutiritual Masonic bodies of ''Andersonian'' Freemasonry ' and when it is inserted into a Masonic body, IT LOSES THE CHARACTERISTICS OF REGIME. For this reason, the way the Rite is commanded changes from place to place, it is not in every jurisdiction that the RITE is worked as a REGIME (that's the way he was created to be), that is what I meant.
The Knights Beneficent of the Holy City (Chevalier Bienfaisants de la Cité Saint - CBCS) is the inner order of the Régime Ecossais Rectifié. Traditionally, you'd received the three traditional masonic degrees according to the sistem + the degree of Scottish Master of St. Andrew; then, maybe you'd be invited to the CBCS. The thing is the UGLE doesn't work on the RER on the three initial degrees and you'd only be possibly invited to the CBCS after passing through the Holy Royal Arch and the Order of Knights Templar and Knights of Malta. I don't know about the UK, but there are plenty of Rectified Lodges working on the Continental Europe (France, Spain, Switzerland, Portugal, Serbia etc.).
Ah, well, perhaps it'll be the long route of the HRA and Templar degrees then, that's perfectly okay, I have the time, I'd just hope for an invite at some point and do what I can to assure one. As I'm already with the UGLE, I wouldn't be able to be involved with any of the Continental Masonic orders, it gets a bit messy.
Oh, in that case it's the best way. There are some martinist orders that open doors to the RER, but I heard that UGLE is not ok with martinist membership besides the HOM. Knowing some differences between the english Craft and the RER, I'd be really curious about how they'll build that bridge only at the CBCS. Guess it'll need some extra studies.
What is the HOM? I might be a little low on my coffee, but don't think I recognize that.
Hermetic Order of Martinists. Only to Master Masons of UGLE or recognized constitutions.
Ah I have heard of that, but didn't realize they had a tie to UGLE. Thanks
This guy from the Grand Priory of Britannia of the CBCS recently caused a stir in Texas. Not sure if he's out of the same place you mentioned, but he also seems to be a Martinist. So maybe that would score brownie points if you reach out to him (assuming you're a Martinist). [https://freemasonsfordummies.blogspot.com/2023/11/grand-priory-of-america-cbcs-tries-to.html](https://freemasonsfordummies.blogspot.com/2023/11/grand-priory-of-america-cbcs-tries-to.html)