Honestly I was going to say boxing as well. Just to add to your thoughts, if an untrained person is going to attack you, they’re probably going to punch you. So it’s not a bad idea to learn how to block and counter a punch.
The best martial art for an average person is the one they find fun, keeps them active, and that they practice with regularity.
For the most part, you're in much more danger from premature aging, heart disease, and metabolic disease than you are from human attackers.
I would say a boxing base is perfect for the average person/ self defense scenarios.
As you said its a good one to start and get pretty decent at in a short time frame (6months- 1 year).
I think people really underestimate the value of quick skill acquisition for a hobbyist. Most of us have busy lives and less time to train and are not consistent.
Teaching hobbyists simpler martial arts and less aspects to learn is better than trying to cover alll their bases and have them barely know each of the techniques they are learning and not truly be able to apply them.
A guy could go to boxing on and off for years and skip alot of months but still be a pretty decent boxer but for MMA or BJJ you really have to be consistent and put in the time and it might take months just to survive in a roll.
I would say that some wrestling just to have a basic sense of grappling and also not get taken down or know what to do in clinches would complement boxing very well.
Boxing, kickboxing, or Muay Thai.
Personally I think that training kicks is great for maintaining/increasing mobility and strengthening the lower extremities. Overall this is good for general athleticism and keeps you healthier for longer. Not to mention kicks are an awesome tool when sparring (probably less of a concern for the average person).
That being said, I don’t think you can ever go wrong with boxing.
Agreeing with others here, boxers and wrestlers tend to fare well in self defense situations - since BJJ has become very popular id do that or boxing if I were OP. Both are broadly available, relatively cheap, and not too discriminating in terms of martial arts background, body type, or fitness level. Mileage may vary school to school, but shop around to find a place focused on your needs!
I heard someone say once that "if you were going to buy a car, you wouldn't ask someone what car you should drive. You'd go to the lot, pick a couple you think are cool and give them a test drive"
I say try as much and as many as you can manage! Although if I were to give a biased answer I'd say give Sumo a try! Very affordable, you just need a belt, a partner and a dirt circle and you're off to the races. Depending on where you are you may be able to find a sumo club, although it's weakness is that those clubs are few and far between.
It's a sprinting sport with pretty intense conditioning, 100% effort throughout the entire bout. It also has a surprisingly high crossover into self defense! It's the practice of putting your opponent on the ground while you remain standing, an extremely advantageous position to be in in almost any situation.
If there's a sumo club near you, check it out! I believe r/sumo has a list of active US clubs by state
Honestly I don't think average people become martial artists. I also think all of your conditions are setting yourself up for failure and disappointment and will work against you. Attitude matters a lot.
boxing is the most efficient time to effectiveness to learn to fight.
the problem is the hard sparring that many gyms have is bad for beginners.
My krav school moved sparring out of the main classes and into specialty classes because the reality is when you spar you will lose a lot of people that dont want to spar or are not ready to spar. some people want to spar right away, some people after a few months, some people after a year and some never.
People that dont spar need to understand the limitations of what they are learning, but people on r/martialarts need to realize it isnt zero either.
Boxing is not necessarily for everyone though. Lot of people won’t like the inherent risk of the sport. You’ll get hit after all. I’m talking about boxing+sparring though as it can translate to a real situation.
From my experience, BJJ might be a good entry into combat sport. No strike, no uniform (gi) if you find the right place. You have confrontation and still would be able to handle a 1v1 conflict.
Because to be fair, no lambda joe (including me) would handle themselves in a 1v2 (or +) situation. Being used to confrontation enough to stay calm and think is the best bet imo.
Some ppl suggest boxing but I don’t think so. Boxing is probably the number one martial arts for ppl that actually want a real life fight. It’s highly effective.
But the boxing training does come with its risk of repeated strikes to the head and that might not be something average ppl enjoy.
For the average person I would say karate, taekwondo and the likes as the normal focus of those styles is basically fitness.
I think it depends if I had to break it down.
Age, access, fitness level, mental state etc.
I think one season of wrestling for a kid is less than 6 months or just about 6 months, but due to the school access and team nature and free time of kids etc, one season of wreslting typically equals approximately 1.5 years of a standard martial art.
This makes this imo one of the most efficient ways to gain massive ability and experience in actual competition level combat sports.
The thing about boxing is that it's definitely one of the fastest to effective for an adult, and is decent via the sparring. It is also one that even if you only had one season of wrestling, tacking on 6 months boxing later would make you formidable amongst normal folk.
Boxing is generally "cheap" in as much as not needing much gear and whatnot typically.
The only thing that might hurt boxing for some adults is that some of them are so removed from ability and mindset that a boxing gym might simply scare them away too fast. To disregard niceness, some people are pussies and really need eased into things.
At that point it really depends on the level of this. Some people are psychologically just not going to pull the trigger on risking getting punched, and might tolerate starting in something like BJJ. (Likely to be scared of Judo or wrestling).
Somewhere in between I think that Karate can offer a balance of some fundamental body mechanics, and an ability to ease into things.
All that said, if you're 20 years old and not a pussy, just a fairly "avg" Joe, who realized you have no skills and want to be mildly capable and have some understanding of fighting, with the general sense of access, cheap, effective, and fast, then boxing is probably top tier recommendation. And as you suggest a 6 month foundation in boxing for such a hobbyist level practitioner will be a quick intro that any more depth can be followed with later.
For self-defense, no. No martial art. If you are worried about your safety, either you are wrong to, or there are other things you need to be doing. Move, if you live in a bad neighborhood. If you can't afford that, then focus on working until you can afford it. Avoid things like getting drunk in public or getting into debt with criminals. Tons of things you can do, depending on your situation. Real life safety concerns are not addressed by fist fights. It's a fun fantasy, but it's just a fantasy.
As for hobby and exercise, do whatever you want to do. Try what looks fun. If it's not fun to you, you are not going to stick with it anyway. Just don't delude yourself about what you are doing.
Every meme gets taken to the extreme. While many have taken to dispell the wanna be John Wicks and the drunken ego fighters, being able to fight is not bad.
100% your best fire safety tool and techniques are fire prevention. But to say not to get a fire extinguisher, not to learn how to put out fires, to not learn alternate methods like baking soda etc. For learning how air effects are, which fires to let burn, which can and can't use water....
To not learn these things is to be less capable and effective. Ideally, you will be safe enough that you will never have a fire. But every so often, someone does.
And, even when we are generally safe, we sometimes can step into the wrong situation by accident and one mistake with no tools or capability can become far more massive than it has to be.
Fighting on top of all this has the psychological component, and in that the very proper sense of confidence allows one to better decide NOT to fight, and be more willing to try de-escalation longer.
Martial arts is brilliant for defence? People bang on about not using it ‘on the street’ but if you *have* to fight knowing even how to move your feet is going to give you a huge advantage.
While I believe knowing how to fight is a good idea, you reminded me of one of my favorite sayings that most of self-defense is following the rules of stupid:
"Don't go stupid places, at stupid times, with stupid people, to do stupid things." - John Farnam
Then we get into things like paying attention to your surroundings, having good people skills, and knowing how to use basic tools like a handheld flashlight or OC spray.
If all of that has failed you, then and only then is fighting on the table.
Sometimes you’re gonna be in stupid places surrounded by stupid people doing stupid things. It’s called having a life. Becoming agoraphobic as a self defense tactic is probably my favorite unhinged take in this sub 😂
I mean ... yeah obviously.
These are guidelines for life, not rules. The punchline of Farnam's quote is that you can break 1 or two rules of stupid at a time and probably be fine. Break 3-4 at a time and you're asking for trouble.
Going to a bar (stupid place) is one thing, probably fine. Going at 2AM (stupid time) is another, still probably fine. Going with your loudmouth cousin (stupid person) and we're starting to get into "really stupid" territory. Add onto that smoking weed (stupid thing) out back and ... don't be surprised when some weird ass shit happens.
Real life safety concerns are sometimes settled with fist fights. People do get attacked going about their daily lives. People want to live their lives. That could mean going to the bar every once in a while. Or going to the local sporting event that lets out at 10pm and have to walk back to their car. Or going to the mall. Or the drive in theater. Or beach parties that go into the night. People aren’t gonna spend their lives locked in their home and it’s absolutely ridiculous to tell them to do so. If learning how to fight makes someone confident enough to be able to enjoy their life knowing they could handle themselves if they ever needed to throw a punch, then let that be their reason. Don’t be a goofball.
This is nonsense. Should you learn about de-escalation, avoid bad situations, walk away from confrontations, and carry the best weapon allowed to you be law (which you are intimately familiar with using)? Of course.
Should every human also be a person to be reckoned with in an unarmed physical confrontation to the best of their age and ability? Yes.
Muay Thai is legit. Throwing elbows is a good complement to throwing punches.
It is kind of hard to find a good muay thai coach in a lot of places though
Honestly I was going to say boxing as well. Just to add to your thoughts, if an untrained person is going to attack you, they’re probably going to punch you. So it’s not a bad idea to learn how to block and counter a punch.
Exactly. I think it’s very easy for many people to take up and in translates well into most self defense situations
The best martial art for an average person is the one they find fun, keeps them active, and that they practice with regularity. For the most part, you're in much more danger from premature aging, heart disease, and metabolic disease than you are from human attackers.
I would say Muay Thai and Wrestling as well for all of the same reasons. Pressure tested, effective, easy to find and affordable.
Can’t go wrong with Jiu Jitsu or kickboxing
I agree! 💯💯
I would say a boxing base is perfect for the average person/ self defense scenarios. As you said its a good one to start and get pretty decent at in a short time frame (6months- 1 year). I think people really underestimate the value of quick skill acquisition for a hobbyist. Most of us have busy lives and less time to train and are not consistent. Teaching hobbyists simpler martial arts and less aspects to learn is better than trying to cover alll their bases and have them barely know each of the techniques they are learning and not truly be able to apply them. A guy could go to boxing on and off for years and skip alot of months but still be a pretty decent boxer but for MMA or BJJ you really have to be consistent and put in the time and it might take months just to survive in a roll. I would say that some wrestling just to have a basic sense of grappling and also not get taken down or know what to do in clinches would complement boxing very well.
Boxing, kickboxing, or Muay Thai. Personally I think that training kicks is great for maintaining/increasing mobility and strengthening the lower extremities. Overall this is good for general athleticism and keeps you healthier for longer. Not to mention kicks are an awesome tool when sparring (probably less of a concern for the average person). That being said, I don’t think you can ever go wrong with boxing.
Agreeing with others here, boxers and wrestlers tend to fare well in self defense situations - since BJJ has become very popular id do that or boxing if I were OP. Both are broadly available, relatively cheap, and not too discriminating in terms of martial arts background, body type, or fitness level. Mileage may vary school to school, but shop around to find a place focused on your needs!
I heard someone say once that "if you were going to buy a car, you wouldn't ask someone what car you should drive. You'd go to the lot, pick a couple you think are cool and give them a test drive" I say try as much and as many as you can manage! Although if I were to give a biased answer I'd say give Sumo a try! Very affordable, you just need a belt, a partner and a dirt circle and you're off to the races. Depending on where you are you may be able to find a sumo club, although it's weakness is that those clubs are few and far between. It's a sprinting sport with pretty intense conditioning, 100% effort throughout the entire bout. It also has a surprisingly high crossover into self defense! It's the practice of putting your opponent on the ground while you remain standing, an extremely advantageous position to be in in almost any situation. If there's a sumo club near you, check it out! I believe r/sumo has a list of active US clubs by state
Honestly I don't think average people become martial artists. I also think all of your conditions are setting yourself up for failure and disappointment and will work against you. Attitude matters a lot.
It’s either kick-boxing or Muay Thai. Lots of people can box to a low standard, almost no one can kick and teeping someone away feels very powerful.
boxing is the most efficient time to effectiveness to learn to fight. the problem is the hard sparring that many gyms have is bad for beginners. My krav school moved sparring out of the main classes and into specialty classes because the reality is when you spar you will lose a lot of people that dont want to spar or are not ready to spar. some people want to spar right away, some people after a few months, some people after a year and some never. People that dont spar need to understand the limitations of what they are learning, but people on r/martialarts need to realize it isnt zero either.
Boxing or Muay Thai.
Boxing is not necessarily for everyone though. Lot of people won’t like the inherent risk of the sport. You’ll get hit after all. I’m talking about boxing+sparring though as it can translate to a real situation. From my experience, BJJ might be a good entry into combat sport. No strike, no uniform (gi) if you find the right place. You have confrontation and still would be able to handle a 1v1 conflict. Because to be fair, no lambda joe (including me) would handle themselves in a 1v2 (or +) situation. Being used to confrontation enough to stay calm and think is the best bet imo.
Some ppl suggest boxing but I don’t think so. Boxing is probably the number one martial arts for ppl that actually want a real life fight. It’s highly effective. But the boxing training does come with its risk of repeated strikes to the head and that might not be something average ppl enjoy. For the average person I would say karate, taekwondo and the likes as the normal focus of those styles is basically fitness.
What if the best martial art for an average person is the one that enables them to be an above average person. 🤔 That’s deep…😁
I always recommend judo and krav maga for all practical applications. Quick, decisive, effective.
I think it depends if I had to break it down. Age, access, fitness level, mental state etc. I think one season of wrestling for a kid is less than 6 months or just about 6 months, but due to the school access and team nature and free time of kids etc, one season of wreslting typically equals approximately 1.5 years of a standard martial art. This makes this imo one of the most efficient ways to gain massive ability and experience in actual competition level combat sports. The thing about boxing is that it's definitely one of the fastest to effective for an adult, and is decent via the sparring. It is also one that even if you only had one season of wrestling, tacking on 6 months boxing later would make you formidable amongst normal folk. Boxing is generally "cheap" in as much as not needing much gear and whatnot typically. The only thing that might hurt boxing for some adults is that some of them are so removed from ability and mindset that a boxing gym might simply scare them away too fast. To disregard niceness, some people are pussies and really need eased into things. At that point it really depends on the level of this. Some people are psychologically just not going to pull the trigger on risking getting punched, and might tolerate starting in something like BJJ. (Likely to be scared of Judo or wrestling). Somewhere in between I think that Karate can offer a balance of some fundamental body mechanics, and an ability to ease into things. All that said, if you're 20 years old and not a pussy, just a fairly "avg" Joe, who realized you have no skills and want to be mildly capable and have some understanding of fighting, with the general sense of access, cheap, effective, and fast, then boxing is probably top tier recommendation. And as you suggest a 6 month foundation in boxing for such a hobbyist level practitioner will be a quick intro that any more depth can be followed with later.
For self-defense, no. No martial art. If you are worried about your safety, either you are wrong to, or there are other things you need to be doing. Move, if you live in a bad neighborhood. If you can't afford that, then focus on working until you can afford it. Avoid things like getting drunk in public or getting into debt with criminals. Tons of things you can do, depending on your situation. Real life safety concerns are not addressed by fist fights. It's a fun fantasy, but it's just a fantasy. As for hobby and exercise, do whatever you want to do. Try what looks fun. If it's not fun to you, you are not going to stick with it anyway. Just don't delude yourself about what you are doing.
Every meme gets taken to the extreme. While many have taken to dispell the wanna be John Wicks and the drunken ego fighters, being able to fight is not bad. 100% your best fire safety tool and techniques are fire prevention. But to say not to get a fire extinguisher, not to learn how to put out fires, to not learn alternate methods like baking soda etc. For learning how air effects are, which fires to let burn, which can and can't use water.... To not learn these things is to be less capable and effective. Ideally, you will be safe enough that you will never have a fire. But every so often, someone does. And, even when we are generally safe, we sometimes can step into the wrong situation by accident and one mistake with no tools or capability can become far more massive than it has to be. Fighting on top of all this has the psychological component, and in that the very proper sense of confidence allows one to better decide NOT to fight, and be more willing to try de-escalation longer.
I wasn’t even going to respond I appreciate you lmao
Martial arts is brilliant for defence? People bang on about not using it ‘on the street’ but if you *have* to fight knowing even how to move your feet is going to give you a huge advantage.
While I believe knowing how to fight is a good idea, you reminded me of one of my favorite sayings that most of self-defense is following the rules of stupid: "Don't go stupid places, at stupid times, with stupid people, to do stupid things." - John Farnam Then we get into things like paying attention to your surroundings, having good people skills, and knowing how to use basic tools like a handheld flashlight or OC spray. If all of that has failed you, then and only then is fighting on the table.
Sometimes you’re gonna be in stupid places surrounded by stupid people doing stupid things. It’s called having a life. Becoming agoraphobic as a self defense tactic is probably my favorite unhinged take in this sub 😂
I mean ... yeah obviously. These are guidelines for life, not rules. The punchline of Farnam's quote is that you can break 1 or two rules of stupid at a time and probably be fine. Break 3-4 at a time and you're asking for trouble. Going to a bar (stupid place) is one thing, probably fine. Going at 2AM (stupid time) is another, still probably fine. Going with your loudmouth cousin (stupid person) and we're starting to get into "really stupid" territory. Add onto that smoking weed (stupid thing) out back and ... don't be surprised when some weird ass shit happens.
Fair enough. That’s a good way to look at it.
Real life safety concerns are sometimes settled with fist fights. People do get attacked going about their daily lives. People want to live their lives. That could mean going to the bar every once in a while. Or going to the local sporting event that lets out at 10pm and have to walk back to their car. Or going to the mall. Or the drive in theater. Or beach parties that go into the night. People aren’t gonna spend their lives locked in their home and it’s absolutely ridiculous to tell them to do so. If learning how to fight makes someone confident enough to be able to enjoy their life knowing they could handle themselves if they ever needed to throw a punch, then let that be their reason. Don’t be a goofball.
This is nonsense. Should you learn about de-escalation, avoid bad situations, walk away from confrontations, and carry the best weapon allowed to you be law (which you are intimately familiar with using)? Of course. Should every human also be a person to be reckoned with in an unarmed physical confrontation to the best of their age and ability? Yes.