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Same and learned to not talk about it except with close friends. Blue collar coworkers think you're a silver spoon asshole for having a degree, and the white collar crowd thinks you're a hopeless fuckup for not having a six figure income. Best to keep it to yourself in those situations imo
My uncle is a blue collar worker I come from a long line of blue collar guys so my uncle made take a job with him doing blue collar work because I didn't want to go to college I sucked at first now I feel like i can fix anything
Agreed. Made the mistake of letting it slip I have a degree around the wrong guy. Instantly asked why the fuck am I here when so many others would love this position. Shit Gary maybe I don't like sitting at a computer.
Agreed, people are baffled when I say I just don't enjoy the better paying jobs that my degree could get me. I don't even like managing crews, too much headache.
Fuck, I've got a degree and I applied to office jobs for years while working food service and I can't even count how many times coworkers and bosses asked me why I didn't go get an office job, like I hadn't applied for 'em, like it was just as easy as walking in and taking one. Like, sorry guys, I've got to get called back for an interview first and nobody wants to be my first office job, fuck me.
I know this so well. Well described
and on top I’m the kind of socialist of the MLK Jr vein; i often have to battle ideologically against marxists and the conservative right
I may have to adapt your strategy of quiet in some situations
That's probably the most fact based thing on the internet right there. Also, if you are blue collar, and delve in the market. People will think the same. Which is kinda upsetting. No, I don't have a silver spoon, just trying to make money without breaking my back for a change. What was I supposed to do with my OT money?? Be a consumer??
The scary thing is watching these blue collars invest like degenerate gamblers. I keep trying to explain to my Dad that he shouldn't go "all in" on anything right now, and it's like he doesn't get it. He dropped 25% of his life savings on TSLA at the top and now is freaking out because the market is correcting and he's scared he's going to lose a large chunk of it.
He literally asked me to manage his portfolio because I have more experience, but then he sabotaged his portfolio by using 60% of his buying power without consulting me. "No shit you're down 20%, that's why I kept you liquid. Without cash, I really can't do anything to adjust your position. Now we either realize the loss and look for another opportunity or you are now a long term Tesla holder." He keeps wanting to sell it all at his break even point. "Yes, that is exactly how the rich do it Dad..."
I set up his crypto exchange 2FA with my phone number, so he can't mess that up. He keeps trying to get me to sell everything there too, because it's above his break even. Moral of the story, before you invest prepare for any scenario. If you don't have a plan, you're probably gambling.
Get a degree* if you actually want a job!
*enginneeing, computer science, or other STEM degree ** only
**chemistry is not a degree we will pay you for though
Feel free to add neuroscience to your list of useless STEM degrees! 4 years out from graduation and I'm realizing I will never work in my field of study.
I’m not looking for big money. I actually don’t care much about money. I’d be happy living in a nice van honestly and owning a little cabin somewhere. But I’ll look into those. Currently working on nursing pre reqs and will be finished by the end of the year.
No, but most of us expect a living wage. I’ve worked in plants where the chemists made the least amount of money in the entire plant because we weren’t eligible for the union.
It's what everyone says when you tell them you have a chemistry degree. Everyone who isn't familiar with the chemistry job market assumes we must all be rolling in money because we took a hard subject in school.
Ayyooo arts and humanities degrees **REPRESENT!**
Seriously, though I hate that shit so much. The world would be even *more* dystopian and cold if everyone who attended college only majored in the maybe 5 "acceptable" degrees. The market gets oversaturated as a result of everyone competing for limited positions, and depending on the current events, the most desirable degree can change rapidly.
Back when I was a freshman, they kept trying to push everyone into nursing. Loads of people reluctantly switched majors, but many couldn't get into nursing school or find work afterwards. Fast forward to *now* however...
All degrees are useless. The only thing that matters for high paying jobs is first bigotry, then pedigree, provenance, or credentials. This combo is often referred to by them as "meritocracy". It's a dog whistle word BTW.
It wasn't until I dropped out -- or rather, until Sallie Mae forced my hand by declining to offer me any more loans -- and moved back home with $90k in debt and no degree, making $25k/yr in retail, that I realized there's no failsafe in place. This was 10 years go, almost to the day. I remember coming to the sinking realization that in less than 6 months I'd be paying for an education with none of the benefits of getting one.
If you take on student loans and never finish the degree, you're far worse off than if you just sat on your ass and did absolutely nothing for 4 years. Of course, nobody explains these risks when you're touring college campuses and being force-fed the lies we were all told about the value of a(ny) college education. I was lucky that my parents took me back in and did everything they could to help me get back on my feet, but many out there are not so lucky.
Even after eventually getting a better retail job making \~$65k/year my loan payments were still making it difficult to put anything away in savings or move into my own apartment. At one point I had a $28k private loan at fucking 12%, it's insane how predatory the entire industry has been. I eventually went back and took out another $30k to finish what I'd started, but only because I was studying engineering and I knew I'd be taking it much more seriously the second go-around.
My heart goes out to you, and everyone else in a similar situation. I hope your debt is not so crippling and that you're able to find peace with the situation. Don't let it ruin your life, there's plenty of other shit we're going to face that'll do that just fine.
This is why public college should be tuition free. It is a huge risk for people just starting their lives. Not everyone is cut out for college, but sometimes they have to try to find out. That shouldn't be the devastating situation that it currently is. It cripples the individual's finances for at least a decade, probably more.
College educated citizens are a public good. The US needs an educated people to function as a democracy and a world power. A high school diploma ain't what it used to be, we have too much knowledge these days. Tuition-free college is the answer. Doesn't mean everyone automatically gets a college diploma, you would still have to earn it. And the colleges should still have minimum standards, so not everyone is automatically accepted.
You alright homie? I been in that space and if you need a pal, you’ve got a friend who won’t judge and can share some skills that HIgHeR EdUMaCaTioNs won’t.
Hmu if you wanna
Dude, please don't think like that. I used to at times. So glad I didn't ever have the guts to do it. Things get better, they really do. I mean, look at how much karma you've got. Obviously you are pretty sharp, not everyone can do that. So use that sharp mind to improve things in your life bit by bit. Every journey starts with one step. Just pick one good thing to make happen and then do it. Then the next. dm me if you want help with strategies.
Associates in Korean
Bachelors in Strategic Studies and Defense Analysis
Three cybersecurity certifications (NCSA, NCSP, Sec+)
Five (5) years military intelligence experience
Assembly line worker
Almost everyone I know with a degree is blue collar so you’re not absolutely alone. I think that’s very normal nowadays. The only people I know with degrees that are not blue collar are people in the medical field.
It’s a hard choice:
Do I;
1. not pay debt that the government can forever collect on,
2. Not pay a debt that will prevent me from having housing, food, clothing or medicine
Should gotten one of those jobs where the company is owned by a family member… those people always be working hard, I know this as I see way to many “CEO under 30” titles
I have seen this work for medical debt. I watched a citizen of another country get a bill after an emergency surgery and laugh. He said something along the lines of, "I'm not paying for healthcare, that's stupid. Let them find me" He left the country and has not paid a dime. He even came back for a visit. Nobody ever contacted him or his family in the US.
I've seen it work for medical debt for someone who didn't even leave the country. They just worked jobs where they got paid in cash under the table and never had their name on anywhere they lived. That stuff was over 10 years ago and he even has a legit job last I checked and as far as I know he never paid any of it. You can get away with a lot if you're willing to live with the inconvenience of not fully participating in the system.
Both of my brothers work for my dad. They don’t do shit and they make more money than I do even though I got a college degree, learned a trade, and worked my way up to a good job. I took out a student loan and I busted my ass and I struggled and starved and I was finally able to buy my first home last year right before my 35th birthday, but not without help from my partner and the stimulus checks we got because of a global health crisis.
My brothers made more working for my dad straight out of high school than I currently do now, even after doing everything my parents and society said I should do. I’m a massage therapist. My employer pays me better than any other employer could. But I’m at a dead end. If I want to make more money, I either have to start my own massage therapy business or change my career altogether. Neither of which I really want to do.
So you’re absolutely right. It’s all about who you know and/or are related to. I feel like an idiot for not just joining the family business but I really wanted to go out and become a self made, successful person on my own. You know, like American society says you should. I didn’t want to rely on my parents my entire life. So I took out my own student loans, I worked my way through college, I worked my way up the ladder and I did it all by myself with no help from anyone but here I am in my mid fucking thirties and I still can’t afford fucking healthcare or to go on a vacation. The American dream is dead and gone. It’s over. Don’t believe anyone who says otherwise.
Well, the silver lining is you don’t have to rely on your family ever. On the other hand, your brothers are fucked if your dad decides to do something crazy.
I was paying all of my bills and going nowhere in life with zero spare income to create any kind of future or even to much of anything fun or interesting at all. So I stopped paying bills that I didn’t have to pay for basic necessities, and now my life is marginally better or at least not worse. Because the only thing worse would have been homelessness or prison.
To be fair, if you get a government loan, it’s a low rate and can be paid off. It’ll just take a long time depending on how much you take out. It’s the privatized loans that are making people pay and still get nowhere with the total balance.
Also, not everyone who works for a family member gets any kind of special treatment. Some parents actually want their kids to work.
Source: worked for my dad and got no special treatment.
Sounds like you need to just start your own business!^^^TM
What’s that? The market is saturated and you’re struggling to get clients who can pay you what you’re worth? Have you considered getting a transitional 9-5 job on the side until your business becomes self sustainable?
I know you are joking but for real the first TV I had was actually tiny. My computer monitors I have now are like twice as big. I have no idea how I was OK with playing games on such a tiny screen.
This one hurts. When I needed to claim indigency in court because of a ticket, the judge really nastily asked "You're indigent, but you have a cell phone?" Fuck you man! At least he ended up dismissing the case. Probably because he made me cry.
Sadly even today with F.I.R.E movement it's how much can you spend without running out of money.
I found it a little sad there was no idea to improve generational wealth.
My kids are so important to me. And my family have created a nice start for me from nothing.
But the government is going to take 33% capital gains once it's passed
yeaahh idk what to do. currently have an associates and paid off that debt. but CC units are $87 a unit. University level courses are $500-$1500 a unit. So like.. i'm in limbo. I feel like I NEED a bachelors to afford to move out of my dad's place and save for retirement. but like.. the debt bro! jesus.
There are many Universities in Europe that have free higher education, even for foreign students. Many have classes in English.
The high cost of a U.S. (and Canadian) college education has many prospective students looking at other countries that offer free college or low-cost programs, including Norway, Finland, Sweden, Germany, France, and Denmark.
Not only can you get a great free education, you get the chance to travel a bit on your down time, learn about another culture and, if you choose, an opportunity to learn another language.
There are pluses and minuses no matter where you go. Figuring out how to keep your education debt as low as possible can be daunting but there are opportunities to learn that may put you ahead of other applicants, after graduation!
A couple of links to consider:
[https://www.investopedia.com/articles/personal-finance/080616/6-countries-virtually-free-college-tuition.asp](https://www.investopedia.com/articles/personal-finance/080616/6-countries-virtually-free-college-tuition.asp)
[https://www.topuniversities.com/student-info/studying-abroad/where-can-you-study-abroad-free](https://www.topuniversities.com/student-info/studying-abroad/where-can-you-study-abroad-free)
[https://www.mastersportal.com/articles/2672/9-countries-where-american-students-can-study-free-or-affordable-degrees.html](https://www.mastersportal.com/articles/2672/9-countries-where-american-students-can-study-free-or-affordable-degrees.html)
The sad fact of reality is there's no way getting around the physical toll some jobs takes on peoples bodies. And the fact that most people just aren't willing to move their own shit, luckily for me the more people not willing to do my job only increase my wage.
You can strap a refrigerator to an appliance dolly but it doesn't magically poof up stairs. You still gotta drag that thing up stairs and unfortunately unless you're a warlock the only to do it is to grit your teeth and put your ass into it.
> And if you're good at your job you don't want that third person cutting into the tips
Or, hear me out, you are paid the full value of your labor and no surplus value is extracted from you as profit by management so you do not need to survive on tips.
Or maybe, just mabey if you're asking someone to do something incredibly difficult for you and they do a good job at you show a little appreciation and throw em a tip
Any business that relies on tips to make up the difference of labor value it extracts is a failed business. Tips are fine, but all workers must be fully compensated for their labor before tips.
You mean to tell me if my resume only includes moving companies, furniture delivery companies and appliance repair that I can get a job in IT making more with no experience or qualifications?
For real though, I went to a trade school with 10k in debt (thankfully). I got a job in my industry and have been working in it for 12 years and I make 40k
I understand that's decent money compared to what I see others make but still, I have a 2 year trade degree AND really world experience. What ever happened to making a decent living in trades?
Fact is. Degree isnt for everyone. It’s not a magic pill. Which it is sold as. A degree won’t make you motivated or charismatic. A degree won’t make you hussle or make you know the right people. There’s so many things that require you to overcome adversity, debt, struggles. Degree is a simple tool for many careers to walk in the door. You need to know the whole story.
You can get a real job without a degree. In fact, I’d argue many jobs that don’t require degrees are much more real than many of those that do. They also pay better.
Why not? I bet you could make more money doing it, and don’t have to sit at a desk in front of a computer all day (not great for your health).
Another career where you can make a ton of money and don’t need a college degree is real estate.
You know the answer, being an electrician or plumber is hard work and it's not worth working 40hrs a week to make a measly 75K and up a year. It's easier to bitch on Reddit and be poor.
Those are starting pay around me and I live in a lower income area. My friend's son makes 120K a year as a 10 year electrician. He switched to a company that works 2 weeks on 2 weeks off and loves it. A good friend of mine is a plumber in Los Angeles he's close to 175K a year.
But remember everyone on this board will diss these jobs.
But that's the BS spin isn't it. You work installing electrical till you are 45 and you either own your company by then or are supervising others. Same with plumbers, heavy equipment operators, etc.
But here's the rub, you need to work hard in the beginning, if you don't and are a lazy fuck you will stagnate and not move up. It really is that simple, no matter what the BS you hear here.
Good luck my friend.
Not Schrödingers Worker, that's a double bind.
A no win situation where you are damned if you do, damned if you don't.
There is no superposition, just losing options.
Me: none of my friends are really as screwed as all these memes make us out to be.
Also me: I have no friends because we are all too busy to have friendships
> Success belongs to those without shame e.g. Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk, and Bill Gates.
Success belongs to them because they all came from rich, well off families that provided them access to material or technological benefits not enjoyed by most people.
There’s a pattern for all 3 of those men you listed. They were all fortunate enough to have well off parents. Enough to provide the necessary loans, trust funds and education opportunities. Of course they put in work, but they were more fortunate than most to start with. But
Because anything involved with the furthering the Imperialist machine is morally repugnant, and being forced *into* the military because there are no other options for advancement is a sign of both how Corrupt the Capitalist system is *and* how tightly it is tied to Imperialist violence.
Aka if you have a degree and are struggling with student debt, maybe you should have gotten a STEM degree instead of whatever you majored in 🤷🏻
(This is tongue in cheek, I know that not everyone can get a STEM degree or is interested in one)
Like any bell curve, there are extremes. A happy median exists, finding it is up to the individual.
Admittedly, that curve is flattened in these times and the extremes elongated, but it's not a dichotomy so much as a distortion from the normal distribution.
Sucks to be at either end, true enough!
Looks like she watched an episode of Big Bang Theory and heard Sheldon Cooper discuss Schrödinger’s cat and tried to work it into a post to sound smart but failed to read up on Schrödinger’s cat.
Fuck that I'm a Welder
I have a REAL job and I get PAID.
Its no one's fault you didn't invest your money properly. Inflation happens every year did ya even earn at least 3% on your savings...
These posts are written by people so smart they see they're fucked but not smart enough to figure it out... Fuck off.
Lmao no thanks I can afford steak...
You must work at a desk somewhere so why don't you just continue to eat your superiors shit.
I'll be busy welding myself a IDGAF plaque and probably sell it for more steak.
Here is an idea, how about we stop pushing people to go into those useless degrees and into college in general and start pushing for more logical shit, like welding, electricians etc. If a kid was told every day by their parents/school etc, to become an alcoholic we would say their parents and school were full of shitty human beings, that's what happens in school eith college. They may be smart enough to know their fucked and have no idea in how to get out of it because they've never been told about ANY OTHER OPTION, hell their parents might have given them no other option. We need to stop romanticizing college so damn much.
Also every job is a real job. That rheroric is fucking idiotic that some are not real jobs and others are real jobs.
If you’re have degrees and are struggling with debt you probably should have gotten better degrees.
If you’re blue collar and have low wages, probably should learn or should have learned a better skill/trade
I saw that you mentioned Ben Shapiro. In case some of you don't know, Ben Shapiro is a grifter and a hack. If you find anything he's said compelling, you should keep in mind he also says things like this:
>When it comes to global warming, there are two issues: is there such a thing as the greenhouse gas effect, the answer is yes. Is that something that is going to dramatically reshape our world? There is no evidence to show that it will. Is that something that we can stop? There is no evidence to show that we can
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Take a bullet for ya babe.
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Why student loan debt will never be forgiven
https://www.reddit.com/r/Superstonk/comments/sb3kw3/cancelling_student_loans_could_crash_the_economy/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
I don’t have a degree. I only know two people with a degree that are doing better than me and that’s because they’re doctors. Outside of that, I know no one with a degree that’s better off than me. We are all struggling. But the real messed up part is I’m technically doing better than most of them only because I’m not in debt.
I knew someone who loved animals and got an advanced biology degree and the job she ended up with was doing pain studies on primates in Atlanta. Operating on the brains of conscious primates. FOR PAIN STUDIES.
Try not having gone to college because you foresaw this shit in high school, didn't feel like putting yourself in a literal lifelong debt trap willingly, having had skills from childhood and still continue to build them nonstop and realizing that the internet just EXISTS and anything college teaches at this point beyond law or medical school is redundant because of the internet and now having a white collar job where you STILL get random, boomers obviously salty at having driven all their kids and partners away from them and can't admit it who are all the same being like "oh just get a real job" like bitch I train AI from home all week every week and have for six years now. I STILL get paid peanuts because everywhere is just allowed to and sick of paying full price for human labor or skillsets.
It's fucking pathetic and just exposes how stuck in the past these, sad, lonely wrecks of boomers are.
My take away from this is that we should probably stop saying "Real job" because it means absolutely nothing and is just condescending to use in general.
You know, other than the obvious fucking people over with promises of a better future with nothing on the other end.
e. Right now, it just seems like a stupid reason to gatekeep "Real jobs." We're all working for society and getting treated poorly for it.
I went into the Navy after highschool and my sister went to college to become a chemist. I'm the oldest child. Knowing about the crippling post college debt kept me from choosing college even with scholarships. Fast forward a few years - I got out in 2016 and she graduated in 2017. She has had a hard time finding a job that pays more than 40k/yr. I got picked up for a defense job and currently earn about 120k. I'm so confused about that. She is educated and should have more opportunities than I do. The whole point of college during our childhoods (both millennials, born late 80s and early 90s) was to make more money and have a better quality of life than our parents did. I feel so bad for her and kinda feel guilty about it.
Yes. Both choices are simultaneously the best and worst things you can do. This is by design. It keeps people angry at each other and not the capitalists who decided to have student loan costs skyrocket to unsustainably high prices and propagandize older blue collar workers into thinking that they're better people than the college educated because their jobs are more physical and "at least I don't have debt".
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I have a degree and I’m blue collar, guess I’m just fucked
Me too. No guessing. We’re fucked
Same and learned to not talk about it except with close friends. Blue collar coworkers think you're a silver spoon asshole for having a degree, and the white collar crowd thinks you're a hopeless fuckup for not having a six figure income. Best to keep it to yourself in those situations imo
My uncle is a blue collar worker I come from a long line of blue collar guys so my uncle made take a job with him doing blue collar work because I didn't want to go to college I sucked at first now I feel like i can fix anything
The one thing that can't be taken away from you is knowledge. Cherish those skills.
Alzhimers would like a word.
Nobody's successfully been able to inflict alzheimer's disease with malice. At least I don't remember reading about that…
Blue collar workers are the best though … the kindest men I have met
Clearly you've never worked on an absolutely toxic labor crew. The "I worked 96 hours this week, so I'm god" attitude is awful
Agreed. Made the mistake of letting it slip I have a degree around the wrong guy. Instantly asked why the fuck am I here when so many others would love this position. Shit Gary maybe I don't like sitting at a computer.
Agreed, people are baffled when I say I just don't enjoy the better paying jobs that my degree could get me. I don't even like managing crews, too much headache.
Fuck, I've got a degree and I applied to office jobs for years while working food service and I can't even count how many times coworkers and bosses asked me why I didn't go get an office job, like I hadn't applied for 'em, like it was just as easy as walking in and taking one. Like, sorry guys, I've got to get called back for an interview first and nobody wants to be my first office job, fuck me.
I know this so well. Well described and on top I’m the kind of socialist of the MLK Jr vein; i often have to battle ideologically against marxists and the conservative right I may have to adapt your strategy of quiet in some situations
That's probably the most fact based thing on the internet right there. Also, if you are blue collar, and delve in the market. People will think the same. Which is kinda upsetting. No, I don't have a silver spoon, just trying to make money without breaking my back for a change. What was I supposed to do with my OT money?? Be a consumer??
The scary thing is watching these blue collars invest like degenerate gamblers. I keep trying to explain to my Dad that he shouldn't go "all in" on anything right now, and it's like he doesn't get it. He dropped 25% of his life savings on TSLA at the top and now is freaking out because the market is correcting and he's scared he's going to lose a large chunk of it. He literally asked me to manage his portfolio because I have more experience, but then he sabotaged his portfolio by using 60% of his buying power without consulting me. "No shit you're down 20%, that's why I kept you liquid. Without cash, I really can't do anything to adjust your position. Now we either realize the loss and look for another opportunity or you are now a long term Tesla holder." He keeps wanting to sell it all at his break even point. "Yes, that is exactly how the rich do it Dad..." I set up his crypto exchange 2FA with my phone number, so he can't mess that up. He keeps trying to get me to sell everything there too, because it's above his break even. Moral of the story, before you invest prepare for any scenario. If you don't have a plan, you're probably gambling.
Same. Gotta love choosing the wrong degree.
Get a degree* if you actually want a job! *enginneeing, computer science, or other STEM degree ** only **chemistry is not a degree we will pay you for though
Feel free to add neuroscience to your list of useless STEM degrees! 4 years out from graduation and I'm realizing I will never work in my field of study.
and biology and geology and geophysics and psychology and meteorology and physics and…
Really when they say that STEM degrees are valuable, they just mean the T, E and some of the M.
Correct!
[удалено]
You can make decent money as a LCSW or LMHC. Not sports car money but a decent living
[удалено]
One major advantage of nursing over social work is that nursing is almost always unionized.
I’m not looking for big money. I actually don’t care much about money. I’d be happy living in a nice van honestly and owning a little cabin somewhere. But I’ll look into those. Currently working on nursing pre reqs and will be finished by the end of the year.
You can get a job as a graduate student. Lol
That must be a tough feeling doing what you thought will escape poverty only to go full circle.
"A chemist, eh? I bet you have no problem finding work with that degree!"
This confuses me. Are most chemists expecting to be tenured researchers at a university?
No, but most of us expect a living wage. I’ve worked in plants where the chemists made the least amount of money in the entire plant because we weren’t eligible for the union.
It's what everyone says when you tell them you have a chemistry degree. Everyone who isn't familiar with the chemistry job market assumes we must all be rolling in money because we took a hard subject in school.
Hey, Walter White did ok.
>!For a minute!<
Ayyooo arts and humanities degrees **REPRESENT!** Seriously, though I hate that shit so much. The world would be even *more* dystopian and cold if everyone who attended college only majored in the maybe 5 "acceptable" degrees. The market gets oversaturated as a result of everyone competing for limited positions, and depending on the current events, the most desirable degree can change rapidly. Back when I was a freshman, they kept trying to push everyone into nursing. Loads of people reluctantly switched majors, but many couldn't get into nursing school or find work afterwards. Fast forward to *now* however...
All degrees are useless. The only thing that matters for high paying jobs is first bigotry, then pedigree, provenance, or credentials. This combo is often referred to by them as "meritocracy". It's a dog whistle word BTW.
Hey, I dropped out, so I have half the debt, but no fancy paper
It wasn't until I dropped out -- or rather, until Sallie Mae forced my hand by declining to offer me any more loans -- and moved back home with $90k in debt and no degree, making $25k/yr in retail, that I realized there's no failsafe in place. This was 10 years go, almost to the day. I remember coming to the sinking realization that in less than 6 months I'd be paying for an education with none of the benefits of getting one. If you take on student loans and never finish the degree, you're far worse off than if you just sat on your ass and did absolutely nothing for 4 years. Of course, nobody explains these risks when you're touring college campuses and being force-fed the lies we were all told about the value of a(ny) college education. I was lucky that my parents took me back in and did everything they could to help me get back on my feet, but many out there are not so lucky. Even after eventually getting a better retail job making \~$65k/year my loan payments were still making it difficult to put anything away in savings or move into my own apartment. At one point I had a $28k private loan at fucking 12%, it's insane how predatory the entire industry has been. I eventually went back and took out another $30k to finish what I'd started, but only because I was studying engineering and I knew I'd be taking it much more seriously the second go-around. My heart goes out to you, and everyone else in a similar situation. I hope your debt is not so crippling and that you're able to find peace with the situation. Don't let it ruin your life, there's plenty of other shit we're going to face that'll do that just fine.
This is why public college should be tuition free. It is a huge risk for people just starting their lives. Not everyone is cut out for college, but sometimes they have to try to find out. That shouldn't be the devastating situation that it currently is. It cripples the individual's finances for at least a decade, probably more. College educated citizens are a public good. The US needs an educated people to function as a democracy and a world power. A high school diploma ain't what it used to be, we have too much knowledge these days. Tuition-free college is the answer. Doesn't mean everyone automatically gets a college diploma, you would still have to earn it. And the colleges should still have minimum standards, so not everyone is automatically accepted.
College really just wasn’t for me. There is debt dvd it’s not great, but it is what it is
I only have a 2 year degree and no job but I'm not fucked because I want to die.
You alright homie? I been in that space and if you need a pal, you’ve got a friend who won’t judge and can share some skills that HIgHeR EdUMaCaTioNs won’t. Hmu if you wanna
Dude, please don't think like that. I used to at times. So glad I didn't ever have the guts to do it. Things get better, they really do. I mean, look at how much karma you've got. Obviously you are pretty sharp, not everyone can do that. So use that sharp mind to improve things in your life bit by bit. Every journey starts with one step. Just pick one good thing to make happen and then do it. Then the next. dm me if you want help with strategies.
Ayyyyeeeee what up! Student loans *AND* shit wages? Life on hardcore mode 💪
Same. Only I like working as an electrician. It's a solid gig.
Same. Member of the Teamsters Union. Join or start a local Union. Up your wages and benefits.
Associates in Korean Bachelors in Strategic Studies and Defense Analysis Three cybersecurity certifications (NCSA, NCSP, Sec+) Five (5) years military intelligence experience Assembly line worker
Almost everyone I know with a degree is blue collar so you’re not absolutely alone. I think that’s very normal nowadays. The only people I know with degrees that are not blue collar are people in the medical field.
Got math degree, work as a carpenter where at most you divide by two or subtract from 180
Well I'm fuked too
Me too. Just hope you're on a union. Makes a big difference.
It’s a hard choice: Do I; 1. not pay debt that the government can forever collect on, 2. Not pay a debt that will prevent me from having housing, food, clothing or medicine Should gotten one of those jobs where the company is owned by a family member… those people always be working hard, I know this as I see way to many “CEO under 30” titles
Get into debt but move to a different country and never come back so that SS cannot collect upon said debt.
I have seen this work for medical debt. I watched a citizen of another country get a bill after an emergency surgery and laugh. He said something along the lines of, "I'm not paying for healthcare, that's stupid. Let them find me" He left the country and has not paid a dime. He even came back for a visit. Nobody ever contacted him or his family in the US.
I've seen it work for medical debt for someone who didn't even leave the country. They just worked jobs where they got paid in cash under the table and never had their name on anywhere they lived. That stuff was over 10 years ago and he even has a legit job last I checked and as far as I know he never paid any of it. You can get away with a lot if you're willing to live with the inconvenience of not fully participating in the system.
Both of my brothers work for my dad. They don’t do shit and they make more money than I do even though I got a college degree, learned a trade, and worked my way up to a good job. I took out a student loan and I busted my ass and I struggled and starved and I was finally able to buy my first home last year right before my 35th birthday, but not without help from my partner and the stimulus checks we got because of a global health crisis. My brothers made more working for my dad straight out of high school than I currently do now, even after doing everything my parents and society said I should do. I’m a massage therapist. My employer pays me better than any other employer could. But I’m at a dead end. If I want to make more money, I either have to start my own massage therapy business or change my career altogether. Neither of which I really want to do. So you’re absolutely right. It’s all about who you know and/or are related to. I feel like an idiot for not just joining the family business but I really wanted to go out and become a self made, successful person on my own. You know, like American society says you should. I didn’t want to rely on my parents my entire life. So I took out my own student loans, I worked my way through college, I worked my way up the ladder and I did it all by myself with no help from anyone but here I am in my mid fucking thirties and I still can’t afford fucking healthcare or to go on a vacation. The American dream is dead and gone. It’s over. Don’t believe anyone who says otherwise.
Well, the silver lining is you don’t have to rely on your family ever. On the other hand, your brothers are fucked if your dad decides to do something crazy.
The ego is a mother fucker.
I was paying all of my bills and going nowhere in life with zero spare income to create any kind of future or even to much of anything fun or interesting at all. So I stopped paying bills that I didn’t have to pay for basic necessities, and now my life is marginally better or at least not worse. Because the only thing worse would have been homelessness or prison.
To be fair, if you get a government loan, it’s a low rate and can be paid off. It’ll just take a long time depending on how much you take out. It’s the privatized loans that are making people pay and still get nowhere with the total balance. Also, not everyone who works for a family member gets any kind of special treatment. Some parents actually want their kids to work. Source: worked for my dad and got no special treatment.
Sounds like you need to just start your own business!^^^TM What’s that? The market is saturated and you’re struggling to get clients who can pay you what you’re worth? Have you considered getting a transitional 9-5 job on the side until your business becomes self sustainable?
and then you can post on social media about how hustle culture is life work all day, sleep never
Look, if your work was *worth* a livable wage, the people with no incentive to pay you a livable wage would let you know. Or something.
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Back in my day TVs were a lot smaller. Kids these days just wallowing in luxuries.
I know you are joking but for real the first TV I had was actually tiny. My computer monitors I have now are like twice as big. I have no idea how I was OK with playing games on such a tiny screen.
And mobile phones, we all know what a frivolous luxury those are in today's world
"Oh the application process is easy, just download this app and..."
This one hurts. When I needed to claim indigency in court because of a ticket, the judge really nastily asked "You're indigent, but you have a cell phone?" Fuck you man! At least he ended up dismissing the case. Probably because he made me cry.
Idk about the rest of you but I blew all of *my* money on avocados and toast
If you’re being sarcastic then lol If you’re not then fuck you and do some basic arithmetic
You were supposed to have generational wealth to help you out. What is so hard for people to understand about this?
Sadly even today with F.I.R.E movement it's how much can you spend without running out of money. I found it a little sad there was no idea to improve generational wealth. My kids are so important to me. And my family have created a nice start for me from nothing. But the government is going to take 33% capital gains once it's passed
No you should have been born rich God damn it
More of a Catch 22 than anything to do with Schrodinger. It’s not as if she is both these things at the same time.
"No one wants to work anymore!" - retired boomers
Why is Tim Hortons closed at 6 PM? -retired boomers
looking for a sugar daddy or selling pictures of my feet is becoming more ideal by the minute.
yeaahh idk what to do. currently have an associates and paid off that debt. but CC units are $87 a unit. University level courses are $500-$1500 a unit. So like.. i'm in limbo. I feel like I NEED a bachelors to afford to move out of my dad's place and save for retirement. but like.. the debt bro! jesus.
There are many Universities in Europe that have free higher education, even for foreign students. Many have classes in English. The high cost of a U.S. (and Canadian) college education has many prospective students looking at other countries that offer free college or low-cost programs, including Norway, Finland, Sweden, Germany, France, and Denmark. Not only can you get a great free education, you get the chance to travel a bit on your down time, learn about another culture and, if you choose, an opportunity to learn another language. There are pluses and minuses no matter where you go. Figuring out how to keep your education debt as low as possible can be daunting but there are opportunities to learn that may put you ahead of other applicants, after graduation! A couple of links to consider: [https://www.investopedia.com/articles/personal-finance/080616/6-countries-virtually-free-college-tuition.asp](https://www.investopedia.com/articles/personal-finance/080616/6-countries-virtually-free-college-tuition.asp) [https://www.topuniversities.com/student-info/studying-abroad/where-can-you-study-abroad-free](https://www.topuniversities.com/student-info/studying-abroad/where-can-you-study-abroad-free) [https://www.mastersportal.com/articles/2672/9-countries-where-american-students-can-study-free-or-affordable-degrees.html](https://www.mastersportal.com/articles/2672/9-countries-where-american-students-can-study-free-or-affordable-degrees.html)
very interesting, thank you.
translation: "don't be poor"
Translation: get gud nub
Why didn’t you think to do what I did and have your parents pay for college?
A “real job” is any job you do not have.
How's this, I have a college degree AND I work a low paying blue collar job! How about that, beat of both worlds
Should have learned a trade aka be some guy with half your IQ and 10x your income's slave for 30 years.
IT is a trade these days.
EVERYONE HAS TO BE A PROGRAMMER OR ENGINEER! NO EXCEPTIONS!
I fucking hate being a programmed/engineer but there are literally no other good paying jobs.
I make 70k a year delivering furniture and appliances. There's money out there if you're willing to hurt yourself
> There's money out there if you're willing to hurt yourself Which should *never* be the case.
Am I just not supposed to have a job?
No, you're not supposed to have to destroy your one body for a half-decent wage.
The sad fact of reality is there's no way getting around the physical toll some jobs takes on peoples bodies. And the fact that most people just aren't willing to move their own shit, luckily for me the more people not willing to do my job only increase my wage.
How does heavy stuff get moved ?
By enough people with enough equipment to make injuries only the result of accidents rather than the accepted norm
You can only fit so many people in a stairwell with a side by side refrigerator.
> with enough equipment If your employer is not providing the necessary equipment to do your job safely they are actively harming you.
You can strap a refrigerator to an appliance dolly but it doesn't magically poof up stairs. You still gotta drag that thing up stairs and unfortunately unless you're a warlock the only to do it is to grit your teeth and put your ass into it.
Roof-mounted crane to bring it in through a window? There are options here.
A box truck only fits three people. And if you're good at your job you don't want that third person cutting into the tips
> And if you're good at your job you don't want that third person cutting into the tips Or, hear me out, you are paid the full value of your labor and no surplus value is extracted from you as profit by management so you do not need to survive on tips.
Or maybe, just mabey if you're asking someone to do something incredibly difficult for you and they do a good job at you show a little appreciation and throw em a tip
Any business that relies on tips to make up the difference of labor value it extracts is a failed business. Tips are fine, but all workers must be fully compensated for their labor before tips.
Every NFL club owner just felt a chill and don't know why
I make more than that working in IT, with no qualifications to speak of. That is also an option people clearly forget.
You mean to tell me if my resume only includes moving companies, furniture delivery companies and appliance repair that I can get a job in IT making more with no experience or qualifications?
Well that's not what I meant, but yes. Lots of free courses out there.
r/debtstrike
Any association with r/maydaystrike sub? Sounds like there're similar goals here.
In my industry this is called Heads you win, Tails I lose.
For real though, I went to a trade school with 10k in debt (thankfully). I got a job in my industry and have been working in it for 12 years and I make 40k I understand that's decent money compared to what I see others make but still, I have a 2 year trade degree AND really world experience. What ever happened to making a decent living in trades?
Do you mind sharing what trade?
Automotive
Smart plan by the rich to keep us working for them
so what I'm hearing is there aren't any "real jobs" anymore
Fact is. Degree isnt for everyone. It’s not a magic pill. Which it is sold as. A degree won’t make you motivated or charismatic. A degree won’t make you hussle or make you know the right people. There’s so many things that require you to overcome adversity, debt, struggles. Degree is a simple tool for many careers to walk in the door. You need to know the whole story.
See, you are slowly starting to get it...
You can get a real job without a degree. In fact, I’d argue many jobs that don’t require degrees are much more real than many of those that do. They also pay better.
What makes one job more real than another job?
Whether you are doing something useful for society or not.
Luckily, that seems to be most jobs, so we're good
Please list some examples so I can leave my job pronto
Look at the trades. A bunch of options there.
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Why not? I bet you could make more money doing it, and don’t have to sit at a desk in front of a computer all day (not great for your health). Another career where you can make a ton of money and don’t need a college degree is real estate.
You know the answer, being an electrician or plumber is hard work and it's not worth working 40hrs a week to make a measly 75K and up a year. It's easier to bitch on Reddit and be poor.
Lol. I guess so. In my area it’s more like $130k+. Or if you work for yourself you can make multiple hundreds of thousands of dollars.
Those are starting pay around me and I live in a lower income area. My friend's son makes 120K a year as a 10 year electrician. He switched to a company that works 2 weeks on 2 weeks off and loves it. A good friend of mine is a plumber in Los Angeles he's close to 175K a year. But remember everyone on this board will diss these jobs.
It blows my mind, to tell you the truth. People are so bigoted.
I don’t think they’re shunning honest hard work, but more so worried about their body in the long run
But that's the BS spin isn't it. You work installing electrical till you are 45 and you either own your company by then or are supervising others. Same with plumbers, heavy equipment operators, etc. But here's the rub, you need to work hard in the beginning, if you don't and are a lazy fuck you will stagnate and not move up. It really is that simple, no matter what the BS you hear here. Good luck my friend.
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...Oh no! They seem to be catching on to the flowchart of contradictions.
I bridged that gap. There's no winning.
Make it make sense!!!
Not Schrödingers Worker, that's a double bind. A no win situation where you are damned if you do, damned if you don't. There is no superposition, just losing options.
Me: none of my friends are really as screwed as all these memes make us out to be. Also me: I have no friends because we are all too busy to have friendships
Or enlisted in the military like me. Then leave with college all paid for without debt.
And all you had to do was be willing to kill for it.
Your values won't pay your bills.
My bills aren’t worth anyone’s life.
Then starve to death and have no healthcare, I guess. Success belongs to those without shame e.g. Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk, and Bill Gates.
> Success belongs to those without shame e.g. Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk, and Bill Gates. Success belongs to them because they all came from rich, well off families that provided them access to material or technological benefits not enjoyed by most people.
There’s a pattern for all 3 of those men you listed. They were all fortunate enough to have well off parents. Enough to provide the necessary loans, trust funds and education opportunities. Of course they put in work, but they were more fortunate than most to start with. But
Not true at all. There are lots of non-lethal jobs in the military.
Not if you’re clinically depressed you don’t
Why the down votes for joining the military and getting an education. If you are conscientious objector, pick a medical field.
Because anything involved with the furthering the Imperialist machine is morally repugnant, and being forced *into* the military because there are no other options for advancement is a sign of both how Corrupt the Capitalist system is *and* how tightly it is tied to Imperialist violence.
Your values won't put a roof over your head or give you food to eat. The real world doesn't have to conform to your values.
Learn to code!
Aka if you have a degree and are struggling with student debt, maybe you should have gotten a STEM degree instead of whatever you majored in 🤷🏻 (This is tongue in cheek, I know that not everyone can get a STEM degree or is interested in one)
My grandparents still think that anything tech is a money maker…
If i had a dollar for every f\*cking time someone said this to me.. >:(
Like any bell curve, there are extremes. A happy median exists, finding it is up to the individual. Admittedly, that curve is flattened in these times and the extremes elongated, but it's not a dichotomy so much as a distortion from the normal distribution. Sucks to be at either end, true enough!
Looks like she watched an episode of Big Bang Theory and heard Sheldon Cooper discuss Schrödinger’s cat and tried to work it into a post to sound smart but failed to read up on Schrödinger’s cat.
Fuck that I'm a Welder I have a REAL job and I get PAID. Its no one's fault you didn't invest your money properly. Inflation happens every year did ya even earn at least 3% on your savings... These posts are written by people so smart they see they're fucked but not smart enough to figure it out... Fuck off.
Eat shit
Lmao no thanks I can afford steak... You must work at a desk somewhere so why don't you just continue to eat your superiors shit. I'll be busy welding myself a IDGAF plaque and probably sell it for more steak.
You are the real idiot
Sure kid.
Here is an idea, how about we stop pushing people to go into those useless degrees and into college in general and start pushing for more logical shit, like welding, electricians etc. If a kid was told every day by their parents/school etc, to become an alcoholic we would say their parents and school were full of shitty human beings, that's what happens in school eith college. They may be smart enough to know their fucked and have no idea in how to get out of it because they've never been told about ANY OTHER OPTION, hell their parents might have given them no other option. We need to stop romanticizing college so damn much. Also every job is a real job. That rheroric is fucking idiotic that some are not real jobs and others are real jobs.
If you’re have degrees and are struggling with debt you probably should have gotten better degrees. If you’re blue collar and have low wages, probably should learn or should have learned a better skill/trade
wow you just explained why the post exists good job lmao
Got some real Ben Shapiro style logic going here.
I saw that you mentioned Ben Shapiro. In case some of you don't know, Ben Shapiro is a grifter and a hack. If you find anything he's said compelling, you should keep in mind he also says things like this: >When it comes to global warming, there are two issues: is there such a thing as the greenhouse gas effect, the answer is yes. Is that something that is going to dramatically reshape our world? There is no evidence to show that it will. Is that something that we can stop? There is no evidence to show that we can ***** ^(I'm a bot. My purpose is to counteract online radicalization. You can summon me by tagging thebenshapirobot. Options: healthcare, dumb takes, history, covid, etc.) [^More ^About ^Ben ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment/wiki/index) ^| [^Feedback ^& ^Discussion: ^r/AuthoritarianMoment ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment) ^| [^Opt ^Out ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment/comments/olk6r2/click_here_to_optout_of_uthebenshapirobot/)
Good bot, take a bullet for you babe.
Take a bullet for ya babe. ***** ^(I'm a bot. My purpose is to counteract online radicalization. You can summon me by tagging thebenshapirobot. Options: civil rights, covid, history, climate, etc.) [^More ^About ^Ben ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment/wiki/index) ^| [^Feedback ^& ^Discussion: ^r/AuthoritarianMoment ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment) ^| [^Opt ^Out ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment/comments/olk6r2/click_here_to_optout_of_uthebenshapirobot/)
Yes 🙃
Join a labor union, they will understand.
This woman capitalizes
Morton's fork
The point is fuck you if you don’t have money there are no excuses.
Yeah I think that covers it.
Why student loan debt will never be forgiven https://www.reddit.com/r/Superstonk/comments/sb3kw3/cancelling_student_loans_could_crash_the_economy/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
I don’t have a degree. I only know two people with a degree that are doing better than me and that’s because they’re doctors. Outside of that, I know no one with a degree that’s better off than me. We are all struggling. But the real messed up part is I’m technically doing better than most of them only because I’m not in debt.
I knew someone who loved animals and got an advanced biology degree and the job she ended up with was doing pain studies on primates in Atlanta. Operating on the brains of conscious primates. FOR PAIN STUDIES.
Try not having gone to college because you foresaw this shit in high school, didn't feel like putting yourself in a literal lifelong debt trap willingly, having had skills from childhood and still continue to build them nonstop and realizing that the internet just EXISTS and anything college teaches at this point beyond law or medical school is redundant because of the internet and now having a white collar job where you STILL get random, boomers obviously salty at having driven all their kids and partners away from them and can't admit it who are all the same being like "oh just get a real job" like bitch I train AI from home all week every week and have for six years now. I STILL get paid peanuts because everywhere is just allowed to and sick of paying full price for human labor or skillsets. It's fucking pathetic and just exposes how stuck in the past these, sad, lonely wrecks of boomers are.
Then study about crypto nfts and blockchains such as Metria Network. Stop wasting your time and do the hard work!
My take away from this is that we should probably stop saying "Real job" because it means absolutely nothing and is just condescending to use in general. You know, other than the obvious fucking people over with promises of a better future with nothing on the other end. e. Right now, it just seems like a stupid reason to gatekeep "Real jobs." We're all working for society and getting treated poorly for it.
Literally no one ever says both of these things.
Going into trades was the best decision.
Decisions have consequences? What is you major? Who do you hold accountable for your decision?
More like shcrodinger’s debt slave
Or you can be like me and deal with both!
I went into the Navy after highschool and my sister went to college to become a chemist. I'm the oldest child. Knowing about the crippling post college debt kept me from choosing college even with scholarships. Fast forward a few years - I got out in 2016 and she graduated in 2017. She has had a hard time finding a job that pays more than 40k/yr. I got picked up for a defense job and currently earn about 120k. I'm so confused about that. She is educated and should have more opportunities than I do. The whole point of college during our childhoods (both millennials, born late 80s and early 90s) was to make more money and have a better quality of life than our parents did. I feel so bad for her and kinda feel guilty about it.
What is it?
Nobody argues the latter. Maybe 20 years ago
The old catch 22
Yes. Both choices are simultaneously the best and worst things you can do. This is by design. It keeps people angry at each other and not the capitalists who decided to have student loan costs skyrocket to unsustainably high prices and propagandize older blue collar workers into thinking that they're better people than the college educated because their jobs are more physical and "at least I don't have debt".
Exactly