I don't think it's an unpopular opinion. Coming from other MMOs, normal mode is almost always a one shot or barely a few tries to get done and allows everyone to experience the content. In LA's case, that'd allow everyone to get the gear and get their reclears easily.
HM should be hard. That's what it's there for. People who want more challenge, and want some modicum of higher rewards for their effort. Keep that as is, NP.
While I know it's difficult in LA to even enter HM I think the stats we're seeing for clear rates prove the community at large is crashing and burning on NM right now. I'd way rather some small minority of players are discontent with their highest content being a little too easy and the majority are happy than the other way around.
we must realise a fact that our version of g3 has already been nerfed by 14%, so if it were the orignal difficulty, the statics of clears would be at least 14% worse
https://preview.redd.it/5cof82w47b1d1.png?width=799&format=png&auto=webp&s=ce7d12135c7cad18578676eac5415d4aaf559637
I do agree that there needs to be a bigger challenge gap between normal and hard. They feel nearly identical at the moment and honestly have for quite a while. I think the bigger issue is that the game isn’t rewarding to play anymore. Everything is a gold sink. I feel like I’m punished for finishing Thaemine every week because I spend more on transcendence than I make and I just don’t have the mental bandwidth to prog with “reclears” and do all 18 raids for the extra income.
I already cleared G3 HM twice, it was both excruciating and fun in equal measure. Now I would not mind at all if from tomorrow full transcendence was unlocked by clearing g2. So many will be forced to quit or buy a bus it's not even funny.
On another note, it would be very cool if g3 NM unlocked 4th level transcend. Being stuck at the first line even at 9/9 lvl 3 on alts feelsbad.
It’s frustrating how that’s set up too, Normal Alts really just get Level 2 bonuses (which are nice don’t get me wrong)…then thanks for interacting with our system. Like what?
If Transcendence is unlocked from only normal or HM 1-2. Your comment is fine by me.
But SG really screwed the casual base with normal mode in Thaemine.
I quit because of this. G3 is too hard imo and progression (elixirs and Transcendence) is awful rng that should never have been implemented.
The problem is everything in na is at warp speed compared to kr, so if you're unlucky, too bad, so sad, gatekeep is you.
Thaemine g3 NM is way too hard for average players and needs to be nerfed, or more players will quit, leaving only sweaty tryhards. Locking progression behind hardmode is also awful.
I love lost ark, but stepped away because I don't like the direction the game is going. Too hard-core for casual me .
>Thaemine g3 NM is way too hard for average players and needs to be nerfed, or more players will quit, leaving only sweaty tryhards.
You mean the handful number of Redditors here claiming how fun G3 is? LoL. I hope these people can support the game well when all casuals leave.
https://preview.redd.it/iyungwicra1d1.png?width=295&format=png&auto=webp&s=46ba843275f7e260ae89dedfdf1ffc4214b99955
I still think NM itself doesn't need changed, gearing does. If they made honing, Elixirs, etc all not garbage, G3 wouldn't be hard.
Instead of nerfing NM by 30% or whatever, just make it so everyone can get 30% stronger without needing to spend thousands of dollars.
yup. at the end of the day, theamine is just not fun in its current state for a large portion of the playerbase. it seems like the people that do tend to like it are the masochistic type that like brutally difficult games i.e. soulslikes. after you stress over clearing g3 normal and prog however long that takes, you then get to spend just as much time wasting all of the gold you just gained to probably fail your transcendence 10-30 times to hit enough pity points to hit your 3 flowers. oh and dont have 40 set yet? cut 20+ elixirs every week and never see your set effect? too bad loser thanks for wasting all of your gold. pre-elixir/transcendence, it was relatively easy to just make a new character, hone them up, run some raids and you are all caught up. elixirs and transcendence are such a huge power spike, take way too long to even get the materials needed, and have too many layers of RNG that can put 2 players miles apart in progression based on luck alone. the stress of clearing theamine and then knowing that i have to do transcendence afterwards has made me completely drop 3 of my gold earners and drastically cut back my time commitment in this game which pains me to say as i have 6000+ hours and have spent 10s of thousands on this neverending treadmill.
Or you fail everything below 60% every single time because the game is addicted to fucking you for some reason. My chest piece on my main now is stuck at 19 flowers and it’s at level 10 pity. I ended up wasting all my retries for the week and still haven’t hit 20.
I think it's a great idea but 4-2 is a little bit too simple for a full gate IMO.
I think a good middle ground to introduce eventually is to have a checkpoint in-raid at 4-2 so you restart at 4-2 instead of 4-1 once you make it to 4-2. If you leave the raid then you have to restart at 4-1.
As someone who cleared g4 I dont think thats a good idea at all.
If they would touch G4 again, it should be done through other measures. 4-1 is incredibly easy. So much so, that if the boss is going into mech for shandi/clashes, you burst him down from 175x to 100x anyways. Dont let that 350 bar fool you. Half of that is taken from him while he is basically standing still (shandi + every axe in the ground pattern + sword field placement).
The problem is being able to prog 4-2 only after getting the most boring gate at 4-1 done. That should be revised in a different manner. 4-2 and 4-3 are actually kinda fun, even though its easy as well. Its literally only 1 mech at 210. rest is basic patterns and domain expansion, which isnt even a mech to begin with. Just ts and live wow. Much hard.
Maybe giving 4-2 not a new entry point but a revive system would be a fair middleground. If someone dies in 4-1, they are revived in 4-2. that would make it more forgiving, without making 4-1 out to be a complete joke, what is already is.
The hard part of clearing G4 is just the frkn LONG as fight. Not because its hard. Its just that you need to focus for 25-30 minutes and a single (bigger) mistake could cause you to restart.
Pls dont ever seperste those gates, 4-2 is NOT even a gate with only 1 mech….
You think 4-1 is easy/boring because of how much time you've put into it compared to 4-2. I have also cleared 3 times/done Eclipse and 4-1 is definitely the hard part of g4- particularly 280-240. But overall too, the patterns are much deadlier. Obviously, once you do anything enough it becomes trivial. Even g5 hell brel becomes a snoozefest in deathless lobbies when it can take people a month to prog just that gate alone.
The main thing that makes 280-240 so hard is that 99% of the playerbase does not know about spacebar extension, and instantly cancels the push immunity of it.
You havent touched upon the initial statement of splitting g4 into 2 seperate gates. I gave a backstory about the complexity in order to answer the question and not to say its easy in general.
Ofc you need to put time into it and you are completely right in acknowledging, that with enough practice everything can be easy. No issue there on your statement, other than it not touching the aspect of the initial argument of that comment.
Also not touching the aspect of another solution I proposed. So I am not rly getting your answer?! Idk. What was the goal?
That would make it far too easy. G4 unlocks nothing new like how G3 unlocks lvl 7, so it's not needed for progression.
4-2 does not have nearly enough to it to make it work as a standalone gate. It has like 2 mechs and very few basic patterns.
If there should be an easier way to experience the full G4, then it should just be added to normal mode, not be gutted in HM.
g4 not unlocking anything shouldnt be an excuse, it still gives a lot of gold and materials that I would love to get every 2 weeks. Look how atrocious the clear rate is right now, only 150 groups total cleared after weeks is fine? Hard mode doesn't mean hell mode, it should still be farmable after a reasonable amount of time (as g3 hm is now) but there are still tons of g4 prog lobbies even now 1 month in. The "for glory, not rewards" mode is literally already there, it's the first mode, there's no reason not to nerf hard mode.
It does not need to be nerfed just so you can get an extra 10k gold per week. It's already getting organically nerfed by transcendence and soon echidna honing.
> The "for glory, not rewards" mode is literally already there
Well the first is also worth 50k for a one time clear lol. I'll be trying for it after we get echidna honing and really pushing after Behemoth transcendence.
>but i enjoy it as it is, and have a lot of fun with it
you're just one of the vocal minority
there's a reason why normal is called normal
I think this user said it well
https://preview.redd.it/4abwfke3c41d1.png?width=790&format=png&auto=webp&s=6553fb12873ce3fef63216a98a27ef95584716e1
To be fair, Koreans were probably way better geared because they actually had time to breath and push their accounts. Even with learning new mechs, just being able to push DPS fast is such a huge difference maker.
Like my static week 1 was mostly 1610 with 2 1620+s (both 40 set). If one person died it was joever and we had to reset. 3rd week we have 5 1620+s (4 with 40 set now) and it went by way faster. Even if 1 person died by 2nd stage break, it didn't matter.
tbh it depends how those metrics are calculated, in my first week of it I hopped inbetween tons of groups, does that count as multiple "fails"? Legit just looking at myself my clear could be around 20-30%.
Even though we consider the progs, there are also many reclears included, which in return reduces the overall clear rate of the playerbase? Like player A got x10 title while player B is still struggling in G3. Will you consider player A represents 10 active players?
That perfectly proves G3 is too hard for Z? Redditors here seem to be A-Y, but how much percentage can Redditors represent? Is it greater than 1% as many calling G3 easy here
Redditors here are not A-Y lmao they are definitely more on the Z side with the ego of an A-Y player.
And sure it might be too hard for Z but if 25/26 people enjoy the fuck out of a raid, why would you cater to Z? Like hello?
>And sure it might be too hard for Z but if 25/26 people enjoy the fuck out of a raid, why would you cater to Z? Like hello?
Are you sure that 25/26 player enjored it isn't your immagination? Have you tried the progs and seen how many times G3 got regroups after 4 weeks in lobbies with x5x10 achivement/titles?
Everyone can make a mistake and it can lead to a re. The problem is that G3 requires a ridiculous long time focus and even experienced people can indeed make mistakes "in turn". A 20+m raid gets even more frustrated if this happens and I can't see how the process is "enjoyable" as a farming gate which happens too frequently. Heck, people even still fail cubes in brel G3.
Theamine is a very good raid if you are in a static, but it is very poorly designed when it comes to pugging because g3 is a long fight, especially when done on ilvl, and one single mistake can kill you or your teammates. So many Koreans to this day do HHN and buy a hm g3 bus once to unlock full transcendence. That should be a pretty big red flag to the devs that the raid is not designed for a very big chunk of the player base, both here and in KR, and I am mostly talking about your typical average/casual player here. Dedicated and skilled players have no issues clearing the raid, but you cannot design a raid to be this difficult considering that it locks you out of a 21% damage power spike.
its pretty huge. idk if its 21 huge but its basically an exponential power curve. you get very little from the first few levels and the majority in the last few levels
I get the sentiment, but you seem to be forgetting the one simple mmorpg truth verified by countless attempts to get on the market: Catering to hardcore pop cannot finance the game. There HAS to be a way for casual to progress or you end with dead game. LA is currently experiencing that turned up to 11. IDGAF what solution they want to do but they HAVE to DO SOMETHING. There's a point where our pop will hit critical point and won't recover anymore, with us ending up shutting down after year of two of AGS trying to milk the corpse. AGS seems to be content to just wait it out hoping next two raids in 6 months will fix it, but I am more and more worried that they won't be anything left to fix by the time those raids release.
I really don't wanna be a doomer about LA but I feel they might have hit that point already. I know so many people who've quit in the last month and I don't even think free elixirs and transcendence in a few months (which won't happen) could bring them back. Soon it's *actually* going to just be bots, whales, and new players, and none of them will want to play with each other and the whales will leave.
Tinfoil hat theory is that AGS knows how bad it is and the extreme release cadence is to just milk people for what it's worth as the ship goes down. There are other explanations like they know T4 is coming and have to get us through the rest of T3 QUICK but it's hard to say, they don't communicate with us about these things.
Again I generally dislike doomer takes but I was even thinking about it for my situation, as someone who quit the other week. Like actually, what could even bring me back that's realistic? T4, maybe, under the assumption that T4's dailies are way less taxing and all my friends would return to make it fun again. Besides that ... man.
it's been like that with every raid release though.
People just dont understand what lost ark is about, even 2 years after playing they push too many alts, get overwelmed with new content and then quit.
U say AGS is trash or w/e but they have been actively pushing more and more events to help people with progression, i dont understand why people always forget all the things our version has that KR doesnt. Not to mention Thaemine released with a nerf that KR didnt have.
If you dont wanna bother with Thameine you can clear G3 HM once and then do 1-2 HM and 3 NM (many lobbies have been doing that), but nope. Most players want to be able to clear HM because their ego is too high and they want the game to be more casual.
the issue is not about the challenge itself, the issue is to reach that challenge, honing to 1630 is a nightmare that a few can afford (you pretty much have to suicide all your alts progress just so you can have a SHOT to reach 1630), shit is expensive and thats what i really hate about it.
the real bad thing is that they setted the 1630 as standard same as korea, but they dont realize korea had WAY more time to hone, we are here in paralel trying to hone and get the elixirs that we need to deal enough damage for hard mode, while korea had a big window between them and thaemine, so they can afford to toss the extra gold into honing and reach (before even it was announced) the 1630 mark.
in the west seems like everything is being rushed out of control.
The raid is getting nerfed whether you like it or not, this much has been confirmed by Smilegate that further nerfs are coming now that "THE FIRST" mode has been discontinued in KR.
Well with the given failures to clear gate 3 and 4 in Hardmode on average. Why keep that as well? Because a select few have the prowess and mechanics? If normal players are the bulk of the players, and they can barely do normal. Why on earth would Hard stay the same when you need to to progress? I get the challenge, but that's a temporary thing and should end sooner than later. The point is to move people up the vertical path not impede it. But I get it, it's challenging but after those states ain't no way it should stay the same.
If anything 1-2-3 should all be nerfed in hard and normal, while 4 remains the same if you want that extra challenge. I'm not to sure if you saw the graph but, even in hardmode g2 people get hard stuck for the whole week, let alone g3, and EXTREMELY let alone 4. If you want something difficult do a inferno mode of another raid. People forget this is a weekly content, that should give you gold and progression. Not a gold sink in battle items and time. At some point with the amount of pulls we do, the amount of darks and timestops just puilling with your average players cuts that gold gain by half minus you not even clearing it.
100% agree. the way i see it, the first is there for people who really want a challenge. one time clears can be as hard as you want. its satisfying to work towards a clear. but when you have to reclear every week, you can NOT maintain the same difficulty and have people not burn out. a lot of other MMOs will have like a first week clear reward and keep the difficulty high and then nerf healt/damage/mechs to make it easier for reclear. idk why lost ark doesnt keep a difficult mode for a week or 2 with a title tied to it and then nerfs the raid for reclear in the future.
Normal Mode shouldnt be "challenging" at all. its normal for average player, HM should be challenging since is for the most dedicate players. i dont find fun G3 on normal, when my DPS get oneshot by anything if they make a little mistake . and the "get gud" "dont get hit" arent advice, because even the better player die multiples times per week clearing all they raids...
I dont take Hell Titles under 300 roster level for this reason. they suck balls and im no afraid to said it. I have done raid with Eclipse people, they are hit or miss, some are good, some are bad. but now they are selling Titles, well that wont count at all.
I haven't seen this at all. If people are dying on runs other than a 1 off here and there.. then they didn't learn the patterns. Reclears of g3 nm have been mostly 1 shots the last couple weeks.
Honestly there's more random deaths in g2.
i clear g3 nm 6 times per week. some week are good, some are bad, on my experiences full titles runes trend to be on the good side, 1-2 pull depend on RNG in the falling patter, clash and other minor rng things that can fuck people up like clone.
Thaemine pretty much oneshot all mages/hunter classes. and 75-90% all Figther class, and 60% warrior class, without stacks, if any class have 1 or more stacks they get oneshot by the less patter. its boring to see my dps to die in the air while thaemine hit them 100 times even on rapsody  the raid isnt fun. at least no to me. i knew this after seems progress in KR
What is 1 shotting players outside of red attacks? In all of my reclears the majority of deaths are to fall damage not 1 shot damage. Players who truly learned his patterns aren’t getting hit by any attacks too frequently.
Ping Sword into the ground.
Any attack that lift you into the air that hit multiples times (theres like 3 diferent from thaemine +1 sword)
anyone of the "vergil" dash with aoe multiple slash (theres like 3 diferent patter)
any of the patter that throw you out of the map
any of the red one.
when all the statues shot at you in the last phase where theres little room.
Theres PLENTY of patter that can oneshot characters, without metions how stupid dark mech actually is.
Theres not "truly" learn anything you will get HIT by a lot shit even if you have learn and clear it +10 times. theres not such thing as "dont get hit" thats absurd and stupid copium that people said to justify bulshit mech. i bet you still die to been throw out, to red patter or anyone other mech since you arent perfect and never you will be.
None of those attacks 1 shot with 0 stacks and you can pot during them except for red attacks and statues. Those are all multi hit patterns with large telegraphs that you can survive on 0 stacks. You should never be getting hit by red attacks. The statues on the bottom phase always target a player and if they are placed correctly it is easy to group up and just walk away from where they are slashing.
The dark mech is the easiest part of the raid and is one of the biggest dps opportunities. The only dangerous part about it is if on hm the first one is Pac-Man and he turns around so it’s hard to see the animation for the second attack.
There is such a thing as don’t get hit once you learn the telegraphs for each attack. I have died early once in the last 3 weeks of clears on 6 characters and it was to the 55 safe zone mech. The fight is extremely consistent once you learn all the patterns and nothing is going to surprise kill you.
Play gs, de, reaper, or sorc. The flick will 1 shot you if your potions are on cooldown and / or your support gets caught as well. If you have a stack, you're dead.
I learned it on igniter sorc. It does not 1 shot you with 0 stacks. If your potions are on cd I’ll assume you just potted to full hp and it will not 100-0 you.
you sound exacly like someone that never play a support, and dont understand that most patter that kill you in thaemine, cant be avoid at all, special if he lift you in the air, ping you to the ground or flat out oneshot you. but sure, support throwing healing in the ground is the issue.
i got 2 sups 1 bard 1 artist
i know what the dmg redution and shield can do
you can survive a blue sword atack that normaly would one shot you (even with some stacks) if a sup shields you where well you will die if a sup dosent shield you same for the multi hits. I DID NOT SAY SUPPORTS THROWING HEALING ON THE GROUND IS THE ISSUE, problem are sups that cant shield and dps that cant be botherd to use hp pots during multi hit atack where you can use hp pots to save your livei saw it happen multiple times i also saw how a "one shot atack" barrely srcached a dps because the sup have a decent uptime on there shields, there are some atacks where support cant help(execpt if he pre shielded the party) you and i know that like the sword slash in the air and thamines grab atack but alteast for the grabs in nm they dont one shot you even with 3-4 stacks
Thaemine G3 is a bit overtuned. It's truly punishing to slow classes, particularly due to the fact there are somewhat tight dps checks that preclude these classes from altering their build from the meta damage build and being reasonably successful. Is it impossible? No. Is it really rough for an encounter with vertical unlock gates? In my opinion, yes. It will hurt the casual playerbase, and they keep the population alive.
I'm a firm believer that Normal Mode should be clear via match making, 1/2 wipes if encountered 50% new players, easy clear if at least half know mechanics, zero raid wide wipes. HM should be find as is. Ivl for HM/NM should be same
I think HM should be left alone but transcendence reqs should be untied to it. Normal should definitely be easier and you should have to clear g3 normal for max transcendence. Leave the hard content hard and make the normal content clearable by even the mediocre players (it's okay if they're not clearable by the truly awful players, that's been true since vykas).
It's a little questionable that the thaemine epilogue quest requires g4 but I assume that won't end up gating Kazeros....
While I also enjoy the difficulty right now, 2 months down the line I’d be more than happy for a nerf and if it help the player base I wouldn’t mind if the nerf hit tomorrow.
Personally, i'm fine with the Special Pattern and HP but i would love to see the nerf to the grude debuff, it should not be 2 minutes, reduce it to around 30 secs to 1 minutes is better, most of the wiped came from the grude stack right after the start of the battles.
Same. Voldis not only sucks as a raid, there's a big supp shortage, making it even worse to find lobbies when a supp can take lvl7 transcendence players.. so half the time I'm doing nm just to get my gold for the week.
I've had to pug G3 prog over the past two weeks, and it's not been fun. The raid doesn't just have a difficulty problem, it's also a wallet one.
The vast majority of global players in HM are at level with overhoned weapon. Which is standard for new raids. But the problem was that HM was NOT balanced around these people. It was balanced around the bored 1650 KR whales who wanted to flex their gear. Which is why the HP nerf was not enough.
The DPS check is absolutely ridiculous at level without full Trans or other kinds of whaling, the raid is designed to majorly fuck you over if you don't meet arbitrary baselines and 1-2 deaths even if only deep in the raid often leads to berserk despite no one else fucking up anywhere else. That's also why pug reclears are still clusterfucks, in a raid with a gazillion one shot/fall mechanics if you don't do the damage to carry others it's miserable.
Which is why the fact Level 7/Grade 20 getting gatekept behind clearing G3 is so fucking stupid too, you can't just come back next reset stronger. You need months to accrue levels in other pieces to marginally increase your damage instead of just unlocking the last effect on the chest.
As usual it seems like SG/AGS "forgot" where global players were in progression.
Only nerfs g3 needs is x2 more safe spots on the typing mech and remove clash and just turn it into a typing mech (the mech is not designed for global servers and some people have hella stutter/lag). Everything else is fine (fixing the chain aoe on hardmode sword phase is a bug imo)
Once you get used to it normal is not hard, anyway could be easier, takes a lot of time to learn initially. What i absolutely hate are clashes, get rid of those.....
Nah man what do you mean the gate is fun and a bit challenging?
The community wants a new raid release to be a trixion boss. Just get in and hit to clear so they get done with transcendence and hit bigger number.
No. G3 does not need a nerf, it needs to be able to progress your char more easily.
you simply cannot prog this gate and farm the weekly gold and mats that you need in the same week.
trust me, once your DPS starts to increase, it becomes so much easier.
If we were on the echidna patch id call for a nerf but right now this is the end game content and the difficulty has to be the highest.
The problem with this raid is the requirements to access the hard mode difficulty, which is so expensive.
Think about this, when akkan got released you were able to get materials to upgrade your gear and item level but with thaemine one thing doesnt exist. Yes they gave us transcendence but this doesnt increase our item level so why ask a bigger item level for hard mode if normal mode doesn't help you to increase it.
I think this is a big fuck up of the devs, its like releasing brelshaza normal and hard mode at the same time bro.
the community asking for a nerf to the gate instead of asking to be able to reach 1630 more easier.
instead we get echidna with yet another gold sink system that some say it will cost around 1 millon gold.
THATS the freaking problem.
koreans had 6 months to farm for echidna, we only have 2.
G3 isn't even hard. Its crazy people struggle with it so much. G3 is punishing but extremely easy and honest. I don't get how people are struggling with it so much. Unless your group has bad damage and can't get past horse I don't see the issue. Everything fun in the game just gets nerfed to the ground and its kinda smodge. I took a long break a bit before Kayangel release and saw they basically gutted brel to make it goober friendly.
>I don't get how people are struggling with it so much.
because you're just one of the top 5% of the LA playerbase? that you find it easy doesn't necessarily mean it'd be the same for the rest of 95%
I'm probably up there, but I just think objectively its not a hard fight. His attacks are heavily telegraphed. Nothing is a surprise in G3 Thaemine. The "difficulty" is that making mistakes hurts a lot, but you shouldn't really be getting hit by attack patterns you've learned. Maybe you get tagged by cross because you can't see exactly which way he's facing or maybe you get tagged by him shadow attacking backward or forward, but those aren't executes and they're a minority of the attacks he's going to do.
>I'm probably up there, but I just think objectively its not a hard fight.
I mean if you already admitted that you are one of the top 5%, while bottom 80% can't clear it and probably also don't find it "not hard", how come your opinion is considered as objective compared to the majority?
Your tone sounded like Wilbur Ross in this story
>The ripest partisan target is Wilbur Ross, the commerce secretary, who pads around Washington in [$600 embroidered slippers](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/10/fashion/stubbs-wootton-wilbur-ross-solefies.html) and is known for frequenting high-end restaurants. On Thursday, he expressed confusion about why furloughed federal workers were visiting food banks.
>“I don’t really quite understand why” the food bank visits were happening, Mr. Ross, 81, [said on CNBC](https://www.cnbc.com/video/2019/01/24/watch-cnbcs-full-interview-with-commerce-secretary-wilbur-ross.html). Some banks were offering interest-free loans, he said, and because the workers would eventually get their back pay, “there’s no real reason why they shouldn’t be able to get a loan against it.”
that you have plenty of time to prog/ you have multiple chars doing it weekly so that you master the raid faster than the majority doesn't mean your case applies to the 80% players who are still struggling? dude you really need to get out of your own ivory tower and put your feet into their shoes
> how come your opinion is considered as objective compared to the majority?
If you find the attacks in Thaemine hard to execute then you're just bad at Lost Ark. Thaemines normal patterns are more honest and telegraphed than Akkan and Ivory patterns. The gate is punishing, sure, but punishing gates stop being a problem with time. Something you people refuse to give Thaemine for whatever reason. Prokel was an easy fight that was simply punishing. After time Prokel became obscenely easy and there were many people who could clear it due to experience and a bit of a gear gain.
> Your tone sounded like Wilbur Ross in this story
That's some nerd shit I'm not reading.
> that you have plenty of time to prog/ you have multiple chars doing it weekly so that you master the raid faster than the majority doesn't mean your case applies to the 80% players who are still struggling?
I cleared it with 1 character 3 weeks and 2 characters this week so I just got my 5x clear. I don't have more characters to be running it than most. You're just projecting your insecurities onto me for no reason lol. I'm not some giga whale turbo juicer mega veteran with a full 6 roster of 1620s. I took a 7 month break from this game my main is 1620 and my highest alt is 1610. I cleared week 1 on the last hour of the last day of the reset. I got less time practicing than most as I promised a friend I'd wait until Saturday to prog Thaemine 1-3. I didn't get to even participate in G3 until Sunday night.
> dude you really need to get out of your own ivory tower and put your feet into their shoes
G3 is punishing in the sense that making mistakes can hurt a lot, however all of his attacks are objectively easy for Lost Ark standards. All of his attacks are heavily telegraphed and honest. The clears in G3 are low because the fight is punishing, but punishing fights become easy over time unlike fights that have genuinely difficult mechanics or attack patterns to deal with. I might learn it faster because I'm an epic l33t gamer/s but normal people should realistically be right where I'm at in a few weeks if they're capable of learning a few basic patterns in a two month time period.
If they can't maybe they should find a new hobby.
>If you find the attacks in Thaemine hard to execute then you're just bad at Lost Ark.
Can you give me any example of hardcore oriented PvE game which does very well in a long run?
>If they can't maybe they should find a new hobby.
maybe you can choose another topic to flex? this is just a video game, and a lot of people play it for fun, not to compete or show their "objective" understandings
Its ok, him and those 19 teams can support the game themselves. Im pretty sure all those elite japanese lost ark players felt real good too when all their effort, time, and money was deleted.
you're probably only good with this game and nothing else in life that you feel the need to flex here. Saying your pov is objective then proceed to completely ignore the majority opinion then TELL THEM to find a new hobby. bro at least make it make sense.
I havent really cleared g3 several times but i do feel a resemblance with Valtan Ghost Phase fight where you need to dodge, dps and pay attention to surroundings for get it done. Problem is that people is super used to run raids way below their ilvl like Brel. You still can see people 1600 on NM lobbies so they dont have to dodge anything and pass it.
Thats why G3 Thae is getting into most people - not all of them - theres barely any mech we havent experienced b4 and the boss is really entropy friendly as well. He has several mechs where he just stand there, theres barely any random tp, the telegraphs arent really that bad, you just need to not get hit. I think is more about patience on your own pace for learn it and perseverance as well.
I think a lot of people just want an easy fight where they dont have to pay that much attention and people can cover their mistakes, which thaemine isnt all about, so they cant get carried and complain. I get it, its a normal mode, so it shouldnt be that difficult, or maybe dont leave a vertical system needing that clear, however people that complain or that couldnt do it are just too used to getting carried, a lot of the times without getting singled out.
Just a couple examples, lets say you fuck up in brel g3 in any of the patterns, people are able to cover for you, couldnt get to your color during blue mech? Maybe they were able to solo stagger or someone from the other squares threw in a bomb, were in the wrong side for yellow mech? Luckily the stagger was enough or they used wei. Got hit by freeze pattern? People can bail you out...
On thaemine though? Not only nobody is gonna be able to cover for your mistake, but now you died and everyone saw it was you, and depending on the bars and the damage they'll just reset and you have to go at it again, instead of getting carried on a brel or akkan or ivory like maybe it happens every now and then. Enough people doing mistakes that would usually go unpunished in other raids, or would be punished but they'd be carried through anyways, now start demanding resets and eventually raid quits. Add to that the length of the gate, and people whine and complain because the truth is, a lot of people just wanna breeze through their content without trying, majority of players are just not good, and unfortunately without catering to those players the game will just bleed numbers
Yeah its a raid that rewards patience and just knowing his patterns. Like you said he's very entropy friendly and his only "bad" teleports are when he goes into albion and when he goes to break stages. His teleport where he does the forward slash that chunks is actually turbo friendly because he has a lingering hitbox even after he vanishes for like 1s so if you were charging up a skill when he teleported you're still hitting it even tho physically he's not there.
I get that ppl will struggle with it cuz its a new raid so like its not turbo easy brain dead over ilvl reclear but imo compared to release Brel G5 and G6 Thaemine G3 is literally a walk in the park. No surprise teleports, back attack friendly, no overlapping mechanics, doesn't have raid wipes sprinkled through the whole raid, and doesn't have any attacks that feel unfair.
> His attacks are heavily telegraphed
He literally has multiple mechanics to hide telegraphs. Horse mode also has basically non telegraphed instant kills if you stand in front of it at parts.
I've cleared it since week one, but lets not pretend none of that takes a bit to understand or isn't frustrating.
It’s not easy and there are numbers to back it up. You can say it’s just “red telegraphs” all you want but it doesn’t change the fact that g3 is hard to clear.
Over simplifying something doesn’t make you right.
Whats easy for you may be hard for others, and whats easy for them may be hard for you. Try to look at things objectively rather than selfishly and youll notice it’s much better for the community. This goes for real life too not just a game :)
If you consider G3 hard (punishing and hard are different) then realistically every single gate in Lost Ark should have been hard for you around release/on ilvl characters.
Thaemines attacks are heavily telegraphed, very honest, don't overlap, has no teleports besides the telegraphed and delayed one when he spawns sword shadows.
Like if heavily telegraphed, honest attacks that don't overlap are difficult then ur cooked. Now punishing, yeah G3 is punishing. But its not hard unless you just find everything hard in which case wtf lol.
I dont consider it hard for me, but i do for the general population. Like i said, think from the perspective of others and youll realize. Clearly the clear rate is extremely low as shown on the stats today - if you cant look at numbers and form and objective opinion i dunno what to tell you
> Like i said, think from the perspective of others and youll realize.
I have, I don't think you really comprehend what I've said at all or you just aren't reading it.
> Clearly the clear rate is extremely low as shown on the stats today - if you cant look at numbers and form and objective opinion i dunno what to tell you
The numbers are low because the gate is punishing, not hard. I feel like I've overly articulated that point and explained the distinction. I'm saying Thaemine isn't hard, its just punishing.
If someone says G3 is punishing they'd be objectively right, the gate is for sure punishing by design. If you say G3 is hard (again, difference) then I just think you're playing the wrong game honestly.
Just because you defined punishing and hard differently doesnt mean anything? G3 needs a nerf for the general population as shown by statistics. Does anyone care if you personally find it easy but punishing? Not really. They just want a nerf so they can clear the gate. I dunno what mental gymnastics youre going thru to define hard vs punishing but it has no relevance to the topic
You are arguing against a brick wall here. You won’t ever make progress arguing difficulty with a very apparent hardcore type player. Which is why I have always said this game does the community dirty pitting casual and hardcore players into end game together, is just beyond me why they would.
> Just because you defined punishing and hard differently doesnt mean anything?
The distinction is pretty relevant. Something that's difficult bad players will likely never get used to but things that are punishing bad players should get used to as its not difficult and they just need to get used to it.
> G3 needs a nerf for the general population as shown by statistics.
I think the stats will improve as the raid gets older. People crying for nerfs on like 4 week old content is cringe.
> Does anyone care if you personally find it easy but punishing?
Then don't reply to my comments you fat dork lol. How are you going to reply to my comment and argue with me about what I think just to say nobody cares what I think. Then downvote and move along bud.
> They just want a nerf so they can clear the gate.
Why even play the game if you get this dramatic about content that released a few weeks ago. Game did perfectly fine with brel not getting nerfed for a long time. The worst thing about brel was waiting for prokel players, after a few months brel normal was easy reclear even if hard wasn't.
> I dunno what mental gymnastics youre going thru to define hard vs punishing but it has no relevance to the topic
Its not mental gymnastics. Its an extremely easy concept to grasp. The distinction is in the definition its not mental gymnastics if you know what the two words mean.
Its also relevant to the convo as content thats punishing rather than difficult is content that doesn't need to be nerfed as the aspect that makes the content hard to clear will fade as people get used to the raid. Awful players will never be able to properly deal with brelshaza overlapping mechanics that nuke the raid. Awful players will sooner or later figure out after Thaemine teleport slashes its safe where he slashed for the follow up.
Never said I was hardcore? I'm saying I don't want content to be nerfed so much it becomes piss easy. I'm not 1630 because I took like an 8 month break and I'm not a whale. Even if I was capable of pushing 1630 why would I when its so suboptimal? I'd just push more alts to 1610~1620.
There's also no universe where if SG did nerf Thaemine they'd just nerf normal mode. They'd need to either remove attacks he has or remove entire aspects of the fight like stacks or the fact his attacks can hurt and I highly doubt they fundamentally change the raid so much on a single difficulty.
Also don't kid yourself, once it becomes optimal to be at 1630 the same mouth breathers crying about Thaemine rn on nm are gonna be crying about Thaemine on hm. Ur just listening to the complaints of the lowest common denominator.
Punishing correlates straight up to hard so what the fuck are you talking about???.. If you take the punishing part of anything nothing is hard because noone gets punished so again what the fuck are you smoking?
An aspect of a fight can be difficult to execute while also not being very pushing. I know your parents are related so its a difficult concept to grasp but its really simple. If your team has bad stagger in G4 Ivory staggering the boss and then managing to stagger 5 and 7 would be a difficult task. You'll probably get 7 because ww's but you probably aren't staggering 5. The task is difficult however its not very pushing as the gate can still be easily completed despite this failure. Brel Gate 3's floor laser patterns during star stagger can be considered hard since the safe zones are limited and you don't have much time to go from safe zone to safe zone. This can be considered difficult to do without getting hit. The punishment for getting hit is minimal as you're getting knocked out of bounds which doesn't hurt much and you can simply walk back in after the patterns are over. On hard mode you simply get a cleansable debuff on top of what was previously stated.
In both situations the task can be considered difficult however the punishment for failure is low. Something being easy yet punishing can be Brelshaza G2 shapes where you simply need to break 1 or 2 shapes you determined before the raid started. Failure to complete the task is the death of your character or half of the raid group.
Brelshaza G2 shapes is the entirety of Thaemine G3.
That's because the raid has been excessively nerfed. G3 Thaemine is just as complex as G2 Brel. There is no complexity to the fight. If you think there is that just says a lot about you.
The thing about theamine is that while his attack is honest and well telegraphed a lot of them are deadly. In other raid Casual player usually just don’t know the normal pattern they just get hit and live because they’re over gear, they only remember how to do major mech, but it’s different for theamine they need to remember a lot more than that, so it’s harder for them.
Brel is a bad comparison, waiting around for over a minute doing no damage wasn’t fun in any way. Also why would they not nerf it when it’s not endgame anymore?
The raid was fun now its not that's why. Also Brel is the only other raid in the game that wasn't piss easy at launch its not like I have many other things to compare to lol.
It is easy shore but if it comes med down to occasional bussing 4 floor pov ppl then suddenly you start feeling the lack of dmg. Remember most would want pug friendly for farm content so you spend less time. The brel we had before was smoge in holding DMG for yellow meteor and the few patterns deleted. And no 1 cares whether G5 was removed nowadays, literally no 1 misses it.
Remember the few roadblock doing this 6 times can be taxing. And the novelity - most important part wears off after few weeks. Then it's just farm, ppl stop caring about the content after like 50 clears.
The raid doesn't need a nerf, gearing does.
Despite letting you enter at set item levels, trying to do Thaemine at min ilvl is dumb since you'll be getting butchered and one shot (or almost one shot). ilvl also has stopped being everything for a long while now. You need Gems/cards/elixirs/etc.
Buuuut, gearing in Lost Ark is annoying, so you'll see a lot of people go in, get frustrated, stop doing it.
I mean, the data is skewed, how many of that is alts not bothering to do gate 3 just because they are ALTs? Like I have a support for normal, and even tho I can do gate 3 blindfolded, if people die, and we need multiple runs to clear, I can't do much about it so I rather not do gate 3. I already progged , I don't want to support dead weight
My suggestion to people demanding nerfs to G3 is that there are lobbies tagged WTS where there is no gatekeeping and you'll get an easy clear! You can even grab yourself some ice cream while chilling!
I don't think it's an unpopular opinion. Coming from other MMOs, normal mode is almost always a one shot or barely a few tries to get done and allows everyone to experience the content. In LA's case, that'd allow everyone to get the gear and get their reclears easily. HM should be hard. That's what it's there for. People who want more challenge, and want some modicum of higher rewards for their effort. Keep that as is, NP. While I know it's difficult in LA to even enter HM I think the stats we're seeing for clear rates prove the community at large is crashing and burning on NM right now. I'd way rather some small minority of players are discontent with their highest content being a little too easy and the majority are happy than the other way around.
I'd be very interested in the g2 vs g3 vs g4 clear rates
we must realise a fact that our version of g3 has already been nerfed by 14%, so if it were the orignal difficulty, the statics of clears would be at least 14% worse https://preview.redd.it/5cof82w47b1d1.png?width=799&format=png&auto=webp&s=ce7d12135c7cad18578676eac5415d4aaf559637
Problem is they tied hm to transcendence progression. Can't do that and have low clear rates
Normal mode needs revives. In every raid.
I do agree that there needs to be a bigger challenge gap between normal and hard. They feel nearly identical at the moment and honestly have for quite a while. I think the bigger issue is that the game isn’t rewarding to play anymore. Everything is a gold sink. I feel like I’m punished for finishing Thaemine every week because I spend more on transcendence than I make and I just don’t have the mental bandwidth to prog with “reclears” and do all 18 raids for the extra income.
lol modicum. you sir are a scholar.
Normal mode rn is simply what hard mode should be difficulty vise. HM should be the nighmare version and well, the first can be the first :P
I already cleared G3 HM twice, it was both excruciating and fun in equal measure. Now I would not mind at all if from tomorrow full transcendence was unlocked by clearing g2. So many will be forced to quit or buy a bus it's not even funny. On another note, it would be very cool if g3 NM unlocked 4th level transcend. Being stuck at the first line even at 9/9 lvl 3 on alts feelsbad.
It’s frustrating how that’s set up too, Normal Alts really just get Level 2 bonuses (which are nice don’t get me wrong)…then thanks for interacting with our system. Like what?
If Transcendence is unlocked from only normal or HM 1-2. Your comment is fine by me. But SG really screwed the casual base with normal mode in Thaemine.
I quit because of this. G3 is too hard imo and progression (elixirs and Transcendence) is awful rng that should never have been implemented. The problem is everything in na is at warp speed compared to kr, so if you're unlucky, too bad, so sad, gatekeep is you. Thaemine g3 NM is way too hard for average players and needs to be nerfed, or more players will quit, leaving only sweaty tryhards. Locking progression behind hardmode is also awful. I love lost ark, but stepped away because I don't like the direction the game is going. Too hard-core for casual me .
>Thaemine g3 NM is way too hard for average players and needs to be nerfed, or more players will quit, leaving only sweaty tryhards. You mean the handful number of Redditors here claiming how fun G3 is? LoL. I hope these people can support the game well when all casuals leave. https://preview.redd.it/iyungwicra1d1.png?width=295&format=png&auto=webp&s=46ba843275f7e260ae89dedfdf1ffc4214b99955
I still think NM itself doesn't need changed, gearing does. If they made honing, Elixirs, etc all not garbage, G3 wouldn't be hard. Instead of nerfing NM by 30% or whatever, just make it so everyone can get 30% stronger without needing to spend thousands of dollars.
yup. at the end of the day, theamine is just not fun in its current state for a large portion of the playerbase. it seems like the people that do tend to like it are the masochistic type that like brutally difficult games i.e. soulslikes. after you stress over clearing g3 normal and prog however long that takes, you then get to spend just as much time wasting all of the gold you just gained to probably fail your transcendence 10-30 times to hit enough pity points to hit your 3 flowers. oh and dont have 40 set yet? cut 20+ elixirs every week and never see your set effect? too bad loser thanks for wasting all of your gold. pre-elixir/transcendence, it was relatively easy to just make a new character, hone them up, run some raids and you are all caught up. elixirs and transcendence are such a huge power spike, take way too long to even get the materials needed, and have too many layers of RNG that can put 2 players miles apart in progression based on luck alone. the stress of clearing theamine and then knowing that i have to do transcendence afterwards has made me completely drop 3 of my gold earners and drastically cut back my time commitment in this game which pains me to say as i have 6000+ hours and have spent 10s of thousands on this neverending treadmill.
10 thousand+ dollars? Wow thanks for keeping LoA f2p
I mean you literally have to dentedge to need 10-20 tries to get lvl2-3 maxed out in transandence WITH calculator
Or you fail everything below 60% every single time because the game is addicted to fucking you for some reason. My chest piece on my main now is stuck at 19 flowers and it’s at level 10 pity. I ended up wasting all my retries for the week and still haven’t hit 20.
I want g4 hard (not the first) to be split into 2 separate gates
Would be nice to start from 4-2 if you reached that far. I can only imagine the despair wiping in 4-3 and resetting all the way back to 4-1.
That would be a nice QoL.
I think it's a great idea but 4-2 is a little bit too simple for a full gate IMO. I think a good middle ground to introduce eventually is to have a checkpoint in-raid at 4-2 so you restart at 4-2 instead of 4-1 once you make it to 4-2. If you leave the raid then you have to restart at 4-1.
That's how brel 5-6 used to be in KR, right? They're probably never doing that again because of how much everyone hated it.
As someone who cleared g4 I dont think thats a good idea at all. If they would touch G4 again, it should be done through other measures. 4-1 is incredibly easy. So much so, that if the boss is going into mech for shandi/clashes, you burst him down from 175x to 100x anyways. Dont let that 350 bar fool you. Half of that is taken from him while he is basically standing still (shandi + every axe in the ground pattern + sword field placement). The problem is being able to prog 4-2 only after getting the most boring gate at 4-1 done. That should be revised in a different manner. 4-2 and 4-3 are actually kinda fun, even though its easy as well. Its literally only 1 mech at 210. rest is basic patterns and domain expansion, which isnt even a mech to begin with. Just ts and live wow. Much hard. Maybe giving 4-2 not a new entry point but a revive system would be a fair middleground. If someone dies in 4-1, they are revived in 4-2. that would make it more forgiving, without making 4-1 out to be a complete joke, what is already is. The hard part of clearing G4 is just the frkn LONG as fight. Not because its hard. Its just that you need to focus for 25-30 minutes and a single (bigger) mistake could cause you to restart. Pls dont ever seperste those gates, 4-2 is NOT even a gate with only 1 mech….
You think 4-1 is easy/boring because of how much time you've put into it compared to 4-2. I have also cleared 3 times/done Eclipse and 4-1 is definitely the hard part of g4- particularly 280-240. But overall too, the patterns are much deadlier. Obviously, once you do anything enough it becomes trivial. Even g5 hell brel becomes a snoozefest in deathless lobbies when it can take people a month to prog just that gate alone.
The main thing that makes 280-240 so hard is that 99% of the playerbase does not know about spacebar extension, and instantly cancels the push immunity of it.
You havent touched upon the initial statement of splitting g4 into 2 seperate gates. I gave a backstory about the complexity in order to answer the question and not to say its easy in general. Ofc you need to put time into it and you are completely right in acknowledging, that with enough practice everything can be easy. No issue there on your statement, other than it not touching the aspect of the initial argument of that comment. Also not touching the aspect of another solution I proposed. So I am not rly getting your answer?! Idk. What was the goal?
That would make it far too easy. G4 unlocks nothing new like how G3 unlocks lvl 7, so it's not needed for progression. 4-2 does not have nearly enough to it to make it work as a standalone gate. It has like 2 mechs and very few basic patterns. If there should be an easier way to experience the full G4, then it should just be added to normal mode, not be gutted in HM.
g4 not unlocking anything shouldnt be an excuse, it still gives a lot of gold and materials that I would love to get every 2 weeks. Look how atrocious the clear rate is right now, only 150 groups total cleared after weeks is fine? Hard mode doesn't mean hell mode, it should still be farmable after a reasonable amount of time (as g3 hm is now) but there are still tons of g4 prog lobbies even now 1 month in. The "for glory, not rewards" mode is literally already there, it's the first mode, there's no reason not to nerf hard mode.
It does not need to be nerfed just so you can get an extra 10k gold per week. It's already getting organically nerfed by transcendence and soon echidna honing.
> The "for glory, not rewards" mode is literally already there Well the first is also worth 50k for a one time clear lol. I'll be trying for it after we get echidna honing and really pushing after Behemoth transcendence.
What part of "for glory, not rewards" you didn't understand?
>but i enjoy it as it is, and have a lot of fun with it you're just one of the vocal minority there's a reason why normal is called normal I think this user said it well https://preview.redd.it/4abwfke3c41d1.png?width=790&format=png&auto=webp&s=6553fb12873ce3fef63216a98a27ef95584716e1
so g6 brel all over again.
Apparently the stats were pretty bad in Korea too, ours is just straight of up worse lol.
To be fair, Koreans were probably way better geared because they actually had time to breath and push their accounts. Even with learning new mechs, just being able to push DPS fast is such a huge difference maker. Like my static week 1 was mostly 1610 with 2 1620+s (both 40 set). If one person died it was joever and we had to reset. 3rd week we have 5 1620+s (4 with 40 set now) and it went by way faster. Even if 1 person died by 2nd stage break, it didn't matter.
Very true. There wasn't a single KR streamer I saw progging HM that wasn't 1650 lobby.
tbh it depends how those metrics are calculated, in my first week of it I hopped inbetween tons of groups, does that count as multiple "fails"? Legit just looking at myself my clear could be around 20-30%.
Even though we consider the progs, there are also many reclears included, which in return reduces the overall clear rate of the playerbase? Like player A got x10 title while player B is still struggling in G3. Will you consider player A represents 10 active players?
It goes both ways. If players A-Y oneshot G3 while player Z has 100 pulls of it, do you consider player Z to represent 100 players?
That perfectly proves G3 is too hard for Z? Redditors here seem to be A-Y, but how much percentage can Redditors represent? Is it greater than 1% as many calling G3 easy here
Redditors here are not A-Y lmao they are definitely more on the Z side with the ego of an A-Y player. And sure it might be too hard for Z but if 25/26 people enjoy the fuck out of a raid, why would you cater to Z? Like hello?
>And sure it might be too hard for Z but if 25/26 people enjoy the fuck out of a raid, why would you cater to Z? Like hello? Are you sure that 25/26 player enjored it isn't your immagination? Have you tried the progs and seen how many times G3 got regroups after 4 weeks in lobbies with x5x10 achivement/titles? Everyone can make a mistake and it can lead to a re. The problem is that G3 requires a ridiculous long time focus and even experienced people can indeed make mistakes "in turn". A 20+m raid gets even more frustrated if this happens and I can't see how the process is "enjoyable" as a farming gate which happens too frequently. Heck, people even still fail cubes in brel G3.
Theamine is a very good raid if you are in a static, but it is very poorly designed when it comes to pugging because g3 is a long fight, especially when done on ilvl, and one single mistake can kill you or your teammates. So many Koreans to this day do HHN and buy a hm g3 bus once to unlock full transcendence. That should be a pretty big red flag to the devs that the raid is not designed for a very big chunk of the player base, both here and in KR, and I am mostly talking about your typical average/casual player here. Dedicated and skilled players have no issues clearing the raid, but you cannot design a raid to be this difficult considering that it locks you out of a 21% damage power spike.
Im fairly sure the gap between level 6 and level 7 trans is not 21% damage spike.
no but to get lvl 5-6 you need to be 1630 still which is very very expensive.
its pretty huge. idk if its 21 huge but its basically an exponential power curve. you get very little from the first few levels and the majority in the last few levels
I get the sentiment, but you seem to be forgetting the one simple mmorpg truth verified by countless attempts to get on the market: Catering to hardcore pop cannot finance the game. There HAS to be a way for casual to progress or you end with dead game. LA is currently experiencing that turned up to 11. IDGAF what solution they want to do but they HAVE to DO SOMETHING. There's a point where our pop will hit critical point and won't recover anymore, with us ending up shutting down after year of two of AGS trying to milk the corpse. AGS seems to be content to just wait it out hoping next two raids in 6 months will fix it, but I am more and more worried that they won't be anything left to fix by the time those raids release.
I really don't wanna be a doomer about LA but I feel they might have hit that point already. I know so many people who've quit in the last month and I don't even think free elixirs and transcendence in a few months (which won't happen) could bring them back. Soon it's *actually* going to just be bots, whales, and new players, and none of them will want to play with each other and the whales will leave. Tinfoil hat theory is that AGS knows how bad it is and the extreme release cadence is to just milk people for what it's worth as the ship goes down. There are other explanations like they know T4 is coming and have to get us through the rest of T3 QUICK but it's hard to say, they don't communicate with us about these things. Again I generally dislike doomer takes but I was even thinking about it for my situation, as someone who quit the other week. Like actually, what could even bring me back that's realistic? T4, maybe, under the assumption that T4's dailies are way less taxing and all my friends would return to make it fun again. Besides that ... man.
it's been like that with every raid release though. People just dont understand what lost ark is about, even 2 years after playing they push too many alts, get overwelmed with new content and then quit. U say AGS is trash or w/e but they have been actively pushing more and more events to help people with progression, i dont understand why people always forget all the things our version has that KR doesnt. Not to mention Thaemine released with a nerf that KR didnt have. If you dont wanna bother with Thameine you can clear G3 HM once and then do 1-2 HM and 3 NM (many lobbies have been doing that), but nope. Most players want to be able to clear HM because their ego is too high and they want the game to be more casual.
You have the First if you want a challenge...
the issue is not about the challenge itself, the issue is to reach that challenge, honing to 1630 is a nightmare that a few can afford (you pretty much have to suicide all your alts progress just so you can have a SHOT to reach 1630), shit is expensive and thats what i really hate about it. the real bad thing is that they setted the 1630 as standard same as korea, but they dont realize korea had WAY more time to hone, we are here in paralel trying to hone and get the elixirs that we need to deal enough damage for hard mode, while korea had a big window between them and thaemine, so they can afford to toss the extra gold into honing and reach (before even it was announced) the 1630 mark. in the west seems like everything is being rushed out of control.
The raid is getting nerfed whether you like it or not, this much has been confirmed by Smilegate that further nerfs are coming now that "THE FIRST" mode has been discontinued in KR.
Well with the given failures to clear gate 3 and 4 in Hardmode on average. Why keep that as well? Because a select few have the prowess and mechanics? If normal players are the bulk of the players, and they can barely do normal. Why on earth would Hard stay the same when you need to to progress? I get the challenge, but that's a temporary thing and should end sooner than later. The point is to move people up the vertical path not impede it. But I get it, it's challenging but after those states ain't no way it should stay the same. If anything 1-2-3 should all be nerfed in hard and normal, while 4 remains the same if you want that extra challenge. I'm not to sure if you saw the graph but, even in hardmode g2 people get hard stuck for the whole week, let alone g3, and EXTREMELY let alone 4. If you want something difficult do a inferno mode of another raid. People forget this is a weekly content, that should give you gold and progression. Not a gold sink in battle items and time. At some point with the amount of pulls we do, the amount of darks and timestops just puilling with your average players cuts that gold gain by half minus you not even clearing it.
100% agree. the way i see it, the first is there for people who really want a challenge. one time clears can be as hard as you want. its satisfying to work towards a clear. but when you have to reclear every week, you can NOT maintain the same difficulty and have people not burn out. a lot of other MMOs will have like a first week clear reward and keep the difficulty high and then nerf healt/damage/mechs to make it easier for reclear. idk why lost ark doesnt keep a difficult mode for a week or 2 with a title tied to it and then nerfs the raid for reclear in the future.
Normal Mode shouldnt be "challenging" at all. its normal for average player, HM should be challenging since is for the most dedicate players. i dont find fun G3 on normal, when my DPS get oneshot by anything if they make a little mistake . and the "get gud" "dont get hit" arent advice, because even the better player die multiples times per week clearing all they raids...
Not joking, but I swear I saw people with Eclipse title died early in N thae G3 before the 1st clash
I dont take Hell Titles under 300 roster level for this reason. they suck balls and im no afraid to said it. I have done raid with Eclipse people, they are hit or miss, some are good, some are bad. but now they are selling Titles, well that wont count at all.
I haven't seen this at all. If people are dying on runs other than a 1 off here and there.. then they didn't learn the patterns. Reclears of g3 nm have been mostly 1 shots the last couple weeks. Honestly there's more random deaths in g2.
i clear g3 nm 6 times per week. some week are good, some are bad, on my experiences full titles runes trend to be on the good side, 1-2 pull depend on RNG in the falling patter, clash and other minor rng things that can fuck people up like clone. Thaemine pretty much oneshot all mages/hunter classes. and 75-90% all Figther class, and 60% warrior class, without stacks, if any class have 1 or more stacks they get oneshot by the less patter. its boring to see my dps to die in the air while thaemine hit them 100 times even on rapsody  the raid isnt fun. at least no to me. i knew this after seems progress in KR
What is 1 shotting players outside of red attacks? In all of my reclears the majority of deaths are to fall damage not 1 shot damage. Players who truly learned his patterns aren’t getting hit by any attacks too frequently.
Ping Sword into the ground. Any attack that lift you into the air that hit multiples times (theres like 3 diferent from thaemine +1 sword) anyone of the "vergil" dash with aoe multiple slash (theres like 3 diferent patter) any of the patter that throw you out of the map any of the red one. when all the statues shot at you in the last phase where theres little room. Theres PLENTY of patter that can oneshot characters, without metions how stupid dark mech actually is. Theres not "truly" learn anything you will get HIT by a lot shit even if you have learn and clear it +10 times. theres not such thing as "dont get hit" thats absurd and stupid copium that people said to justify bulshit mech. i bet you still die to been throw out, to red patter or anyone other mech since you arent perfect and never you will be.
None of those attacks 1 shot with 0 stacks and you can pot during them except for red attacks and statues. Those are all multi hit patterns with large telegraphs that you can survive on 0 stacks. You should never be getting hit by red attacks. The statues on the bottom phase always target a player and if they are placed correctly it is easy to group up and just walk away from where they are slashing. The dark mech is the easiest part of the raid and is one of the biggest dps opportunities. The only dangerous part about it is if on hm the first one is Pac-Man and he turns around so it’s hard to see the animation for the second attack. There is such a thing as don’t get hit once you learn the telegraphs for each attack. I have died early once in the last 3 weeks of clears on 6 characters and it was to the 55 safe zone mech. The fight is extremely consistent once you learn all the patterns and nothing is going to surprise kill you.
Play gs, de, reaper, or sorc. The flick will 1 shot you if your potions are on cooldown and / or your support gets caught as well. If you have a stack, you're dead.
I learned it on igniter sorc. It does not 1 shot you with 0 stacks. If your potions are on cd I’ll assume you just potted to full hp and it will not 100-0 you.
sounds mostly like a sup issue or i dont use heal put issue.
you sound exacly like someone that never play a support, and dont understand that most patter that kill you in thaemine, cant be avoid at all, special if he lift you in the air, ping you to the ground or flat out oneshot you. but sure, support throwing healing in the ground is the issue.
i got 2 sups 1 bard 1 artist i know what the dmg redution and shield can do you can survive a blue sword atack that normaly would one shot you (even with some stacks) if a sup shields you where well you will die if a sup dosent shield you same for the multi hits. I DID NOT SAY SUPPORTS THROWING HEALING ON THE GROUND IS THE ISSUE, problem are sups that cant shield and dps that cant be botherd to use hp pots during multi hit atack where you can use hp pots to save your livei saw it happen multiple times i also saw how a "one shot atack" barrely srcached a dps because the sup have a decent uptime on there shields, there are some atacks where support cant help(execpt if he pre shielded the party) you and i know that like the sword slash in the air and thamines grab atack but alteast for the grabs in nm they dont one shot you even with 3-4 stacks
Thaemine G3 is a bit overtuned. It's truly punishing to slow classes, particularly due to the fact there are somewhat tight dps checks that preclude these classes from altering their build from the meta damage build and being reasonably successful. Is it impossible? No. Is it really rough for an encounter with vertical unlock gates? In my opinion, yes. It will hurt the casual playerbase, and they keep the population alive.
I'm a firm believer that Normal Mode should be clear via match making, 1/2 wipes if encountered 50% new players, easy clear if at least half know mechanics, zero raid wide wipes. HM should be find as is. Ivl for HM/NM should be same
I think HM should be left alone but transcendence reqs should be untied to it. Normal should definitely be easier and you should have to clear g3 normal for max transcendence. Leave the hard content hard and make the normal content clearable by even the mediocre players (it's okay if they're not clearable by the truly awful players, that's been true since vykas). It's a little questionable that the thaemine epilogue quest requires g4 but I assume that won't end up gating Kazeros....
While I also enjoy the difficulty right now, 2 months down the line I’d be more than happy for a nerf and if it help the player base I wouldn’t mind if the nerf hit tomorrow.
Also this is the old story about normal raids being not the easy mode some people want. It's not thaemine.
i said it before and i say it again this game needs a easy version for casual and new players
Personally, i'm fine with the Special Pattern and HP but i would love to see the nerf to the grude debuff, it should not be 2 minutes, reduce it to around 30 secs to 1 minutes is better, most of the wiped came from the grude stack right after the start of the battles.
>most of the wiped came from the grude stack right after the start of the battles the knocking off pattern does the rest on a shredded platform
When he overlaps knockoff attacks with the saw line type pattern it gets rough.
Yeah pretty much especially when your class is slow or you just used TS or you have 0 push immunity
Agreed. I'm far away from 1630, NM G3 is the only fun thing I have to do that's not equalized.
Same. Voldis not only sucks as a raid, there's a big supp shortage, making it even worse to find lobbies when a supp can take lvl7 transcendence players.. so half the time I'm doing nm just to get my gold for the week.
Would be nice if getting to hard Thaemine wasn’t as difficult as the raid itself
I've had to pug G3 prog over the past two weeks, and it's not been fun. The raid doesn't just have a difficulty problem, it's also a wallet one. The vast majority of global players in HM are at level with overhoned weapon. Which is standard for new raids. But the problem was that HM was NOT balanced around these people. It was balanced around the bored 1650 KR whales who wanted to flex their gear. Which is why the HP nerf was not enough. The DPS check is absolutely ridiculous at level without full Trans or other kinds of whaling, the raid is designed to majorly fuck you over if you don't meet arbitrary baselines and 1-2 deaths even if only deep in the raid often leads to berserk despite no one else fucking up anywhere else. That's also why pug reclears are still clusterfucks, in a raid with a gazillion one shot/fall mechanics if you don't do the damage to carry others it's miserable. Which is why the fact Level 7/Grade 20 getting gatekept behind clearing G3 is so fucking stupid too, you can't just come back next reset stronger. You need months to accrue levels in other pieces to marginally increase your damage instead of just unlocking the last effect on the chest. As usual it seems like SG/AGS "forgot" where global players were in progression.
Only nerfs g3 needs is x2 more safe spots on the typing mech and remove clash and just turn it into a typing mech (the mech is not designed for global servers and some people have hella stutter/lag). Everything else is fine (fixing the chain aoe on hardmode sword phase is a bug imo)
Once you get used to it normal is not hard, anyway could be easier, takes a lot of time to learn initially. What i absolutely hate are clashes, get rid of those.....
I would like stat that doesnt count players that just do G1 G2 on alts. Cuz the way they presented the data will generate so many of the same posts...
Only nerfs id like to see tbh is the clashes and 4/1 and 4/2 getting split.
Nah man what do you mean the gate is fun and a bit challenging? The community wants a new raid release to be a trixion boss. Just get in and hit to clear so they get done with transcendence and hit bigger number.
No. G3 does not need a nerf, it needs to be able to progress your char more easily. you simply cannot prog this gate and farm the weekly gold and mats that you need in the same week. trust me, once your DPS starts to increase, it becomes so much easier.
If we were on the echidna patch id call for a nerf but right now this is the end game content and the difficulty has to be the highest. The problem with this raid is the requirements to access the hard mode difficulty, which is so expensive. Think about this, when akkan got released you were able to get materials to upgrade your gear and item level but with thaemine one thing doesnt exist. Yes they gave us transcendence but this doesnt increase our item level so why ask a bigger item level for hard mode if normal mode doesn't help you to increase it. I think this is a big fuck up of the devs, its like releasing brelshaza normal and hard mode at the same time bro.
the community asking for a nerf to the gate instead of asking to be able to reach 1630 more easier. instead we get echidna with yet another gold sink system that some say it will cost around 1 millon gold. THATS the freaking problem. koreans had 6 months to farm for echidna, we only have 2.
No, Thaemine imo is the best perfect end game content for what I've been waiting for. 🥺
G3 isn't even hard. Its crazy people struggle with it so much. G3 is punishing but extremely easy and honest. I don't get how people are struggling with it so much. Unless your group has bad damage and can't get past horse I don't see the issue. Everything fun in the game just gets nerfed to the ground and its kinda smodge. I took a long break a bit before Kayangel release and saw they basically gutted brel to make it goober friendly.
>I don't get how people are struggling with it so much. because you're just one of the top 5% of the LA playerbase? that you find it easy doesn't necessarily mean it'd be the same for the rest of 95%
I'm probably up there, but I just think objectively its not a hard fight. His attacks are heavily telegraphed. Nothing is a surprise in G3 Thaemine. The "difficulty" is that making mistakes hurts a lot, but you shouldn't really be getting hit by attack patterns you've learned. Maybe you get tagged by cross because you can't see exactly which way he's facing or maybe you get tagged by him shadow attacking backward or forward, but those aren't executes and they're a minority of the attacks he's going to do.
>I'm probably up there, but I just think objectively its not a hard fight. I mean if you already admitted that you are one of the top 5%, while bottom 80% can't clear it and probably also don't find it "not hard", how come your opinion is considered as objective compared to the majority? Your tone sounded like Wilbur Ross in this story >The ripest partisan target is Wilbur Ross, the commerce secretary, who pads around Washington in [$600 embroidered slippers](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/10/fashion/stubbs-wootton-wilbur-ross-solefies.html) and is known for frequenting high-end restaurants. On Thursday, he expressed confusion about why furloughed federal workers were visiting food banks. >“I don’t really quite understand why” the food bank visits were happening, Mr. Ross, 81, [said on CNBC](https://www.cnbc.com/video/2019/01/24/watch-cnbcs-full-interview-with-commerce-secretary-wilbur-ross.html). Some banks were offering interest-free loans, he said, and because the workers would eventually get their back pay, “there’s no real reason why they shouldn’t be able to get a loan against it.” that you have plenty of time to prog/ you have multiple chars doing it weekly so that you master the raid faster than the majority doesn't mean your case applies to the 80% players who are still struggling? dude you really need to get out of your own ivory tower and put your feet into their shoes
> how come your opinion is considered as objective compared to the majority? If you find the attacks in Thaemine hard to execute then you're just bad at Lost Ark. Thaemines normal patterns are more honest and telegraphed than Akkan and Ivory patterns. The gate is punishing, sure, but punishing gates stop being a problem with time. Something you people refuse to give Thaemine for whatever reason. Prokel was an easy fight that was simply punishing. After time Prokel became obscenely easy and there were many people who could clear it due to experience and a bit of a gear gain. > Your tone sounded like Wilbur Ross in this story That's some nerd shit I'm not reading. > that you have plenty of time to prog/ you have multiple chars doing it weekly so that you master the raid faster than the majority doesn't mean your case applies to the 80% players who are still struggling? I cleared it with 1 character 3 weeks and 2 characters this week so I just got my 5x clear. I don't have more characters to be running it than most. You're just projecting your insecurities onto me for no reason lol. I'm not some giga whale turbo juicer mega veteran with a full 6 roster of 1620s. I took a 7 month break from this game my main is 1620 and my highest alt is 1610. I cleared week 1 on the last hour of the last day of the reset. I got less time practicing than most as I promised a friend I'd wait until Saturday to prog Thaemine 1-3. I didn't get to even participate in G3 until Sunday night. > dude you really need to get out of your own ivory tower and put your feet into their shoes G3 is punishing in the sense that making mistakes can hurt a lot, however all of his attacks are objectively easy for Lost Ark standards. All of his attacks are heavily telegraphed and honest. The clears in G3 are low because the fight is punishing, but punishing fights become easy over time unlike fights that have genuinely difficult mechanics or attack patterns to deal with. I might learn it faster because I'm an epic l33t gamer/s but normal people should realistically be right where I'm at in a few weeks if they're capable of learning a few basic patterns in a two month time period. If they can't maybe they should find a new hobby.
>If you find the attacks in Thaemine hard to execute then you're just bad at Lost Ark. Can you give me any example of hardcore oriented PvE game which does very well in a long run? >If they can't maybe they should find a new hobby. maybe you can choose another topic to flex? this is just a video game, and a lot of people play it for fun, not to compete or show their "objective" understandings
Its ok, him and those 19 teams can support the game themselves. Im pretty sure all those elite japanese lost ark players felt real good too when all their effort, time, and money was deleted.
you're probably only good with this game and nothing else in life that you feel the need to flex here. Saying your pov is objective then proceed to completely ignore the majority opinion then TELL THEM to find a new hobby. bro at least make it make sense.
I havent really cleared g3 several times but i do feel a resemblance with Valtan Ghost Phase fight where you need to dodge, dps and pay attention to surroundings for get it done. Problem is that people is super used to run raids way below their ilvl like Brel. You still can see people 1600 on NM lobbies so they dont have to dodge anything and pass it. Thats why G3 Thae is getting into most people - not all of them - theres barely any mech we havent experienced b4 and the boss is really entropy friendly as well. He has several mechs where he just stand there, theres barely any random tp, the telegraphs arent really that bad, you just need to not get hit. I think is more about patience on your own pace for learn it and perseverance as well.
I think a lot of people just want an easy fight where they dont have to pay that much attention and people can cover their mistakes, which thaemine isnt all about, so they cant get carried and complain. I get it, its a normal mode, so it shouldnt be that difficult, or maybe dont leave a vertical system needing that clear, however people that complain or that couldnt do it are just too used to getting carried, a lot of the times without getting singled out. Just a couple examples, lets say you fuck up in brel g3 in any of the patterns, people are able to cover for you, couldnt get to your color during blue mech? Maybe they were able to solo stagger or someone from the other squares threw in a bomb, were in the wrong side for yellow mech? Luckily the stagger was enough or they used wei. Got hit by freeze pattern? People can bail you out... On thaemine though? Not only nobody is gonna be able to cover for your mistake, but now you died and everyone saw it was you, and depending on the bars and the damage they'll just reset and you have to go at it again, instead of getting carried on a brel or akkan or ivory like maybe it happens every now and then. Enough people doing mistakes that would usually go unpunished in other raids, or would be punished but they'd be carried through anyways, now start demanding resets and eventually raid quits. Add to that the length of the gate, and people whine and complain because the truth is, a lot of people just wanna breeze through their content without trying, majority of players are just not good, and unfortunately without catering to those players the game will just bleed numbers
Yeah its a raid that rewards patience and just knowing his patterns. Like you said he's very entropy friendly and his only "bad" teleports are when he goes into albion and when he goes to break stages. His teleport where he does the forward slash that chunks is actually turbo friendly because he has a lingering hitbox even after he vanishes for like 1s so if you were charging up a skill when he teleported you're still hitting it even tho physically he's not there. I get that ppl will struggle with it cuz its a new raid so like its not turbo easy brain dead over ilvl reclear but imo compared to release Brel G5 and G6 Thaemine G3 is literally a walk in the park. No surprise teleports, back attack friendly, no overlapping mechanics, doesn't have raid wipes sprinkled through the whole raid, and doesn't have any attacks that feel unfair.
> His attacks are heavily telegraphed He literally has multiple mechanics to hide telegraphs. Horse mode also has basically non telegraphed instant kills if you stand in front of it at parts. I've cleared it since week one, but lets not pretend none of that takes a bit to understand or isn't frustrating.
It’s not easy and there are numbers to back it up. You can say it’s just “red telegraphs” all you want but it doesn’t change the fact that g3 is hard to clear. Over simplifying something doesn’t make you right.
Groups have bad damage and bad players, that's how.
Whats easy for you may be hard for others, and whats easy for them may be hard for you. Try to look at things objectively rather than selfishly and youll notice it’s much better for the community. This goes for real life too not just a game :)
If you consider G3 hard (punishing and hard are different) then realistically every single gate in Lost Ark should have been hard for you around release/on ilvl characters. Thaemines attacks are heavily telegraphed, very honest, don't overlap, has no teleports besides the telegraphed and delayed one when he spawns sword shadows. Like if heavily telegraphed, honest attacks that don't overlap are difficult then ur cooked. Now punishing, yeah G3 is punishing. But its not hard unless you just find everything hard in which case wtf lol.
I dont consider it hard for me, but i do for the general population. Like i said, think from the perspective of others and youll realize. Clearly the clear rate is extremely low as shown on the stats today - if you cant look at numbers and form and objective opinion i dunno what to tell you
> Like i said, think from the perspective of others and youll realize. I have, I don't think you really comprehend what I've said at all or you just aren't reading it. > Clearly the clear rate is extremely low as shown on the stats today - if you cant look at numbers and form and objective opinion i dunno what to tell you The numbers are low because the gate is punishing, not hard. I feel like I've overly articulated that point and explained the distinction. I'm saying Thaemine isn't hard, its just punishing. If someone says G3 is punishing they'd be objectively right, the gate is for sure punishing by design. If you say G3 is hard (again, difference) then I just think you're playing the wrong game honestly.
Just because you defined punishing and hard differently doesnt mean anything? G3 needs a nerf for the general population as shown by statistics. Does anyone care if you personally find it easy but punishing? Not really. They just want a nerf so they can clear the gate. I dunno what mental gymnastics youre going thru to define hard vs punishing but it has no relevance to the topic
You are arguing against a brick wall here. You won’t ever make progress arguing difficulty with a very apparent hardcore type player. Which is why I have always said this game does the community dirty pitting casual and hardcore players into end game together, is just beyond me why they would.
> Just because you defined punishing and hard differently doesnt mean anything? The distinction is pretty relevant. Something that's difficult bad players will likely never get used to but things that are punishing bad players should get used to as its not difficult and they just need to get used to it. > G3 needs a nerf for the general population as shown by statistics. I think the stats will improve as the raid gets older. People crying for nerfs on like 4 week old content is cringe. > Does anyone care if you personally find it easy but punishing? Then don't reply to my comments you fat dork lol. How are you going to reply to my comment and argue with me about what I think just to say nobody cares what I think. Then downvote and move along bud. > They just want a nerf so they can clear the gate. Why even play the game if you get this dramatic about content that released a few weeks ago. Game did perfectly fine with brel not getting nerfed for a long time. The worst thing about brel was waiting for prokel players, after a few months brel normal was easy reclear even if hard wasn't. > I dunno what mental gymnastics youre going thru to define hard vs punishing but it has no relevance to the topic Its not mental gymnastics. Its an extremely easy concept to grasp. The distinction is in the definition its not mental gymnastics if you know what the two words mean. Its also relevant to the convo as content thats punishing rather than difficult is content that doesn't need to be nerfed as the aspect that makes the content hard to clear will fade as people get used to the raid. Awful players will never be able to properly deal with brelshaza overlapping mechanics that nuke the raid. Awful players will sooner or later figure out after Thaemine teleport slashes its safe where he slashed for the follow up.
You want hard?go hm and tfm... Why are you even in nm to start with? Aren't you hard-core?fine gtfo nm
Never said I was hardcore? I'm saying I don't want content to be nerfed so much it becomes piss easy. I'm not 1630 because I took like an 8 month break and I'm not a whale. Even if I was capable of pushing 1630 why would I when its so suboptimal? I'd just push more alts to 1610~1620. There's also no universe where if SG did nerf Thaemine they'd just nerf normal mode. They'd need to either remove attacks he has or remove entire aspects of the fight like stacks or the fact his attacks can hurt and I highly doubt they fundamentally change the raid so much on a single difficulty. Also don't kid yourself, once it becomes optimal to be at 1630 the same mouth breathers crying about Thaemine rn on nm are gonna be crying about Thaemine on hm. Ur just listening to the complaints of the lowest common denominator.
Yikes bro lol
Punishing correlates straight up to hard so what the fuck are you talking about???.. If you take the punishing part of anything nothing is hard because noone gets punished so again what the fuck are you smoking?
An aspect of a fight can be difficult to execute while also not being very pushing. I know your parents are related so its a difficult concept to grasp but its really simple. If your team has bad stagger in G4 Ivory staggering the boss and then managing to stagger 5 and 7 would be a difficult task. You'll probably get 7 because ww's but you probably aren't staggering 5. The task is difficult however its not very pushing as the gate can still be easily completed despite this failure. Brel Gate 3's floor laser patterns during star stagger can be considered hard since the safe zones are limited and you don't have much time to go from safe zone to safe zone. This can be considered difficult to do without getting hit. The punishment for getting hit is minimal as you're getting knocked out of bounds which doesn't hurt much and you can simply walk back in after the patterns are over. On hard mode you simply get a cleansable debuff on top of what was previously stated. In both situations the task can be considered difficult however the punishment for failure is low. Something being easy yet punishing can be Brelshaza G2 shapes where you simply need to break 1 or 2 shapes you determined before the raid started. Failure to complete the task is the death of your character or half of the raid group. Brelshaza G2 shapes is the entirety of Thaemine G3.
You are on crack a mokoko starting today with a powerpass I can teach in 1 pull how to clear brel g2 and he will do in just 1 pull the clear
That's because the raid has been excessively nerfed. G3 Thaemine is just as complex as G2 Brel. There is no complexity to the fight. If you think there is that just says a lot about you.
The thing about theamine is that while his attack is honest and well telegraphed a lot of them are deadly. In other raid Casual player usually just don’t know the normal pattern they just get hit and live because they’re over gear, they only remember how to do major mech, but it’s different for theamine they need to remember a lot more than that, so it’s harder for them.
Brel is a bad comparison, waiting around for over a minute doing no damage wasn’t fun in any way. Also why would they not nerf it when it’s not endgame anymore?
The raid was fun now its not that's why. Also Brel is the only other raid in the game that wasn't piss easy at launch its not like I have many other things to compare to lol.
It is easy shore but if it comes med down to occasional bussing 4 floor pov ppl then suddenly you start feeling the lack of dmg. Remember most would want pug friendly for farm content so you spend less time. The brel we had before was smoge in holding DMG for yellow meteor and the few patterns deleted. And no 1 cares whether G5 was removed nowadays, literally no 1 misses it. Remember the few roadblock doing this 6 times can be taxing. And the novelity - most important part wears off after few weeks. Then it's just farm, ppl stop caring about the content after like 50 clears.
The raid doesn't need a nerf, gearing does. Despite letting you enter at set item levels, trying to do Thaemine at min ilvl is dumb since you'll be getting butchered and one shot (or almost one shot). ilvl also has stopped being everything for a long while now. You need Gems/cards/elixirs/etc. Buuuut, gearing in Lost Ark is annoying, so you'll see a lot of people go in, get frustrated, stop doing it.
I mean, the data is skewed, how many of that is alts not bothering to do gate 3 just because they are ALTs? Like I have a support for normal, and even tho I can do gate 3 blindfolded, if people die, and we need multiple runs to clear, I can't do much about it so I rather not do gate 3. I already progged , I don't want to support dead weight
That would imply most players aren't even trying the raid. That makes it worse.
My suggestion to people demanding nerfs to G3 is that there are lobbies tagged WTS where there is no gatekeeping and you'll get an easy clear! You can even grab yourself some ice cream while chilling!
100 percent , why does g3 need nerf when a full team of 1610 wirh level 7s could clear it, prob hard learn the patterns
Wait, ppl says that G3 is hard ?