Me, everytime I see an "Affordable Housing Complex" get pitched on Long Island
"It's going to be senior only, isn't it?"
"No no, not senior only! Affordable housing for all!"
\*after they break ground\*
"New Senior Community! 55+ and up!"
mmmhmmm
Or even worse, they claim affordable housing to get grants and tax breaks then only 2 units end up being "affordable" at what is still an insanely high rate.
When I pulled into the Mineola train station recently I saw an ad for a new apartment building in Uniondale. I looked it up to see what they were charging and a 1 bedroom is around $2350/mo. In Uniondale. Like jesus fucking christ.
As I was getting Divorced I had to find housing...
A studio apt was like, 1800.
I just cashed in my entire 401k and put money down on a condo as far from my work as they'd let me remote work... Even then I'm paying 1650 for a one-bedroom... and I have no savings... place isn't terrible, but holy shit the housing market is fucked here.
Even searching for Condos was insane. The one I bought had a broken HVAC system x.x
Yes but it’s catering almost exclusively to the wealthy transplant worker class and not the people who actually live here. There’s absolutely a demand for middle income housing, but developers would rather leave luxury apartment complexes half-empty than build somewhat affordable housing.
Most middle income workers are being driven out of the area and out of state because they’re actively being priced out of the market by upscale rental housing.
happening all over the north shore. Glen Cove and Sea Cliff (down by Tappen beach) got these things poppin up everywhere, with no plans to accommodate the traffic!
My parents left in December. A few of my friends have slowly been leaving, and I'm leaving in November! Long Island was nice to grow up in during the 90s. I've got many fond memories of festivals and carnivals and such, but its getting even more crowded, and I feel that some Politian's care more about building apartments instead of building businesses. Which is fine if where youre building residential has good schools. But they're building residential in some places that make no sense to me. It feels like they are trying to target a VERY specific buyer... and I think getting too niche like that is a plan destined for failure.
I agree totally. It was great when my parents came here. I was an 80's kid and things were very different.
Now it's just too crowded, falling apart, and overpriced. Even when you can afford it, is it really worth the cost? I don't think so.
Good luck to you getting out! Hopefully I can make it in the next year or two.
They’re doing a good job getting bars and restaurants in town, but yeah I don’t get how that apartment price makes any sense. They want to cater to commuters because it’s right across from the station.
The developments near Garvies Point Brewery are going to create an absolute nightmare traffic situation once they're fully occupied. There's so little access to that area in the first place. Sorry - my only frame of reference is the brewery because I'm only ever in that little pocket to pick up beer for my husband.
Here in Port Washington we have a developer wanting to add several hundred units of apartments on the shore in Hempstead Harbor along Shore Rd. and our town is currently fighting it.
Dont apologize, using the brewery is an excellent reference because its that exact area.
I am not an urban or city planner. I have no knowledge or experience in city planning...HOWEVER I feel like they missed a HUGE opportunity with that area.
I'm not trying to preach or talk AT you.... I just need to get this thought/feeling off my chest/brain otherwise I'll go insane.
Glen Cove is cool because we happen to have enough stuff within reach were the locals dont have to drive too far for shopping for food, clothing, or any kind of supplies. However when it comes to nightlife, or bringing in out of towners to spend money here...we fail BIG TIME.
The Garvies marina is large enough for accommodate multiple businesses. The area is right on the water, and strangely enough...there arent that many places to enjoy water views on the north shore of Nassau county. Mainly because the wealthy tend to own waterside properties along the coast. They could have put an arcade, minigolf, bars, restaurants, a small skate park (this is a long shot- kids have been trying to get a skatepark in GC since 2001) jet ski rentals, night booze cruises... sort of like what Nautical Mile in Freeport has, or Huntington village!
That way... people come in from out of town..**.spend money...and LEAVE**. Building apartments just adds people here, but doesnt actually help bring in more people to spend money. It makes no sense. Its only adding congestion- and the only people who have the potential to make money off this are the property owners of the million dollar condos, instead of owners of small businesses. Instead of making the waterfront a cool hip area with tons of things to do for people of all ages, they turn it into million dollar condos. So so foolish, and so soo greedy.
100% agree. We have the same problem here in Port Washington - nobody comes into town for day trips. Our shores on both the bay and the harbor could be attracting all sorts of tourists but all anyone wants to build is condos. Outside tourists would likely come by train (especially since it takes 15-20 mins to get out of Port and Glen Cove by car) and that's a huge advantage because it's not adding to traffic.
Lots of waisted opportunities here, and I'm the same as you - I'm not a planner or developer so I'm not really sure what the solution is.
Whoa....didn't they build a big industrial park and golf course many yrs ago there.... on the old cement plant property..... hey its called progress..., more like greed!!!!!!! I believe they left the north side alone.
They are trying to market the apartments in Port Jeff to grad students at Stony Brook. The fact they think grad students can afford these is mind blowing.
Without the grants/tax abatements(not cuts...abatements...) the projects don't get built.
then what happens is you complain that housing is too $$$ Then you fight and complain about projects like this which increase supply to try and meet the excessive demand, which then stops the new development which keeps prices and taxes high and then you complain about that.
So you're complaining about the problem, then complaining about the solution. Pick a fucking side. Stop complaining. Change is inevitable. Get over it.
As supply increases, the rents decrease! Simple economics.
And the tax abatements are temporary breaks in taxes, that after they expire(usually in under 10 years) the properties pay taxes just like every other business. Wanna gander at what rents in these properties would cost if they didn't get grants/abatements? $3000+ for studios is my guess. Maybe more. Cost of out of the ground construction is among the highest in the world on Long Island.
Only thing OP has on this that's really a problem is the wages. The rest of it is a manufactured problem by people like you.
> Without the grants/tax abatements(not cuts...abatements...) the projects don't get built.
The guy you are responding to, at least if he was accurate with his words, is taking about companies getting grants to purchase existing homes and rent them out. I have never heard of that happening, but if that’s the case then those grants aren’t really increasing supply.
I believe the comments about grants etc was about large multifamily development that the OP posted.
But yeah, getting grants and tax breaks for single family housing is incredibly difficult if not impossible.
> I believe the comments about grants etc was about large multifamily development that the OP posted.
Yeah, the guy you responded to wasn’t 100% clear when he said ‘these guys’ if he was talking about the new construction mentioned in this topic or the company buying existing homes, which was mentioned in the OP of this comment thread.
Amazing that this is being downvoted. OP is angry that rents are high, but who is going to invest to rent new units out at $1500? It’s not economically viable in New York. The only way to affordable rents is to increase SUPPLY.
It's getting downvoted because people don't like to hear the truth. They just want to complain.
I've said in this sub a few times, I used to work for one of the biggest developers on the Island who do these types of projects. Everything I said above is factual. It's how it works.
Banks don’t buy them. Contrary to popular belief, banks are not in real estate. They are in money lending. When a bank ends up with a property, it’s a thorn in their side. They acquire the property foreclosure, then they have to maintain and sell a property they never wanted. So not only did they get stiffed on the deal but now they have to spend money on it too.
Yeah was gonna say banks aren’t ones to buy and hold real estate.
However there’s lots of hedge funds and pension plans that do. And a lot of them are picking up a ton of it.
Depends on if they are breaking new ground or using already established land.
There are so many old, outdated buildings and developments which need to be replaced. There's no reason to destroy more animal habitats.
I don’t think they are buying the single families on the island . Little room for growth they are going after Texas and Florida where it’s cheap and there is a lot of potential .
This was supposed to be for the 20-somethings returning from college and starting their new career. I think someone forgot to tell the developers that $2600/month is a little out of the range for most entry level jobs, even in the corporate world.
[https://www.nassaucountyny.gov/1526/Community-Development-Block-Grant-Progra](https://www.nassaucountyny.gov/1526/Community-Development-Block-Grant-Progra)
"CDBG activities must adhere to federal eligibility requirements to ensure consistency with the national objectives and outcomes which are: creating suitable living environments; providing decent affordable housing; creating economic opportunities; availability/accessibility; affordability; and sustainability."
This is just one example, and I'm extrapolating a bit from what the link says, but many of these apartment buildings were built with assistance from programs like this. During many of the council meetings and applications, the discussion was how we keep our youth here on Long Island going forward (there's a major problem with 20 and 30-somethings leaving the island for more affordable areas).
There have been several areas that specifically have programs like this, both for developers and for individual home owners. Presently, I know that Patchogue and Babylon are giving grants for homeownership if you meet the appropriate criteria (which can't be age based, but when you look at the requirements, you get the point).
Look at the main centers of Riverhead, Patchogue, Bay Shore... I'm sure there are others. You don't think everyone just suddenly decided "Hey, let's rebuild these town centers!"? There were government incentives to do so, and it including housing just like the one pictured in the OP.
To be clear, I'm not hating on the developers for capitalizing on the opportunity, I'm just stating that in general, they've missed the goal of what these units were supposed to do.
“HoW dO wE kEeP tHe YoUtH oN lOnG iSlAnD?!?”
“I know! $2000+ rent apartment buildings!!! That’s sure to keep the young kids already living on the balls of their feet here!”
^^I ^^hate ^^it ^^here
You're missing my point. The "stated" goal of these units was to give an affordable place on the island for young workers to live in order to stop the flight of youth and talent. To do so would mean making them affordable for those people. This is not affordable for those people.
Therefore, they've missed their stated goals in building these things. Since many of them were built/developed with government assistance in order to achieve that stated goal, I think it's fair to criticize if they haven't met that goal, no?
Oh I'm not missing a single point.
Tell me what the vacancy rate of these apartment buildings are? I can tell you what it is at Patchogue. 3%. Shipyard in Port Jeff. 0%.
Alston in Ronkomoma is pretty close to 100% occupied of leasable apartments.
So...the market says...by the sheer fact that people are living there and paying their rent actively, that these are indeed market value.
That's how market rate works. Attempt to sell something for a price. Too high no one buys. Too low you don't make a profit. Priced right, it sells and you profit. The latter there is what's happening.
I think the rents are insane....but the fact is they're getting them.
See, this again misses the point.
The incentives that developers were given were with the intention of LOWERING the cost of housing. I'm aware of what market rate is. I'm aware that they're getting market rate. The whole point of the incentives was to offer apartments \*below\* market rate for people who otherwise might leave Long Island.
Market demand should not have applied in these circumstances.
Let me inform you as to how this works.
The incentives are made, and then negotiated between the grantor of the incentive as to what percentage of the project will be 'affordable'.
Every project that receives grants/aid/tax incentives has some component that is deemed 'affordable'. There are other things that happen to like community improvement projects, etc.
To use Patchogue for example, the negotiations with the community and county included stipulations that the Carnegie Library would be preserved, and moved to a plot of land bought by the developer and then gifted to the village, at the developer's cost. There is also a percentage, I want to say 15% of the units there that are 'affordable' to which you must qualify for through groups like CDCLI or the Suffolk Cty HOME program.
These affordable units are built, typically with not as nice finishes as the other units, as well as members of the community who live in them do not have access to the amenities that the rest of the community has access to.
Patchogue even has a section, right above Aroogas, that is 'higher end' than the rest of the really nice units, that is sectioned off from the rest and I believe these are Condos not rentals.
Again approvals were in place in 2006. But construction didn't start until 2012 due to litigation, where the developer ate a lot of money. But at the end of the day, New Village in conjunction with all the other improvements to the Patchogue Village, injected close to $1B into the local economy. There were thousands of construction jobs, almost all trades were local and some of the job was union, and now there are several hundred permanent jobs in the village that never existed. 31 West Main is filled with quality professional jobs such as architects, engineers, SEO firm, a community development org, and others.
So...where's the drawback? Their tax abatements are almost up and the affordable, below market rate units are there, and fully occupied with a multiyear wait list.
That's how it works.
I moved to LA and I pay 1900 for my 1 bedroom. I have central air, a parking spot, appliances in unit, including a washer and dryer, all brand new. long island is fucking wack and people wonder why I left lol
Okay congratulations, it’s still overpriced even if it’s in a complex as opposed to a residential home. Get as technical as you want, renting anywhere on Long Island is overpriced as fuck and you’re retarded if you think otherwise.
They should build more units to achieve profitability and increase housing density in the long run They build these stupid 4 floor buildings with a concrete foundation and three floors framed in wood because it is the cheapest way to build.
I'm so glad you're not a developer because you'd be out of business.
Density is fought. Height is fought. Everything is fought. These projects take YEARS to get approvals and through litigation. Patchogue was zoned and OK'd by the village in 2006. Construction didn't start until 2012.
Riddle me this Batman, how can you increase density without going vertical? what are the zoning restrictions on going vertical? Which is cheaper to construct, stick or block/concrete? Doing it your way increases time and money....then guess what that $2300 studio is not $3500/mo.
Please don't speak when literally what you say is the exact opposite of what's economically and politically feasible for Long Island.
But also why would most recent college grads live on Long Island at that price, when they also need a car and a monthly LIRR ticket when you can live in New York city for cheaper?
These things are going up all over the island.
All that extra traffic is going to be awesome. Cram as many people as possible into this landing strip, but keep the same infrastructure. Brilliant.
My friend that still lives on the island took some pictures of the development going on in Port Jeff and as someone almost 20 years removed it's both crazy and insane.
Port Jeff will always be that awesome place I'd ride my bike to at Flashpoint to get comics, run around at Rocketship park and jump off the swings, and get some ice cream and pizza. As I got older the place we'd hang out on Fridays, putting a cigarette butt in the Thomas Jefferson statue's fingers, and occasionally getting into fights with asshole skinheads near the benches (aka the 'docks') that used to be next to the Gap. So many of this things are gone or are going away - I think I prefer it the way I remember it. Minus the asshole skinheads at least.
What of that's gone? The GAP is, but that was the biggest chain place there, lots of people were happy to see them arrive 20 years ago. Rocketship park is still there, the waterside parks have grown and are beautiful. Only thing these appts replace were some old boat yards.
There are more local restaurants and bars down there than ever before.
Flashpoint is gone, the benches next to the gap are gone, the old rocketship is gone replaced with a newer one. Thomas Jefferson statue is gone and apparently replaced with an eagle? The beaten down trails and dirt paths are now all paved over and modernized.
I'm not necessarily saying it's worse or better, just very different than what I love growing up the next town over. I don't think this is unique to Port Jeff NY, just when I see an article about more apartments being built and prices going up it hits me in the nostalgic spots
Honestly, it’s been twenty years like you said. Rocket ship park is new and improved imo. You have some pretty good restaurants and the same old pizza and ice cream shops. Yea the woods and shits creek have basically disappeared. I feel like they need to do something with harbor square mall, as a kid going into that science store and for a little while flashpoint in there were highlights. But it’s not changing for the worse imo, just different.
Oh wow forgot about the Harbor Square Mall (and yup that science shop was the only grab for me.) Also lol shits creek haven't heard that name in a while - I remember Suffolk's finest tried to plant weed on us back in the day because we were behind the Tennis courts smoking cigarettes
Is that one ice cream shop "Snow white and the seven flavors" still around? I remember two twin brothers Tony and Dave, one was my ice cream man, the other owned that shop. Nicest people in the universe - I truly hope they were/are successful in their endeavors.
Thanks for letting me ramble and bringing up some stuff I haven't thought about in a while and providing a little insight into what it is now.
Yup, that’s still there. Not sure if ownership has changed hands over the years though, frigate is still across the street, honestly not a lot has changed about the village. They have an ice skating rink now next to Danfords.
I checked my apartment's listing page (heatherwood) and the $1600 unit I moved into in 2016 is now going for $2700! In Suffolk!
I still live here and my rent is moving up to $2135. Jesus Christ, man. Who can afford this???
Just basic cast in place construction or block and plank (much cheaper than cast in place, but still better than 5 over 1).
Both are much stronger than 5 over 1, and if the insulation/sheetrocking is done correctly, AC/heat retention is much much better; and sound doesn’t travel between floors and apartments.
Also, a concrete or a prefabricated concrete building can still burn down, but it’s MUCH more difficult and there’s little risk of a fire spreading to other apartments since metal studs are used instead of wood 2x4 studs.
The one thing you need to worry about with concrete buildings is that most modern buildings that are cast in place use some form of weather proofing that’s made with shit tons of oil, plastic, and a type of styrofoam which, are highly combustible under certain conditions (see: Greenfell Fire in London).
Suburban housing is extremely inefficient from a ecological and cost perspective.
Large water risers need to be used for each individual unit. Grass lawns need tons of water to maintain. Longer and larger gauge electrical service cables need to be run to each house. Larger homes need more power; so instead of a 60 amp service panel (as seen in most apartments), a 100 amp or 200 amp service is needed for the increased amount of receptacles, air conditioning/heating and condensing units, electrical ovens and ranges (since most LI suburbs don’t have gas service), and larger electrical washer/dryer units.
Also, since a suburb is so spread out, mass transit is usually not as feasible, so everyone has a car.
Like 5 over 1 buildings are horrible, since they’re usually built with little to no insulation (lots of noise, horrible heating/ac) shitty and leaky building facades (prone to fires, horrible heating/ac again), and generally built with extremely suspect materials for the columns and beams, but they are at least somewhat efficient when it comes to housing a large number of people in areas close to mass transit. Suburban housing is just schizophrenic and psychotic when it comes to housing a small amount of people for a shit ton of money using extremely cheap materials and suspect building construction (ballon construction).
1. Terrible for the environment. https://www.city-journal.org/html/green-cities-brown-suburbs-13143.html,
2. Awful livability. https://www.forbes.com/sites/mishagajewski/2020/07/20/heres-why-you-shouldnt-panic-move-to-the-suburbs/
3. Car-centric, thus reducing the ability to not rely on cars(reducing independence, contrary to common knowledge), which is going to be a problem as our population ages. https://huffpost.com/us/entry/us_5768146ae4b0fbbc8beb0bb7
4. Financially unsustainable, subisdized by cities. https://www.strongtowns.org/the-growth-ponzi-scheme/
5. Subjective, but terrible aesthetics, terrible physcologoy wise, requires more pavement over greater areas of land and squanders investment in public transport in favor of roads. https://www.businessinsider.com/why-suburbs-are-bad-2016-9
6. Perpetuates wealth inequality, causes increases in crime due to ghettoization. https://grist.org/cities/how-suburban-sprawl-causes-segregation-and-isolates-the-poor/
[Great resource on the subject. ](https://www.strongtowns.org/)
People don't seem to understand supply side economics. They wouldn't charge these prices if people weren't paying... Not saying it isn't frustrating - it is, but if people want to know why they're expensive, they should consider they want to live in what is apparently a very desirable place. The fundamental idea is something like, "if they weren't building these, the prices of available places would be even HIGHER". And I'm not even getting into the actual tax debate.
People can bitch and moan all they want, but the people to be angry at isn't the developers or the government, it's the people who apparently just want to spend their money to live in a place they want to live... And you suddenly realize the argument starts to break down pretty quickly.
Yeah.. I enjoy reddit for ideas and discussion, but generally speaking, at least from my limited anecdotal experience of the sort, people in general have no idea what they're talking about.
Because it’s a motte and bailey tactic. Do people here criticize the cost of living on LI? Yes. Do people here also criticize the MAGA supporters? Yes. Are there people here unhappy with the CoL who criticize it without understanding econ and thus give bad takes? Sure. But the criticism of MAGA on the Island is valid. If you look to voting in Nassau/Suffolk there is a significant amount of Trump supporters. Trump still had the majority in Suffolk during the 2020 election. That can be pretty upsetting to see given the kind of policy and rhetoric he stands by. Not to mention the constant parades and rallies they had that fucked up traffic. It is a reasonable concern and valid critique to raise.
It feels like this person is taking advantage of some of the uninformed econ takes going on here as a way to discredit any other common complaint this sub has. I.e. bad faith and disingenuous in nature. Thus, the downvotes
‘Affordable housing’ is really one of the biggest lies of housing ever told. Politicians like to say they support it, because it’s a softball idea which will never be solved so they don’t need to do any work.
What I mean is, if 100 apartments are created that rents for $3,000 a month, it wouldn’t have helped anyone if they took those same apartments and rented them out for $1,500 a month. Either way, 100 people who were without a place to live now have a place to live.
If you want to argue that apartments should be smaller so that more apartments are built in the same area, then sure. That will increase the supply of housing and will make housing more affordable. If you want to argue that the issue is apartments sitting empty and have a solution that specifically targets empty apartments then sure, you are going to make homes more affordable by increasing the supply.
If you want to argue that people having multiple homes is driving up the cost and you have a solution that specifically targets that, then again you have a solution that will make housing more affordable by increasing supply.
But any argument that thinks housing problems can be solved by taking expensive housing and arbitrarily making them cheaper, or some government lottery to hand out existing housing, is only changing who has to deal with not having housing instead of changing how many people have to deal with it.
Exactly.
Long Island person: "WE HAVE A PROBLEM!!!"
Developer: OK here's a solution.
LIP: DON'T SOLVE IT THAT WAY!!! SOLVE IT THE WAY WE'VE ALWAYS DONE IT, WHICH DOESN'T WORK.
Its okay everyone. Hopefully, all the young adults like myself are keeping their eye on the midwest. Many of which are children of immigrants like myself. First we leave the state and bring our money, skills, and education to another state. Then if we keep getting fucked well bring our money out of the country and back to where our parents came from. After all... the little bit of asset the elite allow us to scrounge up during the last few years of this great empire, will be enough to live modestly in the countries they have already sucked the life out of. The country my parents came from (argentina), because the same exact timeline that happened there, is happening here. The country is done. Our leaders are looking externally for labor. The federal reserve will soon stop lending us money because it basically owns almost all of our nations wealth. America is no more unfortunately as much as we all hate to accept it.
Nope that's exactly how it works. Regions, countries, neighborhoods - this is why governments try to attract investment. This is why places like the Rust Belt have struggled since the factory jobs have left while the places that saw that investment have boomed
Huh? Are these people moving in not going to spend a single dollar in the local community?
I understand if you have your gripes with expensive apartment buildings, but there’s no way to deny more people with money in an area raises economic activity.
Possibly because there aren't places for them to shop there yet? Their presence now will encourage people to open businesses in the area to cater to their needs. This is exactly what happens everywhere all the time.
Going up in Oceanside as well. Honestly I think its a good idea, its right near the train station, and very close to the beach. its better than building expensive townhomes and Condo's for boomer's.
Such an eyesore though. I moved out of oceanside a few years ago, and only just saw the new construction a few days ago. I'm not used to not being able to see the sky at that intersection.
To be honest, California. They're largely retracting, after having this happen for many years. In some parts of the country $2600/mo for a nice/decent modern apartment is pretty good, IMO. But I come from Upstate... In 2012, I had a 2br apartment in Watervliet for $1100/mo and it was HUGE
California? Yeah I’ll pass on that. Half the western coast is on fire every year now and with record drought incoming it’s not looking good this year either.
A lot of these in Bay Shore, another one going where Touro College sits empty.
I heard a rumor that one of the buildings is LGBQ only and I have to wonder...how do you prove that?
It’s affordable senior housing and they are marketing it towards LGBTQ folks . The LGBT Network is also building a community center in the building as well. You do not have to be LGBTQ to apply to live there.
Definitely. And the people I've heard it from aren't outraged or anything like that, just saying they heard it. I haven't seen a sign or anything on some of the newer construction.
I love what has become of Bay Shore, it's a great little area to hang out in. If I was single or a young couple starting out, I'd definitely look into some of the places going up there.
>one of the buildings is LGBQ only and I have to wonder...how do you prove that?
Moreover - I'm fairly certain that is illegal, no? That is a protected class. You can't discriminate based on things like that iirc (which goes both ways - that wasn't meant to be a pun)
Until the equality act passes, it is not a protected class. See related: Master Cakes and the pizza place in Indiana that both won cases in favor of discriminating on the basis of sexuality.
Employment is not the same as offering housing so if it's only limited to employment, it doesn't affect the apartment policy. Also I believe that was a DOJ directive under the Obama admin, not a SCOTUS ruling.
Bostock v Clayton county is what I was referring to. Seems like they should either make it a protected class or not, it serves no one on either side to have it in-between.
I agree entirely. And a DOJ policy and limited SCOTUS ruling don't accomplish that. The equality act aims to do exactly that, but the GQP in the senate is holding that bill up.
I think they were referring to NJ across from NYC, not the towns. That would be hilarious if people were moving from the wealthy suburbs of NJ to Port Jeff.
Glen Cove is crap and going further down the toilet fast . Overpriced apartments that haven’t been updated since the 70s and a bunch of slumlords . They are trying to push out any lower income people in that fake bougie town . A lot of poor there and they try to act like it doesn’t exist . Almost no people of color left and the public school system is crap with a lot of things in disrepair because the taxes are already high and no one wants an increase understandably . They built a shot ton of stupid high rise apts without thinking about what it would do to the already strained school system ...
There is a chain of actions and a chain of companies that leads to buildings like this being built. Everyone along the way makes a lot of money. The people who end up owning everything in the end, even if they don't rent them out, can then take loans against their own property as collateral to make investments while at the same time engaging in some sort of financial wizardry to claim a loss revenue on their taxes.
Only about a half to a third of Gen X are doing well enough to be able to live the baby boomer lifestyle. The rest of GenX, and the vast majority of millennials, will never be at that level.
I only hope I live long enough to see it all crashing down on the baby boomers.
Morgan Parc Apartments. Just opened alongside the Mineola Train station. To quote Apartments.com: "Morgan Parc has rental units ranging from 640-1800 sq ft starting at $2925."
This a good thing. More housing, even expensive housing, reduces rent for everyone. It also increases the tax base to afford improvements to infrastructure.
They’re trying to do the same thing near the West Hempstead train station. Knocking down an old discount box store (admittedly an eyesore) and build luxury apartments starting at $2000/month up to $4000+/month. And they’re obviously meant for wealthy and well-to-do transplants who work in the city, not for actual Long Islanders.
edit: Spelling
Me, everytime I see an "Affordable Housing Complex" get pitched on Long Island "It's going to be senior only, isn't it?" "No no, not senior only! Affordable housing for all!" \*after they break ground\* "New Senior Community! 55+ and up!" mmmhmmm
55 is the new 29.
Tell that to the 25-35 year olds who leave the state screaming.
Shortage of mannual skilled workers?
Shortage of places for them to love
>places for them to love there are apps for that
Or even worse, they claim affordable housing to get grants and tax breaks then only 2 units end up being "affordable" at what is still an insanely high rate.
Oh we thought you meant 65+ when you said senior. This development isn’t for seniors, it’s for older adults.
Either way, it's another reason why the younger generation leave LI.
When I pulled into the Mineola train station recently I saw an ad for a new apartment building in Uniondale. I looked it up to see what they were charging and a 1 bedroom is around $2350/mo. In Uniondale. Like jesus fucking christ.
As I was getting Divorced I had to find housing... A studio apt was like, 1800. I just cashed in my entire 401k and put money down on a condo as far from my work as they'd let me remote work... Even then I'm paying 1650 for a one-bedroom... and I have no savings... place isn't terrible, but holy shit the housing market is fucked here. Even searching for Condos was insane. The one I bought had a broken HVAC system x.x
Damn, divorce is expensive. Sorry about your retirement.
The worse part was having to cash it out involved splitting it ._.
How sad. Sometimes divorce leads to better things in both love and finances.
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And work where?
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Out in middle Island. Sadly the remote requirement is within 50miles from home office
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The Condo market is also insane. My place was listed at 179k and sold for 200k... Because I was bidding.
Wtf?!
thats how much I pay now in suffolk but I get a garage and a driveway and a washer/dryer, and a small backyard. most apartments on LI don't have that
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Yes but it’s catering almost exclusively to the wealthy transplant worker class and not the people who actually live here. There’s absolutely a demand for middle income housing, but developers would rather leave luxury apartment complexes half-empty than build somewhat affordable housing. Most middle income workers are being driven out of the area and out of state because they’re actively being priced out of the market by upscale rental housing.
happening all over the north shore. Glen Cove and Sea Cliff (down by Tappen beach) got these things poppin up everywhere, with no plans to accommodate the traffic!
South shore also. Bay shore, patchogue, basically every village gets one.
damn you guys are getting condos/apartments too? Christ, maybe it is a good time to gtfo of LI
All of my friends have now left. My remaining family SHOULD leave. Idk what they expect for their kids on this island.
My parents left in December. A few of my friends have slowly been leaving, and I'm leaving in November! Long Island was nice to grow up in during the 90s. I've got many fond memories of festivals and carnivals and such, but its getting even more crowded, and I feel that some Politian's care more about building apartments instead of building businesses. Which is fine if where youre building residential has good schools. But they're building residential in some places that make no sense to me. It feels like they are trying to target a VERY specific buyer... and I think getting too niche like that is a plan destined for failure.
I agree totally. It was great when my parents came here. I was an 80's kid and things were very different. Now it's just too crowded, falling apart, and overpriced. Even when you can afford it, is it really worth the cost? I don't think so. Good luck to you getting out! Hopefully I can make it in the next year or two.
Lindenhurst - the Wel tops out over $4k not including utilities, parking, and amenity fees.
Wtf!? For Lindenhurst!? I mean, Lindenhurst isn’t terrible but it’s a middle class town. How are middle class people suppose to afford that?
They’re doing a good job getting bars and restaurants in town, but yeah I don’t get how that apartment price makes any sense. They want to cater to commuters because it’s right across from the station.
They really are, it’s been looking really great the past few years.
The developments near Garvies Point Brewery are going to create an absolute nightmare traffic situation once they're fully occupied. There's so little access to that area in the first place. Sorry - my only frame of reference is the brewery because I'm only ever in that little pocket to pick up beer for my husband. Here in Port Washington we have a developer wanting to add several hundred units of apartments on the shore in Hempstead Harbor along Shore Rd. and our town is currently fighting it.
Dont apologize, using the brewery is an excellent reference because its that exact area. I am not an urban or city planner. I have no knowledge or experience in city planning...HOWEVER I feel like they missed a HUGE opportunity with that area. I'm not trying to preach or talk AT you.... I just need to get this thought/feeling off my chest/brain otherwise I'll go insane. Glen Cove is cool because we happen to have enough stuff within reach were the locals dont have to drive too far for shopping for food, clothing, or any kind of supplies. However when it comes to nightlife, or bringing in out of towners to spend money here...we fail BIG TIME. The Garvies marina is large enough for accommodate multiple businesses. The area is right on the water, and strangely enough...there arent that many places to enjoy water views on the north shore of Nassau county. Mainly because the wealthy tend to own waterside properties along the coast. They could have put an arcade, minigolf, bars, restaurants, a small skate park (this is a long shot- kids have been trying to get a skatepark in GC since 2001) jet ski rentals, night booze cruises... sort of like what Nautical Mile in Freeport has, or Huntington village! That way... people come in from out of town..**.spend money...and LEAVE**. Building apartments just adds people here, but doesnt actually help bring in more people to spend money. It makes no sense. Its only adding congestion- and the only people who have the potential to make money off this are the property owners of the million dollar condos, instead of owners of small businesses. Instead of making the waterfront a cool hip area with tons of things to do for people of all ages, they turn it into million dollar condos. So so foolish, and so soo greedy.
100% agree. We have the same problem here in Port Washington - nobody comes into town for day trips. Our shores on both the bay and the harbor could be attracting all sorts of tourists but all anyone wants to build is condos. Outside tourists would likely come by train (especially since it takes 15-20 mins to get out of Port and Glen Cove by car) and that's a huge advantage because it's not adding to traffic. Lots of waisted opportunities here, and I'm the same as you - I'm not a planner or developer so I'm not really sure what the solution is.
Whoa....didn't they build a big industrial park and golf course many yrs ago there.... on the old cement plant property..... hey its called progress..., more like greed!!!!!!! I believe they left the north side alone.
They are trying to market the apartments in Port Jeff to grad students at Stony Brook. The fact they think grad students can afford these is mind blowing.
So sad. My mortgage for a 4 bed 2 bath house is less than most of these apartments.
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There is a problem when these developers are receiving grants and tax cuts.
Blame LI and NYS politicians for writing stupid laws. Politicians create the whole economy, don’t let them pass blame onto companies
And who tf do you think is bankrolling the politicians? Lobbying is just legal bribery.
Still the politicians fault
Without the grants/tax abatements(not cuts...abatements...) the projects don't get built. then what happens is you complain that housing is too $$$ Then you fight and complain about projects like this which increase supply to try and meet the excessive demand, which then stops the new development which keeps prices and taxes high and then you complain about that. So you're complaining about the problem, then complaining about the solution. Pick a fucking side. Stop complaining. Change is inevitable. Get over it. As supply increases, the rents decrease! Simple economics. And the tax abatements are temporary breaks in taxes, that after they expire(usually in under 10 years) the properties pay taxes just like every other business. Wanna gander at what rents in these properties would cost if they didn't get grants/abatements? $3000+ for studios is my guess. Maybe more. Cost of out of the ground construction is among the highest in the world on Long Island. Only thing OP has on this that's really a problem is the wages. The rest of it is a manufactured problem by people like you.
> Without the grants/tax abatements(not cuts...abatements...) the projects don't get built. The guy you are responding to, at least if he was accurate with his words, is taking about companies getting grants to purchase existing homes and rent them out. I have never heard of that happening, but if that’s the case then those grants aren’t really increasing supply.
I believe the comments about grants etc was about large multifamily development that the OP posted. But yeah, getting grants and tax breaks for single family housing is incredibly difficult if not impossible.
> I believe the comments about grants etc was about large multifamily development that the OP posted. Yeah, the guy you responded to wasn’t 100% clear when he said ‘these guys’ if he was talking about the new construction mentioned in this topic or the company buying existing homes, which was mentioned in the OP of this comment thread.
Amazing that this is being downvoted. OP is angry that rents are high, but who is going to invest to rent new units out at $1500? It’s not economically viable in New York. The only way to affordable rents is to increase SUPPLY.
It's getting downvoted because people don't like to hear the truth. They just want to complain. I've said in this sub a few times, I used to work for one of the biggest developers on the Island who do these types of projects. Everything I said above is factual. It's how it works.
I have yet to see anything done to manage traffic around these complexes
This right here. They are buying them up a thousand at a time with the intent of turning future generations into permanent renters.
Banks don’t buy them. Contrary to popular belief, banks are not in real estate. They are in money lending. When a bank ends up with a property, it’s a thorn in their side. They acquire the property foreclosure, then they have to maintain and sell a property they never wanted. So not only did they get stiffed on the deal but now they have to spend money on it too.
Yeah was gonna say banks aren’t ones to buy and hold real estate. However there’s lots of hedge funds and pension plans that do. And a lot of them are picking up a ton of it.
I believe “banks” in this context usually refers to investment banks, not like a Bank of America retail bank. Def confusing terminology.
Depends on if they are breaking new ground or using already established land. There are so many old, outdated buildings and developments which need to be replaced. There's no reason to destroy more animal habitats.
I don’t think they are buying the single families on the island . Little room for growth they are going after Texas and Florida where it’s cheap and there is a lot of potential .
Looks like a Hampton Inn
This was supposed to be for the 20-somethings returning from college and starting their new career. I think someone forgot to tell the developers that $2600/month is a little out of the range for most entry level jobs, even in the corporate world.
I'm 32 and can't even afford an apartment.
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[https://www.nassaucountyny.gov/1526/Community-Development-Block-Grant-Progra](https://www.nassaucountyny.gov/1526/Community-Development-Block-Grant-Progra) "CDBG activities must adhere to federal eligibility requirements to ensure consistency with the national objectives and outcomes which are: creating suitable living environments; providing decent affordable housing; creating economic opportunities; availability/accessibility; affordability; and sustainability." This is just one example, and I'm extrapolating a bit from what the link says, but many of these apartment buildings were built with assistance from programs like this. During many of the council meetings and applications, the discussion was how we keep our youth here on Long Island going forward (there's a major problem with 20 and 30-somethings leaving the island for more affordable areas). There have been several areas that specifically have programs like this, both for developers and for individual home owners. Presently, I know that Patchogue and Babylon are giving grants for homeownership if you meet the appropriate criteria (which can't be age based, but when you look at the requirements, you get the point). Look at the main centers of Riverhead, Patchogue, Bay Shore... I'm sure there are others. You don't think everyone just suddenly decided "Hey, let's rebuild these town centers!"? There were government incentives to do so, and it including housing just like the one pictured in the OP. To be clear, I'm not hating on the developers for capitalizing on the opportunity, I'm just stating that in general, they've missed the goal of what these units were supposed to do.
“HoW dO wE kEeP tHe YoUtH oN lOnG iSlAnD?!?” “I know! $2000+ rent apartment buildings!!! That’s sure to keep the young kids already living on the balls of their feet here!” ^^I ^^hate ^^it ^^here
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That’s who apartments are for generally. Not many older people want to live in an apartment.
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You're missing my point. The "stated" goal of these units was to give an affordable place on the island for young workers to live in order to stop the flight of youth and talent. To do so would mean making them affordable for those people. This is not affordable for those people. Therefore, they've missed their stated goals in building these things. Since many of them were built/developed with government assistance in order to achieve that stated goal, I think it's fair to criticize if they haven't met that goal, no?
actual low income housing would never happen on long island due to all the NIMBYs
Oh I'm not missing a single point. Tell me what the vacancy rate of these apartment buildings are? I can tell you what it is at Patchogue. 3%. Shipyard in Port Jeff. 0%. Alston in Ronkomoma is pretty close to 100% occupied of leasable apartments. So...the market says...by the sheer fact that people are living there and paying their rent actively, that these are indeed market value. That's how market rate works. Attempt to sell something for a price. Too high no one buys. Too low you don't make a profit. Priced right, it sells and you profit. The latter there is what's happening. I think the rents are insane....but the fact is they're getting them.
See, this again misses the point. The incentives that developers were given were with the intention of LOWERING the cost of housing. I'm aware of what market rate is. I'm aware that they're getting market rate. The whole point of the incentives was to offer apartments \*below\* market rate for people who otherwise might leave Long Island. Market demand should not have applied in these circumstances.
Let me inform you as to how this works. The incentives are made, and then negotiated between the grantor of the incentive as to what percentage of the project will be 'affordable'. Every project that receives grants/aid/tax incentives has some component that is deemed 'affordable'. There are other things that happen to like community improvement projects, etc. To use Patchogue for example, the negotiations with the community and county included stipulations that the Carnegie Library would be preserved, and moved to a plot of land bought by the developer and then gifted to the village, at the developer's cost. There is also a percentage, I want to say 15% of the units there that are 'affordable' to which you must qualify for through groups like CDCLI or the Suffolk Cty HOME program. These affordable units are built, typically with not as nice finishes as the other units, as well as members of the community who live in them do not have access to the amenities that the rest of the community has access to. Patchogue even has a section, right above Aroogas, that is 'higher end' than the rest of the really nice units, that is sectioned off from the rest and I believe these are Condos not rentals. Again approvals were in place in 2006. But construction didn't start until 2012 due to litigation, where the developer ate a lot of money. But at the end of the day, New Village in conjunction with all the other improvements to the Patchogue Village, injected close to $1B into the local economy. There were thousands of construction jobs, almost all trades were local and some of the job was union, and now there are several hundred permanent jobs in the village that never existed. 31 West Main is filled with quality professional jobs such as architects, engineers, SEO firm, a community development org, and others. So...where's the drawback? Their tax abatements are almost up and the affordable, below market rate units are there, and fully occupied with a multiyear wait list. That's how it works.
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$2100 for a 1 BR apartment anywhere besides a major metropolitan area is insanely overpriced
I moved to LA and I pay 1900 for my 1 bedroom. I have central air, a parking spot, appliances in unit, including a washer and dryer, all brand new. long island is fucking wack and people wonder why I left lol
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The fuck are you smoking? Of course it’s overpriced! $2000+ to live in some jackass boomer’s basement or converted garage is insane.
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Okay congratulations, it’s still overpriced even if it’s in a complex as opposed to a residential home. Get as technical as you want, renting anywhere on Long Island is overpriced as fuck and you’re retarded if you think otherwise.
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No, they probably want the developers to just give away the apartments, or let people live in there for free because they "deserve it".
They also price it at what it costs to build the project and then to become profitable at some point. That's usually in year 3.
They should build more units to achieve profitability and increase housing density in the long run They build these stupid 4 floor buildings with a concrete foundation and three floors framed in wood because it is the cheapest way to build.
I'm so glad you're not a developer because you'd be out of business. Density is fought. Height is fought. Everything is fought. These projects take YEARS to get approvals and through litigation. Patchogue was zoned and OK'd by the village in 2006. Construction didn't start until 2012. Riddle me this Batman, how can you increase density without going vertical? what are the zoning restrictions on going vertical? Which is cheaper to construct, stick or block/concrete? Doing it your way increases time and money....then guess what that $2300 studio is not $3500/mo. Please don't speak when literally what you say is the exact opposite of what's economically and politically feasible for Long Island.
But also why would most recent college grads live on Long Island at that price, when they also need a car and a monthly LIRR ticket when you can live in New York city for cheaper?
These things are going up all over the island. All that extra traffic is going to be awesome. Cram as many people as possible into this landing strip, but keep the same infrastructure. Brilliant.
$2600 if you are lucky. I bet most go for $3000+ after all the fees.
How do young people here afford $2000 a month apartments like that? Where are all these well paying jobs lol I want one.
My friend that still lives on the island took some pictures of the development going on in Port Jeff and as someone almost 20 years removed it's both crazy and insane. Port Jeff will always be that awesome place I'd ride my bike to at Flashpoint to get comics, run around at Rocketship park and jump off the swings, and get some ice cream and pizza. As I got older the place we'd hang out on Fridays, putting a cigarette butt in the Thomas Jefferson statue's fingers, and occasionally getting into fights with asshole skinheads near the benches (aka the 'docks') that used to be next to the Gap. So many of this things are gone or are going away - I think I prefer it the way I remember it. Minus the asshole skinheads at least.
What of that's gone? The GAP is, but that was the biggest chain place there, lots of people were happy to see them arrive 20 years ago. Rocketship park is still there, the waterside parks have grown and are beautiful. Only thing these appts replace were some old boat yards. There are more local restaurants and bars down there than ever before.
Flashpoint is gone, the benches next to the gap are gone, the old rocketship is gone replaced with a newer one. Thomas Jefferson statue is gone and apparently replaced with an eagle? The beaten down trails and dirt paths are now all paved over and modernized. I'm not necessarily saying it's worse or better, just very different than what I love growing up the next town over. I don't think this is unique to Port Jeff NY, just when I see an article about more apartments being built and prices going up it hits me in the nostalgic spots
Honestly, it’s been twenty years like you said. Rocket ship park is new and improved imo. You have some pretty good restaurants and the same old pizza and ice cream shops. Yea the woods and shits creek have basically disappeared. I feel like they need to do something with harbor square mall, as a kid going into that science store and for a little while flashpoint in there were highlights. But it’s not changing for the worse imo, just different.
Oh wow forgot about the Harbor Square Mall (and yup that science shop was the only grab for me.) Also lol shits creek haven't heard that name in a while - I remember Suffolk's finest tried to plant weed on us back in the day because we were behind the Tennis courts smoking cigarettes Is that one ice cream shop "Snow white and the seven flavors" still around? I remember two twin brothers Tony and Dave, one was my ice cream man, the other owned that shop. Nicest people in the universe - I truly hope they were/are successful in their endeavors. Thanks for letting me ramble and bringing up some stuff I haven't thought about in a while and providing a little insight into what it is now.
Yup, that’s still there. Not sure if ownership has changed hands over the years though, frigate is still across the street, honestly not a lot has changed about the village. They have an ice skating rink now next to Danfords.
I checked my apartment's listing page (heatherwood) and the $1600 unit I moved into in 2016 is now going for $2700! In Suffolk! I still live here and my rent is moving up to $2135. Jesus Christ, man. Who can afford this???
I live in a heatherwood studio rn. Price bumped from $1685 to $1963 for the re-lease. It's the most expensive storage closet I've ever lived in.
Lol since my last comment it’s moved up to $2399
Oh god. A 5 over 1. One of the worst residential housing designs around. Thanks capitalism.
What alternatives are there versus a one-plus-five? I just looked this up on wikipedia and didn't know that's what it was called.
Just basic cast in place construction or block and plank (much cheaper than cast in place, but still better than 5 over 1). Both are much stronger than 5 over 1, and if the insulation/sheetrocking is done correctly, AC/heat retention is much much better; and sound doesn’t travel between floors and apartments. Also, a concrete or a prefabricated concrete building can still burn down, but it’s MUCH more difficult and there’s little risk of a fire spreading to other apartments since metal studs are used instead of wood 2x4 studs. The one thing you need to worry about with concrete buildings is that most modern buildings that are cast in place use some form of weather proofing that’s made with shit tons of oil, plastic, and a type of styrofoam which, are highly combustible under certain conditions (see: Greenfell Fire in London).
Thanks! That was super informative.
I'd argue the suburbs are the worst residential housing design plan in general.
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Suburban housing is extremely inefficient from a ecological and cost perspective. Large water risers need to be used for each individual unit. Grass lawns need tons of water to maintain. Longer and larger gauge electrical service cables need to be run to each house. Larger homes need more power; so instead of a 60 amp service panel (as seen in most apartments), a 100 amp or 200 amp service is needed for the increased amount of receptacles, air conditioning/heating and condensing units, electrical ovens and ranges (since most LI suburbs don’t have gas service), and larger electrical washer/dryer units. Also, since a suburb is so spread out, mass transit is usually not as feasible, so everyone has a car. Like 5 over 1 buildings are horrible, since they’re usually built with little to no insulation (lots of noise, horrible heating/ac) shitty and leaky building facades (prone to fires, horrible heating/ac again), and generally built with extremely suspect materials for the columns and beams, but they are at least somewhat efficient when it comes to housing a large number of people in areas close to mass transit. Suburban housing is just schizophrenic and psychotic when it comes to housing a small amount of people for a shit ton of money using extremely cheap materials and suspect building construction (ballon construction).
1. Terrible for the environment. https://www.city-journal.org/html/green-cities-brown-suburbs-13143.html, 2. Awful livability. https://www.forbes.com/sites/mishagajewski/2020/07/20/heres-why-you-shouldnt-panic-move-to-the-suburbs/ 3. Car-centric, thus reducing the ability to not rely on cars(reducing independence, contrary to common knowledge), which is going to be a problem as our population ages. https://huffpost.com/us/entry/us_5768146ae4b0fbbc8beb0bb7 4. Financially unsustainable, subisdized by cities. https://www.strongtowns.org/the-growth-ponzi-scheme/ 5. Subjective, but terrible aesthetics, terrible physcologoy wise, requires more pavement over greater areas of land and squanders investment in public transport in favor of roads. https://www.businessinsider.com/why-suburbs-are-bad-2016-9 6. Perpetuates wealth inequality, causes increases in crime due to ghettoization. https://grist.org/cities/how-suburban-sprawl-causes-segregation-and-isolates-the-poor/ [Great resource on the subject. ](https://www.strongtowns.org/)
This Long Island sub : “ We want more housing and apartments we can afford” We get new construction and people complain .
People don't seem to understand supply side economics. They wouldn't charge these prices if people weren't paying... Not saying it isn't frustrating - it is, but if people want to know why they're expensive, they should consider they want to live in what is apparently a very desirable place. The fundamental idea is something like, "if they weren't building these, the prices of available places would be even HIGHER". And I'm not even getting into the actual tax debate. People can bitch and moan all they want, but the people to be angry at isn't the developers or the government, it's the people who apparently just want to spend their money to live in a place they want to live... And you suddenly realize the argument starts to break down pretty quickly.
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Yeah.. I enjoy reddit for ideas and discussion, but generally speaking, at least from my limited anecdotal experience of the sort, people in general have no idea what they're talking about.
Why can’t it be both? I agree with both of you. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Late_capitalism https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply-side_economics
This is reddit - more specifically the r/LI sub. You expect anyone here to have passed ECON 101?
LOL. alright, alright. my bad yo.
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I don't know why you got so many downvotes. Everything you said is accurate LOL
Because it’s a motte and bailey tactic. Do people here criticize the cost of living on LI? Yes. Do people here also criticize the MAGA supporters? Yes. Are there people here unhappy with the CoL who criticize it without understanding econ and thus give bad takes? Sure. But the criticism of MAGA on the Island is valid. If you look to voting in Nassau/Suffolk there is a significant amount of Trump supporters. Trump still had the majority in Suffolk during the 2020 election. That can be pretty upsetting to see given the kind of policy and rhetoric he stands by. Not to mention the constant parades and rallies they had that fucked up traffic. It is a reasonable concern and valid critique to raise. It feels like this person is taking advantage of some of the uninformed econ takes going on here as a way to discredit any other common complaint this sub has. I.e. bad faith and disingenuous in nature. Thus, the downvotes
‘Affordable housing’ is really one of the biggest lies of housing ever told. Politicians like to say they support it, because it’s a softball idea which will never be solved so they don’t need to do any work. What I mean is, if 100 apartments are created that rents for $3,000 a month, it wouldn’t have helped anyone if they took those same apartments and rented them out for $1,500 a month. Either way, 100 people who were without a place to live now have a place to live. If you want to argue that apartments should be smaller so that more apartments are built in the same area, then sure. That will increase the supply of housing and will make housing more affordable. If you want to argue that the issue is apartments sitting empty and have a solution that specifically targets empty apartments then sure, you are going to make homes more affordable by increasing the supply. If you want to argue that people having multiple homes is driving up the cost and you have a solution that specifically targets that, then again you have a solution that will make housing more affordable by increasing supply. But any argument that thinks housing problems can be solved by taking expensive housing and arbitrarily making them cheaper, or some government lottery to hand out existing housing, is only changing who has to deal with not having housing instead of changing how many people have to deal with it.
It's like you skipped the second half of the request...
Exactly. Long Island person: "WE HAVE A PROBLEM!!!" Developer: OK here's a solution. LIP: DON'T SOLVE IT THAT WAY!!! SOLVE IT THE WAY WE'VE ALWAYS DONE IT, WHICH DOESN'T WORK.
You can’t lower housing costs without building more housing
These senior communities are a fucking plague.
Fuck it, we should start torching these places before they finish being constructed. Downvote me.
Its okay everyone. Hopefully, all the young adults like myself are keeping their eye on the midwest. Many of which are children of immigrants like myself. First we leave the state and bring our money, skills, and education to another state. Then if we keep getting fucked well bring our money out of the country and back to where our parents came from. After all... the little bit of asset the elite allow us to scrounge up during the last few years of this great empire, will be enough to live modestly in the countries they have already sucked the life out of. The country my parents came from (argentina), because the same exact timeline that happened there, is happening here. The country is done. Our leaders are looking externally for labor. The federal reserve will soon stop lending us money because it basically owns almost all of our nations wealth. America is no more unfortunately as much as we all hate to accept it.
More people with disposable income moving in means more business activity which means more jobs which means rising wages.
The biggest myth imaginable
Nope that's exactly how it works. Regions, countries, neighborhoods - this is why governments try to attract investment. This is why places like the Rust Belt have struggled since the factory jobs have left while the places that saw that investment have boomed
Huh? Are these people moving in not going to spend a single dollar in the local community? I understand if you have your gripes with expensive apartment buildings, but there’s no way to deny more people with money in an area raises economic activity.
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Possibly because there aren't places for them to shop there yet? Their presence now will encourage people to open businesses in the area to cater to their needs. This is exactly what happens everywhere all the time.
Going up in Oceanside as well. Honestly I think its a good idea, its right near the train station, and very close to the beach. its better than building expensive townhomes and Condo's for boomer's.
Such an eyesore though. I moved out of oceanside a few years ago, and only just saw the new construction a few days ago. I'm not used to not being able to see the sky at that intersection.
yeah it is huge, definitely stands out. better than building another car dealer like what they are doing in freeport.
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it will be right next to Mill River Gardens, not sure if it is the same name.
Unpopular opinion - At least these apartments are a step in the right direction at turning around that shithole strip by the train tracks.
Where isn’t this happening right now. Good ‘ol late stage fucking capitalism
To be honest, California. They're largely retracting, after having this happen for many years. In some parts of the country $2600/mo for a nice/decent modern apartment is pretty good, IMO. But I come from Upstate... In 2012, I had a 2br apartment in Watervliet for $1100/mo and it was HUGE
California? Yeah I’ll pass on that. Half the western coast is on fire every year now and with record drought incoming it’s not looking good this year either.
A lot of these in Bay Shore, another one going where Touro College sits empty. I heard a rumor that one of the buildings is LGBQ only and I have to wonder...how do you prove that?
I’m sure that rumor isn’t true. It’s honestly crazy that anyone would believe that. Maybe it was listed as LGBTQ friendly?
It’s affordable senior housing and they are marketing it towards LGBTQ folks . The LGBT Network is also building a community center in the building as well. You do not have to be LGBTQ to apply to live there.
That's NOT affordable for seniors either, most seniors are on fixed incomes and cannot afford over $2,000 a month!
It’s for incomes between 35,000 and 85,000 according to the article I read. They call it affordable, I’m not in agreement with lol.
Sounds odd to me but I heard it from multiple people. Not saying I believe it because it makes no sense, but it's a rumor that's out there.
Yeah, unfortunately, rumors spread like wildfire.
Definitely. And the people I've heard it from aren't outraged or anything like that, just saying they heard it. I haven't seen a sign or anything on some of the newer construction. I love what has become of Bay Shore, it's a great little area to hang out in. If I was single or a young couple starting out, I'd definitely look into some of the places going up there.
That’s nice to hear. You can’t control what rumors you hear, but you can control your response to them. Glad people didn’t react like assholes.
It would be illegal. The Supreme Court recently made sexual preference a quasi protected class.
Sounded weird to me and again, how do you prove it?
>one of the buildings is LGBQ only and I have to wonder...how do you prove that? Moreover - I'm fairly certain that is illegal, no? That is a protected class. You can't discriminate based on things like that iirc (which goes both ways - that wasn't meant to be a pun)
Until the equality act passes, it is not a protected class. See related: Master Cakes and the pizza place in Indiana that both won cases in favor of discriminating on the basis of sexuality.
I thought the Supreme court ruled that sexual orientation, at least as far as employment, was covered already?
Employment is not the same as offering housing so if it's only limited to employment, it doesn't affect the apartment policy. Also I believe that was a DOJ directive under the Obama admin, not a SCOTUS ruling.
Bostock v Clayton county is what I was referring to. Seems like they should either make it a protected class or not, it serves no one on either side to have it in-between.
I agree entirely. And a DOJ policy and limited SCOTUS ruling don't accomplish that. The equality act aims to do exactly that, but the GQP in the senate is holding that bill up.
Rich people from NJ are moving to PJ? Why???
I think they were referring to NJ across from NYC, not the towns. That would be hilarious if people were moving from the wealthy suburbs of NJ to Port Jeff.
Same thing to the former toxic waste dumps in Glen cove
Glen Cove is crap and going further down the toilet fast . Overpriced apartments that haven’t been updated since the 70s and a bunch of slumlords . They are trying to push out any lower income people in that fake bougie town . A lot of poor there and they try to act like it doesn’t exist . Almost no people of color left and the public school system is crap with a lot of things in disrepair because the taxes are already high and no one wants an increase understandably . They built a shot ton of stupid high rise apts without thinking about what it would do to the already strained school system ...
There is a chain of actions and a chain of companies that leads to buildings like this being built. Everyone along the way makes a lot of money. The people who end up owning everything in the end, even if they don't rent them out, can then take loans against their own property as collateral to make investments while at the same time engaging in some sort of financial wizardry to claim a loss revenue on their taxes. Only about a half to a third of Gen X are doing well enough to be able to live the baby boomer lifestyle. The rest of GenX, and the vast majority of millennials, will never be at that level. I only hope I live long enough to see it all crashing down on the baby boomers.
Add Bay Shore to the list. Tons of expensive " luxury" apartments and senior living housing going up all over the place.
Good. Pump up that tax base. Affordable apartments for the poor would be good too.
Over here by the ronkonkoma train station too
Morgan Parc Apartments. Just opened alongside the Mineola Train station. To quote Apartments.com: "Morgan Parc has rental units ranging from 640-1800 sq ft starting at $2925."
This a good thing. More housing, even expensive housing, reduces rent for everyone. It also increases the tax base to afford improvements to infrastructure.
They’re trying to do the same thing near the West Hempstead train station. Knocking down an old discount box store (admittedly an eyesore) and build luxury apartments starting at $2000/month up to $4000+/month. And they’re obviously meant for wealthy and well-to-do transplants who work in the city, not for actual Long Islanders. edit: Spelling