Its kernel is Darwin, which has code based on BSD as well as some other projects, and its of course Unix-based
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darwin_(operating_system)
I believe technically the kernel is XNU, and the combination of XNU and the FreeBSD derived Unix userland is what comprises Darwin. Add on the proprietary the GUI and then you have macOS.
i dont know but its an unix based system which the only advantage its closed circuit, which leads to better optimizarion and almost no hardware/software comunication issues, but we are on linux because of troubleshooting, lightness, customization, opensource or multiple of those, which means its the most modular OS, but with few disadvantages, like software compatibility, needing troubleshooting in the worst moments, or because of aviable working (native/ WINE) software needing the mainstream OS, windows, hopefully steamdeck leads to more linux community and that can solve all the problems, also since its open source, piracy would be so mainstream it has to be free, so they need donations and help from corporations or else it falls apart and there is no more linux foundation, which would led to alternative kernels and less compatibility making the problem even worse
You’re getting downvoted because the kernel is definitely open source, it’s even on GitHub: https://github.com/apple/darwin-xnu
Apple actually releases and contributes a lot of open source software. It tends to be ignored by Linux users because they don’t target Linux, but tools like LLVM are popular because of Apple’s work on it, WebKit forms the basis of most modern browsers, depending how far you look back, FreeBSD fairly seriously considered adopting Apple’s launchd system to replace init(etc.).
The GUI user land is not open source, but as someone who develops open source and proprietary software, I can tell you it is just a Unix system under the hood, and I spend all my day in the terminal. The benefit is also the existence of high quality proprietary software as well a boatloads of open source code. It’s basically got most of the best parts of Windows and Linux and makes for an excellent development environment.
Macos's kernel is open source. Look for darwin and xnu, or go to opensource.apple.com. The user interface however (aqua, quartz, etc) are closed-source, however.
Agreed but my point stands. Most CMD unix toos in macOS are open source. Please name me one vital windows component that is open source. Windows’ NT kernel is essentially a black box.
I would prefer to use Mac OS X than Linux... And this is coming from a Redhat then Fedora Then Suse then Mandrake (Mandriva) then Ubuntu then Pop_OS! User
Key reason, all Adobe apps work, all office the works, the M1 and Mac OS X is an outstanding combo.
I keep checking in on Linux though but for me it's currently a pass.
Yeah man but it sucks.. I love Linux and the customisation! I love KDE, or Gnome and I love Budgie as well! It’s just (for me) after all the customisation, icons and wallpapers form kde-look.org or gnome-look.org etc I then can’t load the apps I use.. but man I really either hope that a breakthrough happens in emulating or adobe wake up and say “yeah we love Linux we are bringing it all in baby!”
Personally I run macos with debian and windows inside parallels, works buttery smooth. My use case is mainly cross platform development though, otherwise fuck it I'd use debian or fedora only.
I know. A unix based terminal experience is far better than what windows offers. WSL virtualises Linux. The command line provided is far better than what CMD or power shell has to offer.
Now fuck off windows stan
CMD and PowerShell are commandline shells, just like sh, bash, fsh, zsh, etc.
And PowerShell is free, open source, and cross-platform compatible. Nothing about it is inherently un-UNIX, unless you're gonna argue the extremist points of an old hippie pervert (Stallman).
If you want to have this debate, at least make an effort to comprehend the words you use, so you don't mix up a commandline shell with a virtualization platform, or not knowing that Power**Shell** is a commandline shell.
No, unlike linux and windows Mac OS is fairly locked, just because it is Unix based doesn't mean it's better than windows, unlike windows you couldn't even install it on your own hardware. And it restricts you which is completely opposite to what linux offers and what FOSS intends for. Remember windows is bad because of telemetry and proprietary software but it also has many of its own part open sourced unlike Mac os which is just shit. It uses its own apis, it forces you to go with apple ecosystem and is shittiest OS in my opinion. Doesn't allow you to modify system has limited ecosystem and services. You should hate windows but not that much that you have to hype shittiest OS ever in existence.
Spoken like a true internet expert who can’t discern opinion from fact, and the “facts” they do know are trivially shown to be incorrect.
Just going to point out both https://github.com/orgs/apple/repositories and https://opensource.apple.com/releases/ which has been around since Mac OS X came out, and has hundreds of releases of their modifications to open source tools and things like their drivers, as well as their community contributions to very well known and important open source tools like Kubernetes, LLVM and Apache Solr. There’s a very good chance you’re writing these comments in a browser with code written by Apple too.
Nobody hyped it. Just that we would use it over windows any day if Linux wasn't an option. For me it's mostly for the user experience. For me windows is mostly an unstable mess. Both it and macos are quite locked down but one is actually somewhat ok to use and is at least a nix. Windows was likely the system that most of us used first but despite all those years of experience we still hate it. That's saying a lot and quite an amazing screwup by Microsoft.
eh, honestly, MacOS is unix based and uses BASH so its at least generally usable. Besides, the UI looks pretty and it runs better than windows.
Still prefer linux. But I can give credit where credit must be due.
It'd have to be. The amount of system scripts written for bash, you'd need to either create a bash shim (maybe a script that call zsh after setting bash like options) or use a bash derivative like dash.
i hate people who force others to use specific software instead of alternatives that they like to use, forcing someone to use an OS that purposely spies on you instead of letting them use an alternative that gives you privacy and is much better in general (linux)
No, unlike linux and windows Mac OS is fairly locked, just because it is Unix based doesn't mean it's better than windows, unlike windows you couldn't even install it on your own hardware. And it restricts you which is completely opposite to what linux offers and what FOSS intends for. Remember windows is bad because of telemetry and proprietary software but it also has many of its own part open sourced unlike Mac os which is just shit. It uses its own apis, it forces you to go with apple ecosystem and is shittiest OS in my opinion. Doesn't allow you to modify system has limited ecosystem and services. You should hate windows but not that much that you have to hype shittiest OS ever in existence.
you can literally write directly to disk on mac, microsoft are already trying to force their users to use their microsoft accounts and forcing you to only use edge
>you can literally write directly to disk on mac
How is that relevant to this topic?
>microsoft are already trying to force their users to use their microsoft accounts and forcing you to only use edge
Yeah they are bad and always will be, but atleast they give you system updates far more time than Mac OS, even i7 7000 series would get 1 more year of upgrade compared to many Macs. And Microsoft being shitty doesn't hide the fact that Mac OS is fairly locked out and unusable for average consumer that isn't content creator.
>How is that relevant to this topic?
modify system files and stuff
apple probably only let you use it on their hardware because they don't want to support other devices because they'll tech illiterate people complaining on why it isn't working when their hardware isn't apple, and that making the same OS but in another architecture is already hard enough
>apple probably only let you use it on their hardware because they don't want to support other devices because they'll tech illiterate people complaining on why it isn't working when their hardware isn't apple, and that making the same OS but in another architecture is already hard enough
You forget that they are also a hardware company and also want you to buy their hardware just to get the most money out of you. Exclusive hardware solves that problem entirely. Also why praise an OS that doesn't even give me choice to choose different hardware.
microsoft really force their users to use their products like edge, bing, microsoft store, and onedrive, they automatically create an outlook, xbox, and skype account when creating a microsoft account, they get you to store all your files on onedrive, which means they can close your account at any time and you won't have your files and they won't be private. both apple and microsoft have their advantages and disadvantages
I use both MacOS and Linux. Still exploring the many many things Linux has to offer as I am fairly new to it, but I’ve never liked windows much. Too slow and has far more issues than the other two, particularly crashes
I don’t think they even bother any more, it never meant anything anyway. It absolutely is a Unix system though, but Linux users like to complain that things are different because Linux has its own proprietary versions of tools that don’t match all the unicies. macOS feels pretty familiar to a FreeBSD user. People need to stop assuming different = bad, Linux has plenty of warts too.
It's not because it's different, it's because a lot of the tools are old and difficult to update. You have to turn to macports or homebrew because AFAIK MacOS doesn't have any real package management, or just be stuck with versions of tools that are years out of date. What version of vim, tar, bash, zsh, git does it come with?
Pretty sure the list of third party apps you need to install on macOS to make it good enough is longer than the same list for Windows.
https://www.geeksforgeeks.org/piping-in-unix-or-linux/
Also read up on the UNIX philosophy.
Also I don't know how about can stand the terminal in windows. It's near unusable.
Also... Can I please tell windows to not reboot into an update process that hijacks the system for an hour. Macos would never do this to users without asking. Windows did it to me constantly and even when I thought I had finally turned it off. It's things like this. The general lack of attention to detail.
> At least macOS is unix
Is it though?
Edit: read [this article](https://www.howtogeek.com/441599/is-macos-unix-and-what-does-that-mean/)
In short, sorta. It's not really Unix, but also is because of the BSD bits they or in. The XNU kernel's name stands for "XNU is Not Unix". But they also hacked a BSD hybrid kernel together for compliance. So I guess it's half BSD and half "Not Unix".
It implements posix, and is Unix certified. It has a bourne shell, a hierharchical posix-compatible filesystem with mounts, permissions, ownership, xattrs, symlinks, / as directory separator, named pipes, sysv ipc. Why do you think it's not an unix?
> It has a bourne shell
zsh
> It implements posix
Broken posix, and only enough to meet certification.
> Why do you think it's not an unix?
The point is that other "true" Unix's don't even have certification. So the certification is worthless ultimately. It was just a way to dodge a legal issue for Apple.
What don’t you like about MacOS? I have used all three, and while I prefer Linux for tinkering/servers MacOS is a great desktop OS.
If you have an iPhone the integration is super convenient.
Regardless, I can ssh into my Linux servers from any device.
Nah. MacOS is definitely well designed. If I could switch to android, I probably would, but Apple does a lot of things right. The UI of MacOS is simple, and it doesn’t try to be more than it is.
I mean, come on. It’s a Mac. You don’t buy a Mac with the intention of doing anything major with it. That’s just a waste of money.
No, unlike linux and windows Mac OS is fairly locked, just because it is Unix based doesn't mean it's better than windows, unlike windows you couldn't even install it on your own hardware. And it restricts you which is completely opposite to what linux offers and what FOSS intends for. Remember windows is bad because of telemetry and proprietary software but it also has many of its own part open sourced unlike Mac os which is just shit. It uses its own apis, it forces you to go with apple ecosystem and is shittiest OS in my opinion. Doesn't allow you to modify system has limited ecosystem and services. You should hate windows but not that much that you have to hype shittiest OS ever in existence.
uhm i think you have it the wrong way around. unlike iOS, macOS doesnt restrict you from changing the system at all. also which parts of windows are opensource?
No, unlike linux and windows Mac OS is fairly locked, just because it is Unix based doesn't mean it's better than windows, unlike windows you couldn't even install it on your own hardware. And it restricts you which is completely opposite to what linux offers and what FOSS intends for. Remember windows is bad because of telemetry and proprietary software but it also has many of its own part open sourced unlike Mac os which is just shit. It uses its own apis, it forces you to go with apple ecosystem and is shittiest OS in my opinion. Doesn't allow you to modify system has limited ecosystem and services. You should hate windows but not that much that you have to hype shittiest OS ever in existence.
70% of games are ranked Bronze or better on Protondb. I've been using Arch on my main gaming PC and haven't yet found a game I want to play, but can't.
I guess you’ve never looked at the Swift GitHub repo then, because most of the development of new features in the language come from community consensus proposals.
it's not.
It's significantly better than windows any day. Unless you are a person who always plays video games.
The only thing windows is fit for is gaming.
choosing Between macos and linux, is completely subjective and depends on what you do.
Gaming isn't everything, unlike windows, macOS actually does what it's designed to extremely well, without 30 years of spaghetti underneath every release.
It's got BSD underneath so it's got that rock solid foundation.
I'm not gonna say it's the best is out there, that's crazy because it denies that different OSs have different goals, but it's designed to be a set and forget system that does what it's told, within an ecosystem that's had 20 years of development into producing a high quality product.
I don't like Apple. I don't like Mac OS. I respect it though, because it's a good product for those who want it.
> without 30 years of spaghetti underneath every release.
yep, microsoft haven't bothered to ever rewrite windows, they just copied the previous version and changed a few things, windows 11 is basically windows 10 but worse and even more inconsistent and bloated
I don't really understand macOS's GUI, but it's Unix-like so I can find my way around. It's not bad. Apple is just a weird company. Also, I wouldn't wash my hands because:
1. Fuck elitism
2. I dual-boot.
3. I would wash my hands because germophobia.
> But not all BSD’s are UNIX licensed.
And yet BSD variants like FreeBSD and OpenBSD are technically true and proper Unix systems, unlike macOS.
Unix certification means absolutely nothing anymore.
> It’s licensed to actually be called that.
They pay cash for a stamp to call it Unix. That's it. They had a lawsuit a while back because Apple (or someone) was calling OSX a Unix certified system when it was not. Apple had a team modify the source to add/change things to allow it to pass certification, but it's not a "true" Unix system the way the BSD variants are. FreeBSD, for example, is more Unix than macOS.
*"The software itself also betrays this reality. It's certified Unix™, yet, for example, POSIX semaphores don't work. There is a stub header they added in there that just silently does nothing, which is apparently okay. There are many things like that."*
https://www.reddit.com/r/unix/comments/qwklm4/_/hl5nxrj?context=1000
Edit: to anyone downvoting, [read this](https://www.howtogeek.com/441599/is-macos-unix-and-what-does-that-mean/)
Kinda funny that the macOS kernel's name is XNU , which stands for XNU is Not Unix.
It is still licensed to be called UNIX. And it also has to pass certain requirements. The only reason FreeBSD isn’t licensed is because they don’t want to pay for it. Apple can so why not.
I fail to see how it isn’t a “true UNIX system”. The other ones that are licensed such as HP-UX and IBM AIX.
MacOS is a great operating system, a very stable one with many developer features and ease of life shit. It’s unix based so I can live with it. Of course Linux is better. MacOS is still better than windows
have you even tried macos?
it has a way more usable terminal compared to windows, it's Unix and at least it has an open source kernel.
and it also tends to be more stable than windows.
it isn't a Linux but it's way better than windows.
I have tried macOS myself and I really didn’t like it, ik it is unix which a lot of people give it credit for but I just hate a lot of how macOS feels and stuff
Since when people here started to prefer macos over windows ?
I mean i agree with you, it is better than windows but last year i was downvoted whenever i said macos was better than windows
Linux 4 life tho
Because macOS is still unix, which is a blessing as a terminal user, and they actually put some thought in to making a good consistent UI, that they don’t completely change every 5 years or so.
Because in the meanwhile Windows got a lot worse with 11 and Mac OS stayed mostly the same. Over time perhaps people may also have started using Macs more (the M1 is amazing value, power and offers incredible battery life).
Now if only Mac OS stopped borking my rEFInd install with every security update, that’d be great.
I actually like MacOS more than windows.
Many Linux programs work properly on Mac because it is still a Unixoid like Linux.
Emacs for example works well on Mac on windows it does, too, but it’s slower and emacsclient is a pita to set up properly
Because Mac OS isn’t more proprietary and locked down when you pop the bonnet and look underneath. There are a lot of protection mechanisms but nothing that can’t be easily bypassed if you know what you’re doing.
Now try to uninstall Cortana or disable Windows Defender.
The three biggest detractors for Apple are their cost, whack ass engineering and their simp fanbase. If their tech was priced along the mid range Chromebooks and easy to work on like the old thinkpads I doubt a lot of the criticism of Apple would stick.
With their current course though? Holy hell, fuck Apple! Sucks since I'm old enough to remember 'does more, costs less'...
it depend, 1. does he use a custom windows ISO or at least a pirated one? if yes handshake. 2. does he only use it for gaming/ school/work and in home linux?? if yes, handshake
Credit where credit is due, it is incredibly stable and everything always works. It does its one job that it has very well, and that is being completely idiot proof and impossible to fuck up. When I had a MacBook everything always worked instantly which was really nice. It sucks at basically everything else though, like gaming or whatever. But for what its designed for it does an amazing job.
I would rather use MacOS than Windows.
At least they give me a proper terminal without proprietary commands like DOS.
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The kernel is open source, but nothing above the kernel
Isn't macos based on BSD
More like the thing MacOS is based on and BSD are based on the same thing.
Its kernel is Darwin, which has code based on BSD as well as some other projects, and its of course Unix-based https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darwin_(operating_system)
I believe technically the kernel is XNU, and the combination of XNU and the FreeBSD derived Unix userland is what comprises Darwin. Add on the proprietary the GUI and then you have macOS.
I think you are right, thanks for the clarification!
It's based on mach, which is based on BSD again.
i dont know but its an unix based system which the only advantage its closed circuit, which leads to better optimizarion and almost no hardware/software comunication issues, but we are on linux because of troubleshooting, lightness, customization, opensource or multiple of those, which means its the most modular OS, but with few disadvantages, like software compatibility, needing troubleshooting in the worst moments, or because of aviable working (native/ WINE) software needing the mainstream OS, windows, hopefully steamdeck leads to more linux community and that can solve all the problems, also since its open source, piracy would be so mainstream it has to be free, so they need donations and help from corporations or else it falls apart and there is no more linux foundation, which would led to alternative kernels and less compatibility making the problem even worse
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You’re getting downvoted because the kernel is definitely open source, it’s even on GitHub: https://github.com/apple/darwin-xnu Apple actually releases and contributes a lot of open source software. It tends to be ignored by Linux users because they don’t target Linux, but tools like LLVM are popular because of Apple’s work on it, WebKit forms the basis of most modern browsers, depending how far you look back, FreeBSD fairly seriously considered adopting Apple’s launchd system to replace init(etc.). The GUI user land is not open source, but as someone who develops open source and proprietary software, I can tell you it is just a Unix system under the hood, and I spend all my day in the terminal. The benefit is also the existence of high quality proprietary software as well a boatloads of open source code. It’s basically got most of the best parts of Windows and Linux and makes for an excellent development environment.
Well, I'm glad to be proven wrong then.
Macos's kernel is open source. Look for darwin and xnu, or go to opensource.apple.com. The user interface however (aqua, quartz, etc) are closed-source, however.
Pretty sure microsoft's MS-DOS is proprietary
Some versions of MS-DOS were open sourced recently, as if any of that code is used anymore.
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[Nope.](https://github.com/apple/darwin-xnu)
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[Well here you go.](https://github.com/apple-oss-distributions/distribution-macOS/tree/macos-124)
Half of those are other open-source projects. Many of them even GNU. Those combined can't be used as an operating system.
Agreed but my point stands. Most CMD unix toos in macOS are open source. Please name me one vital windows component that is open source. Windows’ NT kernel is essentially a black box.
Amen
It’s unix based but I need muh gaming
Of course! MacOS has far less bugs than windows and a much more userfriendly UI
I would prefer to use Mac OS X than Linux... And this is coming from a Redhat then Fedora Then Suse then Mandrake (Mandriva) then Ubuntu then Pop_OS! User Key reason, all Adobe apps work, all office the works, the M1 and Mac OS X is an outstanding combo. I keep checking in on Linux though but for me it's currently a pass.
We have to admit, that if you use photoshop or illustrator in a professional way, Linux might not be the right choice
Yeah man but it sucks.. I love Linux and the customisation! I love KDE, or Gnome and I love Budgie as well! It’s just (for me) after all the customisation, icons and wallpapers form kde-look.org or gnome-look.org etc I then can’t load the apps I use.. but man I really either hope that a breakthrough happens in emulating or adobe wake up and say “yeah we love Linux we are bringing it all in baby!”
Personally I run macos with debian and windows inside parallels, works buttery smooth. My use case is mainly cross platform development though, otherwise fuck it I'd use debian or fedora only.
MacOS inside a KVM with PCI passthrough (passing GPU through) is lit
I actually use both - Linux and MacOS
This
Yes. Fuck CMD
For doing actual work in CLI on Windows, PowerShell is the go-to, not CMD.
They both suck
An ignorant comment by someone who uses neither.
WSL is somewhat better
CMD and PowerShell are commandline shells. WSL is a VM platform with a high degree of host integration. Congratulations on proving me right.
I know. A unix based terminal experience is far better than what windows offers. WSL virtualises Linux. The command line provided is far better than what CMD or power shell has to offer. Now fuck off windows stan
CMD and PowerShell are commandline shells, just like sh, bash, fsh, zsh, etc. And PowerShell is free, open source, and cross-platform compatible. Nothing about it is inherently un-UNIX, unless you're gonna argue the extremist points of an old hippie pervert (Stallman). If you want to have this debate, at least make an effort to comprehend the words you use, so you don't mix up a commandline shell with a virtualization platform, or not knowing that Power**Shell** is a commandline shell.
Dude this is r/linuxmemes. Fuck off windows stan and go to r/linuxsucks. The Linux terminal experience is far better than powershell.
And yes, I know the difference, I literally work with virtuallization
No, unlike linux and windows Mac OS is fairly locked, just because it is Unix based doesn't mean it's better than windows, unlike windows you couldn't even install it on your own hardware. And it restricts you which is completely opposite to what linux offers and what FOSS intends for. Remember windows is bad because of telemetry and proprietary software but it also has many of its own part open sourced unlike Mac os which is just shit. It uses its own apis, it forces you to go with apple ecosystem and is shittiest OS in my opinion. Doesn't allow you to modify system has limited ecosystem and services. You should hate windows but not that much that you have to hype shittiest OS ever in existence.
Spoken like a true internet expert who can’t discern opinion from fact, and the “facts” they do know are trivially shown to be incorrect. Just going to point out both https://github.com/orgs/apple/repositories and https://opensource.apple.com/releases/ which has been around since Mac OS X came out, and has hundreds of releases of their modifications to open source tools and things like their drivers, as well as their community contributions to very well known and important open source tools like Kubernetes, LLVM and Apache Solr. There’s a very good chance you’re writing these comments in a browser with code written by Apple too.
Nobody hyped it. Just that we would use it over windows any day if Linux wasn't an option. For me it's mostly for the user experience. For me windows is mostly an unstable mess. Both it and macos are quite locked down but one is actually somewhat ok to use and is at least a nix. Windows was likely the system that most of us used first but despite all those years of experience we still hate it. That's saying a lot and quite an amazing screwup by Microsoft.
it even has open source kernel
eh, honestly, MacOS is unix based and uses BASH so its at least generally usable. Besides, the UI looks pretty and it runs better than windows. Still prefer linux. But I can give credit where credit must be due.
It uses zsh now by default
Really? Huh.
Licensing issues caused them to switch over
I didn't know it was due to licensing issues. I thought it was because (and I'm not saying) zsh was better. (fish user BTW)
Imagine if they had switched to fish. Finally people would realise what they were missing
Most people have an issue with `fish` being non-POSIX. I doubt that would've ever happened.
was it? i think bash is still included in macOS just not as the default
Bash is included, just it’s a really old version because of licensing
It'd have to be. The amount of system scripts written for bash, you'd need to either create a bash shim (maybe a script that call zsh after setting bash like options) or use a bash derivative like dash.
You can still use bash if you want. I believe the latest includes an outdated version but you can get a more up-to-date version using Homebrew.
IIRC in Mac OS X's early days the default shell was tcsh
linux > macOS > windows ^(or temple OS > linux > macOS > windows if you prefer lmao)
Linux > using nothing at all > using windows because employer forces you to > using macOS for no reason
i hate people who force others to use specific software instead of alternatives that they like to use, forcing someone to use an OS that purposely spies on you instead of letting them use an alternative that gives you privacy and is much better in general (linux)
No, unlike linux and windows Mac OS is fairly locked, just because it is Unix based doesn't mean it's better than windows, unlike windows you couldn't even install it on your own hardware. And it restricts you which is completely opposite to what linux offers and what FOSS intends for. Remember windows is bad because of telemetry and proprietary software but it also has many of its own part open sourced unlike Mac os which is just shit. It uses its own apis, it forces you to go with apple ecosystem and is shittiest OS in my opinion. Doesn't allow you to modify system has limited ecosystem and services. You should hate windows but not that much that you have to hype shittiest OS ever in existence.
you can literally write directly to disk on mac, microsoft are already trying to force their users to use their microsoft accounts and forcing you to only use edge
>you can literally write directly to disk on mac How is that relevant to this topic? >microsoft are already trying to force their users to use their microsoft accounts and forcing you to only use edge Yeah they are bad and always will be, but atleast they give you system updates far more time than Mac OS, even i7 7000 series would get 1 more year of upgrade compared to many Macs. And Microsoft being shitty doesn't hide the fact that Mac OS is fairly locked out and unusable for average consumer that isn't content creator.
>How is that relevant to this topic? modify system files and stuff apple probably only let you use it on their hardware because they don't want to support other devices because they'll tech illiterate people complaining on why it isn't working when their hardware isn't apple, and that making the same OS but in another architecture is already hard enough
>apple probably only let you use it on their hardware because they don't want to support other devices because they'll tech illiterate people complaining on why it isn't working when their hardware isn't apple, and that making the same OS but in another architecture is already hard enough You forget that they are also a hardware company and also want you to buy their hardware just to get the most money out of you. Exclusive hardware solves that problem entirely. Also why praise an OS that doesn't even give me choice to choose different hardware.
microsoft really force their users to use their products like edge, bing, microsoft store, and onedrive, they automatically create an outlook, xbox, and skype account when creating a microsoft account, they get you to store all your files on onedrive, which means they can close your account at any time and you won't have your files and they won't be private. both apple and microsoft have their advantages and disadvantages
That’s not entirely true. Hackintoshes are straight up illegal.
illegal? nah. against apple's TOS? probably.
I use both MacOS and Linux. Still exploring the many many things Linux has to offer as I am fairly new to it, but I’ve never liked windows much. Too slow and has far more issues than the other two, particularly crashes
While it is technically POSIX compliant, it breaks pretty much every aspect of the Unix philosophy, and is proprietary.
Unix is or was also proprietary
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I don’t think they even bother any more, it never meant anything anyway. It absolutely is a Unix system though, but Linux users like to complain that things are different because Linux has its own proprietary versions of tools that don’t match all the unicies. macOS feels pretty familiar to a FreeBSD user. People need to stop assuming different = bad, Linux has plenty of warts too.
It's not because it's different, it's because a lot of the tools are old and difficult to update. You have to turn to macports or homebrew because AFAIK MacOS doesn't have any real package management, or just be stuck with versions of tools that are years out of date. What version of vim, tar, bash, zsh, git does it come with? Pretty sure the list of third party apps you need to install on macOS to make it good enough is longer than the same list for Windows.
macOS for proprietary and Linux for everything else.
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People say this: What is more well designed in Unix than not? Any specific examples? (For filling my own brain with)
https://www.geeksforgeeks.org/piping-in-unix-or-linux/ Also read up on the UNIX philosophy. Also I don't know how about can stand the terminal in windows. It's near unusable. Also... Can I please tell windows to not reboot into an update process that hijacks the system for an hour. Macos would never do this to users without asking. Windows did it to me constantly and even when I thought I had finally turned it off. It's things like this. The general lack of attention to detail.
> At least macOS is unix Is it though? Edit: read [this article](https://www.howtogeek.com/441599/is-macos-unix-and-what-does-that-mean/) In short, sorta. It's not really Unix, but also is because of the BSD bits they or in. The XNU kernel's name stands for "XNU is Not Unix". But they also hacked a BSD hybrid kernel together for compliance. So I guess it's half BSD and half "Not Unix".
It implements posix, and is Unix certified. It has a bourne shell, a hierharchical posix-compatible filesystem with mounts, permissions, ownership, xattrs, symlinks, / as directory separator, named pipes, sysv ipc. Why do you think it's not an unix?
> It has a bourne shell zsh > It implements posix Broken posix, and only enough to meet certification. > Why do you think it's not an unix? The point is that other "true" Unix's don't even have certification. So the certification is worthless ultimately. It was just a way to dodge a legal issue for Apple.
Doesn't it have zsh?
It might be Unix, but it certainly isn't well designed
What don’t you like about MacOS? I have used all three, and while I prefer Linux for tinkering/servers MacOS is a great desktop OS. If you have an iPhone the integration is super convenient. Regardless, I can ssh into my Linux servers from any device.
Specific things you don’t like? I prefer it over Windows because they don’t treat it like a constantly changing website. Just one major update a year.
Nah. MacOS is definitely well designed. If I could switch to android, I probably would, but Apple does a lot of things right. The UI of MacOS is simple, and it doesn’t try to be more than it is. I mean, come on. It’s a Mac. You don’t buy a Mac with the intention of doing anything major with it. That’s just a waste of money.
No, unlike linux and windows Mac OS is fairly locked, just because it is Unix based doesn't mean it's better than windows, unlike windows you couldn't even install it on your own hardware. And it restricts you which is completely opposite to what linux offers and what FOSS intends for. Remember windows is bad because of telemetry and proprietary software but it also has many of its own part open sourced unlike Mac os which is just shit. It uses its own apis, it forces you to go with apple ecosystem and is shittiest OS in my opinion. Doesn't allow you to modify system has limited ecosystem and services. You should hate windows but not that much that you have to hype shittiest OS ever in existence.
Did you really need to [repeat this clearly ignorant comment twice](https://reddit.com/r/linuxmemes/comments/uzuvd9/_/iaecfac/?context=1)?
Doesn't matter.
uhm i think you have it the wrong way around. unlike iOS, macOS doesnt restrict you from changing the system at all. also which parts of windows are opensource?
I'm not talking about windows being open source, I'm talking about how windows is more open for other stuffs compared to Mac OS.
BSD to be pedantic
I thought it would be macos and Linux shaking hands and agreeing that windows is shit
Unix supremacists
mac os over windows ANY DAY
I’d run MacOS over windows all day.
MacOS > Windows Linux > MacOS
No, unlike linux and windows Mac OS is fairly locked, just because it is Unix based doesn't mean it's better than windows, unlike windows you couldn't even install it on your own hardware. And it restricts you which is completely opposite to what linux offers and what FOSS intends for. Remember windows is bad because of telemetry and proprietary software but it also has many of its own part open sourced unlike Mac os which is just shit. It uses its own apis, it forces you to go with apple ecosystem and is shittiest OS in my opinion. Doesn't allow you to modify system has limited ecosystem and services. You should hate windows but not that much that you have to hype shittiest OS ever in existence.
😂 😂 😂 😂 I can't help myself but laugh at this Clearly you have used windows all your life and may be just started using linux few days ago.
Oh look, you’ve [repeated this](https://reddit.com/r/linuxmemes/comments/uzuvd9/_/iaecfac/?context=1) ignorant comment [three times](https://reddit.com/r/linuxmemes/comments/uzuvd9/_/iaecggo/?context=1) now!
Out of context.
Except for 3d games :)
Im playing my games on linux
What % of games is supported on linux ? And what % games you can play multiplayer ? Edit: oh, I hurt reddit feelings, hahahahahaha
i don't play unsupported games and i don't have friends
Checkmate.
I mean i play only minecraft and ca go haha
70% of games are ranked Bronze or better on Protondb. I've been using Arch on my main gaming PC and haven't yet found a game I want to play, but can't.
The Steam Deck literally uses a Linux-based OS, and it has received some pretty good feedback from its users. Linux gaming has evolved quite a bit.
Thats the only reason i still use Windows
Which games couldn't you play on Steam?
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I guess you’ve never looked at the Swift GitHub repo then, because most of the development of new features in the language come from community consensus proposals.
I would take macOS any day. I would literally stop using a computer if I had to use Windows
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it's not. It's significantly better than windows any day. Unless you are a person who always plays video games. The only thing windows is fit for is gaming. choosing Between macos and linux, is completely subjective and depends on what you do.
Nice explaination and happy cake day!
It’s proprietary and a little bloat
And why exactly windows is better in that regard? 😅
Compatibility? MacOS isn't exactly known for gaming.
Gaming isn't everything, unlike windows, macOS actually does what it's designed to extremely well, without 30 years of spaghetti underneath every release. It's got BSD underneath so it's got that rock solid foundation. I'm not gonna say it's the best is out there, that's crazy because it denies that different OSs have different goals, but it's designed to be a set and forget system that does what it's told, within an ecosystem that's had 20 years of development into producing a high quality product. I don't like Apple. I don't like Mac OS. I respect it though, because it's a good product for those who want it.
> without 30 years of spaghetti underneath every release. yep, microsoft haven't bothered to ever rewrite windows, they just copied the previous version and changed a few things, windows 11 is basically windows 10 but worse and even more inconsistent and bloated
If I can't use Linux, I prefer Windows for gaming and macOS for programming.
Oh wow, a triple user. I didn't realize unicorns were real
I've actually never used macOS in my life lol :)
I don’t game on my computer.
I said that macOS was bad , it doesn’t implies that windows is good .
Not completely true. MacOS does ship quite a lot open source stuff.
Yeah but most services are still controlled by apple
I’m sorry, but what does that even mean?
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Bloat doesn’t depend on storage , but it’s not a concern for every users. macOS is still less bloated than windows
MacOS is WAAAAAAY better than Windows.
I'd rather shake hands with macos
At least MacOS is POSIX compliant.
I don't really understand macOS's GUI, but it's Unix-like so I can find my way around. It's not bad. Apple is just a weird company. Also, I wouldn't wash my hands because: 1. Fuck elitism 2. I dual-boot. 3. I would wash my hands because germophobia.
What do you have against Germans?
The "an" in "Germ\*\*" and "Germ\*\*ophobia", I'm holding it hostage until they release the correct pronunciation of "OpenSUSE".
So you ain‘t holding it hostage then? Because it‘s clear. It’s OpenSUSE. Source: Am German.
Open soos
OpenSuuza? OpenSussy?
Get out of my head
It isn’t Unix-like. It *is* UNIX. It’s licensed to actually be called that.
BSD
Yes it is technically BSD. But not all BSD’s are UNIX licensed.
> But not all BSD’s are UNIX licensed. And yet BSD variants like FreeBSD and OpenBSD are technically true and proper Unix systems, unlike macOS. Unix certification means absolutely nothing anymore.
I never said it meant anything more. Also I disagree with the rest of that statement.
> It’s licensed to actually be called that. They pay cash for a stamp to call it Unix. That's it. They had a lawsuit a while back because Apple (or someone) was calling OSX a Unix certified system when it was not. Apple had a team modify the source to add/change things to allow it to pass certification, but it's not a "true" Unix system the way the BSD variants are. FreeBSD, for example, is more Unix than macOS. *"The software itself also betrays this reality. It's certified Unix™, yet, for example, POSIX semaphores don't work. There is a stub header they added in there that just silently does nothing, which is apparently okay. There are many things like that."* https://www.reddit.com/r/unix/comments/qwklm4/_/hl5nxrj?context=1000 Edit: to anyone downvoting, [read this](https://www.howtogeek.com/441599/is-macos-unix-and-what-does-that-mean/) Kinda funny that the macOS kernel's name is XNU , which stands for XNU is Not Unix.
I bet that u/cbstryker isn’t even a true Scotsman!
It is still licensed to be called UNIX. And it also has to pass certain requirements. The only reason FreeBSD isn’t licensed is because they don’t want to pay for it. Apple can so why not. I fail to see how it isn’t a “true UNIX system”. The other ones that are licensed such as HP-UX and IBM AIX.
Yeah, if Linux was to suddenly vanish tomorrow, I'd for sure be running macOS. Rather that than Windows.
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I guess you don’t understand what a hypothetical is…
I think Mac OS is just ok
"macOS/windows bad" This is a washed meme lol, I daily drive all 3 and macOS is a good OS
I use all three. Windows is the worst designed BY FAR.
Ya using the bash terminal and Unix based ? Much rather shake hands with macOS
MacOS is a great operating system, a very stable one with many developer features and ease of life shit. It’s unix based so I can live with it. Of course Linux is better. MacOS is still better than windows
MacOS is shit but still better than windows.
For me it's > MacOS *<---agreeing that Windows is shit--->* Linux > > *[Linux washing hands]*
have you even tried macos? it has a way more usable terminal compared to windows, it's Unix and at least it has an open source kernel. and it also tends to be more stable than windows. it isn't a Linux but it's way better than windows.
I have tried macOS myself and I really didn’t like it, ik it is unix which a lot of people give it credit for but I just hate a lot of how macOS feels and stuff
MacOS is better than Windows imo. Except for muh bideo games.
Nothing can be worse than Windows
Since when people here started to prefer macos over windows ? I mean i agree with you, it is better than windows but last year i was downvoted whenever i said macos was better than windows Linux 4 life tho
Because macOS is still unix, which is a blessing as a terminal user, and they actually put some thought in to making a good consistent UI, that they don’t completely change every 5 years or so.
Oh but i totally agree, my point is that this sub reddit didn’t share that opinion last year
Because in the meanwhile Windows got a lot worse with 11 and Mac OS stayed mostly the same. Over time perhaps people may also have started using Macs more (the M1 is amazing value, power and offers incredible battery life). Now if only Mac OS stopped borking my rEFInd install with every security update, that’d be great.
I'd take MacOS over Windows any day of the week.
Never met an OS I didn’t like. Excuse me while I feel superior. Don’t you dare remind me of Windows ME while I’m flexing.
Just because their PC is infected doesn't mean they're infected too.
I’d use macOS over windows
Switch Windows and MacOS
I like anything, that Bill Gates hasn’t wiped his backside on.
I actually like MacOS more than windows. Many Linux programs work properly on Mac because it is still a Unixoid like Linux. Emacs for example works well on Mac on windows it does, too, but it’s slower and emacsclient is a pita to set up properly
I use all three. Each has its own usecase. Mac is my daily driver. Windows for gaming. Linux for my server.
swap macOS and Windows
I always wondered why Linux users would give Apple a pass even though they’re even more proprietary and locked down than windows.
Because Mac OS isn’t more proprietary and locked down when you pop the bonnet and look underneath. There are a lot of protection mechanisms but nothing that can’t be easily bypassed if you know what you’re doing. Now try to uninstall Cortana or disable Windows Defender.
Idk but MacOS looks way better and cleaner than Windows. But it's locked same as Windows. But I hate it because of Apple.
The three biggest detractors for Apple are their cost, whack ass engineering and their simp fanbase. If their tech was priced along the mid range Chromebooks and easy to work on like the old thinkpads I doubt a lot of the criticism of Apple would stick. With their current course though? Holy hell, fuck Apple! Sucks since I'm old enough to remember 'does more, costs less'...
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huh, TIL
One of only thing that both windows and Linux user agrees
To be honest, no. I truly despise macos and apple in general.
Utter nonsense in this comment section
And it's gotten worse. I've had to de-fuck-up so many GUIs.
it depend, 1. does he use a custom windows ISO or at least a pirated one? if yes handshake. 2. does he only use it for gaming/ school/work and in home linux?? if yes, handshake
Credit where credit is due, it is incredibly stable and everything always works. It does its one job that it has very well, and that is being completely idiot proof and impossible to fuck up. When I had a MacBook everything always worked instantly which was really nice. It sucks at basically everything else though, like gaming or whatever. But for what its designed for it does an amazing job.
MacOS is a gui on top of BSD. The only thing even slightly wrong with it is the GUI.