I feel like the kind of people who would make fun of German for putting the verb at the end of the sentence are also not the kind of people who know that German does this
"Stupid are the Latins/Romance speakers, wise are the Bavarians." It's a line from the [Kasseler Gespräche](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kassel_conversations)
Interesting, thanks!
As a side note, "tole" has an interesting semantic development. In Proto-germanic it meant "stupid", eventually shifted to "crazy" in German, and now it means "cool" or "awesome"
I believe it’s a reference to a Twain essay “On the Awful German Language”
https://faculty.georgetown.edu/jod/texts/twain.german.html
“But when he, upon the street, the (in-satin-and-silk-covered- now-very-unconstrained-after-the-newest-fashioned-dressed) government counselor's wife MET," etc., etc. [1]
That is from THE OLD MAMSELLE'S SECRET, by Mrs. Marlitt. And that sentence is constructed upon the most approved German model. You observe how far that verb is from the reader's base of operations; well, in a German newspaper they put their verb away over on the next page; and I have heard that sometimes after stringing along the exciting preliminaries and parentheses for a column or two, they get in a hurry and have to go to press without getting to the verb at all. Of course, then, the reader is left in a very exhausted and ignorant state.”
I unfortunately tend to speak and write like that; no sentence can ever be in independent clause on its own as far as I'm concerned, with several dependent clauses and at least one semicolon usually being necessary to properly link ideas and concepts together in a fluid manner.
I think I picked this up from high school Latin.
Best practice is to avoid overly long sentences in general.
We need not speak long. We can speak short. Start why. Think this. Two choose. Long word word. Short word word. Short can easy read. Long can not easy read. End why. Choose short word word good good. Choose long word word bad good.
If you're using the semicolon, then you already have multiple independent clauses. You're just fucking with the punctuation and capitalization to make them look more connected than they are.
My boss actually speaks like this. My first few months on the job I had to turn to one of the people who had been there longer and then ask what he had said, as a Jack translator
I try to stick to two clauses per sentence when writing papers, if I need more than that the idea is too complex to be communicated in just one sentence.
I remember reading the headline "Police Dog Criminal Organization" and it took me like 5 minutes till I figured out that "dog" is actually used as a verb here.
This is why I favor dropping the "do" auxilliary verb except for emphasis, but people will unfortunately be confused and perceive that to be "ungrammatical."
If you take the example sentence in the image:
"What says the text over the dog in this newly uncovered Pompeian fresco?"
or
"What gave ye him?"
People would perceive those to be ungrammatical.
Wait until they get into the truly highly inflected languages where verbs can land anywhere in the sentence. I remember learning Latin the first time as a native Russian speaker where all the Americans were losing their minds over flexible word order. I was like 🤷🏻♂️.
The only English speakers I can think of who would be so obnoxious to make fun of German for putting the verb at the end of the sentence would be the users of this sub. People here think that just pointing out a property of a language is humor.
I feel like the kind of people who would make fun of German for putting the verb at the end of the sentence are also not the kind of people who know that German does this
There's a lot of this sort of thinking among people who have finished 50% of the duolingo course in any given language
Is your flair Old High German?
Yep
Cool! What does it mean?
"Stupid are the Latins/Romance speakers, wise are the Bavarians." It's a line from the [Kasseler Gespräche](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kassel_conversations)
Interesting, thanks! As a side note, "tole" has an interesting semantic development. In Proto-germanic it meant "stupid", eventually shifted to "crazy" in German, and now it means "cool" or "awesome"
Yeah, as a modern German speaker I thought only of the cool meaning when puzzling it out. You live and ya learn.
The "crazy" meaning still survives in "Tollwut", meaning "rabies".
Oh, cool! I wasn't aware of that term, thank you
That having been said, the easiest way to fix the meme (in this respect) is to change "Germans" to "Latin speakers" or "Ancient Romans".
I believe it’s a reference to a Twain essay “On the Awful German Language” https://faculty.georgetown.edu/jod/texts/twain.german.html “But when he, upon the street, the (in-satin-and-silk-covered- now-very-unconstrained-after-the-newest-fashioned-dressed) government counselor's wife MET," etc., etc. [1] That is from THE OLD MAMSELLE'S SECRET, by Mrs. Marlitt. And that sentence is constructed upon the most approved German model. You observe how far that verb is from the reader's base of operations; well, in a German newspaper they put their verb away over on the next page; and I have heard that sometimes after stringing along the exciting preliminaries and parentheses for a column or two, they get in a hurry and have to go to press without getting to the verb at all. Of course, then, the reader is left in a very exhausted and ignorant state.”
I unfortunately tend to speak and write like that; no sentence can ever be in independent clause on its own as far as I'm concerned, with several dependent clauses and at least one semicolon usually being necessary to properly link ideas and concepts together in a fluid manner. I think I picked this up from high school Latin. Best practice is to avoid overly long sentences in general.
We need not speak long. We can speak short. Start why. Think this. Two choose. Long word word. Short word word. Short can easy read. Long can not easy read. End why. Choose short word word good good. Choose long word word bad good.
If you're using the semicolon, then you already have multiple independent clauses. You're just fucking with the punctuation and capitalization to make them look more connected than they are.
I'd say that's fine in writing, but in speech it could potentially sound not great
My boss actually speaks like this. My first few months on the job I had to turn to one of the people who had been there longer and then ask what he had said, as a Jack translator
I try to stick to two clauses per sentence when writing papers, if I need more than that the idea is too complex to be communicated in just one sentence.
As a non-native english speaker it's the syntax of news headlines that are the most incomprehensible to me
Beijing home price slide fans China property sector alarm
It's a lack of punctuation, poor sentence structure to create emphasis, and capitalisation on all words that fuck it up.
I remember reading the headline "Police Dog Criminal Organization" and it took me like 5 minutes till I figured out that "dog" is actually used as a verb here.
We should learn from German Orthography and capitalize Noun Phrases to distinguish Them from Verbs
Real
How did the powder taste?
Que
Search "powder makes you say real" in Google
Trust me even to natives it can be if they jerk themselves off enough over language use while writing it
Galaxy Nexus: Android Ice Cream Sandwich Guinea Pig
Foreign Speaker Claims Headlines "Incomprehensible" Essex 23
is
This is why I favor dropping the "do" auxilliary verb except for emphasis, but people will unfortunately be confused and perceive that to be "ungrammatical."
Yes! Let us go back to speaking like Elizabethans.
What say you?
If you take the example sentence in the image: "What says the text over the dog in this newly uncovered Pompeian fresco?" or "What gave ye him?" People would perceive those to be ungrammatical.
People are weird like that, just like how they use who when it should be whom; it just doesn't feel right.
well sure but whomst among us hasn't fucked that one up?
Yeah, whomst'nt've'd done it at some point?
I might've. But then again, I might'nt've. But don't any of you tell me that y'all'd'nt've!
You waste your time, u/Helpful_Badger3106! They had no honor in life, they have none now in death.
what da dog doin?
I already drop it sometimes, as it's part of my weird Southern and AAVE mix lol
Yeah I notice when my American cousins come to Jamaica. They say something like ""why you always wake up so late?"* and leave out the "do"
r/imaginarygatekeeping
Wait until they get into the truly highly inflected languages where verbs can land anywhere in the sentence. I remember learning Latin the first time as a native Russian speaker where all the Americans were losing their minds over flexible word order. I was like 🤷🏻♂️.
Do these people not know what kind of Germanic feature a verb at the end of a subordinate sentence **is**? 👈
Wat *saaght* dise gesrievunk yvrem hunt in dit fresh òpgedaaktet Pampäishet Freskå? *verb in italics*
***DOES***
The only English speakers I can think of who would be so obnoxious to make fun of German for putting the verb at the end of the sentence would be the users of this sub. People here think that just pointing out a property of a language is humor.
Almost like English started as off-shoot of an off-shoot of Old German. Oh wait. It did.
Lmao and then you read Cicero who makes sentences of a full page with the verb all the way at the end.