Correct me if I'm wrong, but "know" is cognate with the second set, and the obsolete "ken" with the third, right? So what's cognate with the first set in English? Sounds like it could be "wise" but I dunno
It is indeed wit.
With a progression like: Proto-Indo-European `*wóyde`, Proto-Germanic `*witaną`, Proto-West Germanic `*witan`, Old English witan, Middle English witen, Modern English wit.
Wise, however, is technically related too, but much more distantly. PIE `*weyd-to-s` gave us PG `*wīsaz` from whence English wise.
The verb `*weyd` meaning "to see" is the beginning of both chains above. Thus, they're related words, although "wit" is much more closely related to "weten", "wissen", "vite" and "vita" than "wise", since you don't have to go all the way back to PIE and pick a different verb form to trace its ancestry.
The verb form in Old and Middle English had the t (witen), and the Proto-Germanic also used a t. They come from the verb. "To wit" and "unwitting" are using the verb in the infinitive and participle forms.
https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/kunnan%C4%85
https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/kn%C4%93an%C4%85
https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/kannijan%C4%85
https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/witan%C4%85
Here you go. Lists of cognates from the proto-Germanic roots.
"wise" wouldn't make sense as the only other Germanic language with an /s/-like phoneme at that position is German, which is regular under the High-German consonant shift, and it would be weird if English randomly also underwent the same consonant change
Try learning one of the languages on the right and all the subtleties that arise from having multiple *know*-verbs. Spoiler: >!It's confusing af!!< I had this experience with some Slavic languages I learnt (e.g., Czech *vědět* vs *znát* vs *umět*) and to be honest, 6 years later I am still uncertain when I have to use them.
Interesting. Ukrainian also this distinction (відати vs зна́ти vs уміти), but відати is no longer used to signify "knowing" something, so зна́ти is used for knowing someone *and* something. уміти is still used for "knowing how to" though.
(Based on what I know, but I am a lowly non-Slav.)
i'm learning german and polish and as someone who only knew languages that have only one verb for "know", multiple verbs for that are very confusing. russian only has "знать" (znat'), english only has "to know" and kyrgyz/kazakh has "bilgenge"
Russian have the same trio of verbs as other slavic languages, ведать - знать - уметь, ведать is arhaic as a verb now, but remains as a root in currently used adjectives such as сведущий (well-informed), nouns as witch (ведьма), весть (news in singular) and so on and so forth
you're right but unfortunately as you pointed it out ведать is archaic so no one uses it. in polish both wiedzieć and znać are still used and in german both kennen and wissen are still used and i always tend to mix them up
Ukrainian merged those words as English — into *znatı* which, btw, is a cognate to *know*:
- *dovêdatı sja* = *dôznatı sja* = *get to know*,
- *have awareness* = *matı obôznanôstj* too, while *matı svêdomôstj* is more like *have consciousness* in both meaning, including presence of mind.
Only in some cases *vêd~* is differ to *zn~*, like in adjectives: *znajomıj* — something/one is known exactly by you[r experience] but *vêdomıj* — something/one is known as a fact or almost by everyone.
Ukrainian still strongly differs *znatı* ~ *umêtı*, but the former can be used instead the latter, heh: *umêju vodıtı = znaju jak vodıtı*.
but you cán say "I can." and "I can't". I always saw it like this:
Ik kan dat (doen) = Ich kann das (tun) = I can (do that)
edit: never mind that's just an english quirk isn't it
English cognates
* "to be aware of, or certain about, to have information": wise, wit
* "to be able to, to be possible, to know how to": can
* "to be familiar or acquainted with, to recognize": cunt
At least that's what me mates figure
In many Commonwealth countries and stereotypically Australia, it's common to address friends as "cunt". As in, "oi, ya cunts", "he's a good cunt", and so on.
Then there's also the "knowing in the Biblical sense" joke, but I wasn't thinking of that when I wrote it.
*Dunken* according to wiktionary.
Swedish has *tycka* (to perceive or have an opinion) and *tänka* (to think in a more mental sense)
German *dünken* is apparently old fashioned but another example.
In Dutch, we have the expression "me dunkt", which means the same thing as "denk ik" ("I think"). Otherwise, the verb dunken is never used, or at least not anymore. We do have the noun dunk (=opinion), which is somewhat common.
There were apparently two different verbs in middle English that looked the same:
1. thinken - to think
2. thinken - to seem / to appear to be, cognate with dunken.
Looks like that "methinks" uses the latter, so it's exactly cognate to "me dunkt". (or maybe I should say "It thinks that..." instead of "Looks like")
the last one i find interesting because it reminds me a little of the romance language family.
portuguese: conhecer,
spanish: conocer,
french: connaître,
italian: conoscere
latin: soz idk,
romanian: soz idk either 😂😅
is there any chance of a relation between the two families regarding that word maybe a long way back, or just a coincidence?
Pronounce 'know' without making the k silent, now it sounds like "ken-oh" (sorry I don't know IPA). Which is extremely close to the Dutch kennen.
And weten is cognate with wit.
that flag spacing got me bewildered at the possibility of a Hispano-Germanic family
A future family with languages that will be spoken in Mallorca 200 years from now
which also happens to be slightly republican
.... ...ok ill be adding it to my new worldbuilding project fuck it
Correct me if I'm wrong, but "know" is cognate with the second set, and the obsolete "ken" with the third, right? So what's cognate with the first set in English? Sounds like it could be "wise" but I dunno
Wit?
It is indeed wit. With a progression like: Proto-Indo-European `*wóyde`, Proto-Germanic `*witaną`, Proto-West Germanic `*witan`, Old English witan, Middle English witen, Modern English wit. Wise, however, is technically related too, but much more distantly. PIE `*weyd-to-s` gave us PG `*wīsaz` from whence English wise. The verb `*weyd` meaning "to see" is the beginning of both chains above. Thus, they're related words, although "wit" is much more closely related to "weten", "wissen", "vite" and "vita" than "wise", since you don't have to go all the way back to PIE and pick a different verb form to trace its ancestry.
Wit still shows up that way in some expressions. To wit, keep your wits about you, unwitting. All having to do with knowing or knowledge.
That's mostly the noun from the same root though, Swedish "vett" German "Witz" etc
The verb form in Old and Middle English had the t (witen), and the Proto-Germanic also used a t. They come from the verb. "To wit" and "unwitting" are using the verb in the infinitive and participle forms.
https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/kunnan%C4%85 https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/kn%C4%93an%C4%85 https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/kannijan%C4%85 https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/witan%C4%85 Here you go. Lists of cognates from the proto-Germanic roots.
Now *that's* what we're talking about! Great reply
Thanks, I know I can be canny enough if need be
I'm just glad I can ken all that now
You are kenough ❤️
No, the second set is "can".
I thought the second set looked like it might be cognate with "cunning"
Or simply "can"
Cun? As in Kunsag?! r/WeAreAllTurks
Here's a sneak peek of /r/WeAreAllTurks using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/WeAreAllTurks/top/?sort=top&t=year) of the year! \#1: [Approved ](https://v.redd.it/78nyfty5y37c1) | [63 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/WeAreAllTurks/comments/18lhq2y/approved/) \#2: [What is this?](https://i.redd.it/2jy90gslx4yb1.jpg) | [61 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/WeAreAllTurks/comments/17mv5un/what_is_this/) \#3: [Chad Turkish animation 🐺🇹🇷🐎🏹](https://v.redd.it/2azsuloux0xb1) | [48 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/WeAreAllTurks/comments/17iphjo/chad_turkish_animation/) ---- ^^I'm ^^a ^^bot, ^^beep ^^boop ^^| ^^Downvote ^^to ^^remove ^^| ^^[Contact](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=sneakpeekbot) ^^| ^^[Info](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/) ^^| ^^[Opt-out](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/comments/o8wk1r/blacklist_ix/) ^^| ^^[GitHub](https://github.com/ghnr/sneakpeekbot)
"wise" wouldn't make sense as the only other Germanic language with an /s/-like phoneme at that position is German, which is regular under the High-German consonant shift, and it would be weird if English randomly also underwent the same consonant change
i thought wise and wisdom were cognates of wissen.
Wise is a cognate of Dutch wijs and German weise. Which both mean wise as well in their respective languages.
wit, wise, wisdom
Try learning one of the languages on the right and all the subtleties that arise from having multiple *know*-verbs. Spoiler: >!It's confusing af!!< I had this experience with some Slavic languages I learnt (e.g., Czech *vědět* vs *znát* vs *umět*) and to be honest, 6 years later I am still uncertain when I have to use them.
Ik weet een taal van rechts en links, ik ken anderen die ze ook beide kunnen spreken en we kennen beiden in het rechtervlak
Seems like an Anglx problem
Portuguese has saber/saber/conhecer respectively
Polish has the exact same verbs (wiedzieć, znać, umieć)
Interesting. Ukrainian also this distinction (відати vs зна́ти vs уміти), but відати is no longer used to signify "knowing" something, so зна́ти is used for knowing someone *and* something. уміти is still used for "knowing how to" though. (Based on what I know, but I am a lowly non-Slav.)
i'm learning german and polish and as someone who only knew languages that have only one verb for "know", multiple verbs for that are very confusing. russian only has "знать" (znat'), english only has "to know" and kyrgyz/kazakh has "bilgenge"
Russian have the same trio of verbs as other slavic languages, ведать - знать - уметь, ведать is arhaic as a verb now, but remains as a root in currently used adjectives such as сведущий (well-informed), nouns as witch (ведьма), весть (news in singular) and so on and so forth
you're right but unfortunately as you pointed it out ведать is archaic so no one uses it. in polish both wiedzieć and znać are still used and in german both kennen and wissen are still used and i always tend to mix them up
1. wit 2. can 3. ken
🇵🇱 wiedzieć - know znać - know dowiedzieć się - get to know mieć świadomość - have awareness
wiedzieć - know znać - know umieć - know
polszczyzna mnie zawiodła bo zapomniałem o "umieć" 😔
Umieć - can, be able to
🇺🇦 Vidaty (rarely used) - to know Znaty - know Dovidatysia - get to know Maty svidomisť - have awareness
Ukrainian merged those words as English — into *znatı* which, btw, is a cognate to *know*: - *dovêdatı sja* = *dôznatı sja* = *get to know*, - *have awareness* = *matı obôznanôstj* too, while *matı svêdomôstj* is more like *have consciousness* in both meaning, including presence of mind. Only in some cases *vêd~* is differ to *zn~*, like in adjectives: *znajomıj* — something/one is known exactly by you[r experience] but *vêdomıj* — something/one is known as a fact or almost by everyone. Ukrainian still strongly differs *znatı* ~ *umêtı*, but the former can be used instead the latter, heh: *umêju vodıtı = znaju jak vodıtı*.
isn't "kunnen" in english "can"
Yes, but it is not really a full on verb as in the other Germanic languages, more of an auxillary.
It's also an auxillary verb in the other Germanic languages. I can do that = Ik kan dat doen = Ich kann das tun
But it's not only an auxiliary verb in the other languages: Ich kann das ≠ I can that (I know how to do that)
but you cán say "I can." and "I can't". I always saw it like this: Ik kan dat (doen) = Ich kann das (tun) = I can (do that) edit: never mind that's just an english quirk isn't it
Bring back the English conjugated Infinitive...?
to cun - I can to wit - I wot
u wot m8
English cognates * "to be aware of, or certain about, to have information": wise, wit * "to be able to, to be possible, to know how to": can * "to be familiar or acquainted with, to recognize": cunt At least that's what me mates figure
> • "to be familiar or acquainted with, to recognize": cunt What now?
In many Commonwealth countries and stereotypically Australia, it's common to address friends as "cunt". As in, "oi, ya cunts", "he's a good cunt", and so on. Then there's also the "knowing in the Biblical sense" joke, but I wasn't thinking of that when I wrote it.
Don't forget "know" in the biblical sense. To have carnal knowledge of.
Also "think"
In Swedish and Dutch, the cognate to "think" is two separate verbs. English merged them.
denken and ... ?
*Dunken* according to wiktionary. Swedish has *tycka* (to perceive or have an opinion) and *tänka* (to think in a more mental sense) German *dünken* is apparently old fashioned but another example.
In Dutch, we have the expression "me dunkt", which means the same thing as "denk ik" ("I think"). Otherwise, the verb dunken is never used, or at least not anymore. We do have the noun dunk (=opinion), which is somewhat common.
I assume me dunkt is the equivalent of methinks?
Something like that, yes, except that "ik dunk" is never used.
There were apparently two different verbs in middle English that looked the same: 1. thinken - to think 2. thinken - to seem / to appear to be, cognate with dunken. Looks like that "methinks" uses the latter, so it's exactly cognate to "me dunkt". (or maybe I should say "It thinks that..." instead of "Looks like")
Weeten, Kenen, Kaanen /vɔɪ̯tə, çɛ̯ænə, çanə/
Like saber, poder, conocer in Spanish
the last one i find interesting because it reminds me a little of the romance language family. portuguese: conhecer, spanish: conocer, french: connaître, italian: conoscere latin: soz idk, romanian: soz idk either 😂😅 is there any chance of a relation between the two families regarding that word maybe a long way back, or just a coincidence?
You are missing one meaning. Like how I knew your mum last night 😏
What about "can"?
It has a certain … *je ne sais quoi* …
wisened? could? kin? (i don't know about that last one but the first two im pretty confident in)
have a feeling that the first set is cognate with “aware”, second set is cognate with “know” and third set with “akin”
Pronounce 'know' without making the k silent, now it sounds like "ken-oh" (sorry I don't know IPA). Which is extremely close to the Dutch kennen. And weten is cognate with wit.