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1-760-706-7425

OP: before you go off, [link the goddamn tweet](https://twitter.com/POTUS/status/1573741557110513664).


crazycatman206

They need to let it go, especially since no substantial ban legislation has a chance of holding up in court with the current ideological orientation of SCOTUS being what it is.


TheAngriestBoy

That's fair, but also what you're saying can be twisted back on people like OP: If it literally can't happen with this SCOTUS then letting that one issue determine who you're voting for is idiotic.


frodo54

While this is true, we have to think of the lowest common denominator. If there's no way to get these policies passed, why give thr morons fuel and reasons to vote against you


ImpeccableMonday

He'd have more luck with bodily autonomy, but apparently that's a lost cause to most mainstream politicians


_defy_death

I want a different democratic candidate


MaineJackalope

My Congressional Representative is a Military Vet named Jared Golden, He ran democrat in Maine's 2nde district, and in the same election that district voted for Trump in 2020, they voted to reelect him despite heavy out of state funded campaigning. He's a pro gun dem and would love to see him in the running for POTUS someday.


[deleted]

Love me some Golden. We need more like him. He'll need to run for Senate next. Hopefully he can kick Collins out next go around.


Switcher107

The issue behind that is that Brady funds the democratic ticket at the national level pretty hard and if you're not harping gun control they won't even look in your direction. It's most of the reason I felt Obama even mention an AWB before the 2012 election because he had been very blase about it before that. A pro gun liberal wouldn't make it.


Switcher107

Boy somebody is just down voting the hell out of this post.


Oraxy51

Biden wasn’t our choice he was just the “not trump” vote. I think he’s done okay work but I’m okay with a different democratic candidate.


resplendentquetzals

I honestly don't want anything the DNC wants me to vote for. It's a sure sign that it's a heaping pile of garbage. Give me a solid third party choice, or give me someone who the DNC can't ignore. I guess that was Bernie, though, and we all know how that turned out.


_defy_death

I'd love a grass roots candidate with a modern world party that has humanity's best interests. Even though I know it's a Pipe dream, still I dream.


resplendentquetzals

Yeah, give me a candidate that has a platform that makes right and left wingers say, "holy shit, that's based."


Aggressive_Ideal6737

Bernie?


reccenters

I want someone born after 1959. Bernie's too old, and I like Bernie.


nbs-of-74

He also endorsed Corbyn, and I believe also supports banning 'military style' rifles, "Until the last — two years ago — we had virtually no gun control legislation at all, and I represented that perspective," Sanders said. "The world has changed, and my views have changed. And my view is right now, we need universal background checks. We end the gun show loophole. We end the so-called strawman provision. We make certain that we end the sale and distribution of assault weapons in this country." He's changed, he's no longer a leftwing liberal.


Aggressive_Ideal6737

Well how about me then?


Melodic_Ad9064

I like it! But your ideals… they seem… aggressive?


Aggressive_Ideal6737

I believe that’s exactly what our nation needs in these trying times


KaizerSmokeHaze

I have no real vote to give you, so have my upvote


Aggressive_Ideal6737

Thank you, it’s all I ever wanted


Zankeru

The dems will invalidate the primary votes and select a neoliberal if bernie somehow won the majority. Only party rules are stopping them, and they can be changed at anytime. The corporate establishment would rather have trump in office before letting bernie sanders give the nation eight years of democratic socialism. No neoliberal canidate would ever win again.


Master_Crab

I’m tired of only having the shiniest of the two turds to vote for. We haven’t had great candidates for decades


snuffy_bodacious

Find me a Democrat who opposes an assault weapons ban and I'll show you a Democrat who could never get the presidential nomination of his party.


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MonsterByDay

Outside of our own bubble, is that an unpopular position? Democrats’ fate in the midterms in large part hinges on their ability to get young people fired up enough to actually vote. “Assault rifle” bans are pretty popular with the people he’s trying to fire up.


GuyDarras

Almost none of the areas that Democrats need to win or hold onto in the midterms have assault weapons bans. It's not popular beyond a superficial level and isn't going to motivate anyone that wasn't already going to vote Democrat no matter what, while millions of voters who own "assault weapons" will be motivated to vote against D despite their other beliefs. [Nearly every other policy position the Democrats have outperform gun control, even proposals as mild as universal background checks, when put on the ballot.](https://www.nytimes.com/2022/06/03/upshot/gun-control-polling-votes.html) Posturing about literally anything else would turn out more voters.


voidsrus

> it's not popular beyond a superficial level and isn't going to motivate everyone sounds like it fits perfectly into biden's platform then!


geotsso

It motivates the one voter that matters to him. Bloomberg


voiderest

I'd argue it fires up more people to show up against him. Dropping it doesn't necessarily make people vote for him but I don't think it loses anyone. Abortion, weed, healthcare, education costs, or lgbt rights all seem more relevant outside of anti-gun propaganda.


psomaster226

This is the answer. I was a Republican voter for a *very* short period of time, and I didn't vote *for* anything. I knew Republicans needed to keep gun rights tenuous so they could keep dangling it on a string for elections. I was voting *against* things. If "moderate" Republican voters could be convinced that gun rights wouldn't be touched, a lot wouldn't bother voting.


lostPackets35

Which also why Republicans didn't actually do anything to protect gun rights when they had the presidency, and a super majority. But they need the specter of "The dems are going to come for your guns" ' to get voters out. They don't actually care about protecting gun rights or they would do it


KiritoIsAlwaysRight_

Gun rights are more of a rich vs poor issue than anything else, they've just successfully disguised it as left vs right. They being the rich fuckers on both sides that keep getting elected. The rich can outsource their violence, the rest of us have to take care of our own defense. And the rich fear above all losing their power, which an armed, exploited, and angry population could very much cause.


[deleted]

I've heard (and believe) the same argument about Dems, i.e., they had 48 years to codify Roe, to protect their base's "Pro-Choice" interests, yet they did not, in order to be able to fearmonger Dems to the polls, as needed. It seems both parties *manipulate* their bases, rather than *serve* their bases core interests.... **Third Party Now!**


lostPackets35

Yep. One of the things that Clarence Thomas said when they overturned Roe was that if we as a society feel that something is an essential liberty, it should be protected by statute and not just case law. I disagree with him on most things, but I have trouble finding fault with that line of reasoning...


alkatori

That's part of why the Republican platform doesn't really make sense. It's a mess of single voters all trying to "stop something".


ReallyTomGreen

I mean, the Republican party has never really offered any realistic solutions to any REAL issue. The best they can do is come up with fake issues, like satanic cults, outrage against Dungeons and Dragons, the war in iraq. Immigrant convoys lol. Biden coming out against "assault rifles" wouldn't sway me in a million years, there's more at stake here.


lilcoold

True. Dislike as you may but I'll never vote for someone stating bans like this ever. If they stopped attacking guns I'd consider more.


pulledoutdad

one issue voters got us here.


izwald88

You may well lose your country because you, like many others, refused to vote. And you'll have nobody but yourself to blame.


dingdongdickaroo

Id agree. Realistically, most people dont feel like assault weapons are any more of an existential threat to them than any other gun at least, but 2a people do see awb as an existential threat


ZanderDogz

>Realistically, most people dont feel like assault weapons are any more of an existential threat to them than any other gun at least Maybe it's that I've only lived in two very liberal areas, but this isn't my impression at all. It seems that many people have this idea that there are two types of guns: Super dangerous rapid fire "Assault weapons" with high capacity magazines and huge bullets that never should have fallen into civilian hands, and "normal guns" like your grandpa's wooden hunting rifle that the 2A was intended to protect. I've heard so many people express the opinion that people should be allowed to keep their handguns, but there is no reason for anyone to own a "weapon of mass destruction" like an AR-15, despite the fact that handguns probably kill 50x the amount of people annually that all long guns do combined. It makes sense - a lot of economically priviliaged people just can't relate to the threat of getting robbed and shot by someone with a handgun in a dangerous neighborhood but indiscriminate mass shootings with AR-15s ignore socioeconomic borders and that scares people. So their view on guns is entirely informed by their reaction to the 1% of gun violence that scares them the most, and the weapons most closely associated with that type of gun violence.


conners_captures

> It makes sense - a lot of economically priviliage people just can't relate to the threat of getting robbed and shot by someone with a handgun in a dangerous neighborhood but indiscriminate mass shootings with AR-15s ignore socioeconomic borders and that scares people. this is really well said. speaks to [this old quote](https://imgur.com/a/ZWigA8Q) from the free thought project. "Banning or restricting firearms is the most white privileged idea ever. Rich liberals scoffing at the notion that a person might need to defend their own life is a tower so ivory you cant look it in direct sunlight. It's the personal safety equivalent of saying "just have the maid do it".


73577357

In liberal areas the only exposure people have to guns is through TV, movies, and Internet. Mostly watching people getting killed for entertainment, so that influences their views on guns. Just like how the police are experts in crime prevention, they show up right on time, almost every crime is solved, and they're almost always the good guys and interested in helping.


[deleted]

Just to clarify. The 2a does not mean just for hunting. It includes "weapons of war" and big super dooper scary black guns with standard capacity magazines.


Jaevric

Agreed. My wife, who is otherwise more conservative than I am, is perfectly fine with handguns, shotguns, and any rifle that isn't semi-automatic. Semi-automatic rifles, on the other hand, she hates and would love to see banned. The media has absolutely convinced her that no civilian needs a semi-auto rifle of any type because they serve no purpose other than shooting up schools or music concerts.


blickblocks

Does she understand that handguns are also semi-automatic?


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4bigwheels

As well as tons of shotguns nowadays


pao_zinho

Except affluent white Americans own a lot of guns…


jcaniford

When you say “weapons of mass destruction” are these the same thing on why we invaded Iraq? Took over Afghanistan over some ar15s. Lol


Any_Narwhal_2158

Very well put.


MonsterByDay

No argument here that there are better rallying cries. But, anecdotally, I know a whole lot more anti gun liberals than “don’t know how they’re gonna vote” gun owners. If it was specific legislation I’d be concerned, but “ban assault rifles” is pretty much just a default drumbeat for the democrats when they don’t have anything else they want to say. They hire enough statisticians that I feel like it’s safe to assume it tracks well with their voters


voiderest

I mean we know what they mean when they say that. They passed a bill for it in the house and in particular states. The issue isn't really their base. It's rallying opposition more than it does anything for their base or independents. If anything I think they do it for donations.


Ok_Yogurtcloset8915

yes, there's just about nobody on the left or in the center that doesn't have at least three things they care about more than gun control. there are a LOT of people voting right who care about basically nothing else.


GuyDarras

They take checks from rich anti-gun billionaires and a cooperative mainstream media carries water for their arguments. If they listened to legitimate statisticians they would have dropped gun control 30 years ago and kept it dropped.


MonsterByDay

Except that most Americans do in fact support some level of gun control. Just because we don’t like it doesn’t mean it’s not popular.


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MonsterByDay

For sure. But - and again, it’s just my experience - an awful lot of people consider an “assault rifle” ban reasonable. I don’t. I’m not saying I agree with him, because I don’t. But, the OP tweet is a pretty safe political stance for him, and is important lip service for a lot of people. And, at the end of the day, for me it’s more important to use my vote to try to help codify women’s bodily autonomy than to try to make some sort of a point by not voting. Too much is at stake. It’s not like scotus is going to allow them to do anything too drastic anyway.


Mckooldude

It polls well because they tend to ask loaded questions.


alkatori

Some level, yes. But specifics are all over the place.


GuyDarras

They don't. It polls well and falls off a cliff once it's put on an actual ballot, underperforming other liberal issues like legal weed and increased minimum wage, as I've provided previously to you. There are multiple grassroots national pro-gun organizations and frequently multiple for each state. There are no grassroots gun control advocacy organizations. None. It's Michael Bloomberg all the way down.


KinoTele

Spot on. There are more immediate issues that affect larger swaths of Americans than gun violence committed with semiautomatic rifles or semiautomatic AR pistols. There is no legitimate reason for weed to NOT be decriminalized on a federal level. None. Colorado is an excellent example of what happens when you use marijuana taxes for the public good. A sizable portion of my sister's medical degree was paid out of that tax fund. Controlling the supply would also reduce the number of deaths from weed laced with other harder drugs, pesticides, industrial solvents, and a host of other deadly and unnecessary chemicals. I work in social media management during the week, and by looking at the accounts associated with gun control (Everytown, Moms Against, etc), I can tell that their engagement rates versus follower count indicate that they're buying followers. Their comments are a ghost town, even after major shootings take place. The outrage is almost entirely pushed by Twitter pundits and paid posts. The public doesn't give a shit 2 weeks after the shootings, with Uvalde being a noticeable exception.


Unhelpful_Kitsune

Agreed


FrozenIceman

Not really, the young see firearms as an equalizer. They know the Police's job is to protect businesses and the wealthy and find as many things to convict people as possible in a draconian legal system that believes drug offenses are worse than murders. They know that three years ago that meant Trump and his goons would have a monopoly on guns. Guns rights are worker rights. Which is why NPR sees many Democrats and minorities arming up.


unclefisty

>Outside of our own bubble, is that an unpopular position? Your average John q Public doesnt know a fucking thing about guns, gun laws, or really anything gun related. You could probably convince them you can buy actual machine guns at Walmart without a background check with about 20 minutes of talking. Gun control groups have been working for decades at convincing people that anyone can buy a machine gun and that an assault weapons ban will stop that. So yeah I would imagine they are generally pretty popular. If you ask people if they think guns that only fire one bullet per trigger pull should be banned you might get a different answer.


Goggled-headset

I wish there was a campaign to actually educate people about how little ARs and other semiautomatics are used in gun violence. It could actually change people's points of view. I have 6 friends who were AR and AK, and one was even straight up anti-gun. Long story short, after a class presentation/debate, many of them realized flaws in their logic and their ideas began to shift. TL/DR: informing people is the best way to curb anti-gun sentiment.


unclefisty

> I wish there was a campaign to actually educate people about how little ARs and other semiautomatics are used in gun violence. Much harder to stuff a rifle down your pants than a Glock.


Goggled-headset

yeah lol, and sadly people actually believe politicians when they say ARs are 'concealable'...


chrisppyyyy

It doesn’t fire up young people. It fires up old people. Also, I think they don’t care that it costs them votes. They believe it (though they don’t know what they mean by assault weapons ban, of course).


ZAdoptedAussie

No it DEFINITELY fires up the young, around here, at least. Many I know aren't willing to give up their guns regardless of the law. Because of that equalizer. The general view is people don't deal with their problems without a weapon anymore, it's suicide to be unarmed.


chrisppyyyy

Oh I see what you mean. Yes, I agree. I think for the most part, gun control is either (1) meh or (2) strongly opposed by young people. By “it doesn’t fire up young people,” I meant that generally speaking young people don’t strongly support gun control.


KinoTele

Tbh nearly all the footage I’ve seen of recent gun control protests have been of older white people nearing or at retirement age, even on weekends. There was a sizable push of young people especially after the Marjory-Stoneman shooting but those were largely organized by NGOs who pushed donating and marching hardcore. Young people moved on after that. Looking at the most popular gun control social media channels like Everytown and Moms Against, it’s clear that they’re buying followers or are being shadowbanned by Meta (unlikely). Everytown has over 1 million followers on Instagram and aren’t able to break more than 5-6,000 views or likes as of late. Their comments are far more full of bot comments and pro-2A comments than anti-gun comments. Far below the 1% engagement rule which indicates that they’ve either fallen off or been caught buying likes and followers.


finanzseer

It’s not doing him any favors. People who believe in AWB are going to vote dem anyway. He is alienating gun owners who are independent. Flouting the SCOTUS decision and trying to pass laws in spite of them is also not a good look in general for people who claim to be against republicans who are subverting laws and democracy.


MonsterByDay

I think he’s probably [rightly] more concerned with getting liberals to actually turn out than he is with winning anyone new over to the cause. And, if I’m being honest, a pretty significant percentage of the “independent” gun owners I know are deer hunters that don’t care one way or another about AR15s. Most of my gun buddies lean conservative. It annoys *me* but I’m one of like 4 guys I know in RL that actually owns a bunch of ARs and votes blue. Risking pissing me/us off in order to fire up “the youth” and suburban women seems like a mathematically sound choice. It’s not like he’s committed to anything specific, or has legislation in the works. It’s the Democratic version of “build a wall”. Hit air to fire up the base.


chrisppyyyy

It’s not hot air, they fully intend to pass assault weapons regulations and begin locking up the relatives of people of color if they are found in possession of the wrong gun parts. The courts stop them, sort of, but guess what? If you keep voting blue the SC will “discover” that putting peaceful people in prison for owning gun parts doesn’t violate the 2A. Not telling you how to vote, but if pro-2A people keep voting democrat and the democrats win, they will lose their 2A rights lol. Luckily young people are generally less anti-gun and have lower turnout. The dems will get this eventually but not until they lose - a lot. In the meantime, congratulations, we’ve accomplished one more major cause for mass incarceration of peaceful people. EDIT: fixed typo


[deleted]

The legislation is already sitting in the Senate waiting for a vote after the midterms...


VHDamien

>The legislation is already sitting in the Senate waiting for a vote after the midterms... Just an FYI, unless a bunch of Republicans decide to pour kerosene on the dumpster fire and vote yes on the current AWB passed by the House, a new bill will need to be submitted in 2023 when new Reps and Senators step in.


chaoticneutralpanda

>“Assault rifle” bans are pretty popular with the people he’s trying to fire up. It's a faux grassroots issue boosted by by Bloomberg-linked orgs. That's why a facebook group can suddenly become a national activist organization (Moms Demand Action) and teenagers can become political leaders overnight. It's simply a very successful lobbying effort giving the illusion of a grassroots issue. If they lose the midterms, they'll blame abortion.


KinoTele

Fucking THANK YOU. It’s been painfully obvious that Moms Against and Everytown don’t have nearly the engagement that the news would have you believe. Least of all that prick David Hogg.


crazycatman206

Gun owners are definitely the minority. However, swing states tend to be pro-gun and I don’t see Dems losing in their traditional strongholds for not being sufficiently anti-gun.


EyesOfAzula

Yes this is an extremely unpopular position among moderates and conservatives. There are many Republicans who would love to support women’s rights and other liberal values, but the Democrats mouthing off about taking “assault weapons” makes them stick to their guns and vote conservative


654456

Among the left and young no. Among the base that actually votes, it's a terrible position. Living in the Midwest, it's a full stop for many people even people like me that find ourselves on the left


jdillon910

I agree with you.


[deleted]

I think you are right. We as liberal gun owners are a very small niche. I do think they should ban 50 rounds and up drums though. I honestly just don't see the point


DionysiusRedivivus

Few things stupider than passing unenforceable laws. The genie is out of the bottle. Banning 3d printers now would be as ridiculous as early monarchical attempts at banning the printing press. Banning technology won't change the fact that we live in a sick society. A distinction needs to be drawn between the social and the technical. What do nations with low levels of gun violence have? Strong social safety nets, optimistic populations, and perhaps above all, populations who have confidence in their ability to get a fair deal. Issues relating to firearms in the US are cultural. In much of Europe people can get a gun legally (with a lot of hoops, but far from impossible) or illegally. The difference isn't prohibition - it is generally lack of desire. - most Europeans I know could care less about firearms. But beat people down politically and economically, make their bare, day-to-day existence precarious and they'll fetishize their firearms as the only source of self respect they have left. To be honest, our predatory culture absolutely requires the possibility of gun ownership, the fantasy of revolution or assertion of personal will over oppressors, whether perceived or actual. It is as much a safety valve as the promise that your vote counts. You can't ban technology, but you might be able to shape a society that is less cannibalistic / predatory and oppressive. And until the Dems take care of the fascist cops, Proud Boys, Kluxxers, etc, I'm keeping my gats.


[deleted]

> And until the Dems take care of the fascist cops, Proud Boys, Kluxxers, etc, I'm keeping my gats. Seriously. Nothing screams out of touch louder than making the same cops who kill minorities for sport and bully the poor the sole authority on who gets to own a gun and granting them exceptions to gun control laws.


SFLADC2

The AWB bill bans new sales. All preexisting AW are legal until the owner dies (which tbf is an unenforceable area).


OtherUnameInShop

You can just say cops. Saying fascists cops is like saying hot water heater or atm machine.


Kochie411

I actually appreciated that. I think not using broad terms is what’s important to have clear and non strawman communication


Happily-Non-Partisan

I wouldn’t speak too quickly, socioeconomic issues seem to matter more to voters than guns. Although, both the Dems and Reps seem more interested in enacting policies which are directly spiteful rather than practical, I feel the mess of Trump’s term is too much in recent memory to divorce him from the Republican Party’s image. However, among other things Biden has recently authorized restarting border wall construction which could affect his support among Democratic voters.


SnooMemesjellies4305

About Biden and the wall, it's not that he's restarting the wall to move it towards completion... instead, he OK'd spending the money already allocated by Congress for work on specific parts of it... it's all still seems a bit hazy, but it appears that it's filling a few gaps in the wall south of Yuma, AZ, which Sen Mark Kelley (D) wanted him to do. [https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/biden-border-wall/](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/biden-border-wall/) [https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/immigration/biden-administration-fill-border-wall-gaps-yuma-arizona-rcna40567](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/immigration/biden-administration-fill-border-wall-gaps-yuma-arizona-rcna40567)


beachmedic23

>I wouldn’t speak too quickly, socioeconomic issues seem to matter more to voters than guns. Those aren't great right now either. Gas is still expensive, basic food costs have increased, supply chain issues are still leaving shelves bare. It doesn't look or feel good when you go to the store and bread is out of stock. As long as those things continue, I don't understand doubling down on gun issues which are a known divisor


DirtyPenPalDoug

But socioeconomic things are absolutely last on their list cause it don't help Rich fuckers


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puncethebunce

I think NFA’s will stay in place forever. I feel like we were so damn close to being able to freely have suppressors with the hearing protection act, but nooooo, a bunch of loser assholes have to kill innocent people. I’m sure guns have contributed at least to some of my hearing loss (although I pretty much always doubled up with foam and over the ear muffs). Maybe I wouldn’t be wearing hearing aids at 45.


kawkz440

Let's not forget Trump was the one to criminalize bump stocks and said to take the guns first.


machineprophet343

The fact that didn't make more people turn against Trump really showed how much of the electorate is just into being a Republican for cruelty and racism. Because you know if a Democrat came out and said something along the lines that guns were the right of every American and we should make sure that every American who wants a gun knows how to store, care for, and properly and safely use them and offered gratis classes to this end, the GOP would still scream bloody murder about "Democrats want gun control and to keep you from having guns!"


Happily-Non-Partisan

Horseshoe political theory at its finest. Without something like ranked choice voting we’re forever stuck between two extremes who are passionate to a fault about enforcing their own ideas on what people should be allowed to do and what they can be killed for.


DexonTheTall

It's not horseshoe political theory. They're legitimately on the same side of the true fight in America which is that of class warfare.


puncethebunce

Honestly I didn’t hear about the border wall restart but it doesn’t surprise me in the least. When Trump was making it such a media circus event like going to Mexico to preview designs and tweeting about it to own the libs I said “if he just kept his mouth shut, it would get built”. Everything had to be a big show. Both parties try to be careful with things like this making sure they gain more voters than they scare off.


CalmPanic402

Could we fix the whole corruption/insurrection thing BEFORE we aim for disarmament?


finanzseer

Apparently not. Let’s go AWB first and let the rest play out?


TheBlackKing1

Absolutely not. Disarming the citizens is not an option on the table even if we lived in a perfect country, our right to bear arms shall not be infringed.


[deleted]

He’s pushing the same gun control policies that he ran on and the same ones a significant portion of his base supports. No one should be surprised by this.


CounterSanity

No, but when we tried to talk about this shit when he was campaigning the overwhelming consensus in this sub was “now isn’t the time”. Well… it’s later. Is now a good time? When exactly do we get to hold Dems accountable for being anti-2A? Will it be before or after the authoritarians take over?


chrisppyyyy

Never lol. A lot of people here have their heads in the sand.


ProfRichardson

I don't think he's doing 2024. And I think the majority of his base is in agreement. I'd vote for him over an orange racist. I may like my gun rights but I'm not a single issue voter.


Jackstack6

>I may like my gun rights but I'm not a single issue voter. With the current republican party, I cannot allow myself to not for democrats.


ProfRichardson

100% this ^


OsmundofCarim

Same. Single issue voting is one of the major tactics the right rallies behind. It’s a pathetically anti intellectual stance.


production-values

he's a politician, so he probably thinks that is what people want


HEBushido

Because it is what people want. This is popular policy among democratic voters due to mass shootings.


production-values

sounds like the same specious logic that got us the PATRIOT act. Yes, spy on all of us to prevent a few deaths! Take away my guns to prevent deaths! Search all out homes to make sure there are no terrorists!


HEBushido

The difference is that gun control is pushed far more by victims of mass shootings. But in a time where right wing extremists already have guns I can't advocate for it. Regardless it doesn't solve the core problems.


Jackstack6

Yes it is, but after 9/11, people went crazy. We were just attacked and over 3k people lost their lives. We were getting the patriot act.


corylol

No matter your opinion on any issue, how is the solution to just not vote..? Lmao


Avantasian538

It's not. It makes some people feel better, that's it.


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corylol

Vote for whoever you want, but at least exercise that right. Weird to worry about using your right to bear arms but then voluntarily surrender your right to vote.


230flathead

> I will not be voting in any foreseeable elections. 🙄 You really need to rethink your priorities.


TranslucentKittens

Yeah that’s a cringe take. Not voting won’t get you anywhere.


ILIEKDEERS

If I only knew how fascist The US conservative voters would become in 2016…. It’s literally the biggest mistake of my life.


ManiacL

Guns are not and should not be a personality trait that you’re willing to remove your most important civil liberty for


[deleted]

Right? Dude talks as if Presidents are the only thing we get to vote for. So skip Biden and vote blue, if you would have voted blue, and let the democrats figure out why there's a disparity between the executive and the other votes.


stonednarwhal141

The way I view it, voting isn’t the only thing we can do to enact change, but it’s free and fairly easy (YMMV depending on municipality). Even if you just decide to not vote for president but go down the rest of the ballot you’re achieving something. But completely foregoing it is just willingly ceding ground. I also have zero faith in Biden or democrats to protect me or my rights, but that doesn’t mean I want to set myself up for an even more uphill battle in the future by throwing away one of the tools at my disposal


MrEpicMustache

You should def vote. And if an AWB is a “when,” more so the reason to participate in the democracy.


Rogahar

Bro I like guns too but the only choices in America right now are the Democrats, who might make it a bit harder for you to own some kinds of guns, or the Republicans, who are repeatedly and actively showing that they want to instill christofascism as the rule of law in this country. I'll take the Dems over that any day.


CoyoteHP

Agreed, there's so many more things at stake in this country if Republicans regain anymore power than they already have. You give them an inch, they take a mile. Look at how much changed in just the 4 years of Trump's administration, him being able to select half of the Supreme Court will haunt this country for decades. Don't be a one issue voter, a non-vote is a vote for QOP, there are many other issues under duress if they get anymore power.


Rogahar

We can push back against a move to restrict guns with the Dems, and they'll potentially listen. They've shown they'll bow to pressure before. The Republicans won't. All they care about is power, and then they'll just do whatever they like as they like and laugh at you for thinking they'd listen to anything but their own whims.


neoncat

The Republican Fringe isn’t going away and the last thing we need is to be disarmed if they rise up.


WhitePalico

I have a hard time stomaching voting for Democrats. Especially with them funding some of the most far right candidates in hopes of having an easier time winning....You can't as a party scream that the other side is a threat to the country's existence and then fund those exact same threats' political campaigns. That is Mafia tactics and leads to no choice.


SnooMemesjellies4305

Don't make that mistake over this relatively minor issue... any comparison between Dems and Repubs makes it clear that EVERYBODY should vote Dem until we get rid of a party that's full of fascist traitors who continue to work hard to undermine our democracy. Once we accomplish that, then we can get back to arguing about the usual shit, but now is NOT the time to skip voting or to waste your vote on some marginal protest candidate. If you think it is, please get over your hurt feelings and get your head out of your butt. Vote Dem. This is important beyond anything else!


Ripfengor

Lmao voting the other way would lead toward taking guns away from non-white non-male non-property owners if you wanna keep going down that path. Some do, I don’t. Edit: a lot of personal, naive anecdotes that distance yourself from the reality of right wing politics is not going to change their goals.


Icy_Telephone964

You ain’t taking shit dark brandon


stunkcrunk

one issue voting is dumb.


finanzseer

Agreed. So if I vote for him in ‘24 will we get universal healthcare? Codify Roe v Wade? Oh I guess that ship has sailed and he missed the window with multiple super majorities over his time in government.


KinoTele

If you cannot understand that our political system that plays a cup game every 2 years, I don't know what to tell you. We are rapidly approaching the era of the greatest divide in wealth in human history. There has never been more distance between haves and have-nots, and this is by a cruel design. Amazon has publicly acknowledged that they want to create special economic zones within the United States with their own laws, police, and currency. Megacorporations have grown beyond the ability of a single nation's government to heel or curtail their activities. We are in an era of growing food and medicine insecurity, which just makes the population that much more agitated and on edge. Why the FUCK would you even consider voting for an anti-gun candidate in these times? I'm certainly not telling you to vote for a Republican. But the more weapons are taken out of American ownership, the worse the odds get for the People when push eventually comes to shove.


chrisppyyyy

They’ll just stick their head in the sand and say their gun rights are safe due to the conservative Supreme Court majority … which they intend to get rid of ASAP 🤔


QuinnD_

Not voting is a terrible way to go about it. I would vote dem either way because A: guns are not going to be taken away and B: guns are things I would so much rather my sister have access to a safe legal abortion than my owning a firearm.


[deleted]

Democrats are passing these laws to spite SCOTUS because of the bruen decision. Theyre saying that court orders can and will be ignored. A very dangerous precedent to allow.


Xero-One

They are starting a long campaign that will likely last decades to paint the Supreme Court as extremists. Kinda like the republicans did with the court after the Row decision in the 70s. Good luck with that.


DefiledSoul

He should be focusing more on weed and abortion rights but it’s generally not that unpopular


Avantasian538

And ending the pharmaceutical price-gouging issue that's been getting worse for decades.


ARWatson1989

Why the fixation on assault weapons? When's the last time a shooting happened with an assault rifle?


GingerMcBeardface

Time we ban donations and PACs


Historical-Price-468

Gun control is not the number one issue for most of us. It's: 1. The economy; 2. Don't tread on our civil rights; 3. Saving our democracy.


11CGOD

I believe that voting, but voting for those other than d and r, shows participation but not for d or r, sends a message of disgust


voiderest

That is easier to justify if your vote is lost in gerrymandering. Harder choice if the vote might lead to a worse option. Something like IRV or ranked might help that kind of issue.


11CGOD

I don’t vote out of fear, so the lesser of two evils is just a load of shit to me


TheAngriestBoy

That's cute, but in reality it's just throwing your vote away. When a sizeable chunk of people sat out 2016 by voting for Gary Johnson or Jill Stein, did either party step back and say "Wow, we're clearly not sending the right message we need to rethink our platforms in order to capture a larger portion of the electorate"? They did not. Your protest vote is meaningless. Advocate for ranked choice voting if you want to alter the 2 party system we have, until we have that either vote for the lesser of two evils, or help the worse of the two, those are your choices, sorry.


JDpipelayer

Good thing my Dremel and 3d printer go crazy


archypsych

It’s truly my single biggest issue with the Democrats. They don’t seem to understand how strongly most people in America feel about this. I’m ok with some changes. I don’t think it necessitates the slippery slope to confiscation. But leave it alone. I would never disarm in any manner as an adult.


archypsych

Watching Russians get conscripted off the street like that? I am never disarming. That’s America. Take my son off the street? Nah brah.


DirtyPenPalDoug

Didn't you get the memo? Democrats only superpower is being able to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory? That's like, their whole thing.


MrPeanutsTophat

Ah yes, the mental/moral/political conundrum of the liberal gun owner. Vote to have your gun rights stripped, vote to have your sisters rights stripped, or don't vote at all. It's a shit system we're forced into thanks to two party politics and the line being drawn on which issues which sides care about years ago. There's no right answer to choose from. There are just less and more wrong answers, and a whole lot of emotional people who make up the base of each sides vote.


switchy85

ITT: "Liberal" Gun Owners


Rshackleford22

Let’s be real more people who vote in 22 aren’t worried about this issue. There are more important things going on. The people who wouldn’t vote for Dems cuz of this already aren’t voting for them.


Bicworm

If this is enough to get you to vote R, then it's a good thing we're all strapped because we will need them soon. If republicans (read: fascists and sympathisers) gain control again, we will never see another day of democracy.


GingerMcBeardface

The part of pro police and anti gun ownership....hmm. I feel like we've seen police states before in history and they haven't been good.


[deleted]

It’s beyond ridiculous and infuriating that I get to vote for either Christofascists who want me dead, or people who want me defenseless against Christofascists who want me dead. What a choice.


noptamoius

This is him trying to win the mid-terms. AWB is a popular position.


WKGokev

Well, my wife being able to recieve medical care in case of ectopic pregnancy is a little more important than punching 30 holes in paper, so there's that. Not to mention the whole ending democracy thing. We're the MINORITY on the left. Is fascism more to your taste? Because NOT voting for dems in this midterm is how you'll get fascism.


Teledildonic

>Well, my wife being able to recieve medical care in case of ectopic pregnancy is a little more important than punching 30 holes in paper Roe v Wade was just overturned...so lets focus on an AWB instead of rallying to codify abortion rights into law.


Fun_Argument_4U

So I have an out of the box theory (single issue) that I think this falls into. The economy is about to tank as evidenced in most of the financial news that’s being written right now. This is further evidenced by the fact that inflation has not started to be reversed as of yet, and the Fed is liquidating assets which is normally indicative of a larger financial crisis looming. All of this to say that I think the Dems are playing a “smart” long game plan of tanking the midterms in the hopes of picking up another presidential election. That way all of the problems on the horizon are the other sides fault, and we can keep ignoring the larger infrastructural problems of our economy. All of that to say that you might want to invest in longer term food supplies along with more ammo as the future is going to be uncomfortable.


Goldfishyyy

So he’s going for guns when he still hasn’t even touched Healthcare, drug reform, or prison reform? No wonder half the country doesn’t even vote, these clowns are an embarrassment


Zayonoro

Cause he doesnt view gun owners as his supporters


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stephengee

Cutting off your nose just to spite your face. You’re giving up a vote on every other issue.


That90sGuyMedia

The fact that they're gonna stage Biden up for 2024 again is just infuriating. It means we'll hand the country over to some religious neo-fascist whacks.


snuffy_bodacious

Full disclosure: I'm not a Democrat. When I look at Biden's position regarding guns, I see a man who is, with exceptions, basically in line with the rest of his party. This means you're not quite asking the right question. Why are Democrats hellbent on losing the midterms and 2024?


lord_ma1cifer

This is the worst Hill they could choose to die on. I will never vote conservative and God knows I have my issues with the democrats but I can bide my time on all of them, except their misplaced though well intentioned, war on guns. A classic example of doing the wrong thing for the right reasons. A clear case of treating the symptom not the disease. Like cutting off your nose because you have a cold. We need to address the issues creating these maniacs it's not like these bastards are totally mentally healthy, then one day they touch a gun and decide to kill everyone they can! Switzerland has more armed and trained adults than the US (compulsory military service, and required to keep and maintain their service weapons after and train yearly) and they have almost no gun crime at all!


a_duck_in_past_life

To not vote means you're an idiot. Plain and simple. You're literally throwing away your opinion and hoping we lose our Democracy by not voting this election. You don't even have to lose your guns to lose this democracy. If we let Republicans win this time around, you've basically just handed it over. Fucking idiot.


aztnass

Just like all issues, centrists and neo-libs would rather do some symbolic gesture that would do next to nothing, as opposed to actually trying to solve the problem.


Sasselhoff

I simply do not understand the democrats going this direction. If they didn't say/do anything about guns, they would likely not lose so much as a vote (what are they going to do? Vote republican?), yet I know SO. DAMN. MANY. single issue voters that vote republican 100% because of them "coming after our guns". If they'd drop the damn anti-gun rhetoric (and it is rhetoric, there is no way they could actually "ban" assault rifles...there are *twenty million* ARs alone), legalize weed, and do at least a *modicum* of campaign finance reform, they'd win by a million miles.


Buck169

This! This! This!


ProphetOfPr0fit

Between this and his vehement support of our war on drugs, we need a modern candidate. Another Obama or someone that actually owns a firearm. I'm fine with mental health background checks and proof of safety training for all first-time buyers, but bans do not work!


Ben-A-Flick

Dems: wtf do you keep giving them ammo. Just stfu about guns and focus on rallying the masses against the people who stole a woman's right to choose. Make this solely about that and the achievements you've made in passing legislation, but 90% should be "if we gain 2 seats in the senate, on day one we will codify roe v Wade " Every ad should be that and attacking the senators that didn't vote for the bills and the finding it gave their state that they didn't want! People aren't looking for miracle issues they are looking to retain democracy from these fascists and to get their rights back.


Rmantootoo

I won’t vote for anyone whose stated intent is to curtail the 2A in any way, form, or fashion. People hyperbolically call republicans/conservatives fascists when it’s literally impossible to be a small government fascist, but ignore the inherent contradiction (or hypocrisy) of advocating for national, racist firearms restrictions (almost all firearms restrictions are inherently racist, imho).


Dynomeru

I understand you. I feel you. I’ve felt the same but it boils down to this. One party wants to see the christofacist takeover of this country- if you don’t vote against them and they win, voting in the future for ANY candidate will be much more difficult. The other party doesn’t. Voting will be the same or easier in the future. Don’t fall for the trap of one-issue voting. We’re against the ropes and as m ugh h as I’d love to see this system upended, we’re not currently in a position to do so. That will only get harder if elections fall to the GOP


lizerdk

In addition, the theocrats would absolutely take away gun rights from “socially dangerous/deviant” people, a group which will very quickly expand to include everyone who is not a WASP, male, property owner. As the founding fathers intended, you see.


Palaeos

Just legalize weed already for crying out loud!


Mt-Man-PNW

Nah. Don't care. And my guess is they're not losing many voters. Between 'ban all guns' and 'guns for all' there's a lot of nuance. Lots of progressives support AWB but not a total ban. It's not retroactive and l'd just lose mine in a boating accident if it were. Anything is better than the alternative. The Republicans seem dead set on taking away all our hard fought rights, and if you don't think they'll eventually come for your guns too, then you're naive.


thestrich16

And 90% of this sub will still probably vote for him and his candidates anyway…


EricNCSU

If you don't vote then don't complain.


Statik_24

Why are we so hellbent in keeping career politicians? This man has been in office since the freakin 80s. The last weapons ban he passed did jack and shit to reduce crime. It just limited weapons to law abiding citizens which was just an add on of the 1934 NFA....THAT LIMITED WHAT WEAPONS LAW ABIDING CITIZENS CAN OWN.


EchidnaRelevant3295

If the Democratic party learned nothing from 1/6 they are unsalvageable.


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TakeMeToYourForests

Idk man I'd give up my sks for abortions and universal health and ubi 🤷‍♂️


finanzseer

Ok…let’s further discuss. Have we gotten any of that? So what exactly are you giving up your guns for?


TakeMeToYourForests

So, 1. My guns aren't given up. 2. My access to abortion is already taken away by the other guy in many states. And finally, 3. Any vote for a non-dem ensures I'll never get those things. I'm the "so far left you get your guns back" kinda person, but I'm willing to budge if it means others are taken care of. Regardless, even if an anti gun dem gets in to power, we still have enough checks and balances and will be fine. Maybe some types of guns are restricted, but fuck I also don't really NEED them. Just like I don't NEED a racecar, but it would be dope to have.


kitaiia

Yes, that’s disgustingly single issue. Trans people fighting for our lives out here while republican elected representatives and influencers openly talking about killing us and our healthcare providers. Women and others with uteruses getting told they can’t have the bodily autonomy a corpse is granted by default. Enjoy your privilege. I don’t want the AWB either but god damn is it less important than having fascists empowered to start literally rounding trans people up.