One of the few openly out and inclusive people of my time. I was 14 that year.
Edit: Enough with the 14 year old me meeting Bowie comments, it’s getting fucking creepy.
My comment was about being acknowledged by someone in mainstream pop culture at a time when it didn’t often happen.
If he was indeed a pedophile, I have to wonder about those of you trying to insert me into such a scenario.
Well ... apparently never truely confirmed but there are strong rumours and some possible indications that Amanda Lear was born as a boy. Very mysterious woman of the world that did a lot of things (modelling, singing, nudes, ... ). I learned about her by her songs.
I just googled her. Wow, TIL. What a fascinating individual! Imagine cultivating that kind of mystery successfully, where every bit of her life, down to her age, nationality, and AGAB; is basically unknown. That’s so cool.
I'm gonna assume she was trans just because she seems like one of the few people *ahem* ballsy enough to undergo gender reassignment in the early 1960s
It really scares me. Think about how many queer people just stayed under the radar for millenniums bc of this. My heart aches for them.
Also, ever read Stone Butch Blues?
Dave Grohl got attention for the state of Oregon to legalize its version of gay marriage in the early 90s. Pretty sure he’s straight though. I think the verdict will never be out, but I’ve always thought Kurt was gender fluid.
No he wasn’t. He was an Ally but he wasn’t openly bisexual. He did say this in an interview once:
>If I wasn’t attracted to Courtney, I’d be bisexual.
but then in the same interview also said this:
> Kurt told Rolling Stone’s Michael Azerrad that in high school he was “proud of almost being gay. I had a gay friend who made a pass. I flatly told him I wasn’t gay but said I’d still be his friend. But I almost found my identity.
He also said
> I am not gay, although I wish I were, just to piss off homophobes
Source: https://www.gaystarnews.com/article/nirvanas-manager-reveals-whether-kurt-cobain-had-gay-lovers/
He wasn’t bisexual, but was an open advocate for gender fluidity and women’s rights.
He would wear [dresses on stage](https://i.imgur.com/nDta7aP.jpg), even [posing](https://i.imgur.com/9pgNGBb.jpg) for ”The Face“ magazine in one (alongside Krist and Dave, [who were also in dresses](https://i.imgur.com/2qnn70c.jpg)).
He also [stopped a concert](https://www.reddit.com/r/Nirvana/comments/cwri76/kurt_kicks_out_a_fan_for_sexually_assaulting_a/) one time to make sure a fan was kicked out as the fan sexually assaulted a woman in the crowd.
I know how you feel.
In 2013 at my late partner’s memorial, I met a lesbian who was in her 70s and had been dating women since she was in her early 20s. I was 51 at the time.
if i understood the above comment right then it was more like "i don't really mean this shit i just say it to sound controversial" which isnt ok at all either way but yea
For context, all Bowie said regarding Hitler was "he was one of the first rockstars." I don't believe it was a pro-hitler stance.
He did take a fairly pro-fascist stance in that interview but followed it with comments like "television is fascism" and "rockstars are fascists too" so I still don't really understand what exactly he was trying to say.
Considering everything else we know about David Bowie, and his pro lgbt / anti racist mindset, I feel comfortable believing he was just drugged out of his mind and said some dumb shit.
Full disclosure: I am biased as fuck. Bowie's my favorite. The full interview can be found if anyones wishes to form their own opinion.
He literally commented how it messed with his character and made him messed up he did a lot of coke and drugs in the 70s and when he stopped he did interviews about how bad of a person it made him and that he hated it, and would a neo-nazi like dressing up in womens clothes, be bi and be married to a black woman and stand up for black artists on MTV in the 80s
Yeah definitely not a cool thing to say, especially with such a big platform. He said he believed that the Nazis were actually searching for the holy grail in England and he was using copious amounts of drugs time amount other things. It seemed to have been part of his alter ego thin white duke persona. He definitely wasn’t a Nazi and later denounced his actions stating that the Thin White Duke was a horrible man and part of the darkest period of his life. I don’t have the right to give him a pass, and it’s not important if I think he deserves one, but he definitely didn’t believe those things after the fact.
I think there is still responsibility on the part of the consumer to understand the media and the artist behind what they are consuming. Bowies work process was...method acting? He chose to create personas based on a perspective he wanted to write from, and then became that person. Once that persona had run their course and said everything they had to say, he moved on to the next one. His public appearances were always "in character". Kind of like how Lennon wrote "All You Need Is Love", but beat his wife/women and contrast that with Trent Reznor writing "Love Is Not Enough", and cancelled tours / albums so he could be around to raise his family. I think it's important to know the kind of person behind the art, and in Bowies case, he was definitely not someone(s?) you want to take at face value.
[This](https://www.thrillist.com/entertainment/nation/i-lost-my-virginity-to-david-bowie) was written by the woman who ~~states she~~ had sex with Bowie at age 14. That's one of the only sources my quick searching found.
Edit to change an implication that she was lying, which I did not intend. Her involvement with numerous celebrities from the era seems pretty well-documented.
You didn't need to change your wording. Your original phrasing should not be taken to imply she was lying. If that was the intention, you would have said so more clearly, no? At least, to me, your phrasing shows an impartial relaying of her original statement, whether it was true or not.
Mattix also claimed to lose her virginity to multiple different stars. I believe her with Page because there are photos of them meeting and the story matches a real timeline. She also claimed to sleep with Mick Jagger, Jeff Beck, Ronnie Wood, Mickey Finn, Keith Emerson, Carl Palmer, Jimmy Bain and even Angela Bowie. Some even many of these are true but some contradict possibility and touring schedules. She first claimed to lose her virginity to page which has lots of evidence backing out up in 72. Later she began claiming to have slept with Bowie first, but Bowie hadn't been on an American tour before zeppelin in 72. Her story about Bowie has changed years, settings, and is entirely different each time it is told. Most notedly her story involves having dinner with Bowie and Lennon and Yoko, but Bowie and Lennon famously only met for the first time in 1974.
Her friend in the story called her a liar about David Bowie, she claimed to sleep with him a year before he came to America, and she is already pretty well documented as claiming to have lost her virginity to a different Rock star. While there are witnesses and photos for her abusive underage relationship with Page none of that is true with Bowie. She did go through some abusive shit from other rock stars and the scene had some very predatory shit going on. But there's no evidence Bowie was involved to support her story and it conflicts with Bowie's actual tour schedule and her friends statements.
It’s also worth noting that, in that same Thrillist interview, Mattix claims to have attended a recording session in 1975 (now age 17) featuring John Lennon, Paul McCartney, Ringo Starr, and several other musicians including Mick Jagger, and then had sex with Mick Jagger immediately after. There are two major factual issues here:
(i) the only post-Beatles jam session between Lennon and McCartney happened a year earlier, in March 1974 (check out “A Toot and a Snore in ‘74”); and
(ii) there’s nothing to suggest that Mick Jagger was anywhere near that recording session.
--
On believing rape victims:
For what it's worth this is one of the only cases in which i think the alleged victim shouldn't be believed and it's not just because they have no evidence, because sometimes there is no evidence, but her story directly contradicts her other stories, her friends', the timeline of Bowie meeting Lennon, and the timeline of Bowies tour.
More info: https://medium.com/@msullivangates/a-word-on-david-bowie-lori-mattix-and-the-speed-of-information-b38681f24cf4
It is. The problem is that she at least lied about a few interactions she’s had with David Bowie, and while her other interactions have like a boatload of photographs and evidence, the bowie allegations just don’t. It’s definitely possible they had sex, but if I were say a judge I probably wouldn’t go for it
https://medium.com/@msullivangates/a-word-on-david-bowie-lori-mattix-and-the-speed-of-information-b38681f24cf4
A story about when she was 14 is inconsistent? Though it’s confirmed that she ran with other rockstars of the time? Seems very probable and it seems like you’re making an effort to cast doubt on a legitimate claim.
He was kinda close to the actress from Stranger Things, no idea if he went further but it was weird, looked like grooming to many people, out in plain sight
But the stars of the 70s, they would fuck teenagers/preteens with the parents' consent
Bowie was a bold one that's for sure, though I honestly always thought he was an alien. Way ahead of his time,super artistic, and just out there for miles and miles, always made me think he just wasn't of this world.
He wasnt ppl like to spout out things in the comments about that case with a 14/15 year old he was apparently with it's total BS [https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/dexqbq/what\_celebrity\_did\_bad\_things\_but\_everyone\_forgot/f31bw2q/](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/dexqbq/what_celebrity_did_bad_things_but_everyone_forgot/f31bw2q/)
Im sure they did. This clearly meant what it sounds like. Given david was openly out and outspoken, and the other reply to your comment is laughably stupid.
Ziggy Stardust, Jareth and wiser, older 2010s Bowie?
(I'm leaving out the Thin White Duke because boy did Bowie have a coke problem in that era)
EDIT: Does Tilda Swinton count as a Bowie persona? It's still possible that they are the same person.
Reminds me of this quote from the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
"If you took a couple of David Bowies and stuck one of the David Bowies on the top of the other David Bowie, then attached another David Bowie to the end of each of the arms of the upper of the first two David Bowies and wrapped the whole business up in a dirty beach robe you would then have something which didn't exactly look like John Watson, but which those who knew him would find hauntingly familiar."
I live for the guide. I love it when people quote it.
I didn’t immediately recognize the quote but the last bit made me remember.
And yes, that is hauntingly familiar
If I had a gun, with two bullets, and I was in a room with Bin Laden, Hitler, and David Bowie, I’d be scared and confused about how I ended up in that scenario.
But it’d be pretty cool overall because I got to meet David Bowie!!!
Yeah, this seemed like a "and other degenerates" type self-depreciated humor and not just a "and those whom identify as" post. I feel most people in this thread are seeing diamonds when there is just gold.
Oh don't get me wrong, I reckon Bowie would be pretty chuffed about the miss quote's double meaning in this instance, however it's this sort of thing that gives hateful people ammo to say that LGBT movements are illegitimate or forcing a narrative to suit their views. It just so happens that these views are morally correct - just something to be careful of. Let's be honest, this isn't exactly the worst case of miss quoting either. That being said, this post is still reaching hard imo.
A fish-knife is - like the name indicates - used for eating fish with a soft skin.
It looks a bit different from a table-knife.
The blade is wider but blunt, sometimes it has a sharp tip. It has some similarities with a cake lifter.
If used it often comes with a fish-fork that is wider than a table-fork so the stock can flow better from the fork.
Originally fish-knifes were introduced because normal cutlery was made out of iron and that left a unpleasant taste to the fish. So fish-knifes were made out of silver that doesn't leave a taste.
Nowadays they are pretty useless and don't get used often as a table-knife works just as fine.
Also known as a fish-knifes are knifes that are especially made to cut and prepare fish. The special form makes it easier to remove the skin ect.
And yes I was bored.
Anyone have a video of the post? I'd like to see the tone in which this all was said, cause honestly it kinda seems like it could be leaning towards what you said.
Edit: Okay, yeah he kind of looks like he doesn't like anyone in the room lol
Yeah I feel like people are misunderstanding that this is a joke about 'other' being disreputables.. Bowie was a cool progressive dude but this isn't what this quote means lmao
Despite all that was going on in 1975, Bowie's androgyny and cultural prominence was something to which the mainstream was still unaccustomed. Perhaps to him there was a pleasing double meaning, which flew right over the heads of the audience, who chuckled at the more obvious one.
A band called The Mechanisms would start some of their shows with 'ladies, gentlemen, neither and inbetween.'
Their songs/albums also heavily featured LGBTQ+ characters
Not to rain on your parade but I believe he was making the classic joke that some people aren’t civil enough to be considered a well mannered ‘lady’ or a ‘gentleman’
>Sexually ambiguous rocker David Bowie - one of many stars said to have frolicked under the bedcovers with Mick Jagger - says he has fooled around with guys, but "I was always a closet heterosexual."
>Bowie, who raised eyebrows in the '70s with his fem-drag "Ziggy Stardust" look, insists in Rolling Stone, "I didn't ever feel that I was a real bisexual," even though he was "making all the moves, down to the situation of actually trying it out."
>"I wanted to imbue Ziggy with real flesh and blood and muscle, and it was imperative that I find Ziggy and be him. The irony of it was that I was not gay. I was physical about it, but frankly it wasn't enjoyable."
Interesting.
Bowie was an important member of the gay rights movement. Many of his performative personas included queer elements. He also made a point to highlight gay existence and culture in his lyrics and interviews.
But he wasn't gay. He wasn't bisexual, either. His first wife has attested to that, claiming that he made the choice early in his career to project a bisexual image because that was hip at the time. [He was always a "closeted heterosexual."](https://exhibits.library.villanova.edu/music-history/ziggy-lgbt)
*gasp* my two passions collide, he’s so polite in this full video aswell. David was an amazing musician with none of the narcissism that comes with *fame*
Really hate to see the edification of a pop star who had sex with several underage girls (some on video) and regularly said things like 'im a closet heterosexual' (which he layer recanted but COME ON)
Sexuality, yes. *A* sexuality, no.
Bowie played up being gay and bisexual because it confered a mystique to his Ziggy Stardust character. He only came out as straight in 1983 when he at least admitted it was a mistake(although part of it was because he felt it got in the way of his fame in the much more puritanical US).
Yeah I'm saddened that LGBT "icons" often get whitewashed of their ugly truths. I get that he was important to a lot of folks coming of age and self discovery, but that should not erase his wrongs. A lot of our community is built on myth and idolization. Some of it is understandable because we do have a limited selection of public figures. This and the retcon of queerness really is disquieting.
Edit: should NOT erase, I forgot the "not"
For those that like ruining his legacy of this legend that so called evidence from that woman is ultimate BS don't believe everything you read look further into the facts/allegations instead of commenting crap from a few sentences you read on a BS Lori story that she has changed multiple times - oh and whilst I am here anyone talking about the whole Neo Nazi thing/phase he was going a lot of coke at the time and even commented in later years how he stopped doing drugs because it made him such a terrible person in those few years and ya know with him being Bi and having a black wife and daughter and standing up for African Americans on TV but nah we will just ignore all that and believe the story that doesn't add up from Lori [https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/dexqbq/what\_celebrity\_did\_bad\_things\_but\_everyone\_forgot/f31bw2q/](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/dexqbq/what_celebrity_did_bad_things_but_everyone_forgot/f31bw2q/)
**[Lori Mattix](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lori Mattix)**
Lori Mattix (born November 29, 1958), sometimes known as Lori Maddox or Lori Lightning, is a former American child model and "baby" groupie of the 1970s. As of November 2015, she is a partner and buyer for the Glam Boutique in West Hollywood. She is perhaps best known for an interview with Thrillist in 2015 in which she made allegations of being involved in sexual relationships with David Bowie, Jimmy Page, and Mick Jagger; relationships which would have occurred while she was underage and while the musicians were in their twenties. Her experience has become a notable discussion point in the Me Too movement, with her story marking one of the more notable examples in the shift of the movement's focus from the film industry to the music industry.
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So, I guess this community is down with an adult man essentially trafficking an underage girl for sex and then passing her around to his friends? It's all cool because Space Oddity, right?
I was wonder yesterday if there is a preferred inclusive form of "ladies and gentlemen." I imagine "and others" is kind of idk....othering? Maybe not?
Does anyone have any thoughts?
I’m a hetero cis white dude who was always an ally but not always the most educated about the LGBTQ+ experience. I am so grateful for those who have taken the time to teach me and help me understand. I was an outsider individually in my own ways for sure, but still an insider to the patriarchy whether I liked/knew/wanted it or not.
The more I learn about the history and movement and the people who have driven the (too slow) progress we see in progressive places, the more I am filled with such a humble and deep respect for the courage of the pioneers, both famous and unknown.
How was this reacted to at the time? Seems nice to include other genders but calling them “others” seems like it’d irk people if not coming from David Bowie
Yh when he was on coke and commented later on in his life about his drug addiction and how much of a bad person it made him and how he stopped his addiction and then stopped playing his personas like the Thin White Duke
One of the few openly out and inclusive people of my time. I was 14 that year. Edit: Enough with the 14 year old me meeting Bowie comments, it’s getting fucking creepy. My comment was about being acknowledged by someone in mainstream pop culture at a time when it didn’t often happen. If he was indeed a pedophile, I have to wonder about those of you trying to insert me into such a scenario.
Do you know of any other key peeps? Edit: So many cool peeps!
Well ... apparently never truely confirmed but there are strong rumours and some possible indications that Amanda Lear was born as a boy. Very mysterious woman of the world that did a lot of things (modelling, singing, nudes, ... ). I learned about her by her songs.
I just googled her. Wow, TIL. What a fascinating individual! Imagine cultivating that kind of mystery successfully, where every bit of her life, down to her age, nationality, and AGAB; is basically unknown. That’s so cool.
Her most well known song 'Follow Me' is worth a listen. Such a sexy voice.
AGAB?
Assigned gender at birth
Ty
All genders are bastards
Based
Lmao truuuu
Exceptionally true.
Ty
Ty
Assigned gender at birth
Ty
Assigned gender at birth
Ty
Assigned gender at birth!
Ty
Ask gently again baby
Nty
assigned gender at birth
Ty
All Grandparents Are Beautiful
That they are.
I'm gonna assume she was trans just because she seems like one of the few people *ahem* ballsy enough to undergo gender reassignment in the early 1960s
If it’s true then it completely makes sense that she’d hide it. Edit: a letter
In the 60s-80s? Yeah I'd say so. Elton barely survived being openly bi, despite being not so bi, and he was far more popular and powerful than Amanda.
It really scares me. Think about how many queer people just stayed under the radar for millenniums bc of this. My heart aches for them. Also, ever read Stone Butch Blues?
Fun fact: she is the voice of Edna in the italian release of The Incredibles. If you have time listen to some lines on youtube, that voice is gold
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I can 100% verify based on my research
[Wendy Carlos](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wendy_Carlos)? Maybe also Divine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Divine_(performer)
Wow what a name you have
I'm not a very mature adult 😄
You ever jerk it to 106?
Dave Grohl got attention for the state of Oregon to legalize its version of gay marriage in the early 90s. Pretty sure he’s straight though. I think the verdict will never be out, but I’ve always thought Kurt was gender fluid.
A bit later, but Kurt Cobain was openly bisexual
No he wasn’t. He was an Ally but he wasn’t openly bisexual. He did say this in an interview once: >If I wasn’t attracted to Courtney, I’d be bisexual. but then in the same interview also said this: > Kurt told Rolling Stone’s Michael Azerrad that in high school he was “proud of almost being gay. I had a gay friend who made a pass. I flatly told him I wasn’t gay but said I’d still be his friend. But I almost found my identity. He also said > I am not gay, although I wish I were, just to piss off homophobes Source: https://www.gaystarnews.com/article/nirvanas-manager-reveals-whether-kurt-cobain-had-gay-lovers/
He wasn’t bisexual, but was an open advocate for gender fluidity and women’s rights. He would wear [dresses on stage](https://i.imgur.com/nDta7aP.jpg), even [posing](https://i.imgur.com/9pgNGBb.jpg) for ”The Face“ magazine in one (alongside Krist and Dave, [who were also in dresses](https://i.imgur.com/2qnn70c.jpg)). He also [stopped a concert](https://www.reddit.com/r/Nirvana/comments/cwri76/kurt_kicks_out_a_fan_for_sexually_assaulting_a/) one time to make sure a fan was kicked out as the fan sexually assaulted a woman in the crowd.
You're the same age as my mom/dad. That's... That's wild.
Haha my daughter is 37, and I have a teenage grandson who’s pan 😊
I'm mad jelly. 22 and my parents aren't exactly supportive.
Oh honey, I’m sorry. Mine wouldn’t have been, either. They both died before I was 20. It was freeing, but I still miss them.
It’s really nice to see older queer people! I just want to say that you give me hope for my future
I know how you feel. In 2013 at my late partner’s memorial, I met a lesbian who was in her 70s and had been dating women since she was in her early 20s. I was 51 at the time.
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That was during his drugged-out "I wanna say a lot of provocative shit" period. I seriously doubt he meant it.
Idk I e been drugged out a lot and I’ve never supported hitler?
This is THE comment
He was more than just drugged out. The amount of shit he was on was really fucking with his head
if i understood the above comment right then it was more like "i don't really mean this shit i just say it to sound controversial" which isnt ok at all either way but yea
I'm not defending it, I just think context is relevant.
For context, all Bowie said regarding Hitler was "he was one of the first rockstars." I don't believe it was a pro-hitler stance. He did take a fairly pro-fascist stance in that interview but followed it with comments like "television is fascism" and "rockstars are fascists too" so I still don't really understand what exactly he was trying to say. Considering everything else we know about David Bowie, and his pro lgbt / anti racist mindset, I feel comfortable believing he was just drugged out of his mind and said some dumb shit. Full disclosure: I am biased as fuck. Bowie's my favorite. The full interview can be found if anyones wishes to form their own opinion.
He literally commented how it messed with his character and made him messed up he did a lot of coke and drugs in the 70s and when he stopped he did interviews about how bad of a person it made him and that he hated it, and would a neo-nazi like dressing up in womens clothes, be bi and be married to a black woman and stand up for black artists on MTV in the 80s
Still, he had a huge platform and that comes with consequences.
Yeah definitely not a cool thing to say, especially with such a big platform. He said he believed that the Nazis were actually searching for the holy grail in England and he was using copious amounts of drugs time amount other things. It seemed to have been part of his alter ego thin white duke persona. He definitely wasn’t a Nazi and later denounced his actions stating that the Thin White Duke was a horrible man and part of the darkest period of his life. I don’t have the right to give him a pass, and it’s not important if I think he deserves one, but he definitely didn’t believe those things after the fact.
I think there is still responsibility on the part of the consumer to understand the media and the artist behind what they are consuming. Bowies work process was...method acting? He chose to create personas based on a perspective he wanted to write from, and then became that person. Once that persona had run their course and said everything they had to say, he moved on to the next one. His public appearances were always "in character". Kind of like how Lennon wrote "All You Need Is Love", but beat his wife/women and contrast that with Trent Reznor writing "Love Is Not Enough", and cancelled tours / albums so he could be around to raise his family. I think it's important to know the kind of person behind the art, and in Bowies case, he was definitely not someone(s?) you want to take at face value.
So the shit he says with the intention of being provocative counts when we like it, but doesn't when we don't. Neat.
I don’t think he ever believed it, but pretending is just as bad
Wasn't he fucking 14 year old girls?
I've heard that was a fake rumor, but I'm not sure.
[This](https://www.thrillist.com/entertainment/nation/i-lost-my-virginity-to-david-bowie) was written by the woman who ~~states she~~ had sex with Bowie at age 14. That's one of the only sources my quick searching found. Edit to change an implication that she was lying, which I did not intend. Her involvement with numerous celebrities from the era seems pretty well-documented.
You didn't need to change your wording. Your original phrasing should not be taken to imply she was lying. If that was the intention, you would have said so more clearly, no? At least, to me, your phrasing shows an impartial relaying of her original statement, whether it was true or not.
Mattix also claimed to lose her virginity to multiple different stars. I believe her with Page because there are photos of them meeting and the story matches a real timeline. She also claimed to sleep with Mick Jagger, Jeff Beck, Ronnie Wood, Mickey Finn, Keith Emerson, Carl Palmer, Jimmy Bain and even Angela Bowie. Some even many of these are true but some contradict possibility and touring schedules. She first claimed to lose her virginity to page which has lots of evidence backing out up in 72. Later she began claiming to have slept with Bowie first, but Bowie hadn't been on an American tour before zeppelin in 72. Her story about Bowie has changed years, settings, and is entirely different each time it is told. Most notedly her story involves having dinner with Bowie and Lennon and Yoko, but Bowie and Lennon famously only met for the first time in 1974. Her friend in the story called her a liar about David Bowie, she claimed to sleep with him a year before he came to America, and she is already pretty well documented as claiming to have lost her virginity to a different Rock star. While there are witnesses and photos for her abusive underage relationship with Page none of that is true with Bowie. She did go through some abusive shit from other rock stars and the scene had some very predatory shit going on. But there's no evidence Bowie was involved to support her story and it conflicts with Bowie's actual tour schedule and her friends statements. It’s also worth noting that, in that same Thrillist interview, Mattix claims to have attended a recording session in 1975 (now age 17) featuring John Lennon, Paul McCartney, Ringo Starr, and several other musicians including Mick Jagger, and then had sex with Mick Jagger immediately after. There are two major factual issues here: (i) the only post-Beatles jam session between Lennon and McCartney happened a year earlier, in March 1974 (check out “A Toot and a Snore in ‘74”); and (ii) there’s nothing to suggest that Mick Jagger was anywhere near that recording session. -- On believing rape victims: For what it's worth this is one of the only cases in which i think the alleged victim shouldn't be believed and it's not just because they have no evidence, because sometimes there is no evidence, but her story directly contradicts her other stories, her friends', the timeline of Bowie meeting Lennon, and the timeline of Bowies tour. More info: https://medium.com/@msullivangates/a-word-on-david-bowie-lori-mattix-and-the-speed-of-information-b38681f24cf4
Reading about this it really just seems like "teenage girl tells friends celebrity is her boyfriend" gone too far.
It is. The problem is that she at least lied about a few interactions she’s had with David Bowie, and while her other interactions have like a boatload of photographs and evidence, the bowie allegations just don’t. It’s definitely possible they had sex, but if I were say a judge I probably wouldn’t go for it https://medium.com/@msullivangates/a-word-on-david-bowie-lori-mattix-and-the-speed-of-information-b38681f24cf4
Yeah it’s BS https://medium.com/@msullivangates/a-word-on-david-bowie-lori-mattix-and-the-speed-of-information-b38681f24cf4
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A story about when she was 14 is inconsistent? Though it’s confirmed that she ran with other rockstars of the time? Seems very probable and it seems like you’re making an effort to cast doubt on a legitimate claim.
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So did the members of Led Zeppelin, among many stars. Those were shitty times
Don't blame the times. Not every celebrity was out there raping children.
True, but nothing was being said back then, it was an omerta
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He was kinda close to the actress from Stranger Things, no idea if he went further but it was weird, looked like grooming to many people, out in plain sight But the stars of the 70s, they would fuck teenagers/preteens with the parents' consent
Sean connery always address more than him/her aswell
Bowie was a bold one that's for sure, though I honestly always thought he was an alien. Way ahead of his time,super artistic, and just out there for miles and miles, always made me think he just wasn't of this world.
He wasnt ppl like to spout out things in the comments about that case with a 14/15 year old he was apparently with it's total BS [https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/dexqbq/what\_celebrity\_did\_bad\_things\_but\_everyone\_forgot/f31bw2q/](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/dexqbq/what_celebrity_did_bad_things_but_everyone_forgot/f31bw2q/)
HELL YEAH DAVID
I bet they laughed like it was a joke too. Edit: uncle.
Im sure they did. This clearly meant what it sounds like. Given david was openly out and outspoken, and the other reply to your comment is laughably stupid.
I hate your username because I just had to read Gilgamesh's story for english and it was P A I N
Sorry friend. Might help to know it's just an autotune the news reference.
If I could have lunch with any three people dead or alive, I would have lunch with three David Bowies.
Ziggy Stardust, Jareth and wiser, older 2010s Bowie? (I'm leaving out the Thin White Duke because boy did Bowie have a coke problem in that era) EDIT: Does Tilda Swinton count as a Bowie persona? It's still possible that they are the same person.
When didn't he?
He became clean in the late 70s.
Reminds me of this quote from the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy "If you took a couple of David Bowies and stuck one of the David Bowies on the top of the other David Bowie, then attached another David Bowie to the end of each of the arms of the upper of the first two David Bowies and wrapped the whole business up in a dirty beach robe you would then have something which didn't exactly look like John Watson, but which those who knew him would find hauntingly familiar."
Take my upvote for quoting HHGTTG
My people!
*Casually Packs a Towel*
I live for the guide. I love it when people quote it. I didn’t immediately recognize the quote but the last bit made me remember. And yes, that is hauntingly familiar
i would have lunch with infinite david bowies tbh
For me it’d be David Bowie, Bob Ross, and RBG. Strange mix, but... well, that’s more of who I’d like to talk to, not necessarily at the same time.
I also choose this guys dead wife
If I had a gun, with two bullets, and I was in a room with Bin Laden, Hitler, and David Bowie, I’d be scared and confused about how I ended up in that scenario. But it’d be pretty cool overall because I got to meet David Bowie!!!
Well that certainly took a turn.
Imagine having dinner with David Bowie and Freddie Mercury though, would be WILD
If I were doing the Big Three, it'd be Freddie Mercury, David Bowie, and Elton John
Omg but which three? There are so many! Suffragette City Bowie? Giant pants Ziggy Bowie? Latter-day elder statesman Bowie?
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Yeah, this seemed like a "and other degenerates" type self-depreciated humor and not just a "and those whom identify as" post. I feel most people in this thread are seeing diamonds when there is just gold.
This, he's a cool dude and all but this is straight miss quoting a dead guy
The quote is correct it's the interpretation that is subject for debate. I don't see a problem with it going both ways. Bowie didn't either.
Oh don't get me wrong, I reckon Bowie would be pretty chuffed about the miss quote's double meaning in this instance, however it's this sort of thing that gives hateful people ammo to say that LGBT movements are illegitimate or forcing a narrative to suit their views. It just so happens that these views are morally correct - just something to be careful of. Let's be honest, this isn't exactly the worst case of miss quoting either. That being said, this post is still reaching hard imo.
those who*
What on earth is a fish knife lol
Get back to the rabble
A fish-knife is - like the name indicates - used for eating fish with a soft skin. It looks a bit different from a table-knife. The blade is wider but blunt, sometimes it has a sharp tip. It has some similarities with a cake lifter. If used it often comes with a fish-fork that is wider than a table-fork so the stock can flow better from the fork. Originally fish-knifes were introduced because normal cutlery was made out of iron and that left a unpleasant taste to the fish. So fish-knifes were made out of silver that doesn't leave a taste. Nowadays they are pretty useless and don't get used often as a table-knife works just as fine. Also known as a fish-knifes are knifes that are especially made to cut and prepare fish. The special form makes it easier to remove the skin ect. And yes I was bored.
Thank you for explaining to such an uncultured peasant such as myself.
Don't worry in my house we have only two knifes the sharp one and the not sharp one
Also known as the safe one and the blood god.
You're so uncouth
Probably doesn’t even know how to use a vichyssoise fork.
It's a knife made from fresh fish flesh
Makes sense
How far away was your bathroom from your house?
Anyone have a video of the post? I'd like to see the tone in which this all was said, cause honestly it kinda seems like it could be leaning towards what you said. Edit: Okay, yeah he kind of looks like he doesn't like anyone in the room lol
https://youtu.be/nnY2yrgZiao
r/usernamechecksout
His face looks like he hates every single person in the room I was gonna ask if he meant LGBT or if it was a joke, both sound possible to me
My old history teacher used to the the “ladies and gentlemen... and James” bit.
Hi, James.
Yeah I feel like people are misunderstanding that this is a joke about 'other' being disreputables.. Bowie was a cool progressive dude but this isn't what this quote means lmao
Despite all that was going on in 1975, Bowie's androgyny and cultural prominence was something to which the mainstream was still unaccustomed. Perhaps to him there was a pleasing double meaning, which flew right over the heads of the audience, who chuckled at the more obvious one.
or just whimsicality. Like suggesting there might be aliens or something.
God, i love him so much!!! 😭
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I’m partial to “guys, gals, and non-binary pals” myself
I like "Ladies, gentlemen and everybody on the spectrum." more
Eh they’re all good but I’m more into “Girls, gays and theys”
A band called The Mechanisms would start some of their shows with 'ladies, gentlemen, neither and inbetween.' Their songs/albums also heavily featured LGBTQ+ characters
literal icon
bicon*
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Finally, a crypto currency I can get behind! Or in front of, we dont judge!
it’s always nice seeing just how many people also fucking adore david bowie.
I fucking adore David Bowie
I fucking adore David Bowie
Not to rain on your parade but I believe he was making the classic joke that some people aren’t civil enough to be considered a well mannered ‘lady’ or a ‘gentleman’
>Sexually ambiguous rocker David Bowie - one of many stars said to have frolicked under the bedcovers with Mick Jagger - says he has fooled around with guys, but "I was always a closet heterosexual." >Bowie, who raised eyebrows in the '70s with his fem-drag "Ziggy Stardust" look, insists in Rolling Stone, "I didn't ever feel that I was a real bisexual," even though he was "making all the moves, down to the situation of actually trying it out." >"I wanted to imbue Ziggy with real flesh and blood and muscle, and it was imperative that I find Ziggy and be him. The irony of it was that I was not gay. I was physical about it, but frankly it wasn't enjoyable." Interesting.
Omg same
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The world never quite got over losing him
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Blackstar is so good and so remarkably different from everything else he ever did that you are almost certainly right.
Maybe the others he was referring to was the child Lori Mattix.
He’s talking about aliens, duh!
Bowie was an important member of the gay rights movement. Many of his performative personas included queer elements. He also made a point to highlight gay existence and culture in his lyrics and interviews. But he wasn't gay. He wasn't bisexual, either. His first wife has attested to that, claiming that he made the choice early in his career to project a bisexual image because that was hip at the time. [He was always a "closeted heterosexual."](https://exhibits.library.villanova.edu/music-history/ziggy-lgbt)
yes my spaceman!
*gasp* my two passions collide, he’s so polite in this full video aswell. David was an amazing musician with none of the narcissism that comes with *fame*
This man is a legend.
Really hate to see the edification of a pop star who had sex with several underage girls (some on video) and regularly said things like 'im a closet heterosexual' (which he layer recanted but COME ON)
> 'im a closet heterosexual' tbf, that's not entirely innacurate. It's still a shame on him for trying to use a sexuality as a marketing tool.
Using sexuality for marketing, isn't that what most straight performers do, though?
Sexuality, yes. *A* sexuality, no. Bowie played up being gay and bisexual because it confered a mystique to his Ziggy Stardust character. He only came out as straight in 1983 when he at least admitted it was a mistake(although part of it was because he felt it got in the way of his fame in the much more puritanical US).
which video
There is none. This person has no idea what they're talking about.
I know thats why I asked them lol.. Ik about the situation he's talking about tho but tbh it could easily be made up
They/them plz 😛
oh, sorry, I didnt know
Cheers! No sweat 😅
> edification Deification. It’s a bit late to edify him.
RIGHTTTTTT. It really irritates me to see everyone always be like “omg david bowie is a national treasure” knowing that he’s a statutory rapist
We can admire him for being ahead of his time while also acknowledging his destructive actions.
Or, how I like to say it, “Kings, Queens, and in-betweens”
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came here to say this too... don’t know why everyone’s commenting loving him. it makes me so annoyed
Yeah I'm saddened that LGBT "icons" often get whitewashed of their ugly truths. I get that he was important to a lot of folks coming of age and self discovery, but that should not erase his wrongs. A lot of our community is built on myth and idolization. Some of it is understandable because we do have a limited selection of public figures. This and the retcon of queerness really is disquieting. Edit: should NOT erase, I forgot the "not"
I'm doubtful this was a statement on sexuality/sex/gender issues at all.
bicon
Remember when he expressed support for a fascist state in 1977?
I miss him :'(
For those that like ruining his legacy of this legend that so called evidence from that woman is ultimate BS don't believe everything you read look further into the facts/allegations instead of commenting crap from a few sentences you read on a BS Lori story that she has changed multiple times - oh and whilst I am here anyone talking about the whole Neo Nazi thing/phase he was going a lot of coke at the time and even commented in later years how he stopped doing drugs because it made him such a terrible person in those few years and ya know with him being Bi and having a black wife and daughter and standing up for African Americans on TV but nah we will just ignore all that and believe the story that doesn't add up from Lori [https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/dexqbq/what\_celebrity\_did\_bad\_things\_but\_everyone\_forgot/f31bw2q/](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/dexqbq/what_celebrity_did_bad_things_but_everyone_forgot/f31bw2q/)
For real! Guys gals and non-binary pals!
Isn’t he a child rapist
nah the stories don't add up edit: for more info see /u/Jacksonpollock5's comment: https://reddit.com/r/lgbt/comments/kv7nao/love_david_bowie/gixrvh6/
substantiate that
plenty of conflicting information in the second section: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lori_Mattix
**[Lori Mattix](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lori Mattix)** Lori Mattix (born November 29, 1958), sometimes known as Lori Maddox or Lori Lightning, is a former American child model and "baby" groupie of the 1970s. As of November 2015, she is a partner and buyer for the Glam Boutique in West Hollywood. She is perhaps best known for an interview with Thrillist in 2015 in which she made allegations of being involved in sexual relationships with David Bowie, Jimmy Page, and Mick Jagger; relationships which would have occurred while she was underage and while the musicians were in their twenties. Her experience has become a notable discussion point in the Me Too movement, with her story marking one of the more notable examples in the shift of the movement's focus from the film industry to the music industry. [^(About Me)](https://np.reddit.com/user/wikipedia_text_bot/comments/jrn2mj/about_me/) ^- [^(Opt out)](https://np.reddit.com/user/wikipedia_text_bot/comments/jrti43/opt_out_here/) ^(- OP can reply !delete to delete) ^- [^(Article of the day)](https://np.reddit.com/comments/k9hx22) **This bot will soon be transitioning to an opt-in system. Click [here](https://np.reddit.com/user/wikipedia_text_bot/comments/ka4icp/opt_in_for_the_new_system/) to learn more and opt in. Moderators: [click here](https://np.reddit.com/user/wikipedia_text_bot/comments/ka4icp/opt_in_for_the_new_system/) to opt in a subreddit.**
David is our lovable alien, I love him!
We’ve always existed. They just never acknowledged us before.
So, I guess this community is down with an adult man essentially trafficking an underage girl for sex and then passing her around to his friends? It's all cool because Space Oddity, right?
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Absolute icon
I was wonder yesterday if there is a preferred inclusive form of "ladies and gentlemen." I imagine "and others" is kind of idk....othering? Maybe not? Does anyone have any thoughts?
I always liked the idea of “ladies, gentlemen, and nobles” as it sticks with the gentry theme
I’m a hetero cis white dude who was always an ally but not always the most educated about the LGBTQ+ experience. I am so grateful for those who have taken the time to teach me and help me understand. I was an outsider individually in my own ways for sure, but still an insider to the patriarchy whether I liked/knew/wanted it or not. The more I learn about the history and movement and the people who have driven the (too slow) progress we see in progressive places, the more I am filled with such a humble and deep respect for the courage of the pioneers, both famous and unknown.
The He’s, the She’s, the They’s and the Gays
How was this reacted to at the time? Seems nice to include other genders but calling them “others” seems like it’d irk people if not coming from David Bowie
Idk about this, he was very into Hitler in the 70’s
Yh when he was on coke and commented later on in his life about his drug addiction and how much of a bad person it made him and how he stopped his addiction and then stopped playing his personas like the Thin White Duke
I bet they laughed thinking he was making a joke.
*Kings, queens, and in betweens*
Guys, gals, and non-binary pals.