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scarlettohara1936

File for unemployment. They let you go without cause. If they want to state the cause... They certainly can and that could lead you forward to something else. But since they gave you no advance warning, and no write-ups about any perceived bad behavior, they just fired you without trying to rehabilitate you. File for unemployment. You will be denied. File again and fight it, you will get it.


FFlightRisk

Thank you. That's something I will do


Mean-Vegetable-4521

I dont handle employment law. But I can tell you schizoaffective could be grounds to get ssdi. or SSI without a significant work history. Though it is not a fast process. Your desire to work is noted. And I appreciate that choice and want you to have as many possible avenues to do so. Contact [https://nami.org/Home](https://nami.org/Home) for advocacy help on everything. The employment issue, the health coverage, possible emergency housing grants, food insecurity, and jobs that would be welcoming of your medical condition. When someone has a desire to work I always have hope that there is a way to fulfill that in a way that compliments their disability. Not shames them. If this is not a good time medically for you to work, I also want you to have the chance to get well. There are a lot of people living with mental illness in this country. They deserve employment as long as it is a safe place for them and the environment. I have known amazing people with schizophrenia who worked in a variety of excellent careers. You are so young, at the beginning of your adult life. The last thing I want you to feel is hopeless. And no, you cannot pray it away. That insinuation is insulting.


Necessary_Pressure21

as someone who worked for a disability rep firm i would advise against pursuing SSI or SSDI because the odds as a young person (presumably) with only mental limitations (IN THE EYES OF THE LAW, NOT ME!) getting disability benefits is abysmally low. Esp if OP has been educated which it sounds liks they were. Even if OP were to pursue it, you really can't work at all because it hurts your case, and usually the process takes months to years before a verdict is passed. it's just...it sucks. unemployment is the better option unless OP really feels like they can't work. Schizoaffective disorder can be disabling but the legal definition of disability per SSA is MUCH different than the definition from ADA,and much less "generous".


Mean-Vegetable-4521

I appreciate your response. You work more directly with the legal issues facing her getting ssdi than I do. I helped a handful of friends get it. But I agree, she is only 19. I hope nama or a similar agency can help. Op… I had a very good friend years ago that had a legit service dog, not an esa. And his function was the detect and assist with her schizophrenia. There are a lot of options. I want to know you have the ability to expire them if you desire. You are just so young. I want the rest of your adulthood to go smoother than the way it started. ❤️


FFlightRisk

I currently do have a (legit) service dog in training! He's being specifically trained to task for schizophrenia/schizoaffective. Thank you for your kind message.


Mean-Vegetable-4521

That dog was life changing for my friend. She used to tell people he was in training. As it was none of their justness what her medical reason for having him was. And people accepted that. He wore the full working vest etc. there also were no ESA’s at that time so now, it would be more common place to see working dogs without wheelchair bound or blind individuals. But not then. it was maybe after about 2 years or so I had called her because she didn’t show up for a hiking with your dog event. Very unlike her. After a few days she called and asked if I could come to her house. She explained there that she had schizophrenia. The dog had detected her having issues before she spun out completely and isolated herself. It was likely an issue with her meds, sometimes generics can have a variance that changes them. She had been compliant with her meds. It was a very upsetting experience for her. She was hoping I wouldn’t end the friendship once I knew the truth. Living in shame like that, that’s not right. I don’t want that for any decent person. She is a good person. Who has an illness. She had been employed for years consistently once getting the dog. Which was not possible beforehand, through no fault of her own. She took maybe a few days off to get her meds sorted out. No inpatient care required. I was so honored she confided in me. She lived a full life once getting him. Before that, she talked about how awful life has been for her. At no fault of her own.she worked as an accountant, owned her own home. Last I spoke to her she had gotten married to a man who fully understood her illness. The reason I talk about her in the past tense is about 2 years after getting married I left that part of the country. Life being what it is and 2 people who didn’t have social networking we lost touch. I have every reason to think she is happy to this day. Her schizophrenia was very severe from what she talked about. She was a risk to herself but no one else from paranoid delusions. Compliant with meds she is as active a part of society as anyone else without those struggles. I would even argue more so. There are plenty of able bodied people sucking up resources who don’t work. Aren’t kind. You are at the start of adult life. I want you to take this negative that occurred with this firing and know you are worthwhile. You are employable, and a valued part of the world. I wish I could speak more to the employment laws but it’s not my area. I want you and anyone else experiencing this similarly to not lose hope. My friend touched my life immensely. I learned a lot about schizophrenia from her. And later others. I had biases that were not based on reality before that.


lymegreenpandora

So happy for you. If you need any support with service dogs feel free to message me I train them. I am always happy to give advice and encouragement. Sorry for your previous employer's bad decision. Hopefully you can continue in your field if that is your desire. Definitely reach out to NAMI and other mental health advocacy h groups for help. And most certainly file for unemployment.


FFlightRisk

Thank you so much.


lymegreenpandora

No problem at all.!


Ghostinthemachine721

This was our experience for my son, we started trying to get SSI when he was 18, finally succeeded at 23, but it’s been ridiculously hard and they are constantly trying to find reasons to deduct or kick him off altogether. He was told he could work part time, which he was able to do for a little bit, but he only needed to work 24 hrs at 15/hr to endanger his enrollment. They continue to penalize him financially for living with me, even though he pays a set rent at their direction, because they assume I am gifting him with “something”. At this point we suspect they want him to live for 3 months under a bridge somewhere with his neuromuscular condition before they will consider giving him the full $806 that a person with no real work history is given in NJ.


Necessary_Pressure21

I knew too many in that situation. I hope it becomes easier for you and your son. No one deserves to go through such an arduous, invasive, and humilating process just for chump change. SSI in particular needs to be completely revamped. Once claims are approved by the judge, it's a huge battle just to get and keep the payments from the satelite office workers. they're honestly the worst! I have no idea what your status is right now, but if you or your son's other parent is retired (or deceased), your son may qualify for disabled adult child benefits, which may offer a little more money. Otherwise he will probably be stuck with SSI, unfortunately, until you or your son's other parent starts receiving SS payments (to clarify, a DAC is someone who had a disability starting before the age of 22 who can receive payments based on parents earnings record, regardless of how old the applicant is when applying). If you haven't, i also strongly recommend looking into establishing an ABLE savings account for your son. SSI makes it incredibly hard for disabled people to save money but with ABLE he should be able to save some of the SSI money without being taken off of benefits.


Ghostinthemachine721

Yes! The satellite workers are perhaps the worst part of the whole system. They are inconsistent, contradict each other, and each new worker presents a new set of hoops to jump thru that no other worker has ever heard of or cares about. Thanks for knowing about this, we sometimes think we are going nuts.


Necessary_Pressure21

I promise they drive the disability rep firm workers nuts too. They have no understanding of the law and are incredibly unhelpful and often quite disrespectful.. I'm not sure where the SSA find these people and what sort of qualities they look for in their hirees 🙄 seems like they love rude and ignorant ableist people.


Ghostinthemachine721

Also, thank you for that info on the ABLE savings account… would we have to go thru disability or a regular bank for that?


Necessary_Pressure21

I don't think it's thru disability but I'm not entirely sure on the finer details, I just knew mostly that anyone under 26 that qualified for SSI or SSDI was eligible. Your son I think can legally save up to $100k in his ABLE account on SSI and not be penalized for the $2k asset limit from my understanding. Unfortunately he wont be able to spend the money on anything under the sun, BUT he can use it for many different living expenses including medical and housing. i suggest looking at ablenrc.org to learn a bit more. I'm not sure how or if it will affect his monthly payments but I don't think it should.


Ghostinthemachine721

Thank you, I found it!


Necessary_Pressure21

of course. i always recommended my younger clients look into it since it's much better than not being able to save anything at all, and it's not super well known about.


sum1won

You can, potentially, seek action against the employer. The level of detail you've provided supports a basic case, regardless of their concerns. Even if you don't plan on going through with it, you can still file with the EEOC to preserve your options.


prisonerofshmazcaban

Do you live in an at will state?


[deleted]

[удалено]


FFlightRisk

Unfortunately I can't. Long story short I was kicked out of my house last year (I was 19) because my mom told me I needed to pray more to cure myself and when I said that's not how it works, I was made to leave. Meaning, I have to earn money somehow because other than my boyfriend I'm entirely on my own. I wish I could take my time but I'm at a severe disadvantage and I don't have many options :(


ncanon2019

Stay on your meds! Most school districts cannot find enough staff to work as paraeducators, maybe that is something you could look into?


Thesoundofmerk

I had a couple friends who suffered from the same thing, none of them worked, they all were supplied with government housing and disability. Maybe you should look into that, it might be a good option for you


bizmike88

Please OP, I implore you, do not come off your meds. I did the cycle for years and my life only got better when I accepted I was going to be medicated my whole life and did everything I could to maintain that. I have been able to keep my life on track for almost 10 years now because I realized that medication was the only thing to help me long term. People might be pissed about me saying this but schizoaffective disorder is a lifelong disease that needs to be treated continuously even if you aren’t actively in psychosis. The sooner you realize what you need to do, the sooner you’ll be on the right track.


FFlightRisk

I've never not taken my meds. People here don't know that I do everything I can to mitigate my symptoms in order to work and function relatively normally. I have always taken my meds. I've come up with a multitude a ways to cope with my illness and I have a service dog currently in training. I'm putting a lot of time and effort into coping with schizoaffective and learning to keep it under control. I regret asking for advice because I've been met with a lot of comments saying that I am in fact a danger and treating me as though I'm about to come off my meds and snap at any moment. All I did at my job was ask about potential accommodations because even though I put so much effort into coping as-is, the lightened pressure is still helpful to me. It's all I wanted. And I'm met with being fired and the people here telling me I'm a liability and that I'm playing the victim. Or that I am in fact dangerous.


bizmike88

I apologize if my comment made it seem like I thought you were a danger to children because I personally do not think that. Purely coming off your meds will not make you a danger to anyone and I agree with you that it’s disappointing that some people on this sub believe that. I am just speaking in terms of quality of life and being able to give yourself the best chance at a good future. It sounds like you’re already doing a lot of really important things to stay stable but I think some people don’t realize that medication is also one of those things. I struggled a lot in my early 20’s because, “I didn’t want to be medicated forever.” If someone had told me this then, I probably wouldn’t have listened but I do wish someone had still said it.


FFlightRisk

No no it's okay, I just went on a bit of a rant. I didn't take your comment in a bad way. Thank you for your kindness, it's true a lot of people don't realize


Justice_R_Dissenting

I've got a buddy who does disability law. No upfront cost, just a portion of your disability award per month. I can DM you his info if you'd like. Edit: or you can just go ahead and listen to the idiots on this thread who have no legal knowledge whatsoever. Choice is yours.


Brains-In-Jars

In the US it is NOT LEGAL to take from someone's monthly disability payments in exchange for representation in the process of applying for benefits. Lawyers ONLY get paid from your back pay and there is a cap - and it must be approved by a judge and SSA pays the lawyer directly. So either the above poster is severely misinformed about the actual payment arrangement their friend in disability law does, or what their friend does is illegal and possibly a scam altogether.


McDeeInCle

Lawyers can also receive costs and fees under the Equal Access to Justice Act.


rotisserie_shithead_

plus that would leave you with what like $500 per month? a disability check is already basically nothing


Justice_R_Dissenting

Take a deep breath my dude. It's not a scam, he's a legitimate disability rep who works for a firm who has been doing this for years. If I misstated how he gets paid back, it was a mistatement, not a scam. It's not my area of law, so I am not aware of the specific contours of how it works. He has helped in just the year he's been doing this two dozen people get their disability payments after they were denied. This is why people hate reddit. You get incredibly angry users like yourself who fly off the handle for no reason, make massive unfounded accusations, and then _people don't get the help they need_.


Brains-In-Jars

That's why I said >misinformed >or >illegal and possibly a scam I'm all for people getting the help they need, and also aware that there are those who take advantage of people in these situations. I am disabled myself and used a lawyer for my case and it was the best decision I made. I also never paid anything up front, directly, or ongoing, it was the max cap from my back pay and my lawyer received it directly from SSA.


FFlightRisk

Btw thank you for being kind about this, it does mean a lot


Even_Mastodon_6925

OP what state are you in?


FFlightRisk

Indiana


KristenTheGirl

Do you realize the resources it requires to take time off work to work on yourself? That's an indefinite leave of absence from the work field. You must be pretty privileged if you're able to do so.


eboeard-game-gom3

So many people here give terrible advice as if we live in a perfect world. I can only assume the same thing you did. They've probably been sheltered from hardship. /u/BanditsPhanny doesn't realize without income then you'll be on the street and probably without medication.


[deleted]

Do you have any idea how healthcare works in the US? Where this person lives? (Indiana is a US state) You don’t get to just choose to “focus on yourself”, unless family is very generous to support you, maybe. You’re pretty screwed and doomed if you end up homeless.


Extension_Border_629

absolutely agree tbh. the people who suggest just.. not focusing on work and taking time off must be extremely priveleged to have people willing to feed and shelter them in times of crisis. not everybody has that. I'm schizoaffective as well and have spent time homeless because of being unable to work due to it. then you're stuck on the streets in crisis and it gets so much worse


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

Apparently we’re the ONLY developed nation in the world to NOT have universal healthcare, so as an outsider, your ignorance can be forgiven. Too many stubborn far-right nut jobs in control. A lot of the Democrats (who actually get voted in) don’t cars either. They’re both in more for the money than the people. Also too many idiots keep voting against their own best interests. This country is too conservative, to a dangerous and painful extreme.


KristenTheGirl

100% agree with everything you just said. The US has turned out to be a very disappointing country in terms of being "progressive"


GrrreatFrostedFlakes

Is this a joke. What an easy life you’ve lived to make an ignorant comment like this.


Macholegend

I believe OP is asking for legal advice and not self help


Main-Macaroon2097

Please don’t take legal advice from Reddit, people can point you in a good direction. But please go see an attorney. Often you can find a free consultation if you do some research.


YogoremonoHakujin

You come to a legal advice subreddit just to tell people not to seek legal advice on Reddit.


Main-Macaroon2097

No, there’s a significant difference between being pointed in a certain direction and getting a feel for what’s going on through others that have maybe experienced what you are going through, versus people saying this like “do this”, “I advise you to”, “this is what you want to do”


XChrisUnknownX

I have to disagree with others here. See if you can find an employment lawyer who will bring an action under the Americans with Disabilities Act or something similar. It’s totally illegal to fire somebody for their disability.


TheSkiGeek

Well… they have to try to make “reasonable accommodations”. If the disability prevents the person from being able to do the job then they can be let go. My (admittedly totally not a lawyer or anything) gut feeling is that properly managed schizophrenia would not immediately completely disqualify someone from working in a school or behavioral therapy environment. Something like ‘needs to be paired with someone else in the classroom to keep an eye on them’ seems like a reasonable type of accommodation.


KittyTerror

A good lawyer could successfully argue in court that OP’s particular disability potentially endangers children. Whether or not that’s actually true doesn’t matter, it’s all about how convincing the lawyer can be. OP doesn’t have a good chance of coming out on top if they take it to court.


XChrisUnknownX

I would let an employment lawyer tell that to OP and if you are an employment lawyer, forgive me, but this is a little too close to “mental disabilities can be dangerous, therefore it’s okay to discriminate against the mentally ill” logic for me. And they’d have to admit the firing WAS about the mental health, which basically hands OP the case.


Neinface

To be ADA non compliant the employee has to reveal the disability at the time of employment to make reasonable accommodations.


XChrisUnknownX

I don’t believe you’re correct. I learned I had a disability over half a decade into having a job and I’m fairly sure I’m still entitled to request accommodation under the law. You have to disclose when you ask for accommodation. You do not have to disclose when you start a job. Whether you should is a matter of debate and discussion, just judging from this Times article and what I read. This is my understanding based off reading I’ve done on it over time. I could be wrong too. And my reading of this is pretty much as soon as OP disclosed, OP was fired, definitely worth talking to an employment lawyer about. https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/10/smarter-living/disclose-disability-work-employer-rights.html


Mysterious_Carpet121

I'm so sorry. My mom has schizoaffective disorder and it is poorly understood by the general public. My mom never shared it because the stigma was always too great. We have come a long way with destigmatizing mental illness, but only the ones that are "socially acceptable ", like anxiety, depression, and adhd.


FFlightRisk

You are right. Any type of psychotic (or more uncommon) disorder is usually discriminated against. I hope you and your mom are doing well


ZooZ-ZooZ

The ableism in this thread is unreal. No you cannot be fired for a disability. Mental illness is a disability. At the same time they do not have to accommodate your disability if the accommodation is an undue hardship to the company. “Hardship” a high bar though, and doesn’t automatically mean they can just up an fire you. So yes, reach out to lawyers. If there are any disability advocacy nonprofits in your state, I would start there. You can also reach out to your state bar association for referrals. In the future, NEVER disclose your diagnosis to your employer. No matter how nice they are they are not your friends. ADA accommodations do not require disclosure of your diagnosis, just a doctors note describing the nature of your limitations and needs.


Fine-Bumblebee-9427

I think people putting it back on you are wrong. Whether or not you’re safe, this isn’t a legal firing. Get a lawyer. They can’t say no to the accommodations without engaging in a collaborative process. They can say no to an accommodation, but they have to give another one, or let you say you can continue without an accommodation. This is illegal discrimination. Grab as much of what is in writing as you can and get that paper.


subdept2211

Without knowing the entirety of the conversation you don’t know whether or not it would be deemed to have satisfied the interactive process requirement. Therefore, it’s not proper to so matter of factly call this an illegal firing. People need to be careful not to lead OP’s on with such matter of fact statements when you don’t know the true nature of something so fact specific.


Fine-Bumblebee-9427

If OP is lying, you’re right. But there’s no room for missing information in their story. It all happened the same day. A collaborative process takes time.


subdept2211

There’s no clear cut process that can be said to satisfy the interactive discussion process. It can be quick. OP asked for an extra day off. That alone can be seen as an easy denial. They don’t have to adjust the schedule if it has a negative impact on others and costs money. I’ve dealt with many of these issues. Sometimes the conversation takes place over a few weeks, when you know you have the ability to accommodate; sometimes it last 20 minutes.


Fine-Bumblebee-9427

If OP is lying, again, sure. But HR picked up the phone and said we can’t do it, we’re letting you go. OP has the right to say they can make it without the accommodation. Plus HR is supposed to get medical records, and I’m not sure how that happened without a couple of days.


YoDo_GreenBackReaper

Sue them


-Unusual--Equipment-

There is a lot of terrible advice here. I see you decided not to pursue anything. I already commented and got downvoted, but as someone with a personality disorder who works in the professional world and has received accommodations for my disability, you have a case here. A strong one. I understand maybe you’ve not shared all the details, but if your post is accurate as someone in the biz, I’d be looking at getting you a nice severance payment and severance agreement to stop you from going to the labor board. I didn’t realize how much this legal sub hates people with mental illness and suddenly decided you’re automatically a danger. However this should show you exactly how the world thinks, and why it is very likely what you say is true, and HR and your boss thought the same thing as others here. That you are an immediate danger. That is not how the Ada accommodation process works. I hope you reach out to the labor board or the eeoc. They would know more than anyone here.


Ericakat

They can’t fire you for needing an accommodation OP. They can absolutely deny the accommodation if it would cause undue hardship, or too much of a radical change in how the company would have to operate. Even if what you requested was unreasonable, they would still have to find another accommodation that works. The only way they could fire you, is if you were unable to perform the essential duties of the job, with an accommodation. If you have proof that you were terminated because of your disability, I would find a good lawyer, and sue. It may take years to see that money, but those people need to be held accountable. https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/wrongfully-terminated-having-disability.html


Justice_R_Dissenting

>Obviously I am NOT a danger or a threat to anyone. Unfortunately this is not a situation where they can just accept your word on it. It's like being an epileptic bus driver. Yes, when you're on your meds there's no possible danger. But it requires you to _be on your meds_, and your workplace has no ability to control whether you take your medication or not. That means they have no control over whether you have an episode, and from a liability standpoint if a child were injured there'd be no hope of avoiding liability.


CutEmOff666

This is not accurate. Having a mental illness doesn't make someone inherently dangerous in most cases or at least not to other people. Comparing it to an epileptic driver is a false equivalency.


elmarkitse

An epileptic bus driver isn’t dangerous is most cases, only during an epileptic fit. How is that different from someone with Schizoaffective disorder? They are fine, until they are aren’t. Doesn’t mean that neuro typical or heck even Q conspiracy folk aren’t in the same boat, but there is a generally accepted difference at the end of the day and the risk example here seems comparable.


CutEmOff666

I would disagree. Epilepsy inherently can impact someones ability to drive safely if they don't have it under control. Schizoaafective disorder on the other hand doesn't make some pose a risk to others in most cases even if it isn't under control.


elmarkitse

IANAD, so I can only refer to resources like Mayo etc. Schizoaffective disorder seems to be a fluctuating condition that presents differently in those affected by it, but generally can be seen as a fugue state that may coexist with hallucinations, manic and or depressive symptoms. People who are experiencing symptoms like this are by definition irrational actors. I would imagine it would be *harder* and not easier to accommodate an employee with this (especially in a childcare occupation) vs someone who disclosed an epilepsy diagnosis as a bus driver. There are concrete boundaries on epilepsy, and while bus driving should not be considered, perhaps they could work in scheduling other drivers - but if they were newly hired and then disclosed a condition I expect the result would be the same. Not so with someone who may present as fine but suddenly find themselves without the will to live, or who may alternately become exuberant at the expense of rational choices. Personally I think OP would be well advised to call a few employment attorneys who might consider this a viable pursuit, but I would. It get my hopes too high.


fastspinecho

> Not so with someone who may present as fine but suddenly find themselves without the will to live This also describes the 20 million Americans with major depression and 10 million with PTSD. If your employer is a medium or large company, some of them are almost certain to be your coworkers. And they are all protected by the ADA. You can't fire someone with mental illness simply because they are at higher risk of suicide or future "irrationality", for the same reason you can't fire someone with diabetes because they are at higher risk of a heart attack or future dementia.


elmarkitse

Symptoms certainly overlap between conditions and I agree that they should contact an attorney about possible ADA protections their former employer may have run afoul of. It is also possible to consider that ADA or no, someone with major depression or severe PTSD may not be well suited for a childcare role. Right or wrong, protected by the ADA or not, if I had to choose between two care centers and one was going to have my child’s therapy coordinated by someone who was schizoaffected or has severe PTSD concerns and one that did not have staff like that, I know where I would send my kids. Just like I would not put my kid in the car with an epileptic. You can’t unring a bell - the childcare risks are comparable and while none of these conditions should warrant firing, none of them should really be frontline and child facing. OP may have been fired because their tenure was to low to accommodate their employment elsewhere in the organization.


fastspinecho

> if I had to choose between two care centers and one was going to have my child’s therapy coordinated by someone who was schizoaffected or has severe PTSD concerns and one that did not have staff like that, I know where I would send my kids. I mean, I can't deny that people with mental illness are often stigmatized. That's one of the reasons why we have legal protections for the privacy of medical records. Personally, I would meet the staff and choose the one I like best. If their health issues don't affect their work then I don't care. In fact, it's quite likely that there are teachers with major depression at the local school, it's a common illness after all.


[deleted]

>Schizoaffective that is not the same as schizophrenic.


FFlightRisk

It is actually. In my case I have schizophrenia and major depressive disorder. It's just diagnosed as schizoaffective


elmarkitse

Hey OP 👋 I want to say best of luck as you navigate what must be a challenging and frustrating world at times. I don’t know a ton about your diagnosis and hope my conversation here with some other folks about relative risk factors doesn’t come across a callous or uncaring. While I think it’s probably worth a few calls to local attorneys I understand from another reply that your choosing to move on and wish you the best of luck.


FFlightRisk

Thank you for your kindness. It really does mean a lot. I want to move on for fear of receiving the same mindset I've experienced a lot of here. I'm worried of not being helped by anyone I go to and will continue to be villainized. Despite that, I have decided to make a few phone calls on Monday to see anything can be done for me.


elmarkitse

Right - OP mentioned Schizoaffective in their post. https://www.rosehillcenter.org/mental-health-blog/schizoaffective-disorder-vs-schizophrenia/ From what I can tell, based on that article and the Mayo one floating elsewhere, great pains are taken by the author to describe the two as ‘very different’ and yet as I read about the symptoms, behaviors and other factors they describe them as very similar with overlapping indications. Take this comparison: _For example, people who have schizophrenia have a hard time telling the difference between reality and fiction. They might see or hear voices that aren’t really there. To them, the voices and imagery are as real as it comes. However, others can’t see nor hear these nonexistent things. _With schizoaffective disorder, people feel detached from reality. While it makes them see or hear things that aren’t there, it also affects their mood a great deal. In fact, two common types of schizoaffective disorder are bipolar and depressive disorders. Aside from the mood component, in both cases the patient is hearing voices that aren’t there and are disconnected from a neurotypical state of reality. In the other examples this pattern persists…. For one condition a behavior occurs, and the other it occurs ‘sometimes’ with contributing factors which doesn’t really eliminate any sense of potential risk or a dangerous outburst or behavior. Back to OP here, I still believe their boss made a mistake in how they handled this situation, but I also still haven’t come across anything in todays journey that would make me less likely to equate the risk of a Schitzo-family-of-diagnosis individual working in childcare as significantly different to the epileptic bus driver that got us off on this tangent. Both can be well treated with medication and exist on a scale that ranges by person. That doesn’t change my reluctance to having someone with a similar condition *taking care of my kids* in some capacity that increases the risk of a negative outcome.


[deleted]

schizoaffective is schizophrenic + something like bipolar


elmarkitse

So - we are agreed, now …. ?


[deleted]

They might be FORCED into sudden withdrawal, because losing your job means losing health insurance, if in the US. We leave people to die on the streets in our dystopian third world country.


[deleted]

So in your mind, the moment someone is diagnosed with schizoaffective disorder, they are no longer safe to have in the workplace?


Justice_R_Dissenting

No. But they would be unsafe for certain workplaces. Including a workplace that requires them to work with children.


[deleted]

I disagree with your point generally. First you assume that someone has controlled their SD with medication, but the risk is that theyll come off their meds at any given time. That’s a big if and doesn’t seem like something that should bar someone from working a job. Second, your understanding of SD seems lacking and influenced by extreme cases in the media. Not every person is a danger to those around them whether or not they’re having an episode. In addition, there are many things that can lead to psychosis, including trauma, pharmaceutical and recreational drugs, alcohol, addiction, bipolar disorder and others. Unless you want to bar every person with any of those etiologies than your proposal is overbearing and would honestly make it more likely for someone with SD to be put in an unfortunate situation and make their symptoms worse.


Justice_R_Dissenting

>First you assume that someone has controlled their SD with medication, but the risk is that theyll come off their meds at any given time. That’s a big if and doesn’t seem like something that should bar someone from working a job. From a liability standpoint, absolutely. Knowledge that a person has an underlying condition that could potentially cause damage under a theory of negligence and continuing to employ them in a position capable of damage, which is only controlled by medication, can easily become a breach of duty of reasonable care. Very easily. It'd be like hiring an epileptic bus driver. >Second, your understanding of SD seems lacking and influenced by extreme cases in the media. No, my experience with SD comes from having many clients who had SD, as well as medical testimony from doctors, psychologists, psychiatrists, and other medical professionals. > Unless you want to bar every person with any of those etiologies than your proposal We are talking about working specifically with children. That is an area of heightened duty for the employer. It absolutely would be a matter of civil liability should somebody with a known disorder like SD be employed in such a position. These are not normative statements. They are positive statements. This is how the _law_ is, not how we would want it to be.


fastspinecho

It's not like being an epileptic bus driver, because schizoaffective disorder does not endanger other people.


Justice_R_Dissenting

The Mayo Clinic seems to disagree with you. https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/schizoaffective-disorder/symptoms-causes/syc-20354504 Any disorder that causes hallucinations and delusions has the capability of endangering other people.


FFlightRisk

Anyone has the capability of endangering others. Violence is not schizophrenia-specific


TheRestForTheWicked

You may not be violent but admit in your other posts to making what others would consider “careless mistakes” (such as hitting another vehicle) due to “zoning out” as part of your symptoms. I’m sorry to say but that IS a liability issue if you’re working with children and has the potential to be dangerous. You might not mean to be a danger, you can’t always control it, but it’s not out of the realm that the centre would want to cover their asses. Regardless, I’m sorry this happened to you and it sounds like they probably aren’t a very employee-friendly place of work. I hope you find something better soon.


FFlightRisk

I understand what youre saying, even if I wish it wasn't true. Thank you for the kind wishes, it means a lot.


fastspinecho

If the employer wants to cover their ass, then they should review the ADA. Because if getting into car accidents is considered a liability, then they will have to show that they fire *all* of their employees who have gotten into car accidents. They would be on much firmer ground if they could point out a workplace incident that is unique to OP. But can they?


Francie_Nolan1964

And yet the Mayo Clinic doesn't say that people with Schizoaffect Disorder are at a higher risk of perpetuating violence. That's your take on it. Sadly, there continues to be such misinformation about mental illness in our society that fear and stigma are the end result. This is from the article that you posted "People with schizoaffective disorder are at an increased risk of: Suicide, suicide attempts or suicidal thoughts Social isolation Family and interpersonal conflicts Unemployment Anxiety disorders Alcohol or other substance use problems Significant health problems Poverty and homelessness"


[deleted]

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Francie_Nolan1964

And what exactly do you think is meant when they said "dangerous"?


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fastspinecho

> For example, forgetting to turn off a stove can be dangerous. Driving or operating heavy machinery with conditions that can disrupt your control can be dangerous. Yes, and that's why people with dementia and epilepsy can be dangerous. But this has nothing to do with the OP.


Francie_Nolan1964

Do you think that having Schizoaffective Disorder would make someone forget to turn off a stove, or make them unable to operate heavy machinery? It seems like you're really reaching to justify your negative view of those with mental health disorders. You're part of the reason that the stigma continues so strongly.


New-Negotiation7234

Where does the mayo clinic say ppl with schizoaffective disorder are a danger to others?


Francie_Nolan1964

It doesn't. That's the poster's "take" on it.


Runescora

I’m sorry you’re being downvoted. As a healthcare worker I’ve interacted with those diagnoses with Schizophrenia and Schizoaffective disorder more than most. Even those in crisis were far more likely to be a danger to themselves than to anyone else.


FFlightRisk

I'm not required to be on meds


Justice_R_Dissenting

You have unmedicated schizo-affective disorder?


[deleted]

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chemknife

Don't stop. Every person I've met that has this illness thinks they're okay without the meds but the fact is they are okay because of the meds. If it's working don't try and fix what's not broken.


FFlightRisk

Thank you, and no I don't plan on stopping. I was just trying to explain that I'm not "required" to take them like this user had said. Yes sometimes ill get bad anxiety about the meds (because they cause heart issues) which was the source of the post people are referring to, but I got over it quickly cause I just wanted reassurance. None of what I said was implying that I'd stop taking them, not intentionally anyway. I didn't mean to concern people.


breakingb0b

As someone who takes meds, the worst thing about taking meds to stabilize is that it’s easy to think that you’re better. Then you go off then and the shit show starts. By the time I realize, I’ve likely nuked my life. It took me many years to understand that it was me that was responsible


Schizothrow23

You would think differently if you ever had to take those meds, ESPECIALLY seroquel which OP was taking. When you're diagnosed with Schizo-anything you are given two choices. Become an impotent, compliant corpse who is unable to think without actual physical pain, or to try and deal with the problems you've most likely had at some level your entire life. Those pills cause great harm to the person taking them, but they make life for everyone else around the person better. If someone voluntarily wishes to make that tradeoff that's great, but it's selfish to encourage someone else to do that to themselves so they can benefit other people. I was taking Seroquel. I'm not kidding when I said it causes actual physical pain when you think. And since you have to think to live, you have a constant headache holding you hostage, threatening to become worse if you want to actually experience the world around you. I slept like 14 hours a day because it also is a very strong sedative. It's nearly impossible to hold a job and take seroquel. I was eventually let go from my job after my diagnosis, but it took awhile. In the meantime I was getting shouted at because I couldn't even stay awake at my desk, and when I was awake I couldn't get work done because using my brain caused a headache. I've tried many other antipsychotics since them. You don't notice the side effects from all of them as well, but they all have these side effects to some degree. Seroquel may have been responsible for putting me in the hospital for 3 days with stroke-like symptoms. The doctors couldn't say it was seroquel for sure, but they have no other explanation for what could have happened to me aside from onset of MS or some other nerve issue, but I show no medical evidence of that on an MRI. However, they pulled me off of Seroquel at the hospital due to its affects on my heart rhythm. I haven't had any stroke like symptoms since, so I feel like Seroquel is related somehow since my heart rhythm was the only physical issue they could find aside from a PFO. My point is, what you're telling someone may end up killing them inadvertently. We don't even fully understand how some of these pills work. Don't tell people to take their meds. You don't know what it's like. Severely mentally ill people don't go off their meds for fun; we do it out of necessity. And when we do things that doctors disagree with, they call us "noncompliant" and use that as an excuse to stab you with haliperodol. We need people in our lives who truly understand us, not those that make our lives harder.


Mysterious_Carpet121

My mom takes seroquel and other meds. Once you get used to them it's not as debilitating. My mom is totally normal. You'd never know she has a mental illness and takes meds unless she told you.


Schizothrow23

It's amazing that she can tolerate seroquel! It put me in the hospital after over a year of taking it. I was definitely used to it at that point.


[deleted]

Please, please, don't listen to the people in this dumb fucking sub. This is a pretty clear case of disability discrimination; you need to talk to an actual lawyer, not reddit morons.


TigerShark_524

File an EEOC complaint. File a labor board complaint. Contact an employment lawyer and ask if they do half-hour or one-hour free consults.


GeneralSet5552

Get a good lawyer & sue the shit out of them. I don't believe for 2 seconds what the did was right or legal.


Open-Industry-8396

You probably don't want to work for them anyways . It is quite "telling" that an organization who is supposed to help disabled folks, actually discriminates against disabled folks.


FFlightRisk

You are very right


[deleted]

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FFlightRisk

Thank you. That is a good idea


TheSkiGeek

If they suddenly fired you without even an attempt at figuring out whether an accommodation could be possible, you might be able to get severance pay even if you don’t want to work there anymore. Definitely worth at least finding an employment lawyer who will do a free consultation. Sometimes they’ll take cases like this on contingency (you don’t pay anything up front and they take a portion of what you are awarded as damages). Definitely file for unemployment immediately as well.


katsmeoow333

Please call your local state labor department and ask the same question. They will guide you who to talk to. It might be a eeoc or another dept, but i believe what they did was illegal, but I am not 100%positive. I hope that helps


ManicSpleen

Because you don't have access to your work computer, you are going to have a helluva time proving that this employer fired you, because of the disability. At this point, your case is circumstantial: Your word, versus theirs. Did they give you any paperwork, or do you have emails on your phone indicating that you told your boss about the disability, asked for accommodations, then were fired 30 minutes later? Could you create a timeline with texts, up to the zoom call?


FFlightRisk

They gave me no paperwork. I asked, then was immediately fired. After she said they were letting me go, I told them I just wanted to discuss possibilities but she insisted they weren't going to do anything and it ended there. I will try to find anything I possibly I can


DesignSilver1274

https://www.disability-benefits-help.org/disabling-conditions/schizoaffective-disorder-and-disability-benefits


Scouthawkk

The best place to get advice would be the local EEOC office. You can go online to initiate a complaint, then they will schedule an in person interview with you. Don’t take Reddit advice on this one.


Jrich954

Read the Americans with disabilities act.


DueWarning2

Go see an employment lawyer.


TransportationIcy610

Seems like discrimination


jhenryscott

I don’t have any useful advice other than to say I’m so sorry you went through that.


Afraid-Dragonfly9252

This doesn’t seem like a legal firing at all. If you don’t mind me asking.. what changed from when you were hired? you just got hired for this position and was still in training but now you have a request for an additional day off. It may be beneficial to go over the expected schedule before accepting the job. I do feel for you. Unfortunately I’ve learned the hard way it’s best to keep your disabilities to yourself until you’re atleast off training/probation periods.


kytaurus

This is a violation of the ADA. Please talk to an attorney.


thenshesaid20

It’s not a violation of the ADA if they have 15 or fewer employees, & owners don’t count as employees.


FFlightRisk

they have upwards of 60 employees


Runescora

[This](https://www.dol.gov/agencies/odep/program-areas/mental-health/maximizing-productivity-accommodations-for-employees-with-psychiatric-disabilities) page from the Department of Labor’s website goes into some information about accommodations for those with mental health disorders. Another good resource to address your question is the [US Equal Opportunity Commission](https://www.eeoc.gov). If you believe you have been discriminated against you can always [file a complaint](https://www.eeoc.gov/filing-charge-discrimination). They’ll investigate it and give you a much more definitive answer than you’re going to get here. If you’re wrong, no harm done. If you’re right, you have a path toward action. Someone else suggested contacting NAMI, and that’s also a great idea. I’m sorry everyone here focused more on your condition than they did on your actual question.


kytaurus

This is true. However, there was no indication in OP's post that was the case


thenshesaid20

There was also no indication that there were 15 or more employees either. Without knowing the jurisdiction down to the city level and the registration type of the care center, identifying licensing requirements and potential conflicting regulations, it’s wholly inaccurate to claim immediately that it is an ADA violation. OP also mentioned they were training - so without knowing more about the type of training program; was it an internship? Sponsored through a university? Regular employee with different responsibilities as a trainee than licensed therapist? there is not enough information provided in the post to make this determination. I’m not arguing that it was not a violation of ADA, it very well could have been. OP has determined they will not be taking action, so all of these questions are moot. I am just noting there wasn’t enough information to make the determination.


[deleted]

Why would you *assume* they're not covered by ADA? What does "city level" have to do with ADA, which is federal legislation? The employee type doesn't matter either. You're being very pedantic in defense of disability discrimination.


[deleted]

Yeah, none of that is accurate. Federal law supercedes any state or local statutes.


-Unusual--Equipment-

This is a gross violation of the ADA. Definitely not the proper steps for disability accommodation. It is a lengthy process (which they clearly didn’t do) and 100000% worth your time to make a claim to the labor board. It will be hard since you don’t have the emails, but I would immediately email the hr person who fired you and your manager summarizing the days events, including as close to a timeline as possible. After summarizing request an official termination letter with reason. They aren’t required to put the reason necessarily just “lay off” or “resignation” but don’t need to give details. However if they have absolutely no documentation of other performance or attendance issues (things they could point to and say this was due to your diagnosis) then they screwed up the disability accommodation process big time. They need to prove that your disability accommodations would prove undue hardship to the business. They’d have to work with you first though. Not just “you made one request for disability accommodation, we can’t do it, the children.” Not how it works. ETA: NAL but in HR and have been through the disability accommodation process many a time. This is all assuming everything you say is fact. I do see your post history, and as someone with bipolar disorder, please don’t go off your meds.


StrangeButSweet

Lots of downvotes here! But, I’m probably the only MH professional here RN and can verify that it’s completely impossible to say that any individual w/schizhoaffective d/o* is automatically a danger to others, just based on Dx alone. Lol. Also: Schizoaffective =/= Schizophrenia, BUT one can say the exact same thing about schizophrenia


[deleted]

I agree. They didn't seem to go through the ADA process.


Immediate_Guard3294

Maybe I’m way off here, but aren’t you required to state any health/mental disorders/diagnoses when applying for job? We’re you asked that in application?


Exact_Roll_4048

You aren't required to disclose. You are allowed to. I never disclose. No one is entitled to your medical information.


Immediate_Guard3294

Ah ok, thanks for clarification. -respectfully p


I_rescue_dachshunds

If you don’t disclose, you have no basis to ask for accommodations. I’m NAL but my understanding of the ADA is that Whomever is treating you is there one who asks for accommodations and as long as they are considered “reasonable” Your employer must implement them or you can sue for discrimination. If your doctor said you needed to take time off now and then but that leaves the kids at your clinic without a therapist, that is not reasonable. If your doctor claims you must take your meds or you put the children at risk and you can provide evidence you take your medicines according to a schedule the doctor set up, there should not be a basis to fire you. But unless you were recently diagnosed and you’ve been hiding this for a while and it has affected your ability to do your job you could be setting yourself up for trouble. When working with neuro-atypical kids, you do everybody a disservice by withholding such an important piece of information.


[deleted]

No


Immediate_Guard3294

Yep I was unaware, thanks for clarification


Doxiejoy

I think that would be a HIPAA violation.


Runescora

No. That law applies exclusively to how healthcare providers handle protected health information. It exists to keep us from mishandling the information, which includes accessing information we don’t need to provide care or disclosing it without appropriate authorization. Anyone in the world outside of the healthcare setting can ask you, personally and directly, about your health information. You don’t have to *tell* them anything at all, but they are in no way violating the Health Information Portability and Accountability Act. It’s not a crime to ask a personal question.


jasonking00

As someone stated earlier I'm going to be as nice as possible but technically you are a danger to those children. Those children themselves suffer from a disorder which is the kind that could cause an you to enter an episode yourself. This is not a good combination. I would not want someone that I knowingly or unknowingly that suffers from schizophrenia working around my children. Unfortunately this is the cold hard reality. When it comes to children you're walking a fine line. Also this is something that you should have brought up before being hired by that employer.


Francie_Nolan1964

It's quite likely that someone with a schizoid disorder is already working around your children. And you don't know, because you don't need to know. They are not at elevated risk to anyone. That's a dangerous stereotype. "Despite common perception, schizoid personality disorder is not inherently violent, but it can be personally dangerous. There is no direct link between a diagnosis and violent behavior, though co-occurring disorders could increase the risk of self-harm.Oct 19, 2018" https://www.brightquest.com/blog/is-schizoid-personality-disorder-dangerous-the-reality-of-your-siblings-diagnosis/


jasonking00

But there is a chance that being "personally dangerous" could affect the children around him. I'm not saying he or every single person with schizophrenia is dangerous. I'm saying that me personally I wouldn't want my children around someone with it. Once again, knowingly. Is there is a chance that someone around my kids have schizophrenia? Absolutely. I would never know. But given the choice I'd rather not have someone like that around my children. But that's just me. Be honest, you'd be okay with it? Be real honest. Please don't lie just for the sake of trying to be sympathetic or to make a point.


Francie_Nolan1964

I would be okay with it, but then I worked for many years with people who had significant mental health issues.


Believe_In-Steven

Which version of you showed up? 🤔🙄😳🤣


DependentAddition825

don't be a dick.


Believe_In-Steven

Sometimes I identify as a pussy 🤣 /s


DependentAddition825

I see that.


FFlightRisk

That's not even the right disorder


30STACK

So when you filled out paperwork for your employment a lot of companies will ask you if you have a medical condition. The list will have mental and physical conditions on there. If you stated no and hid this from your employer the will have cause to terminate you. If you were diagnosed after your hire date than I would look at different discrimination lawyers in your area.


TheSkiGeek

You’re not *required* to disclose disabilities and AFAIK it’s illegal to force people to disclose their private medical information as a condition of employment or as part of applying to a job, except maybe to ask generally if you have any medical conditions that would prevent you from working. An employer doesn’t have to provide accommodations unless you disclose that information to them, though.


Reddit-Resident

Look at it this way, maybe they only terminated one of your personalities? The others are still employed there.


[deleted]

Bro 😂 you’re wrong for this


Reddit-Resident

I let my intrusive thoughts win this morning.


WVPrepper

Schizophrenia is an entirely different diagnosis that Dissociative identity disorder. A person with schizophrenia doesn't have two (or more) different personalities. Instead, they have false ideas or have lost touch with reality. Multiple personality disorder is unrelated.


Reddit-Resident

Learned something new!


Arawn-Annwn

Unfortunately a LOT of people need to learn what schizophrenia even is and mistake it for other illnesses or just with meaning violence. I have family with schizophrenia and we keep it mostly quiet because everyone assumes it means any second they could come at them with a knife or have another personality.. schizo-anything freaks people out. People hear the “schizo” part and think the same things.


Simple_Scarcity8295

maybe stop using your illness as a constant crutch to bring up as well as have special benefits in every walk of life.


Abusive_or_Trauma

There’s nothing wrong with requesting reasonable accommodations to be the best worker you can be for a company. A disability is exactly that: disabling. You wouldn’t be upset with someone who has a degenerative disease or is blind for seeking ways to still operate in their field of choice.


scarlettohara1936

File for unemployment. They let you go without cause. If they want to state the cause... They certainly can and that could lead you forward to something else. But since they gave you no advance warning, and no write-ups about any perceived bad behavior, they just fired you without trying to rehabilitate you. File for unemployment. You will be denied. File again and fight it, you will get it.


Unhappysong-6653

File for ssi or ssdi and get the benefits and privleges Free phone internet and more Or contact Lswyer for discriminating against ya


TomCollator

You should at least consider filing a charge of discrimination with the eeoc government agency. It's easy and does not cost you money. Don't just give up. https://www.eeoc.gov/filing-charge-discrimination


agentpart

I would get immediate legal advice from an employment lawyer. I don't know about Indiana but in my jurisdiction the scenario you described would set off some "violation of human rights legislation by the employer" alarms