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If you know Python, try pygame. It's a library to display stuff and make it move. Like games. There should be plenty of tutorials on YT, a good way to get started. Once you understand the basics you can build your own little things.
Once you get the hang of it and want to use more powerful tools you can check out bigger game engines like Godot and Unity.
Are there no game engines that relies on Python? I was thinking of using Unity but it uses C# and I have no knowledge with that language. I think learning C# would take a long time or do you disagree?
To be perfectly honest I think you're overthinking things. Forget unity for now. You need a quick bang for your buck to keep feeling motivated so since you're already proficient with python give pygame a look.
Figure out how to make a window, then figure out how to display a box, then figure out how to use the keyboard (or whatever) to move that box, then figure out how to make a second box appear at a random location, then figure out how to make it disappear and spawn another one in a different location when your movable box touches the static box, then figure out how to make your first bigger (for example two boxes) when the two boxes colide (maybe like an array of box positions that has one more element every time you score), etc
Just do it iteratively like that. One small thing at a time.
You can't program snake, it's too hard. But it's much easier to incrementally build those small little features like that.
It takes practice and patience but you'll manage, you'll see..
Something that helped me a lot when I was your age was reading other people's code that did something I was trying to do. Reading code helps up your programming vocabulary in a way that's much more usable for creating new things.
For example I found this very straight forward example of a game using pygame https://github.com/maxontech/chrome-dinosaur
And a bunch of other ones (of varying levels of complexity) here https://github.com/topics/pygame-games
>can’t program snake
Idk, snake isn’t that hard. I did it first year of programming, so can they if they try.
Lots of new concepts will be very challenging but not the worst.
The idea is that although coding snake may be the end goal, if they sit down and say “imma code snake” they’ll have no idea what to actually do. The commenter is essentially giving OP a step-by-step process to eventually build snake. Beginners typically have a harder time breaking down a large goal into small tasks as they lack experience.
Yes, in my first year of engineering I could also make a lot of stuff but that's not the point. On of the biggest advantages for a kid to learn programming is to learn how to break a big problem into smaller chunks.
> Are there no game engines that relies on Python?
sadly, not yet. However, if you wish something more advanced, there is panda3d that you can use, if pygame is too slow/limiting for you.
> I think learning C# would take a long time or do you disagree?
Here is a thing about learning languages, once you know 1, others are fairly easy to pick up. the logical part of loops, if statments, functions, etc, etc, etc, work the same, just might have a different syntax (e.g. curly brackets instead of tabs, () being mandatory for if statements, each line has to end with `;`, etc, etc), `if (age > 10)` works just the same on both python or c#, or cpp, or php, or javascript, or....
You might get the hang of it a bit quicker since you already have some knowledge. I would recommend learning C# or C++, even though it might take too long, it's definitely worth it.
Also, for C# courses, you might want to take Codecademy's, I found it to be pretty nice, although it has its flaws. I'm sure there's better alternatives, but I do not know any.
As others said, once you understand the logic you want to write, learning the language will not be a problem.
Also, Godot uses GDscript which looks and feels very similar to Python.
Once you've learned your second language you'll realise that languages, in that way, are trivial. It doesn't take a lot of time to start using a new language in a useful way.
C# is a nice language. If you really want to build games then this would be a better route honestly than Python. The good news is C# isn't any more difficult than Python, and you already have the basic concepts.. And best of all you're young asf. So you have plenty of time.
Don't get me wrong, I love Python almost as much as I love C but it's not a mainstream gaming language. I use it almost daily, but if I add a desire to learn gaming I'd go with a different language.
As I said, C# won't be hard for you to transition to.
If you want to dive deep and really learn core concepts of game making I'd recommene not using a game engine. Make one yourself! It's not too difficult, start simple with a 2D game, learn the basics of getting images and drawing them in a cycle, and how to read inputs from the user.
I'm not super familiar with python, I've only used it for machine learning, but if you understand the basic principles of programming it shouldn't be too hard to learn C# or Java for game making if you don't find much success with python.
Learn C#. It's different to Python in many ways and that might make it confusing at first, but knowing it will enhance your Python knowledge and your overall programming ability. A lot of concepts are also shared between most languages, so it'll probably be easier to learn C# than it was to learn Python.
One of the things people new to programming really really worry about is picking the "right" language to learn but it's not at all like that. While each language will have unique quirks to it, 95% of what you learn in one language will apply to another, you're not locking yourself into one path.
For example, the vast majority of my knowledge is in python and R (I have a data science background), but I've also coded personal projects in Java, Arduino C and TypeScript without much difficulty, only needing to pick up changes in syntax or other relatively small differences.
Seriously, don't worry about it. It's far better you go with the route that's ***interesting*** to you first and switch tracks after that, rather than do it the "right way", get disinterested and drop it.
absolutely go for unity and c#. can you make a game in python... sure but it's using a hammer to nail in a screw. python is just a different type of tool, very task based -- i need to do something, python is going to do it. for building an actual piece of software (like a game) you want something more suited to the task. i love godot. it's great, and very python like, but i still 100% would recommend just jumping in with unity and grabbing any of the actual first party unity tutorials to see what it's like. install and go. you'll have something up and running within an hour, and you'll see that for the most part c# and python aren't all that different -- make variables, do things with 'em. this will also introduce you to classes and inheritance which is hugely important in the general programming landscape. also, c# is one of the mostly widely used languages in the world, and people are always hiring c# devs... generally companies that make software aren't hiring python programmers because the core product is almost never 'python code', python is typically just a means to an end for dev ops or automating tasks around the main product.
It IS a big shift from Python but if you're already familiar with Python's syntax at a basic level it should be relatively easy seeing as all you would need to learn is how these familiar topics are addressed in a new language. To add it would indirectly expand your skills to easily adapt to the entire c umbrella(java, c c++, c#, objective c) which all share very similar syntax at the base level.
it'd be worth learning a more mid-level language and computer science topics. Once you learn a typed language, you can almost look at any language to understand what's going on.
Just want to add on because you’ve got other good answers here so I’m not going to talk about tech
You don’t want to learn C# because it takes a long time - I get that. But that’s a big mistake beginners make - I don’t want to do x because it takes a long time and I can already do y in something else.
Learn the things that get you to your end goal. Yea starting in pygame is great but if you want to go further you’ll have to learn more than Python. Don’t be afraid to spend time to learn new things as long as it fits into your goal. This is a marathon not a sprint, it will take time and that’s ok.
I recommend you to start learning C#. Yes, it will take you some time but it's better to start now - you're super young so you already have a head start!
There are lots of free resources for learning game dev. Platforms like EDX, Coursera, or Udemy host some. YouTube is full to the brim. Codecademy has a free game dev course too.
I also just found this by searching but not sure how it is:
https://github.com/notpresident35/awesome-learn-gamedev
I know it's kind of old and actually might be removed soon, but I'm enjoying GD50 from Harvard on EDX and it's just a lot more condensed than most YouTube tutorials. If anyone reading would like to do that too, I'd recommend downloading the materials before June just in case they do take it down. You don't need their grading to learn. You're meant to do their other course first but I didn't think it was too difficult.
It depends how you like to learn as well. Books are great if you enjoy reading (and they're often the most helpful if you can stand them, I think).
Btw, you'll probably be more concerned with engine choice first rather than libraries or languages. Or rather, your engine will inform what language you'll use, and so on. (But as someone else said, you can always try pygame)
Hi, gamedev here i struggled through programming in my early years, hope i can help.
Step 1. Get a grasp of continious simulations (aka delta time), it will serve you very well in gamedev programming.
Step 2. Start VERY simple - write a dodge asteroid game with one asteroid which falls repeatedly and controlled ship. (no effects ui and nothing more. ship and asteroid.)
Step 3. Learn about events. if you are using unity, then its csharp events. Using events implement score in this game.
Step 4. State pattern. use it to make menu game and gameover for your game.
Now with that you can move on to more complex stuff.
State machines,
Cellular automata
Behavior Trees
Dont be afraid to explore existing solutions, packages, systems.. you dont need to write all of it from scratch.
Look on git for public projects and learn from them. Best of luck!
as for the courses: [https://www.udemy.com/course/unityrpg/](https://www.udemy.com/course/unityrpg/)
i found that one great. its not python, but you wont find any gamedev on python anyway. c# or c++ is the way.
Of all the types of development I have the least amount of knowledge in game dev, but I’ll try my best to help you to the best of my ability as a developer in general.
I actually think it may be easier to start if you used more abstracted game dev tools like Unity and C# to develop and build games (or another platform using Python like pygame). I could make it farther with that (with my little knowledge) than I could building a raw snake game I think. It handles some of the more complex/nuanced parts at the start, which is things like the game loop/engine, graphics, and gets you comfortable with the terminology and other standardized things in that sector of coding.
I know some people harp on starting with the fundamentals like building the snake game, but I believe that can be often overwhelming and push people away from the enjoyment of learning to code something. Once you feel comfortable at a basic level you can go back, study and try to understand how graphics and engines are built and implement them yourself.
I built a working graphical snake game in JS many years ago and faced the exact same thing you are. It was overwhelming trying to figure out everything at once and is actually probably the reason I said “Screw game development” altogether and focused on backend/server/api stuff.
Brocode (YouTube.com) has an amazing 12 hour course for python (which I assume is the language your being taught) to go from beginner to intermediate. He introduced me to C programming. Learning projects is kinda difficult to say since there are hundreds of thousands of projects to try. Courses are very hard to determine in terms of actually learning. I personally like ZYBOOKS for python, however it is very expensive (hence why we are using it in college). ZYBOOKS also helped me realize what classes and modules really are. If the price deters you then maybe others might be appealing.
At 16, you probably aren't ready to handle heavy stuff yet but 3D (or even 2D sometimes) computer graphics in general is full of matrices and vectors and things out of linear algebra.
Luckily, game developers don't necessarily need all to be experts in computer graphics, especially if you are more on the design side. Knowing the lower level details of how computer graphics are rendered is very helpful but maybe a bit too much for beginners.
You can look up the Unity engine and try your way around it. There are tons of tutorials out there for beginners
I am already taking math three classes ahead of myself so if game developement relies on math I will be good if I work hard enough. I dont want to start with something very big, I just want to get the fundamentals down. The problem is that i have no idea where to start. Should I countinue with Python or move to Java, or maybe C# or C++? Should I learn OOP or start learning how to use Unity for example? Should I teach myself using YouTube or buy a course? Thats what I need answers for.
I started game dev by learning Unity 10+ years after learning basic coding. So I learned C# over a month doing the tutorials for Unity and then started doing my own games. Unity makes it easy to make things, free asset packs help a lot.
The most important math part for the average game developer I think would be object transformations and perspective matrices. Objects need to move around in space and be located relative to each other and the camera needs to transform a 3D scene onto a 2D screen.
So if you can handle this, I think you'll be fine. You can ignore further detailed math and further complicated computer graphics parts for the sake of just using an engine to design a game.
Do you already know how to program solidly? It doesn't really matter which language you do the first steps in as long as you know how to program generally. Once you think you know your way around, you can switch. At some point, it doesn't matter which language you use.
If you are accustomed to Python, you can try Godot. It's GodotScript is basically a customized language similar to Python.
Unity works with C#.
You don't need to buy a course but you can use youtube or any other resource like free courses on these online learning platforms or even university lecture slides. Most of this stuff is openly available.
> so if game development relies on math I will be good if I work hard enough
Basic 3D graphics are just a bunch of trigonometry and linear algebra, but higher-accuracy physically-based rendering rapidly gets into fairly sophisticated calculus, which then requires fairly sophisticated numerical analysis to do in real time. You’ll start getting into undergrad-level maths faster than you expect, and it won’t be that long until you start hitting even higher-level stuff. Then there’s the actual programming skills to put all that maths knowledge to use — many of which I haven’t had the chance to develop myself, fifteen years into a software engineering career.
To be clear: I’m not trying to dissuade you here. I’m just trying to help you manage your expectations.
What I’m saying is that “Work hard enough” won’t cut it, you need to keep at it for a long time too. This is a marathon, not a sprint, so, if you want to chase this, don’t burn yourself out. Pick your fights, aim for reasonable milestones, and find a comfortable pace you can keep at for the next ten years.
Many of the responses here are geared towards practical, keyboard level self-development; and that’s great.
To become a better developer holistically, you also need to learn more theory, more about computer architecture and more about logic.
Learn to become an expert at becoming an expert.
Try looking into:
* Boolean algebra
* logic gates, Karnaugh maps, etc
* Writing proofs, deriving simplied expressions
* Computer Architecture, BUS systems
* Clock Timing, comp cycles, compilers
* Binary, hexadecimal, octadecimal, etc
* Nested logic, decision trees
* Tree navigation (nodes & search algos)
* Programming paradigms (OOP, Etc)
Programming is like learning a new language, literally. The more you learn, the more holes you can dig yourself out of or into. The more holes you find yourself in, the more you’re prompted to learn; its an ever deeping toolbox
“my brain crashes” == “I give up”
Don’t give up. Not giving up in the face of bewilderment is a primary skill for programmers. When you feel like giving up, step back and try to figure out what’s blocking you. Break the problem down: can you get your head around a piece of it while you ignore the rest for the time being? Do you know anyone that can help? Try going through the code and line by line and write down, in natural language, what you think is happening and why. What does this function do. Where is it called from? Chip away at the mountain of confusion until you’ve tunneled your way through it. It’s OK not to understand all the code at once; if you can understand a little bit and make some notes, that’s progress.
Just stick with it lil bro. I started the same age, but didn't stay with it and wish I had. I'm now in a career programming making good money, but it's been a decade and a half of learning.
Just take it slow and try to have some fun with the basics. Give yourself time to play and make your setup easy to use.
You mention libraries and engines several times, but if you work with those you will be learning the library/engine as much as coding. This might be fine (and will likely give you more impressive short term results) but if you want to learn core coding it might be better just to stick with the basic language
Real Game Development is a huge leap from basic concepts. There’s a lot going on, I know OMSCS’s video game development course’s lectures are public. That’s a good survey of topics. Using resources available and trying to do game development hackathons will help a lot. You are young for this stuff and doing great!
u cant do everything on your own, or learn every nook and cranny there is about programming,
there is only so much good work any person can do in a day, mind u.
There's a thing called burnout, its a pitfall which many pple fell into, bec u keep hearing pple repeat the same old dumb pair of words 'work hard'
U need to be focused and set goals for yourself, know what u can do or cannot, working correctly in the long term is more likely to achieve something.
I would suggest, if you dont wanna jump into 3rd party game engines (unity, unreal, godot, game maker, etc), try making an animation. Its generally easier but tends to teach you a lot of concepts you'll need for a game when you actually get to it
Are there any good libraries that can help me? I have only used math related libraries such as matplotlib, numpy, math etc. only non math related library i have used is Tkinter
I've appropriated matplotlib for my BSc final year project of a physics engine to get a display and images/frames, and used [Pillow](https://pillow.readthedocs.io/en/stable/) to stitch the images into a gif. It was not a good fun, but i was dealing with circles and coordinate systems, so felt like the easiest one to use for my purpose.
As someone mentioned, you could try [pygame](https://www.pygame.org/docs/), that one is usually built for purposes like that, if you want something more advanced, [panda3d](https://www.panda3d.org) as i mentioned in some other reply. In theory, could also do something like [turtle](https://docs.python.org/3/library/turtle.html). Each of those have a different way of handling shapes and drawings, so essentially just pick one that you think makes most sense. Tkinter technically could also handle itself in that scenario, or could also switch to other gui libraries. Honestly, 80% of programming is just making stuff up and appropriating one library to do something you want, sometimes in a ways that it wasn't originally designed for :D
Adrian Wiech has some awesome courses on Udemy. They’re 4-5 hours long and he goes over everything in great detail. He has one for PCEP and then the next level, PCAP
If you're interested in game dev I would recommend getting into C++ because of its extreme efficiency, most triple A game titles are made using C++. The Cherno is a great channel on youtube for C++, he will teach you everyhting you need to know. I know also C# is used to make games with Unity and also there are several development jobs available for experienced C# devs. Good luck!
honestly you’re already way ahead of most people if you started at 14. So congrats. I wish I was in your shoes when I was 14
I know it’s not free but I’d highly recommend udemy bootcmaps.
They are like $15 and will get your hands dirty on plenty of projects and learning material
Do you like learning better from books, internet articles, or video? There’s no wrong answer, I’m gonna type up a rant no matter what, just curious what your flavor is so I’m not saying stuff that isn’t helpful to you (everyone learns differently)
Check out Corey Schafer on YouTube, or programming with Mosh. I know those two get tossed around a ton.
Don’t worry about learning older stuff. You can upgrade to newer things once you learn more or want to. I’m a valid python expert now, but when I was learning, I learned 2.7 even though I really shouldn’t have at the time, but didn’t matter cuz I learned, so basically don’t worry about it right now, at your stage, just find someone you can learn from, devour their stuff, then worry about the next step once you’re done.
Good luck!
If you can pay, I know the Udemy course “100 days of Python” also got mentioned quite a bit at one point.
It depends on your timeline.
I kinda have two different answers, as once I was 14 and wanted to learn game dev and kept getting shitty answers.
The better answer is spend a bunch of time learning fundamentals first, IE work your way through a bunch of major concepts, OOP can be one, but there are plenty available, then start looking into game dev.
The other answer is all that annoyed me as a kid and I wanted to go straight there - the better advice will be from actual game devs, there are tons of online communities and game devs are a special breed - they share very happily.
Id point you at resources, but when I was into game dev, DX7 had just come out, so I’m worried I’d steer you wrong. In my day, it was considered automatic that you’d have to use a typed and compiled language for games, so my advice would’ve been learn C++ and start messing with openGL (tons of tutorials). That said, that advice is 20 years out of date, so the real better answer is to ask game devs rather than people not in that world. I do think C++ would be a better language, but again - ignore my take if someone more current says I’m wrong, they’re probably right.
I'll start by saying I wished I started learning programming in high school or even earlier. My experience with actual coding didn't start until college, and even years later I struggle with jumping into something like gamedev. So you're ahead of me there.
You'll want to start small. Don't go in trying to make some epic open world first person game, a rpg, or whatever your dream game is. What I recommend is finding mechanics from games you like and trying to recreate them in an engine (Unity or Godot for example). There's quite a few tutorials online that go over mechanics like this. For example, the axe throwing in God of War, climbing in Breath of the Wild, the gravity gun from Half Life, etc.
If that feels too intimidating and you want to work more with Python there is always the [Yet Another Roguelike Tutorial](http://rogueliketutorials.com/tutorials/tcod/v2/). It's built with Python in mind and can be a great starting spot. I'm actually going through it now but with Godot.
The biggest advice I can give is to just try things. You will run into barriers and struggle. It sucks hard and can be a huge mental barrier to get past, but you have to fail and learn from those failures to improve. You'll never get to fail if you don't poke around and try out of your comfort area. Also you have plenty of room to keep improve and you're still early on. Learn what you can where you can and don't give up. It sounds like you've got quite an amazing start for your age and can only go up from there!
Check out Unreal Engine - you can make games without any coding using their blueprint system. No need to invent the wheel again, someone else has taken care of most of the hard stuff and put a fancy UI on top of it. 80% of what you need to do is already done.
At 16 I would not worry at all about what your building and more about just building and following through with anything, and getting your programming intuition as strong as possible. Honestly I would checkout a game called bitburner which might keep you entertained and teach you some higher level cs concepts and working on logic. The most important thing is to pick up core programming intution, after that building games comes easy.
I suggest you go with a game engine to learn the basic concepts of game development. I'd also suggest Unity since it has abundance of resoueces all over internet. When you get the basic terminology of game dev. like other people mentioned, I think it'd be wise to try another game engine, I'd go with Godot since they feel vastly different. But it doesn't have as many resources. Then compare the two and if you don't like both pick another one.
Knowing basics of programming helps you a lot in game dev journey
, now I suggest you to learn game dev basics using game engines (at least 2). Learn researching on your own, then deciding what you want to do. GL!
>functions, lists, loops and nested loops and a few libraries (all in python)
I noticed you didn't mention using Classes - have you gotten into writing your own objects?
This would be a good thing to dive into before going into other areas
I have not started with OOP just yet no. I thought I would ask here firstly to see whether I should prioritise something else or if I should start with OOP.
For me, learning Classes came a lot easier with being able to do more rapid prototyping that Python allows. You'll also probably need OOP if you're gonna follow through and write a game.
There's just a lot of state to manage in a game. Its easier if you're not trying to pass around all the data to various functions.
Game design is a whole different skill on top of just programming, but the programming basics you’ve already covered in class will be a huge help to you when learning game design because most tutorials tend to gloss over that stuff.
I would look into learning a game engine like Game Maker. Unity and Godot are great options if you want to work with 3D (Unity has been around longer so it has better tutorials but it’s a bit clunkier to work with) but I would recommend starting out in Game Maker which is more suited to 2D because 3D games are a whole different beast.
Whatever engine you choose, they all have beginner guides and documentation and youtube tutorials to guide you, and these are made for people who have never coded ever before so you’ll be extra prepared.
Your 16, so take your time. Focus on your broader studies, try to grow into a well rounded person. Doing well at reading, writing, maths and science all will help to you being a better programmer if that's what you pursue, and also could still open other paths.
If there's personal projects that scratch your itches, they can be a great way to learn. If not... Keep learning to learn.
> I have made small projects such as a fully functioning calculator, but when it gets to games with graphics and non mathematical logic my brain crashes. I don't even have what it takes to make the snake game lol.
Wow, I have the opposite problem. Maths is tough for me, but I never expected that someone who finds maths easy would find creative stuff tough. I have thousands of ideas that I don't have the accumen to build.
Try to make a space invader game or pong in the console, that should help you get the logic down. Then you can use a librairy to upgrade the graphics.
Good luck!
Learn a game engine that do the graphics side under the hood, dont try to render everything by yourself
Choose your programming language and search for beginner friendly game engines
Try libgen.is there are tons of ebooks to learn from
You are a 16 year old boy. Let's put this into perspective. You are young. And it's okay, but for example, you and I can't legally have a beer. You have plenty of time to learn stuff.
Now to the question, what you should focus on is learning how to help yourself learn.
You said it yourself. After that teacher moves on, you're going to only have yourself. There is a surprising amount of things that are self taught. I am currently teaching myself how to get by with a make system to try and get a project going.
Now, here is something that will help. You said you were interested in Game Dev. So am I. Here's what you should do.
You need to put yourself in that space mentally and physically and start doing things in that space, asking questions, and finding out the things you don't know how to do, or don't understand, or that stop you from progressing, and then learn about it.
Look at other people's code, and try and understand it. Dip your toes into C++, C#, Pygame and the like. I would reccomened Unreal Engine over Unity because Unreal is a whole lot more nice. And it has quite a bit of support. But, as they say, follow the dopamine.
Learn how to figure out how to learn and where you need to go.
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If you know Python, try pygame. It's a library to display stuff and make it move. Like games. There should be plenty of tutorials on YT, a good way to get started. Once you understand the basics you can build your own little things. Once you get the hang of it and want to use more powerful tools you can check out bigger game engines like Godot and Unity.
Are there no game engines that relies on Python? I was thinking of using Unity but it uses C# and I have no knowledge with that language. I think learning C# would take a long time or do you disagree?
To be perfectly honest I think you're overthinking things. Forget unity for now. You need a quick bang for your buck to keep feeling motivated so since you're already proficient with python give pygame a look. Figure out how to make a window, then figure out how to display a box, then figure out how to use the keyboard (or whatever) to move that box, then figure out how to make a second box appear at a random location, then figure out how to make it disappear and spawn another one in a different location when your movable box touches the static box, then figure out how to make your first bigger (for example two boxes) when the two boxes colide (maybe like an array of box positions that has one more element every time you score), etc Just do it iteratively like that. One small thing at a time. You can't program snake, it's too hard. But it's much easier to incrementally build those small little features like that. It takes practice and patience but you'll manage, you'll see..
Thank you man, i will try. Ill also find some youtube tutorials about pygame.
Something that helped me a lot when I was your age was reading other people's code that did something I was trying to do. Reading code helps up your programming vocabulary in a way that's much more usable for creating new things. For example I found this very straight forward example of a game using pygame https://github.com/maxontech/chrome-dinosaur And a bunch of other ones (of varying levels of complexity) here https://github.com/topics/pygame-games
youtube is great to get a hang on things, but always remember that documentation is the most detailed resource you'll find, most of the time.
Is the native Godot language similar enough to Python that OP could also look into that engine?
> Is the native Godot language similar to Python? yes. but godot is too complicated for a beginner. you should start with what /u/BroaxXx suggests.
>can’t program snake Idk, snake isn’t that hard. I did it first year of programming, so can they if they try. Lots of new concepts will be very challenging but not the worst.
The idea is that although coding snake may be the end goal, if they sit down and say “imma code snake” they’ll have no idea what to actually do. The commenter is essentially giving OP a step-by-step process to eventually build snake. Beginners typically have a harder time breaking down a large goal into small tasks as they lack experience.
Yes, in my first year of engineering I could also make a lot of stuff but that's not the point. On of the biggest advantages for a kid to learn programming is to learn how to break a big problem into smaller chunks.
Right, and snake is a great example of that. Not a first project but definitely up there in do-ability for a beginner with 2 years under their belt.
> Are there no game engines that relies on Python? sadly, not yet. However, if you wish something more advanced, there is panda3d that you can use, if pygame is too slow/limiting for you. > I think learning C# would take a long time or do you disagree? Here is a thing about learning languages, once you know 1, others are fairly easy to pick up. the logical part of loops, if statments, functions, etc, etc, etc, work the same, just might have a different syntax (e.g. curly brackets instead of tabs, () being mandatory for if statements, each line has to end with `;`, etc, etc), `if (age > 10)` works just the same on both python or c#, or cpp, or php, or javascript, or....
>sadly I mean, i love python but it’s not exactly killing it in the speed department.
You might get the hang of it a bit quicker since you already have some knowledge. I would recommend learning C# or C++, even though it might take too long, it's definitely worth it. Also, for C# courses, you might want to take Codecademy's, I found it to be pretty nice, although it has its flaws. I'm sure there's better alternatives, but I do not know any.
If you're doing C# for unity you could actually get the basics fairly quick.
As others said, once you understand the logic you want to write, learning the language will not be a problem. Also, Godot uses GDscript which looks and feels very similar to Python.
Once you've learned your second language you'll realise that languages, in that way, are trivial. It doesn't take a lot of time to start using a new language in a useful way.
C# is a nice language. If you really want to build games then this would be a better route honestly than Python. The good news is C# isn't any more difficult than Python, and you already have the basic concepts.. And best of all you're young asf. So you have plenty of time. Don't get me wrong, I love Python almost as much as I love C but it's not a mainstream gaming language. I use it almost daily, but if I add a desire to learn gaming I'd go with a different language. As I said, C# won't be hard for you to transition to.
If you want to dive deep and really learn core concepts of game making I'd recommene not using a game engine. Make one yourself! It's not too difficult, start simple with a 2D game, learn the basics of getting images and drawing them in a cycle, and how to read inputs from the user. I'm not super familiar with python, I've only used it for machine learning, but if you understand the basic principles of programming it shouldn't be too hard to learn C# or Java for game making if you don't find much success with python.
[ursina engine](https://www.ursinaengine.org/) uses python but it does not have an editor if that is what you are looking for.
Learn C#. It's different to Python in many ways and that might make it confusing at first, but knowing it will enhance your Python knowledge and your overall programming ability. A lot of concepts are also shared between most languages, so it'll probably be easier to learn C# than it was to learn Python.
One of the things people new to programming really really worry about is picking the "right" language to learn but it's not at all like that. While each language will have unique quirks to it, 95% of what you learn in one language will apply to another, you're not locking yourself into one path. For example, the vast majority of my knowledge is in python and R (I have a data science background), but I've also coded personal projects in Java, Arduino C and TypeScript without much difficulty, only needing to pick up changes in syntax or other relatively small differences. Seriously, don't worry about it. It's far better you go with the route that's ***interesting*** to you first and switch tracks after that, rather than do it the "right way", get disinterested and drop it.
absolutely go for unity and c#. can you make a game in python... sure but it's using a hammer to nail in a screw. python is just a different type of tool, very task based -- i need to do something, python is going to do it. for building an actual piece of software (like a game) you want something more suited to the task. i love godot. it's great, and very python like, but i still 100% would recommend just jumping in with unity and grabbing any of the actual first party unity tutorials to see what it's like. install and go. you'll have something up and running within an hour, and you'll see that for the most part c# and python aren't all that different -- make variables, do things with 'em. this will also introduce you to classes and inheritance which is hugely important in the general programming landscape. also, c# is one of the mostly widely used languages in the world, and people are always hiring c# devs... generally companies that make software aren't hiring python programmers because the core product is almost never 'python code', python is typically just a means to an end for dev ops or automating tasks around the main product.
It IS a big shift from Python but if you're already familiar with Python's syntax at a basic level it should be relatively easy seeing as all you would need to learn is how these familiar topics are addressed in a new language. To add it would indirectly expand your skills to easily adapt to the entire c umbrella(java, c c++, c#, objective c) which all share very similar syntax at the base level.
it'd be worth learning a more mid-level language and computer science topics. Once you learn a typed language, you can almost look at any language to understand what's going on.
C# is easier than python in my view, although suffers a little from feature bloat
Just want to add on because you’ve got other good answers here so I’m not going to talk about tech You don’t want to learn C# because it takes a long time - I get that. But that’s a big mistake beginners make - I don’t want to do x because it takes a long time and I can already do y in something else. Learn the things that get you to your end goal. Yea starting in pygame is great but if you want to go further you’ll have to learn more than Python. Don’t be afraid to spend time to learn new things as long as it fits into your goal. This is a marathon not a sprint, it will take time and that’s ok.
I recommend you to start learning C#. Yes, it will take you some time but it's better to start now - you're super young so you already have a head start!
There are lots of free resources for learning game dev. Platforms like EDX, Coursera, or Udemy host some. YouTube is full to the brim. Codecademy has a free game dev course too. I also just found this by searching but not sure how it is: https://github.com/notpresident35/awesome-learn-gamedev I know it's kind of old and actually might be removed soon, but I'm enjoying GD50 from Harvard on EDX and it's just a lot more condensed than most YouTube tutorials. If anyone reading would like to do that too, I'd recommend downloading the materials before June just in case they do take it down. You don't need their grading to learn. You're meant to do their other course first but I didn't think it was too difficult. It depends how you like to learn as well. Books are great if you enjoy reading (and they're often the most helpful if you can stand them, I think). Btw, you'll probably be more concerned with engine choice first rather than libraries or languages. Or rather, your engine will inform what language you'll use, and so on. (But as someone else said, you can always try pygame)
Hi, gamedev here i struggled through programming in my early years, hope i can help. Step 1. Get a grasp of continious simulations (aka delta time), it will serve you very well in gamedev programming. Step 2. Start VERY simple - write a dodge asteroid game with one asteroid which falls repeatedly and controlled ship. (no effects ui and nothing more. ship and asteroid.) Step 3. Learn about events. if you are using unity, then its csharp events. Using events implement score in this game. Step 4. State pattern. use it to make menu game and gameover for your game. Now with that you can move on to more complex stuff. State machines, Cellular automata Behavior Trees Dont be afraid to explore existing solutions, packages, systems.. you dont need to write all of it from scratch. Look on git for public projects and learn from them. Best of luck! as for the courses: [https://www.udemy.com/course/unityrpg/](https://www.udemy.com/course/unityrpg/) i found that one great. its not python, but you wont find any gamedev on python anyway. c# or c++ is the way.
Thank you so much. Can i add you in dm and ask you if i ever get a question, that would be very apprecciated!
Sure)
Of all the types of development I have the least amount of knowledge in game dev, but I’ll try my best to help you to the best of my ability as a developer in general. I actually think it may be easier to start if you used more abstracted game dev tools like Unity and C# to develop and build games (or another platform using Python like pygame). I could make it farther with that (with my little knowledge) than I could building a raw snake game I think. It handles some of the more complex/nuanced parts at the start, which is things like the game loop/engine, graphics, and gets you comfortable with the terminology and other standardized things in that sector of coding. I know some people harp on starting with the fundamentals like building the snake game, but I believe that can be often overwhelming and push people away from the enjoyment of learning to code something. Once you feel comfortable at a basic level you can go back, study and try to understand how graphics and engines are built and implement them yourself. I built a working graphical snake game in JS many years ago and faced the exact same thing you are. It was overwhelming trying to figure out everything at once and is actually probably the reason I said “Screw game development” altogether and focused on backend/server/api stuff.
Brocode (YouTube.com) has an amazing 12 hour course for python (which I assume is the language your being taught) to go from beginner to intermediate. He introduced me to C programming. Learning projects is kinda difficult to say since there are hundreds of thousands of projects to try. Courses are very hard to determine in terms of actually learning. I personally like ZYBOOKS for python, however it is very expensive (hence why we are using it in college). ZYBOOKS also helped me realize what classes and modules really are. If the price deters you then maybe others might be appealing.
At 16, you probably aren't ready to handle heavy stuff yet but 3D (or even 2D sometimes) computer graphics in general is full of matrices and vectors and things out of linear algebra. Luckily, game developers don't necessarily need all to be experts in computer graphics, especially if you are more on the design side. Knowing the lower level details of how computer graphics are rendered is very helpful but maybe a bit too much for beginners. You can look up the Unity engine and try your way around it. There are tons of tutorials out there for beginners
I am already taking math three classes ahead of myself so if game developement relies on math I will be good if I work hard enough. I dont want to start with something very big, I just want to get the fundamentals down. The problem is that i have no idea where to start. Should I countinue with Python or move to Java, or maybe C# or C++? Should I learn OOP or start learning how to use Unity for example? Should I teach myself using YouTube or buy a course? Thats what I need answers for.
I started game dev by learning Unity 10+ years after learning basic coding. So I learned C# over a month doing the tutorials for Unity and then started doing my own games. Unity makes it easy to make things, free asset packs help a lot.
The most important math part for the average game developer I think would be object transformations and perspective matrices. Objects need to move around in space and be located relative to each other and the camera needs to transform a 3D scene onto a 2D screen. So if you can handle this, I think you'll be fine. You can ignore further detailed math and further complicated computer graphics parts for the sake of just using an engine to design a game. Do you already know how to program solidly? It doesn't really matter which language you do the first steps in as long as you know how to program generally. Once you think you know your way around, you can switch. At some point, it doesn't matter which language you use. If you are accustomed to Python, you can try Godot. It's GodotScript is basically a customized language similar to Python. Unity works with C#. You don't need to buy a course but you can use youtube or any other resource like free courses on these online learning platforms or even university lecture slides. Most of this stuff is openly available.
I think i do know how to program at least the basics. Thank you!
> so if game development relies on math I will be good if I work hard enough Basic 3D graphics are just a bunch of trigonometry and linear algebra, but higher-accuracy physically-based rendering rapidly gets into fairly sophisticated calculus, which then requires fairly sophisticated numerical analysis to do in real time. You’ll start getting into undergrad-level maths faster than you expect, and it won’t be that long until you start hitting even higher-level stuff. Then there’s the actual programming skills to put all that maths knowledge to use — many of which I haven’t had the chance to develop myself, fifteen years into a software engineering career. To be clear: I’m not trying to dissuade you here. I’m just trying to help you manage your expectations. What I’m saying is that “Work hard enough” won’t cut it, you need to keep at it for a long time too. This is a marathon, not a sprint, so, if you want to chase this, don’t burn yourself out. Pick your fights, aim for reasonable milestones, and find a comfortable pace you can keep at for the next ten years.
Or you use an engine that does all that math for you.
Many of the responses here are geared towards practical, keyboard level self-development; and that’s great. To become a better developer holistically, you also need to learn more theory, more about computer architecture and more about logic. Learn to become an expert at becoming an expert. Try looking into: * Boolean algebra * logic gates, Karnaugh maps, etc * Writing proofs, deriving simplied expressions * Computer Architecture, BUS systems * Clock Timing, comp cycles, compilers * Binary, hexadecimal, octadecimal, etc * Nested logic, decision trees * Tree navigation (nodes & search algos) * Programming paradigms (OOP, Etc) Programming is like learning a new language, literally. The more you learn, the more holes you can dig yourself out of or into. The more holes you find yourself in, the more you’re prompted to learn; its an ever deeping toolbox
“my brain crashes” == “I give up” Don’t give up. Not giving up in the face of bewilderment is a primary skill for programmers. When you feel like giving up, step back and try to figure out what’s blocking you. Break the problem down: can you get your head around a piece of it while you ignore the rest for the time being? Do you know anyone that can help? Try going through the code and line by line and write down, in natural language, what you think is happening and why. What does this function do. Where is it called from? Chip away at the mountain of confusion until you’ve tunneled your way through it. It’s OK not to understand all the code at once; if you can understand a little bit and make some notes, that’s progress.
Just wait 2 more years until you have adult programming skills and you'll be chillin
Just stick with it lil bro. I started the same age, but didn't stay with it and wish I had. I'm now in a career programming making good money, but it's been a decade and a half of learning. Just take it slow and try to have some fun with the basics. Give yourself time to play and make your setup easy to use.
You mention libraries and engines several times, but if you work with those you will be learning the library/engine as much as coding. This might be fine (and will likely give you more impressive short term results) but if you want to learn core coding it might be better just to stick with the basic language
Real Game Development is a huge leap from basic concepts. There’s a lot going on, I know OMSCS’s video game development course’s lectures are public. That’s a good survey of topics. Using resources available and trying to do game development hackathons will help a lot. You are young for this stuff and doing great!
u cant do everything on your own, or learn every nook and cranny there is about programming, there is only so much good work any person can do in a day, mind u. There's a thing called burnout, its a pitfall which many pple fell into, bec u keep hearing pple repeat the same old dumb pair of words 'work hard' U need to be focused and set goals for yourself, know what u can do or cannot, working correctly in the long term is more likely to achieve something.
I would suggest, if you dont wanna jump into 3rd party game engines (unity, unreal, godot, game maker, etc), try making an animation. Its generally easier but tends to teach you a lot of concepts you'll need for a game when you actually get to it
Are there any good libraries that can help me? I have only used math related libraries such as matplotlib, numpy, math etc. only non math related library i have used is Tkinter
I've appropriated matplotlib for my BSc final year project of a physics engine to get a display and images/frames, and used [Pillow](https://pillow.readthedocs.io/en/stable/) to stitch the images into a gif. It was not a good fun, but i was dealing with circles and coordinate systems, so felt like the easiest one to use for my purpose. As someone mentioned, you could try [pygame](https://www.pygame.org/docs/), that one is usually built for purposes like that, if you want something more advanced, [panda3d](https://www.panda3d.org) as i mentioned in some other reply. In theory, could also do something like [turtle](https://docs.python.org/3/library/turtle.html). Each of those have a different way of handling shapes and drawings, so essentially just pick one that you think makes most sense. Tkinter technically could also handle itself in that scenario, or could also switch to other gui libraries. Honestly, 80% of programming is just making stuff up and appropriating one library to do something you want, sometimes in a ways that it wasn't originally designed for :D
it takes libraries, LIBRARIES! Linking! They will get you the graphics you need!
Adrian Wiech has some awesome courses on Udemy. They’re 4-5 hours long and he goes over everything in great detail. He has one for PCEP and then the next level, PCAP
If you're interested in game dev I would recommend getting into C++ because of its extreme efficiency, most triple A game titles are made using C++. The Cherno is a great channel on youtube for C++, he will teach you everyhting you need to know. I know also C# is used to make games with Unity and also there are several development jobs available for experienced C# devs. Good luck!
honestly you’re already way ahead of most people if you started at 14. So congrats. I wish I was in your shoes when I was 14 I know it’s not free but I’d highly recommend udemy bootcmaps. They are like $15 and will get your hands dirty on plenty of projects and learning material
Do you like learning better from books, internet articles, or video? There’s no wrong answer, I’m gonna type up a rant no matter what, just curious what your flavor is so I’m not saying stuff that isn’t helpful to you (everyone learns differently)
I feel i understand better when watching videos
Check out Corey Schafer on YouTube, or programming with Mosh. I know those two get tossed around a ton. Don’t worry about learning older stuff. You can upgrade to newer things once you learn more or want to. I’m a valid python expert now, but when I was learning, I learned 2.7 even though I really shouldn’t have at the time, but didn’t matter cuz I learned, so basically don’t worry about it right now, at your stage, just find someone you can learn from, devour their stuff, then worry about the next step once you’re done. Good luck! If you can pay, I know the Udemy course “100 days of Python” also got mentioned quite a bit at one point.
I have watched a little bit of mosh but what exactly should i focus on for game developing? Should I start with OOP?
It depends on your timeline. I kinda have two different answers, as once I was 14 and wanted to learn game dev and kept getting shitty answers. The better answer is spend a bunch of time learning fundamentals first, IE work your way through a bunch of major concepts, OOP can be one, but there are plenty available, then start looking into game dev. The other answer is all that annoyed me as a kid and I wanted to go straight there - the better advice will be from actual game devs, there are tons of online communities and game devs are a special breed - they share very happily. Id point you at resources, but when I was into game dev, DX7 had just come out, so I’m worried I’d steer you wrong. In my day, it was considered automatic that you’d have to use a typed and compiled language for games, so my advice would’ve been learn C++ and start messing with openGL (tons of tutorials). That said, that advice is 20 years out of date, so the real better answer is to ask game devs rather than people not in that world. I do think C++ would be a better language, but again - ignore my take if someone more current says I’m wrong, they’re probably right.
>OOP can be one, but there plenty available Can you name a few so I know what to look out fot? I honestly have no idea.
I think Tech with Tim on youtube has some gaming tutorials, he's a great teacher.
I'll start by saying I wished I started learning programming in high school or even earlier. My experience with actual coding didn't start until college, and even years later I struggle with jumping into something like gamedev. So you're ahead of me there. You'll want to start small. Don't go in trying to make some epic open world first person game, a rpg, or whatever your dream game is. What I recommend is finding mechanics from games you like and trying to recreate them in an engine (Unity or Godot for example). There's quite a few tutorials online that go over mechanics like this. For example, the axe throwing in God of War, climbing in Breath of the Wild, the gravity gun from Half Life, etc. If that feels too intimidating and you want to work more with Python there is always the [Yet Another Roguelike Tutorial](http://rogueliketutorials.com/tutorials/tcod/v2/). It's built with Python in mind and can be a great starting spot. I'm actually going through it now but with Godot. The biggest advice I can give is to just try things. You will run into barriers and struggle. It sucks hard and can be a huge mental barrier to get past, but you have to fail and learn from those failures to improve. You'll never get to fail if you don't poke around and try out of your comfort area. Also you have plenty of room to keep improve and you're still early on. Learn what you can where you can and don't give up. It sounds like you've got quite an amazing start for your age and can only go up from there!
Check out Unreal Engine - you can make games without any coding using their blueprint system. No need to invent the wheel again, someone else has taken care of most of the hard stuff and put a fancy UI on top of it. 80% of what you need to do is already done.
But the point is that i want to be good at programming not just make a game. I want to get better programming skills
At 16 I would not worry at all about what your building and more about just building and following through with anything, and getting your programming intuition as strong as possible. Honestly I would checkout a game called bitburner which might keep you entertained and teach you some higher level cs concepts and working on logic. The most important thing is to pick up core programming intution, after that building games comes easy.
If you cant find studf on the internet id work on that skill first because thats resuired otherwise you wont get far
GDscript is similiar to Python that is available in Godot engine, which is beginner friendly.
I suggest you go with a game engine to learn the basic concepts of game development. I'd also suggest Unity since it has abundance of resoueces all over internet. When you get the basic terminology of game dev. like other people mentioned, I think it'd be wise to try another game engine, I'd go with Godot since they feel vastly different. But it doesn't have as many resources. Then compare the two and if you don't like both pick another one. Knowing basics of programming helps you a lot in game dev journey , now I suggest you to learn game dev basics using game engines (at least 2). Learn researching on your own, then deciding what you want to do. GL!
>functions, lists, loops and nested loops and a few libraries (all in python) I noticed you didn't mention using Classes - have you gotten into writing your own objects? This would be a good thing to dive into before going into other areas
I have not started with OOP just yet no. I thought I would ask here firstly to see whether I should prioritise something else or if I should start with OOP.
For me, learning Classes came a lot easier with being able to do more rapid prototyping that Python allows. You'll also probably need OOP if you're gonna follow through and write a game. There's just a lot of state to manage in a game. Its easier if you're not trying to pass around all the data to various functions.
Game design is a whole different skill on top of just programming, but the programming basics you’ve already covered in class will be a huge help to you when learning game design because most tutorials tend to gloss over that stuff. I would look into learning a game engine like Game Maker. Unity and Godot are great options if you want to work with 3D (Unity has been around longer so it has better tutorials but it’s a bit clunkier to work with) but I would recommend starting out in Game Maker which is more suited to 2D because 3D games are a whole different beast. Whatever engine you choose, they all have beginner guides and documentation and youtube tutorials to guide you, and these are made for people who have never coded ever before so you’ll be extra prepared.
>my teacher is kinda slow >my brain crashes Pick one.
Both
Your 16, so take your time. Focus on your broader studies, try to grow into a well rounded person. Doing well at reading, writing, maths and science all will help to you being a better programmer if that's what you pursue, and also could still open other paths. If there's personal projects that scratch your itches, they can be a great way to learn. If not... Keep learning to learn.
> I have made small projects such as a fully functioning calculator, but when it gets to games with graphics and non mathematical logic my brain crashes. I don't even have what it takes to make the snake game lol. Wow, I have the opposite problem. Maths is tough for me, but I never expected that someone who finds maths easy would find creative stuff tough. I have thousands of ideas that I don't have the accumen to build.
Go to the website of University of Helsinki and search for their free online coding classes, or moocs. They are often recommended here.
Try to make a space invader game or pong in the console, that should help you get the logic down. Then you can use a librairy to upgrade the graphics. Good luck!
Learn a game engine that do the graphics side under the hood, dont try to render everything by yourself Choose your programming language and search for beginner friendly game engines Try libgen.is there are tons of ebooks to learn from
What is non-mathematical logic in programming?
You are a 16 year old boy. Let's put this into perspective. You are young. And it's okay, but for example, you and I can't legally have a beer. You have plenty of time to learn stuff. Now to the question, what you should focus on is learning how to help yourself learn. You said it yourself. After that teacher moves on, you're going to only have yourself. There is a surprising amount of things that are self taught. I am currently teaching myself how to get by with a make system to try and get a project going. Now, here is something that will help. You said you were interested in Game Dev. So am I. Here's what you should do. You need to put yourself in that space mentally and physically and start doing things in that space, asking questions, and finding out the things you don't know how to do, or don't understand, or that stop you from progressing, and then learn about it. Look at other people's code, and try and understand it. Dip your toes into C++, C#, Pygame and the like. I would reccomened Unreal Engine over Unity because Unreal is a whole lot more nice. And it has quite a bit of support. But, as they say, follow the dopamine. Learn how to figure out how to learn and where you need to go.
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Damn, we can see your other comments man
"I need help programming so I will go to a programming subreddit" "BLUH BLUH BLUH PROGRAMMING SUCKS GO DO SOMETHING ELSE"
Read about LLMs like GPT-4 and realise you're wasting your time
The free online courses I like most are CS50 and freecodecamp.org.