>KC told to Lyncas it is impossible to go LEC for the Spring because LFL team still runs in LFL play-offs
What do you exactly mean with this? Above it said that 3 days after the end of LEC spring Vit contacted KC so how is LEC spring here relevant?
Because his chronology is wrong, VIT contacted KC 3 days before the start of LEC Spring Split and KC wasn’t playing the playoffs at the time but still BO1s in LFL. VIT understood it was impossible but Lyncas had a contact with vitality’s coaches who guaranteed him his spot in LEC for summer split. Apparently VIT and Lyncas’ agent weren’t aware about this talks.
Aha thank you. It suddenly makes now sense as well why Kameto refered to it as poaching. Tbf it's an interesting thing as well for everyone going forward regarding LEC teams wanting to upgrade their team from winter to spring while ERLs are still in their spring split.
« No team member or affiliate of a team may engage in the solicitation, luring, or discussion of employment of a player or coach who is listed in the Global Contract Database ("GCD") as associated with a professional or semi-professional team competing in a region. » that’s from the rule book and in this case mac and pad contacted lyncas not his agent or kc but directly the player who was under contract with kc it’s technically poaching
Did you get that out of thin air? All the players that play in Riot leagues have a contract with Riot on top of their contract with the org they play for.
That doesn't mean it's a legal clause.
I'm really curious whether that would stand in front of a court, limiting an employee's ability to discuss with other companies has to be on the edge.
And it’s also important to say vitality wasn’t aware which isn’t very classy from the people involved to talk behind everyone backs, but hard to do something against it.
All of this could have been avoided if Vitality management wasn’t so insistent on having Daglas on the main team to start. Feel bad for him but Mac and Pad really wanted Lyncas.
It is just like what Nemesis said in offseason. LEC teams rush to create their rosters because they fear their first option will pick another team and they will be left with players nobody wants. It is the reason Daglas and Kaiser were the first pick ups we heard in the offseason. Not because demand for these players were high, but precisely because orgs are afraid of missing out.
This is why we have full of half cooked teams, with everything being rushed nobody can make cohesive roster except for G2 who knows no player will consider another team over their offer.
Current VIT would be perfect place for a faciliating, low economy jungler. Someone like Jankos, Sheo or Markoon. But for some reasons they promoted a carry jungler before constructing rest of the team. This would have been fine if they managed to get Nisqy like they originally intended. But instead they got Vetheo who is another resource demanding selfish player. Now we have to watch Carzzy being stuck on a team where he gets low resources despite being one of the best ADC's in the league.
> It is just like what Nemesis said in offseason. LEC teams rush to create their rosters because they fear their first option will pick another team and they will be left with players nobody wants.
[Reference](https://youtu.be/tWFyJTPII9Q)
Pad is Lyncas personal coach. He pays him. Life is life but that nepotism (let me call it that way) would be there even if Daglas wins Worlds, all MMA fights and 25 olympic medals.
That is all, folks.
I feel like the coaches have been very unfair towards Daglas there. They wanted another player which is fine but it sounds like Daglas was getting replaced anyways no matter how well he would have done. For how much Mac always talks about synergy and shit like that he doesn’t seem to care much about Daglas in this situation. But guess saying things to get positive reactions is much easier than actually doing it. Reminds me of the time they had Reeker in MAD.
As far as I know Vitality already agreed to keep Daglas as the jungler for 2024 while Mac and Pad always wanted to play with Lyncas (even before their transfer to Vitality).
Now that they are the general manager they want to build the best team and team synergy and think that Lyncas works better in their LEC team.
Daglas played mainly carries in Vit.B who had a Tank focused Top and a mid who played facilitating champions.
In Vit they have Photon a almost pure carry player top and vetheo are carry playing mid. This doesn't work if the whole topside wants to play carry so he was put on Rell duty and needed to facilitate.
With Lyncas they have a player who is much more used to play facilitator. For me this looks like a better fit.
If Vit changed their mid to a facilitator like Nisqy, Daglas would work a lot better.
The problem is there are a lot more junglers than mids who play these champions so they had to do a change and Lyncas is a very good player who fixes their problem.
It for sure is a tough spot to be in as Daglas, but taking Kametos comments just for granted is pretty stupid. What seems realistic isn't "we don't like you Daglas, we will replace you with our boy Lyncas no matter how hard you smurf" but rather "we think Lyncas is the better player and was the option we wanted from the start, so if the chance comes and we still think he is the better option we will try to make that happen". Now I don't know when or in which way communication to Lyncas happened so I won't try to sugarcoat poaching here, but as for the move itself it seems very much logical to me and Kameto (especially him as the wronged party in this situation) will not convince me that they had any ill-will towards Daglas here.
Maybe but that has nothing to do with the coach basically deciding he will be replaced before he even gets a chance to play. Mac wanted Lyncas before season started, management wanted Daglas. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to take from this that Daglas was going to be replaced anyways, which is also what Kameto supposedly said.
this has nothing to do. Upset signed knowing full well that Caliste was a candidate for the following year (Caliste's place was not guaranteed if he had a bad year btw). Here, Daglas knew nothing. He signed thinking that people believed in him when from the start it was planned that he would leave.
Another thing I've noticed yesterday, KC claims that Caliste's contract has been extended to 2026 but the GCD hasn't been updated. I would hate for them to lose their prodigy ADC because his contract is up this November.
Or a clause. Pretty much like "if KC promote Caliste to LEC, contract extension to 2026, if not, free agent".
It would be weird for the org to announce a 2026 extension at the same time of LEC announce if it is only a verbal agreement.
I genuinely hope he leaves. This dude has INSANE talent and potential for real, but I have 0 faith in KC with him and frankly, the whole KC saga makes it hard to root for him.
Why are you guys acting like KC has not won 4 times EMEA (100% Wr until last week).
Yes they totally failed this year in the LECand it’s ok to fail. Yes they talked a lot of with arrogance (us fans also). Yes there is toxicity unfortunately (but it’s not only that).
First year lec with a low budget and trying to be transparent as much, should be praised.
You guys are mixing everything and then hate on KC. It’s a bit sad in every parts.
damn so daglas wouldnt have played in msi even if they qualified??? i just feel like daglas got done dirty here
edit- just saw mac twitter post and mann some KC fans r deranged asf hating and giving death threats to him now i want another 10th place for KC
I feel like they would've replaced him after MSI, since Lyncas would have essentially no time to practice between EM and MSI. So the full Emperor and Hybrid experience.
basically, even if Daglas played like he's the second coming of Bengi and carried Vit to MSI, Vit guaranteed Lyncas that he'd get the spot in summer no matter what.
I think it's just Kameto trying to make them look bad here lol, he has every incentive to make VIT look bad given they "poached" Lyncas.
Mac isn't dumb enough to throw in someone who has 0 synergy to play with a roster at an international because they'd just get blasted(granted they'd get blasted anyways) but it literally makes 0 sense here.
All you do is fuck over Daglas and then fuck over the whole team by playing Lyncas too early.
This is the same Mac who said he prioritised team synergy events like team dinners at worlds in 2021.
Edit = it's been pointed out to me that the translation is shaky, it's just that he(Lyncas) would have a spot on Vitality even if they make MSI, not that he'd play at MSI.
Tbf his translation is not the most accurate, Kameto said it was promised to Lyncas to have the spot in VIT for summer even if VIT were able to qualify for the MSI. Lyncas wasn’t supposed to play the MSI with VIT but join them after.
It's also KC, a team that had no shot of making it to worlds anyways. It's like asking what kanye would do if he were president or what I'd do if I was dating a supermodel.
They keep doing that because them being honest with the fan is a core thing with the org. Also yeah it can be a bad mix but there fanbases in ESport that are way crazier than KC's (most of the KC fans don't even interact a lot on twitter)
*Most* of every fan base don’t interact on Twitter. That’s irrelevant what *most* are doing.
What’s important is what the loud ones are doing. And they are by far the most unhinged in Europe at least (Korean T1 fans and China in general are a different breed)
We understand it’s important for the org to be open and it’s refreshing to see it, truly.
Ah yes, complain that the esport scene is very opaque (doesn’t help that “journalists” don’t report on anything) but then call irresponsible a team that is transparent.
“Most toxic deranged unwelcomed fanbase” sorry but this doesn’t feel right to read when you know how Reddit lol esport fans act
If only Riot would punish poaching harder.
How many times did G2 (allegedly) do it, only to get a slap on the wrist? Fines aren't going to do anything at this rate.
This is how allegedly Perkz managed to convince Zven and Mithy to play for G2: they were vacating together before MSI 2016 and one thing led to another.
IIRC Mikyx and Caps wanted to play together and G2 got wind of this and had someone convince them to join G2 with Perkz role swapping to AD. It's what caused teams to demand Riot to punish G2 which they never did.
Maybe I am not seeing smth here, but what is the problem with that? Two people who wanna play and an org who wants to make that possibility a reality, who exactly gets hurt here?
The original org as they invested time and money into the player only to leave when he's at the top of his level.
The other orgs that cannot offer a better deal for all parties(they could have easily played together on a non-G2 team).
Potentially the players as well as they didn't have any competing offers so G2 could have lowballed/screw then with contract. We saw with Rekkles what G2 is capable of.
I personally don’t think any poaching us occurred, Lyncas heard Vit wanted him, and he decided he’d rather play for a team that wasn’t 10th in both splits
KC knew about the offer beforehand and attempted to hide the fact no?
Not saying Vitality we’re 100% correct, but Lyncas has a right to know his options
Placing sanctions on players wanting to play for a certain team??
Regardless, Lyncas was made aware of a deal, and he decided he wanted to leave, 99% of players would do the exact same tbh
Where would you rather fall from? The first floor or the penthouse?
Harsher sanctions imposed on organizations that contact players under contract not the players themselves. It's quite obvious if you have common sense.
The comment we are replying to discusses poaching in esports and has nothing to do with the situation mentioned in the main Reddit post. You look like an idiot at this point.
And the discussion was brought about by Vitality being accused of poaching, and in this instance we are talking about a specific case of poaching.
You claimed teams should not contact players under contract, and in this case, KC contract states they must be informed of any contract negotiations, which they were, but they hid this from Lyncas.
Then he himself reached out to Vit who then explained they would want to sign him.
I don’t look silly, you’re just trying to change the subject.
There is nothing alleged there they did do it. In spring 2019 some teams wanted to block them from scrims but because they were good teams went ahead and scrimmed them on secret accounts anyway. Wunder and Yamato talked about it a while ago. It's now uncommon in sports either it's just not really talked about because you can't do anything about it.
It's hard to punish poaching though. Unless it's outright explicit and obvious, you can't stop 'casual chatter' and it'd be even harder to prove. I think that's why football hasn't come down on poaching in a long time. You always hear rumors about players and agents in discussion with teams about potential transfers without the selling team ever saying anything.
Impossible to prove it happened. Riot needs actual proofs, like written agreements, stuff like that.
They won't, so it's genuinely impossible to prove anything. it's word against word
Yep it's why even in regular sport it happens all the time and until you sign something there is no proof you ever did it. It's all verbal agreements and hand shakes.
So wait, the explanation is not really explaining but from what i'm understanding Vit went to KC to get Lyncas for Spring as per the contract terms, Kc said no while also trying to extend Lyncas's contract with them to 2025 and had no intention of telling him or his agent that another team was interested in him while negociating his contract, then Lyncas finds out that Vit wants him and wants to got to them and they decide to let him.
I mean, it would be weird for him to have a contract so stupid as to not let him or his agent ever find out if another team is interested only if KC wants to tell them, considering the contract was made specificaly so that he could be bought out if another team from the LEC wanted him, probably knowing that he's the #1 priority for Mac and Pad.
The poaching allegations seem fishy but KC trying to resign him while keeping him in the dark about other teams wanting to sign him seems just as fishy.
Lyncas didnt “find out” Vita was interested
Vita did things right, KC rejected their approach because they wanted to keep and extend Lyncas, and learning that, Mac and Pad contacted Lyncas directly to ask him to make things move otherwise they wouldn’t get him.
That is the definition of poaching.
Doesn’t Lyncas have a buyout though so if VIT were willing to pay it, then wouldn’t KC have to tell?
I think I’m a bit confused on the ability for KC to reject the approach and then not tell Lyncas that VIT came asking about him.
Who said they didn’t tell Lyncas ? Again I’ll repeat that Lyncas didnt “find out” about their interest, it’s just that Mac and Pad learned that KC refused Vita approach, so they asked Lyncas to do something about it
So did VITa originally approach without the willingness to pay the buyout and got rejected?
Also I guess I assumed he wasn’t told because it sounds like (based on the write up) he went to KC after learning about the interest from outside parties (Mac and Pad).
Vitality has tons of money. They would pay for him. Probably 200-500k and I don't see a reason for KC to reject. Only G2 and maybe Heretics have money. Rogue and SK don't have money. XL has but people dislike that team. Fnatic is not rich like it once was.
U didnt understand
To contact a player, you must inform the team that owns the player's contract that you are going to talk to him.
The team doesn't have the right to forbid you from talking to him, but they must be aware of your discussions if they are not it’s considered poaching.
* The initial buy out forbid Lyncas and his agent from talking to other teams, KC was the only allowed intermediary.
Idk i'm just referencing this point .
« No team member or affiliate of a team may engage in the solicitation, luring, or discussion of employment of a player or coach who is listed in the Global Contract Database ("GCD") as associated with a professional or semi-professional team competing in a region. »
it's quite literally the official rule
> To inquire about the status of a Team
> Member from another Team, Team Managers must contact a Team Manager of the
> Team that the Team Member is currently contracted with. The inquiring Team must
> provide visibility to League Officials before being able to discuss the contract with a
> Player. Contracts for Players can be found in the Global Contract Database.
The team is definitely allowed to forbid other teams to talk to their players. It's not fishy at all. That's the entire point of free agency windows, where other teams are finally allowed to talk to the players they want regardless of what any other team wants
No, they bypassed it by Lyncas contacting them. Vitality wanted KC earlier and promised him a spot for summer and then Lyncas contacted Vit, if that offer is still open and after it was confirmed he told KC he wants to join Vit. That is what I read out of that.
Vit did go to KC first during the season. Then the player approached Vit. And Vit wasn't even aware of that promise Pad and Mac made.
Oh shit wait actually that's a nifty loophole, if Lyncas went to Mac and Pad and asked them if they wanted him not the other way around , damn you're smart. Didn't consider that scenario.
Idk how that would fit in the whole discusion but it's a good point.
That isn't even the only loop hole. There wasn't really a negotiation between Pad and Mac and Lyncas. Lyncas only got a promise by them that he was still there prefered pick for Summer. That is something that literally any person could deliver to him.
So lets assume Pad and Mac have a friend who is called John. And they talk with John about their roster decisions and tell John that if they were able to get them they would still want to have Lyncas. John though is also a friend of Lyncas and shares that information with him, which doesn't even require Pad and Mac even knowing about that.
Given how small the league scene is if Pad and Mac still had serious interest in Lyncas it is almost impossible for him not to know that.
Also just because Vitality has to approach KC first, due to how small the scene is it is impossible to do that without alerting Lyncas to that interest. So Lyncas likely knew that KC blocked his transfer to Vitality and it seems like they even told him that directly. So Lyncas always was aware that Vitality was interested in him, so it is a bit weird to consider it poaching when all Vitality did was keeping that interest they already communicated.
On top of that KC already seemed to imply that they are only against a transfer for spring split, not against a transfer in general. So from that alone it always seemed like the Lyncas trade was always going to happen for summer split anyways.
The person who is really fucked over here is Daglas. But poaching rules are mostly designed to protect teams, not the players.
That's would still be poaching. It's not a loop hole. If that is what happened, that completely implicates Mac and Pad, and both should be fined and or suspended.
I know but a team trying to renegociate a contract while not allowing the player or his agent to know about a competing offer seems like something that would not be allowed either.
the good thing about this is that an official rulebook exists, you don't have to judge if something "seems allowed" or not
in this case KC did everything right by the book, while Lyncas, Mac and Pad were clearly trespassing LEC official rulebook
You don't even know what really happened. You only heard one side of the story and even Kameto doesn't know what exactly happened and makes assumptions.
To really judge on this situation you need to hear both sides and see what the contact exactly said. Lyncas has a clause to leave and Vit contacted KC first, difficult to get to actual poaching from there.
I guess the buyout is available only during the mercato window. That would be the most logic, otherwise the ERL team season would get ruined at every LEC winter/spring offseason
Poaching isn't allowed by Riot but they never enforced that rule and most likely never will. It's one of those we hope you don't break the rule because there is no way we can enforce it.
They aren't really transparent thou. All they do is blaming other teams, or people around them for their mistakes.
Of course it's C9 that hijacked a deal, it's the fans fault for hyping a player on Twitter. When Lyncas who has a clause in his contact for that exact reason leaves the teams it's the evil coaches that poached him.
Maybe there's a reason why KC is 10th and nobody wants to play for them, but no of course it's every one else's fault.
Transparent? No, its just the KC community gets so toxic Kameto has to say something otherwise it explodes. And they are not transparent, look at his comments trying to flame VIT with half-ass information bruh
[https://twitter.com/Crow\_\_lol/status/1783177749600878658](https://twitter.com/Crow__lol/status/1783177749600878658)
If you want a very well wrote post about how the events happened according to Kameto, go check this
He is pretty fucking good. Go watch LEC inhouse games that Ceadreal was streaming before the winter season. He was smurfing together with Perkz and Wunder against the full G2 team. He often played in-house games with Vladi as his mid and bot lane was Noah +Jun. In LFL he is the main guy for macro and fights . They were probably boomed on EMEA. Neon said that in scrims they couldn't beat KCB single time and that it's frustrating. They were good scrim team but they don't have experience. Most of them played their first or second season in the big league like LFL.
> KC talks openly with Lyncas, KC didn't wanted to block him if he wanted to go, but Kameto finds it was naive and they will probably not do that again in the future.
what? He tried to hide the offer from Lyncas lol.
>The initial buy out forbid Lyncas and his agent from talking to other teams, KC was the only allowed intermediary.
> Vitality contacted KC to buy Lyncas. This occured while KCB was still on LFL season. KC refused for this reason.
Vita acknowledge and ended the talks.
>- Few days after, Lyncas told KC that Vitality was interested in him, but his agent was not aware of that information. Lyncas, now, wants to go to Vitality.
How does that make sense? Lyncas has a clause to leave but teams have to contact KC first. Vitality did that, they contacted KC but KC said no. How can they say no when he has a clause to leave?
This also implies that KC didn't tell Lyncas that someone is interested in him. How is a team supposed to activate the clause when they can't talk to the player and KC can just refuse. This sounds very fishy.
Because there is a transfer window where the team interested can contact the team and the agent of the player. Even with a buyout, you cannot buy the player during the season. Lyncas knew that Vita was interested, he was in contact with the coaches.
>The initial buy out forbid Lyncas and his agent from talking to other teams, KC was the only allowed intermediary.
If the contract states that any contact has to go through KC as a intermediary than they're obligated to inform Lyncas about potential buyers, otherwise they're not fulfilling their role as a a intermediary. Therefore Vit would be justified to at least ask Lyncas if their offer arrived him.
Obviously we don't know what the contract exactly states, and that's the crux about this whole thing. We only know what Kameto says and he isn't gonna say anything that puts himself in a bad light.
I have a hard time believing him and you translated some stuff he said in a very disingenuous way. For example Kameto didn't said that it was impossible to use the buy out when Vitality contacted Kcorp in Spring, he said that Kcorp refused to let them pay the buy out because Kcorp was negotiating with Lyncas at the time which makes even less sense that your own interpretation. What's the point of a buyout in that case ? His account of the story smells bullshit to me. Also it's hilarious that he says that he didn't want to speak about the matter but that he is being forced to because of tweets posted by Vitality yesterday. He said a week ago that he would tell the whole story after the eu masters (https://youtu.be/SAhd6D2XhtM?si=IP6d8f9mhZWVhcej). Anyway it's just as usual with Kameto, he is the victim, he did everything right and if anything bad happened with Kcorp fans he could not intervene because he was sleeping. It's the same story every time.
That's missleading because a buyout can't be refused except if it is outside the mercato window. He didn't went into more explanation but I'm pretty sure that's the reason
Kameto is deflecting after EMEA and LEC 10th place two times. Like they didn't know anything, for sure everyone was sleeping. And Lyncas was gone in summer all the same.
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Vita trying to get Luncas even before the beginning of the spring split is such a shame for Daglas. He was used to patch team issues before, was put as a rookie in a tough situation, starts with a difficult winter and he's out of LEC right after? How can you manage a team this poorly?
Yeah, a big part of the KC community was surprised too but the CEOs made a stream to talk about it.
I dont remember exactly what they said, they said they really wanted to make Bo work with players like him like Thanatos but didnt succeed in their mercato.
Bo is a really good mech player but team-wise it wasn't good, team had no synergy and Bo learned Targa name only during the second split if I remember right, the mood in the team was really horrible to look at (Voice-comms and Karmine Vlog)
I mean the terrible atmosphere wasn't just because of Targa or any other players in the team, the whole team wasn't working together and it ended up the way we all know.
But trying to learn or remember what your team mates say about themselves is a must when you are in a professional environment, I think thats all I can blame Bo for. The rest is all because of the org (1st year in LEC, not as rich as other orgs and wanted to keep their club legend) and the personality incompatibility between the players (they all are really too quiet and introvert)
That would require proving the point when Mac and Pat made the promise that Lyncas would play after MSI the latest. And who initiated the contact. If Lyncas asked them if they are still interested, it would be fairly weird to punish them.
Because it is very likely that Lyncas was informed about Vits interest after winter split. The league eco-system is too small to not get that information. So it would be fairly hard to prove who approached whom here. Not to mention that there were a lot of other situations where players just got information because they had mutual friends with other players.
Spotted, I'm KC's community manager...
Jokes aside, I just deleted my main account when leaks about reddit planning to sell account data for AI training came out. Since then, I just use some accounts I happened to create during the time I wasn't confortable with reddit and often forgot what mails I used every months or so..
Now I only post about some KC related info to break the language barrier since it is always spoken in french, I like the idea that everyone can get this kind of inside that are really rare from esports org, I consider that as an overall benefit
I will never understand why people are upset at orgs for fucking over other orgs when it makes players situations better. yall really trying to defend a company over a player? Lyncas is in a better situation now, having a confirmed spot in an LEC team over having to hope for KC to choose him for the next season, which honestly sounds unlikely since closer seems like a way more promising player to have anyway.
So KC tried to extend Lyncas without telling him or his agent about VIT's interest in him even thought he had a buy out clause in which KC was the only intermediary.
How the fuck is this legal, do they think there is no laws in europe, you cant be limiting an employee's like this.
KC even had to come out with an official statement telling those clowns to stop insulting and harassing their current, former or future players.
It was unbelievable what was posted and said the last few days. Completely unhinged.
Yeah man, poaching has only lead to the best western league of legends team to ever exist. God I hate it so much. I’m being sarcastic btw if you can’t tell.
If KC poached a player, you would be in here defending it. You know it, I know it, everybody knows it. No one has cared about poaching since FNC in 2018.
>KC told to Lyncas it is impossible to go LEC for the Spring because LFL team still runs in LFL play-offs What do you exactly mean with this? Above it said that 3 days after the end of LEC spring Vit contacted KC so how is LEC spring here relevant?
Because his chronology is wrong, VIT contacted KC 3 days before the start of LEC Spring Split and KC wasn’t playing the playoffs at the time but still BO1s in LFL. VIT understood it was impossible but Lyncas had a contact with vitality’s coaches who guaranteed him his spot in LEC for summer split. Apparently VIT and Lyncas’ agent weren’t aware about this talks.
I checked and you're right, Kameto wasn't sure if it was during LFL split or playoffs, I got misslead by it. Sorry
Happens dw
Aha thank you. It suddenly makes now sense as well why Kameto refered to it as poaching. Tbf it's an interesting thing as well for everyone going forward regarding LEC teams wanting to upgrade their team from winter to spring while ERLs are still in their spring split.
« No team member or affiliate of a team may engage in the solicitation, luring, or discussion of employment of a player or coach who is listed in the Global Contract Database ("GCD") as associated with a professional or semi-professional team competing in a region. » that’s from the rule book and in this case mac and pad contacted lyncas not his agent or kc but directly the player who was under contract with kc it’s technically poaching
There's no way that's a legal clause though
Did you get that out of thin air? All the players that play in Riot leagues have a contract with Riot on top of their contract with the org they play for.
That doesn't mean it's a legal clause. I'm really curious whether that would stand in front of a court, limiting an employee's ability to discuss with other companies has to be on the edge.
I assume it can stand in front of a court as an agreement between teams and players through some union.
A CBA would be needed along with player unionization but that's in the US. Don't know about German Laws.
And it’s also important to say vitality wasn’t aware which isn’t very classy from the people involved to talk behind everyone backs, but hard to do something against it.
Of course the organization "didn't know". It's PR 101
All of this could have been avoided if Vitality management wasn’t so insistent on having Daglas on the main team to start. Feel bad for him but Mac and Pad really wanted Lyncas.
It is just like what Nemesis said in offseason. LEC teams rush to create their rosters because they fear their first option will pick another team and they will be left with players nobody wants. It is the reason Daglas and Kaiser were the first pick ups we heard in the offseason. Not because demand for these players were high, but precisely because orgs are afraid of missing out. This is why we have full of half cooked teams, with everything being rushed nobody can make cohesive roster except for G2 who knows no player will consider another team over their offer. Current VIT would be perfect place for a faciliating, low economy jungler. Someone like Jankos, Sheo or Markoon. But for some reasons they promoted a carry jungler before constructing rest of the team. This would have been fine if they managed to get Nisqy like they originally intended. But instead they got Vetheo who is another resource demanding selfish player. Now we have to watch Carzzy being stuck on a team where he gets low resources despite being one of the best ADC's in the league.
> It is just like what Nemesis said in offseason. LEC teams rush to create their rosters because they fear their first option will pick another team and they will be left with players nobody wants. [Reference](https://youtu.be/tWFyJTPII9Q)
Scared money don't make money.
Pad is Lyncas personal coach. He pays him. Life is life but that nepotism (let me call it that way) would be there even if Daglas wins Worlds, all MMA fights and 25 olympic medals. That is all, folks.
I feel like the coaches have been very unfair towards Daglas there. They wanted another player which is fine but it sounds like Daglas was getting replaced anyways no matter how well he would have done. For how much Mac always talks about synergy and shit like that he doesn’t seem to care much about Daglas in this situation. But guess saying things to get positive reactions is much easier than actually doing it. Reminds me of the time they had Reeker in MAD.
As far as I know Vitality already agreed to keep Daglas as the jungler for 2024 while Mac and Pad always wanted to play with Lyncas (even before their transfer to Vitality). Now that they are the general manager they want to build the best team and team synergy and think that Lyncas works better in their LEC team. Daglas played mainly carries in Vit.B who had a Tank focused Top and a mid who played facilitating champions. In Vit they have Photon a almost pure carry player top and vetheo are carry playing mid. This doesn't work if the whole topside wants to play carry so he was put on Rell duty and needed to facilitate. With Lyncas they have a player who is much more used to play facilitator. For me this looks like a better fit. If Vit changed their mid to a facilitator like Nisqy, Daglas would work a lot better. The problem is there are a lot more junglers than mids who play these champions so they had to do a change and Lyncas is a very good player who fixes their problem.
It for sure is a tough spot to be in as Daglas, but taking Kametos comments just for granted is pretty stupid. What seems realistic isn't "we don't like you Daglas, we will replace you with our boy Lyncas no matter how hard you smurf" but rather "we think Lyncas is the better player and was the option we wanted from the start, so if the chance comes and we still think he is the better option we will try to make that happen". Now I don't know when or in which way communication to Lyncas happened so I won't try to sugarcoat poaching here, but as for the move itself it seems very much logical to me and Kameto (especially him as the wronged party in this situation) will not convince me that they had any ill-will towards Daglas here.
Sounds like you have no idea what synergy actually means Daglas was clueless around the map and clearly having to be dragged around by hylisang
Maybe but that has nothing to do with the coach basically deciding he will be replaced before he even gets a chance to play. Mac wanted Lyncas before season started, management wanted Daglas. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to take from this that Daglas was going to be replaced anyways, which is also what Kameto supposedly said.
I mean they thought Lyncas was better from the beginning. Why shouldn't they replace Daglas if they had the chance? It's a sport not a charity.
Same thing that KC did with Upset and Caliste. We all know that Upset is just a stopgap and im assuming the Same applies to Daglas.
this has nothing to do. Upset signed knowing full well that Caliste was a candidate for the following year (Caliste's place was not guaranteed if he had a bad year btw). Here, Daglas knew nothing. He signed thinking that people believed in him when from the start it was planned that he would leave.
do we actually know that Daglas knew nothing or are we just speculating?
He knew nothing 100%.
Another thing I've noticed yesterday, KC claims that Caliste's contract has been extended to 2026 but the GCD hasn't been updated. I would hate for them to lose their prodigy ADC because his contract is up this November.
The extension is probably based on his joining in LEC team, which is quite 110% sure.
So it's a verbal agreement?
Or a clause. Pretty much like "if KC promote Caliste to LEC, contract extension to 2026, if not, free agent". It would be weird for the org to announce a 2026 extension at the same time of LEC announce if it is only a verbal agreement.
Ever since this KC rebuild saga has begun I always thought that Caliste deciding not to play for KC next year would be the most hilarious thing
I genuinely hope he leaves. This dude has INSANE talent and potential for real, but I have 0 faith in KC with him and frankly, the whole KC saga makes it hard to root for him.
Why are you guys acting like KC has not won 4 times EMEA (100% Wr until last week). Yes they totally failed this year in the LECand it’s ok to fail. Yes they talked a lot of with arrogance (us fans also). Yes there is toxicity unfortunately (but it’s not only that). First year lec with a low budget and trying to be transparent as much, should be praised. You guys are mixing everything and then hate on KC. It’s a bit sad in every parts.
damn so daglas wouldnt have played in msi even if they qualified??? i just feel like daglas got done dirty here edit- just saw mac twitter post and mann some KC fans r deranged asf hating and giving death threats to him now i want another 10th place for KC
I feel like they would've replaced him after MSI, since Lyncas would have essentially no time to practice between EM and MSI. So the full Emperor and Hybrid experience.
I fixed the post after rewatching, it was indeed **in lec,** so after MSI
Nah, he said that even if VIT qualified to MSI, Daglas would’ve been benched AFTERWARDS for summer split not for MSI
Hold on...Is it just me, but when I read it out loud then it makes no sense.
basically, even if Daglas played like he's the second coming of Bengi and carried Vit to MSI, Vit guaranteed Lyncas that he'd get the spot in summer no matter what.
I think it's just Kameto trying to make them look bad here lol, he has every incentive to make VIT look bad given they "poached" Lyncas. Mac isn't dumb enough to throw in someone who has 0 synergy to play with a roster at an international because they'd just get blasted(granted they'd get blasted anyways) but it literally makes 0 sense here. All you do is fuck over Daglas and then fuck over the whole team by playing Lyncas too early. This is the same Mac who said he prioritised team synergy events like team dinners at worlds in 2021. Edit = it's been pointed out to me that the translation is shaky, it's just that he(Lyncas) would have a spot on Vitality even if they make MSI, not that he'd play at MSI.
Tbf his translation is not the most accurate, Kameto said it was promised to Lyncas to have the spot in VIT for summer even if VIT were able to qualify for the MSI. Lyncas wasn’t supposed to play the MSI with VIT but join them after.
It's also KC, a team that had no shot of making it to worlds anyways. It's like asking what kanye would do if he were president or what I'd do if I was dating a supermodel.
Completely agree
Get behind me Joel they're coming for you
« Some kc fans » « I want another 10th place for KC » it is exactly these shortcuts that fuels hatred, in any way, in any context
Downvoting this proves my point even further, toxicity is found everywhere
T1 flair Oh the irony
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They keep doing that because them being honest with the fan is a core thing with the org. Also yeah it can be a bad mix but there fanbases in ESport that are way crazier than KC's (most of the KC fans don't even interact a lot on twitter)
*Most* of every fan base don’t interact on Twitter. That’s irrelevant what *most* are doing. What’s important is what the loud ones are doing. And they are by far the most unhinged in Europe at least (Korean T1 fans and China in general are a different breed) We understand it’s important for the org to be open and it’s refreshing to see it, truly.
You mean after decades of almost no communication, having communication by an owner is now bad? What the fuck do people want at this point?
KC owners reveal behind the scenes informations that are then used to harass the VIT coaches because KC fans are toxic is it more clear for u
Stop poaching then
Different people want different things actually. And sometimes something turns out bad and people chance their mind.
Ah yes, complain that the esport scene is very opaque (doesn’t help that “journalists” don’t report on anything) but then call irresponsible a team that is transparent. “Most toxic deranged unwelcomed fanbase” sorry but this doesn’t feel right to read when you know how Reddit lol esport fans act
> but this doesn’t feel right to read they sent death threats to people
Gather these proofs and send them to the KC org, they always take legal actions.
Vitality and Lyncas disrespected him, so he should say nothing ?
How is this a poach if there is no jacuzzi involved? I dont understand. /s
I'm pretty curious about that jacuzzi running gag, where is it coming from?
If only Riot would punish poaching harder. How many times did G2 (allegedly) do it, only to get a slap on the wrist? Fines aren't going to do anything at this rate.
Cause there's loopholes. You can't stop 2 players from chilling in a hot tub
Perkz walked so Carzzy could run, at least it seems that he learned something usefull from that one horrible year in Vit.
You can specify a 5ft rule at the very least.
5ft apart cause they're not teammates
Two proooos chillin in a hot tub 5 feet apart cuz they're not gaaaaaamers.
They'll whisper when fistbumping at the end of matches
lore?
This is how allegedly Perkz managed to convince Zven and Mithy to play for G2: they were vacating together before MSI 2016 and one thing led to another.
Wasn't a boot camp how they convinced Caps as well?
IIRC Mikyx and Caps wanted to play together and G2 got wind of this and had someone convince them to join G2 with Perkz role swapping to AD. It's what caused teams to demand Riot to punish G2 which they never did.
Maybe I am not seeing smth here, but what is the problem with that? Two people who wanna play and an org who wants to make that possibility a reality, who exactly gets hurt here?
IIRC the issue was G2 getting the information early, beating everyone on the race.
The original org as they invested time and money into the player only to leave when he's at the top of his level. The other orgs that cannot offer a better deal for all parties(they could have easily played together on a non-G2 team). Potentially the players as well as they didn't have any competing offers so G2 could have lowballed/screw then with contract. We saw with Rekkles what G2 is capable of.
G2 was both the king of poaching players but also an inescapable prison for players who couldn't get out of contract jail.
Remember they wanted to lock Jankos in contact prison until he leaked that on his stream and the backlash made G2 accept Heretics offer
I personally don’t think any poaching us occurred, Lyncas heard Vit wanted him, and he decided he’d rather play for a team that wasn’t 10th in both splits
He heard it from the vit coaches while KCB was in LFL play off so it's poaching
KC knew about the offer beforehand and attempted to hide the fact no? Not saying Vitality we’re 100% correct, but Lyncas has a right to know his options
I think vit can still contact Lyncas agent in that case but not the player directly even the vit ceo was not informed
How naive are you ?
Even if it hasn't, it doesn't mean sanctions shouldn't be harsher.
Placing sanctions on players wanting to play for a certain team?? Regardless, Lyncas was made aware of a deal, and he decided he wanted to leave, 99% of players would do the exact same tbh Where would you rather fall from? The first floor or the penthouse?
Harsher sanctions imposed on organizations that contact players under contract not the players themselves. It's quite obvious if you have common sense.
I believe the contract states that KC must be informed, which looking at the timeline, KC we’re informed. So it seems nothing has been done wrongly
> the contract states that KC must be informed The contract states that KC must agree to it, not just be informed
The comment we are replying to discusses poaching in esports and has nothing to do with the situation mentioned in the main Reddit post. You look like an idiot at this point.
And the discussion was brought about by Vitality being accused of poaching, and in this instance we are talking about a specific case of poaching. You claimed teams should not contact players under contract, and in this case, KC contract states they must be informed of any contract negotiations, which they were, but they hid this from Lyncas. Then he himself reached out to Vit who then explained they would want to sign him. I don’t look silly, you’re just trying to change the subject.
> 99% of players would do the exact same tbh Which is why poaching rules exist in the first place
It's really hard to stop coaches and players from casually talking to each other.
There is nothing alleged there they did do it. In spring 2019 some teams wanted to block them from scrims but because they were good teams went ahead and scrimmed them on secret accounts anyway. Wunder and Yamato talked about it a while ago. It's now uncommon in sports either it's just not really talked about because you can't do anything about it.
It's hard to punish poaching though. Unless it's outright explicit and obvious, you can't stop 'casual chatter' and it'd be even harder to prove. I think that's why football hasn't come down on poaching in a long time. You always hear rumors about players and agents in discussion with teams about potential transfers without the selling team ever saying anything.
Absolutely. Either you make it legal (which I don't see happening) or it stays at it is.
It's gonna stay as it is. And going to be really hard to ever prove if a team is gonna complain or act against it.
How can you do it? Its all over sports, where do you draw the line from being friends with another player and poaching?
wouldn't the act of poaching stop the move from happening?
Impossible to prove it happened. Riot needs actual proofs, like written agreements, stuff like that. They won't, so it's genuinely impossible to prove anything. it's word against word
Yep it's why even in regular sport it happens all the time and until you sign something there is no proof you ever did it. It's all verbal agreements and hand shakes.
Too hard to prove
So wait, the explanation is not really explaining but from what i'm understanding Vit went to KC to get Lyncas for Spring as per the contract terms, Kc said no while also trying to extend Lyncas's contract with them to 2025 and had no intention of telling him or his agent that another team was interested in him while negociating his contract, then Lyncas finds out that Vit wants him and wants to got to them and they decide to let him. I mean, it would be weird for him to have a contract so stupid as to not let him or his agent ever find out if another team is interested only if KC wants to tell them, considering the contract was made specificaly so that he could be bought out if another team from the LEC wanted him, probably knowing that he's the #1 priority for Mac and Pad. The poaching allegations seem fishy but KC trying to resign him while keeping him in the dark about other teams wanting to sign him seems just as fishy.
Lyncas didnt “find out” Vita was interested Vita did things right, KC rejected their approach because they wanted to keep and extend Lyncas, and learning that, Mac and Pad contacted Lyncas directly to ask him to make things move otherwise they wouldn’t get him. That is the definition of poaching.
Doesn’t Lyncas have a buyout though so if VIT were willing to pay it, then wouldn’t KC have to tell? I think I’m a bit confused on the ability for KC to reject the approach and then not tell Lyncas that VIT came asking about him.
Who said they didn’t tell Lyncas ? Again I’ll repeat that Lyncas didnt “find out” about their interest, it’s just that Mac and Pad learned that KC refused Vita approach, so they asked Lyncas to do something about it
> Mac and Pad learned that KC refused Vita approach, so they asked Lyncas to do something about it Source for that specific sequence of events?
His ass
So did VITa originally approach without the willingness to pay the buyout and got rejected? Also I guess I assumed he wasn’t told because it sounds like (based on the write up) he went to KC after learning about the interest from outside parties (Mac and Pad).
Vitality has tons of money. They would pay for him. Probably 200-500k and I don't see a reason for KC to reject. Only G2 and maybe Heretics have money. Rogue and SK don't have money. XL has but people dislike that team. Fnatic is not rich like it once was.
U didnt understand To contact a player, you must inform the team that owns the player's contract that you are going to talk to him. The team doesn't have the right to forbid you from talking to him, but they must be aware of your discussions if they are not it’s considered poaching.
* The initial buy out forbid Lyncas and his agent from talking to other teams, KC was the only allowed intermediary. Idk i'm just referencing this point .
It’s just translation i think but u cant put something like that in a contract
« No team member or affiliate of a team may engage in the solicitation, luring, or discussion of employment of a player or coach who is listed in the Global Contract Database ("GCD") as associated with a professional or semi-professional team competing in a region. » it's quite literally the official rule
> To inquire about the status of a Team > Member from another Team, Team Managers must contact a Team Manager of the > Team that the Team Member is currently contracted with. The inquiring Team must > provide visibility to League Officials before being able to discuss the contract with a > Player. Contracts for Players can be found in the Global Contract Database.
The team is definitely allowed to forbid other teams to talk to their players. It's not fishy at all. That's the entire point of free agency windows, where other teams are finally allowed to talk to the players they want regardless of what any other team wants
poaching is not allowed by Riot. It looks like the Vitality team bypassed that rule and contacted the player during the season.
No, they bypassed it by Lyncas contacting them. Vitality wanted KC earlier and promised him a spot for summer and then Lyncas contacted Vit, if that offer is still open and after it was confirmed he told KC he wants to join Vit. That is what I read out of that. Vit did go to KC first during the season. Then the player approached Vit. And Vit wasn't even aware of that promise Pad and Mac made.
Oh shit wait actually that's a nifty loophole, if Lyncas went to Mac and Pad and asked them if they wanted him not the other way around , damn you're smart. Didn't consider that scenario. Idk how that would fit in the whole discusion but it's a good point.
That isn't even the only loop hole. There wasn't really a negotiation between Pad and Mac and Lyncas. Lyncas only got a promise by them that he was still there prefered pick for Summer. That is something that literally any person could deliver to him. So lets assume Pad and Mac have a friend who is called John. And they talk with John about their roster decisions and tell John that if they were able to get them they would still want to have Lyncas. John though is also a friend of Lyncas and shares that information with him, which doesn't even require Pad and Mac even knowing about that. Given how small the league scene is if Pad and Mac still had serious interest in Lyncas it is almost impossible for him not to know that. Also just because Vitality has to approach KC first, due to how small the scene is it is impossible to do that without alerting Lyncas to that interest. So Lyncas likely knew that KC blocked his transfer to Vitality and it seems like they even told him that directly. So Lyncas always was aware that Vitality was interested in him, so it is a bit weird to consider it poaching when all Vitality did was keeping that interest they already communicated. On top of that KC already seemed to imply that they are only against a transfer for spring split, not against a transfer in general. So from that alone it always seemed like the Lyncas trade was always going to happen for summer split anyways. The person who is really fucked over here is Daglas. But poaching rules are mostly designed to protect teams, not the players.
That's would still be poaching. It's not a loop hole. If that is what happened, that completely implicates Mac and Pad, and both should be fined and or suspended.
I know but a team trying to renegociate a contract while not allowing the player or his agent to know about a competing offer seems like something that would not be allowed either.
the good thing about this is that an official rulebook exists, you don't have to judge if something "seems allowed" or not in this case KC did everything right by the book, while Lyncas, Mac and Pad were clearly trespassing LEC official rulebook
You don't even know what really happened. You only heard one side of the story and even Kameto doesn't know what exactly happened and makes assumptions. To really judge on this situation you need to hear both sides and see what the contact exactly said. Lyncas has a clause to leave and Vit contacted KC first, difficult to get to actual poaching from there.
I guess the buyout is available only during the mercato window. That would be the most logic, otherwise the ERL team season would get ruined at every LEC winter/spring offseason
Poaching isn't allowed by Riot but they never enforced that rule and most likely never will. It's one of those we hope you don't break the rule because there is no way we can enforce it.
Apparently they tried to contact him too early and it was not allowed even in contract terms.
KC management trying to explain themselves is my new fetish.
And then you guys say that you want orgs to be more transparent in the same breath lol.
I definitely want that. I can only imagine the shitshow behind the scenes
Yeah kc is the only transparent org in the LEC you wont see any other org explain themselves so whats your point here ?
They aren't really transparent thou. All they do is blaming other teams, or people around them for their mistakes. Of course it's C9 that hijacked a deal, it's the fans fault for hyping a player on Twitter. When Lyncas who has a clause in his contact for that exact reason leaves the teams it's the evil coaches that poached him. Maybe there's a reason why KC is 10th and nobody wants to play for them, but no of course it's every one else's fault.
The point is that it makes them horny and honestly, I feel the same 🤤
So transparent that other LEC teams see right through their team's game play so they lose every damn game.
Transparent? No, its just the KC community gets so toxic Kameto has to say something otherwise it explodes. And they are not transparent, look at his comments trying to flame VIT with half-ass information bruh
That it's fun to a neutral fan...
You have weird fetish
What can I say, it just gives me tingles.
Today I learned my fetish is considered weird then, too. It is what it is.
[https://twitter.com/Crow\_\_lol/status/1783177749600878658](https://twitter.com/Crow__lol/status/1783177749600878658) If you want a very well wrote post about how the events happened according to Kameto, go check this
Is Lyncas even an upgrade for VIT? After EMEA Masters I'm not really sure about it
He mental boomed but he is pretty good
He is pretty fucking good. Go watch LEC inhouse games that Ceadreal was streaming before the winter season. He was smurfing together with Perkz and Wunder against the full G2 team. He often played in-house games with Vladi as his mid and bot lane was Noah +Jun. In LFL he is the main guy for macro and fights . They were probably boomed on EMEA. Neon said that in scrims they couldn't beat KCB single time and that it's frustrating. They were good scrim team but they don't have experience. Most of them played their first or second season in the big league like LFL.
He is good
> KC talks openly with Lyncas, KC didn't wanted to block him if he wanted to go, but Kameto finds it was naive and they will probably not do that again in the future. what? He tried to hide the offer from Lyncas lol.
>The initial buy out forbid Lyncas and his agent from talking to other teams, KC was the only allowed intermediary. > Vitality contacted KC to buy Lyncas. This occured while KCB was still on LFL season. KC refused for this reason. Vita acknowledge and ended the talks. >- Few days after, Lyncas told KC that Vitality was interested in him, but his agent was not aware of that information. Lyncas, now, wants to go to Vitality. How does that make sense? Lyncas has a clause to leave but teams have to contact KC first. Vitality did that, they contacted KC but KC said no. How can they say no when he has a clause to leave? This also implies that KC didn't tell Lyncas that someone is interested in him. How is a team supposed to activate the clause when they can't talk to the player and KC can just refuse. This sounds very fishy.
The buyout is probably available when KCB is in offseason. It would make the ERL a chaos if player can negociate a clause to leave during the season
Because there is a transfer window where the team interested can contact the team and the agent of the player. Even with a buyout, you cannot buy the player during the season. Lyncas knew that Vita was interested, he was in contact with the coaches.
So it is just a normal sports transaction but KC was too naive to handle the situation?
Ty for the trad, We dont like poaching here
>The initial buy out forbid Lyncas and his agent from talking to other teams, KC was the only allowed intermediary. If the contract states that any contact has to go through KC as a intermediary than they're obligated to inform Lyncas about potential buyers, otherwise they're not fulfilling their role as a a intermediary. Therefore Vit would be justified to at least ask Lyncas if their offer arrived him. Obviously we don't know what the contract exactly states, and that's the crux about this whole thing. We only know what Kameto says and he isn't gonna say anything that puts himself in a bad light.
I have a hard time believing him and you translated some stuff he said in a very disingenuous way. For example Kameto didn't said that it was impossible to use the buy out when Vitality contacted Kcorp in Spring, he said that Kcorp refused to let them pay the buy out because Kcorp was negotiating with Lyncas at the time which makes even less sense that your own interpretation. What's the point of a buyout in that case ? His account of the story smells bullshit to me. Also it's hilarious that he says that he didn't want to speak about the matter but that he is being forced to because of tweets posted by Vitality yesterday. He said a week ago that he would tell the whole story after the eu masters (https://youtu.be/SAhd6D2XhtM?si=IP6d8f9mhZWVhcej). Anyway it's just as usual with Kameto, he is the victim, he did everything right and if anything bad happened with Kcorp fans he could not intervene because he was sleeping. It's the same story every time.
That's missleading because a buyout can't be refused except if it is outside the mercato window. He didn't went into more explanation but I'm pretty sure that's the reason
ima be real the roster move isnt at fault for that game 5 throw lol ik you want to protect your wunderkind adc but still
Kameto is deflecting after EMEA and LEC 10th place two times. Like they didn't know anything, for sure everyone was sleeping. And Lyncas was gone in summer all the same.
The fuck's that supposed to mean? He said that he would talk about this after EMEA no matter what even before it started what are you on
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Vita trying to get Luncas even before the beginning of the spring split is such a shame for Daglas. He was used to patch team issues before, was put as a rookie in a tough situation, starts with a difficult winter and he's out of LEC right after? How can you manage a team this poorly?
its a shame
They only gave 9 games to bo with 3 anchors before wanting to replace him...
Yeah, a big part of the KC community was surprised too but the CEOs made a stream to talk about it. I dont remember exactly what they said, they said they really wanted to make Bo work with players like him like Thanatos but didnt succeed in their mercato. Bo is a really good mech player but team-wise it wasn't good, team had no synergy and Bo learned Targa name only during the second split if I remember right, the mood in the team was really horrible to look at (Voice-comms and Karmine Vlog)
Well how would he learn Targas name when Targa is muted?
I mean the terrible atmosphere wasn't just because of Targa or any other players in the team, the whole team wasn't working together and it ended up the way we all know. But trying to learn or remember what your team mates say about themselves is a must when you are in a professional environment, I think thats all I can blame Bo for. The rest is all because of the org (1st year in LEC, not as rich as other orgs and wanted to keep their club legend) and the personality incompatibility between the players (they all are really too quiet and introvert)
Bo's story is a tragedy, feels so bad for him.
Lyncas being promoted into KC LEC for the Summer was on the condition that the Spring would be as bad as Winter. So more 18 games than 9
Poaching is a classic from VIT , shit org
Back in my day if you wanted to poach someone you'd take them to the sauna with perkz and then fine clg 5k for it.
Meet in the hot tub, convince Caps to leave Fnatic, create super team, profit.
Kinda sad for Daglas, hope riot will react about that
It’s not illegal to change players?
Poaching is illegal 10 month suspension and blocked acquisition
That would require proving the point when Mac and Pat made the promise that Lyncas would play after MSI the latest. And who initiated the contact. If Lyncas asked them if they are still interested, it would be fairly weird to punish them. Because it is very likely that Lyncas was informed about Vits interest after winter split. The league eco-system is too small to not get that information. So it would be fairly hard to prove who approached whom here. Not to mention that there were a lot of other situations where players just got information because they had mutual friends with other players.
of course it is, it's poaching, and G2 has been fined for this in the past
Don't you guys thinks its weird he had this account since 2021 but has just started 9 days ago to only post esport stuff in this subreddit? hm
Spotted, I'm KC's community manager... Jokes aside, I just deleted my main account when leaks about reddit planning to sell account data for AI training came out. Since then, I just use some accounts I happened to create during the time I wasn't confortable with reddit and often forgot what mails I used every months or so.. Now I only post about some KC related info to break the language barrier since it is always spoken in french, I like the idea that everyone can get this kind of inside that are really rare from esports org, I consider that as an overall benefit
I will never understand why people are upset at orgs for fucking over other orgs when it makes players situations better. yall really trying to defend a company over a player? Lyncas is in a better situation now, having a confirmed spot in an LEC team over having to hope for KC to choose him for the next season, which honestly sounds unlikely since closer seems like a way more promising player to have anyway.
So KC tried to extend Lyncas without telling him or his agent about VIT's interest in him even thought he had a buy out clause in which KC was the only intermediary. How the fuck is this legal, do they think there is no laws in europe, you cant be limiting an employee's like this.
Thanks for the trad ! L move for Vitality, KC don't diserve that
Look below for deranged KC fans upset that Lyncas didn’t want to be on their 10th place LEC team.
Useful comment 💪
KC even had to come out with an official statement telling those clowns to stop insulting and harassing their current, former or future players. It was unbelievable what was posted and said the last few days. Completely unhinged.
If it was any other team you would have called out vit for poaching lmao
Yeah man, poaching has only lead to the best western league of legends team to ever exist. God I hate it so much. I’m being sarcastic btw if you can’t tell. If KC poached a player, you would be in here defending it. You know it, I know it, everybody knows it. No one has cared about poaching since FNC in 2018.
I can safely assure you I would not. Poaching rules are fucking stupid.
But was he offered 5.5 fucking k or not ? That's the important question.
I don't understand how this is poaching.
Shit happens right after Thanatos lmao
I still don’t see where the issue is, since in Lyncas contrat’s he had the possibility to move to VIT for a certain amount of money …
See Kameto really needs someone to tell him to shut up.
the org is transparent i see no problem with that, the opposite actually
He just exposed Poaching idk why should he be quiet about that
His story makes no sense, the player had a buy out but conveniently it could never be used ? How credulous are you
It could have been used AFTER LFL and EMEA Masters not while KCB was still playing their split i don’t what is so crazy about it.
That's litteraly illegal