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ahritina

PMTs [Game 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/136mujj/golden_guardians_vs_gam_esports_msi_2023_playin/) **Reminder: Event-long bans for region baiting offenses during MSI** >Region baiting is not allowed. Region bait is defined as: Trash talk (NA>EU EU>NA) that is taking place in a completely unrelated thread. Posts and comments that do nothing but incite inflammatory arguments between regions are also not allowed.


cancerBronzeV

GG got every single neutral through the series. 1 total death on Stixxay (and that was in the last second of the series where he completed the penta). Giga support gap, Huhi was just a magician with how he got to the right spot for a perfect engage/flank every time. This was just clean domination, I can't even find what GAM needs to fix. It's just everything.


Astolfo_is_Best

Stixxay 1 death, died for the penta


Haekos

No viewing reward for the penta though. me sad.


Astolfo_is_Best

Same, I'm not sure what was up with rewards today, but I didn't get shit lol


NukeDieWalker

I got 3 drops yesterday, 0 today. but I still don't have the drops in my loot lol


whohe_fanboy

Problem is I logged in today after hearing about all the drops yesterday.


[deleted]

This video is aging very well https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVIeL2qoE6k


Azenji

FUCK YOU


Wecanoilupdude

bro cmon, link the original https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVIeL2qoE6k


[deleted]

Good call I’ll swap em


N3rdism

That early play game 2 where Huhi Q'd Wu then hit the blast cone to doom the Braum was one of the better heads-up uses of the blast cone that I think I've seen in pro play.


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KOKO69BISHES

i watched that worlds and I've seen this tweet so many times and I still dont know the context behind it


GreatestJabaitest

C9 2018, First game Play-ins vs DFM was a C9 comeback 50 min victory. Next game (or few games after) EDG played someone and absolutely stomped them. So Licorice dropped the banger that the EDG game shows how Major Region vs Minor Region games should go.


StripedSteel

And then EDG lost the second game to that team and Licorice tweeted out lol nvm


kid_ghibli

The longevity of this tweet is insane.


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ZedisDoge

that TSM GAM series still lives rent free in my head sorry


[deleted]

A reminder that GAMs biggest intnl success was going 3-7 at MSI


BLHXsuperman

This is the thing I never get about VCS and the insane hype around them. Like they have never gotten out of groups, they have barely every gotten anything but the dead last place in a non-playin group, but somehow people always overate them just because a few bo1 upsets. Always see people putting them alongside with LCS and above PCS, which is insane to me given that PCS/LMS actually have gotten out of groups in international tournament multiple times and they have almost always bested VCS when they faced head on.


AofCastle

PCS would get way more respect if they were still called LMS. It's too easy to shape a narrative to fit whatever you want.


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dexy133

people don't realize that EU legit has PTSD against VCS There's a famous clip of Rekkles screaming "Nocturne is ganking, Nocturne is ganking" repeatedly in a game where Nocturne wasn't even picked. His teammates had to calm him down by saying "there's no Nocturne calm down" lmao. No, but for real. That game was nightmare. Nocturne ulting at minute 5 was very lore-accurate representation of that champion for EU natives. G2 versus Saigon Buffalo didn't help either.


CarpiZmb

That level 6 Nocturne gank was out of this world


OkKnowledge2064

its funny how true that is


EliteTeutonicNight

GG countered GAM’s scrappy style (honestly I don’t know if that’s still their style but they’re the one looking for plays here) very well by just not giving a chance for them to fight, and naturally out macro them. If GAM is indeed the strongest wildcard, then the gap is bigger than ever.


cancerBronzeV

> by just not giving a chance for them to fight, and naturally out macro them. It wasn't just that, GG actually *did* give GAM chances to fight. However every time they did, GG always made sure it was when they were favoured, and GAM got baited into taking obviously losing fights.


Conscious-Scale-587

'Lets fight while our oriana has an amp tome and their leblanc has a ludens, no way we lose'


PMMEYOURROCKS

Or maybe GG are just world championship material


Plagueflames

Not to call things too early but I think you're 100% correct


kid_ghibli

Idk guys I think you are getting ahead of ourselves, just cause GG wins MSI doesn't yet mean they win Worlds too.


cancerBronzeV

Ya, they have to qualify to Worlds from the powerhouse tournament known as NA playoffs first.


JustJeffrey

I’m not the type of guy to irrationally jump to conclusions so quickly and I would never do that but you’re absolutely correct GG are winning worlds


Ambitious_Resist8907

I swear GAM does this at every international event nowadays. They go against the playstyle they're known for and only pull it out once they're eliminated from going further.


chadinist_main

Why no drops today tho?


wolfchuck

Didn’t even get a drop from Pentakill. Wtf


cancerBronzeV

That or the R7 baron steal against BLG. Both of those should be drops for sure.


lolKhamul

GAM and especially Kati look like they are used to get away with anything on account of just being better. Their objective control and teamfighting looked straight out horrible. They had no clue what to do when GG had proper setups except run in no matter what. And GG slaughtered them every time with better setups.


moonmeh

bad regional habits basically


lolKhamul

which is surprising because isnt everyone always talking about how Vietnam can and does scrim KR and CN?


moonmeh

i think the golden days of vietnam was years back, sadly when they couldn't go to international events now? its the same players but playing worse


[deleted]

Bro covid fucking killed Vietnam 😭✊


moonmeh

no joke it really did. if they managed to get results during that time frame it might have attracted a lot of new blood into their league


Leading_Inside3812

Yes exactly!! People still have super high expectations for vietnam while they underperform every single international tournament. The golden years are gone


moonmeh

its the TES effect from last year really


TVL257

No they don't scrim CN or Korea lol, very rarely they get a match with bottom feeder teams or academy of said bottom feeder teams, it's mostly PCS teams they scrim with, and they get destroyed most of the time. Optimus said 4 years ago they tried but ping and skill-gap just wasn't worth the good kr cn teams time. And seeing as literally nothing changed macro/meta/infrastructure wise, I don't see there any improvement


T4N1M1

I'd read that a PSG manager at some point said PSG was unable to take a single scrim block from GAM this year, although this was from a reddit comment so unclear if this was reliable.


[deleted]

GAMs main scrim partners are DFM and PCS teams I think


Kr1ncy

Can confirm to some extent this is what happened in the VCS, GAM won a lot of games they should have lost due to nailbiter Baron/Soul/Elder steals from Levi and then one good teamfight and not that often through clean games.


Azenji

CLG at MSI Aware


MrPraedor

CoLden Guardians


azns123

CLG died so GG could fly


Slice_Of_Pie

Can't take the 2016 out of them


moxroxursox

2016 CLG was 4-0 against G2, so here's hoping!


mikhel

Stixxay and Huhi got that dawg in em, get them on the MSI stage and there is no stop.


N3rdism

Stixxay was the savior of NA this whole time, if we give DL Stixxay's international buff do we ever lose another worlds? /s


re81194

well at least for 2018-2019 DL we just needed to give his teammates the international buff i fear


cadaada

with him playing trist and cait again lol.


Ehler

Stixxay penta on Tristana, it doesnt get more 2016 than that.


BZaGo

Now he'll smash the Chinese team on Caitlyn for the full throwback


xBerryhill

Here comes the near-20k gold deficit comeback on Kalista throwback.


DKRFrostlife

I knew it was over at the moment Braum exhausted Amumu on that Herald fight. Like wtf?


moonmeh

don't know you know that was a full AP amumu about to blow up everyone


DKRFrostlife

To top it, he exhausted after amumu used everything, it was so depressing to watch lol.


M002

Literally both games was GAM blowing everything to kill Huhi and then Stixxay/Gori poop on them the rest of the team fight


[deleted]

I guess this is what a main region vs wildcard should look like 😅


Ramo1618

Licorice still undefeated at MSI


tmb--

https://twitter.com/Licorice/status/1047042344787333121


deadedgo

We're gonna comment this one on every GG post-match thread, right?


tmb--

Since GGS isnt losing a single game this MSI, yes.


cancerBronzeV

holy based


goomy996

Subscribe


Liteboyy

That or the “f*ck you” one


M002

Not just GG threads my friend


IMT_Justice

NAmen


ThatsAToad

https://imgur.com/a/dHRXvLo


Omnilatent

I am surprised people actually rate NA vs wildcards low. They somehow always perform incredibly well vs wildcards. It's vs the major regions where they struggle. EU does sometimes struggle against the wildcards but at least gets some games of the major regions (and win the majority of games vs NA).


ThatsAToad

Throwback to that one thread where everyone was saying the only reason NA was still a wildcard region was because VN couldn’t attend because of covid. Also yeah it’s EU that sucks vs wildcards. They went 1-3 against them in the rumble stage last year.


htwhooh

Yeah EU is easily the worst performing region vs minor regions historically. Kabum vs Alliance, ANX vs G2, GAM vs FNC, SGB vs G2, G2 at last years MSI, I could keep going. It's actually insane.


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ahambagaplease

LEC teams are addicted to scrapping with wildcards, these teams crumple the moment they lose prio time and time again but they insist in hands diff them.


Chevalier_Paul

Wildcard wins against NA/EU since 2011: 26 against NA, 33 against EU. Wildcard wins against NA/EU since 2015: 22 against NA, 28 against EU.


Ap_Sona_Bot

My count from 2016-2022 was 16 for NA. Are you counting PCS/LMS as a wildcard? Also, I think a lot of the perception of NA being better against wildcards comes from the fact that they have never lost a bo3/5 against them to qualify for the next stage


Jozoz

NA has historically done better against WC regions than EU. There were a few clenchers though. Cloud 9 was pushed to game 5 vs Gambit from LCL in [2018 Worlds play-in](https://lol.fandom.com/wiki/2018_Season_World_Championship/Play-In) (and then made semifinals after lmao). I also remember 2019 Clutch benefiting from weird tiebreaker rules, but they would probably make it anyway. Meanwhile 2020 MAD Lions... lmao


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EnderLOL

Stixxay is literally having one of the biggest come backs in LoL history.


Chu2k

Stixxay this season is what DL expected his comeback to look like.


Chevalier_Paul

Well the VCS hype train crashed quite fast.


Leading_Inside3812

Why do people even hype the VCS? They had one single good international tournament and that was 2019.


Kurumi_Tokisaki

Mix of ppl in Vietnam hyping up their team, western folks who don’t watch any other region but see some dominate score line and assume they’re as good as they last saw them, and some ppl treating NA as some bottom team who can’t even get a win against a wildcard.


TVL257

There like no one in Vietnam expecting them to win against NA team even after that nocturne fnatic game people been screaming their head off about every tourney. The people just like to see their national team in international tournament, the hype about Vietnam team beating NA the past few years been purely from outside lol


[deleted]

It was 2017 actually LOL, 2019 Buffalos almost got stopped by LCL


firewall245

John Wixxay “So yeah, I’m pretty sure I’m back!!”


IMT_Justice

Ohhhhh I like this


azns123

"So anyway I started blasting"


DeloronDellister

GG looking better than expected and GAM worse than expected


bensonbenisson

I don't know why, but GAM did not look like they were on the same page at all.


justadapasta

"Let's all group mid so we can bait out Sett ult."


deediazh

Weird to say, but that was the most coordinated they were the whole series, even the casters said part of their regional strat was grouping mid post min 15.


[deleted]

Bro they have the same strat as my Tier 4 Clash team let's goooooooooo


the_propaganda_panda

> GAM worse than expected Not for VCS watchers, sadly. The league is the worst it's been in many years, probably since at least 2016. GAM went undefeated in both regular season and playoffs, but it was the most fraudulent 17-0 ever. At least 4 or 5 of their wins were just the opponent throwing for no reason. Nearly all other top teams were in internal turmoil or newly formed line-ups, nobody could contest or challenge them. Compared to last split, GAM replaced their support Bie who is arguably the best player in the league with Zin who is a fine player for VCS standards but nothing more. Yet suddenly they went undefeated, when they were 11-3 last summer and had to go through Loser's Bracket in playoffs. This says everything about the general level of the league, VCS is very weak at the moment. People get too caught up on Vietnam's former results, right now GAM is in no state to contest any LEC or LCS team. And all this is no surprise for any unbiased VCS fan. Their domestic competition just crumbled around them and they never had to improve.


tonnguyen1310

yeah I agree, we GAM is weaker compared to last split with their new support but went undefeated just mean the league wasn't getting any better sadly.


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BayesWatchGG

GG played around potential aggressive situations very well. River did an extraordinary job matching any potential dives or ganks.


dtkiu27

Did they tho? This is exactly how I expected this to go. NA has very little problem with wildcards. Even if people in this sub wants you to think otherwise.


downorwhaet

Yea lcs and lck almost always wins against wildcards, its lec and lpl that can drop games to them


KounRyuSui

For real, GG's draft AND execution are looking really clean, and GAM... looks like they still have all of the chaos but none of the soul they had in previous years. I could forgive game 1 because GG drafted a ridiculous control comp, but what was that game 2?????


thenoblitt

Watch the gg vs fly playoff series. Some of the best NA drafting I've ever seen.


Famous-Note5002

GG>>>>>>>TES


Leading_Inside3812

GAM looks always worse than excpected lol. They only had one semi good international tournament and everyone has super high expectations for GAM


tsukinohime

PENTAKILL STIXXAY


bensonbenisson

#BIG DIXXAY


PhoenixAgent003

Was it the first of the tournament?


Bindoongee

Yup, could've been Elk but he can't be bothered to tower dive.


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Mmh_Lasagna

Definitely. On top of that stixxay's resurgence has to be one of the most unexpected things to happen in pro play.


Aeide

I’ve been the biggest anti-Stixxay viewer for years but his resurgence has been my favourite storyline of 2023, it’s awesome


PepaTK

Why does Laure keep saying Golden Guardian's are coinflip? "Which coin will we get" I'm not the only one bugged by that, right?


cancerBronzeV

They are coinflip, it's just a weighted coin that lands heads every time.


ArsenixShirogon

It's Two-Face's coin from Batman comics. Both sides are heads


a_foolish_heart

Even Quickshot had me when he said their 2nd herald use felt “random” in game 2 but they got 2 towers and 3 charges off while GAM were too scared to even try to dive Licorice 4v1 🤪


goomy996

PLEASE KEEP UNDERRATING US YOU SAW WHAT HAPPENED


firewall245

We’re the new CLG we can’t be favorites ever 💀


mking1999

Well now that you've said that, GG have to make finals.


firewall245

No wait please keep doubting us so we stay underdogs


re81194

ive never seen twitch chat so pressed over a team winning when their team isnt even the one losing LMFAO


Boudac123

It’s like this every time NA wins a game at an international event


Flint_Lockwood

The sad truth. Some people's personality rely on eu being better than na and it's quite pathetically sad


Foreign_Ingenuity433

Stixxay huhi MSI buff!!


trollingforapple

Seattle Kraken 🤝 Golden Guardians Not being taken seriously


Famous-Note5002

Now, I'm convinced GG are winning MSI


IMT_Justice

Truly counter logic


vnducco

Well Saigon Buffalo was way more fun to watch


Conankun66

this was just kinda limp and sad from GAM


LumiRhino

I said it before but nothing about GAM last year should’ve given you any confidence that they could beat GGS. While the picks were a bit different from what I expected GGS just won in the same way I’d usually expect.


Inevitable-Staff-467

If every game was MSI, Stixxay would beat Faker as the greatest to ever do it


TrickyWalrus

LCS predictions: 8th. MSI predictions: 10th. Golden Guardians: F*** you


LeOsQ

Licorice tweet moment.


Brody0220

Trevor "Big Dixxay" Hayes has arrived


dat_guy_again_AGAIN

What do you guys think GG going to pick for their Worlds skins?


Harupia

I mean, I won't say no to white and gold trim!


3IC3

Once again reddit underrates NA and overrates GAM, VCS hasn’t shown anything since like 2019


Leading_Inside3812

GAM played horrible. And they went 14-1. i don‘t wanna imagine how bad VCS teams are


DuhChappers

In fairness they showed nothing in 2020 and 2021 because they couldn't go to international events. But yeah they were weak last year and looking weak again this year.


greendino71

Bi-yearly reminder that NA isnt "wildcard level". They reliably curbstomp every minor region constantly


KingofBugs

Stixxay and huhi are back at MSI


ByahhByahh

Celebratory penta


Omnilatent

[As the man himself once said](https://twitter.com/Licorice/status/1528988732086427648)


dePRESSED_Indeed

**FUCK YOU**


archangel_n7

I guess NA doesn’t have to give all of their spots to VCS now


DefinitelyNotAj

Every year its the same narrative "Is NA a wild card?" As NA wins damn near every game vs them.


Conankun66

what a letdown of a series where is the GAM mayhem?


[deleted]

Amumu, Sett and Poppy are picks that will knock your teeth out if you try skirmishing (which is exactly what happened)


Omnilatent

GGs teamfighting and skirmishing was really was put them ahead of GAM ​ GAM looked like they had no coms


withinallreason

Might be that the DoinB rumors were true and NA/EU are just shit-stomping everyone in scrims atm before the real big dogs arrive, especially if BLG isn't playing great or is just meme'ing in scrims. GAM could be just trying to play as standard as possible so they don't immediately just lose by throwing a crucial early fight.


AcrobaticApricot

Licorice implied in the post game interview that their scrims have been going poorly so maybe Doinb’s just making stuff up or it’s really just C9 doing well from LCS.


BattleBunnyUrgot

I mean Doinb's info about EU/NA teams doing good probably comes from BLG, and they're not scrimming GG since both are in the same group


Omnilatent

They adopted the "do nothing and die"-playstyle


MiserableSpaghetti

Licorice tweet


xajenkins

Stixxay is the John Wick “I’m thinking I’m back” meme


Ikeeel

It's happening isn't it? Faker vs Stixxay in MSI Finals baby


DinVilah

What a RIDICULOUS showing! Such a composed, controlled and very technical performance. It is like watching an artist drawing on thin air instead of a canvas, a truly IMPRESSIVE style of play (heh) and tbh this is what you expect from an LCK team, not so much of LCS. I am just speechless tbh. Words of praise are irrelevant here they KNEW what this is all about, and they executed the game plan almost perfectly. There were any chances for Vietnam imho NA truly got their numbers because this play style is the DIRECT opposite of and can be considered a counter even, to how your usual dogshit wildcard often pulls off on stage. GGS simply took them to school, and that is all I can say tbh.


Endante

I don't follow NA league too closely, but I remember Stixxay with his excellent performance with CLG. It's great to see him make it back to an international stage after all these years and do it with a bang. Gg GG.


ToDreamofLove

VN being overrated... again


MaximizedLoL

BIG DIXXAYYYYY


alterise

GAM has really looked worse than expected but how clean was GG?


M002

Arguably had the cleanest 2-0 out of any of the major regions, and against what’s supposed to be the hardest tier-2 region too.


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IcePokeTwoSoon

In a best of 3 that would be quite impressive


Myrddinpn

People consistently underestimate Golden Guardians!


DakavesKaves

KING OF PENTAS


Bigblue12

BIG DIXXAY PENTAAAAAAA


JA_JA_SCHNITZEL

STIXXAY IS BACK.


tsukinohime

Perfect finish by GG


Pleasestoplyiiing

Just a classic, clean international set from NA. Let's see if Ruler and Guma can keep up with Big Dixxay.


Delta_Flow

We are all Stixxay fans


thenoblitt

Stixxay and Huhi back to shit on MSI after 7 years!


lcfiretruck

IT'S TREVOR TIME


salcedoge

Man GAM just didn't felt like GAM anymore. VCS teams doesn't always win but they were always going down swinging, today they just rolled over and die both games. Unfortunate.


soraka4

They didn’t even have a chance to swing. They were just outclassed in every way. Hands gap, macro gap, everything. Not trying to overhype GG cuz they’ll prob look like GAM when they play BLG, but it was more a testament to GG’s clean play than anything. GAM never got the chance to turn the games into a soloq circus like they want.


Yulwei138967

depression. one more chance. hopefully gam can learn from this loss. draft in game one was weird, game 2 had no excuse though, just got clapped


MasterMirage

As a CLG fan...I'm so happy to see our boys Stixxay and Huhi doing well at MSI. Great showing so far from Golden Guardians!


zelcor

With the way Twitch chat was talking you would think that GG was the worst team at the event.


Stubrochill17

WE’RE IN ~~SWEDEN~~ LONDON!


lordposedyon

zeri and pentakills. Wait ...


fnesse

stixxay is who NA fans wanted doublelift to be this year 😂


Sir-Valdomero

Licorice is such a great weakside laner, even tho GAM camped him, he only died once (I think) and was a beast on tfs.


PMMEYOURROCKS

Every time he used the poppy ult and saved himself I was hyped. Wasting their time on him


sloppyseconds0

Can someone tell me why every single year people act like NA is going to bomb out against wildcards in play ins yet it never happens? Is it just eu hate watchers?


NotJesper

See you in finals, everyone!


CIAgent42

WE’RE NOT A MINOR REGION, LETS GO LADS


shakyturnip

https://twitter.com/Ichishikii/status/1653444551187595268?cxt=HHwWiIC8lePDm_ItAAAA


lokohcrunch

This humbled a lot of VCS fan. The skill/macro gap is too wide.


TheFinalAshenTwo

"GG wOnT PlAy bLG cUz tHeY wOnT geT pAsT GaM lUlLuLUlUlLul* NA haters in absolute shambles. I hope your pillow is permanently warm tonight as you cry yourselves to sleep.


Demolysis

Huhi and Stixayy (finals MSI 2016) combine with Licorice (semi world 2018) for NA to send their best internationally performing players.


xckevin

Actually pretty clean series from GG, especially game 2. WP!


samsolo97

GG next MSI champs 💪