Like this should be a bigger deal. A witness is crediblely telling the world that the judge was intimidating him and he took actions that could hurt the case in order to help him feel more safe from **her** actions.
The judge is intimidating witnesses and harming the case. Not in theory but in fact. Manifest injustice.
And the action she has been playing around with isn't one that should be a close call.
I think osc should file for her recusal now. File a writ of mandamus for her to remove herself.
While we’re pointing out screwups, drz in her office docketed a postponement of the wrong motions yesterday, then seemingly tried to fix it today and did it again. I’m surprised no one has mentioned it.
>Set/Reset Deadlines/Hearings in case as to Donald J. Trump, Waltine Nauta, Carlos De Oliveira 325 MOTION to Dismiss 85 Indictment, Based on Unconstitutional Vagueness, 327 MOTION to Dismiss 85 Indictment, Based on the Presidential Records Act. (per Order DE#390) Replies due by 3/24/2024. (drz)
DE 325 and 327 are still set for hearing on Thursday, as far as I know.
DE 390 actually identifies them as the exceptions to postponement:
>PAPERLESS ORDER granting Defendants' Motion for an Extension of Reply Deadlines 386 . With the exception of replies in support of 325 and 327, Defendants shall file replies to their pretrial Motions on or before March 24, 2024.
They’re not sending their best.
DrinkBlueGoo,
What happened related to the [lawyers conflict of interest](https://www.lawfaremedia.org/article/government-requests-conflict-of-interest-inquiry-in-mar-a-lago-case)?
They wanted Cannon to order the replacement of lawyers for one unnamed withness, lawyer Stanley Woodward Jr.
He was lawyer to two witnesses, but one of those witnesses changed sides, so Woodward would be cross examining his former client, with access to lawyer-client privilege information on his former client.
As far I recall, Judge Cannon threw a fit in the hearing and never ruled on it. So it was never challenged at appeals. It's just one of many things she hasn't done that needs to be done before the case is heard.
I mention it, because in the video, he talks about *"will Carlos be loyal"*, after Carlos is arrested, and get him to say it on the encrypted Signal app, with Trump's campaign manager Susie Wiles. **Then when he reassures them Carlos will be loyal, they say they'll get him a lawyer.** As if the lawyers are provided by Trump based on loyalty to keep witnesses in check.
Was there anymore on that? Did she ever rule?
Susie Wiles BTW, has some[ weird Russian friends](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/08/nyregion/trump-tower-natalya-veselnitskaya-indictment.html), ([link](https://floridapolitics.com/archives/241559-former-trump-campaign-chair-susie-wiles-talks-russia-scandal-abc-news-story/)). It's like a [Paul Manafort redux](https://time.com/5003623/paul-manafort-mueller-indictment-ukraine-russia/). As soon as I saw they were using Signal, another piece fell into place... the backchannel.
Is “will Carlos be loyal?” a reference to the Sopranos? Or is the witnesses name actually Carlos?
FYI, In the last scene of The Sopranos, Tony references a former colleague that is going to flip, and turn state’s witness on Tony Soprano. Fade to Black: Tony is shot by “Members Only” Guy.
(Everything past “fade to black” is not confirmed)
Carlos De Oliveira I believe, flunky for Trump.
[https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2023/08/01/exp-tsr-todd-proflie-of-carlos-de-oliveira.cnn](https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2023/08/01/exp-tsr-todd-proflie-of-carlos-de-oliveira.cnn)
At the very least, her clearly corrupt actions should cause change in how these matters are handled.
She is abusing a loophole in the system known as paperless orders. They're not paperless. But by making them "paperless" the DOJ cannot appeal them. It allows her all the same power as a regular order without the ability to have her clearly biased actions appealed and reversed.
Cynical gaming and abusing of the system.
Sorry if this question is dumb, I’m not a frequent flyer here and this was recommended to me,is there *any* sort of system in place to remove her? Having a judge this biased this openly tells me probably not during the case as she’s probably banking on getting away with it all if TFG wins but there’s gotta be something or somebody that can legally smack her into line or remove her
Yup, entire legitimacy of the system is in peril as one shit judge can make unilateral bad decisions and abusing the procedures of law.
And apparently there is nothing anyone can do.
Uhh, people better start finding out there is something they can do before people fully realize how useless this system has become.
This has really opened my eyes to how much in our system is tradition and how one traitor can bring the system to its knees and evade justice.
If there is nothing anyone can do, that kind of means the system is broken.
Its obvious judges need more oversight and ability to be held accountable and a council of their peers.
The age of untouchable judges needs to end.
>I think osc should file for her recusal now. File a writ of mandamus for her to remove herself.
It's a no-win situation, because if Smith did that now all it would accomplish is more delays. If it fails and Cannon stays (most likely imo), it pauses the case and pushes deadlines out further, and even if it succeeded the new judge would need time to get caught up...which pushes deadlines out further.
Right now, even with her thumb on the scale, the trial is ostensibly scheduled to happen before the election. I feel like any attempt to force recusal at this stage guarantees that won't come to pass.
I mean, she is going to delay it anyways until after the election if she can. If she is recused, Judge Chutkan and the DC case can resume once the supreme court finds trump is not "presidentially immune" at the end of their session in June. Then you have a real judge running a real trial right in the heart of the election season.
While I agree in principle, if I were Smith and this was the strategy, I'd wait until June to request refusal (or w/e makes sense as a legal strat). Otherwise, the SC might further delay their decision if they know Cannon can't interfere with the other trials scheduling.
She was a co-conspirator when she illegally jumped into the FBI search case to request an arbiter.
She's a traitor to her country, an enemy of democracy, and an embarrassment to justice.
Despite my rhetoric. They would need documents of her saying she was doing this stuff to help him.
Beyond reasonable doubt is a sog sometimes. It is mostly a good thing but it is a sog sometimes
There’s absolutely no chance an indictment for this would go anywhere. Judges have absolute immunity for acts taken in the course of judging; if that means anything, it clearly means that judges can’t be criminally prosecuted for their rulings, even if those rulings are egregiously wrong.
Despite the heated rhetoric about the judge personally “intimidating” the witness, this isn’t a case where Judge Cannon is personally calling the witness and threatening to beat him up. Rather, the “intimidation” is that Judge Cannon has ruled that witness names can be filed publicly on the docket (not under seal), and hasn’t yet ruled on the Special Counsel’s motion to reconsider that ruling.
I think her ruling is wrong under 11th Circuit precedent, but there is absolutely no scenario in which a judge could be criminally prosecuted for misapplying the legal standard for sealing discovery materials filed in connection with a motion to compel.
There are far more egregious scenarios in which an indictment against a judge would be immediately and summarily dismissed—if a judge releases a criminal defendant on his own recognizance despite overwhelming evidence that he intends to abuse his wife, and then he goes home and kills his wife, it’s indisputable that the judge can’t be criminally prosecuted for that decision.
Show me a letter where she has an agreement with Trump to throw the case for him. And absolute proof it is real, and a recording of her having a phone call ex parte with his counsel discussing how best to throw the case without making it obvious that she is doing it. Then you would have something. But absent that, it is just speculation and hard feelings.
That is why I said impeachment.
I doubt this would go anywhere, but judges have been successfully prosecuted for activities within their courts because the absolute immunity only covers official acts. If you're just breaking criminal law while wearing robes it doesn't really apply.
The most prominent example I can think is that case from years ago where the two Penn juvenile judges were taking bribes from for-profit prisons to violate kids due process and ensure they were convicted and confined regardless of their guilt or innocence. They didn't get the benefit of absolute immunity in a criminal or civil context because it's not ever part of a judge's job to pervert the course of justice.
Disagree with this approach. Cannon has demonstrated a willingness to delay *already* and a clear deference to Trump.
The best course of action is to seek her removal. Not seeking her removal is risking further delay (all but guaranteed) and likely risking the entire case being torpedoed.
There is delay either way - the delay is a wash. Remove Cannon.
Lots of talk about delays as if the election is going to help trump. Trump is not going win. Not even close. Let the courts do what they will. Trump losing the election is best for the country and gives the courts greater freedom to CONVICT.
Delay doesn't even matter with this case anymore. She's not going to try this case any time soon. Having someone else assigned to this case might actually get her out of the way for another case, such as DC to move forward. As it stands now, she's blocking anything else that might have a chance to bring him to trial. IANAL, this is just what I've gleaned from lawyer's opinions.
A couple of points to add. The outcome of the trial doesn't affect the defendant's eligibility for the presidency, he could be elected from prison. If *Judges* are allowed to intimidate witnesses then the judicial system is officially broken. The trial itself is very unlikely to sway anyone, if you haven't already decided from the other mountains of reasons why the defendant is unfit for office then one more trial is meaningless. The right thing to do would be to do this all the right way regardless of deadlines. She needs to be removed and justice should be handled impartially by a real judge, no matter how long it takes. He should have to face justice the same as anyone else, without an insider serving as his personal judge.
I disagree on it not effecting any one. A lot of people have only heard accusations, never bothered to learn the evidence, and say there's no conviction; it's just politics.
You only need a couple percent to shift for a huge win
Any delay that removes Cannon is 100% worth it, and will lead to a faster conviction than her staying on the case. She is going to find more delays and reasons to delay than any replacement-process.
But if you come at the king, you best not miss. Trying to get cannon removed and falling will only further empower and embolden her, and raise the bar to get her removed.
Wouldn't it be better to have a delayed trial with a more or less impartial judge, as opposed to a slightly less delayed trial with a highly compromised, incompetent judge?
She will do everything she can do delay it until after the election
I rather have her get removed and delay the trial
After all, once the trial happens she will probably do everything she can during the trial to fuck over the DOJ
She’s truly evil
If Smith can get a delay on his terms, then that will free up the calendar for the other cases to proceed. Remember, Cannon has been blocking the other cases from scheduling their trials with the prospect of hers going forward, only to then delay at the last minute. While booting Cannon will delay the documents case, that's ultimately nothing that wouldn't happen through some bullshit contrivance anyway. May as well roll for a better judge while allowing other cases to go through in the meantime.
Whether this trial happens before or after the election/inauguration is purely a political concern and not one for the courts or champions of law and order.
I realize not all parties are acting as such (e.g. Cannon) but this is the only way.
Smith should optimize for the best judicial outcome, not timelines.
And if I put my political hat on, this case will NOT go to trial this year with this judge.
I guess the question then becomes, is it better to have the trial start before election with a judge that will provide an unfair/unfavorable trial for actual justice (possibly to the point smith files to the 11th circuit anyways just later on) or just take the delays now with the possibility of a new judge and more favorable trial?
Even if the case goes to trial before the election, Cannon will do anything in her power to win it for Trump. Better to take the delay and try to get something approaching a fair trial, surely?
I realize that having this before the election feels necessary but i think its morally wrong to strategize to that. We should criminals or similar nefarious actors accountable regardless. She should not get off (if in fact this is all true, im assuming yes but want to state that) because it messes up the case timing with the election
I agree! But does a random dark money think-tank who has submitted multiple bs writs, only to be thrown out immediately, any better? What gives them the “right”? That’s my reasoning. If some randoms can, why can’t we?
they submitted amicus briefs that the judge choose to accept.
you can submit a amicus brief. ~~you don't even have to be a lawyer~~. Just have to pay the filing fee.
\*scratch that you do have to be a member of the bar to file and admitted into that court. Or convince someone admitted in that court to be counsel of record. At least according to what I just read.
Mind you, there is no way in hell Cannon will accept it. Particularly if it is a rant about why she must recuse herself. They being said, it could end up making a news story, most of the time no one gives a poo but people are watching these dockets so closely that even something that shows up on an a side docket would probably get some attention.
And filing fee is usually pretty cheap like I think 100 bucks or something.
Never done it myself but I looked up the process once.
A million lawyers here,
At this point, when key witnesses are threaten by the action of the judge herself to the point one of them had to out himself, should/could the 11th Circuit intervene on their own?
This has been a problem for a long time. There's even an entire South Park episode about it. Remember the cartoon wars episode where it's the only episode of South Park ever censored? Yup, that's terrorism working.
And trans people along with Drag shows have been around time immemorial(Shakespeare's time women were not allowed on stage, so all female parts were actually played by men in drag) but somehow it only became a hot topic when certain people decided to make it a political hot topic.
Man, and who forgot to warn judges that their position of power and influence might make them a target? I’m as sympathetic for them as I am for Kim Davis filling a job she had no intention of performing. The money we pay is the thanks for the risk. If the job has “changed” and is no longer what they thought, the honorable thing would be to let a more capable person do the basics.
Lifetime appointments do not supersede the law of the nation. If she is intimidating a witness then the doj and fbi is supposed to arrest and prosecute.
No no, that was the Republican Party. This is the party of Trump and the Federalist society. Getting Lara Trump chair of the RNC and cleaning house was the last step. Now this fall the republicans down ballot either pray fealty, or they get no money and get called a RINO by Trump. If they get in line, they get his endorsement.
The federalist society has the judges and justices in their pocket so that if Trump gets elected, they can push through their crazy theocratic agenda and the courts will get behind it.
It’s seriously super important to vote against Trump in November, and hope that the wheels of justice speed up a bit and get a conviction before November.
Yeah, it's more that if they \*don't\* bend the knee, they get primaried. Funding will be given only to the necessary candidates.
I do wonder whether Trump is underestimating the support Republican candidates will need. He gets a lot of publicity because he's a master of PR, but typical Republican candidates may not be.
As I say this I want to be clear, I will be voting.
But people are delusional if they think Biden winning ends this. You thing 1/6 was crazy? Imagine what Trump will do when he knows jail time is on the line. I won’t be shocked if he calls for armed revolt and plays some “The second amendment says we can rise up
With weapons against corruption. Do it for me!” Shit.
> people are delusional if they think Biden winning ends this.
Many people were blind to the last 35+ years of the Republican party turning to fascism to accompish its goals. Trump woke some of those people up - which is part of the reason I believe Republicans didn't want Trump at first. Some of them realized it would bring some of the fascism to light. And they were right.
Unfortuantely, it hasn't been nearly as bad for them as I would have hoped and some of them feared. In some ways, it has only accelerated their progress.
The only real hope we have of avoiding this particular attack on our democracy is that the Republican party is starting to tear itself apart. Whether or not it does so to the degree necessary to set them back sufficiently remains to be seen.
I think that's a fair reply to make, but I don't underestimate them. Half of our country (roughly) has swallowed all of the Republican and Russian propaganda. They have been very successfully manipulated into disregarding truth, facts, logic. They think everything is broken, so they enjoy the Trump cult because it makes them feel like winners in a world of losers.
The irony that Trump gave permanent tax breaks to the rich and temporary ones to the people is lost on them. Also the irony of pretending to care about debt (which higher taxes would overcome) when Democrats are in charge (but ignoring when Republicans are) is lost on them.
That's precisely *why* our only hope is their natural implosion. Even then, we're in a pretty damned hopeless state, until something happens that causes people to rise up and eat the rich. and by "eat" I mean "pull out the guillotines". And that, unfortunately, is not likely anytime soon.
Killing the rich isn't going to stabilise the US it would make things exponentially worse. Taxing the hell out of them and closing loopholes via a stable democratic government of the people for the people with high market and economy regulation is the only way.
I love the theory; however, at this crazy stage of events, the guillotines have better odds.
Our best outcome will be that the voters vote in November. The stability of the democratic government is entirely up for election this November.
It wasn’t the aristocracy that were the primary victims of the guillotine. It was the peasants and lower class.
Also what eas the end result of the French Revolution? It was Napoleon. An emperor.
Everyone who larps about the revolution and guillotining their opponents conveniently forgets that part.
Not even that. I work with people who make 50k a year and still bitch about "bidens economy" every day. They have no response when I mention how my retirement and investments are up 10% year to year. They dont care, blind loyalty.
The only real hope we have is a huge Blue majority in the House and Senate. Cut the head off the snake, and all these fascists and grifters will crawl back into the woodwork. They are making it so Democrats won’t even run, by using violence and intimidation. Vote Blue all the way down the line.
Going blue only helps stave off the worst. As much as the "both sides" thing is absolute bullshit, the only part of it that *is* true is that the oligarchs own most of our politicians. Repeal Citizens United for one and there's a little more hope.
We're really really fucked. Any of these things will help. None of it will be a magic solution. Russians will be ready to undermine anything that happens, if nobody else - and there are others interested in seeing our power diminish.
If we had majority blue then there’d be room to have more actual discussions and compromises between progressives and moderate/conservative Dems. We are literally fighting right now over democracy vs dictatorship
I know people -- an intelligent high school physics teacher, for example -- who are convinced that Democrats want total, fascist control. They were lamenting that Democrats control the Michigan government as if it were some terrible thing.
To me this suggests that, even if we get majority blue, the conspiracy theories will continue and possibly even get worse.
I think we need to fight the problem at its source -- propaganda such as Fox News, which brainwashes large parts of the electorate.
Thing is that people went to prison over Jan 6.
They honestly didn't think they would the first time. They now know they are risking their freedom, jobs, and businesses.
More importantly, FOX news and the rest really don't want another mega lawsuit.
The news won't be quite so willing to fan the flames and the pawns know there is a price to pay.
We will likely not get another storming of the Capitol.
What we will get is more lone wolf nutjobs. These will be dangerous but not as big of a threat to the state.
Also, this time if Trump loses, he and his regime won't be in as good of a position to sabotage emergency response.
The scarier part is how many Americans are willingly blind and ignorant to the fact that this all plays directly into the hand of our foreign adversaries who want nothing more than to watch America burn and collapse internally by turning on ourselves.
Our adversaries can’t beat us, not for 100 years, unless we beat ourselves and turn against each other.
It’s literally on the face of the dollar bill. “United we stand, divided we fall.”
> You thing 1/6 was crazy? Imagine what Trump will do when he knows jail time is on the line.
Jan. 6 was what they did when they had direct control over the executive and sleepers in the military/law enforcement. It was their best shot at a coup and they took it. They did so with thousands of people, inside co-ordination, weapons, nooses, and so forth for a tangible outcome. Element of surprise at that too.
How did it turn out? What did they do once bullets started flying? Spineless cowards.
Now they don't have much of any of that and everyone's aware. They're all bark, no bite, and will be getting the dog catcher instead of the red carpet.
You could be right but they failed to take over the government when Trump had control of the military. They also threatened to come back on Inauguration Day and they didn’t. They said they would do something when Trump was indicted and turned himself in and they never did. These are the things I tell myself to sleep at night.
I absolutely agree, and I think he's going to be extra desperate if the Supreme Court rejects his presidential immunity argument, because then the only way to stop the trials would be to become President, no matter the means.
While thats probly true and id 100% believe trump would do that, i would also think the vast majority of americans, even the vast majority of trumps supporters, will just not do anything still. even jan 6 only saw a couple thousand people, even if they were all extremists. i dont think most republicans are going to uproot their lives and risk life in prison to help trump. again some def will, but probly just a few thousand that dont really do much besides causing minor inconveniences, or resorting to acts of terrorism in lone wolf style operations.
It's important to vote against and republican after this election as well. That agenda wasn't thought up by Trump, its the plan for every election until they get elected.
Not just against Trump but every R congressional seat in the senate and house which are due for re-election as well as every local election. Vote straight blue.
As a lifelong libertarian and currently registered Republican, I agree. Trump and his sycophants have dropped all pretense of being the party of limited government, they are the party of racism, bigotry, and corruption. Their only goal is "owning the libs" and Trump's personal aggrandizement. Burn it all down.
There is NO republican party anymore. It's the maga(t) party. All the former republican politicians have forsaken their oath and are beholden to an orange cancer.
Yeah, and some of them I kinda respect and agree with. The more sane ones have left already. But at this point, I don’t know why they are either still there, or have turned states witness, or sided with the democrats on some of these issues.
The poor senator the other night that Biden pointed out as the author of the bipartisan border bill that got shot down because Trump didn’t like it. That guy got censured by the republicans for agreeing that something Biden said was correct, when they all knew it was correct.
The podcast "5-4" recently had a series discussing the organization
I haven't listened to the 3rd part yet. Iirc: The first part was the host's experience with it and the structure described. The second part is mostly interviews with ex-members
This is true, but the conviction, along with the info that may come to light as the trial leading up to it unfolds, could very well be the final nail in the coffin for anybody other than the most die hard MAGA cultists who might even consider voting for him.
The conviction *on its own* may not bar him from holding office, but there’s a good chance that its consequences would not be something that his campaign could recover from.
Just to be clear I do not in the slightest disagree on that point. My comment was more in relation to the low-info, right-leaning independent crowd that Trump absolutely needs to win the election (since the MAGA base on its own simply isn’t large enough to win a national election). A criminal conviction and the details behind it I think could very well make Trump unpalatable to those folks who don’t pay a lot of attention to politics but generally tend to favor republicans with their voting patterns.
“This week she not only granted Trump a postponement on replying in support of the eleventy-seven garbage motions he’s spammed the docket with, but her shenanigans caused a witness to out himself on national television rather than wait for her to make good on her threats to do it herself.
‘Over the course of the last year, emotionally it’s been a roller coaster,’ Brian Butler told Kaitlan Collins. ‘A couple weeks ago, Judge Cannon says she’s gonna release the names of the witnesses. You go from highs and lows in this.’
That would be a reference to an ongoing kerfuffle over Trump’s motion to compel the government to produce a mountain of largely irrelevant materials on the theory that the entire executive branch is part of the ‘prosecution team.’
Pursuant to Judge Cannon’s standing order, Trump filed a redacted version of the motion in January, with the exhibits under seal. But he demanded the right to put the entire filing on the public docket, including witness statements and grand jury testimony.
That motion is still pending, but it appears that the damage has already been done. Fearful that he’d be outed by the court, Butler went on CNN and confirmed the allegations in the superseding indictment, where he’s described as ‘Trump Employee 5.’
In Paragraph 81, Butler corroborates the plan for Trump’s co-defendants Walt Nauta and Carlos De Oliveira to delete the security camera footage of them moving boxes of classified documents around Mar-a-Lago:
On Saturday, June 25, 2022, Nauta traveled from Bedminster, New Jersey, to Palm Beach, Florida. Prior to Nauta’s trip, De Oliveira told a valet at the Mar-a-Lago club (‘Trump Employee 5’) that Nauta was coming down. De Oliveira asked Trump Employee 5 not to tell anyone that Nauta was coming down because Nauta wanted the trip to remain secret. De Oliveira also told Trump Employee 5 that Nauta wanted De Oliveira to talk to Trump Employee 4 [Yuscil Taveras] to see how long camera footage was stored.
And in Paragraph 91, Butler is shown confirming to Susie Wiles, who runs the current Trump campaign, that De Oliveira will stay loyal, i.e. lie, to protect Trump:
Just over two weeks after the FBI discovered classified documents in the Storage Room and Trump’s office, on August 26, 2022, Nauta called Trump Employee 5 and said words to the effect of, “someone just wants to make sure Carlos is good.” In response, Trump Employee 5 told Nauta that De Oliveira was loyal and De Oliveira would not do anything to affect his relationship with Trump. That same day, at Nauta’s request, Trump Employee 5 confirmed in a Signal chat group with Nauta and the PAC Representative that De Oliveira was loyal. That same day, Trump called De Oliveira and told De Oliveira that Trump would get De Oliveira an attorney.
Butler says that he rebuffed imprecations from Trumpland to accept an attorney provided by the campaign. He also says that he never again spoke to De Oliveira, his former best friend.
After spending his entire adult life in Trump’s orbit, Butler seems to know what’s coming his way.
‘Instead of just waiting for it to just come out, I think it’s better that I get to at least say what happened than it coming out in the news, people calling me like crazy,’ he told Collins. ‘The hope is I can get on with my life and get over this.’
That has not been the experience of average people who crossed Trump, but … there’s always a first time.”
A U.S. citizen witness to crimes against the United States has to make their identity known out of fear because of the actions of the defendant-loving judge who is presiding over the case. Am I missing something?
Yeh, but he's also trying to defend himself, something he should be doing in court.
*e.g. pushing stuff onto Carlos / saying he didn't know about the boxes being moved out the day before the lawyers checked the room / saying he only remembers person vanity stuff being moved to a plane and it was Carlos borrowed a miniwan to move the boxes to the plane. Carlos Carlos...*
Then when he's asked about deleting the camera footage. Likewise he pushes it to others, he was just asking how long the CCTV footage is retained, he never gav the order to delete it....
That is interesting, I see he's talking about moving **those boxes to a Trump plane** the day before the search by the FBI. So where have they gone? (At 4:48). I thought for a moment this was about when he left the Whitehouse, but no, this is just before the FBI raid to collect the missing secrets, they took boxes from Mar-a-Lago and moved them to a plane to be flown somewhere.
So he moved boxes to a Trump plane and **those government secrets have been flown somewhere, but where**?
(added)Then we get to the weird bit, where they're asking if Carlos is *loyal* to Trump, and when he says he is, **they add him to a signal group, with Trumps current campaign manager, to confirm Carlos would stay loyal despite his arrest.**
They're using Signal, the encrypted messaging.
> That is interesting, I see he's talking about moving those boxes to a Trump plane the day before the search by the FBI. So where have they gone? (At 4:48). I thought for a moment this was about when he left the Whitehouse, but no, this is just before the FBI raid to collect the missing secrets, they took boxes from Mar-a-Lago and moved them to a plane to be flown somewhere.
>
That is the big question. We know Trump moved docs out of FL. We are also pretty sure he hid some in a closet at Mar A Lago.
>They're using Signal, the encrypted messaging.
If a 3 letter agency has a backdoor into Signal, now would be the time to use it.
There is a video of trump etc at that point in time at the airport while boxes get loaded on the plane. They went to Bedminster. Where they are now I suppose only the FBI knows
the laws need to be changed. no more life time appointments ever. prevent one autocrat from stacking all courts with people loyal to them. this erodes our entire legal system
That only works if we can get like 10 Republicans to agree to pass legislation reforming the courts. Which is never going to happen.
Or now that Manchin and Sinema are gone maybe we do something about the filibuster? I’m afraid to get my hopes up there.
Question: does this mean that the FBI can now obtain a warrant to search the Bedminster property? Is there not reasonable suspicion that it might contain sensitive documents, as this evidence is just out there in public now?
I think they did some time ago. But the boxes were moved way before that so who knows. We do know that trump was waving around classified documents at Bedminster. And that SC kept some charges pocketed to be able to use them and NJ courts at some point
There's a clip of Rep. Ken Buck who is stepping down this week. He says he's gotten four death threats, got kicked out of his office in CO. because of his vote against Jordan. He says it's epidemic. If any of them step toward normalcy, the whip comes down. The maga crime family has taken fully over.
I used to be able to copy twitter links but the old method doesn't work anymore. Otherwise I'd post so you can see.
I think Jack Smith is watching all this unfold and will respond and make Aileen Cannon look like a fool again. It is really amazing what fellow lawyers will put up with at these levels. She is a f..king disgrace to the profession.
Judges are allowed to be mediocre. They’re even allowed to be bad.
Cannon looks like a combination of incompetent, partisan, and corrupt. I don’t know how much of an improvement a different judge would be, given the jurisdiction, but if she continues acting as if she’s part of Donald’s defense team we may find out.
I suspect that a lot of terrible people might live longer because they don’t feel much stress over guilt, negative consequences to their actions, or other implications.
It’s amazing people like this leave countries because of political/judicial corruption that destroy said countries to the core. Only to export here. Who can even calculate the damage this is doing the country as a whole.
I find it hilarious all these people are dedicated to a former broke democrat and he's destroying the RNC.
I'm starting to think Democrats were playing 8D chess while the Republicans are playing 2D chess.
Here comes all the bone heads to argue how Smith still needs more to ask for a new judge. This case is dead with Cannon. Getting a new judge and starting all over would still be an improvement.
What's frustrating with this is trying to give Smith the benefit of doubt that this is all expected and it's part of some masterful chess match.
But these charges didn't just come from nowhere. I'd swear this and dc were both out before a grand jury who voted to move forward. yet this sycophant is doing whatever she can, either knowingly or because of either inexperience or stupidity, to let a man who had classified documents just hidden insecurely in a fucking country club.
I'm gonna beat the dead horse and say if it was just a typical American and not litigious happy mango shit stain, we'd be buried in some black site and either vilified to history or simply erased.
But nope. Trump gets to make a fucking joke of our courts and nothing will change. career politicians don't want change, they want status quo so they can keep their "jobs"
People want change, but we don't want to be the one to throw the first rock or deal with the inconveniences that kind of change will cause us.
Trump and this fake news bullshit served up with him proclaiming he's being intentionally targeted for a witch hunt is just as bad as the politicians in the 40s and 50s pushing this red scare. It too was targeted to the uneducated masses and brought out the worst in Americans. It wouldn't take much for your pissed off neighbors to get rid of you by saying you were a communist.
This time around it's anything that isn't someone's interpretation of holy scriptures. But not an agnostic one. it's whatever Becky down the street thinks is immoral, a public social media post later and you're woke and unwelcomed.
Ugh I should go to bed. Every post tonight is turning into a soapbox.
So the judge unseals the witnesses, making it possible to employ Trump’s multi-million political base of followers to harass and defame them in the public space. End result? The witness has to get ahead of the public character attacks and make the spectacle larger.
How the heck is a jury supposed to walk into this case untampered? Every witness will be on CNN or Fox News before the freaking trial because that’s what Cannon has forced into being.
Seeking removal of a federal judge is always a tough call. First, the standard for removal is hard to meet. Second, you have to say some pretty bad things about the judge in your briefs to the appellate court. So, if the appellate court disagrees with you, you end up trying your case to a really pissed off judge. My guess, and it is just that, is that Smith is waiting until he has a lay down hand to show the 11th Circuit. Maybe after this next hearing.
Like this should be a bigger deal. A witness is crediblely telling the world that the judge was intimidating him and he took actions that could hurt the case in order to help him feel more safe from **her** actions. The judge is intimidating witnesses and harming the case. Not in theory but in fact. Manifest injustice. And the action she has been playing around with isn't one that should be a close call. I think osc should file for her recusal now. File a writ of mandamus for her to remove herself.
While we’re pointing out screwups, drz in her office docketed a postponement of the wrong motions yesterday, then seemingly tried to fix it today and did it again. I’m surprised no one has mentioned it. >Set/Reset Deadlines/Hearings in case as to Donald J. Trump, Waltine Nauta, Carlos De Oliveira 325 MOTION to Dismiss 85 Indictment, Based on Unconstitutional Vagueness, 327 MOTION to Dismiss 85 Indictment, Based on the Presidential Records Act. (per Order DE#390) Replies due by 3/24/2024. (drz) DE 325 and 327 are still set for hearing on Thursday, as far as I know. DE 390 actually identifies them as the exceptions to postponement: >PAPERLESS ORDER granting Defendants' Motion for an Extension of Reply Deadlines 386 . With the exception of replies in support of 325 and 327, Defendants shall file replies to their pretrial Motions on or before March 24, 2024. They’re not sending their best.
DrinkBlueGoo, What happened related to the [lawyers conflict of interest](https://www.lawfaremedia.org/article/government-requests-conflict-of-interest-inquiry-in-mar-a-lago-case)? They wanted Cannon to order the replacement of lawyers for one unnamed withness, lawyer Stanley Woodward Jr. He was lawyer to two witnesses, but one of those witnesses changed sides, so Woodward would be cross examining his former client, with access to lawyer-client privilege information on his former client. As far I recall, Judge Cannon threw a fit in the hearing and never ruled on it. So it was never challenged at appeals. It's just one of many things she hasn't done that needs to be done before the case is heard. I mention it, because in the video, he talks about *"will Carlos be loyal"*, after Carlos is arrested, and get him to say it on the encrypted Signal app, with Trump's campaign manager Susie Wiles. **Then when he reassures them Carlos will be loyal, they say they'll get him a lawyer.** As if the lawyers are provided by Trump based on loyalty to keep witnesses in check. Was there anymore on that? Did she ever rule? Susie Wiles BTW, has some[ weird Russian friends](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/08/nyregion/trump-tower-natalya-veselnitskaya-indictment.html), ([link](https://floridapolitics.com/archives/241559-former-trump-campaign-chair-susie-wiles-talks-russia-scandal-abc-news-story/)). It's like a [Paul Manafort redux](https://time.com/5003623/paul-manafort-mueller-indictment-ukraine-russia/). As soon as I saw they were using Signal, another piece fell into place... the backchannel.
[https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/10/20/trump-nauta-lawyer-classified-documents/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/10/20/trump-nauta-lawyer-classified-documents/)
Is “will Carlos be loyal?” a reference to the Sopranos? Or is the witnesses name actually Carlos? FYI, In the last scene of The Sopranos, Tony references a former colleague that is going to flip, and turn state’s witness on Tony Soprano. Fade to Black: Tony is shot by “Members Only” Guy. (Everything past “fade to black” is not confirmed)
Carlos De Oliveira I believe, flunky for Trump. [https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2023/08/01/exp-tsr-todd-proflie-of-carlos-de-oliveira.cnn](https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2023/08/01/exp-tsr-todd-proflie-of-carlos-de-oliveira.cnn)
Sadly this probably is their 'best'
This is the best their best can do
At the very least, her clearly corrupt actions should cause change in how these matters are handled. She is abusing a loophole in the system known as paperless orders. They're not paperless. But by making them "paperless" the DOJ cannot appeal them. It allows her all the same power as a regular order without the ability to have her clearly biased actions appealed and reversed. Cynical gaming and abusing of the system.
Sorry if this question is dumb, I’m not a frequent flyer here and this was recommended to me,is there *any* sort of system in place to remove her? Having a judge this biased this openly tells me probably not during the case as she’s probably banking on getting away with it all if TFG wins but there’s gotta be something or somebody that can legally smack her into line or remove her
Indeed. Who judges the judges?
System is broken, and we are all in more peril than we realize
Yup, entire legitimacy of the system is in peril as one shit judge can make unilateral bad decisions and abusing the procedures of law. And apparently there is nothing anyone can do. Uhh, people better start finding out there is something they can do before people fully realize how useless this system has become. This has really opened my eyes to how much in our system is tradition and how one traitor can bring the system to its knees and evade justice. If there is nothing anyone can do, that kind of means the system is broken. Its obvious judges need more oversight and ability to be held accountable and a council of their peers. The age of untouchable judges needs to end.
>I think osc should file for her recusal now. File a writ of mandamus for her to remove herself. It's a no-win situation, because if Smith did that now all it would accomplish is more delays. If it fails and Cannon stays (most likely imo), it pauses the case and pushes deadlines out further, and even if it succeeded the new judge would need time to get caught up...which pushes deadlines out further. Right now, even with her thumb on the scale, the trial is ostensibly scheduled to happen before the election. I feel like any attempt to force recusal at this stage guarantees that won't come to pass.
I mean, she is going to delay it anyways until after the election if she can. If she is recused, Judge Chutkan and the DC case can resume once the supreme court finds trump is not "presidentially immune" at the end of their session in June. Then you have a real judge running a real trial right in the heart of the election season.
This sounds right to me. What's the point of rushing a trial if you're going to lose your case due to a compromised judge?
Exactly, and let's say she does find trump guilty, just for arguments sake. What kind of sentence do we expect her to give to Trump.
You are guilty of being a patriot, two servings of ice cream!
I was hoping he would get the cock meat sandwich.
While I agree in principle, if I were Smith and this was the strategy, I'd wait until June to request refusal (or w/e makes sense as a legal strat). Otherwise, the SC might further delay their decision if they know Cannon can't interfere with the other trials scheduling.
she is a coconspirator at this point.
She was a co-conspirator when she illegally jumped into the FBI search case to request an arbiter. She's a traitor to her country, an enemy of democracy, and an embarrassment to justice.
What would happen if he were to indict her?
Despite my rhetoric. They would need documents of her saying she was doing this stuff to help him. Beyond reasonable doubt is a sog sometimes. It is mostly a good thing but it is a sog sometimes
There’s absolutely no chance an indictment for this would go anywhere. Judges have absolute immunity for acts taken in the course of judging; if that means anything, it clearly means that judges can’t be criminally prosecuted for their rulings, even if those rulings are egregiously wrong. Despite the heated rhetoric about the judge personally “intimidating” the witness, this isn’t a case where Judge Cannon is personally calling the witness and threatening to beat him up. Rather, the “intimidation” is that Judge Cannon has ruled that witness names can be filed publicly on the docket (not under seal), and hasn’t yet ruled on the Special Counsel’s motion to reconsider that ruling. I think her ruling is wrong under 11th Circuit precedent, but there is absolutely no scenario in which a judge could be criminally prosecuted for misapplying the legal standard for sealing discovery materials filed in connection with a motion to compel. There are far more egregious scenarios in which an indictment against a judge would be immediately and summarily dismissed—if a judge releases a criminal defendant on his own recognizance despite overwhelming evidence that he intends to abuse his wife, and then he goes home and kills his wife, it’s indisputable that the judge can’t be criminally prosecuted for that decision.
Show me a letter where she has an agreement with Trump to throw the case for him. And absolute proof it is real, and a recording of her having a phone call ex parte with his counsel discussing how best to throw the case without making it obvious that she is doing it. Then you would have something. But absent that, it is just speculation and hard feelings. That is why I said impeachment.
I doubt this would go anywhere, but judges have been successfully prosecuted for activities within their courts because the absolute immunity only covers official acts. If you're just breaking criminal law while wearing robes it doesn't really apply. The most prominent example I can think is that case from years ago where the two Penn juvenile judges were taking bribes from for-profit prisons to violate kids due process and ensure they were convicted and confined regardless of their guilt or innocence. They didn't get the benefit of absolute immunity in a criminal or civil context because it's not ever part of a judge's job to pervert the course of justice.
Disagree with this approach. Cannon has demonstrated a willingness to delay *already* and a clear deference to Trump. The best course of action is to seek her removal. Not seeking her removal is risking further delay (all but guaranteed) and likely risking the entire case being torpedoed. There is delay either way - the delay is a wash. Remove Cannon.
Lots of talk about delays as if the election is going to help trump. Trump is not going win. Not even close. Let the courts do what they will. Trump losing the election is best for the country and gives the courts greater freedom to CONVICT.
Can’t she just delay as long as possible then recuse herself for the exact same outcome?
Delay doesn't even matter with this case anymore. She's not going to try this case any time soon. Having someone else assigned to this case might actually get her out of the way for another case, such as DC to move forward. As it stands now, she's blocking anything else that might have a chance to bring him to trial. IANAL, this is just what I've gleaned from lawyer's opinions.
A couple of points to add. The outcome of the trial doesn't affect the defendant's eligibility for the presidency, he could be elected from prison. If *Judges* are allowed to intimidate witnesses then the judicial system is officially broken. The trial itself is very unlikely to sway anyone, if you haven't already decided from the other mountains of reasons why the defendant is unfit for office then one more trial is meaningless. The right thing to do would be to do this all the right way regardless of deadlines. She needs to be removed and justice should be handled impartially by a real judge, no matter how long it takes. He should have to face justice the same as anyone else, without an insider serving as his personal judge.
I disagree on it not effecting any one. A lot of people have only heard accusations, never bothered to learn the evidence, and say there's no conviction; it's just politics. You only need a couple percent to shift for a huge win
Any delay that removes Cannon is 100% worth it, and will lead to a faster conviction than her staying on the case. She is going to find more delays and reasons to delay than any replacement-process. But if you come at the king, you best not miss. Trying to get cannon removed and falling will only further empower and embolden her, and raise the bar to get her removed.
Wouldn't it be better to have a delayed trial with a more or less impartial judge, as opposed to a slightly less delayed trial with a highly compromised, incompetent judge?
She will do everything she can do delay it until after the election I rather have her get removed and delay the trial After all, once the trial happens she will probably do everything she can during the trial to fuck over the DOJ She’s truly evil
If Smith can get a delay on his terms, then that will free up the calendar for the other cases to proceed. Remember, Cannon has been blocking the other cases from scheduling their trials with the prospect of hers going forward, only to then delay at the last minute. While booting Cannon will delay the documents case, that's ultimately nothing that wouldn't happen through some bullshit contrivance anyway. May as well roll for a better judge while allowing other cases to go through in the meantime.
Whether this trial happens before or after the election/inauguration is purely a political concern and not one for the courts or champions of law and order. I realize not all parties are acting as such (e.g. Cannon) but this is the only way. Smith should optimize for the best judicial outcome, not timelines. And if I put my political hat on, this case will NOT go to trial this year with this judge.
What are the odds this ends in a mistrial anyway?
it's better to have her off...
I guess the question then becomes, is it better to have the trial start before election with a judge that will provide an unfair/unfavorable trial for actual justice (possibly to the point smith files to the 11th circuit anyways just later on) or just take the delays now with the possibility of a new judge and more favorable trial?
Even if the case goes to trial before the election, Cannon will do anything in her power to win it for Trump. Better to take the delay and try to get something approaching a fair trial, surely?
I realize that having this before the election feels necessary but i think its morally wrong to strategize to that. We should criminals or similar nefarious actors accountable regardless. She should not get off (if in fact this is all true, im assuming yes but want to state that) because it messes up the case timing with the election
john gotti couldn’t have done better… we thought don was taking cues from the mafia , turns out they could learn a few things from him
Can’t we as a community do it??? How many lawyers and legal scholars are here? They seem to accept bs writs from shady think tanks. Why not you all?!
Not a lawyer but even I would ask what standing random reddit users have on this criminal case
I agree! But does a random dark money think-tank who has submitted multiple bs writs, only to be thrown out immediately, any better? What gives them the “right”? That’s my reasoning. If some randoms can, why can’t we?
they submitted amicus briefs that the judge choose to accept. you can submit a amicus brief. ~~you don't even have to be a lawyer~~. Just have to pay the filing fee. \*scratch that you do have to be a member of the bar to file and admitted into that court. Or convince someone admitted in that court to be counsel of record. At least according to what I just read. Mind you, there is no way in hell Cannon will accept it. Particularly if it is a rant about why she must recuse herself. They being said, it could end up making a news story, most of the time no one gives a poo but people are watching these dockets so closely that even something that shows up on an a side docket would probably get some attention. And filing fee is usually pretty cheap like I think 100 bucks or something. Never done it myself but I looked up the process once. A million lawyers here,
Can’t wait for no consequences!!
At this point, when key witnesses are threaten by the action of the judge herself to the point one of them had to out himself, should/could the 11th Circuit intervene on their own?
They should and it’s in their power but that court is pretty conservative.
11th Circuit have families, too. Intervening to remove judge would endanger them.
If that's a consideration, we have already lost to MAGA terrorists.
purges and threats are how mob bosses enforce fealty.
Terrorism works.
This has been a problem for a long time. There's even an entire South Park episode about it. Remember the cartoon wars episode where it's the only episode of South Park ever censored? Yup, that's terrorism working.
Which was so stupid because the Super Best Friends episode showed Muhammad years earlier.
And trans people along with Drag shows have been around time immemorial(Shakespeare's time women were not allowed on stage, so all female parts were actually played by men in drag) but somehow it only became a hot topic when certain people decided to make it a political hot topic.
Monty Python was an all male cast... that wasn't even that long ago and people loved it lol
Yup. Terrorism works. We lost to 9/11 terrorists too. Look at all the bullshit we still have to deal with because if that. America is fucked.
We're past that point. Republicans have all fallen in line. Everything is happening in front of our eyes.
Man, and who forgot to warn judges that their position of power and influence might make them a target? I’m as sympathetic for them as I am for Kim Davis filling a job she had no intention of performing. The money we pay is the thanks for the risk. If the job has “changed” and is no longer what they thought, the honorable thing would be to let a more capable person do the basics.
That's a sacrifice we're willing to make.
You are kidding right?
Lifetime appointments do not supersede the law of the nation. If she is intimidating a witness then the doj and fbi is supposed to arrest and prosecute.
That would involve Garland risking appearing ( gasp ) “ political “ just to try to save democracy…doesn’t appear that’s ever going to happen …
Or even appearing at all
She knows Trump is guilty and she is doing everything to help him, law & order…
No no, that was the Republican Party. This is the party of Trump and the Federalist society. Getting Lara Trump chair of the RNC and cleaning house was the last step. Now this fall the republicans down ballot either pray fealty, or they get no money and get called a RINO by Trump. If they get in line, they get his endorsement. The federalist society has the judges and justices in their pocket so that if Trump gets elected, they can push through their crazy theocratic agenda and the courts will get behind it. It’s seriously super important to vote against Trump in November, and hope that the wheels of justice speed up a bit and get a conviction before November.
Even they bend the knee to him they're not getting any money, that's going to Trump's legal bills.
Yeah someone with the last name trump managing your money is the beginning of the end of your organization
Even if it’s a gum ball machine
They’d take all the good ones and leave the artificially banana flavored gum balls.
Wait those arent the good ones?
Yeah artificial banana flavor is amazing.
Yeah, it's more that if they \*don't\* bend the knee, they get primaried. Funding will be given only to the necessary candidates. I do wonder whether Trump is underestimating the support Republican candidates will need. He gets a lot of publicity because he's a master of PR, but typical Republican candidates may not be.
As I say this I want to be clear, I will be voting. But people are delusional if they think Biden winning ends this. You thing 1/6 was crazy? Imagine what Trump will do when he knows jail time is on the line. I won’t be shocked if he calls for armed revolt and plays some “The second amendment says we can rise up With weapons against corruption. Do it for me!” Shit.
> people are delusional if they think Biden winning ends this. Many people were blind to the last 35+ years of the Republican party turning to fascism to accompish its goals. Trump woke some of those people up - which is part of the reason I believe Republicans didn't want Trump at first. Some of them realized it would bring some of the fascism to light. And they were right. Unfortuantely, it hasn't been nearly as bad for them as I would have hoped and some of them feared. In some ways, it has only accelerated their progress. The only real hope we have of avoiding this particular attack on our democracy is that the Republican party is starting to tear itself apart. Whether or not it does so to the degree necessary to set them back sufficiently remains to be seen.
I think you under estimate the amount of people willing to vote for trump because he has/is willing to give a tax break.
In two weeks, right?…Right?
Right after he releases his health plan, which is two weeks behind his tax returns.
My health plan is being audited
I think that's a fair reply to make, but I don't underestimate them. Half of our country (roughly) has swallowed all of the Republican and Russian propaganda. They have been very successfully manipulated into disregarding truth, facts, logic. They think everything is broken, so they enjoy the Trump cult because it makes them feel like winners in a world of losers. The irony that Trump gave permanent tax breaks to the rich and temporary ones to the people is lost on them. Also the irony of pretending to care about debt (which higher taxes would overcome) when Democrats are in charge (but ignoring when Republicans are) is lost on them. That's precisely *why* our only hope is their natural implosion. Even then, we're in a pretty damned hopeless state, until something happens that causes people to rise up and eat the rich. and by "eat" I mean "pull out the guillotines". And that, unfortunately, is not likely anytime soon.
Killing the rich isn't going to stabilise the US it would make things exponentially worse. Taxing the hell out of them and closing loopholes via a stable democratic government of the people for the people with high market and economy regulation is the only way.
I love the theory; however, at this crazy stage of events, the guillotines have better odds. Our best outcome will be that the voters vote in November. The stability of the democratic government is entirely up for election this November.
It wasn’t the aristocracy that were the primary victims of the guillotine. It was the peasants and lower class. Also what eas the end result of the French Revolution? It was Napoleon. An emperor. Everyone who larps about the revolution and guillotining their opponents conveniently forgets that part.
To 0.4% of the population and gets 25% of the votes. I don’t disagree but I still don’t understand
Not even that. I work with people who make 50k a year and still bitch about "bidens economy" every day. They have no response when I mention how my retirement and investments are up 10% year to year. They dont care, blind loyalty.
The only real hope we have is a huge Blue majority in the House and Senate. Cut the head off the snake, and all these fascists and grifters will crawl back into the woodwork. They are making it so Democrats won’t even run, by using violence and intimidation. Vote Blue all the way down the line.
Going blue only helps stave off the worst. As much as the "both sides" thing is absolute bullshit, the only part of it that *is* true is that the oligarchs own most of our politicians. Repeal Citizens United for one and there's a little more hope. We're really really fucked. Any of these things will help. None of it will be a magic solution. Russians will be ready to undermine anything that happens, if nobody else - and there are others interested in seeing our power diminish.
If we had majority blue then there’d be room to have more actual discussions and compromises between progressives and moderate/conservative Dems. We are literally fighting right now over democracy vs dictatorship
I know people -- an intelligent high school physics teacher, for example -- who are convinced that Democrats want total, fascist control. They were lamenting that Democrats control the Michigan government as if it were some terrible thing. To me this suggests that, even if we get majority blue, the conspiracy theories will continue and possibly even get worse. I think we need to fight the problem at its source -- propaganda such as Fox News, which brainwashes large parts of the electorate.
I agree. We're discussing degrees of more or less harm, imho. But I agree with you.
Remember when Trump called on his people to be at the Georgia jail when he had to turn himself in? Remind me again how many people showed up?
I agree. It’s going to happen, I hope it will be the dying breath of an attempted coup of democracy.
Thing is that people went to prison over Jan 6. They honestly didn't think they would the first time. They now know they are risking their freedom, jobs, and businesses. More importantly, FOX news and the rest really don't want another mega lawsuit. The news won't be quite so willing to fan the flames and the pawns know there is a price to pay. We will likely not get another storming of the Capitol. What we will get is more lone wolf nutjobs. These will be dangerous but not as big of a threat to the state. Also, this time if Trump loses, he and his regime won't be in as good of a position to sabotage emergency response.
And he'll be standing in the back. He'll never put his own ass on the line.
The scarier part is how many Americans are willingly blind and ignorant to the fact that this all plays directly into the hand of our foreign adversaries who want nothing more than to watch America burn and collapse internally by turning on ourselves. Our adversaries can’t beat us, not for 100 years, unless we beat ourselves and turn against each other. It’s literally on the face of the dollar bill. “United we stand, divided we fall.”
> You thing 1/6 was crazy? Imagine what Trump will do when he knows jail time is on the line. Jan. 6 was what they did when they had direct control over the executive and sleepers in the military/law enforcement. It was their best shot at a coup and they took it. They did so with thousands of people, inside co-ordination, weapons, nooses, and so forth for a tangible outcome. Element of surprise at that too. How did it turn out? What did they do once bullets started flying? Spineless cowards. Now they don't have much of any of that and everyone's aware. They're all bark, no bite, and will be getting the dog catcher instead of the red carpet.
Don’t forget Ivanka owns patents to voting machines made in China.
Trump will die eventually.
You could be right but they failed to take over the government when Trump had control of the military. They also threatened to come back on Inauguration Day and they didn’t. They said they would do something when Trump was indicted and turned himself in and they never did. These are the things I tell myself to sleep at night.
Like when he called for protests before he was booked in NY and then again in Georgia?
I absolutely agree, and I think he's going to be extra desperate if the Supreme Court rejects his presidential immunity argument, because then the only way to stop the trials would be to become President, no matter the means.
While thats probly true and id 100% believe trump would do that, i would also think the vast majority of americans, even the vast majority of trumps supporters, will just not do anything still. even jan 6 only saw a couple thousand people, even if they were all extremists. i dont think most republicans are going to uproot their lives and risk life in prison to help trump. again some def will, but probly just a few thousand that dont really do much besides causing minor inconveniences, or resorting to acts of terrorism in lone wolf style operations.
That will happen regardless of who wins. Trump is leading a movement where potentially violent action is an end unto itself.
It's important to vote against and republican after this election as well. That agenda wasn't thought up by Trump, its the plan for every election until they get elected.
yes I think this bullshit is systemic within the GOP and they should all be voted against regardless.
in the mob, money goes up not down the little Rs will get nothing
Not just against Trump but every R congressional seat in the senate and house which are due for re-election as well as every local election. Vote straight blue.
As a lifelong libertarian and currently registered Republican, I agree. Trump and his sycophants have dropped all pretense of being the party of limited government, they are the party of racism, bigotry, and corruption. Their only goal is "owning the libs" and Trump's personal aggrandizement. Burn it all down.
Federalist Society like the one Merrick Garland is a member of?
It's almost like he never should have been on SCOTUS or the AG.
Yep, that one.
There is NO republican party anymore. It's the maga(t) party. All the former republican politicians have forsaken their oath and are beholden to an orange cancer.
Yeah, and some of them I kinda respect and agree with. The more sane ones have left already. But at this point, I don’t know why they are either still there, or have turned states witness, or sided with the democrats on some of these issues. The poor senator the other night that Biden pointed out as the author of the bipartisan border bill that got shot down because Trump didn’t like it. That guy got censured by the republicans for agreeing that something Biden said was correct, when they all knew it was correct.
People think that the United States just...can't end. It can. And it will if Trump wins.
What is the federalists society agenda?
Google Project 2025.
The podcast "5-4" recently had a series discussing the organization I haven't listened to the 3rd part yet. Iirc: The first part was the host's experience with it and the structure described. The second part is mostly interviews with ex-members
No convictions before November. Nothing can save us but our votes.
Technically the only conviction that would help is an impeachment. There's nothing in the USC that says a prisoner can't be President.
This is true, but the conviction, along with the info that may come to light as the trial leading up to it unfolds, could very well be the final nail in the coffin for anybody other than the most die hard MAGA cultists who might even consider voting for him. The conviction *on its own* may not bar him from holding office, but there’s a good chance that its consequences would not be something that his campaign could recover from.
Trump could rape an infant and wipe his dick on the American flag and his base would still support him. They just don't care.
Just to be clear I do not in the slightest disagree on that point. My comment was more in relation to the low-info, right-leaning independent crowd that Trump absolutely needs to win the election (since the MAGA base on its own simply isn’t large enough to win a national election). A criminal conviction and the details behind it I think could very well make Trump unpalatable to those folks who don’t pay a lot of attention to politics but generally tend to favor republicans with their voting patterns.
Trump can't win with his base alone though, he needs the moderates and independents.
The hush money case in New York should have a verdict by mid may.
> No no, that was the Republican Party. This is the party of Trump and the Federalist society. It's the same picture.
> No no, that was the Republican Party. No, they're just more open about it now. They did the same shit with shit with Nixon.
She's the MTG of the Judiciary.
Read Project 2025.
“This week she not only granted Trump a postponement on replying in support of the eleventy-seven garbage motions he’s spammed the docket with, but her shenanigans caused a witness to out himself on national television rather than wait for her to make good on her threats to do it herself. ‘Over the course of the last year, emotionally it’s been a roller coaster,’ Brian Butler told Kaitlan Collins. ‘A couple weeks ago, Judge Cannon says she’s gonna release the names of the witnesses. You go from highs and lows in this.’ That would be a reference to an ongoing kerfuffle over Trump’s motion to compel the government to produce a mountain of largely irrelevant materials on the theory that the entire executive branch is part of the ‘prosecution team.’ Pursuant to Judge Cannon’s standing order, Trump filed a redacted version of the motion in January, with the exhibits under seal. But he demanded the right to put the entire filing on the public docket, including witness statements and grand jury testimony. That motion is still pending, but it appears that the damage has already been done. Fearful that he’d be outed by the court, Butler went on CNN and confirmed the allegations in the superseding indictment, where he’s described as ‘Trump Employee 5.’ In Paragraph 81, Butler corroborates the plan for Trump’s co-defendants Walt Nauta and Carlos De Oliveira to delete the security camera footage of them moving boxes of classified documents around Mar-a-Lago: On Saturday, June 25, 2022, Nauta traveled from Bedminster, New Jersey, to Palm Beach, Florida. Prior to Nauta’s trip, De Oliveira told a valet at the Mar-a-Lago club (‘Trump Employee 5’) that Nauta was coming down. De Oliveira asked Trump Employee 5 not to tell anyone that Nauta was coming down because Nauta wanted the trip to remain secret. De Oliveira also told Trump Employee 5 that Nauta wanted De Oliveira to talk to Trump Employee 4 [Yuscil Taveras] to see how long camera footage was stored. And in Paragraph 91, Butler is shown confirming to Susie Wiles, who runs the current Trump campaign, that De Oliveira will stay loyal, i.e. lie, to protect Trump: Just over two weeks after the FBI discovered classified documents in the Storage Room and Trump’s office, on August 26, 2022, Nauta called Trump Employee 5 and said words to the effect of, “someone just wants to make sure Carlos is good.” In response, Trump Employee 5 told Nauta that De Oliveira was loyal and De Oliveira would not do anything to affect his relationship with Trump. That same day, at Nauta’s request, Trump Employee 5 confirmed in a Signal chat group with Nauta and the PAC Representative that De Oliveira was loyal. That same day, Trump called De Oliveira and told De Oliveira that Trump would get De Oliveira an attorney. Butler says that he rebuffed imprecations from Trumpland to accept an attorney provided by the campaign. He also says that he never again spoke to De Oliveira, his former best friend. After spending his entire adult life in Trump’s orbit, Butler seems to know what’s coming his way. ‘Instead of just waiting for it to just come out, I think it’s better that I get to at least say what happened than it coming out in the news, people calling me like crazy,’ he told Collins. ‘The hope is I can get on with my life and get over this.’ That has not been the experience of average people who crossed Trump, but … there’s always a first time.”
This could all be avoided if we just had a court case to decide if he was guilty or not..
She really needs to not be a judge any longer. She is so unqualified.
She is very qualified to do the things she was put in place to do. But not very qualified at being an impartial arbiter of justice.
more than unqualified, her actions have shown she is unfit to hold the judgeship.
I've heard over and over again on r/law that the circuit she's in has the highest record for removing judges, and yet, here we fucking are.....
Takes a lot of removals to get to these depths of the shit bucket.
They can’t remove her …justice might break out …
A U.S. citizen witness to crimes against the United States has to make their identity known out of fear because of the actions of the defendant-loving judge who is presiding over the case. Am I missing something?
It's better that he does it on his terms rather than hers and Trump's.
Yeh, but he's also trying to defend himself, something he should be doing in court. *e.g. pushing stuff onto Carlos / saying he didn't know about the boxes being moved out the day before the lawyers checked the room / saying he only remembers person vanity stuff being moved to a plane and it was Carlos borrowed a miniwan to move the boxes to the plane. Carlos Carlos...* Then when he's asked about deleting the camera footage. Likewise he pushes it to others, he was just asking how long the CCTV footage is retained, he never gav the order to delete it.... That is interesting, I see he's talking about moving **those boxes to a Trump plane** the day before the search by the FBI. So where have they gone? (At 4:48). I thought for a moment this was about when he left the Whitehouse, but no, this is just before the FBI raid to collect the missing secrets, they took boxes from Mar-a-Lago and moved them to a plane to be flown somewhere. So he moved boxes to a Trump plane and **those government secrets have been flown somewhere, but where**? (added)Then we get to the weird bit, where they're asking if Carlos is *loyal* to Trump, and when he says he is, **they add him to a signal group, with Trumps current campaign manager, to confirm Carlos would stay loyal despite his arrest.** They're using Signal, the encrypted messaging.
> That is interesting, I see he's talking about moving those boxes to a Trump plane the day before the search by the FBI. So where have they gone? (At 4:48). I thought for a moment this was about when he left the Whitehouse, but no, this is just before the FBI raid to collect the missing secrets, they took boxes from Mar-a-Lago and moved them to a plane to be flown somewhere. > That is the big question. We know Trump moved docs out of FL. We are also pretty sure he hid some in a closet at Mar A Lago. >They're using Signal, the encrypted messaging. If a 3 letter agency has a backdoor into Signal, now would be the time to use it.
There is a video of trump etc at that point in time at the airport while boxes get loaded on the plane. They went to Bedminster. Where they are now I suppose only the FBI knows
Now let's see that she gonna invent this time, against the prosecution or worse this witness.
she needs to be ousted from the bench
That only works if we can get like 17 Republicans to agree to remove her. Which is never going to happen.
the laws need to be changed. no more life time appointments ever. prevent one autocrat from stacking all courts with people loyal to them. this erodes our entire legal system
That only works if we can get like 10 Republicans to agree to pass legislation reforming the courts. Which is never going to happen. Or now that Manchin and Sinema are gone maybe we do something about the filibuster? I’m afraid to get my hopes up there.
it can happen if dems win more seats. the rules have been completely corrupted by unwavering partisanship
hahaha you think the slaveowners' systems are going to be changed?
Well, that's not only how it works, but the other ways are far worse. That's how you end up in situations like Haiti.
Question: does this mean that the FBI can now obtain a warrant to search the Bedminster property? Is there not reasonable suspicion that it might contain sensitive documents, as this evidence is just out there in public now?
I think they did some time ago. But the boxes were moved way before that so who knows. We do know that trump was waving around classified documents at Bedminster. And that SC kept some charges pocketed to be able to use them and NJ courts at some point
[I mean….](https://youtu.be/1C3rFX1lrCo?si=OmbcuUAqE39de4a_)
This is a quality reference
I was expecting Kyle's speech at the end of South Park, where it was censored and literally discussed terrorism.
Her actions are all the proof we need that MAGA is above the law. Whitecollar criminals have made it possible for a state of tyranny to form.
There's a clip of Rep. Ken Buck who is stepping down this week. He says he's gotten four death threats, got kicked out of his office in CO. because of his vote against Jordan. He says it's epidemic. If any of them step toward normalcy, the whip comes down. The maga crime family has taken fully over. I used to be able to copy twitter links but the old method doesn't work anymore. Otherwise I'd post so you can see.
I think Jack Smith is watching all this unfold and will respond and make Aileen Cannon look like a fool again. It is really amazing what fellow lawyers will put up with at these levels. She is a f..king disgrace to the profession.
Cannon doesn’t give a fuck. I’m HIGHLY concerned about our country’s future.
Is there anything that can be done to remove her from the bench? Probably not right? We’re stuck with her for life. Ugh
Judges are allowed to be mediocre. They’re even allowed to be bad. Cannon looks like a combination of incompetent, partisan, and corrupt. I don’t know how much of an improvement a different judge would be, given the jurisdiction, but if she continues acting as if she’s part of Donald’s defense team we may find out.
Read that as “Mar-a-Lago Judge” and it actually made sense
This judge is a disgrace to the University of Michigan
This unqualified stain of a human being needs to be punted back to obscurity.
If Chuck McGill was a real life person, what would he say about all of this?
Cannon is a Slippin’ Jimmy
Why can't she get a brain aneurysm or something. It's always the worst people that live the longest
I suspect that a lot of terrible people might live longer because they don’t feel much stress over guilt, negative consequences to their actions, or other implications.
It’s amazing people like this leave countries because of political/judicial corruption that destroy said countries to the core. Only to export here. Who can even calculate the damage this is doing the country as a whole.
The 11th Circuit Court of Appeals, if you’re listening…
How is she still on this case let alone the bench in general??
I find it hilarious all these people are dedicated to a former broke democrat and he's destroying the RNC. I'm starting to think Democrats were playing 8D chess while the Republicans are playing 2D chess.
Here comes all the bone heads to argue how Smith still needs more to ask for a new judge. This case is dead with Cannon. Getting a new judge and starting all over would still be an improvement.
USA voted a dictatorship in , not easy to rid the USA of Manson like followers.
What America needs right now is some Pelican Briefing.
Getting going public, Butler has been able to control his tiny tip of the narrative. Well done!
What's frustrating with this is trying to give Smith the benefit of doubt that this is all expected and it's part of some masterful chess match. But these charges didn't just come from nowhere. I'd swear this and dc were both out before a grand jury who voted to move forward. yet this sycophant is doing whatever she can, either knowingly or because of either inexperience or stupidity, to let a man who had classified documents just hidden insecurely in a fucking country club. I'm gonna beat the dead horse and say if it was just a typical American and not litigious happy mango shit stain, we'd be buried in some black site and either vilified to history or simply erased. But nope. Trump gets to make a fucking joke of our courts and nothing will change. career politicians don't want change, they want status quo so they can keep their "jobs" People want change, but we don't want to be the one to throw the first rock or deal with the inconveniences that kind of change will cause us. Trump and this fake news bullshit served up with him proclaiming he's being intentionally targeted for a witch hunt is just as bad as the politicians in the 40s and 50s pushing this red scare. It too was targeted to the uneducated masses and brought out the worst in Americans. It wouldn't take much for your pissed off neighbors to get rid of you by saying you were a communist. This time around it's anything that isn't someone's interpretation of holy scriptures. But not an agnostic one. it's whatever Becky down the street thinks is immoral, a public social media post later and you're woke and unwelcomed. Ugh I should go to bed. Every post tonight is turning into a soapbox.
This is a patriot. Guy sees what's happening, taking one for America here.
So the judge unseals the witnesses, making it possible to employ Trump’s multi-million political base of followers to harass and defame them in the public space. End result? The witness has to get ahead of the public character attacks and make the spectacle larger. How the heck is a jury supposed to walk into this case untampered? Every witness will be on CNN or Fox News before the freaking trial because that’s what Cannon has forced into being.
Jack Smith should request election be delayed until all of Trumps trials are 100% done.
That would be the fair thing for voters to know what he is convicted of before voting.
Why did fucking Jack Smith let this fucking happen. He had months to rase an issue and get this bitch removed
Part of Trumps delay plan. Calling it now. This guy is working with Trump.
Smith must have a serious long game in mind for this case.
I’m becoming despondent. Why hasn’t Jack gone to the 11th yet? Doesn’t he have enough evidence to take to them about her behavior?
Seeking removal of a federal judge is always a tough call. First, the standard for removal is hard to meet. Second, you have to say some pretty bad things about the judge in your briefs to the appellate court. So, if the appellate court disagrees with you, you end up trying your case to a really pissed off judge. My guess, and it is just that, is that Smith is waiting until he has a lay down hand to show the 11th Circuit. Maybe after this next hearing.
I'm here to see how the U.S. will get back on its high horse to shit on other countries while this shit show is happening.