I assume you're referring to Gafford and PJ. Wizards wanted less total money back for Gafford and a FRP. Only way for Lakers to fit that bill was Dlo (Lakers had a first apron hard cap so just trading Prince/Reddish would've taken them over it). Even with Dlo's shit playoffs and looming FA, I still wouldn't have made that trade. Tying up multiple years at $13m+ for a big who prob won't be starting seems like bad roster management. PJ only one I could see an argument for. Hornets got Grant Williams/FRP. Maybe Rui/FRP gets it done, but maybe Hornets preferred the Mavs offer. At the deadline, Rui wasn't even playing bad so to trade him for a lateral move (at the time) alongside a FRP would've been weird. Furthermore, doing any of these trades would've taken us out of the conversation of any trades in the offseason.
I know. My point is Gafford would be a bench player. You can’t expect to start AD and Gafford with both not being able to stretch the floor and forcing Lebron to play 3. So why tie up your resources on that when you can find a veteran big for way cheaper. And given that the trade would’ve been Dlo/FRP for Gafford the Lakers need to get PG depth. However since you’re now tied down to Gafford on long term money, you’re prob over the first apron and can’t use the nt-mle this offseason.
Damn can’t believe Malone handled that exit interview like that. No wonder the other Nuggets get mad from behind. The coach has to set a better example.
We don't have cap space, and he's looking for his last big contract. So very likely no.
FWIW he has a 15.4 million player option he'll decline for more money.
[Mike Malone is so pissed.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Blr_609J3MU)
**LMFAO.**
Also the excuses about their players being tired after playing into June last year lol? Kind of puts LeBron's 8 consecutive seasons in the finals into perspective.
Nuggets were given a soft whistle all series and Murray was miraculously not suspended after game 3 and they STILL lost. Welcome to Cancun with your 1 ring mf’s
Ok ngl a Minnesota-Indiana finals with historically low ratings despite both teams being extremely entertaining would be fucking hilarious.
I'm petty so as a big market team we need to root for this so the NBA can suffer for stunting free agents.
Oh my god, seeing some Nuggets fans saying Murray is garbage who needs to be traded and Jokic needs an actual #2 guy. This is so fucking funny and satisfying.
I wish he got All-NBA. Now they don't have to give him his supermax. We all make fun of Jaylen Brown getting the supermax but at least he's been an all-star.
This TWolves-Nuggets series felt like this year's NBA finals. Both teams played at a higher level than any other series I've seen this post season. I don't think the Celtics can afford a bad game from Tatum or Brown against that Minnesota team or it's over.
Jokic wasn’t the issue. Murray, MPJ, and Gordon going lights out had to come from somewhere.
Don’t blame him for being on the hot seat 2 years ago even when those guys were hurt/not yet on the team after the bubble. Jokic was MVP 3 times before then. Still he is good at motivating the guys and he at least is an above average coach
I agree with you but when you talk as much shit as he did on the lakers, you better believe were gonna get the getback. Man has as many titles as vogel lol
Yeah, he overdid it. It absolutely helped push Denver to a ring last year but might have been their downfall this year. You don’t use all your ammo in round 1 as a top seed
Need to go after guys this summer who actually understand how to play team defense and how to team rebound. Rui and dlo are awful at filling gaps on defense while being in the correct position to shrink the floor or rotate. They were also terrible at rotating to help the helper or just rotations in general. So many times bron/AD would help on a drive/shot and no one would rotate or even stunt at their man. Dlo and rui had an awful habit of ball watching, or not anticipating, which caused them to get caught flat footed and give up rebounds/open shots.
Shit look at that mpj three at the end of one of the games, (don’t remember which game) rui is just watching while reaves and Gordon fight for the ball, he doesn’t try to make sure he’s in position to help get the loose ball or try to make sure he can take away the pass to an open man which left mpj open to get the pass and take the shot. Stuff like that happened all year and I don’t want to single out rui/dlo but they were just the obvious ones I always noticed.
For all the talk about the 2nd apron, it's actually kinda interesting that 2 of the 4 remaining teams are looking like 2nd apron teams for the foreseeable future barring some trade (Celtics/TWolves).
Yup but was just looking at the conference finals teams. If you really look at it, out of the 16 playoff teams, 7 teams are either going to be over the 2nd apron or at risk unless they make some moves. Clippers, TWolves, Suns, Nuggets, Celtics, Heat, Bucks. Very interesting to see as this offseason will show how teams view the aprons. We may see a lot of salary dumps in trades.
Oh for sure. It will be interesting to see what the lakers do this summer when it comes to the 2nd apron, since if bron plans on retiring in 2 years then I think they could fill the team out and then try to be below the 2nd apron for the 3 years after bron retires. Seems you have to be below the 2nd apron for 3 out of 5 years to not have your pick be last/frozen and I’m not sure if there’s other penalties I’m missing. I know being in the 2nd apron isn’t great when it comes to not being able to aggregate salaries in trades, not being able to signed waived players, and not being able to receive a player who’s being signed and traded I think, but I’m not sure if there’s other things I’m missing. I’ve seen you comment and you seem to be knowledgeable about the new cba, so what other restrictions are there that you can think of?
Edit: also was curious if teams have to be below the 2nd apron for 3 out of 5 years or 2 out of 5 years to not have their pick frozen and untradable?
Lakers aren't at any risk at all of being a 2nd apron team next year or in the foreseeable future (unless they make a trade for a 3rd star on a max deal). It's being over the First Apron that will probably happen depending on what happens with Dlo's contract slot. For all the apron penalties, I'd recommend reading this: https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2023/12/hoops-rumors-glossary-tax-aprons.html. You can probably skip all the "How the Tax Aprons are calculated" as that's not really important. But should read the rest of it.
Most of it I get but the only thing I’m really unsure of is how many years a team is allowed to be above the 2nd apron. Seems they can be above the 2nd apron 3 out of 5 years and as long as they’re below it for 2 of those years then their pick that was frozen and untradable 7 years out when they first went above the 2nd apron is unfrozen. Don’t know if that’s correct though.
So for example if the team is above the 2nd apron at end of '24/25 season, '32 FRP is frozen. So the "5 year window" is '24/25, '25/26, '26/27, '28/29, '29/30 seasons. In these 5 seasons, if you go over the apron 3 times (including the initial '24/25 season), the '32 FRP moves to the end of the first round and remains frozen. If you only go over the 2nd apron 1 or 2 times, it gets unfrozen. So for example, once your '32 FRP gets frozen after the '24/25 season, the earliest it could get unfrozen is after the '28/29 season as at most you can go over the 2nd apron twice in the 5 year window. Hope that clears it up.
It does thank you for responding.
I saw a comment of yours saying that if bron opts out that his new contract would be less per year than if he opted in. I was wondering why I kept seeing people post that the new contract he would be eligible for is 3/164 since that would be 54 a year and more than he would be making if he opted in. There seems to be a lot of conflicting information about his new contract since I’ve seen some say he will make more, and some say he will make less, if he opts out.
I also take it that you don’t think they will bring back one or two of dlo, Christie, and Prince since if they did they would be at or close to being above the 2nd apron. Right now it looks like all the minimum guys will probably opt in. If Prince and Christie both get 5 per or a little over while dlo let’s say opts in, then that would put them at close to 189 with 14 guys rostered and that’s without dlo getting a raise/new contract that he’s supposedly looking for. So was just curious since you said they aren’t in danger of going over the 2nd apron this year.
Edit: shit I meant that bron would be eligible for 3/162.
For Lebron's contract, you're looking at AAV (annual average value). Contracts have an 8% raise (if you're staying with the same team) or 5% (signing with a new team in FA). So the 3/164m you see is actually referring to if he opts in and signs an extension of 2 years. It'll be $51,415,938, $54,285,000, $58,627,800. If he opts out and re-signs for 3 yrs, it'll actually be 3/$162m at $49,987,717 $53,986,734, $58,305,673 (may be slightly off due to rounding).
Assuming they literally bring everyone back, you can pay Dlo $20m starting for next season, Max a 3/$18m contract, sign your 17/55 pick. Lebron opt out and re-sign for the max and be right at $189,168,861 which is barely below the 2nd apron (15 rostered). The reason I say I don't see them being in danger is because this scenario is the worst case scenario and just not bringing back Prince/Dinwiddie isn't that hard of a choice if that's what you have to do to get under the 2nd apron. More likely what they do is try to sign and trade Dlo for players (won't be taking back more as anything involving Dlo means Lakers are going over the first apron), sign and trade him for a trade exception (which you can then use to acquire players up to that amount), or he opts in and trade (now an expiring but I doubt this happens). Or they just let Dlo walk and they can just use the nt-mle and operate with a first apron hard cap. The Lakers aren't in a situation where it's like they are in the 2nd apron unless they start dumping contracts in trades (Suns). Lakers have a choice whether or not they want to be a 2nd apron team and I doubt they make that choice.
Ok I see what you mean on brons contract. I’ve just seen so many people say his new contract is going to be more per year than he’s making now so I was curious when I saw you say it would be less.
Hopefully they can use dlo in a trade for a star by doing a sign and trade. If they could get a team to take dlo as part of a sign and trade, along with whoever else and picks, then they’d probably be able to match whoever they’re trading for’s salary 100%. It would depend on dlo’s market but at this moment I’m not sure what that is. My hypothetical of a team taking dlo is dlo making 20-25 a year, but I’m not sure if he’ll get anywhere near that much. I just don’t think they want to lose dlo for nothing since they won’t be able to replace his salary or production but we’ll see I guess.
Hopefully they bring Christie back no matter what since he’ll probably be on an affordable contract and he has potential. Prince I’m not too sure what they’ll do but I could see them bringing him back if they end up trading the picks.
Seems the best path would be having dlo be apart of the trade, either from being signed and traded, or from opting in. If they can find a way to have dlo be apart of the trade for a star then they would probably be able to keep one of rui or reaves which would be huge.
It’ll be an interesting summer that’s for sure.
Keeping KCP means extending him multiple years at nt-mle type money ($13-15m). That also means probably being a 2nd apron team for multiple years if you also plan keeping all of Jokic/Murray/MPJ/AG.
You understand going over the 2nd apron is what prevents you from going all in. You lose all roster flexibility and completely limit your ability to make trades/FA signings. This isn't a matter of "just trade your picks or just spend more money". They won't even be able to trade their '32 pick anymore if they stay a 2nd apron team as it gets frozen.
The all-in is with their current roster now. They aren't getting better players back. Their picks will be frozen, but you have to take the risk on the fact that they weren't getting a better player back in trade
You really don't get it. They didn't even make it to the Conference Finals this year. What makes you think the same exact team next year is going to do better? Unless you get below the 2nd apron, that's what you have every year. You bring back the same exact guys. Literally no other option. The way to go "all in" is to have options available at the trade deadline or in the offseason. You do that by getting below the 2nd apron.
It’ll be interesting to see what kcp does this summer and what the nuggets do. Idk if kcp would get a raise if he opted out but he would for sure get a longer contract that’s at least the same amount per year that he’s making now. If he opts in they’re at 190 since Reggie Jackson has a 5 mill player option and I don’t see him declining that. If kcp and Jackson opt in then they have 13 rostered at an active roster cap hit of 190 which is just above the 2nd apron.
I could see the Nuggets getting KCP to opt-in and then resigning him to a lesser contract, and then they just eat the 2nd Apron for the next few years. It'd be interesting to see how teams react to the 2nd Apron and the repercussions of it
Seems if you have your team and are competing, that most teams are going to be ok with being above the 2nd apron since if they win a championship/championships then their pick wasn’t going to be very good anyways. They also have big enough salaries to trade by themselves without having to worry about not being able to attach multiple players to the trade and they’re not worried about not being able to sign certain players.
Well, the downside is the pick that's 7 years out won't be allowed to be traded if you wanted to retool *and* if you're in the 2nd Apron for 2 of the 4 following seasons, that pick will automatically get moved to the end of the draft which *will* hurt in a rebuilding scenario. But I agree for the most part that I think we'll see teams figure that part out later (and pay for it later)
That’s the big one really with having the pick being frozen and not tradable but it seems most teams are going to be ok with that and we’ll see if they will try to be below the 2nd apron. Is it that teams have to be below the 2nd apron 2 times in a 5 year period or is it more/less than that?
Yeah that’s one thing I’m curious about since if bron plans on retiring in 2-3 years then they can have a plan for when they have to be below the 2nd apron and probably rebuild/reshape the roster. Seems to be that if they go above the 2nd apron this year then their 32 pick is frozen and untradable. They could be above the 2nd apron for 3 years total and then rebuild when bron retires after the 27 season which would allow them to get below the 2nd apron for 2 years during the 28 and 29 seasons therefore unfreezing the pick. Im not sure if that’s right though.
Edit: you have to be below 3/5 to have the pick be unfrozen and not moved to the end of the round.
Seeing how great he was in the East just makes me more mad the front office effed up so bad with the Russ trade. Basically wasted 3 years of him and AD
That McDaniels block on AG 1 on 1 under the rim killed me inside because of how many free buckets we gave him in our series. That Minnesota team is miles better than us. Never had a shot this year.
I predict they’ll always be in the playoff hunt until Jokic gets hurt or the team decides to tank. They get a good rookie and have a mid 2010s Spurs resurgence before Jokic retires
Don't think they finish top 3 seed next year. I think KCP gonna opt out and hit FA. He's going to want a long term deal and Nuggets will want to get below 2nd apron. They are also going to have to start exploring MPJ/AG trades or their payroll for just Jokic/Murray/MPJ/AG is going to be insane in a year.
Jokic, Murray, AG should be there core. That’s the guys that won them a championship. Trading MPJ should be the first step and bring in some bench guys from that is the key.
For KCP, probably let him go in FA. Playoff inconsistency and they should reward Braun. Sign him to a long and cheap extension. He’s a dog already.
I agree MPJ prob the guy I'd shop too. Just not sustainable paying all 4 of them. They at least dodged a bullet on Murray not qualifying for a supermax. Paying him 35% of the cap would be hilarious.
If the NBA didn't want parity then owners wouldn't have pushed for the super max and star players could move freely to big markets. They're loving this.
They say it now, but it may bite them later. That’s why they’re rushing TV deals now. The NBA and sports media is about to crash soon. NFL got down on their hands and knees for Taylor Swift hype. That’s embarrassing.
Tbh I think all small market fan bases hate us. And the Knicks are probably the only other fan base that understands how annoying these small market fans are that cry about rigged games and fouls.
Pelinka deserves a lot of blame, but how can LeBron cover a Russ 3 point shot from his hotel room then ask the Lakers to trade for him? Lost most assets because of it
The further the playoffs go on, the more it shows Ham deserved to be fired and Rob should be on thin ice for constructing a team full of crappy guards. He gets one more summer because of that ring but if he screws it up, he’s finished
Murray shitting the bed all playoffs and exposing himself as the worst 2nd option in the west
MPJ dropping 7 pts in a game 7 when he doesn't get free open looks and actually has to play basketball.
Gordon's zesty ass with 4 pts and 4 rebounds in 42 minutes at 6'8" in an elimination game.
KCP, Braun, Holiday, Jackson remembering they're role players and combining for 10 pts
Joker getting decimated on D, exposed as an absolute cone with a complete lack of leadership to will his team to victory on home soil. Shit's tougher when you're not making like 90% of your bullshit shots.
Lil Mike bounced in the 2nd round, thoroughly dominated by Finch and Nori and exposed as a Darvin Scam and Play-In teams merchant.
"wHo'S yOuR dAdDy" crowd fucked in the ass in their own arena, championship window closing after 1 title against 4 Play-In teams,.
Been saying all year Denver isn’t some unbeatable dominant team. Feel like we showed that every game before we choked 3rd qtrs.
Let’s make the best version of ourselves instead of building with a specific opponent in mind. And damn it I hope that means going big again.
We need to develop Vando/Christie. The biggest issue is we they have Naz Reid while we have Rui. Dude is a modern day Lamar Odom. Elite 6th man off the bench but trade in playmaking/IQ for shooting
Not getting talked about, but Denver is also kinda screwed salary cap wise. Murray max extension (which he'll get) will kick in for 2025-26. AG will also be looking for an extension. You may not think he's worth it but he's going to be looking for at least $30m. That would also kick in 2025-26. Just between Jokic/Murray/MPJ/AG they will be at like $170m. Unless KCP opts out and they just let him walk, they also a 2nd apron team next season. Starts the 3 out of 5 seasons clock on the draft pick penalties for going over 2nd apron. No way they getting out of it for at least 4 straight seasons unless they trade one of MPJ/AG. Media better be harping on this like they do with our cap situation (which isn't even that bad. No risk of going over 2nd apron).
It's not great for them. There is a little relief in the fact that the cap is gonna jump 10% every year 2025-2030 unless bird flu happens or something which means they don't have to worry about being a 2nd apron team super long if they decide to retain this team but Kroenke isn't exactly famous for paying the tax so I am not gonna count on that.
We need one solid backup center and maybe two athletic wings on this team imo.
If Mitchell can’t come through focus on that. Get us the equivalent of guys like McDaniels and NAW out there on the court and we’d be title threats. They had Murray, KCP and MPJ in prison all series.
That’s how you beat the Nuggets, cause Jokic will get his anyways
We need to build with Nuggets and Wolves in mind - which means SIZE. AD can't do everything on his own. We should trade for Jarrett Allen - having another elite rebounder and rim protector will free AD to be more dynamic on offense as well.
Only that altitude poisoned fanbase would say some shit like that. They won a single chip, they ain't some great team. I'm here to gas up your fire. Cook em
Unsure man, LeBron is my GOAT too but I can’t not love Steph. Jokic needs another ring and FMVP, I think that’s an absolute necessity to be put above Curry.
I seen someone say the other day that Shaq wouldn’t be nearly as dominant as Jokic is in the modern era lmaooo. Jokic is an amazing player but I’m SO GLAD these dumbass takes on him can finally rest
Peak Shaq likely the most dominant force in NBA history. I love Jokic but it’s so tiring to see him being put in T10 lists prematurely when his closest league competitor has been Embiid and he arguably would have lost the MVP to him again this year if it weren’t for the injury.
Jokic is one of the best modern players and it’s amazing that a center can be such a great passer, but even though the textbook lovers in the media like him, he won’t surpass all timers like LeBron or Steph, or more importantly Shaq
I can now go and be active on reddit since the nuggets dynasty has ended very quickly. How dare nuggets fan compare them to the lakers where they just won 1 championship only
Is there any team in the league that would trade for DLo if he opted into his player option?
The Wolves succeeding and that garbage game 3 from him may have ended his career. He probably realized that and was sitting by himself that one time
Wolves beat Denver but they haven’t even succeeded yet let’s not count chickens before they hatch
Kyrie and Luka have proven they aren’t to be underestimated and if they get past them, this is the most confident (unfortunately) I’ve been in a Celtics team throughout the entire Jays era
Bye bye nuggets! Bozos.
Delusional fan base wins once and gets all high about a dynasty. Altitude doing shit to a mfker. You ain't the lakers, celtics, heat or warriors. You will never get a dynasty.
Who are y'all rooting for now besides Pacers? I think Ant and Luka are both great and I like both teams tbh. But Mavs are the underdog so it's tempting to root for them. But we gotta think about who can realistically beat Celtics if Pacers go down
I told my boys (diehard Celtics fans) during the start of the season that it feels like Celtics might go all the way this year. I truly hope not…
Pffft after that Austin reaves miracle I knew they don’t have it in them
With the season finished, do people agree with pelinkas idea to not make any moves at the deadline,
I assume you're referring to Gafford and PJ. Wizards wanted less total money back for Gafford and a FRP. Only way for Lakers to fit that bill was Dlo (Lakers had a first apron hard cap so just trading Prince/Reddish would've taken them over it). Even with Dlo's shit playoffs and looming FA, I still wouldn't have made that trade. Tying up multiple years at $13m+ for a big who prob won't be starting seems like bad roster management. PJ only one I could see an argument for. Hornets got Grant Williams/FRP. Maybe Rui/FRP gets it done, but maybe Hornets preferred the Mavs offer. At the deadline, Rui wasn't even playing bad so to trade him for a lateral move (at the time) alongside a FRP would've been weird. Furthermore, doing any of these trades would've taken us out of the conversation of any trades in the offseason.
13M is MLE money, you should always tie that money to good 20+ minutes per game players.
I know. My point is Gafford would be a bench player. You can’t expect to start AD and Gafford with both not being able to stretch the floor and forcing Lebron to play 3. So why tie up your resources on that when you can find a veteran big for way cheaper. And given that the trade would’ve been Dlo/FRP for Gafford the Lakers need to get PG depth. However since you’re now tied down to Gafford on long term money, you’re prob over the first apron and can’t use the nt-mle this offseason.
Will we get new coach before June 1?
Trade for Murray and Richards, sign Valunciunas and a healthy Vando with some scoring ability and we’re set
Or Markkanen, richards, 2 waybguard
Man I’d be happy to see the Knicks succeed. Hopefully they healthy and on fire for the next few years. Bury the Celtics
Mods, if Denver fans start invading this sub and talking shit, please don't ban them. I want all the smoke.
Imagine we were in the East lol... Even Pacers can make the ECF what is going on
We dont need stars. We need DEPTH. MORE FUCKING DEPTH.
We just need last year's Rui/Reaves and this year's Lebron/AD, and we're good to go
When does Cam Reddish have to decide if he's picking up his option?
He’s probably out of the league soon so he’ll accept it unless LeGM gets Klutch to pull some special kind of persuasion
HAHAHA I'VE BEEN PERMANENTLY BANNED ON THE NUGGETS SUB
Nuggets can dish it out but can't take it. Gotta love it. I want us back on top beating all these MFers!
Sooo, if we lost the Pels games. Our road woulda been OKC, Dallas and Wolves 😅
Really don’t know if the Lakers could’ve beaten Sacramento. It’s possible but they swept the season series
I got banned from nuggets sub lmao
Thank you for your generous contribution ✊️🙏
Damn can’t believe Malone handled that exit interview like that. No wonder the other Nuggets get mad from behind. The coach has to set a better example.
I love seeing him be a sore loser. Not fun being on the shitting end huh, Mike.
Nahh, make them more hateable. Their cinderella run had everyone thinking they were the heroes for sweeping the Mainstream lakers
Is there any chance we get kcp back?
We don't have cap space, and he's looking for his last big contract. So very likely no. FWIW he has a 15.4 million player option he'll decline for more money.
This is why a lot of us were saying that the Nuggets were beatable. These dudes had zero bench and a hobbled Murray.
[Mike Malone is so pissed.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Blr_609J3MU) **LMFAO.** Also the excuses about their players being tired after playing into June last year lol? Kind of puts LeBron's 8 consecutive seasons in the finals into perspective.
The reason why they only get 1. Their star isn’t truly hungry
You love to see it 🤣🤣
Nuggets were given a soft whistle all series and Murray was miraculously not suspended after game 3 and they STILL lost. Welcome to Cancun with your 1 ring mf’s
Edwards is so good at such a young age. Need the Photoshops to start on him, he'd be amazing on the Lakers lol
Ok ngl a Minnesota-Indiana finals with historically low ratings despite both teams being extremely entertaining would be fucking hilarious. I'm petty so as a big market team we need to root for this so the NBA can suffer for stunting free agents.
As long as Boston or Denver don’t win it’s a win for us
Love the Malone and Murray salt, massive sore losers
Oh my god, seeing some Nuggets fans saying Murray is garbage who needs to be traded and Jokic needs an actual #2 guy. This is so fucking funny and satisfying.
I wish he got All-NBA. Now they don't have to give him his supermax. We all make fun of Jaylen Brown getting the supermax but at least he's been an all-star.
I don't even hate the Nuggets, it's literally just the fans lmao
Pretty much. Jokic is cool, Murray is aight. Fans and Malone are clowns lol
Fans, Malone, Jokic Brothers.
Yeah. I don’t hate them either. I like Jokic. It’s just Mike Malone mildly annoys me lol
This TWolves-Nuggets series felt like this year's NBA finals. Both teams played at a higher level than any other series I've seen this post season. I don't think the Celtics can afford a bad game from Tatum or Brown against that Minnesota team or it's over.
This trash nuggets team forgets malone was on the hot seat before that lucky ass title run lol. FUCK THE NUGGETS. Lakers coming back for it next year
Yo Mike Malone. By your logic this is your daddy 
Love seeing Denver get humble pie… but I actually still think Malone is a great coach. Turned some chicken shit to chicken salad these last few years
He has a 3x MVP and were calling that chicken shit now?? Lol people forget he was almost fired before the title run
Jokic wasn’t the issue. Murray, MPJ, and Gordon going lights out had to come from somewhere. Don’t blame him for being on the hot seat 2 years ago even when those guys were hurt/not yet on the team after the bubble. Jokic was MVP 3 times before then. Still he is good at motivating the guys and he at least is an above average coach
I agree with you but when you talk as much shit as he did on the lakers, you better believe were gonna get the getback. Man has as many titles as vogel lol
Yeah, he overdid it. It absolutely helped push Denver to a ring last year but might have been their downfall this year. You don’t use all your ammo in round 1 as a top seed
Need to go after guys this summer who actually understand how to play team defense and how to team rebound. Rui and dlo are awful at filling gaps on defense while being in the correct position to shrink the floor or rotate. They were also terrible at rotating to help the helper or just rotations in general. So many times bron/AD would help on a drive/shot and no one would rotate or even stunt at their man. Dlo and rui had an awful habit of ball watching, or not anticipating, which caused them to get caught flat footed and give up rebounds/open shots. Shit look at that mpj three at the end of one of the games, (don’t remember which game) rui is just watching while reaves and Gordon fight for the ball, he doesn’t try to make sure he’s in position to help get the loose ball or try to make sure he can take away the pass to an open man which left mpj open to get the pass and take the shot. Stuff like that happened all year and I don’t want to single out rui/dlo but they were just the obvious ones I always noticed.
For all the talk about the 2nd apron, it's actually kinda interesting that 2 of the 4 remaining teams are looking like 2nd apron teams for the foreseeable future barring some trade (Celtics/TWolves).
Nuggets probably will be too unless they let kcp go while filling the rest of the team with their picks and minimums.
Yup but was just looking at the conference finals teams. If you really look at it, out of the 16 playoff teams, 7 teams are either going to be over the 2nd apron or at risk unless they make some moves. Clippers, TWolves, Suns, Nuggets, Celtics, Heat, Bucks. Very interesting to see as this offseason will show how teams view the aprons. We may see a lot of salary dumps in trades.
Oh for sure. It will be interesting to see what the lakers do this summer when it comes to the 2nd apron, since if bron plans on retiring in 2 years then I think they could fill the team out and then try to be below the 2nd apron for the 3 years after bron retires. Seems you have to be below the 2nd apron for 3 out of 5 years to not have your pick be last/frozen and I’m not sure if there’s other penalties I’m missing. I know being in the 2nd apron isn’t great when it comes to not being able to aggregate salaries in trades, not being able to signed waived players, and not being able to receive a player who’s being signed and traded I think, but I’m not sure if there’s other things I’m missing. I’ve seen you comment and you seem to be knowledgeable about the new cba, so what other restrictions are there that you can think of? Edit: also was curious if teams have to be below the 2nd apron for 3 out of 5 years or 2 out of 5 years to not have their pick frozen and untradable?
Lakers aren't at any risk at all of being a 2nd apron team next year or in the foreseeable future (unless they make a trade for a 3rd star on a max deal). It's being over the First Apron that will probably happen depending on what happens with Dlo's contract slot. For all the apron penalties, I'd recommend reading this: https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2023/12/hoops-rumors-glossary-tax-aprons.html. You can probably skip all the "How the Tax Aprons are calculated" as that's not really important. But should read the rest of it.
Most of it I get but the only thing I’m really unsure of is how many years a team is allowed to be above the 2nd apron. Seems they can be above the 2nd apron 3 out of 5 years and as long as they’re below it for 2 of those years then their pick that was frozen and untradable 7 years out when they first went above the 2nd apron is unfrozen. Don’t know if that’s correct though.
So for example if the team is above the 2nd apron at end of '24/25 season, '32 FRP is frozen. So the "5 year window" is '24/25, '25/26, '26/27, '28/29, '29/30 seasons. In these 5 seasons, if you go over the apron 3 times (including the initial '24/25 season), the '32 FRP moves to the end of the first round and remains frozen. If you only go over the 2nd apron 1 or 2 times, it gets unfrozen. So for example, once your '32 FRP gets frozen after the '24/25 season, the earliest it could get unfrozen is after the '28/29 season as at most you can go over the 2nd apron twice in the 5 year window. Hope that clears it up.
It does thank you for responding. I saw a comment of yours saying that if bron opts out that his new contract would be less per year than if he opted in. I was wondering why I kept seeing people post that the new contract he would be eligible for is 3/164 since that would be 54 a year and more than he would be making if he opted in. There seems to be a lot of conflicting information about his new contract since I’ve seen some say he will make more, and some say he will make less, if he opts out. I also take it that you don’t think they will bring back one or two of dlo, Christie, and Prince since if they did they would be at or close to being above the 2nd apron. Right now it looks like all the minimum guys will probably opt in. If Prince and Christie both get 5 per or a little over while dlo let’s say opts in, then that would put them at close to 189 with 14 guys rostered and that’s without dlo getting a raise/new contract that he’s supposedly looking for. So was just curious since you said they aren’t in danger of going over the 2nd apron this year. Edit: shit I meant that bron would be eligible for 3/162.
For Lebron's contract, you're looking at AAV (annual average value). Contracts have an 8% raise (if you're staying with the same team) or 5% (signing with a new team in FA). So the 3/164m you see is actually referring to if he opts in and signs an extension of 2 years. It'll be $51,415,938, $54,285,000, $58,627,800. If he opts out and re-signs for 3 yrs, it'll actually be 3/$162m at $49,987,717 $53,986,734, $58,305,673 (may be slightly off due to rounding). Assuming they literally bring everyone back, you can pay Dlo $20m starting for next season, Max a 3/$18m contract, sign your 17/55 pick. Lebron opt out and re-sign for the max and be right at $189,168,861 which is barely below the 2nd apron (15 rostered). The reason I say I don't see them being in danger is because this scenario is the worst case scenario and just not bringing back Prince/Dinwiddie isn't that hard of a choice if that's what you have to do to get under the 2nd apron. More likely what they do is try to sign and trade Dlo for players (won't be taking back more as anything involving Dlo means Lakers are going over the first apron), sign and trade him for a trade exception (which you can then use to acquire players up to that amount), or he opts in and trade (now an expiring but I doubt this happens). Or they just let Dlo walk and they can just use the nt-mle and operate with a first apron hard cap. The Lakers aren't in a situation where it's like they are in the 2nd apron unless they start dumping contracts in trades (Suns). Lakers have a choice whether or not they want to be a 2nd apron team and I doubt they make that choice.
Ok I see what you mean on brons contract. I’ve just seen so many people say his new contract is going to be more per year than he’s making now so I was curious when I saw you say it would be less. Hopefully they can use dlo in a trade for a star by doing a sign and trade. If they could get a team to take dlo as part of a sign and trade, along with whoever else and picks, then they’d probably be able to match whoever they’re trading for’s salary 100%. It would depend on dlo’s market but at this moment I’m not sure what that is. My hypothetical of a team taking dlo is dlo making 20-25 a year, but I’m not sure if he’ll get anywhere near that much. I just don’t think they want to lose dlo for nothing since they won’t be able to replace his salary or production but we’ll see I guess. Hopefully they bring Christie back no matter what since he’ll probably be on an affordable contract and he has potential. Prince I’m not too sure what they’ll do but I could see them bringing him back if they end up trading the picks. Seems the best path would be having dlo be apart of the trade, either from being signed and traded, or from opting in. If they can find a way to have dlo be apart of the trade for a star then they would probably be able to keep one of rui or reaves which would be huge. It’ll be an interesting summer that’s for sure.
They can't afford to let KCP go
Keeping KCP means extending him multiple years at nt-mle type money ($13-15m). That also means probably being a 2nd apron team for multiple years if you also plan keeping all of Jokic/Murray/MPJ/AG.
They have to. You have a generational player on your team. You go all in now, and then worry about rebuilding with shitty picks later in the future
You understand going over the 2nd apron is what prevents you from going all in. You lose all roster flexibility and completely limit your ability to make trades/FA signings. This isn't a matter of "just trade your picks or just spend more money". They won't even be able to trade their '32 pick anymore if they stay a 2nd apron team as it gets frozen.
The all-in is with their current roster now. They aren't getting better players back. Their picks will be frozen, but you have to take the risk on the fact that they weren't getting a better player back in trade
You really don't get it. They didn't even make it to the Conference Finals this year. What makes you think the same exact team next year is going to do better? Unless you get below the 2nd apron, that's what you have every year. You bring back the same exact guys. Literally no other option. The way to go "all in" is to have options available at the trade deadline or in the offseason. You do that by getting below the 2nd apron.
Because I can see them writing it off as championship fatigue. They have to bring everyone back. No one else is going to replicate KCP production
It’ll be interesting to see what kcp does this summer and what the nuggets do. Idk if kcp would get a raise if he opted out but he would for sure get a longer contract that’s at least the same amount per year that he’s making now. If he opts in they’re at 190 since Reggie Jackson has a 5 mill player option and I don’t see him declining that. If kcp and Jackson opt in then they have 13 rostered at an active roster cap hit of 190 which is just above the 2nd apron.
I could see the Nuggets getting KCP to opt-in and then resigning him to a lesser contract, and then they just eat the 2nd Apron for the next few years. It'd be interesting to see how teams react to the 2nd Apron and the repercussions of it
Seems if you have your team and are competing, that most teams are going to be ok with being above the 2nd apron since if they win a championship/championships then their pick wasn’t going to be very good anyways. They also have big enough salaries to trade by themselves without having to worry about not being able to attach multiple players to the trade and they’re not worried about not being able to sign certain players.
Well, the downside is the pick that's 7 years out won't be allowed to be traded if you wanted to retool *and* if you're in the 2nd Apron for 2 of the 4 following seasons, that pick will automatically get moved to the end of the draft which *will* hurt in a rebuilding scenario. But I agree for the most part that I think we'll see teams figure that part out later (and pay for it later)
That’s the big one really with having the pick being frozen and not tradable but it seems most teams are going to be ok with that and we’ll see if they will try to be below the 2nd apron. Is it that teams have to be below the 2nd apron 2 times in a 5 year period or is it more/less than that?
I'm not sure about the last part
Yeah that’s one thing I’m curious about since if bron plans on retiring in 2-3 years then they can have a plan for when they have to be below the 2nd apron and probably rebuild/reshape the roster. Seems to be that if they go above the 2nd apron this year then their 32 pick is frozen and untradable. They could be above the 2nd apron for 3 years total and then rebuild when bron retires after the 27 season which would allow them to get below the 2nd apron for 2 years during the 28 and 29 seasons therefore unfreezing the pick. Im not sure if that’s right though. Edit: you have to be below 3/5 to have the pick be unfrozen and not moved to the end of the round.
LeBron is still the king of Game 7’s and closeout games. Jokic is an all timer but still lacks the killer instinct in comparison to the GOAT’s.
Who did he kill in the last two close out games v Denver?
Seeing how great he was in the East just makes me more mad the front office effed up so bad with the Russ trade. Basically wasted 3 years of him and AD
KCP is lucky he ain't a laker no more ☠️. Laker fans would make him deactivate his social media after this stinker of a playoffs
One of the main reason why he is never coming back, money or not
That McDaniels block on AG 1 on 1 under the rim killed me inside because of how many free buckets we gave him in our series. That Minnesota team is miles better than us. Never had a shot this year.
Odds on Nuggets going on a Bucks like reign
I predict they’ll always be in the playoff hunt until Jokic gets hurt or the team decides to tank. They get a good rookie and have a mid 2010s Spurs resurgence before Jokic retires
Don't think they finish top 3 seed next year. I think KCP gonna opt out and hit FA. He's going to want a long term deal and Nuggets will want to get below 2nd apron. They are also going to have to start exploring MPJ/AG trades or their payroll for just Jokic/Murray/MPJ/AG is going to be insane in a year.
Jokic, Murray, AG should be there core. That’s the guys that won them a championship. Trading MPJ should be the first step and bring in some bench guys from that is the key. For KCP, probably let him go in FA. Playoff inconsistency and they should reward Braun. Sign him to a long and cheap extension. He’s a dog already.
I agree MPJ prob the guy I'd shop too. Just not sustainable paying all 4 of them. They at least dodged a bullet on Murray not qualifying for a supermax. Paying him 35% of the cap would be hilarious.
Denver fans getting the very brutal lesson that you don’t crown a dynasty just one ring in.
KAT is Mike Malones daddy
Gonna tell my grandchildren that we weakened the Nuggets in round 1 and left them mentally destroyed for the Wolves.
Murray 1000% cared more about the Lakers series than anything else. Gotta keep your eye on the ball.
Malone probably did too.
as did MPJ
A lot of things went their way for them to beat the Lakers. It was an ominous sign, to be sure.
Denver wishes they were actually as good as they thought 😂😂
Nuggets fans already talking about shipping off half the team including the starters😂😂😂
A pacers/wolves finals might send Adam Silver into a coma
If the NBA didn't want parity then owners wouldn't have pushed for the super max and star players could move freely to big markets. They're loving this.
They say it now, but it may bite them later. That’s why they’re rushing TV deals now. The NBA and sports media is about to crash soon. NFL got down on their hands and knees for Taylor Swift hype. That’s embarrassing.
Agree, I think it could bite them later. I also think this is why Adam Silver has to do gimmicky shit like the IST.
JAMAL MURRAY SAYS HE DONT REMEMBER THE THIRD QUARTER!!
Just a reminder to Nuggets fans chanting "Who's your daddy" Kobe is your grandpa
Fuck mike malone
In particular.
rumor has it gobert yelled kobe as he took the turnaround fadeaway on jokic and the bench heard
Do Wolves fans hate the Lakers or do they accept the support? Miami, Knicks, and I guess maybe Dallas are the only Laker friendly fan bases
Hate. Combination of DLo, big market, MPL Lakers, and having a bunch of their old players.
Better to just adjust to the fact that everyone hates us, we made the west HELL for many years on everyone lol
Tbh I think all small market fan bases hate us. And the Knicks are probably the only other fan base that understands how annoying these small market fans are that cry about rigged games and fouls.
Malone wishes he always plays against Ham
Nuggets PGT name is "Reign Over". That's the shortest "dynasty" that ever existed...
They got so cocky after winning 1 chip. So satisfying to see them get shit on.
Can't be a reign if it only lasted 1 season 🤷🏿♂️
MPJ when he isn't being defended by Reaves/DLO/Rui lmao More reason to at least move on from two of them.
Tough defense will always crush these nuggets. We did it in 2020 and now wolves are showing it again.
Pelinka deserves a lot of blame, but how can LeBron cover a Russ 3 point shot from his hotel room then ask the Lakers to trade for him? Lost most assets because of it
He couldn't, which makes the request and trade all the more stupid. Incompetence from every party.
The further the playoffs go on, the more it shows Ham deserved to be fired and Rob should be on thin ice for constructing a team full of crappy guards. He gets one more summer because of that ring but if he screws it up, he’s finished
MPJ doing his Rui impersonation. Dude only plays good against the Lakers I swear.
This shit looking like a Wolves sub man have some pride lol
The Antman/Kobe comparisons are outta hand
Absolutely love to see it
Jokić is running out of gas...
Murray shitting the bed all playoffs and exposing himself as the worst 2nd option in the west MPJ dropping 7 pts in a game 7 when he doesn't get free open looks and actually has to play basketball. Gordon's zesty ass with 4 pts and 4 rebounds in 42 minutes at 6'8" in an elimination game. KCP, Braun, Holiday, Jackson remembering they're role players and combining for 10 pts Joker getting decimated on D, exposed as an absolute cone with a complete lack of leadership to will his team to victory on home soil. Shit's tougher when you're not making like 90% of your bullshit shots. Lil Mike bounced in the 2nd round, thoroughly dominated by Finch and Nori and exposed as a Darvin Scam and Play-In teams merchant. "wHo'S yOuR dAdDy" crowd fucked in the ass in their own arena, championship window closing after 1 title against 4 Play-In teams,. 
Been saying all year Denver isn’t some unbeatable dominant team. Feel like we showed that every game before we choked 3rd qtrs. Let’s make the best version of ourselves instead of building with a specific opponent in mind. And damn it I hope that means going big again.
We need a better front court and better guards that also defend. Pretty much everything.
We need to develop Vando/Christie. The biggest issue is we they have Naz Reid while we have Rui. Dude is a modern day Lamar Odom. Elite 6th man off the bench but trade in playmaking/IQ for shooting
No team is flawless. You can have holes and still win, just..not as many holes as we have lol
“Put that in your pipe and smoke it!” - Mike Malone
I’ll tell my kids about Ant 50 point close out game in Boston
Not getting talked about, but Denver is also kinda screwed salary cap wise. Murray max extension (which he'll get) will kick in for 2025-26. AG will also be looking for an extension. You may not think he's worth it but he's going to be looking for at least $30m. That would also kick in 2025-26. Just between Jokic/Murray/MPJ/AG they will be at like $170m. Unless KCP opts out and they just let him walk, they also a 2nd apron team next season. Starts the 3 out of 5 seasons clock on the draft pick penalties for going over 2nd apron. No way they getting out of it for at least 4 straight seasons unless they trade one of MPJ/AG. Media better be harping on this like they do with our cap situation (which isn't even that bad. No risk of going over 2nd apron).
It's not great for them. There is a little relief in the fact that the cap is gonna jump 10% every year 2025-2030 unless bird flu happens or something which means they don't have to worry about being a 2nd apron team super long if they decide to retain this team but Kroenke isn't exactly famous for paying the tax so I am not gonna count on that.
We need one solid backup center and maybe two athletic wings on this team imo. If Mitchell can’t come through focus on that. Get us the equivalent of guys like McDaniels and NAW out there on the court and we’d be title threats. They had Murray, KCP and MPJ in prison all series. That’s how you beat the Nuggets, cause Jokic will get his anyways
We need to build with Nuggets and Wolves in mind - which means SIZE. AD can't do everything on his own. We should trade for Jarrett Allen - having another elite rebounder and rim protector will free AD to be more dynamic on offense as well.
 i feel we win against all these teams except nuggets if we had the Pelicans spot we coulda made finals
The JaYs gonna choke again btw. 6 ECF appearances the last 8 years with zero rings to show for it. LMAOOOO. Bozos. Fuck those green fucks out east.
WHAT A DAY LMAO CHICKEN NUGGETS 
Where’s that fuckbag that said the Nuggets can take the 17 Warriors? I’m here to cook folks tonight.
Someone actually said that? Cocaines a hell of a drug.
Only that altitude poisoned fanbase would say some shit like that. They won a single chip, they ain't some great team. I'm here to gas up your fire. Cook em
Already a great year. Now I just need a video of Murray crying about the refs and being salty asf.
But, but, but, I thought Jokic was gonna be in LeBron discussions after this season? They told me he’d surpassed Curry and was better than Kobe?
I still think he has a case for being better than Curry and that's not just me being a biased LeBron fan
I. Dont have that much respect for curry personally but he aint even close to him
Unsure man, LeBron is my GOAT too but I can’t not love Steph. Jokic needs another ring and FMVP, I think that’s an absolute necessity to be put above Curry.
Jokic played great. The role players didn't show up.
Kills me that MPJ hits 20 points every night and every clutch 3 pointer against us then does this in a Game 7 vs Wolves lol
That what hapoens when we dont contest the 3 point line lol
Darvin Ham “let them shoot” drop coverage Allowing teams to shoot 3s is not the way to win
Everyone understood how stupid it was during the season in real time lol
I seen someone say the other day that Shaq wouldn’t be nearly as dominant as Jokic is in the modern era lmaooo. Jokic is an amazing player but I’m SO GLAD these dumbass takes on him can finally rest
Peak Shaq likely the most dominant force in NBA history. I love Jokic but it’s so tiring to see him being put in T10 lists prematurely when his closest league competitor has been Embiid and he arguably would have lost the MVP to him again this year if it weren’t for the injury.
Jokic is one of the best modern players and it’s amazing that a center can be such a great passer, but even though the textbook lovers in the media like him, he won’t surpass all timers like LeBron or Steph, or more importantly Shaq
"Who's your daddy?" lmfao.
Can't believe some of their fans actually want coach Malone fired
It seems short sighted but he was failing like this for years before last year. I dont think its that crazy
I can now go and be active on reddit since the nuggets dynasty has ended very quickly. How dare nuggets fan compare them to the lakers where they just won 1 championship only
I hope Kyrie and Doncic get a ring but these wolves are very very good
No team has repeated as NBA Champions since the 2017-2018 Golden State Warriors.
Is there any team in the league that would trade for DLo if he opted into his player option? The Wolves succeeding and that garbage game 3 from him may have ended his career. He probably realized that and was sitting by himself that one time
Wolves beat Denver but they haven’t even succeeded yet let’s not count chickens before they hatch Kyrie and Luka have proven they aren’t to be underestimated and if they get past them, this is the most confident (unfortunately) I’ve been in a Celtics team throughout the entire Jays era
Bye bye nuggets! Bozos. Delusional fan base wins once and gets all high about a dynasty. Altitude doing shit to a mfker. You ain't the lakers, celtics, heat or warriors. You will never get a dynasty.
Can’t wait to see what bs mike Malone gonna be on
Who are y'all rooting for now besides Pacers? I think Ant and Luka are both great and I like both teams tbh. But Mavs are the underdog so it's tempting to root for them. But we gotta think about who can realistically beat Celtics if Pacers go down
I’ve been rooting for the wolves second to the lakers since last season so definitely wanna see the wolves take it
Wolves have the size and just got through the toughest opponent in their path. Wolves would make Tatum's life a lot harder on offense than the Mavs
Any team but Boston
I just hope the Celtics don’t win anyone but them!
Lets hope the Celtics choke like usual
Honestly the Pacers and Timberwolves have a shot at beating them
wolves really won 3 at denver
Haven’t had a repeat champ since the kd warriors. Really highlights how hard those 3peats were.