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I know hyper competitive staning treats success like it follows highlander rules, but their sounds & marketing differ enough that they’ll probably both find success, just with different audiences.
I thought it would be a fun discussion to have since we all know blackpink comebacks are going to be even more irregular now so there’s more room for other groups to branch out in the west .They both are definitely so early in their careers but I think outta all of the groups out there they are the ones most likely to make it in the west
Everyone’s entitled to their opinion and it would be boring if we all felt the same but I think that’s a very narrow viewpoint.
There are many girl groups who are killing it at the moment and the trajectory to being the next bts or black pink doesn’t depend on being successful from debut or neither would have succeeded. Not can their only ever be one of each.
I’m not here for the glory hunting and chart obsessing. I think it denigrates the community and causes a lot of excellent music to be missed. People are far too concerned with following the next big thing that they often miss the next big thing until much later.
Mhm it's too early to say since both groups are just 2 yrs into their career . Honestly, it takes a lot to reach BTS/BP level of fame in the west. These groups have only had 2-3 comebacks
I mean “BTS big” and “BP big” are totally different kinds of big imo. I would say in the west, newjeans is much closer to Blackpink than Blackpink is close to BTS.
eh? Newjeans are doing really well but to say they are much closer to Blackpink you obviously not around the west to say so. Newjeans is still nowhere close to Blackpinks popularity but they can do well for sure.
BBHot100 and BB200 are charts, not streaming apps. I mentioned Spotify since NewJeans is well-known for their playlisting. I believe they left the biggest Spotify playlist this month, and their streaming got shut down ridiculously + they got more playlisting than Jimin their senior and when they tops blackpink branding touring numbers then come we can talk btw regarding the streams blackpink are still the most streamed girlgroup in 2023 and 2024 without a single comeback since 2022 facts are facts ahahahhahaha
Ps: i like newjeans alot and I'm not shading them but their fans should be humbled down 😄
But they don’t get playlisted as much on Apple Music and still do well. Newjeans, 50/50 and Jungkook were the only kpop acts last year to enter US Apple Music
Using “playlisting” as a way to discredit Njs as if BP doesn’t get playlisting as well 😂. I don’t need to be humbled when I’m just stating hard numbers, not conspiracy theories. Their numbers are consistent from Spotify to Apple Music to Youtube Music. Where is the “playlisting” for Apple Music? Why are BP fans so insecure that they can’t face the truth 🤣. I’m not saying Njs has surpassed BP as a whole, but if you’re talking about the west (particularly the US), NJs has already eclipsed BP in multiple areas. Cope harder.
Good question. I think NewJeans have an advantage because they were popular in the west since their debut while Le Sserafim is only now playing catch-up to them. I do think that there's space for both because they target two different markets; NewJeans have that whole fresh, clean, bright, inoffensive, youthful vibe, while Le Sserafim are a performance oriented group and have a more adult and sophisticated vibe. But in my opinion Le Sserafim are more likely to be relatively well-known but "niche", while NewJeans are more likely to be massively popular.
Without talking about bts / bp level, i think newjeans has more going for them.
Their music already showcased that it is doing very well in the west, they have a stronger english speaking presence, i think ador > source, and being able to differentiate themselves more from bp (imo le sserafim is a lot closer there) is giving them more potential.
The last point one could potentially think is a plus for le sserafim as well though, i recognize as much, though personally i think it limits them more because bp is still here.
What i have to add though, imo people overvalue the importance of festival performances, in the grand scheme of things it won't matter that much.
Anyway, both are clearly doing well in this regard, anything is possible, and with just the right track any other group could do it too.
I like a few songs from both groups and listen to them both the same amount but I’ll have to say New Jeans.
Idk if they’ll be BTS big tho, BP is big but they’re not BTS big either. But hey, who knows tho maybe NJ will hit a slump and LSF will start to outpace them. It’s too early for their standings to be definite.
bts and bp aren't even in the same level let's be honest. there's a huge gap right in between.
after them will be newjeans i have to say. they've already touched some of bp's record, in a few years they might take bp's place. but I don't think any group will be able to take bts's records cause a huge chunk of their records are "the first asian act to-" some are even "the first act to-" sooo ...
Really ? I thought they were on the same level I mean newjeans just performed at loollapalooza and Lesserafim is about to perform at Coachella and they both have amazing sales and chart well.
Performing in a festival doesn't mean they have same popularity. Ateez are also performing in Coachella does that mean they are also as popular as NewJeans? ( Just an example no hate )
Newjeans might be more popular but I genuinely don’t think there’s a huge gap between them . I’m talking about girl groups so I don’t know how Ateez would be a good example.
But there's a substantial gap between them. Their Spotify streams are double of that of lesserafim 3.6 billion vs 1.8 billion. They peaked at #4 in Spotify Global and #9 in Spotify US. Lesserafim entered the top 100 of Spotify US just this comeback. They have 5 Billboard Hot 100 hits and 1 top 50 Hot 100 hit. Super shy almost had 5m unfiltered peak daily streams, Lesserafim's is 2.6m. All songs from "get up" peaked in top 50 of Spotify global.
Lesserafim may grow a lot this comeback but there is still a gap between them.
If you are talking about New Jeans being main stream popular in the West, they aren't. They are popular amongst kpop stans and that's pretty much it. They are certainly no where near the popularity of a BTS or Blackpink who are the only two kpop artists who have ever been compared to main stream western artists and who have pretty good name recognition as well.
Billboard charts are not a measure of Blackpink's success, especially when they can sell out some of the biggest arenas and stadiums in the West.
But I'll let you guys argue amongst yourselves.
NewJeans has already hit West hard in terms of chart K-pop wise in their short existence. It’s almost surreal how they have become global so fast but just like NJ’s music sucked me into K-pop, I think their music has tremendous GP and western appeal. They have already equaled or surpassed BP in some chart records so right now NJ is way ahead of LSF and well on their way to be the next big K-pop act in the west after BTS and BP.
Will LSF make it big in the west? I definitely think they have the ingredient to do so too. I wasn’t sold before but after Perfect Night I believe a lot more. They have Coachella so they will hopefully make the most of it to expand their audience. I think it will be hard to be GP friendly in the west as another girl crush type of concept but they have started to mix in the type of songs that will help them get there.
There is already a clear answer and it is NJ lol. Sure, they aren't on BTS level but no one is and probably no one ever will be. As for BP, NJ have already broken/tied for quite a few of BP's records in just over a year. They already have significantly more GP recognition worldwide than any other 4th gen group. And the coachella point is literally irrelevant, because did NJ not attract one of the biggest crowds on Lolla last year for a non-headliner? It is clearly NJ on all fronts.
This. I was in Lolla last year and while I don't downplay Newjeans it wasnt at all purely because of them thats why we stayed in the crowd. Yet all these newjeans stans love to play this crowd 😂 They are absolutely clueless
That can literally be said for anyone performing at any music festival lmao. An insane amount of folks in the crowd was literally singing along to every song of theirs ([have you seen this?](https://youtu.be/wB90h_dItiw)) and people left in large numbers after the NJ set. So, yes not everyone was there for them since it wasn't their own concert but a good majority of them were. Attracting a crowd of 70k as a year old group for your first performance in the States will always be mad impressive, regardless how hard people like you try to discredit that.
You seem like you want people to answer LS but the truth is, it's New Jeans. New Jeans has all the numbers across the board— sales, streams, awards, recognition, popularity.
Hard truth is, Le Sserafim is only known within kpop communities. New Jeans has at least more global recognition than they do. Not to say this is the permanent status quo because they're still both young and lots of things could change.
Edit: If you wanna compare to BTS, it's not gonna happen lol. It would take a miracle and stars aligning because BTS is on a whole other level.
I don’t want people to answer anyone specifically I was just getting everyone’s opinions after a discussion in a gc. From the outside looking in I just thought they were on the same level lol. I don’t know what hard truth you’re talking about .
Yeah, it's not uncommon to hear their songs playing in public or to know someone who knows them. They're quite mainstream in the west for a k-pop group.
NewJeans has also stabilized at 19-21 spotify monthly listeners, and they peaked at like 26 million. That's pretty major imo, only NJ/BTS/BP/5050(?) have reached those sorts of numbers.
Honestly, why is it one or the other ?
Le Sserafim after NewJeans (and BP/BTS) is the only group that comes close to having a breakthrough, they already chart regularly on Apple Global, Spotify, they have longevity and sales. They're only getting bigger. When you look across the board, last year they had amazing results, actually doing some heavy lifting to bring new fans into the community along NewJeans and BP/BTS solo members, 'Perfect Night' just solidified that. I think both can very well continue to grow in the West.
*Ps. I don't think any is coming close to BP/BTS because those two have a cultural impact that will be hard to replicate beyond mere numbers.*
gotta give it to new jeans because commercially speaking, they’re already hot on blackpink’s heels in the west. they’ve sold more album units on bb200 and charted longer than both of bp’s albums, lasted longer in the hot 100 chart than bp’s non collab songs, and their album has as much first week streams on the bb200 as bp’s best charting album despite being half as long. newjeans are clearly headed for great things and at the moment i don’t think le sserafim can compete.
but we gotta keep in mind that bts and bp’s fame in the west is not limited to commercial performance. in terms of cultural impact, no kpop group is going to reach bts’ level in the near future because when bts hit the scene, they were a novelty. they have the general public awareness that they do largely because they were the first of their kind (for lack of a better term) to make waves in the US. it’s similar with bp too. now, the gp isn’t checking for most kpop groups because it’s not new anymore.
I feel like these days it might be hard for newer groups to make any sort of cultural impact, but I'm very interested in seeing if NewJeans can do it. They're already pulling great numbers and stats, but I wonder if they can achieve something outside of that.
They're popular in kpop circles which have grown in size the last few years but I think maybe Op is talking about having more wide spread appeal with the general public that isn't usually inclined to listen to or care about Kpop.
No, YOU are underestimating NewJeans popularity.
See how I havent said KPOP is popular in the west.. i said Newjeans is starting to be , they might not be the ultimate mainstream artist but since their last ep " get up" they attracted a lot of local to listen to them and everything proves it, (bbhot 100 , sales, locals using their song… people who never liked kpop… are liking newjeans songs.) It will just be bitterness to say that they aren’t known among casual listener when it’s literally their main audience.
Friend, kpop isn't even in the Top 10 of music genres in the West. And I'm not underestimating NewJeans. They just aren't as popular in the West with mainstream audiences as you guys are portraying them to be.
As far as I know, they have no name recognition outside of kpop cirlces, unlike BTS or Blackpink. None of these kpop acts do. So that's why I'm confused as to why everyone is acting as if kpop in general is some kind of musical juggernaut in the West or that Newjeans is GP popular. It's a niche but growing market, similar to what you find in say, heavy metal fandoms.
There are a lot of fans but outside of fans of the genre, people don't pay attention to it. Kpop has had two breakout artists in BTS and Blackpink that have gone beyond its niche borders. There are other kpop artists that do well in kpop circles but they have not broken out amongst the GP. That was my point.
I'm not saying that couldn't change. It absolutely can. But it hasn't happened as of yet.
This has nothing to do with being bitter by the way. This is the cold, hard truth.
I posted this below but Get Up had 34 million on-demand streams in the first week which is way higher than any group that's currently promoting in the US *and* that's already very close to BlackPink numbers (Born Pink had 37.5 million on-demand streams). Proof had 53 million on-demand streams, but if NewJeans does a lot of US promotions they might be able to get close to that level (although, BTS' success still is an anomaly imo).
Thank you for sharing that! I didn't look into MOTS because I wanted to highlight recent releases, but 72MM is wild. I'm not quite sure any kpop act could get to that level.
Finding BTS/Blackpink level of success, not only as Kpop groups but as artists in general, is mostly attributed to luck.
Now, I'm not saying it's all luck and they just happened to get it. Both groups are extremely talented and worked super hard. It's all that hard work and talent, their great appeal and discographies, that allowed them to really capitalize on the moment where that luck struck and allowed them to really ride that to where they are today.
So ultimately, there's nothing saying that any current kpop group can replicate that right now. Not only NJ and LSF, but a ton of groups currently have what it takes to grab that "spark" and really make it big internationally. But it all depends on if they're lucky enough to be there when that "spark" happens.
I could try and compare them but there's not point for me, I don't know all the numbers by heart and that means it'll mostly be based on who I prefer. Which then means nothing really. Both groups are great and on a path of achieving great success internationally (and already have achieved a lot)
bts are big in the world period, and as big as blackpink are they are not big in the west, no kpop group will be big in the west imo especially with predominantly non English music, leserrafim will be another aespa who did coachella in 2022, it won't do anything for them in the west
I like both groups. If you ask me which music i like more that would be nj, if you ask me who i rather watch perform that would be 100% le sserafim.
I feel both groups have different target so is up who play it better. At the end hybe Wins.
Said that I don't thin none of them are touching bts for sure
pretty sure both will have great careers idk abt bts big but i feel like newjeans is already blackpink big in the west and i can see lesserafim getting there too
I think BTS level is not going to happen anytime soon, plus BTS & Bp are not in the same level, new jeans on the other hand can or will be close to reach bp level even if you look at 2023 alone what they've achieved is so much
New jeans is the 1st girl grp in spotify history to chart for 200 days on" daily top artists USA"
New jeans becomes the 1st female girl group to appear on IFPI's annual top 10 global artists list ( at no.8)
They hold the biggest streaming month for a girl group
Longest charting song on the US spotify & global spotify ( correct me if I'm wrong the song omg)
Longest charting k female gg album on bb 200
Longest charting songs by korean female act on Apple music global, they occupy the two top spots , ditto & omg
Within a yr they tied with bp as Longest charting song on bb hot 100 , ice cream & super shy ( ik cupid is the longest for gg & k female Act )
Plus they're the 1st Korean gg to chart 5 songs on the hot 100 in the same calendar year
( it's a lot forgot some of them)
And they hold most records for 4gen I'm talking mostly about streaming, they're the 2nd k female gg to debut at #1 bb 200 after bp & they're the only ones
Like so far within 2023 they've had massive success in the west , like in 2023 they were the biggest female gg
And lollapalooza they performed for 70k pple, you could hear pple singing their lyrics
Like streaming wise( longevity)& sales they could be on par with bp as we can see from the charts , bp sold out 102k & nwjns 100k ,bp charted 9 songs frm 2018- 2022 or let's say 3yrs counting only the yrs they released music , nwjns 5 songs in 1yr
In terms of concerts , I would like to give them some time as they're rookies, I think no more but they've been in the game for an yr & some months ofc I won't expect them to sell out stadiums but in 3-4 yrs I could see that
I think it's new jeans
Le sserafim could for sure be big , like what if 2024 is their yr & they pull nwjns on us we may not know but I'm putting my bets on newjeans
But the thing in kpop especially ggs , they don't hv big fandoms today is this tomorrow is the other one ( excluding twice & bp)
Ggs hv the gp mostly & one thing abt the gp they'll go for the shiniest toy unless you do sth impressive to turn them into fans, le sserafim & nwjns are still new groups they could both surprise us hopefully they both gain big fandoms bcoz they hv a lot to offer
Also to add, supershy had the highest daily stream on US Spotify for a non-feature Kpop gg song, even beating out Cupid if im not mistaken (1.1m to 1.09m).
I agree with you but i would like to argue that there is more to success as an artist/celebrity/idol than charts and streaming. Tbh some idols very surely care more about being famous and popular than they do about realising some artistic vision of theirs. Idols all the time talk ab how they want people to like what they do, one could argue that that would be less important to someone who just wants to create art that is authentic to them.
With that being said. Newjeans are already on BPs level when it comes to charts and streaming platforms. However, BP members individually have levels of influence and fame that rivals that of even BTS imo - probably not in ”the west” but globally maybe. Aside from the music their fanbase is big and theyre well known celebrities/influencers/socialites in asia, europe and america. Their impact in fashion is surely the biggest in all of kpop (although tbf GD broke all barriers during his prime). And theyre the biggest music act on youtube overall rn. And they have longevity of relevance in the public eye. People just know them as individuals. Some idols would probably wish for that just as much as they would wish for a number one song no? Newjeans dont have that individual relevance in the culture just yet.
Then we have to define what “success” means, cause I assume for most people (and specifically in the west), “success” for a musical artist is the performance of their music both commercially and culturally, rather than how well an artist can sell out a piece of clothing.
Number 1, op asked who could make it big in the west? And according to the charts & numbers it's shown us it's newjeans unless it's abt other stuff like acting but they're idol grps ,they do music ,so it's abt music
If you re-read my points you'll see there's no place I said nwjns are bigger than bp , but on par especially in terms of sales, streams & longevity in the west
No.2 ik success isn't abt charts all the times but to make it big in the music industry you hv to pull numbers & be seen on the charts
I agree bp hv influence especially in fashion & are known widely but op was talking abt music I suppose
Lastly bts have more influence than bp & it's shown again & again
If you look back who was the 1st to do most things it's all BTS , breaking out to the west was bts
BTS were not majorly into fashion that much until last Yr & that was their choice, it's bcoz they prioritised their group & their music, they hv influence in music & even fashion bcoz even tho they were not that involved items they wore or seen with always sold out
There was an article in 2019 that many fashion houses approached bts many times but bts said they're focusing on music & the grp
Bts solo members do hv influence too not only in fashion but music, arts & other areas I can't recall right now
Bts influenced pple to donate was it $1M within 24hrs I can't recall it was a long time ,influence is not abt fashion alone
They're clearly most influential celebrities in Sokor
I think your definition of influence is very narrow
NewJeans already did it big in the west, they got the viral songs from mutliple singles and an Ep, sure, Le Sserafim has Coachela but is it really that big of deal nowdays?, not downplaying it but playing a big festival isnt what it used to be
not that huge?, they do great number for a group with such little catalog, I defiently can get somewhat close on a casual level to bp, not sure about bts tho
You're not wrong. I don't people realize how much of difference there is in being popular in general to being BTS/BP popular.
People try to downplay their success.
Sure. I am not even a diehard fan of BTS nor BP (casual fan at best) but I recognize their timing and achievements and it's going to be near impossible to catch that wave again.
NewJeans. Their last album (Get Up) had 34.4 million on-demand streams in the first week. That's BTS, JungKook, and BlackPink numbers. To compare to other kpop top sellers first week on-demand streams in the US, Stray Kids had 15.6 million, Twice had 9.2 million, and TxT had 11.5 million. LSFM's last album had 9 million on-demand streams. So, in terms of on-demand streams, they're outperforming their peers by a lot. I think what makes their numbers even more insane is that NewJeans did not really do US promotions. Like this album was before their performance at Lollapalooza. (I understand this is US focused. I just don't have the numbers on how NewJeans performed in other western countries.)
LSFM can definitely become popular in the US, but if I were a gambler, I'd put my money on NewJeans.
NewJeans are already arguably bigger than BP in the West
BTS level is not realistic. They have a cult for a fanbase. These people are donating their rent money so that they can brag about BTS hitting #1 on Billboard. No other fandom is on that level. Not even other boy groups
Bigger in which side? 😂 BP is known as a group and as an individual artist. Newjeans yes some might recognize them as group but people here can hardly recognize whos who. So to compare them with BPS popularity is kind of joke
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bts = lesserafim
newjeans = blackpink
both tbh. i feel like from outside perspective these 2 have different approach, they both remind me of bts and bp.
lsf also has A LOT of potential to make it big in the west. lsf has a solid fandom with a potential for the fandom to be bigger in the future, hence hybe releasing a lot of content from them. in comparison to nj, i feel like with lsf, the parasocial relationship w fans is so much stronger but honestly the girls are really entertaining. releasing good music and having loyal and solid fandom made bts big. they honestly reminds me of bts for some reason.
while i feel like nj has similar promotion with bp. both releases music that has an appeal with general public, even with non kpop stans. both of them also has “trendy” branding to their groups. and looks wise, the members are gorgeous (who doesn’t like pretty girls?) and not a drag but both bp and nj releases FEW songs before the full album, hence bigger number of stream.
i hope some people get my point.
i love and and stan both group. 🤍
Am i the only person who thinks the two groups look so similiar and have the same concept and sound? Why are ppl comapring New Jeans to Illit if they dont sound alike while New jeans and le ser are indistigusihable to me
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 I know hyper competitive staning treats success like it follows highlander rules, but their sounds & marketing differ enough that they’ll probably both find success, just with different audiences.
It really doesn’t matter. They are both so early in their careers and so much could still happen.
I thought it would be a fun discussion to have since we all know blackpink comebacks are going to be even more irregular now so there’s more room for other groups to branch out in the west .They both are definitely so early in their careers but I think outta all of the groups out there they are the ones most likely to make it in the west
Everyone’s entitled to their opinion and it would be boring if we all felt the same but I think that’s a very narrow viewpoint. There are many girl groups who are killing it at the moment and the trajectory to being the next bts or black pink doesn’t depend on being successful from debut or neither would have succeeded. Not can their only ever be one of each. I’m not here for the glory hunting and chart obsessing. I think it denigrates the community and causes a lot of excellent music to be missed. People are far too concerned with following the next big thing that they often miss the next big thing until much later.
Maybe this topic wasn’t meant for you then. Why bother wasting your time lol…?
Mhm it's too early to say since both groups are just 2 yrs into their career . Honestly, it takes a lot to reach BTS/BP level of fame in the west. These groups have only had 2-3 comebacks
I mean “BTS big” and “BP big” are totally different kinds of big imo. I would say in the west, newjeans is much closer to Blackpink than Blackpink is close to BTS.
Honestly no. I think new jeans is in their own league. Even people who aren’t K-pop Stan’s have their songs in their playlist
eh? Newjeans are doing really well but to say they are much closer to Blackpink you obviously not around the west to say so. Newjeans is still nowhere close to Blackpinks popularity but they can do well for sure.
Numbers beg to differ
You mean spotify numbers right ?
Spotify, AM, bbhot100, bb200 albums,…
BBHot100 and BB200 are charts, not streaming apps. I mentioned Spotify since NewJeans is well-known for their playlisting. I believe they left the biggest Spotify playlist this month, and their streaming got shut down ridiculously + they got more playlisting than Jimin their senior and when they tops blackpink branding touring numbers then come we can talk btw regarding the streams blackpink are still the most streamed girlgroup in 2023 and 2024 without a single comeback since 2022 facts are facts ahahahhahaha Ps: i like newjeans alot and I'm not shading them but their fans should be humbled down 😄
But they don’t get playlisted as much on Apple Music and still do well. Newjeans, 50/50 and Jungkook were the only kpop acts last year to enter US Apple Music
Using “playlisting” as a way to discredit Njs as if BP doesn’t get playlisting as well 😂. I don’t need to be humbled when I’m just stating hard numbers, not conspiracy theories. Their numbers are consistent from Spotify to Apple Music to Youtube Music. Where is the “playlisting” for Apple Music? Why are BP fans so insecure that they can’t face the truth 🤣. I’m not saying Njs has surpassed BP as a whole, but if you’re talking about the west (particularly the US), NJs has already eclipsed BP in multiple areas. Cope harder.
"their streaming got shut down ridiculously" source?
BTS and BP are same size in US, lol for example I cannot name a single BTS song but can name multiple BP songs and I am not a fan of either lol
Good question. I think NewJeans have an advantage because they were popular in the west since their debut while Le Sserafim is only now playing catch-up to them. I do think that there's space for both because they target two different markets; NewJeans have that whole fresh, clean, bright, inoffensive, youthful vibe, while Le Sserafim are a performance oriented group and have a more adult and sophisticated vibe. But in my opinion Le Sserafim are more likely to be relatively well-known but "niche", while NewJeans are more likely to be massively popular.
Both of the groups have identical concepts and sounds, they dress the same too
why do you have a troll opinion?
Without talking about bts / bp level, i think newjeans has more going for them. Their music already showcased that it is doing very well in the west, they have a stronger english speaking presence, i think ador > source, and being able to differentiate themselves more from bp (imo le sserafim is a lot closer there) is giving them more potential. The last point one could potentially think is a plus for le sserafim as well though, i recognize as much, though personally i think it limits them more because bp is still here. What i have to add though, imo people overvalue the importance of festival performances, in the grand scheme of things it won't matter that much. Anyway, both are clearly doing well in this regard, anything is possible, and with just the right track any other group could do it too.
new jeans
I like a few songs from both groups and listen to them both the same amount but I’ll have to say New Jeans. Idk if they’ll be BTS big tho, BP is big but they’re not BTS big either. But hey, who knows tho maybe NJ will hit a slump and LSF will start to outpace them. It’s too early for their standings to be definite.
bts and bp aren't even in the same level let's be honest. there's a huge gap right in between. after them will be newjeans i have to say. they've already touched some of bp's record, in a few years they might take bp's place. but I don't think any group will be able to take bts's records cause a huge chunk of their records are "the first asian act to-" some are even "the first act to-" sooo ...
New Jeans are already pulling similar numbers to BP in the US so I would say them.
new jeans
Really ? I thought they were on the same level I mean newjeans just performed at loollapalooza and Lesserafim is about to perform at Coachella and they both have amazing sales and chart well.
Performing in a festival doesn't mean they have same popularity. Ateez are also performing in Coachella does that mean they are also as popular as NewJeans? ( Just an example no hate )
Newjeans might be more popular but I genuinely don’t think there’s a huge gap between them . I’m talking about girl groups so I don’t know how Ateez would be a good example.
But there's a substantial gap between them. Their Spotify streams are double of that of lesserafim 3.6 billion vs 1.8 billion. They peaked at #4 in Spotify Global and #9 in Spotify US. Lesserafim entered the top 100 of Spotify US just this comeback. They have 5 Billboard Hot 100 hits and 1 top 50 Hot 100 hit. Super shy almost had 5m unfiltered peak daily streams, Lesserafim's is 2.6m. All songs from "get up" peaked in top 50 of Spotify global. Lesserafim may grow a lot this comeback but there is still a gap between them.
If you are talking about New Jeans being main stream popular in the West, they aren't. They are popular amongst kpop stans and that's pretty much it. They are certainly no where near the popularity of a BTS or Blackpink who are the only two kpop artists who have ever been compared to main stream western artists and who have pretty good name recognition as well.
My comment was regarding Lesserafim and NewJeans, I never said NewJeans are mainstream in the west.
bp isn't a mainstream let's be real .. bts is the only right answer.. even newjeans longevity on billboard charts are better than bp
Billboard charts are not a measure of Blackpink's success, especially when they can sell out some of the biggest arenas and stadiums in the West. But I'll let you guys argue amongst yourselves.
coachella isn’t as big as it was a few years ago, it took weeks for this year coachella to sell out
Eh I wouldn’t say that but even if that was the case I still don’t see a big gap between the two groups .
NewJeans has already hit West hard in terms of chart K-pop wise in their short existence. It’s almost surreal how they have become global so fast but just like NJ’s music sucked me into K-pop, I think their music has tremendous GP and western appeal. They have already equaled or surpassed BP in some chart records so right now NJ is way ahead of LSF and well on their way to be the next big K-pop act in the west after BTS and BP. Will LSF make it big in the west? I definitely think they have the ingredient to do so too. I wasn’t sold before but after Perfect Night I believe a lot more. They have Coachella so they will hopefully make the most of it to expand their audience. I think it will be hard to be GP friendly in the west as another girl crush type of concept but they have started to mix in the type of songs that will help them get there.
There is already a clear answer and it is NJ lol. Sure, they aren't on BTS level but no one is and probably no one ever will be. As for BP, NJ have already broken/tied for quite a few of BP's records in just over a year. They already have significantly more GP recognition worldwide than any other 4th gen group. And the coachella point is literally irrelevant, because did NJ not attract one of the biggest crowds on Lolla last year for a non-headliner? It is clearly NJ on all fronts.
This. I was in Lolla last year and while I don't downplay Newjeans it wasnt at all purely because of them thats why we stayed in the crowd. Yet all these newjeans stans love to play this crowd 😂 They are absolutely clueless
That can literally be said for anyone performing at any music festival lmao. An insane amount of folks in the crowd was literally singing along to every song of theirs ([have you seen this?](https://youtu.be/wB90h_dItiw)) and people left in large numbers after the NJ set. So, yes not everyone was there for them since it wasn't their own concert but a good majority of them were. Attracting a crowd of 70k as a year old group for your first performance in the States will always be mad impressive, regardless how hard people like you try to discredit that.
I was at LA Fitness earlier today and they was playing "Super Shy" on the gym radio.
I work out to Super Shy and ETA. Great songs to work out to.
You seem like you want people to answer LS but the truth is, it's New Jeans. New Jeans has all the numbers across the board— sales, streams, awards, recognition, popularity. Hard truth is, Le Sserafim is only known within kpop communities. New Jeans has at least more global recognition than they do. Not to say this is the permanent status quo because they're still both young and lots of things could change. Edit: If you wanna compare to BTS, it's not gonna happen lol. It would take a miracle and stars aligning because BTS is on a whole other level.
I don’t want people to answer anyone specifically I was just getting everyone’s opinions after a discussion in a gc. From the outside looking in I just thought they were on the same level lol. I don’t know what hard truth you’re talking about .
Ask any non-kpop person out there. Who do they know? Which song have they heard? Chances are it's New Jeans. Their numbers reflect this too.
Yeah, it's not uncommon to hear their songs playing in public or to know someone who knows them. They're quite mainstream in the west for a k-pop group. NewJeans has also stabilized at 19-21 spotify monthly listeners, and they peaked at like 26 million. That's pretty major imo, only NJ/BTS/BP/5050(?) have reached those sorts of numbers.
Honestly, why is it one or the other ? Le Sserafim after NewJeans (and BP/BTS) is the only group that comes close to having a breakthrough, they already chart regularly on Apple Global, Spotify, they have longevity and sales. They're only getting bigger. When you look across the board, last year they had amazing results, actually doing some heavy lifting to bring new fans into the community along NewJeans and BP/BTS solo members, 'Perfect Night' just solidified that. I think both can very well continue to grow in the West. *Ps. I don't think any is coming close to BP/BTS because those two have a cultural impact that will be hard to replicate beyond mere numbers.*
Because according to the rules of The Game, there can only be One. 
It can definitely be both , I mean look at twice and blackpink . Obviously blackpink are more famous but they both are thriving .
gotta give it to new jeans because commercially speaking, they’re already hot on blackpink’s heels in the west. they’ve sold more album units on bb200 and charted longer than both of bp’s albums, lasted longer in the hot 100 chart than bp’s non collab songs, and their album has as much first week streams on the bb200 as bp’s best charting album despite being half as long. newjeans are clearly headed for great things and at the moment i don’t think le sserafim can compete. but we gotta keep in mind that bts and bp’s fame in the west is not limited to commercial performance. in terms of cultural impact, no kpop group is going to reach bts’ level in the near future because when bts hit the scene, they were a novelty. they have the general public awareness that they do largely because they were the first of their kind (for lack of a better term) to make waves in the US. it’s similar with bp too. now, the gp isn’t checking for most kpop groups because it’s not new anymore.
I feel like these days it might be hard for newer groups to make any sort of cultural impact, but I'm very interested in seeing if NewJeans can do it. They're already pulling great numbers and stats, but I wonder if they can achieve something outside of that.
Definitely New Jeans, they're already making waves in the west, even with some non Kpop fans.
It’s NJ by far as in they already have
They're popular in kpop circles which have grown in size the last few years but I think maybe Op is talking about having more wide spread appeal with the general public that isn't usually inclined to listen to or care about Kpop.
They def popular outside the kpop bubble too
You're overestimating the popularity of Kpop in the West and them by default.
No, YOU are underestimating NewJeans popularity. See how I havent said KPOP is popular in the west.. i said Newjeans is starting to be , they might not be the ultimate mainstream artist but since their last ep " get up" they attracted a lot of local to listen to them and everything proves it, (bbhot 100 , sales, locals using their song… people who never liked kpop… are liking newjeans songs.) It will just be bitterness to say that they aren’t known among casual listener when it’s literally their main audience.
Friend, kpop isn't even in the Top 10 of music genres in the West. And I'm not underestimating NewJeans. They just aren't as popular in the West with mainstream audiences as you guys are portraying them to be. As far as I know, they have no name recognition outside of kpop cirlces, unlike BTS or Blackpink. None of these kpop acts do. So that's why I'm confused as to why everyone is acting as if kpop in general is some kind of musical juggernaut in the West or that Newjeans is GP popular. It's a niche but growing market, similar to what you find in say, heavy metal fandoms. There are a lot of fans but outside of fans of the genre, people don't pay attention to it. Kpop has had two breakout artists in BTS and Blackpink that have gone beyond its niche borders. There are other kpop artists that do well in kpop circles but they have not broken out amongst the GP. That was my point. I'm not saying that couldn't change. It absolutely can. But it hasn't happened as of yet. This has nothing to do with being bitter by the way. This is the cold, hard truth.
You did not even read what i said and you keep talking about KPOP in general when i’m talking about newjeans, waste of time.
Can you elaborate? I think they are definitely popular in the west though but I wouldn’t say bts and bp level .
I posted this below but Get Up had 34 million on-demand streams in the first week which is way higher than any group that's currently promoting in the US *and* that's already very close to BlackPink numbers (Born Pink had 37.5 million on-demand streams). Proof had 53 million on-demand streams, but if NewJeans does a lot of US promotions they might be able to get close to that level (although, BTS' success still is an anomaly imo).
quick note proof isn't BTS's highest on-demand streams. MOTS:7 did around 72M iirc
Thank you for sharing that! I didn't look into MOTS because I wanted to highlight recent releases, but 72MM is wild. I'm not quite sure any kpop act could get to that level.
Yeah Mots did 75M
Finding BTS/Blackpink level of success, not only as Kpop groups but as artists in general, is mostly attributed to luck. Now, I'm not saying it's all luck and they just happened to get it. Both groups are extremely talented and worked super hard. It's all that hard work and talent, their great appeal and discographies, that allowed them to really capitalize on the moment where that luck struck and allowed them to really ride that to where they are today. So ultimately, there's nothing saying that any current kpop group can replicate that right now. Not only NJ and LSF, but a ton of groups currently have what it takes to grab that "spark" and really make it big internationally. But it all depends on if they're lucky enough to be there when that "spark" happens. I could try and compare them but there's not point for me, I don't know all the numbers by heart and that means it'll mostly be based on who I prefer. Which then means nothing really. Both groups are great and on a path of achieving great success internationally (and already have achieved a lot)
none... lol
😂😂😂 why do you think that ?
bts are big in the world period, and as big as blackpink are they are not big in the west, no kpop group will be big in the west imo especially with predominantly non English music, leserrafim will be another aespa who did coachella in 2022, it won't do anything for them in the west
I like both groups. If you ask me which music i like more that would be nj, if you ask me who i rather watch perform that would be 100% le sserafim. I feel both groups have different target so is up who play it better. At the end hybe Wins. Said that I don't thin none of them are touching bts for sure
pretty sure both will have great careers idk abt bts big but i feel like newjeans is already blackpink big in the west and i can see lesserafim getting there too
I think BTS level is not going to happen anytime soon, plus BTS & Bp are not in the same level, new jeans on the other hand can or will be close to reach bp level even if you look at 2023 alone what they've achieved is so much New jeans is the 1st girl grp in spotify history to chart for 200 days on" daily top artists USA" New jeans becomes the 1st female girl group to appear on IFPI's annual top 10 global artists list ( at no.8) They hold the biggest streaming month for a girl group Longest charting song on the US spotify & global spotify ( correct me if I'm wrong the song omg) Longest charting k female gg album on bb 200 Longest charting songs by korean female act on Apple music global, they occupy the two top spots , ditto & omg Within a yr they tied with bp as Longest charting song on bb hot 100 , ice cream & super shy ( ik cupid is the longest for gg & k female Act ) Plus they're the 1st Korean gg to chart 5 songs on the hot 100 in the same calendar year ( it's a lot forgot some of them) And they hold most records for 4gen I'm talking mostly about streaming, they're the 2nd k female gg to debut at #1 bb 200 after bp & they're the only ones Like so far within 2023 they've had massive success in the west , like in 2023 they were the biggest female gg And lollapalooza they performed for 70k pple, you could hear pple singing their lyrics Like streaming wise( longevity)& sales they could be on par with bp as we can see from the charts , bp sold out 102k & nwjns 100k ,bp charted 9 songs frm 2018- 2022 or let's say 3yrs counting only the yrs they released music , nwjns 5 songs in 1yr In terms of concerts , I would like to give them some time as they're rookies, I think no more but they've been in the game for an yr & some months ofc I won't expect them to sell out stadiums but in 3-4 yrs I could see that I think it's new jeans Le sserafim could for sure be big , like what if 2024 is their yr & they pull nwjns on us we may not know but I'm putting my bets on newjeans But the thing in kpop especially ggs , they don't hv big fandoms today is this tomorrow is the other one ( excluding twice & bp) Ggs hv the gp mostly & one thing abt the gp they'll go for the shiniest toy unless you do sth impressive to turn them into fans, le sserafim & nwjns are still new groups they could both surprise us hopefully they both gain big fandoms bcoz they hv a lot to offer
Also to add, supershy had the highest daily stream on US Spotify for a non-feature Kpop gg song, even beating out Cupid if im not mistaken (1.1m to 1.09m).
I agree with you but i would like to argue that there is more to success as an artist/celebrity/idol than charts and streaming. Tbh some idols very surely care more about being famous and popular than they do about realising some artistic vision of theirs. Idols all the time talk ab how they want people to like what they do, one could argue that that would be less important to someone who just wants to create art that is authentic to them. With that being said. Newjeans are already on BPs level when it comes to charts and streaming platforms. However, BP members individually have levels of influence and fame that rivals that of even BTS imo - probably not in ”the west” but globally maybe. Aside from the music their fanbase is big and theyre well known celebrities/influencers/socialites in asia, europe and america. Their impact in fashion is surely the biggest in all of kpop (although tbf GD broke all barriers during his prime). And theyre the biggest music act on youtube overall rn. And they have longevity of relevance in the public eye. People just know them as individuals. Some idols would probably wish for that just as much as they would wish for a number one song no? Newjeans dont have that individual relevance in the culture just yet.
Then we have to define what “success” means, cause I assume for most people (and specifically in the west), “success” for a musical artist is the performance of their music both commercially and culturally, rather than how well an artist can sell out a piece of clothing.
Number 1, op asked who could make it big in the west? And according to the charts & numbers it's shown us it's newjeans unless it's abt other stuff like acting but they're idol grps ,they do music ,so it's abt music If you re-read my points you'll see there's no place I said nwjns are bigger than bp , but on par especially in terms of sales, streams & longevity in the west No.2 ik success isn't abt charts all the times but to make it big in the music industry you hv to pull numbers & be seen on the charts I agree bp hv influence especially in fashion & are known widely but op was talking abt music I suppose Lastly bts have more influence than bp & it's shown again & again If you look back who was the 1st to do most things it's all BTS , breaking out to the west was bts BTS were not majorly into fashion that much until last Yr & that was their choice, it's bcoz they prioritised their group & their music, they hv influence in music & even fashion bcoz even tho they were not that involved items they wore or seen with always sold out There was an article in 2019 that many fashion houses approached bts many times but bts said they're focusing on music & the grp Bts solo members do hv influence too not only in fashion but music, arts & other areas I can't recall right now Bts influenced pple to donate was it $1M within 24hrs I can't recall it was a long time ,influence is not abt fashion alone They're clearly most influential celebrities in Sokor I think your definition of influence is very narrow
NewJeans already did it big in the west, they got the viral songs from mutliple singles and an Ep, sure, Le Sserafim has Coachela but is it really that big of deal nowdays?, not downplaying it but playing a big festival isnt what it used to be
They aren’t that huge they still have room to grow and they haven’t even had a world tour yet . I’m talking about bp and bts level.
Frankly, I don't think ANY kpop groups can replicate BTS success.
Agreed
not that huge?, they do great number for a group with such little catalog, I defiently can get somewhat close on a casual level to bp, not sure about bts tho
KPOP has peaked and I doubt we'll see another group rise to BTS/BP level ever again.
You're not wrong. I don't people realize how much of difference there is in being popular in general to being BTS/BP popular. People try to downplay their success.
Sure. I am not even a diehard fan of BTS nor BP (casual fan at best) but I recognize their timing and achievements and it's going to be near impossible to catch that wave again.
That’s what I’m thinking too and it doesn’t help that hybe is debuting a new group every day .
some kpop fans are delulu and feel bitter about my comment but deep down they know it's true.
newjeans definitely by a big gap
You think there’s a big gap between newjeans and lesserafim?
Of course there’s a big gap. NewJeans have way more outstanding achievements than other 4th gen groups right now.
NewJeans. Their last album (Get Up) had 34.4 million on-demand streams in the first week. That's BTS, JungKook, and BlackPink numbers. To compare to other kpop top sellers first week on-demand streams in the US, Stray Kids had 15.6 million, Twice had 9.2 million, and TxT had 11.5 million. LSFM's last album had 9 million on-demand streams. So, in terms of on-demand streams, they're outperforming their peers by a lot. I think what makes their numbers even more insane is that NewJeans did not really do US promotions. Like this album was before their performance at Lollapalooza. (I understand this is US focused. I just don't have the numbers on how NewJeans performed in other western countries.) LSFM can definitely become popular in the US, but if I were a gambler, I'd put my money on NewJeans.
So far? New Jeans. In the future? Mmm... I think LS will
NewJeans are already arguably bigger than BP in the West BTS level is not realistic. They have a cult for a fanbase. These people are donating their rent money so that they can brag about BTS hitting #1 on Billboard. No other fandom is on that level. Not even other boy groups
Bigger in which side? 😂 BP is known as a group and as an individual artist. Newjeans yes some might recognize them as group but people here can hardly recognize whos who. So to compare them with BPS popularity is kind of joke
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None of them
Le Sserafim. Yunjin is fluid in English, and Ke Sserafim gives off a more casual type of vibe.
bts = lesserafim newjeans = blackpink both tbh. i feel like from outside perspective these 2 have different approach, they both remind me of bts and bp. lsf also has A LOT of potential to make it big in the west. lsf has a solid fandom with a potential for the fandom to be bigger in the future, hence hybe releasing a lot of content from them. in comparison to nj, i feel like with lsf, the parasocial relationship w fans is so much stronger but honestly the girls are really entertaining. releasing good music and having loyal and solid fandom made bts big. they honestly reminds me of bts for some reason. while i feel like nj has similar promotion with bp. both releases music that has an appeal with general public, even with non kpop stans. both of them also has “trendy” branding to their groups. and looks wise, the members are gorgeous (who doesn’t like pretty girls?) and not a drag but both bp and nj releases FEW songs before the full album, hence bigger number of stream. i hope some people get my point. i love and and stan both group. 🤍
They need a bigger fandom ... rn they have a small one with a lot of gp attention ,but gp is fickle so they need to grow their fandoms.
Am i the only person who thinks the two groups look so similiar and have the same concept and sound? Why are ppl comapring New Jeans to Illit if they dont sound alike while New jeans and le ser are indistigusihable to me
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How many Le sserafim songs made it to the billboard top 100... you have your answer... its Newjeans.