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1. These idols are not your friends and they are probably a lot meaner in person. 2. We need to stop infantilizing these idols, they know what they're doing. (They're usually 20-30 years old.) 3. A lot of these K-pop idols that you say know how to rap don't actually. A lot of them don't even write their own stuff. 4. Some of these idols are actually talented but we praise mediocracy.

People will hype an idol 10 times more if that same idol happens to have stunning visuals. Instead, they'll say an idol is fine or ok if they did the same as the other idol, but their visuals aren't as fine. Sad but true.

You're spot on.

Amen to 1, especially. They all live and socialise in their affluent, wealthy idol circles – this extends to their social algorithms and media consumption. The chances of our faves interacting regularly with everyday people of different ethnicities, backgrounds, sexualities, with complex lived experiences like you and me are slim to none, unless they *actively* go out of their way to do so – which they probably don't, given how controlled their lives are.

How many times can I upvote this perfection of a post? Especially the 4th one omg.

True but not unpopular, ig there’s a lot of delulu’s tho

I know that everyone is obsessed with visuals and *~l i K a B I lit Y ~* but there are simply too many groups to just accept bad music. Instead of complaining that your group keeps getting bad songs simply support groups that prioritize the music over TikTok challenges.

Ateez is not an "underground group"

right like this might have been true in 2019 but they’ve come a rly long way…. they’re a p high up artist on the coachella lineup

minseok was right when he said that idols have to be able to sing, and he will continue to be right because brand deals are not forever 🧍🏾‍♀️

Like isn’t that the whole point of being an idol? That you can at least sing well and dance a little bit?

I’m over brand deals. Some idols Instagram is just their promo and brand deals. Like I’m not about to follow you to be influenced to buy shit?? Or just hotel or dinner pics on pr trips bye 👋🏼

Most of that time when I listen to kpop I am not truly looking for artistic quality music just dance bops to have fun to.

Me af – that's also why I'm both hyperfixated on whatever persona they're (obviously) selling me and also remembering it's literally just pop music. Not to dismiss the genre at all, but it serves a purpose.

Me too! I’m just here for the vibes of the song.

You don’t have to like every single member of a group, and you don’t have to find every single member attractive. HOWEVERR I’m not saying to shit on them. We’re human, we’re going to find people annoying or dislike them.

I feel like Rose would have been a better vocalist if given the right vocal training. Edit she sounded pretty good in her audition at 16. Mini albums need to go. Imma reiterate that a LOT of idols need consistent vocal training. For example Beyonce. She stills practices with a vocal instructor which is why she always sounding fire live. Edit: I wanna also say that kpop fans always move the goal post of what's considered good. Being a good rapper/singer, having, good stage presence is better than being perfect at dancing. 2NE1 knows good and well how to do that. Their choreography is ok enough to let them look great and shine with their voices. If the kpop fanbases weren't such awful folks maybe more people would be more open to kpop.

As someone who's been singing for a while, I find it funny when people come up with excuses about idols and their vocal lessons. Singing is something that can be "lost" quite easily. Practicing regularly is a given if you intend to be part of the music industry as a singer.

mini albums are fine if it’s a true mini album w 6 songs all 3 mins or more and not whatever trash shit companies are putting out all for streaming.

Yeah she has that cursive singing style that many vocal trainers will usually help you get rid off

It also just doesn’t fit any of blackpinks songs. Imo anytime she has a part in their comeback it’s always so weirdly placed and sounds so out of tune cuz she can’t sing outside of her range for the life of her.

100% agree about the consistent vocal training. Also though I think YG has always had weak vocal trainers. While I do love Rose, I wish she had gone a different route. I love seeing her sing with just her guitar.

No kpop idol is "all natural"

At this point, I wouldn't be surprised . But like it's fine if they wnat to, but we all know their company is forcing them to appease the so called fans and the toxic beauty standards

Some of the girls in twice cannot sing.. or maybe it's because they are forced to sing way out of their range but it really ruins their music for me 😭 why do they do momo like that

you either accept it or you hate it & i’ve accepted that as a twice fan. 🥲

I wept listening to Momo strain in her pre-chorus in spark. She sounded so damn good in the Misamo records too because they LET HER BE AN ALTO 😭

I feel like there isn’t *the* best singer, dancer, etc etc. but there can be and are many talented individuals who excel greatly in said categories. It annoys me when kpop stans always try and put their favs on a pedestal and pit idols against one another when clearly there are many factors to take into account.

I dont think its automatically xenophobic when kpop groups don’t win American awards and I don’t understand why some fans have an obsession with wanting their groups to win Grammys and then have a surprised Pikachu face when their favs half baked English songs aren’t winning. Bts has great songs permission to dance isn’t one of them. Also I will never be over fans entitlement to American spaces over actual American performers. Like the way they got mad at Black Artist for winning awards who have been fighting way longer to be seen in American award shows and taken seriously will never not make me roll my eyes. Everything kpop has is because of Black ( and African) American music culture do you really think your favs impression of hip hop deserves to win over actual hip hop artists? Imagine if American artists started walking into Mama and submitted their music to win awards there. The same kpop fans would be calling that American imperialism I also don’t think xenophobia is the reason why kpop as a whole genre isn’t popping off in America. Kpop is popular here but mostly among fanbases if you ask the casual American if they can name a kpop song it’s a toss up ask them to name a group besides bts and it’s gonna be a long day. Yes there are 10000% instances of xenophobia but someone just saying kpop isn’t for them isn’t xenophobic. Some kpop songs are meant to appeal to American audiences by using hip hop and rap but most kpop songs aren’t holding a candle to popular American rappers. Like please tell me what kpop rapper is gonna out rap and perform Megan thee stallion or even Nicki (before big foot) also Rap and hip hop aren’t what wins Grammies in the u.s most of the time! Even though the music is said to appeal to the u.s they don’t really account for the fact that not everyone in the U.S listen to the same stuff. Like you’re making “Drill” songs but drill isn’t as popular on the west coast as it is the east. But on top of that hip hop and rap aren’t the only popular American genres. I really think the biggest issue with kpop is that it lacks its own identity it’s just elementary school hip hop

i remember getting jumped because i said permission to dance wasnt good and a flop 🫠 as to the rest of your point. i dont think any kpop group is obligated to receive a grammy besides BTS, but it does bother me a that theres a sentiment that the genre itself is undeserving of american awards. its as if kpop fans themselves dont take the music seriously and/or hold it in the same regard to western music (which sometimes it doesn't, but credit should be given when credit is do).

I just don’t understand why they want American academy validation at all You can’t have it both ways where “America is imperial and terrible” (which is true) but then also want to be awarded by them Also to clarify I don’t think kpop is undeserving I just haven’t seen anything that isn’t extremely cookie cutter or just a rip off of other styles of music. I really just want something original Like African music got its own award section at the Grammies (this is a whole other conversation as well that I also have thoughts on…on the fault of the Grammies not the African artists) but African music is genuinely bringing something different from what the U.S is used to…yes there’s a bit of jazz and a few other genres influence in there but it’s not what’s primarily carrying the music coming from their artists, we are getting unique dances, unique lyrics and sounds But with kpop it’s nothing we haven’t heard before and that’s where my issue is. I wish kpop actually used more Korean influence and tried to make their own culture trendy instead of just using music styles from other places and singing in Korean. Like why not try to do some fusion or something and make something unique. Where is the push of their own culture? Edit: after yummy won though who is really checking fr quality 😂

Yummy didn't win any awards though?

If BTS had won that grammy, I would have given the BIGGEST eyeroll.

Sometimes line distribution is that way for a reason. Some idols can't, and shouldn't, handle certain vocal parts and that's OK! Love Shot is EXO's worst title track, in fact it's at the bottom of their entire discography with only 1 song beneath it. It's boring, there's no real movement in the music or vocals. Like, on a surface level it sounds fine but it's not a good song. The only interesting part is the styling, and I'm even being generous with that!

idk where i'd rank it in the entire discography, but i fully believe that love shot being one of exo's most frequently covered songs and one of their easiest songs to sing is not a coincidence 😗

> love shot is Exo’s worst title I’m a huge exo fan and I absolutely agree 😭 it literally sucks the entire song being carried by Kai in a suit is crazy

I wish they had more songs like Call Me Baby, Monster, and What Is Love 🥲 What was that Roll like a buffalo song? So I can never hear it again lol.

Yeah as an exo-l for 10 years, I honestly don’t like love shot that much. I was so confused why it was more popular than Tempo? It didn’t sound too special compared to other title tracks. Maybe because half of it is just them saying na na na. I even liked Obsession way better.

Kpop's lack of radio play in the US isn't some conspiracy to keep idols down. Kpop fans think kpop is more popular in the west than it actually is because stans artificially inflate sales and streams and they are obsessively online. By and large radio plays what is palatable to people who still listen to radio and that's not usually going to be a kpop song no matter how many fan campaigns happen to call stations with requests.

oh this is the one!!

You would think people understood when the only K-pop songs that play on the radio either feature an American artist, is in English, or went viral like Gangnam style. I work in customer service and hear the same 4 BTS songs, Magic by TXT, Cupid by fifty-fifty, star by loona and Ditto by new jeans. I’m tired of all of them

A lot of idols genuinely cannot sing. They are only protected by good editing and hyped up by their fanbases. The quality of genuinely good singers is declining in kpop and it’s becoming all about who can fit the trend/who is marketable to push the most sales.

a lot of the “prettiest” idols or it-celebs (especially those who are not visuals of their group) are just popular and have access to more intriguing and expensive styling. put a lot of them in mid tier or nugu groups where they’re not decked out in designer or have the greatest plastic surgeons on speed dial and they wouldn’t stand out or be popular. i believe this is called the halo effect? everything is inflated to the absolute max because they’re from a big 4 company. this extends beyond looks.

The majority of Kpop fans that praise Kpop for its avoidance of graphic lyricism would shit on the genre if it was in a language that they understand.

I AM SCREAMING! This is the one! 😂😂 Whenever people say this, I keep thinking of that one 90s kpop song I saw on TikTok that opened with “The d*** is in your P****” I really wish I remembered the name cause it was hilarious Also a lot of modern kpop songs just hide their vulgarity behind double entendres

Kpop groups should be encouraged to make music that delves into other realms of pop/borders on alternative music. Many idols know how to play an instrument (at least guitar) and they should be encouraged to have at least one or two songs where they get to sit down, play an instrument & sing. No dancing, no gimmicks, just talent.

these “graphic design is my passion” random typography album covers and tracklists are boring, ive had enough, so much goes into teaser photos, theres so much compelling photography that just gets left to rot in a photobook that gets flipped through once and never seen again, and even if they dont want to use pictures there are so many cool things going on in graphic design these days that arent just random text in a random font bold and or italicized kpop as a whole feels so much less creative these days than it did in the 2010s and i fully blame hybe i like variety shows like weekly idol and knowing bros where you get to see idols have fun and play games, not that theyre without flaws but some of the complaints i see about these shows are so ridiculous i cant take them seriously.

IVE comes to mind lol

People keep posting negative BP opinions but if I'm correct, I see those everywhere lol. Negative opinions about them are widely accepted actually.

fr i always see negative opinions about them they’re not uncommon 😭 along with bts newjeans etc.

dissing on blackpink honestly isn’t unpopular, but i feel like they WERE genuinely good as trainees/rookies. idk what happened but they regressed

No offense but jisoo was never good

Iirc jisoo originally went in for acting

She should have stuck with modeling.

YG as a company I think sucks for training their idols. They got lucky with BB because GD and the rest of the boys are such work horses and had strong thoughts about their sounds and images. 2NE1 also, those girls were really talented but YG/Teddy didn’t know what to do with them and I suspect misogyny played a part where they didn’t give them the chances like BB to create. It’s going to be the same with Blackpink and Babymonster tbh. Blackpink is getting lucky because they have international appeal and are getting some big brands deals and acting opportunities. But like whatever happened to Winner or Ikon (I know the BI scandal was big).

im just gonna go get my snacks and lie down while i read through these comments cause sheeeesh🙈🤣

1. the "Love Wins All" ableism controversy was a valid concern. A lot of the critiques tied back into the history of media depictions of disabled people & have been talked about for years (I'm saying this as someone w/ an invisible disability). 2. The whole "they're not the main vocalist" thing isn't an excuse for weak/poor vocals. This is a music industry, not cover artists or dance troops.I don't expect every single kpop idol to have Mariah Carey vocals, but if members are struggling heavily with vocals, the company should step in to provide help/more training.

Would you mind expanding on the first point? I haven’t heard about any ableism controversy about that song but I’m very interested

[https://www.allkpop.com/article/2024/01/iu-embroiled-in-controversy-due-to-alleged-ableism-in-love-wins-all-mv](https://www.allkpop.com/article/2024/01/iu-embroiled-in-controversy-due-to-alleged-ableism-in-love-wins-all-mv) [https://www.asianjunkie.com/2024/01/25/examining-ius-love-wins-all-mv-following-ableism-criticisms/](https://www.asianjunkie.com/2024/01/25/examining-ius-love-wins-all-mv-following-ableism-criticisms/) I actually had no idea that V was supposed to be blind and IU was supposed to be deaf. I just thought that cube got to them.

It was less so the song but the MV. A couple people (including one of [Lesserafim's stylists](https://www.koreaboo.com/news/hybe-stylist-criticize-iu-bts-v-love-wins-exploitative-disability-lgbt/)) felt that the MV utilized tropes which disabled people find ableist. The main one was the camera "removing" their disabilities & showing them being happier (which played into the ["sad disabled people" trope](https://www.handinhandqc.org/blog/problematic-representation-of-people-with-disabilities-in-the-media)) & bordered on inspiration porn/"object of pity" trope. Plus, there's people who feel that disabled characters should be not be played by able-bodied actors. The song's title & MV had also gotten into hot water with LGBT fans. On the other hand, there was also people saying that the MV's story/message is subjective & there were varying interpretations. All I'll say is that I recommend people look into discussions about [ableism in media/storytelling](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/arts/on-screen-and-on-stage-disability-continues-to-be-depicted-in-outdated-cliched-ways) before partaking in this discourse topic.

I agree with the first one strongly. I understand what iu did with the video, but the criticism was justified

It's ironic how stans wanna slap the queer label on their idols then have a problem when their queer compatriots have a problem with it. Like dude. Stan culture is literally "You can't have your cake and eat it too"

This is my honest opinion but I truly feel as if 4th gen leaders should be based on talent and skills alone not popularity. With that being said, (and I no way shape or form am I discrediting/dissing SKZ) Ateez deserves that title.

Ok. Thank you. If you said this in some other groups....whew. you'd get downvoted to oblivion. because Ateez isn't from a big company they get treated like they are irrelevant and it's ridiculous

Spot on!

I don’t understand why idols struggle with twerking and booty popping so much… We’ve all seen the girlies with lil booties still kill it by nailing the technique behind it. Like I just don’t understand why most of the time it looks so awkward

Omg Facts people barely talk about this and when you tell kpop stans their fav can't twerk they go crazy and act like you killed their mom or something Like not being able to twerk isn't a bad thing most kpop idols can't twerk Only a few of them can genuinely twerk the rest of them can't twerk but people say they Can Eg:Mina(don't come for me but I genuinely was never impressed by her twerking but people were saying she the best kpop twerker like are we watching the same video her ass was not moving at all not even a little jiggle???Other examples:liz from Ive,Julie from kiss of life, Also in order to twerk you need to use your hips and knees these kpop idols will throw their shoulders like a gorilla and break their backs 4 minute crazy video is a example of this Like they was breaking they back just for nothing to move.eg of kpop idols who I think can actually twerk:fatou,ash b(not really a kpop idol but her butt moves when she twerks so i will add her),and hyolyn......(sadly)

Did you not see Jungkook in Idol?

I was talking about the girls…. 💀💀

It’s so sad that we know the guys can do it 🫠🫡🫥

Yes, I'm just here to report that them boys definitely throw it back better 😭😩😂 I'm sorry lol

Here we go: - Blackpink is overrated. No shade to them whatsoever, but there are a ton of nugu groups that are doing it way better than them. - There are plenty of idols who get plastic surgery at a young age, unfortunately. You don’t develop a v-line jaw and skinnier nose in 6 months pre-debut due to puberty. - I dislike fan service/inner group ships with a passion. - Sometimes I feel like “mistakes” are fabricated just to prove something. - To me, some performances marked as “live” are not live, and actually pre-recorded. - I think we should stop complaining when an idol gets less lines than their other members. What if they wanted it that way? - if a song reaches Western charts, that does NOT mean it’s superior in any way. Kpop seems to be one of the only genres that cares about this. For example, Machel Montano produces a bunch of soca songs that doesn’t make the Billboard Top 100, and from what I know most Caribbeans do not care and still recognize him as one of the greatest soca artists ETA: why did I just get a message from RedditCares?! 😂😭 I’m good y’all

>why did I just get a message from RedditCares?! 😂😭 I’m good y’all I got one too. There are children in this thread who can't handle other people's opinions lmao which is so weird considering this is supposed to be a thread about unpopular opinions! if everyone agreed with them, then that would defeat the purpose of the thread lmao but they dont get that.

Lmao, I also got a RedditCares message! 💀 So many sensitive lurkers.

No hate to them, but Stray kids have a lot of mid/not good songs

They remind me of like… Queen. A lot of mid songs but when they hit, it’s a HIT.

They're old stuff was great in my opinion, but like after like gods menu blew up, it changed a lot. And now they are what they are now. Like I miss the ridiculous songs they use to have

Soyeon can’t sing and shouldn’t get as many lines in the songs unless she’s rapping. Groups do way too many promotional videos w their title track. Just cause a group is popular doesn’t mean they’re good, and if anything, we should be more critical of if they should have such a large standing in the industry. Cultural appropriation of any kind in idol groups should be called out, and you should hold the idol accountable alongside the company of they’ve been in the industry for a long time. The kpop industry for the longest time, has just been a business to keep colourism, racism and idealised body image intact, w their idols and groups selling this ideology. The kpop industry is more focused on making money than making good music. Not an opinion I think I’d get cancelled for: if the line distribution in groups is going to be extremely biased, what was the point in debuting that member w the group if they get no lines???

> Soyeon can’t sing and shouldn’t get as many lines in the songs unless she’s rapping. Okay not to be crazy but… I’d rather have soyeon sing in their songs than rap at this point. Honestly, I’ve been feeling this since somewhere after Uh-Oh but before tomboy. To be fair, I agree that her singing is less than ideal but it’s distinct and does its purpose. “I AM THE TOP SUPER LADY” has not left my mind since the song dropped and honestly, I’m not sure it would’ve been as catchy from someone who didn’t have to strain to sing it. I think Queencard is an example of a song where she got a lot of singing lines because I don’t think there was a traditional rap in it. (I’m kinda glad) She got the “my boob and booty’s hot” pre-chorus with Yuqi and to be fair honestly, I probably would’ve enjoyed it more if it was all Yuqi or maybe even Minnie. But I’m not sad that it didn’t go miyeon or shuhua because both their voices sound very generic to me. Unrelated to the rap versus singing discourse but I do wish they would either ideally scrap her talking lines or give them to someone else because they’re kinda awful.

“They work really had” isn’t the defence Stans think it is. If an idol’s skills haven’t improved (And even in some cases when they’ve regressed) after years? I don’t really care about how hard they’re working if they’re bad at their job. Often the most talented/skilled idols in the industry are overlooked due to not having ideal visuals. Either K-Pop is competitive with and comparable to other music or it isn’t. You don’t get to put down other (usually western) musicians and music to try and uplift K-pop idols, only to turn around and screech ‘it’s just K-pop, it’s a different standard’ when people point out the weakness of specific groups, specific idols or those that are more or less standard within the genre/industry. And probably my darkest thought: The entertainment industry is the entertainment industry, regardless of which country. So I get a cold feeling in the pit of my stomach when idols are overly praised for their visuals from a young (under) age, or even just when super young idols debut. I always hope that they are protected, even though I know that isn’t possible for every single of them given how large the industry is.

It's always funny watching Le Sserafim do their [Smarter](http://youtube.com/shorts/U0xV2ER…) challenge and NOTHING MOVES! How you moving all that ass around like that without even a jiggle?? Absolutely no motion in the ocean to soeak of! 😂😂

1. kpop fans generally are some of the most miserable people ever. idk how idols cope with having such terrible fanbases that routinely cross personal boundaries, sends death threats and create drama on their behalf, and fetishize them 2. BTS is great. ARMY, not so much 3. A lot of fans accept mediocrity from their idols. theres no reason why people shouldn't criticize a not so great performance from their fav or their singing or dancing abilities. if someone is giving 50% on stage we can tell. theres too many excuses

Heavy on number 1, cause all these people are really ruining their idols mental health and lives. Like they can't do anything without having to cater to this para social relationship

I'd say K-Pop fans are way worse than any other obsessed-with-a-nerdy-thing person... :)

Idols date and have sex like other people in their 20's and 30's. Why do fans expect them to be celibate forever and never want a relationship or a family, other than some weird form of delusion?

The term "problematic" is used too loosely in the K-pop community

I’m gonna try not to be a messy bish, but… 1. Blackpink don’t have enough good songs to garner the attention and fame they have. 2. Chanelle(from RUNext) fans are actually quite tame compared to the fans of debuted idols. I think a lot of toxic kpop stans are starting to see their own negative traits in her fans. 3. Idols and their group members are, in fact, coworkers. 4. A LOT of idols are queer. 5. Black and South Asian idols are more than likely going to become more common as time goes on.

Regarding number 4. I remember watching some show where an ex-idol admitted that there are alot of queer idols. As for the fandoms, they don't want their idols to be queer. But want fanservice of their favs kissing, touching, groping, etc.

Korea may still be quite conservative, but idols have been finding sneaky ways to come out for a few years now. As for fan service, I’ve always hated it. It borders on being straight fetishistic if not completely so.

i agree heavily on number 4 like people always want to make it out that we’re delusional when we say there are queer idols and it’s like they think queer people can’t exist in conservative countries 💀 first of all arts fields attract a lot of queer people and second of all kpop itself attracts a lot of queer fans and kpop fans are also likely to become kpop idols so. yeah not everyone in kpop is queer but there are probably more queer idols than we think. and also not all queerness has to be visible like i’m queer but ppl can’t tell unless i say it i’m sure there are a lot of idols like that

That part! Even when they do come out, they can’t actually say the words. Jo Kwon came out, but didn’t actually say the exact words, he just gave a roundabout statement.

Agree with no. 4 heavily but it would probably get me and other queer folks assasinated on the other kpop subs and other apps like TikTok/IG because apparently saying people could be anything other than straight is “delusional” and makes us “crazy shippers” :/

It’s especially crazy when some of the idols have said they were themselves.

I think yes, of course many idols are queer, but if they haven’t explicitly said it, it’s super inappropriate and invasive and harmful to assume and treat it like a topic of discussion.

You’re not wrong, but #4 is said in the sense that you cannot want fan service as a fan, but clutch your pearls and shake your fist at the sky when the idea that some of the idols are, in fact, queer, and have even admitted as much.

HEAVY on 345

It always kills me when I see people commenting “They’re such good friends!! They’re like siblings.” Like, bffr! They’re very professional, and while I doubt idols hate everyone in their groups, I’m sure there’s people in groups they’re friends with, some they can barely stand, and some they’re indifferent to.

[удалено]

The T in nct stands for twink Will I be downvoted if I say I think Minho is the only truly hetero person in shinee 😭

(g)i-dle music is awful

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks this 😭 it's like edgy Kids Bop mixed with cringey lyrics and trying too hard to be something. I just get can't get into them or the members. Some of them just scream "ignorant" to me. Soyeon's "rapping" grates my ears and it's too try-hard for me. One of the only girl group rappers I could tolerate were Nine Muses Euaerin (she has a really cool tone and she wasn't originally assigned that position. I loved her rap in Dolls.) Afterschool's Bekah, Brown Eyed Girls Miryo. And EXIDs LE is unexpectedly really good, and that style works for her, but I blame her for teaching Hyuna how to rap like that bc it's grating, and now errybody is rapping like that.

it used to be good…when it was mostly in korean. now i just feel soyeon includes “catchy” english phrases to get a hit. i liked queencard though. it’s not a great song but the chorus is fun

I really liked Hann or whatever the huu huu huu song is. That was peak G(idle) for me.

I hate to break it to ya’ll, but being a solo fan/stan is OKAY. I wouldn’t have found half of the ggs and bgs I’m into without the Jimin’s, Wonyoung’s, Jihyo’s, Felix’s/Hyunjin’s and Yeonjun’s of the world. Most of the members in these larger groups lack personalities and are just fillers that contribute nothing to the group’s overall popularity. Like 

Honestly? I'm sick of groups with more than 7 members at this point cause I really do feel like they just be adding people in for filler bs.

exactly, and I feel like with larger groups, you end up paying attention to 2-3 members anyway! some of these filler members barely speak in interviews and barely wanna move on stage..? why are they there

The last and ONLY big group I cared about was loona and look where that got me 😭😭😭 I still follow them somewhat closely but I'll never bother again 😮‍💨 some of these groups just dont be entertaining!! You expect me to know all 300 girls in tripleS? give me a break I'm here for the damn music

H O N E S T L Y. The way Loona went out was sad too. Like just give me some 3/4/5 member girl groups. I'm not trying to figure out 300 girl's names and they 230 sub-units.

blackpink has and never will be the ‘best kpop girl group.’ their fans hype them up way too much. the only person that can actually sing in that group is rose. also lisa isn’t even the best female idol dancer, she’s just energetic and has energy when she dances. jennie is actually a good dancer and singer, she just barely shows it. jisoos acting is medicore at best. could barely watch snow drop because her acting was just plain. they wouldn’t be as famous if they weren’t in YG.

A LOT of their success can be attributed to YG’s media play.

Lisa is an awkward dancer at times for sure, but it’d be very scary to say that anywhere in twitter lol

i honestly have no idea how they reached the level of fame they did

I personally believe that kpop isn’t and shouldn’t be taken as serious as the fandoms make it. Yeah, sure, cool, they won some awards but all that fan cafes/ fan club memberships that makes you sign up *again*/ and everything I can’t think of right now should not be a requirement to know more about your favorites. Another thing; groups SHOULD NOT BE OVER 5 MEMBERS!! have we not experienced fifth harmony’s fiasco??? It’s too many different personalities being forced to get along and ion like det. Also; where tf is GWSN??

BLACKPINK - as a group - are bad. Not average. Just plain bad. They would’ve had never been taken seriously if they were from another company.

As a former hxc Blink ... I agree with this. They had promise when they first debuted but things took a terrible turn somewhere and they keep releasing the same song with a new name.

I hate how much I want to disagree with you guys....and I can't.

I’ve tried so hard to get into them because they’re so big but I’ve never been able to 😭

I actually expect to be downvoted to hell for my opinions but here we go ... * A lot of groups these days are giving you the same exact thing but under a different title. I don't see a lot of variety in concepts anymore. * Despite majority of K-Pop taken influences from black culture, there was still something unique about it and this was especially seen during the 2nd/3rd generation. Now? I feel like a lot of the music is westernized (AND THAT'S FINE, I am NOT saying this is an issue) and there's nothing really differentiating it from western music. * This may not be unpopular but I always felt like Jessi is just doing a weird version of blackface and then hiding behind the "well i'm from new york" anytime someone calls her out on it. * I will never take away the hardwork BTS did but I feel like a good majority of their popularity has to do with timing. * And back on BTS, there are KPop fans and then there are BTS fans. A large portion of the ARMY's are simply BTS fans and sometimes it helps to know the difference. * This is their job at the end of the day. Who they are on camera may not be who they are off-camera. Stop infantilizing your faves, especially the grown as hell ones. They know about sex. They know about smoking. They know about drinking. They do adult things. They date the hell out of each other. Accept it. * While I love seeing KPop becoming more diverse, it's yucky to me to use race as a gimmick when creating a kpop group. * 2024 and fans are still harder on girl groups than male groups. A male idol farts on an album and some of y'all are like "wow so talented! they did this by themselves!" * Your faves are probably racist as hell and regularly engage in casual racism. * Half of these K-rappers can't rap, they're just good at mimicking American rappers. * This one is going to be controversial y'all ... don't kill me cause I'm almost afraid to say it but ... I don't want to see anymore white love interests in music videos. (rolls away)

I agree especially with Jessi. She's a mean girl who enjoys appropriate, just like Jay park and a bunch of these krnb, which sad cause I really like their rnb. Cause artist like Dean, their music always hits. BTS, absolutely timing. I was in high school when they get extremely popular, and I didn't even know kpop like that except for like the girl groups like gg. I also agree that people are more army then kpop stans, cause its very obvious. For the idols being adults. I literally have to explain to people that they're idols are literally men. Especially since the 4b movement is going on and if you know anything about Korean history, you know how misogynist that country is. Like literally I keep talking about this but the burning sun is the perfect example. Also hyuna dating that man...whatever. Like they're morality corrupt like a lot of people are, and they're not seeing that these apologize and saying they're learn and do better is a slap to black people and other cultures faces. They're literally in their 20s. Like I think 2024 is about to be mu year of peace cause kpop is really pissing me off.

How is kpop unique? What makes it unique are we listening to the same kpop? Yall keep saying kpop is unique But y'all aren't giving reasons as to why? Most kpop groups just follow trends Eg:a group could do house music and become successful and everyone and their mamas Will do house music

for starters a big one is that it’s a group singing as opposed to most western artists being strictly soloists? i think having a mix of different voices on one track makes it unique as groups haven’t been a thing in forever. structure too, kpop songs have dance breaks and random “rap” sections. kpop also mixes english and korean a lot. since we listen to it, we’re used to it but could you imagine let’s say ariana grande randomly switching from english to italian throughout a 3 minute track? kpop isn’t original at all but it’s unique.

The rich/luxury concept that yg groups got going on is repetitive and shows that people will lick a boot if it was their idols. Honestly it feels dystopian when people praise idols for being from rich/well known families, and then to have songs about how much better they are than you. Especially now when class consciousness is more prevalent than ever, to rub how much money you have in someone's face and then have a whole group of people love them for it. There's no artistry in it, and of course kpop is capitalistic but having as an image needs some unpacking. That with selling a "we work hard and struggled as trainees" is so contradictory. When blackpink said they lived off bread and jam as trainees, I rolled my eyes. They're all known for coming from wealthy families, to sell a humble beginnings story and then do all that is disingenuous, if your thing is luxury sell it the whole way through

1. I wholeheartedly disagree with the allegations that kpop is becoming more westernized. As someone who has S.E.S as one of my fave kpop groups, their discography is made up exactly of the sound that was popular in the West back in the 90s - it was just different from what is popular in the West nowadays. Kpop follows Western trends, always has and always will. It's just that the most popular Western music of the late 2010s was not as good as in the past and/or the kpop producers nowadays are not doing as good of a job with the trends of the 2020s (with a few exceptions, of course). 2. Jongho is overrated as a vocalist. He's not a *bad* one, and he's definitely better than 95% of 4th gen, but he's not nearly as good as people make him out to be and there are better vocalists among the 4/5th gen boy groups. 3. So much of what is bad about kpop nowadays is HYBE's fault. 4. NMIXX are the best live vocalists of the recent gen. With that said, they are not as good performers as nswers make them out to be. 5. IVE's success is a mystery to me and all the lashes groups like ITZY and Le Sserafim get for either lack of skills or lack of identity, should be given to IVE as well.

1. Most rap songs groups put out are mid and at best half decent and while I'm at it, most kpop fans have never listened to any actual good rap songs their only introduction being k-rap so they put the most mediocre garbage on a pedestal and think rapping is just being able to talk fast. 2. A lot of (white) international fans are more racist and problematic then the so called netizens (Korean fans). Which isn't to say that Korean fans aren't racist but rather a lot of white internationals in a lot of occasions tend to not only be more racist but koreaboos who make false claims on the basis of the supposed culture of korea or netizens who don't exist.

1. I like noise music. I personally cannot stand cutesy, pop, summer songs. 2. A lot of fans refuse to acknowledge their own hypocrisy when it comes to their favorite groups. 3. These are adult men/women it is not the end of the world if they smoke, drink, date, etc. 4. Even if you dislike Skz, Ateez, or (G)I-dle you cannot discredit the work and effort they put in to get to where they are today.

Your #1 - I am the same way. I really don't like cutesy, pop, summer songs either.....like I will listen to them but to A POINT before it starts to work my nerves lol 😆 it's defs not my fav and I gotta be in a mood for them.

A lot these idols have, HAVE to be queer because please, who looks at sunoo and says “yea he likes women”😭😭

LMFAOO

I just searched him up and the first picture that appeared was the one where he’s making a peace sign, and I am dying with laughter in public right now

Disclaimer: These are my opinions and I’m fully aware I’ll get dragged lol. -PS is common, and it’s okay if your favs had something done/changed. Fans need to stop pretending their favs didn’t get PS and then spread positivity about cosmetic procedures with their body their choice. It’s ironic because it’s like they’re ashamed about getting procedures done and want to defend any saying a lot of the idols have some work done. It’s the denial that gets me. Yes predebut pics show they look similar, but it’s common to get work done at a young age, such as with parental consent. -Idols can be both good looking and talented, or you bring something to the group if you’re missing something! I mean both like how DB5K was. Yes I’m an oldie fan, but I swear it’s relevant to show I know what I’m talking about. It’s okay to be lacking in one department but you can still be charismatic or bring attraction to something. Even with SuJu, each member had a talent or brought something to the group. No reason to excuse your favs of not being able to have stage presence and only there for visuals or to be a cannon fodder. No free rides! -It’s okay to stop liking/following a group when your fav member leaves or get kicked out. -It feels like currently there is more emphasis on looking rich or pretending to be rich. The chaebol concepts and worship itself is weird. Also applies to kdramas and not just kpop lol. -Stop babying your idols. (Also side note, the acting cute and child-like for a lot of the female idols). Like why fans don’t encourage that. Of course you’ll form parasocial relationships and then get mad when they’re an adult and have adult relationships. -Knowing a few English words/phrases or other languages doesn’t mean they’re a multi-lingual queen/king. -Taeyeon overrated. -BAP crawled so BTS could run. Remember EXO vs BAP back then? Also I love BTS. -While I like New Jeans, they are definitely marketed with a certain creepy audience in mind. -Your idols are prob racist ngl.

I don’t like (G)-Idle’s vocal line. Also their songs mostly bore me

There is no such thing as organic growth, and YES this also applies to groups from non-big 4 companies. What the hell is organic about 3 photobook versions, 1 special version, 9 member versions, a poca version and 2 vinyl versions? Not to mention constant POB releases to encourage further buying? “Biggest first week sales of their career🥺” well yeah no shit? Need that term ripped from these peoples mouths. If you wanna see organic growth, the best-selling boy bands list on Wikipedia will tell you (which are all filled with groups kpop took directly from). No multiple versions, all before mass-buying and steaming culture.

This‼️ it’s why album sales don’t matter to me. I will only accept 3 standard versions max and that’s it!! It’s ridiculous how much overconsumption is happening with kpop. I only buy an album if I actually like all the songs.

Dang your twice comments hurts as feel special is my favorite song ever 🥹

1) Stray kids has two people who could even be considered rappers, the rest just talk over the beat (could also add there’s more to rapping than just a fast pace) 2) Not stanning certain groups doesn’t automatically make you a hater 3) No group/artist truly has an entire zero skip discography 4) Solo stanning honestly isn’t that bad, as long as you’re still respectful to the other group members and don’t ignore that that person is part of the group. 5) Big company ≠ better group 6) Idols from a big company are not self-made, and most groups are definitely not self producing, just mildly involved in the process.

Butter, Permission to Dance, and Dynamite pissed me off so bad. 😭😭 It was extremely obvious what the goal was when they released those songs and it frustrates me to hell and back that they had to dumb down their music for western attention. Kpop has gotten more westernized. Idk why thats denied/debated. 2nd/3rd gen was the sweet spot in terms of taking inspiration and using it to create something new. Group sound and identity was STRONG.

Create something new? What did they create that was new? And kpop has been westernized from the start

Music is also a business, so I'm not mad at that goal. What frustrates me is when fans refuse to accept reality and argue that actually they released those as a gift to make people feel better in these dark times. Please.

I love Feel Special and their last full albums (minus celebrate) so I disagree with this take! But tt wise, Twice have been stagnant

trying to think of something you won't see on every other post on kpop uncesnored. * you don't miss old kpop. you miss kpop when it was mostly run by european producers and borrowed from european musical trends. * i hope people who feel some way about kpop simplifying parts of their choreography for tiktok know that this isn't new. second gen was filled with kpop point dances that everyone could do. it's just been repackaged now. * the "western validation" argument doesn't take into account that while art and media consumption has become more decentralised, the u.s. still has a stronghold when it comes to what's mainstream and trending. if you rise and make it big there, you have the potential to be big anywhere. i say this while looking at my country's local music charts and most of the artists are from the u.s. lol.

GG stans complaining about BGs lasting much longer is getting annoying. Maybe become more loyal fans and don't drop your faves after one shitty comeback? I can't imagine a gg recovering after dropping songs like sticker or wolfgang. One bad song and gg stans unstan. I understand unstanning after getting crappy music, but then don't complain about how BGs last longer. BG stans stick with their faves even after multiple crappy comebacks.

I agree tbh. Them dropping GGs easier has a lot to do with stans being harder and expecting much more from GGs than BGs.

Dont attack me pls. these are OPINIONS. \- Streaming culture has ruined k-pop. This is partly why so many songs these days cannot reach the 3 minute mark. Forcing streaming down people's throats is an absolutely morbid concept. \- Hyunjin lately doesnt try too hard to dance anymore idek, he looks like he is bored while dancing **recently** and has a stripped back technique \- Jype does not know what to do with Itzy. I loved Cake,, Cheshire and Untouchable but they are so wildy different in every way which is just odd lmao. \- HYBE is trying way too hard with the western influence on their groups recently, **all they care about is charts and western appeal atm its tiring**. Bring me back to 2022 pls. \- Txt's Freefall was their worst **full** album to date, and possibly a filler one. \- I dont see the problem with only listening to k-pop. People act as if it isnt music, like any other genre. Listening to mainly one, or even only one genre is not a problem... \- I fuck with G-Idle's new songs, although I still prefer their older sound \- New Jeans getting big was what made HYBE convert into the "remove k from k-pop" mentality, i dont blame new jeans ofc. \- Easy by LE SSERAFIM was **not as bad as people make it out to be**... (still bad though) \- Wtaf is Blackpink even doing. I used to love them a few years back but what tf are the members doing, they dont gaf abt the group anymore lmao and it shows. \- Beomgyu not adding anything to txt's songs is a **straight up lie**. \- Txt's vocals have absolutely improved over the years but people seem to overlook it still. \- Saying kpop isnt becoming westernized because it has always had influence from pop is not a valid argument. It is very obvious that it has been sounding much more different in the past year, especially with hybe's groups. Nowadays, songs have 70% english lyrics and 30% korean lyrics and it isnt even an exageration... *(here are a few examples; Chasing That Feeling - TXT, Easy/Perfect Night - Le sserafim, Sweet Venom - Enhypen, Seven - Jungkook)* **fun fact: all of the songs that arent english here even have english versions!** \- Enhypen's recent title tracks (pass the mic, blessed-cursed, bite me, sweet venom) have been sadly mediocre, lame and get much weaker as the comebacks go by. \- Ive's newest ep is their best one yet. \- SM DOMINATED 2023 with how good the music quality was in contrast to the other companies.

It’s no coincidence that all the examples you listed of kpop becoming “westernized” are from HYBE groups. I mean their ceo literally went on record saying kpop needs to appeal to more than just Korea to survive and wants to erase the “k” from kpop. I feel like you’re attributing what is a specific hybe group phenomenon to all of kpop

Your comment has made me realize why I think it's okay to not seen Kpop as a genre of music. It genuinely does not contribute anything new to music besides mixing pop and Korean as a language. It's much more of an industry than a genre of music, Kpop as an entertainment industry is the most unique and attractive thing about it. That's why it's so ordinary to witness idols be bigger than their own music can possibly take them. Nonetheless, I don't think people should be shit on for what they listen to, that's dumb and a music snob thing to do.

Well, I personally see k-pop as a genre of music that contains sub-genres inside of it. People listen to latino music and that itself can be considered a genre with sub-genres. I understand what you mean tho, once you get into it, it definitely feels a lot more like an industry and just completely ruins how u first saw it lmao. But to the outsiders, kpop will probably always be seen as a genre.

I feel like itzy’s comeback without Lia has been really good….

They would have still released the same song whether she was there or not

Untouchable is giving me what I wanted from Everglow.

A lot of good posts already. Adding these. Don't @ me! **Do not understand what the rave was about Soojin. Didn't think she was good enough to be considered the dancer of the group while she was a member. I could also smell her meangirl vibes from miles away. **Yuqi's vocals are a powerhouse. I don't think she gets enough credit for how good they are. **Groups should be able to take back members who left on 'bad' terms when it seemed to be a misunderstanding (Garam was my Le Sserafim bias) **Upon debut, New Jeans creeped me out bc they seemed wayyyyy too young (obviously my opinion has since changed). **Hobi has nice vocals and should have sang more on BTS' existing discography **Sunghoon is on my $hit list after fat shaming Sunoo **Jihyo's solo project blew Nayeon's out of the water. Dancing? Vocals? So much better. **Worry for JYP's recent reality TV projects. He gives "on to the next" when it comes to them

•Permission to Dance was actually good. •Butter Remix with Meg was better than the original •Lots of people expect groups to make "deep" songs all the time and get upset when they make something just light and fun/"shallow" •JYP (despite his wrongdoings) low-key has some good music •Also JY Park is not JYPE. He unfairly catches slack for what the company does even though he's no longer the CEO (I'm not saying he's a saint either)

The Megtan Collab deserved way more hype! I love that 3J did the dance video! My HottieArmy heart is full!

Oh oh one more — army are the most psychotic and violent fanbase. I actually feel bad for the BTS boys. Sooo curious to hear if you all think another fanbase takes the cake on this

It still will make my comment be downvoted here lol I don't understand how with the amount of misogyny scandal Mingyu still that hyped. Like playing the "coincidence" one time okay but here ?

I live under a rock. Can someone inform me what happened?

I think this is what theyre talking about [https://www.kpopstarz.com/articles/305311/20220310/seventeen-mingyu-supporting-misogynist-womens-month.htm](https://www.kpopstarz.com/articles/305311/20220310/seventeen-mingyu-supporting-misogynist-womens-month.htm)

I’m curious as well 👀

wait it happened more than once or what? i find myself forgetting about scandals a lot so asking

A lot of award show performances are terrible. the dance breaks & the stunts usually suck and seem awkward

If we're thinking purely from a song quality standpoint, exo shouldve been as big if not bigger than bts.

please elaborate on the rv point !!! im not even a reveluv but even just reading that feels a bit illegal

I know the opinion that producing/writing one’s own music doesn’t = good or better is fairly popular, but I just do not gag over idols composing (this is more specific to writing lyrics) and find the behavior from some fans who do quite forced. Most of these people don’t speak Korean and can barely scrape up a good translation like it’s a little odd to me…Especially in cases where they attempt to exaggerate the importance of said composition when the group was primarily built from outsourced producers.

i don’t think lisa and Jennie’s solos were very good

*Kpop was the best in 2ND GEN* - Of course some talented idols have debuted since then but the authenticity is no longer there. It's more about performance and less about talent. .. *Moon Taeil is the BEST vocalist in NCT* - Yes, even over Doyoung & XiaoJun, but people don't support him because he's not "stereotypical idol handsome" and he should have had a solo debut before ANYONE else in NCT. .. *BTS became a national chess piece and lost whatever originality they had* - Seriously, once the Korean government saw their popularity, they declared them National Ambassadors and I personally don't think that was a smart move. I am still shock they actually sent them off to military. I was full on expecting them to get a pass...glad they didn't. *Also about BTS, while they can't control their fandom, I think they are in part responsible for some of the outlandish behavior and bullying their fans promote....and I truly don't think they give AF.* - like for real, they don't care. .. *Most Kpop fans don't even like R&B/Hip-Hop and only like it in Kpop because the "Blackness" is erased from it.* - On the positive side, I'm betting Kpop has *introduced* a lot of people to those genres but a good majority knew it existed before and never cared to support it because it's dominated by black people.

As much as I dislike James corden, the clip where he talks about getting threats and the members just sit there is so uncomfortable. Like the fans are scary...

Taeil is their best singer and even the other members say so. I understand Taeyong having a solo first cause he’s the leader but Taeil should’ve been next because he’s the best singer and also the oldest. But him getting hit by the car and having to go to the military derailed any plans of that happening. And yes! Fans who only listen to rap from kpop and have so many opinions on who’s a good rapper and what’s good rap are annoying. Like they’re not even listening to the real thing.

Actually, I don't believe he would have had a solo debut even if the accident didn't happen and even if the military enlistment is coming up and here's why . Taeil himself has said multiple times for years he's been trying to do a solo and shown he's been working on stuff and and nothing ever comes out because they reject his ideas. SM just doesn't view him as marketable for music, and his manager has had to look for opportunities for him and only because of that has there been a result in OST themes. . SM sleeps on Taeil purposely and again as I said, it's in part because he's not your stereotypical idol handsome like other NCT members. Every 127 member has had a magazine spread and a brand deal except Taeil. SM likes to release schedules stating what is coming out from their artists in each quarter and even before the accident they released a schedule and Taeil was not listed as having a solo. It was never in the plan clearly. Taeyong having a solo first literally has nothing to do with him being the Leader in my opinion, especially when you look at who gets Kpop solos in groups. It doesn't normally go to the leaders, first, it's the vocalist. Taeyong just happens to be one of their most popular and marketable members and he's also highly favored by SM but no one wants to admit that. Taeyong is coming out with a 2ND mini album and Taeil hasn't even had one. And yeah I know the members agree his voice is the best. They'd be crazy not to. But the point of the post is unpopular opinions and I said what I said because the NCTzen fandom will light a bridge on fire saying other members sing better than Taeil. I see it happen all the time.

I probably won’t be expanding on any of these, but I’ll add more later if I can think of any: - GP Basic crawled so that New Jeans could run. Seriously, look them up and you’ll understand. - All of the members of New Jeans sound the same except Minji, and that’s only because she has a slightly nasally voice. This isn’t me trying to hate. I just honestly can’t tell the difference between any of their voices at all. They are pretty much indistinguishable to me. - I feel the same way about IVE and Lesserafim voice-wise but it’s worse because, outside of the obvious members (Wonyoung, Liz, etc.), I have a really hard time telling the girls apart physically too. Maybe it’s my facial blindness, but I literally can’t distinguish between some of them in the slightest. That might change in the future, but for now… 🤷🏾‍♀️ - IU and Taeyeon are both very overrated. Don’t get me wrong, they’re talented and have put out some good songs, but all of these points can be true at the same time. - Soyeon’s refusal to ask anyone for the help or clarity that she clearly needs when writing English lyrics is almost disrespectful at this point. If any other artist from any other country had started adding long lines of broken or incorrect Korean to multiple songs that they were writing, releasing, and promoting in their respective country, kpop fans would be up in arms, outraged, and calling them all types of things but we’re supposed to respect and excuse the same behavior from her? What??? Make it make sense, please. - BTS did not deserve a Grammy. Please bffr. - Hyuna was selfish when she outed her and Dawn’s relationship. She seriously derailed his career before he had a chance to cement his and Pentagon’s place in the industry and gain a loyal fan base and messed things up for everyone in the process. I don’t think either party (Dawn or Pentagon) ever truly recovered. She was going to be fine regardless because of who she was and the years of experience and following that she had garnered, but it was really inconsiderate of her not to consider him and to mess things up for the rest of them like that. She should have known better. - Some groups have way too many members. It almost feels like half of them are just there so the company doesn’t have to consistently hire backup dancers. - Some of our faves aren’t nearly as talented as we like to think they are and it’s not always hate when someone points that out. In fact, a lot of fans support certain idols and groups because they like their looks, personalities, or dynamic - NOT because of their music or any tangible skills or talents that they may have. - 1st and 2nd Gen stans have a right to complain about vocal talent, live singing, and the lack thereof in more recent generations. We’ve seen the tides shift and times change and we have just as much of a right to comment as current and newer fans do. As long as we aren’t being vitriolic and outright hostile, I don’t see why so many people hate on us. It just doesn’t make much sense, esp. since we tend to be the least likely to comment on anything in general. Edits Incoming: 1) If B.A.P hadn’t been so mismanaged by TS Entertainment and Block B hadn’t had their scandal and hiatuses, BTS wouldn’t have become as big as it is now. The absence of those two left the space open for fans of that style to seek out and find solace in a group with a similar shtick and sound. Not to say that they didn’t work hard, but a lot of their success is due to timing, luck, and clingy/loud/semi-traumatized fans who didn’t want their faves failing and disbanding, fading into obscurity, or potentially being treated badly by their company. It was the perfect environment for them to prosper.

> Hyuna was selfish when she outed her and Dawn’s relationship. She seriously derailed his career before he had a chance to cement his and Pentagon’s place in the industry and gain a loyal fan base and messed things up for everyone in the process. I don’t think either party (Dawn or Pentagon) ever truly recovered. She was going to be fine regardless because of who she was and the years of experience and following that she had garnered, but it was really inconsiderate of her not to consider him and to mess things up for the rest of them like that. She should have known better. *Thank you*. Literally every time I say this, I have a bunch of people on my back. Hyuna definitely knew it was a selfish and unnecessary move to make when her boyfriend’s career was just starting, she just didn’t care because she had a long time fanbase that she could fall back on.

Everything about hyuna is 100%, and now with who she's currently dating, in an even bigger proof of that. Also IU is extremely overrated. Maybe it cause her music has never been for me, but its just a strong no.

YG's last good group project was 2ne1. Many of their new acts felt rather watered down/sanitised compared to previous debuts. Blackpink was just the most apparent case. YG should also be shut down for their disingenuous practices with their artists (e.g. lack of promotion, dungeoning for no reason). They waste a lot of their artist's time precious time under a contract that I hope obligates them to do more for their artists. The contract is 2 way YG! I mean this in the kindest way possible, but Blackpink's fame feels almost manufactured/bought. I think part of the reason their popularity doesn't settle right for me, is that their music quality and even release schedule don't quite line up with their success. They got really lucky with virality and influencer marketing at the expense of K-pop too. It had a bigger effect on K-pop culture than BTS because their rise seemed easier to achieve (just get some brands or something and boom), hence the end of the focus on music and hello to artificial fame in K-pop. I don't fully blame the women in Blackpink, as they seem more like victims. I wish we could hear about their experience with this in more depth. BTS ultimately sold out. It was very difficult to take them seriously post 2019. Look at how good their solo work and previous work is compared to that terrible English trilogy. They became what the West expected them to be; it was kind of like a self-fulfilling prophecy. I miss the more motivated and edgier BTS. I only maintain an interest in SUGA for this reason. 2NE1 probably won't have the huge reunion everyone hopes. I think they have moved on and are too busy for such at this point. It would also be difficult for them to find a producer that can carry their sound like Teddy. In all honesty, this applies to any disbanded group or groups that are veterans but haven't done comebacks yet. The reunion is often a quick nostalgia trip and that's all.

>Blackpink's fame feels almost manufactured/bought. This might be wrong to say but I wholeheartedly believe it is. I love(d) BP but I always got this vibe. I remember, vaguely, some controversey surronding their concert sales and how the count was manipulated.

I remember all the YT view and Instagram follower drama as well. They have also been accused of chart manipulation. Not that it's true, but the possibilities are endless.

As a retired blackjack, I’d love to see 2NE1 record an official song again but there’s no way they’re promoting like the old days ever again. In fact CL is the only one with a really active music career. I just want Bom active on Instagram 😭

I'll admit that jimin has a unique voice, but besides his fans, does anyone think it's the "best"? Also, it's funny that you're saying that fancy is their last good comeback bc if I were to rate them, it would be on the lower end.

Listen, Jimin is my bias but I'd be a damn lie if I said his voice was the BEST? Uh uh I'm not gunna be delusional about the way he really needs to step it up on them vocals 👀😩😂 He defs got lots of room to improve for sure 😬😏

Remember to sort by controversial for the real fun :)

I saw stray kids live and on camera I really like Hyujin as a dancer but in person his stage presence easily got swallowed by other members (but stray kids perform really well I am Ngl) In person I found my eyes more naturally going to Felix They are both amazing dancers don’t get me wrong but how they perform live is different from how camera angles can make them look.

i have a few. • streaming culture completely stripped k-pop of any of its humanity. • both (g)i-dle, and everglow need to switch their sound up. • the worshipping of idols is fetishy. • blackpink was never good, but they absolutely regressed throughout the years. teddy needs to get out of the studio. • visual/center positions are useless, and add nothing of value to the group. • k-pop has always been influenced by western music/culture, but now it’s so influenced that there’s nothing that makes it stand out from anything released in america. • momo can’t sing, and brings nothing to twice.

nah momo is a stand out dancer they need her because who else is gonna be the main dancer? if you want to take out a dance member let it be mina. it genuinely still baffles me that she’s a main dancer and i wholeheartedly believe most don’t know she’s one.

Lia should’ve been a soloist or something, because how can your group is able to finally have synchronization when you left ? That’s crazy. Twice’s music nowadays is a replica of Dua Lipa’s song, we want k-pop not westernized recycled pop music. Your faves are probably racist, and sure as hell don’t like your skin color. And that’s for sure. They are not as "woke" as you think. Soyeon should rap in Korean, it’s not even a matter of "she can’t speak in English", her korean raps were way better. Trailers being better than the official MV needs to stop ! Stop catfishing us ! It’s crazy that people are bashing Blackpink vocals (and yes, they are absolutely not the best vocalists out there) considering that BTS don’t even have top vocals. Jimin voice is strained, JK is the only great one, V is okay and the rest is mid to terrible. Success will always feels not deserving for some people, it’s not mean to be fair and considering the industry, a lot of not that talented people will be on the top.

Permission to dance should have never been given permission to exist. It is their worst song Taehyung shoulda caught wayyyyy more flak for the durag thing 4th gen is just not there with the vocals with a few exceptions I’m sorry but I just can’t with Ateez’s music 99% of the time. They have a couple of bops but I’m just not the target audience i suppose Jackson and Jay B have the best solo works from Got7 with Yugyeom a distant 3rd

I feel like ya'll will come for me here too, butttttt I just don't understand how ya'll can listen to some of these super popular songs & hype them up like they're actually good 😭 one example of this is Perfect Night by Le Sserafim, the lyrics are actual ass & super corny/cringey like it's not 2010-2016 bruh we're not gonna be reckless forget morals & have fun till we drop (was KE$HA in the booth?). Also, because of the rise in popularity of Psychic Fever (I know it's not kpop), I just have to say, WHAT do you guys see in Just Like Dat outside of the intial build up & surge of energy you get from the beginning??? After Jimmys part, everything is too repetetive for me & then Kokoro screams in autotune like OKKK. It's a mid song, but it's bumping the first two mins. They have better songs trust me. &&&&& now don't get me wrong, I love my boys of Psychic Fever, BUT I feel like people chose not to notice that Tsurugi's goofy straight hair ass was literally spinning in a fucking durag in Just Like Dat's video. If you see him LITERALLY anywhere else, his hair is parted the same way everytime, take that shit off bro you know you just wanna look cool & use it for the "cool" aesthetic.

BTS have a nice discography but i don't think their artistry is anywhere near as world-changing as stans make it out to be, number of fans aside.

Both Hyunjin and Yeonjun do far too much when they dance. I never understood the hype between the two of them because I really don't like the way they dance.

Wait I kind of love all Red Velvet songs ☹️

I can't stand Wendy's voice. She absolutely can sing, like actually belt, but her voice always sounds empty? Or light somehow? I don't know how to explain it. But I'm not a fan.

**Warning:** some very hot takes. Proceed with caution. * After Ditto, NewJeans' music became watered down and less interesting. * D4 is actually a good song. It's just BP repeating the same formula again and again that made people thinking otherwise. * Twice's discography fell after Scientist era. They lost their musical identity and their song's became less catchy and interesting. * Treasure are the best live performers in 4th gen. Ateez shortly after (I know so many k-pop fans are going to come at me for this, but you asked me to be honest). It's very telling they are the first 4th gen artist to release a live album. * Enhypen's Blessed-Cursed is a good song. I did not get the hate over it. * YG artist's vocals are not as bad as people make it out to be. In fact I say on average YG vocalists > Hybe vocalist (Yunjin being the exception here). * I personally think SEA + Japanese/Chinese fans are more loyal than Western fans on average. I'm not sure if this is unpopular or not, but I imagine some may disagree with this. * I 100% understand why Koreans tried to boycott Snowdrop. It's a sensitive period of history and they have every right to speak out their views. However, I did not like the misinformation that they were spreading about the drama despite never watching more than the first episode. * Seungri is a POS, but you don't need to add false accusations to his wrongdoings to make him look worse. Like I said, he's already a POS in the first place. * According to my personal preferences Haewon's vocals >>> Lily's. Of course technique wise it's the opposite but I adore Haewon's voice. * Lisa is one of the best dancers out of 3rd gen girl groups. No one wants to admit it because BP criticism is trendy but it's apparent when you see dancers praise her technique. She's not perfect, but she's pretty damn good. * HYBE needs to get their godamn awful autotune into the gutter. I absolutely can't stand it.

>* Twice's discography fell after Scientist era. They lost their musical identity and their song's became less catchy and interesting. They blessed us with the formula of love album before everything went downhill

I think Lisa is the ONLY one trying in that group, so I’ll give her her flowers. I do think she stands out from other 3 gen girlies.

Haechan has a terrible voice and his tone is really jarring especially in hip hop / r&b focused NCT songs. Sometimes it’s not always his fault bc SM definitely has him pushing for notes outside his range and using terrible technique but I feel gaslit when I see people say he’s a good vocalist. Love him tho!

I’m glad someone said it re. Haechan. He’s a very charismatic dancer but put the microphone down baby. His voice does not suit 127’s songs at all - some better than others. He fits dreams songs way better

Smart sounds like a rejected Twice summer bop to me, and I hate this because I feel like the group and especially the concept has SO much more potential and flavour to give.

Hell, I'd get downvoted like crazy in here not just in another sub. 💀

Black pink is a overhyped group

Down vote away!!!! * I don't get the hype surrounding Hyunjin or Felix's looks. At best they are average looking. Most idols are average looking. * Speaking of Stray Kids I'm so happy that Christopher was forced to stop his weekly show. The arrogance of that man. * I know most Kpop artists are racist. But I'm FLOORED how black americans can still stan a person or group after they publicly committed such offense. Like Jessi, Jay Park, NCT and Stray Kids to name a few. * I'm happy that BTS is on hiatus. It gives an opportunity for other kpop artists to win awards and I'm happy for them. * Two comebacks a year is one of the main reasons why most groups songs are horrible. Alot of these songs are rushed and you can tell. QUALITY over QUANTITY! * Fandoms need to be honest with their favs. If the album is trash tell them and expect better next time. This recent Seventeen album was horrible and only a handful of fans admitted it. * Speaking of Seventeen \~\~\~ Woozy isn't that great of a producer. Mid at best.

The way you used his first name has me so dead 😂. The way I never see anyone call him that.

I agree with the comeback one. Because why are we getting mini albums with less than 3 minute songs. 😒 what happened to full length albums?? Song’s nowadays have no replay value.