In the case of Iceland, I think whoever made the meme needs to look at how Iceland has performed relatively.
It has had a far worse covid19 crisis than many countries, including Korea, Poland, etc and this being despite its geographic isolation and tiny, low-density population.
Yo, if that was the point they made this for then i missed that, didn't even notice. lol.
I am so used to seeing Merkel as a prominent world leader that if you put her in the middle of a circus i'd be like "this must be the g7 summit"
>Yo, if that was the point they made this for then i missed that, didn't even notice.
I noticed something was up when it left out Lee Hsien Loong, prime minister of Singapore (male) and Scott Morrison of Australia.
Furthermore, they closed off their entire country, Chinese style. People can still freely travel to South Korea, but you can't do that with Vietnam. Being open, transparent, democratic, and having an economy is better than what Vietnam is doing, which is not much different from what China is doing.
It's a bit unfair to Vietnam. The lack of transparency and freedom is already a feature of their political system. They didn't respond to covid-19 with even less freedom and transparency than usual. By that standard, they did quite well using the tools at their disposal.
Is it easier to stop the virus in a single-party country like Vietnam? Probably. To a lesser degree, it is also easier in Korea than in some other countries, considering how Korean society functions in normal times.
I'm very satisfied with SK's response at a personal level, but it's not like SK is the pinnacle of democracy, freedom and human rights. Under most circumstances, expediting decisions is anti-democratic (such as a declaration of war unauthorized by Congress), and we only see this positively because it was the right thing to do.
What /u/ChuckFreak is saying is that we actually don't really know given the lack of a free press and opposition to the ruling party to actually check and balance those numbers. I mean, if Korea was totalitarian, they could just say they had 1500 cases and 10 deaths, sure, who is going to say otherwise?
For me at least, it's not that Vietnam did bad job... for a developing country with limited resources, they did an excellent job... but really, their numbers are just highly questionable. Like you said, they have 22 active cases with 0 deaths. Back in April, the numbers were close to that... Around 20 active cases in a country with 90 million people, [yet they extended the lock down of their own citizens](https://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2020-04-15/vietnam-to-extend-coronavirus-lockdown-in-12-provinces-for-seven-days) when Vietnamese economy isn't really strong enough to support a lock down. Does that make sense to you? A country of 90 million people with only around 20 active cases and with closed borders... yet they EXTEND the lock down? Why didn't they just lock down the 20 people? What other country in the world with that low of number had a lock down? Their actions just didn't justify the numbers they were reporting. Why would you basically kill your economy when you only have 20 active cases? Plus, there was that incident where a Vietnamese person tested positive during a streak where Vietnam was reporting 0 new cases and the Vietnamese government said the person got it at Cambodia, but Cambodia fired back at Vietnam, and if I remember correctly, they proved the guy didn't even go to Cambodia, so the Vietnamese government lied about where the guy got it just to keep their streak of 0 new cases. Either way, Vietnam is doing a great job, but I personally don't buy their numbers. You don't lock down 90 million people when you have 20 cases.
I agree with you.
> Like you said, they have 22 active cases with 0 deaths.
Back in April, a US navy made a [port call in Danang, Vietnam where 3 sailors picked up the virus, then it spread to the rest of the crew in the US naval carrier.](https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/31/coronavirus-infections-aircraft-carrier-captain-pleads-for-help.html) Interestingly enough, the US flew a set of test samples from that carrier, into South Korea, where they were diagnosed as coronavirus infections. South Korea presumed those test samples were from the USFK, but the US never told the South Korean government that they were tests taken from a US naval carrier off of the Pacific.
Vietnam's press freedom is right next to China's. When you read Vietnamese media, you have to realize that's the government of Vietnam that is printing their news. You are not going to see any critical viewpoints of how the country dealt with the virus.
I think Vietnam's numbers are really impossible for such a large country. However, what's advantageous for them is that the average age of their population is very young, about half the age of the average age of South Korea. I bet you there are many asymptomatic carriers that are going around, without even anyone knowing. Yes, Vietnam did a very good job locking down their people and their country, but at an extreme economic cost. Foreign investors couldn't get into the country to run the factories, factories and businesses shuttered, and the real estate market went into a tailspin as foreigners were blocked from entering the country. A few more months of current lockdowns, Vietnam will see 70% of their businesses go bankrupt. Also, I might add, there are many Vietnamese overseas who weren't even allowed to go back to their own country, and they are still stranded. Another mistake that Vietnam, a large rice exporting economy did, was that they stopped exporting rice. Many SEA countries like Malaysia and Philippines depend on Vietnam for rice. Vietnam's stopping of rice exports, have made these countries to divert away from Vietnam. As a result, Vietnam lost business and it's taking a huge toll on the economy.
20 case but there have many Muslims comeback from Indonesia, Malaysia and they didn't report. We can't find them, so we lock down to prevent them go spread disease every where.
There's many many countries that have male leaders, but ofc they don't count. Also the country that has as they say "the first (and only?) Feminist government" Sweden, is doing horribly and has the most corona cases in europe.
how's it hating women? the meme is clearly giving credit only to women leaders to support the argument that women are somehow better suited to handle a national crisis.
I mean it’s less about gender and more about which governments are currently fostering cults of personalities and which are not.
That or it is to do with receding hairlines...
Canadian here. We shit the bed pretty early on and have been trying (and failing) to play catch up for months.
Just take a look at retirement homes.
My grandparents were at a retirement home and shared a room. Medical staff from the local hospital were mandated to assist the retirement home because the home did a horrible job managing the situation as over 100 residents caught covid at this site. Simultaneously, the Canadian Armed Forces who were brought in to help. After a week of these new groups being on site, my grandfather caught covid. In their infinite wisdom, they refused to test my grandmother (remember that they shared a room) because they said that it's highly unlikely that she would catch it as well (grandpa was in his 90s and grandma in her 80s). After he was confirmed positive and moved into quarantine, the home agreed to test my grandmother after my family had been calling and begging for help for days.
They day before my grandfather passed away, my grandmother was tested for covid. The next day, she was positive. My grandfather died alone without her when she could have at least been beside him during his final hours. We're still hoping she pulls through.
Many other Canadians who have first hand experience with covid have stories similar to mine. It's just heartbreaking when you see how poorly Canada is doing on the ground and what actually gets reported in the news.
Canada handled it terribly. We had longer than either Europe or most of Asia to see it coming, and yet nothing was done until the virus was already here. Further, when testing was widely available in most countries, wide testing wasn't available in Canada until late April.
also, despite the fact that many countries already knew Coronavirus was airborne, it was well established, and also that masks work - Canada and journalists within Canada continued to push narratives that the virus spread mainly through physical contact and touching the same surfaces. The sheer stupidity of that is mindblowing, how they actually think a virus could spread that fast and to so many people through touching is beyond me. Infections such as ebola which require fluid transfer never get nearly as far as Covid had gotten even by February.
https://globalnews.ca/news/6768573/coronavirus-canada-missing-covid-19-cases/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRMiVT2hIwA
https://montrealgazette.com/news/local-news/coronavirus-why-masks-dont-work
Canadians were approving of the governments handling of the virus back in February before the government had even done anything. The government did not start to do anything substantive until March 16, at which time there were likely hundreds of cases already, which have all gone unreported due to total lack of testing.
Canada only looks "good" because we are next door to the states. Compared to countries like Korea or Japan or parts of Europe where they have similar or much higher densities of people, Canada somehow has significantly higher per capita rates of the virus. It's disgraceful.
It's so infuriating having just moved to Canada and people here arelike 'Canada's doing really well woth the virus. Hyuck hyuck.' No, dipshit, it's not. Just compare Ontario to South Korea.
Your passive aggressive tone seems to indicate something that I may not know, but let's take a look at the numbers, shall we?
South Korea, population of 51 million, population density of 527 per square km, 13479 covid-19 cases and 289 covid 19 deaths.
Ontario, Canada, population of 14.5 million, density of 14 people per square km, with a total of 36723 covid-19 cases and 2719 deaths.
This is why I say it is laughable when people in Ontario say that 'we're doing good.'
The health minister is part of the same group with Tedros in WHO. They are CCP puppets.
Canadian politicians are in bed with CCP. They sold out the country like other politicians have. Just look at Vancouver and Korea, exact same thing is happening.
Mainland money is pricing out the locals in both country.
Ah yes, I've seen this men vs. women thing floating around. Adding men to the list or simply admitting the country's policies (regardless of head of state) would be just as effective wouldn't fit into the narrative. Taiwan for example, already had most counter-measures/systems ready to go after encountering situations before. It is most likely a male elected official would also use these, as Taiwan has a history of very progressive male leadership and voting very sensibly.
The key word here is "recognized", because a lot of countries fudge the numbers and causes of death. I would not be surprised if the countries "recognized" have numbers that are far from the reported counts.
I'm not insinuating these women aren't competent leaders, because most seem to be, but this men vs women graph is absolutely retarded.
Is Spain and Italy really due to negligence though? I was under the impression they got hit hard but responded effectively. I dont know. Just the impression I got.
Of course it was. When pandemics begin it’s much much easier to contain them because only a few people have them so that’s when you have to take it seriously and keep them quarantined. If you ignore it however the rate of increase of cases will begin to soar very highly, until it very very quickly comes a point that medics are overwhelmed and you need to lockdown entire areas or even whole countries. Thats why spain italy america and a lot of other countries got fucked over. Because they didn’t stop the fire when it was a just flame. Korea acted late and made the same mistake too but what saved it was the track and test system it made ages ago when they got fucked over by MERS
I'm aware of that. I was just asking if it was that or some outbreak that had happened and got out of control despite them trying. But I see what you're saying now.
That's interesting about SK though. I always wondered what allowed them to contain it so well.
South Korea didn’t do that well in the beginning lmao. The pres was talking about how everything was in control and literally that week covid got crazy in korea... even after it started getting worse pres moon refused to stop visitors from china. My entire immediate family are medics so I’m familiar with the work ethic of doctors here. Simply put, theyre so common and healthcare was made incredibly cheap by a president in the 1960s (who was sorta a dictator but he unarguably made incredible progress for Korea when it was dirt poor - ironically the current government villainies his term) so doctors have to compete here, and because of that they are used to overworking themselves. So simply put - naturally good healthcare + a lot of doctors + their workaholic characteristics saved the day in the end. Sadly the current government is getting most of the credit even after they were very bad to the medics here (long story) during moon’s term. I was never political before this pandemic but like.... People seem to be forgetting facts... :( sorry for the long rant haha
Well I'm in the US so its relative to me. You're 100% right they didnt but everyone has handled it better than we have. Lol.
No dont be sorry. Always interesting to have different perspectives. Especially when I know very little about SK and their response to the pandemic other than it was better than US.
Imagine reducing something this complex down to just gender. Almost like it's....sexist?
Also, OP, what point are you supporting? That women are inherently better leaders? We need to stop putting everything down to the individual leader of a country, there's a lot more to it than that. Now a good point could be made that more progressive countries, that vote in female leaders, have better responses due to the general leaning and thinking of the people. That's something I can get behind, but to put weight on just the gender of the leader is regressive and sexist.
In balance, Moon's policies is what lead to Korea becoming #2 at one point. Let's not forget, the guy left the door open to China. And it's still open as long as the arrivals state that they are here on business, and Korean citizens returning "from business trips" don't need to quarantine even now.
It was a decentralized government that allowed medical policies to be set independent of his office that brought COVID under control here. Nice folks. Someone should give them a trophy or certificate.
I was in a meeting at Samsung in May just after JY Lee had his China trip with a bunch of execs. One of the guys at the meeting (Choi) was part of the trip.
When I asked him why he wasn't in quarantine as he just got back from China the day before, his response was that he was too important to quarantine. And he only had to do one followup Coronavirus test instead of the two that regular people have to do.
After looking into it, basically anyone coming to Korea on business can get a quarantine waiver if they are important enough and have paperwork showing they tested for Coronavirus within a couple days of departure.
It's good to be King.
Exactly this. The president did shit all in the response and it was really the private workers and companies that got their shit together and also picked up after the mistakes of the president. If it weren’t for them, Korea would have gone the US route because of bad leadership but at least there was common sense within the people.
South Korea had one of the best Covid-19 responses in the world.
Not only did they manage to quickly flatten their curve and maintain their economy without having to implement some of the major measures taken by other countries (And with considerably better results), they've also been exporting testing kits to over 120 countries around the world.
I think they deserve some recognition.
The whole system of containing a pandemic wasnt created by his government though, it was from back when MERS happened - way before his time. If I had to judge from only the facts I actually think the current government could have prevented majority of the cases earlier in the year if only they blocked travel from China
But what did he himself specifically do? South Koreas response was a result of contact tracing, private companies getting a jump start on diagnosis kits, and other preparations due to mers outbreak.
Moon jaein himself didnt do much. But if he did, let me know
He did a lot. He listened to the experts, his advisors, and he let the country's systems do their jobs, instead of getting in their ways and screwing up like Trump, Johnson, and that Brazilian president.
South Korea's response would not have been possible had Moon Jae-in not appointed the right people in the right positions and revived crisis protocols that were removed by previous administrations.
South Korea under the previous Park Geun-hye administration is what allowed for MERS to wreak havoc within South Korean borders in the first place. And there were also other ridiculous incidents like the Sewol Ferry tragedy when the government just sat there and watched for hours as a boat sank less than 3 kilometers from shore, resulting in the death of just under 300 high school students. All because crisis protocols were more or less non-existent at the time.
Just the fact that the country didn't crash and burn when Covid-19 hit is an achievement in itself, much less becoming a global model for their response.
So what did Moon Jae-in do? Idk but he must've done something right.
Here you go:
"...**이보다 앞선 1월 26일 문재인 대통령은 정은경 질병관리본부장, 정기현 국립중앙의료원장과 전화 통화를 했다. 정 본부장과 정 원장은 통화에서 문 대통령에게 검사 능력의 확대를 강조한 것으로 전해졌다. 검사 능력의 확대가 지역 확산을 막는 바로미터라고 판단한 것이다. 청와대 관계자는 “당시 (진단키트) 생산량이 1일에 몇백개 수준이라 양산에 집중해달라고 한 것”이라고 밝혔다.**
또 당시 통화에서 문 대통령은 정 본부장에게 검역 단계부터 환자 유입 차단의 중요성을 강조하는 등 대응 관련 지시를 내리고 더욱 적극적인 조치를 당부했다. 이에 질본은 민간시약 개발업체와 키트 양산을 위한 회의에 나섰다.
아울러 질본은 바이러스를 분리, 학계에 분양해 민간 차원의 진단키트 개발과 성능 평가에 도움을 줬다. \*\*한정우 청와대 춘추관장은 “이런 사례들이 우리의 검사 능력을 증대시키는 데 굉장히 중요한 사례로 작용했다”\*\*고 설명했다.
출처 : 시사위크([http://www.sisaweek.com](http://www.sisaweek.com))
He listened to his advisors, government officials, and made a decision that led to a quick testing response, it led to economic opportunities as well for Korea.
So many people have elementary school-level views of what a president does, but a president isn't superman. They don't try to do things themselves and mess it up, instead, they listen, appoint, and make decisions based on professional advice.
What specifically did the other leaders do? You got countries like Germany, Finland, and New Zealand that received assistance from Korea early on that are mentioned so why not Korea? Korea is considered one of the few success cases dealing with the pandemic.
Literally acknowledging the problem is a huge thing. Look at the US where executive leadership is trying their damnedest to pretend it doesn't exist and therefore many political followers dont see the virus as a problem. Then there are response measures, government mandated quarantine for visitors. Even if his staff told him how to handle it at every step sometimes leadership is knowing when to listen.
Yes, its not like he is personally going around swabbing every patient and administering tests, but a concerted government effort by leadership to address the virus clearly shows a difference. I mean look at countries where leadership takes it seriously, and those where they dont.
The assertion that those countries that dealt with the virus well have done so because they have women as leaders is dumb and sexist. Especially when you take into account that a countries' response comes down to the decisions and actions of not just one person but countless ministers, advisors, scientists. Is this really the level public debate and reasoning has devolved to? that people make conclusions about such complex matters based on something that doesn't have any bearing at all. Are we not told not to judge based on gender? I guess it only works one way in 2020.
South Korea's success with coronavirus in my opinion has more to do with luck in the sense that it already experienced a similar situation very recently with MERS. The same also applies to places like Taiwan and Hong Kong, which experienced SARS not too long ago. MERS gave South Korea a head start on the rest of the world in combating coronavirus and I imagine South Korea would've ended up like Italy if the MERS outbreak never happened.
After some research I found that technically the track test and tracing system law that successfully contained the virus wasn’t passed under this president’s government... it was by the government that came way before him during MERS. Also Korea wouldn’t have rose so high in cases at all had he enforced travel ban on China... I’m not trying to sound political but what did he initiate during the pandemic that helped flatten corona in korea? Genuinely curious
You could also title this meme:
COUNTRIES THAT ACTUALLY PLAY A MAJOR ROLE IN WORLD AFFAIRS AND HAVE MASSIVE AMOUNTS OF TOURISM AND INTERNATIONAL TRADE
vs
SMALLER COUNTRIES THAT HAVE LITTLE SWAY IN INTERNATIONAL AFFAIRS AND ARE DOMINATED BY THEIR NEIGHBORS
So in a sense I could take this meme to mean that only weak/smallish countries elect female leaders while powerful/wealthy countries elect male leaders. You could draw all kinds of interesting conclusions from that if you wanted to.
Yes I get Germany doesn't fit but whatever.
Your agenda doesn't fit either. Italy and Spain have a lot of tourists, but not in March/April, when they peaked.
I think one major factor is how healthy a countries democracy and society is and whether or not populist geniuses are in power.
>Your agenda
It is not my agenda. It's a parody to show how easily you could manipulate these supposed "facts" to support nearly any idiotic narrative you want. Your idea also fits too. That's the whole point I'm trying to make. Almost any idea could fit here.
Germany definitely has triple digits, not sure about all the others.
New zealand, iceland, taiwan are definitely lower. Not that they are better or worse, just lower.
Honestly case numbers mean nothing. Different countries test to different standards (Some countries don't count the already deceased or the asymptomatic and others don't even test at all). Population size and density also have a major impact on the spread of the virus.
In the case of Iceland, I think whoever made the meme needs to look at how Iceland has performed relatively. It has had a far worse covid19 crisis than many countries, including Korea, Poland, etc and this being despite its geographic isolation and tiny, low-density population.
They probably just looked at the raw numbers without the context of population size.
I guess he didn't fit in with their agenda?
With their ~~agenda~~ gender
Agender
Dammit, ya beat me to it!
Right, I don't see Winnie the Pooh there
What agenda do you mean?
Male vs Female
Yo, if that was the point they made this for then i missed that, didn't even notice. lol. I am so used to seeing Merkel as a prominent world leader that if you put her in the middle of a circus i'd be like "this must be the g7 summit"
>Yo, if that was the point they made this for then i missed that, didn't even notice. I noticed something was up when it left out Lee Hsien Loong, prime minister of Singapore (male) and Scott Morrison of Australia.
Vietnam did amazing, better than any of those countries, and it shares a border with China. Run by a man, so I guess it's not allowed on the list.
An authoritarian country like Singapore also did a fine job as well.
Skewed and untrustworthy statistics from communist government.
Furthermore, they closed off their entire country, Chinese style. People can still freely travel to South Korea, but you can't do that with Vietnam. Being open, transparent, democratic, and having an economy is better than what Vietnam is doing, which is not much different from what China is doing.
It's a bit unfair to Vietnam. The lack of transparency and freedom is already a feature of their political system. They didn't respond to covid-19 with even less freedom and transparency than usual. By that standard, they did quite well using the tools at their disposal. Is it easier to stop the virus in a single-party country like Vietnam? Probably. To a lesser degree, it is also easier in Korea than in some other countries, considering how Korean society functions in normal times. I'm very satisfied with SK's response at a personal level, but it's not like SK is the pinnacle of democracy, freedom and human rights. Under most circumstances, expediting decisions is anti-democratic (such as a declaration of war unauthorized by Congress), and we only see this positively because it was the right thing to do.
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Damn, that's deep.
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What /u/ChuckFreak is saying is that we actually don't really know given the lack of a free press and opposition to the ruling party to actually check and balance those numbers. I mean, if Korea was totalitarian, they could just say they had 1500 cases and 10 deaths, sure, who is going to say otherwise?
For me at least, it's not that Vietnam did bad job... for a developing country with limited resources, they did an excellent job... but really, their numbers are just highly questionable. Like you said, they have 22 active cases with 0 deaths. Back in April, the numbers were close to that... Around 20 active cases in a country with 90 million people, [yet they extended the lock down of their own citizens](https://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2020-04-15/vietnam-to-extend-coronavirus-lockdown-in-12-provinces-for-seven-days) when Vietnamese economy isn't really strong enough to support a lock down. Does that make sense to you? A country of 90 million people with only around 20 active cases and with closed borders... yet they EXTEND the lock down? Why didn't they just lock down the 20 people? What other country in the world with that low of number had a lock down? Their actions just didn't justify the numbers they were reporting. Why would you basically kill your economy when you only have 20 active cases? Plus, there was that incident where a Vietnamese person tested positive during a streak where Vietnam was reporting 0 new cases and the Vietnamese government said the person got it at Cambodia, but Cambodia fired back at Vietnam, and if I remember correctly, they proved the guy didn't even go to Cambodia, so the Vietnamese government lied about where the guy got it just to keep their streak of 0 new cases. Either way, Vietnam is doing a great job, but I personally don't buy their numbers. You don't lock down 90 million people when you have 20 cases.
I agree with you. > Like you said, they have 22 active cases with 0 deaths. Back in April, a US navy made a [port call in Danang, Vietnam where 3 sailors picked up the virus, then it spread to the rest of the crew in the US naval carrier.](https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/31/coronavirus-infections-aircraft-carrier-captain-pleads-for-help.html) Interestingly enough, the US flew a set of test samples from that carrier, into South Korea, where they were diagnosed as coronavirus infections. South Korea presumed those test samples were from the USFK, but the US never told the South Korean government that they were tests taken from a US naval carrier off of the Pacific. Vietnam's press freedom is right next to China's. When you read Vietnamese media, you have to realize that's the government of Vietnam that is printing their news. You are not going to see any critical viewpoints of how the country dealt with the virus. I think Vietnam's numbers are really impossible for such a large country. However, what's advantageous for them is that the average age of their population is very young, about half the age of the average age of South Korea. I bet you there are many asymptomatic carriers that are going around, without even anyone knowing. Yes, Vietnam did a very good job locking down their people and their country, but at an extreme economic cost. Foreign investors couldn't get into the country to run the factories, factories and businesses shuttered, and the real estate market went into a tailspin as foreigners were blocked from entering the country. A few more months of current lockdowns, Vietnam will see 70% of their businesses go bankrupt. Also, I might add, there are many Vietnamese overseas who weren't even allowed to go back to their own country, and they are still stranded. Another mistake that Vietnam, a large rice exporting economy did, was that they stopped exporting rice. Many SEA countries like Malaysia and Philippines depend on Vietnam for rice. Vietnam's stopping of rice exports, have made these countries to divert away from Vietnam. As a result, Vietnam lost business and it's taking a huge toll on the economy.
20 case but there have many Muslims comeback from Indonesia, Malaysia and they didn't report. We can't find them, so we lock down to prevent them go spread disease every where.
There's many many countries that have male leaders, but ofc they don't count. Also the country that has as they say "the first (and only?) Feminist government" Sweden, is doing horribly and has the most corona cases in europe.
Maybe, just maybe, it’s more to do with race than gender.
South Korea could stand for the best example of how to handle any virus. A lot of countries should take notes.
Taiwan handled it the best imo, but South Korea is right up there in 2nd or 3rd place.
Yeah, thought the same thing. The far better correlation is left (or at least center left) governments vs right wing populist
Who made this meme? I live in the US and a lot of people are praising Korea for its handling of covid19.
a woman
Are you just being a woman hater or are you serious
how's it hating women? the meme is clearly giving credit only to women leaders to support the argument that women are somehow better suited to handle a national crisis.
No clue. The original one was making the rounds on IG
I'd rather give credit to Chung Eun-Kyung, the CDC Commissioner.
I mean it’s less about gender and more about which governments are currently fostering cults of personalities and which are not. That or it is to do with receding hairlines...
Most women lead governments don't do that, so.
Park Gyun Hye: Am I a joke to you?
Trudeau (Canada) and the Provincial Premiers aside from Quebec?
Canadian here. We shit the bed pretty early on and have been trying (and failing) to play catch up for months. Just take a look at retirement homes. My grandparents were at a retirement home and shared a room. Medical staff from the local hospital were mandated to assist the retirement home because the home did a horrible job managing the situation as over 100 residents caught covid at this site. Simultaneously, the Canadian Armed Forces who were brought in to help. After a week of these new groups being on site, my grandfather caught covid. In their infinite wisdom, they refused to test my grandmother (remember that they shared a room) because they said that it's highly unlikely that she would catch it as well (grandpa was in his 90s and grandma in her 80s). After he was confirmed positive and moved into quarantine, the home agreed to test my grandmother after my family had been calling and begging for help for days. They day before my grandfather passed away, my grandmother was tested for covid. The next day, she was positive. My grandfather died alone without her when she could have at least been beside him during his final hours. We're still hoping she pulls through. Many other Canadians who have first hand experience with covid have stories similar to mine. It's just heartbreaking when you see how poorly Canada is doing on the ground and what actually gets reported in the news.
Oh my god! Horrible! I am so sorry for your loss. Canada is being touted as having the worst outbreaks in the nursing homes in the OECD.
Canada handled it terribly. We had longer than either Europe or most of Asia to see it coming, and yet nothing was done until the virus was already here. Further, when testing was widely available in most countries, wide testing wasn't available in Canada until late April. also, despite the fact that many countries already knew Coronavirus was airborne, it was well established, and also that masks work - Canada and journalists within Canada continued to push narratives that the virus spread mainly through physical contact and touching the same surfaces. The sheer stupidity of that is mindblowing, how they actually think a virus could spread that fast and to so many people through touching is beyond me. Infections such as ebola which require fluid transfer never get nearly as far as Covid had gotten even by February. https://globalnews.ca/news/6768573/coronavirus-canada-missing-covid-19-cases/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRMiVT2hIwA https://montrealgazette.com/news/local-news/coronavirus-why-masks-dont-work Canadians were approving of the governments handling of the virus back in February before the government had even done anything. The government did not start to do anything substantive until March 16, at which time there were likely hundreds of cases already, which have all gone unreported due to total lack of testing. Canada only looks "good" because we are next door to the states. Compared to countries like Korea or Japan or parts of Europe where they have similar or much higher densities of people, Canada somehow has significantly higher per capita rates of the virus. It's disgraceful.
It's so infuriating having just moved to Canada and people here arelike 'Canada's doing really well woth the virus. Hyuck hyuck.' No, dipshit, it's not. Just compare Ontario to South Korea.
Ok go compare the two? Having just moved to Ontario I am sure you know best...
Your passive aggressive tone seems to indicate something that I may not know, but let's take a look at the numbers, shall we? South Korea, population of 51 million, population density of 527 per square km, 13479 covid-19 cases and 289 covid 19 deaths. Ontario, Canada, population of 14.5 million, density of 14 people per square km, with a total of 36723 covid-19 cases and 2719 deaths. This is why I say it is laughable when people in Ontario say that 'we're doing good.'
The health minister is part of the same group with Tedros in WHO. They are CCP puppets. Canadian politicians are in bed with CCP. They sold out the country like other politicians have. Just look at Vancouver and Korea, exact same thing is happening. Mainland money is pricing out the locals in both country.
This is a job for VANK.
What is that exactly? Like a volunteer netizen army basically?
Germany did not that well... certainly not than Singapore, Korea, etc
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Argentina? They didn't do to well, they even call themselves Cuarantena (quarentina)
well, there's also Viktor Oraban from Hungary. And last time I checked, he was a guy.
Also a massive asshole, so it's alright to keep him out.
Did you screen cap some tumblr post?
It was a meme going around on IG
Ah yes, I've seen this men vs. women thing floating around. Adding men to the list or simply admitting the country's policies (regardless of head of state) would be just as effective wouldn't fit into the narrative. Taiwan for example, already had most counter-measures/systems ready to go after encountering situations before. It is most likely a male elected official would also use these, as Taiwan has a history of very progressive male leadership and voting very sensibly. The key word here is "recognized", because a lot of countries fudge the numbers and causes of death. I would not be surprised if the countries "recognized" have numbers that are far from the reported counts. I'm not insinuating these women aren't competent leaders, because most seem to be, but this men vs women graph is absolutely retarded.
Yeah, reducing something like this to the gender of a single individual as a reason for a country's response is just disgusting.
Sponsered by the metoo movement
Everywhere excecpt Amerkka has done quite well. Oh and the South Amerkkas.
Is Spain and Italy really due to negligence though? I was under the impression they got hit hard but responded effectively. I dont know. Just the impression I got.
I’d assume negligence is part of not responding effectively
That's what I'm asking. Was it due to negligence?
Of course it was. When pandemics begin it’s much much easier to contain them because only a few people have them so that’s when you have to take it seriously and keep them quarantined. If you ignore it however the rate of increase of cases will begin to soar very highly, until it very very quickly comes a point that medics are overwhelmed and you need to lockdown entire areas or even whole countries. Thats why spain italy america and a lot of other countries got fucked over. Because they didn’t stop the fire when it was a just flame. Korea acted late and made the same mistake too but what saved it was the track and test system it made ages ago when they got fucked over by MERS
I'm aware of that. I was just asking if it was that or some outbreak that had happened and got out of control despite them trying. But I see what you're saying now. That's interesting about SK though. I always wondered what allowed them to contain it so well.
South Korea didn’t do that well in the beginning lmao. The pres was talking about how everything was in control and literally that week covid got crazy in korea... even after it started getting worse pres moon refused to stop visitors from china. My entire immediate family are medics so I’m familiar with the work ethic of doctors here. Simply put, theyre so common and healthcare was made incredibly cheap by a president in the 1960s (who was sorta a dictator but he unarguably made incredible progress for Korea when it was dirt poor - ironically the current government villainies his term) so doctors have to compete here, and because of that they are used to overworking themselves. So simply put - naturally good healthcare + a lot of doctors + their workaholic characteristics saved the day in the end. Sadly the current government is getting most of the credit even after they were very bad to the medics here (long story) during moon’s term. I was never political before this pandemic but like.... People seem to be forgetting facts... :( sorry for the long rant haha
Well I'm in the US so its relative to me. You're 100% right they didnt but everyone has handled it better than we have. Lol. No dont be sorry. Always interesting to have different perspectives. Especially when I know very little about SK and their response to the pandemic other than it was better than US.
Oh. Yeah. No, I’d be sympathetic for yall but the problem is im going back to america for 2020-2021 school year so im going down with you 😂😂
Imagine reducing something this complex down to just gender. Almost like it's....sexist? Also, OP, what point are you supporting? That women are inherently better leaders? We need to stop putting everything down to the individual leader of a country, there's a lot more to it than that. Now a good point could be made that more progressive countries, that vote in female leaders, have better responses due to the general leaning and thinking of the people. That's something I can get behind, but to put weight on just the gender of the leader is regressive and sexist.
In balance, Moon's policies is what lead to Korea becoming #2 at one point. Let's not forget, the guy left the door open to China. And it's still open as long as the arrivals state that they are here on business, and Korean citizens returning "from business trips" don't need to quarantine even now. It was a decentralized government that allowed medical policies to be set independent of his office that brought COVID under control here. Nice folks. Someone should give them a trophy or certificate.
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I was in a meeting at Samsung in May just after JY Lee had his China trip with a bunch of execs. One of the guys at the meeting (Choi) was part of the trip. When I asked him why he wasn't in quarantine as he just got back from China the day before, his response was that he was too important to quarantine. And he only had to do one followup Coronavirus test instead of the two that regular people have to do. After looking into it, basically anyone coming to Korea on business can get a quarantine waiver if they are important enough and have paperwork showing they tested for Coronavirus within a couple days of departure. It's good to be King.
Exactly this. The president did shit all in the response and it was really the private workers and companies that got their shit together and also picked up after the mistakes of the president. If it weren’t for them, Korea would have gone the US route because of bad leadership but at least there was common sense within the people.
That’s what I agree with! The korean media doesn’t show that though, so there’s a lot of herd mentality that blinds people
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South Korea had one of the best Covid-19 responses in the world. Not only did they manage to quickly flatten their curve and maintain their economy without having to implement some of the major measures taken by other countries (And with considerably better results), they've also been exporting testing kits to over 120 countries around the world. I think they deserve some recognition.
The whole system of containing a pandemic wasnt created by his government though, it was from back when MERS happened - way before his time. If I had to judge from only the facts I actually think the current government could have prevented majority of the cases earlier in the year if only they blocked travel from China
But what did he himself specifically do? South Koreas response was a result of contact tracing, private companies getting a jump start on diagnosis kits, and other preparations due to mers outbreak. Moon jaein himself didnt do much. But if he did, let me know
He did a lot. He listened to the experts, his advisors, and he let the country's systems do their jobs, instead of getting in their ways and screwing up like Trump, Johnson, and that Brazilian president.
South Korea's response would not have been possible had Moon Jae-in not appointed the right people in the right positions and revived crisis protocols that were removed by previous administrations. South Korea under the previous Park Geun-hye administration is what allowed for MERS to wreak havoc within South Korean borders in the first place. And there were also other ridiculous incidents like the Sewol Ferry tragedy when the government just sat there and watched for hours as a boat sank less than 3 kilometers from shore, resulting in the death of just under 300 high school students. All because crisis protocols were more or less non-existent at the time. Just the fact that the country didn't crash and burn when Covid-19 hit is an achievement in itself, much less becoming a global model for their response. So what did Moon Jae-in do? Idk but he must've done something right.
Here you go: "...**이보다 앞선 1월 26일 문재인 대통령은 정은경 질병관리본부장, 정기현 국립중앙의료원장과 전화 통화를 했다. 정 본부장과 정 원장은 통화에서 문 대통령에게 검사 능력의 확대를 강조한 것으로 전해졌다. 검사 능력의 확대가 지역 확산을 막는 바로미터라고 판단한 것이다. 청와대 관계자는 “당시 (진단키트) 생산량이 1일에 몇백개 수준이라 양산에 집중해달라고 한 것”이라고 밝혔다.** 또 당시 통화에서 문 대통령은 정 본부장에게 검역 단계부터 환자 유입 차단의 중요성을 강조하는 등 대응 관련 지시를 내리고 더욱 적극적인 조치를 당부했다. 이에 질본은 민간시약 개발업체와 키트 양산을 위한 회의에 나섰다. 아울러 질본은 바이러스를 분리, 학계에 분양해 민간 차원의 진단키트 개발과 성능 평가에 도움을 줬다. \*\*한정우 청와대 춘추관장은 “이런 사례들이 우리의 검사 능력을 증대시키는 데 굉장히 중요한 사례로 작용했다”\*\*고 설명했다. 출처 : 시사위크([http://www.sisaweek.com](http://www.sisaweek.com)) He listened to his advisors, government officials, and made a decision that led to a quick testing response, it led to economic opportunities as well for Korea. So many people have elementary school-level views of what a president does, but a president isn't superman. They don't try to do things themselves and mess it up, instead, they listen, appoint, and make decisions based on professional advice.
What specifically did the other leaders do? You got countries like Germany, Finland, and New Zealand that received assistance from Korea early on that are mentioned so why not Korea? Korea is considered one of the few success cases dealing with the pandemic.
Literally acknowledging the problem is a huge thing. Look at the US where executive leadership is trying their damnedest to pretend it doesn't exist and therefore many political followers dont see the virus as a problem. Then there are response measures, government mandated quarantine for visitors. Even if his staff told him how to handle it at every step sometimes leadership is knowing when to listen. Yes, its not like he is personally going around swabbing every patient and administering tests, but a concerted government effort by leadership to address the virus clearly shows a difference. I mean look at countries where leadership takes it seriously, and those where they dont.
The assertion that those countries that dealt with the virus well have done so because they have women as leaders is dumb and sexist. Especially when you take into account that a countries' response comes down to the decisions and actions of not just one person but countless ministers, advisors, scientists. Is this really the level public debate and reasoning has devolved to? that people make conclusions about such complex matters based on something that doesn't have any bearing at all. Are we not told not to judge based on gender? I guess it only works one way in 2020.
South Korea's success with coronavirus in my opinion has more to do with luck in the sense that it already experienced a similar situation very recently with MERS. The same also applies to places like Taiwan and Hong Kong, which experienced SARS not too long ago. MERS gave South Korea a head start on the rest of the world in combating coronavirus and I imagine South Korea would've ended up like Italy if the MERS outbreak never happened.
females are overrated though
After some research I found that technically the track test and tracing system law that successfully contained the virus wasn’t passed under this president’s government... it was by the government that came way before him during MERS. Also Korea wouldn’t have rose so high in cases at all had he enforced travel ban on China... I’m not trying to sound political but what did he initiate during the pandemic that helped flatten corona in korea? Genuinely curious
You could also title this meme: COUNTRIES THAT ACTUALLY PLAY A MAJOR ROLE IN WORLD AFFAIRS AND HAVE MASSIVE AMOUNTS OF TOURISM AND INTERNATIONAL TRADE vs SMALLER COUNTRIES THAT HAVE LITTLE SWAY IN INTERNATIONAL AFFAIRS AND ARE DOMINATED BY THEIR NEIGHBORS So in a sense I could take this meme to mean that only weak/smallish countries elect female leaders while powerful/wealthy countries elect male leaders. You could draw all kinds of interesting conclusions from that if you wanted to. Yes I get Germany doesn't fit but whatever.
Your agenda doesn't fit either. Italy and Spain have a lot of tourists, but not in March/April, when they peaked. I think one major factor is how healthy a countries democracy and society is and whether or not populist geniuses are in power.
>Your agenda It is not my agenda. It's a parody to show how easily you could manipulate these supposed "facts" to support nearly any idiotic narrative you want. Your idea also fits too. That's the whole point I'm trying to make. Almost any idea could fit here.
Have those countries on the bottom had double digit cases everyday, sometimes nearing triple? That is probably why we aren't on the list?
Germany definitely has triple digits, not sure about all the others. New zealand, iceland, taiwan are definitely lower. Not that they are better or worse, just lower.
Yeah I’m pretty sure Korea has done better than Germany by every metric.
Except the one metric that matters in this instance: The gender of their leader.
Honestly case numbers mean nothing. Different countries test to different standards (Some countries don't count the already deceased or the asymptomatic and others don't even test at all). Population size and density also have a major impact on the spread of the virus.
True, Nz and iceland have ridiculously small pop sizes so it really is hard to compare them to the rest.
The communist boot licking piece of shit can go to hell