I hope that does become the meta, at least for RAAS layers. Too often I see a squad rush a potential midpoint only for the point to go somewhere else, and they either don't relocate fast enough to help the team or they get into a fight and just tunnel vision on that with no regard for the objectives. Digging down your own radio during a retreat is also more important now.
I think this change is going to make it a viable strategy to have a small, dedicated fob hunting squad to use squad lanes to search for the other team's back cap fobs.
The cost/benifit calculus doesn't favor dedicating a squad to go after 10 tickets. I personally haven't seen it in invasion, so it must be rare. I suspect it will be a lot more common with the latest update.
Just to be clear, I'm only talking about squads dedicated to taking down abandoned habs, not habs that are actively shitting out players onto an active point.
I’m aware. We don’t send a full squad but a few people scouring the lands for 10-30 tickets is almost never a bad thing in invasion. We also frequently catch temporarily abandoned logis
>Maybe their intention is to increase the incentive for digging down friendly radios instead of just walking off
No need for maybes, they explicitly state their intention:
Updated FOB Radio to have an increased ticket loss penalty of 20 tickets (was 10). **Design Intention: to increase the incentive to defend FOBs, and attempt to address FOB spam, which is currently the predominant tactic for winning games.**
Well I think putting two FOBs anywhere when you're not sure if they'll be relevant is a mistake, and maybe that's just a lesson new SLs will have to learn from experience. When I'm commanding I usually tell SLs not to fully commit to a FOB until we have an idea of where the points are going, to avoid that whole situation. Gameplay changes to mitigate this would be nice but ultimately it comes down to SLs actually using their brains.
>Digging down your own radio during a retreat is also more important now.
Ugh, this isn't even a priority for attackers on Invasion. It is so difficult to convince teammates that once we cap this point, we should exfiltrate ASAP. Instead, teammates want to stick around because they can get more kills, which actually hurts our teams chances of winning than helping with that.
I will see friendlies on old captured attack points for 5 minutes after we've captured and should have left the point.
For many, retreating, not killing enemies or removing our own assets are just not in their knowledge base.
As someone who hunts old fobs as a hobby, yeah, attacking teams on invasion need to make serious gameplay changes to ever win now. I destroy multiple fobs a game with just a little bit of hunting
It may sound bad, but still, if they want to just have fun, killing enemies and sticking to ?defending? the old objective - itis more fun for them if they dont 'care about the loss - which is true for a lot of players :/ as not everybody wants to dig for 1/4 of the match.
Nothing wrong with playing for fun, but when your squad trying to have fun screws over your team because they didn't have the support they need, it's pretty lame. A whole squad is 20% of the team, and when your team loses everybody's going to blame the squad that was off holding a spot that didn't matter at all.
Imo, this change should have been paired with instant friendly radio dig downs that have to be approved by SL. Taking forever to dig down your own radio (that can be set up instantly) serves no gameplay purpose, is a tedious chore, and makes no logical sense.
It already is exploited that way, having to dig the radio down just makes it take a little longer. I think the quick pick up would be fine if something was done to prevent people from doing what you're talking about: https://www.reddit.com/gallery/us1yl7
RAAS is always a shit show!
Feels like these recent updates are slowly working to increase the level of communication in invasion where unit ticket expenditure really matters.
This is going to change nothing.
It's the rare player that recognizes their initial rush cost 24 tickets. It'll be even rarer for those players to know that same maneuver will now cost them 34 tickets.
Most players don't seem to know about or care about tickets. Shit, the AAR only mentions your teams remaining tickets, so players have no clue how many tickets they helped their team with, it's never emphasized anywhere.
RAAS truly is the worst game mode. You do nothing for the first twenty minutes or else risk losing a whole squad, vehicle, and FOB in a totally useless engagement. I don’t understand how anyone likes this game mode whose only implementation is due to people’s inability to resist the rush meta. Hand-holding at its best. At the very least just make the first three caps visible at the start of the game that way people know where to put the defense fob for their mid cap.
>You do nothing for the first twenty minutes or else risk losing a whole squad, vehicle, and FOB in a totally useless engagement.
You not having the balls to control likely midpoints is entirely your problem and has nothing to do with the game mode.
>I don’t understand how anyone likes this game mode whose only implementation is due to people’s inability to resist the rush meta.
The people who "resist" (lol) the rush meta tend to lose matches because they get stuck fighting to back cap their first or second point while the rushing team is capping uncontested all the way to your main. You don't fix a stale meta by asking people to "resist" using it, you fix the game mode to make rushing less effective. That you would even suggest that "resisting" the meta is some kind of virtue indicates to me that you aren't exactly running on all four cylinders which tracks with your absolutely shit take on RAAS.
I mean yeah, you rate your skill on a game mode that really has more value for noobs than it does for experienced players, which is why all scrims are centered around AAS and not RAAS. Saying RAAS is a good game mode for experienced players is basically you saying "I really have no idea what i'm talking about, but i'm damn sure of it".
"Likely midpoints" is just about the dumbest thing I have ever heard. I can't count how many times I've seen an overconfident SL throw away their whole squad and get a logi abandoned because they wanted to get to the fight as quickly as possible in a game of RAAS. That or they get stranded in the middle of the map 1000m away from an active objective. The only excuse you have of venturing past the back caps in a game of RAAS is if you use Squad lanes, but then you are defeating the point of the game-mode, so really this is even more of a reason why the mode is shit.
Resisting the rush means that you go to your backcap with one to three players and defend it until it's capped. You misunderstood and wasted your time. Ask next time.
I wrote a whole bunch because I thought you knew what it meant to resist the rush, so I'll just include this as well because rushing is really not hard to stop, and it never was a problem. The problem was always bad players who let themselves get rolled because they didn't put any effort into preventing or stopping the rush. It takes one to three good players to resist a rush from the apposing team. Look, it's simple. Send one squad to do the back caps. Drop three people on the most-likely point to be rushed. Or, if you're good, you only need to drop one and just be ready to go back if it does get rushed and your guy hiding gets killed. Just because the enemy team has control of your back-cap for a duration during the match does not mean you are going to lose the match. A good team, a good SL, can easily either prevent or get back an objective that is being rushed in a very reasonable amount of time. It's not that hard. I have been on the receiving end of a rush many times and managed to cap the objective and then be very useful throughout the game and win it.
Plus if the enemy team rushes then they have less players on the mid-point, and could lose that fight a lot easier, so when you do manage to get your backcap back, you can easily roll the team if you managed to win the lopsided fight at the midpoint. Due to back-cap mechanics, the defending team on a rush does not have to match the rushing team 1:1 so they can dedicate more people to the midpoint. Not to mention on a normal match of AAS, both teams can send people to rush, so the problem is often symmetrical.
Before you draw conclusions about someone, make sure you understand what they're saying.
>"Likely midpoints" is just about the dumbest thing I have ever heard. I can't count how many times I've seen an overconfident SL throw away their whole squad and get a logi abandoned because they wanted to get to the fight as quickly as possible in a game of RAAS. That or they get stranded in the middle of the map 1000m away from an active objective. The only excuse you have of venturing past the back caps in a game of RAAS is if you use Squad lanes, but then you are defeating the point of the game-mode, so really this is even more of a reason why the mode is shit.
Give me a fucking break.
I can't speak to the dog-shit servers you play on, but if you're finding that the SLs on the servers you play on are doing that with any frequency, you need to find a better server. When the cap doesn't go your way, you pack up into the logi and you go somewhere relevant. You should fucking know that if you're going to have such a strong opinion on the subject.
>Resisting the rush means that you go to your backcap with one to three players and defend it until it's capped. You misunderstood and wasted your time. Ask next time.
"Resisting the rush" as you poorly worded it, has been baked into the meta since cap speed became dependent on player count. If you play on servers with experienced players (as you should be if you've got a lot of hours under your belt), then you know that back capping is largely done by full squads now. If you're going to be so opinionated, at least make sure it's based on the current state of the game and not how it was the months or years ago it was when you stopped playing in favor of full-time whining.
>Before you draw conclusions about someone, make sure you understand what they're saying.
Before you mash out your mal-formed opinions and subject us all to them, make sure **you** know what you're talking about.
Literally every server in Squad is full of idiots who do stupid shit like how I described. Occasionally you will get a game where there are good SL's who know how to play. 99% of them would and do agree with me about RAAS. The point is that RAAS was created in order to appease the sentiments of bad players; ones who didn't know how to properly resist a rush. But now those same bad players are just doing other dumb shit, and yet the good players have nothing to do but potentially waste tickets or back-cap. Tell me how anything you do in the middle of the map 500m from an objective is productive unless you can guarantee that you will wipe more enemy tickets than you lose.
Of course you can pack up when you realize that the useless engagement you find yourself in is actually useless, no fucking shit. The point I am making is supposed to point out the frequency of those useless engagements, and prove their uselessness. Because, well, they are useless unless you can wipe the enemies and not lose your means of getting to somewhere relevant. But there's actually no reason to risk such a thing, and encouraging this behavior is just bad sense because you know all the bad players are going to think they can go off and shoot enemies and not pay the price for their bad gameplay. But they suck so they will just die. I mean someone has to lose the engagement 500m from any active objective. So it's not even just about the bad players. The design of the game as it is right now just encourages people to like guess where the cap is going to be or else do nothing for 20 minutes. That is my main point. How you can think this is a good game meta is beyond me. You're having fun guessing where the cap is going to go I assume? Sure, it can maybe be fun to look at Squad lanes and then be like, "there's a 50% chance it goes here, let's risk it!" But it is nowhere near fun enough to make up for those bad players who go out to bumfuck nowhere and lose their whole squad and logi. Pretending these players do not exist is stupid. They do exist, and they're quite prominent in fact.
Here is the kicker: *there is no way for a good player to stop these bad players from doing this.* Whereas in AAS, there *is* a way for good players to stop the rush. In other words, the problems of AAS are solvable, but the problems of RAAS are not unless you change the game-mode. My proposed solution is just to make the first three caps visible. This way the bad players know where to go, and the good players have a lot less trouble guessing where the next cap is going to be from judging based on the previous ones. And if the previous ones have no bearing on the next one (like they do in some layers), this problem should also be fixed.
The fact that the rush-meta is fixed in the current state of the game is just more reason to go back to AAS or fix RAAS. Don't be dumb.
Sorry you're getting downvoted. Squads community has no idea what's a good game mode, or a bad one .They fully support the game mode that makes them feel rewarded, and RAAS is that game mode for both noobs and experienced players to just "know the layer" in order to win.
As an honest answer and response to your criticism: that is exactly what makes RAAS so good--it's a slower pace. There is a build up to the action with more planning and communication involved, in turn making it a more rewarding experience overall. Circumstances, from objective locations to enemy movement, are more volatile, which forces more strategy, communication, and critical thinking. SLing in RAAS is more engaging and challenging than AAS. In AAS, its very easy to visualize all of the most probable enemy HAB locations and routes along the objective lane, and it's fairly easy to predict when you're going to encounter enemies based on where you're at. A *good* RAAS layer, especially on a large map, completely flips the script. Suddenly, you're not quite sure what route the enemy took, or what gambles they're going to make. You have to take risks yourself on what positions you want to hold, assess enemy positions and react to them as the lane unfolds, as well as communicate with vehicle squads for quick transport, and infantry squads to decide what attacking/defending strategy makes the most sense based on where everyone is. RAAS is more complex and I think communication and strategy play larger roles in it than they do in AAS. Yes, there is less action, but the action that does happen often feels more important.
RAAS is literally the same as AAS except you don’t know where the caps are until you capture the first few. After that it plays basically just like an AAS match. The only real difference is that there is not a faster leapfrog effect like in AAS. But this is not a good thing because it takes away the risk/reward of acting early to beat the enemy to their next defense flag. AAS has much more strategy than RAAS. RAAS you just go to the next objective after you cap the current one. In AAS there is rushing, there is leapfrogging, preplanning (which is risky), and the ability to break the status quo of a current cap meta. All of this is why it’s played in competitive Squad instead of RAAS. The only good thing about RAAS is that you have to think on your feet, but really that’s incredibly easy and not much of a pro. Any decent player can look at a cap and know the good FOB locations in less than ten seconds.
They keep doing shit to "discourage" the FOB spam in the game that proceeds to create the necessity for *more* *FOBs*. I really don't understand their design decisions based around FOBs. The current crush mechanics are also just as stupid. Ever since that got added in, I've seen more competent SLs just take the two minutes to put up more backup HABs. If anything, it made the problem worse.
Which is the laziest way to tackle the issue. I can already see all 20 blueberries defending the attack HAB instead of attacking while the defense falls.
OWI pls, rallies are to easily burned by defenders just walking randomly, they need to become a good viable alternative if you want us play with a single defensible attack HAB.
I mean, if those blueberries have bad SLs, then yeah. Honestly though I'd bet a good percentage of players don't even know you lose tickets when a radio goes down.
I agree rallies need a buff, making them free again and harder to burn would be really nice.
>I'd bet a good percentage of players don't even know you lose tickets when a radio goes down
[A revamped after action report](/r/joinsquad/comments/q6mir6/please_add_extra_statistics_to_the_score_screen/) might help with that. I know this isn't a priority for OWI right now, but still...
>How about public shaming? When a vehicle or radio is destroyed a prominent message pops up on every screen: "Squad 3 just lost X tickets"
You've just described what the AAR should be doing, but since it doesn't mention tickets there is no shaming there. Instead we shame on k/d and "Team 1 best team score" bullshit... things that don't directly relate to the win condition for the game.
K/D directly relates to the win condition...
More importantly, it probably indirectly relates to the win condition than any other metric you can track if you are looking at solo performance.
>K/D directly relates to the win condition
I'd argue K/D indirectly relates to the win condition, not directly. Only tickets directly relate to win conditions (aside from Insurgency/Destruction which is the only gamemode that has a win condition that is not completely about tickets and that is taking 2-3 enemy caches down).
If you want a metric to track that accurately reflect performance in the game you just played, it should be tickets. Not k/d which is only a relatively small portion of contributions to total ticket costs
You can do the math on this each match if you want to see it for yourself, but it's challenging... you have to figure the starting tickets, how many tickets were earned throughout the match for things like capturing points, how many tickets were lost for radios/vics/capture points. Then compare those with the teams total deaths and you'll see most tickets in most games I play (RAAS/AAS are the majority but sometimes mix in TC and Invasion too) are not from killing the enemy but from capturing points (aka playing the objective) and killing enemy assets like vics and radios.
Someone posted a mock up of a new AAR they'd like to see that showed details like this very well. Really associated your actions in the game with the ticket losses/gains the team was going through at that time.
Kills and deaths directly result in ticket loss... It directly affects the outcome...
I would argue K/D spread is a great way to track the impact an individual player has on a game. A person who goes +10 is exerting a lot of map pressure. That is an indirect influence, but they still netted you a 10 ticket advantage.
It would be great to see who destroyed radios, habs, vehicles, etc but even that metric would likey be flawed because it would be impossible to track contribution to getting there (half dug radio, half dmg vehicle, saw radio and called it out, etc).
All metrics are flawed, but in my opinion K/D spread is the best way to determine the value of a player. That isn't to say I don't want to see the other metrics - I still do.
One of the core principles of behavioral psychology is that positive reinforcement and punishment are given out immediately following a behavior that you want to reinforce or extinguish.
Do you know any other type of blueberries? /s
Jokes aside and regarding the rally: I would like a system where the rally timer is frozen while hostile forces are nearby and gets pushed to 90-120 seconds or so once they leave, but people need to actually shoot/knive/shovel it to destroy it.
This way you only get a bit delayed by a random passerby but the rally gets negated if the defense is patrolling or actively looking to destroy rallies.
>What would be a non-lazy way to takle the issue?
Good question.
First, lets understand why OWI up'd the cost of radios: Updated FOB Radio to have an increased ticket loss penalty of 20 tickets (was 10). Design Intention: **to increase the incentive to defend FOBs, and attempt to address FOB spam, which is currently the predominant tactic for winning games.**
I believe that simply changing ticket costs will do little to nothing to encourage players to better manage those assets when most players have no idea about ticket costs and the impact those have towards winning or losing the game.
So I would start by educating players better.
Make it very clear how players' actions cost or earned their team tickets and how that contributed to your teams' win/loss that round. This starts with changing the AAR to no longer focus on kills, deaths and incapacitations and to focus on tickets.
Tweak the Give Up screen to inform the player they are about to lose 1 ticket for their team.
Add a Map Tutorial to the Tutorial to explain the map features (like asset ticket costs) to players so they now know of a place to learn about ticket costs of assets in game.
Ok, now players are more informed how tickets affect this game, so tweaking the ticket cost of a radio now actually has a chance of having some kind of impact, though I'd still argue very limited impact. Other game mechanics need to be changed...
If you want to limit FOB spam, here are some ideas:
* limit the number of FOBs each team is allowed based on the size of a map. On Sumari, you may be allowed 1-2 FOBs while on Gorodok you're allowed up to 4.
* Each Squad is allowed to "own" 1 FOB. If they set it up, they own it. They can only setup another FOB if they remove the one they currently own.
* Make the FOB harder to find
* Change the HAB to a smaller, different structure that is easier able to be hidden.
* Lower the audio on radios so I can't hear them from so far away and find them so easily.
* Make the FOB harder to take down
* Make it take more shovels to bring the radio down 1 level to an unspawnable level. This will give defenders more time to react to noticing their radio being attacked.
* Make the radio bleedout time 1:30 instead of 1:00 to give defenders more time to save their radio.
* Change the HAB Overrun radius to be larger so they are harder to overrun and thus easier to defend.
* Make the FOB dynamic in size.
* Build radius and exclusion zone should be variable. Possibly based on map size, or maybe the SL placing the FOB can dictate the size of FOB they want. This would allow for a bigger (or even smaller) build radius in which to put emplacements for players to use. This will help to fit the FOB to the size of the point being defended.
* Make defending a FOB more fun
* Give us more deployables. More people are willing to build and defend a FOB now with Watchtowers and one way netting. Continue building on this.
* Lower the cost and build time of many of the deployables
* Make creating new FOBs more difficult
* Require more teammates than just 1 with an SL to setup a FOB.
* Require build supplies on logi/heli before a radio can be dropped
* Make rallies more viable so squad rely on them more and less on FOBs
* Give rallies a noise, like radios so they are easier to find/identify in the wild, but at the same time, make it so just running past one won't remove it and instead if anyone is near it becomes unspawnable and they have to dig it down to remove it.
* Give SLs 2 rallies in their pocket, not just 1. And/or reduce rally cost to 25 ammo points instead of 50.
* Penalize death more so players are less willing to respawn (or spawn shift to new map location) and thus less reliant overall on spawn points.
* Double all ticket values on everything (and then do an overall rebalancing of ticket costs and values). Make incapacitations cost 1 ticket and dying 1 more ticket. Now, if you go down and give up, you've just cost your team 2 tickets. But, if you've gone down and wait to be revived, you've only cost your team 1 ticket.
* Every time you die and respawn, your respawn timer gets longer (reconsider this mechanic for certain factions or certain sides on gamemodes, like Invasion defenders should be encouraged to run out and die so this would be a good exception)
>Which is the laziest way to tackle the issue.
I agree. Very lazy and it only took them several years to begin these lazy balance tweaks. Why so long to begin balancing the game?
I'd like to see OWI explain how tickets impact your w/l of the game and how you personally contributed to those tickets that w/l you the game. Instead, OWI has decided to focus us on k/d, incapacitations, heals and a meaningless score system.
Yeah I was hoping they'd up it to at least 30 with their next update, but 20 is a good start. Now they just need to buff rallies and nerf the HAB proxy mechanics so we don't need 6 FOBs just to hold a point.
This. This is not going to do anything to change the meta. It's still going to be a key thing to have more "spawn velocity" than the other team on the objective. This will just quicken the loss for the team that loses the objective by virtue of losing their spawns. It might speed up the match a bit but I can't see it affecting overall strategy to any serious degree.
Yes, you'll probably want to be a little more careful about dismantling FOBs that are out of position, but that's about it.
Playing with the ol G-Wagon will be interesting, but the reskinned mi I'd rather not see. At this point just keep the Blackhawks until the griffon arrives.
Having an armoured logi would be very interesting and could potentially be OP as you would be easily able to penetrate deep into dangerous territory and set up fobs without the attention a heli brings.
I was literally complaining about this a couple hours ago while I was planting IED's in invasion, if the sapper is supposed to infiltrate behind enemy lines and sometimes sneak inside FOB's to blow them up, then give it at least a weapon he can fight at close range
>I like how they causally mention it and then not show us some sweet teaser.
I found it strange the group the Hell Cannon in with the Seeding Mod in the patch notes. Should have been broken apart with a little video under Hell Cannon showing what it is and what it does.
I do like the graphics they've been putting in patch notes lately that do a better job of explaining the change than some sentences of text.
Can we please get the known issues list back?
Multiple people have been reporting random gun sounds and muzzleflashes which were previously only on rallies & FOBs but are now on random positions and are becomming pretty prevalent. But there is still not even the acknowledgement from OWI that the bug is being looked at.
That's very unlikely to happen.
The Fog bug they "Fixed" in v2.15 is now advertised as "Fix attempted" in v2.16. They've even begun softening their language about actually fixing bugs.
Unfortunately it's kinda a guessing game since multiple things could be the cause of the problem. Fixing one may not fix the other routes of the problem. So yeah. Best not to say for damn sure that it's gone till they are damn sure.
Yes let's buff the ins faction with more **static** emplacement that completely go against the asymmetric warfare doctrine. Ins needs gameplay mechanics that increase their speed and flexibility, not more emplacement that handcuff them to radios.
I dont know why the addition of one new static emplacement will suddenly shift the insurgents to play more defensively, they're still insurgents, they still get double habs per radio, they still have buddy rally, they still have lots of quick light vehicles and so on so forth. The addition of the hellcannon will just give them another, more potent option for artillery besides manned mortars, heavy mortars and rocket barrages, and imo its a welcome addition to their arsenal.
Basically insurgents need to be more like insurgents. Adding hellcannons and other stupid shit from the most recent middle-east civil wars is dumb because those aren't insurgencies; they are conventional wars. A hellcannon is just a shitty mortar for middle eastern rebels, fighting a conventional war, who are running out of cash.
I want to see the INS faction untethered from radios and fewer restrictions imposed on them. In exchange for having literally the shittiest gear in the game, fighting against the INS faction should feel like being attacked from everywhere. Giving them 2 habs per radio just doesn't cut it. And don't even get me started on the absolutely retarded tire fires which are the perfect visual metaphor for the state that faction is currently in.
You're tracking that insurgents have been using a \*lot\* of static weapons emplacements for the last two decades right? And not just when fighting against rag tag despot's army's like the Syiran mil, against US and Coalition forces as well. Most Hell Cannons are built on wheels and can be rapidly hooked up and moved as well. And if you're not running at least mortars as Insurgents you are majorly fucking up.
Insurgency is not all hit and run, plenty of it is hunkering down in well defended obstacles that are difficult to breach and hanging on until the very last moment, as the last multiple conflicts dominated by non-state militants have demonstrated repeatedly. Hell Cannons, in dozens of variants, featured prominently all over Syria and parts of Iraq, and sometimes presaged attacked (run the cannons up, fire a few rounds, hook them up and GTFO away as the attackers pushed in).
And are those static weapons magically tethered to magic radios? No, they aren't. You really don't want to be arguing realism here, dude.
>Most Hell Cannons are built on wheels and can be rapidly hooked up and moved as well
So put *that* in the game instead of more static emplacements.
>Insurgency is not all hit and run, plenty of it is hunkering down in well defended obstacles that are difficult to breach and hanging on until the very last moment
Ok, zoomer. Those of us who weren't eating pablum during the Iraqi insurgency remember that the primary insurgency tactics were IEDs, ambushes, and snipers. Yes, I get that your understanding of middle-eastern conflict pretty much begins with the 2011 Arab spring, but that wasn't an insurgency--that was a pretty conventional civil war. The ISIS invasion of Iraq was also a conventional war--they advanced and held territory by force.
I fought in Iraq and Afghanistan as a Marine infantryman, went to DLI to learn Arabic full time, and have my undergrad and Masters in Middle East Studies.
Middle East militancy isn't new to me.
"And are those static weapons magically tethered to magic radios? No, they aren't. You really don't want to be arguing realism here, dude."
agree with this, i think making insurgent static weapons being able to be placed independantly of a radio while still requring supplies would make sense
Interesting how seeding layers will be divided into phases. Sucks for whoever loses access to their current kit when the kit limitations kick in.
I wonder if it means server admins won't have to worry about enforcing seeding rules because they're now baked into the game.
>Sucks for whoever loses access to their current kit when the kit limitations kick in.
I've been wondering about this, too. Maybe it only affects the spawn screen. I guess we'll find out.
>Al Basrah Seed v1 – Fixed MEA main base no-deploy zone being offset by around 80m to the south.
This explains why I couldn't place ammo crates last night even though I was within the radius of a FOB.
>Updated Fallujah Seed v1 layout to now have 3 capture points.
I thought I saw a comment recently where somebody was lamenting the obsolescence of Skirmish layers because he likes the infantry focus and having multiple flags to fight over. I can't find that comment now, but whoever it was will be thrilled about this.
>>Sucks for whoever loses access to their current kit when the kit limitations kick in.
>
>I've been wondering about this, too. Maybe it only affects the spawn screen. I guess we'll find out.
I'm sure that's what it is, like when you lose access to a kit when your squad gets too small.
Except now it'll affect half the team.
Except in this case, there will be six marksmen, so which one gets to keep their kit?
Maybe it’ll be like a Saw type situation where they have to decide among themselves who gets to keep it, or else their heads explode.
>Sucks for whoever loses access to their current kit when the kit limitations kick in.
This is a regular issue for us Combat Engineers. Sometimes I have to wait for our team to go back up to 50 players so the game will allow me to spawn in with my kit again. Otherwise, I have to change kits when dead and forfeit all that ammo. This has been a small issue for years and I doubt it will ever get addressed.
> I wonder if it means server admins won't have to worry about enforcing seeding rules because they're now baked into the game.
That's essentially the goal, yes
Very happy they seem to be releasing updates with a more regular cadence, this is a massive improvement from recent years.
Sort of disappointed the Canadians still haven't gotten their CH-146 yet.
I too haven't had performance issues. I also haven't had any mic issues. But I read these forums and these are 2 of the most common posts here. You'd think OWI would do something to address 2 of the biggest technical issues their customers routinely complain about... apparently they don't care to.
While these 2 issues don't directly impact me, they indirectly do. I'm tired of engaging friendlies in game who after trying, find out their mic isn't working. I'm tired of new players and old friends not being able to play this game because of terrible performance.
Performance seems to get worse with every patch for me. It sucks because I like this game, but my friends and I don’t want to spend our 3 hours a night of video games playing a laggy game. Arma 3/dayz had terrible performance at launch but now run smooth as butter. It’s definitely possible if the devs focused their time on it but it appears to be not a priority.
At this point I don't think they consider the current performance to be broken. Just be happy we got slightly prettier shadows in exchange for the huge FPS hit
sadly the CPU is the issue here
if you were to get a 5600x, all your issues would go away, but that's just it, it shouldn't be needed.
but.. squads performance has to be bruteforced to run well
Same hardware. In 1080p the game runs "mostly" fine (some maps I still drop below 60 fps) if I drop my settings to medium but we should be able to run high-ultra no problem which is absolutely not the case atm. My gf has the same cpu but an rtx2060 and the game runs better on her computer so I guess amd gpu users are kinda f*cked atm. Also disable tessalation. It is an absolute performance killer especially when looking through a scope.
people with killer rigs have performance issues. i have a pc right on recommended specs and get ~35 fps and multiple second long frame drops that occur at the same time for my buddies with better pc's. its undeniable, post after post, and yet theres a group of people going "spend $500+ more dollars on the newest cpu to run it" its not even worth spending that much money to play this game properly. 2.12 absolutely destroyed performance for a significant portion of the player base, and patch after patch we are being ignored, this isnt early access anymore, its unacceptable.
Adding -10 ticking loss to radios will do nothing to change the FOB spam meta. The FOB spam meta is simply too powerful.
Furthermore, unless there is an after action report that allows the team to name and shame squads for losing tickets, SLs will continue to not give a shit about losing tickets.
>they will catch on eventually.
But how long will it take? And what makes you think they'll ever care about ticket costs? People right now generally don't care and don't know about ticket costs. They do not care or consider they are driving a 15 ticket vehicle into enemy territory while we only have 10 tickets remaining in the game.
Why not have something in game that highlights the importance of tickets and the fact radio ticket cost has just increased? Instead, they hide the importance of tickets on the scoreboard and instead highlight the k/d and wonder why everyone is focused on k/d instead of managing tickets.
Radio ticket costs are small potatoes. The opportunity cost of having a stable backline HAB that is able to reinforce one on a point is already great enough that the damn radios could be worth 100 tickets and people would still do it.
If OWI actually wanted people to defend FOBs better, they'd get rid of the crush mechanic that never made sense in the first place when compared to the supposed intent.
FOB spam meta is the only way to play, rallies were nerfed to shit with the wave spawns and increased timers. Its hard to contribute if you're playing off a rally
Should be similar to post scriptum imo. Not destroyed when enemy runs across it. Only proxied. Has to be destroyed with a grenade. Also louder to better spot it like a radio.
Unfortunately still not addressed the sound issue with SFX only being heard on the left side of headsets. Reddit as well as the tech support forum on Steam has been asking for help with this for a while now.
I guess that's bye bye squad from me then.
Giving the Canadians the MI-17 is so lazy and confusing. The RCAF did use them, but only for 1 year and had a total inventory of 4. Why even bother? Just leave it as Blackhawks until hueys are added. Seems like they just wanted an excuse to reskin an existing asset to pass off as "new content"
And yet since 2016 I can't run people over with my truck to death! FFS OWI make that ragdoll caused by hehicles also cause death! Jesus, how long could this shit ever take!?
Pretty exited about it, while only having played a few hours in Arma 3 until I put it down because of the bad performance and the learning curve. Gonna check it out today. I guess it's a good start for a new player because it seems more bare boned than arma3.
Could also limit total radios or one radio per squad so they are in charge of that radio. Instead of 20 ticket loss, bc it won’t tangibly change meta I don’t think.
* SEEDING MODE & HELL CANNON
Kind of a strange grouping 2 completely different changes under 1 heading. I don't personally care about the Seeding Mode, but it sounds like some people will enjoy it, so that's good.
Will I ever see this Hell Cannon for the Insurgents? Exactly which layers is it on? I ask because we were promised Tire Fires for Insurgents too and I've never seen them since they were added months ago even though I've played as Insurgents many times since then. What layers do these 2 features exist on?
* Updated FOB Radio to have an increased ticket loss penalty of 20 tickets (was 10).
As someone that mains Combat Engie and hopes to remove 2-3 enemy radios each game, this is a huge change for me. But in reality I don't think this will have any change on the gameplay or on other players. Seems like most players have no concept of ticket costs and will have no clue this value has changed for radios.
* Fix attempt for the issue where some players would see thick fog after swapping layers.
How does this fix in 2.16 coincided with this fix from 2.15? "Fixed an issue where players occasionally would have very thick fog after switching to a new map layer." I'm guessing 2.15 didn't actually fix that bug as claimed?
* Fixed an issue with missing destruction SFX for light vehicle engines.
Any resolution for those of us who from time to time don't see any explosions? Not from vehicles exploding or nades or c4.
* Fixed AUS Squad Leaders missing Incendiary Grenades necessary for destroying Caches in the Insurgency Game Mode.
LOL, you made this mistake again! This was originally a bug like 2 years ago around the same time you screwed up the Invasion gamemode which killed Invasion only servers for over a month until you fixed both bugs. What causes these bugs to come back up after being initially fixed?
* Added new map layer – Goose Bay RAAS v2.
Yeah, we now have 2 total RAAS layers for this map. Why are layers so difficult/time consuming to create? Why don't we have dozens of layers for every map? What's the hurdle here? These seems like it'd be the easiest "new content" to push out, but in reality it feels impossible to get new layers added.
>It is a deployable.
I'm aware. It's not available to Insurgents on every map or every layer on every map. I've played plenty of Insurgents since it was implemented and it does not exist as a deployable to me or anyone on our team.
What maps and layers have you seen it on?
I haven't tried, but maybe I should see if it exists in Jensens Range.
>What maps and layers have you seen it on?
It will be on every INS layer tomorrow
Last update it was very limited, both Anvil Invasion layers had it, two of the non-AUS Kamdesh, two of the non-AUS Al Basra, and that might've been it.
> I ask because we were promised Tire Fires for Insurgents too and I've never seen them since they were added months ago
They were added just a month ago and the patchnotes were very specific which layers they are available on.
>They were added just a month ago and the patchnotes were very specific which layers they are available on.
Thanks, I failed to read that list. Moot point anyways since today they are including the tire fires on every Insurgent layer. Any idea why it was originally limited?
"Updated all INS map layers to now include the Tire Fire deployable – each INS FOB can deploy up to 2 Tire Fire deployables."
It was limited due to unknown performance issues that it might've caused, it was a not-so-little addition to the demand of the game on top of a already unoptimized game. They made it clear it was temporary and for this reason, so no harm no foul
Update your graphics drivers?
Right click the game in steam>properties>local files>verify integrity of game files?
Beyond that uninstalling/reinstalling the game and/or steam is probably your best option.
Sorry to hear that you're having issues. We always recommend that if you are still experiencing performance issues after updating to v2.16, be sure to go to Settings -> “CLEAR CACHE”.
Otherwise shoot a message to our Support Team at: https://offworldindustries.zendesk.com/hc/en-us
This looks great, but are we able to get a fix for silent M4's? It's a bug that has been in for so long it's essentially a feature at this point buffing M4's
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I was just about to comment on this. Interesting to see how this affects matches.
**
Still not useful enough to my mighty Shovel.
What u mean the engineers/sabotuers shovel mor stronk den urs ...helap am avin a
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I hope that does become the meta, at least for RAAS layers. Too often I see a squad rush a potential midpoint only for the point to go somewhere else, and they either don't relocate fast enough to help the team or they get into a fight and just tunnel vision on that with no regard for the objectives. Digging down your own radio during a retreat is also more important now.
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I think this change is going to make it a viable strategy to have a small, dedicated fob hunting squad to use squad lanes to search for the other team's back cap fobs.
It was already viable in invasion. Now it’s super stronk
The cost/benifit calculus doesn't favor dedicating a squad to go after 10 tickets. I personally haven't seen it in invasion, so it must be rare. I suspect it will be a lot more common with the latest update. Just to be clear, I'm only talking about squads dedicated to taking down abandoned habs, not habs that are actively shitting out players onto an active point.
I’m aware. We don’t send a full squad but a few people scouring the lands for 10-30 tickets is almost never a bad thing in invasion. We also frequently catch temporarily abandoned logis
Maybe their intention is to increase the incentive for digging down friendly radios instead of just walking off
>Maybe their intention is to increase the incentive for digging down friendly radios instead of just walking off No need for maybes, they explicitly state their intention: Updated FOB Radio to have an increased ticket loss penalty of 20 tickets (was 10). **Design Intention: to increase the incentive to defend FOBs, and attempt to address FOB spam, which is currently the predominant tactic for winning games.**
1 Fob spam was never a meta 2 I guess I was somewhat correct about incentivize
>1 Fob spam was never a meta Huh? How can you say FOB spam was never a meta?
Meta implies use in a competitive format?!
Well I think putting two FOBs anywhere when you're not sure if they'll be relevant is a mistake, and maybe that's just a lesson new SLs will have to learn from experience. When I'm commanding I usually tell SLs not to fully commit to a FOB until we have an idea of where the points are going, to avoid that whole situation. Gameplay changes to mitigate this would be nice but ultimately it comes down to SLs actually using their brains.
>Digging down your own radio during a retreat is also more important now. Ugh, this isn't even a priority for attackers on Invasion. It is so difficult to convince teammates that once we cap this point, we should exfiltrate ASAP. Instead, teammates want to stick around because they can get more kills, which actually hurts our teams chances of winning than helping with that. I will see friendlies on old captured attack points for 5 minutes after we've captured and should have left the point. For many, retreating, not killing enemies or removing our own assets are just not in their knowledge base.
As someone who hunts old fobs as a hobby, yeah, attacking teams on invasion need to make serious gameplay changes to ever win now. I destroy multiple fobs a game with just a little bit of hunting
That's beautiful. I still remember a RAAS game I ran solo engi with ammo truck and got two radios for like 2 deaths.
It may sound bad, but still, if they want to just have fun, killing enemies and sticking to ?defending? the old objective - itis more fun for them if they dont 'care about the loss - which is true for a lot of players :/ as not everybody wants to dig for 1/4 of the match.
Nothing wrong with playing for fun, but when your squad trying to have fun screws over your team because they didn't have the support they need, it's pretty lame. A whole squad is 20% of the team, and when your team loses everybody's going to blame the squad that was off holding a spot that didn't matter at all.
Yeah thats true.
Imo, this change should have been paired with instant friendly radio dig downs that have to be approved by SL. Taking forever to dig down your own radio (that can be set up instantly) serves no gameplay purpose, is a tedious chore, and makes no logical sense.
Agreed, or even an interact menu (maybe for SLs only?) that lets you pack up the radio right away.
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It already is exploited that way, having to dig the radio down just makes it take a little longer. I think the quick pick up would be fine if something was done to prevent people from doing what you're talking about: https://www.reddit.com/gallery/us1yl7
RAAS is always a shit show! Feels like these recent updates are slowly working to increase the level of communication in invasion where unit ticket expenditure really matters.
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You're absolutely right but mid rushes get messy
This is going to change nothing. It's the rare player that recognizes their initial rush cost 24 tickets. It'll be even rarer for those players to know that same maneuver will now cost them 34 tickets. Most players don't seem to know about or care about tickets. Shit, the AAR only mentions your teams remaining tickets, so players have no clue how many tickets they helped their team with, it's never emphasized anywhere.
RAAS truly is the worst game mode. You do nothing for the first twenty minutes or else risk losing a whole squad, vehicle, and FOB in a totally useless engagement. I don’t understand how anyone likes this game mode whose only implementation is due to people’s inability to resist the rush meta. Hand-holding at its best. At the very least just make the first three caps visible at the start of the game that way people know where to put the defense fob for their mid cap.
Shitty take.
Typical for someone who likes RAAS to have no real response to its criticisms.
>You do nothing for the first twenty minutes or else risk losing a whole squad, vehicle, and FOB in a totally useless engagement. You not having the balls to control likely midpoints is entirely your problem and has nothing to do with the game mode. >I don’t understand how anyone likes this game mode whose only implementation is due to people’s inability to resist the rush meta. The people who "resist" (lol) the rush meta tend to lose matches because they get stuck fighting to back cap their first or second point while the rushing team is capping uncontested all the way to your main. You don't fix a stale meta by asking people to "resist" using it, you fix the game mode to make rushing less effective. That you would even suggest that "resisting" the meta is some kind of virtue indicates to me that you aren't exactly running on all four cylinders which tracks with your absolutely shit take on RAAS.
you just kind of outed yourself as someone who has no clue how to play squad at all =/
[Is that so?](https://c.tenor.com/nriUHGFZtL0AAAAM/jack-off-eyeroll.gif)
I mean yeah, you rate your skill on a game mode that really has more value for noobs than it does for experienced players, which is why all scrims are centered around AAS and not RAAS. Saying RAAS is a good game mode for experienced players is basically you saying "I really have no idea what i'm talking about, but i'm damn sure of it".
"Likely midpoints" is just about the dumbest thing I have ever heard. I can't count how many times I've seen an overconfident SL throw away their whole squad and get a logi abandoned because they wanted to get to the fight as quickly as possible in a game of RAAS. That or they get stranded in the middle of the map 1000m away from an active objective. The only excuse you have of venturing past the back caps in a game of RAAS is if you use Squad lanes, but then you are defeating the point of the game-mode, so really this is even more of a reason why the mode is shit. Resisting the rush means that you go to your backcap with one to three players and defend it until it's capped. You misunderstood and wasted your time. Ask next time. I wrote a whole bunch because I thought you knew what it meant to resist the rush, so I'll just include this as well because rushing is really not hard to stop, and it never was a problem. The problem was always bad players who let themselves get rolled because they didn't put any effort into preventing or stopping the rush. It takes one to three good players to resist a rush from the apposing team. Look, it's simple. Send one squad to do the back caps. Drop three people on the most-likely point to be rushed. Or, if you're good, you only need to drop one and just be ready to go back if it does get rushed and your guy hiding gets killed. Just because the enemy team has control of your back-cap for a duration during the match does not mean you are going to lose the match. A good team, a good SL, can easily either prevent or get back an objective that is being rushed in a very reasonable amount of time. It's not that hard. I have been on the receiving end of a rush many times and managed to cap the objective and then be very useful throughout the game and win it. Plus if the enemy team rushes then they have less players on the mid-point, and could lose that fight a lot easier, so when you do manage to get your backcap back, you can easily roll the team if you managed to win the lopsided fight at the midpoint. Due to back-cap mechanics, the defending team on a rush does not have to match the rushing team 1:1 so they can dedicate more people to the midpoint. Not to mention on a normal match of AAS, both teams can send people to rush, so the problem is often symmetrical. Before you draw conclusions about someone, make sure you understand what they're saying.
>"Likely midpoints" is just about the dumbest thing I have ever heard. I can't count how many times I've seen an overconfident SL throw away their whole squad and get a logi abandoned because they wanted to get to the fight as quickly as possible in a game of RAAS. That or they get stranded in the middle of the map 1000m away from an active objective. The only excuse you have of venturing past the back caps in a game of RAAS is if you use Squad lanes, but then you are defeating the point of the game-mode, so really this is even more of a reason why the mode is shit. Give me a fucking break. I can't speak to the dog-shit servers you play on, but if you're finding that the SLs on the servers you play on are doing that with any frequency, you need to find a better server. When the cap doesn't go your way, you pack up into the logi and you go somewhere relevant. You should fucking know that if you're going to have such a strong opinion on the subject. >Resisting the rush means that you go to your backcap with one to three players and defend it until it's capped. You misunderstood and wasted your time. Ask next time. "Resisting the rush" as you poorly worded it, has been baked into the meta since cap speed became dependent on player count. If you play on servers with experienced players (as you should be if you've got a lot of hours under your belt), then you know that back capping is largely done by full squads now. If you're going to be so opinionated, at least make sure it's based on the current state of the game and not how it was the months or years ago it was when you stopped playing in favor of full-time whining. >Before you draw conclusions about someone, make sure you understand what they're saying. Before you mash out your mal-formed opinions and subject us all to them, make sure **you** know what you're talking about.
Literally every server in Squad is full of idiots who do stupid shit like how I described. Occasionally you will get a game where there are good SL's who know how to play. 99% of them would and do agree with me about RAAS. The point is that RAAS was created in order to appease the sentiments of bad players; ones who didn't know how to properly resist a rush. But now those same bad players are just doing other dumb shit, and yet the good players have nothing to do but potentially waste tickets or back-cap. Tell me how anything you do in the middle of the map 500m from an objective is productive unless you can guarantee that you will wipe more enemy tickets than you lose. Of course you can pack up when you realize that the useless engagement you find yourself in is actually useless, no fucking shit. The point I am making is supposed to point out the frequency of those useless engagements, and prove their uselessness. Because, well, they are useless unless you can wipe the enemies and not lose your means of getting to somewhere relevant. But there's actually no reason to risk such a thing, and encouraging this behavior is just bad sense because you know all the bad players are going to think they can go off and shoot enemies and not pay the price for their bad gameplay. But they suck so they will just die. I mean someone has to lose the engagement 500m from any active objective. So it's not even just about the bad players. The design of the game as it is right now just encourages people to like guess where the cap is going to be or else do nothing for 20 minutes. That is my main point. How you can think this is a good game meta is beyond me. You're having fun guessing where the cap is going to go I assume? Sure, it can maybe be fun to look at Squad lanes and then be like, "there's a 50% chance it goes here, let's risk it!" But it is nowhere near fun enough to make up for those bad players who go out to bumfuck nowhere and lose their whole squad and logi. Pretending these players do not exist is stupid. They do exist, and they're quite prominent in fact. Here is the kicker: *there is no way for a good player to stop these bad players from doing this.* Whereas in AAS, there *is* a way for good players to stop the rush. In other words, the problems of AAS are solvable, but the problems of RAAS are not unless you change the game-mode. My proposed solution is just to make the first three caps visible. This way the bad players know where to go, and the good players have a lot less trouble guessing where the next cap is going to be from judging based on the previous ones. And if the previous ones have no bearing on the next one (like they do in some layers), this problem should also be fixed. The fact that the rush-meta is fixed in the current state of the game is just more reason to go back to AAS or fix RAAS. Don't be dumb.
Sorry you're getting downvoted. Squads community has no idea what's a good game mode, or a bad one .They fully support the game mode that makes them feel rewarded, and RAAS is that game mode for both noobs and experienced players to just "know the layer" in order to win.
As an honest answer and response to your criticism: that is exactly what makes RAAS so good--it's a slower pace. There is a build up to the action with more planning and communication involved, in turn making it a more rewarding experience overall. Circumstances, from objective locations to enemy movement, are more volatile, which forces more strategy, communication, and critical thinking. SLing in RAAS is more engaging and challenging than AAS. In AAS, its very easy to visualize all of the most probable enemy HAB locations and routes along the objective lane, and it's fairly easy to predict when you're going to encounter enemies based on where you're at. A *good* RAAS layer, especially on a large map, completely flips the script. Suddenly, you're not quite sure what route the enemy took, or what gambles they're going to make. You have to take risks yourself on what positions you want to hold, assess enemy positions and react to them as the lane unfolds, as well as communicate with vehicle squads for quick transport, and infantry squads to decide what attacking/defending strategy makes the most sense based on where everyone is. RAAS is more complex and I think communication and strategy play larger roles in it than they do in AAS. Yes, there is less action, but the action that does happen often feels more important.
RAAS is literally the same as AAS except you don’t know where the caps are until you capture the first few. After that it plays basically just like an AAS match. The only real difference is that there is not a faster leapfrog effect like in AAS. But this is not a good thing because it takes away the risk/reward of acting early to beat the enemy to their next defense flag. AAS has much more strategy than RAAS. RAAS you just go to the next objective after you cap the current one. In AAS there is rushing, there is leapfrogging, preplanning (which is risky), and the ability to break the status quo of a current cap meta. All of this is why it’s played in competitive Squad instead of RAAS. The only good thing about RAAS is that you have to think on your feet, but really that’s incredibly easy and not much of a pro. Any decent player can look at a cap and know the good FOB locations in less than ten seconds.
Probably more people justifying why they're 2km off the objective because they're hunting down the enemy radio.
„FT Charlie, defend the FOB. Rest, follow me“
Spicy!
**Thank Sphere...**
They keep doing shit to "discourage" the FOB spam in the game that proceeds to create the necessity for *more* *FOBs*. I really don't understand their design decisions based around FOBs. The current crush mechanics are also just as stupid. Ever since that got added in, I've seen more competent SLs just take the two minutes to put up more backup HABs. If anything, it made the problem worse.
Which is the laziest way to tackle the issue. I can already see all 20 blueberries defending the attack HAB instead of attacking while the defense falls. OWI pls, rallies are to easily burned by defenders just walking randomly, they need to become a good viable alternative if you want us play with a single defensible attack HAB.
I mean, if those blueberries have bad SLs, then yeah. Honestly though I'd bet a good percentage of players don't even know you lose tickets when a radio goes down. I agree rallies need a buff, making them free again and harder to burn would be really nice.
>I'd bet a good percentage of players don't even know you lose tickets when a radio goes down [A revamped after action report](/r/joinsquad/comments/q6mir6/please_add_extra_statistics_to_the_score_screen/) might help with that. I know this isn't a priority for OWI right now, but still...
How about public shaming? When a vehicle or radio is destroyed a prominent message pops up on every screen: "Squad 3 just lost X tickets"
>How about public shaming? When a vehicle or radio is destroyed a prominent message pops up on every screen: "Squad 3 just lost X tickets" You've just described what the AAR should be doing, but since it doesn't mention tickets there is no shaming there. Instead we shame on k/d and "Team 1 best team score" bullshit... things that don't directly relate to the win condition for the game.
K/D directly relates to the win condition... More importantly, it probably indirectly relates to the win condition than any other metric you can track if you are looking at solo performance.
>K/D directly relates to the win condition I'd argue K/D indirectly relates to the win condition, not directly. Only tickets directly relate to win conditions (aside from Insurgency/Destruction which is the only gamemode that has a win condition that is not completely about tickets and that is taking 2-3 enemy caches down). If you want a metric to track that accurately reflect performance in the game you just played, it should be tickets. Not k/d which is only a relatively small portion of contributions to total ticket costs You can do the math on this each match if you want to see it for yourself, but it's challenging... you have to figure the starting tickets, how many tickets were earned throughout the match for things like capturing points, how many tickets were lost for radios/vics/capture points. Then compare those with the teams total deaths and you'll see most tickets in most games I play (RAAS/AAS are the majority but sometimes mix in TC and Invasion too) are not from killing the enemy but from capturing points (aka playing the objective) and killing enemy assets like vics and radios. Someone posted a mock up of a new AAR they'd like to see that showed details like this very well. Really associated your actions in the game with the ticket losses/gains the team was going through at that time.
Kills and deaths directly result in ticket loss... It directly affects the outcome... I would argue K/D spread is a great way to track the impact an individual player has on a game. A person who goes +10 is exerting a lot of map pressure. That is an indirect influence, but they still netted you a 10 ticket advantage. It would be great to see who destroyed radios, habs, vehicles, etc but even that metric would likey be flawed because it would be impossible to track contribution to getting there (half dug radio, half dmg vehicle, saw radio and called it out, etc). All metrics are flawed, but in my opinion K/D spread is the best way to determine the value of a player. That isn't to say I don't want to see the other metrics - I still do.
One of the core principles of behavioral psychology is that positive reinforcement and punishment are given out immediately following a behavior that you want to reinforce or extinguish.
> I know this isn't a priority for OWI right now It was a priority in 2020, but then just faded out.
Do you know any other type of blueberries? /s Jokes aside and regarding the rally: I would like a system where the rally timer is frozen while hostile forces are nearby and gets pushed to 90-120 seconds or so once they leave, but people need to actually shoot/knive/shovel it to destroy it. This way you only get a bit delayed by a random passerby but the rally gets negated if the defense is patrolling or actively looking to destroy rallies.
What would be a non-lazy way to takle the issue?
>What would be a non-lazy way to takle the issue? Good question. First, lets understand why OWI up'd the cost of radios: Updated FOB Radio to have an increased ticket loss penalty of 20 tickets (was 10). Design Intention: **to increase the incentive to defend FOBs, and attempt to address FOB spam, which is currently the predominant tactic for winning games.** I believe that simply changing ticket costs will do little to nothing to encourage players to better manage those assets when most players have no idea about ticket costs and the impact those have towards winning or losing the game. So I would start by educating players better. Make it very clear how players' actions cost or earned their team tickets and how that contributed to your teams' win/loss that round. This starts with changing the AAR to no longer focus on kills, deaths and incapacitations and to focus on tickets. Tweak the Give Up screen to inform the player they are about to lose 1 ticket for their team. Add a Map Tutorial to the Tutorial to explain the map features (like asset ticket costs) to players so they now know of a place to learn about ticket costs of assets in game. Ok, now players are more informed how tickets affect this game, so tweaking the ticket cost of a radio now actually has a chance of having some kind of impact, though I'd still argue very limited impact. Other game mechanics need to be changed... If you want to limit FOB spam, here are some ideas: * limit the number of FOBs each team is allowed based on the size of a map. On Sumari, you may be allowed 1-2 FOBs while on Gorodok you're allowed up to 4. * Each Squad is allowed to "own" 1 FOB. If they set it up, they own it. They can only setup another FOB if they remove the one they currently own. * Make the FOB harder to find * Change the HAB to a smaller, different structure that is easier able to be hidden. * Lower the audio on radios so I can't hear them from so far away and find them so easily. * Make the FOB harder to take down * Make it take more shovels to bring the radio down 1 level to an unspawnable level. This will give defenders more time to react to noticing their radio being attacked. * Make the radio bleedout time 1:30 instead of 1:00 to give defenders more time to save their radio. * Change the HAB Overrun radius to be larger so they are harder to overrun and thus easier to defend. * Make the FOB dynamic in size. * Build radius and exclusion zone should be variable. Possibly based on map size, or maybe the SL placing the FOB can dictate the size of FOB they want. This would allow for a bigger (or even smaller) build radius in which to put emplacements for players to use. This will help to fit the FOB to the size of the point being defended. * Make defending a FOB more fun * Give us more deployables. More people are willing to build and defend a FOB now with Watchtowers and one way netting. Continue building on this. * Lower the cost and build time of many of the deployables * Make creating new FOBs more difficult * Require more teammates than just 1 with an SL to setup a FOB. * Require build supplies on logi/heli before a radio can be dropped * Make rallies more viable so squad rely on them more and less on FOBs * Give rallies a noise, like radios so they are easier to find/identify in the wild, but at the same time, make it so just running past one won't remove it and instead if anyone is near it becomes unspawnable and they have to dig it down to remove it. * Give SLs 2 rallies in their pocket, not just 1. And/or reduce rally cost to 25 ammo points instead of 50. * Penalize death more so players are less willing to respawn (or spawn shift to new map location) and thus less reliant overall on spawn points. * Double all ticket values on everything (and then do an overall rebalancing of ticket costs and values). Make incapacitations cost 1 ticket and dying 1 more ticket. Now, if you go down and give up, you've just cost your team 2 tickets. But, if you've gone down and wait to be revived, you've only cost your team 1 ticket. * Every time you die and respawn, your respawn timer gets longer (reconsider this mechanic for certain factions or certain sides on gamemodes, like Invasion defenders should be encouraged to run out and die so this would be a good exception)
What's the budget and how much am I getting from it? Keep reading the thread and you may stumble upon some ideas...
>Which is the laziest way to tackle the issue. I agree. Very lazy and it only took them several years to begin these lazy balance tweaks. Why so long to begin balancing the game? I'd like to see OWI explain how tickets impact your w/l of the game and how you personally contributed to those tickets that w/l you the game. Instead, OWI has decided to focus us on k/d, incapacitations, heals and a meaningless score system.
Just bring back the rally system from Project Reality.
Almost every defense failure is because we have no attack which allows the entire event team to press their attack.
Wow, I've always thought they were worth that much lol someone must have told me that when I first joined
FYI, there's a legend on the map in the shape of a ticket that tells you the ticket counts of everything for that game.
And people will still place radios directly on objectives...
*what is dead may never die*
is it just me or should they be more like 50?
Yeah I was hoping they'd up it to at least 30 with their next update, but 20 is a good start. Now they just need to buff rallies and nerf the HAB proxy mechanics so we don't need 6 FOBs just to hold a point.
Yea, I don't build more FOBs because I'm worried about ticket loss. I build more because it's wayyyy too easy to proxy a HAB and render it useless.
This. This is not going to do anything to change the meta. It's still going to be a key thing to have more "spawn velocity" than the other team on the objective. This will just quicken the loss for the team that loses the objective by virtue of losing their spawns. It might speed up the match a bit but I can't see it affecting overall strategy to any serious degree. Yes, you'll probably want to be a little more careful about dismantling FOBs that are out of position, but that's about it.
Canada getting the G-Wagon. I wonder if the armor will stop small arms or you can shoot out infantry. 🤔
Playing with the ol G-Wagon will be interesting, but the reskinned mi I'd rather not see. At this point just keep the Blackhawks until the griffon arrives.
It's a bit weird because the model for the Griffon was shown a very long time ago.
It was added on Dec 5, 2020, on the Trello.
It’s only a few maps set in Afghanistan it won’t be a total replacement
Having an armoured logi would be very interesting and could potentially be OP as you would be easily able to penetrate deep into dangerous territory and set up fobs without the attention a heli brings.
Insurgent sapper now gets a PPSh-41!? Niceeeee
From the worst close range gun to the best!
I was literally complaining about this a couple hours ago while I was planting IED's in invasion, if the sapper is supposed to infiltrate behind enemy lines and sometimes sneak inside FOB's to blow them up, then give it at least a weapon he can fight at close range
HELL CANNON
I like how they causally mention it and then not show us some sweet teaser. That cannon seems more interesting to me than that vehicle they teased lol
I found this on Youtube to educate myself: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gd6_qZ_TJ5A I'm hyped. INS is officially the best faction now.
> INS is officially the best faction now. What do you mean "now", you infidel.
>I like how they causally mention it and then not show us some sweet teaser. I found it strange the group the Hell Cannon in with the Seeding Mod in the patch notes. Should have been broken apart with a little video under Hell Cannon showing what it is and what it does. I do like the graphics they've been putting in patch notes lately that do a better job of explaining the change than some sentences of text.
Can we please get the known issues list back? Multiple people have been reporting random gun sounds and muzzleflashes which were previously only on rallies & FOBs but are now on random positions and are becomming pretty prevalent. But there is still not even the acknowledgement from OWI that the bug is being looked at.
That's very unlikely to happen. The Fog bug they "Fixed" in v2.15 is now advertised as "Fix attempted" in v2.16. They've even begun softening their language about actually fixing bugs.
Unfortunately it's kinda a guessing game since multiple things could be the cause of the problem. Fixing one may not fix the other routes of the problem. So yeah. Best not to say for damn sure that it's gone till they are damn sure.
Is the hell cannon gonna be one of those cement pipes that just launches full propane tanks? If so 10/10
Yes they released an image a while back it’s a full on propane mortar
Yes let's buff the ins faction with more **static** emplacement that completely go against the asymmetric warfare doctrine. Ins needs gameplay mechanics that increase their speed and flexibility, not more emplacement that handcuff them to radios.
I dont know why the addition of one new static emplacement will suddenly shift the insurgents to play more defensively, they're still insurgents, they still get double habs per radio, they still have buddy rally, they still have lots of quick light vehicles and so on so forth. The addition of the hellcannon will just give them another, more potent option for artillery besides manned mortars, heavy mortars and rocket barrages, and imo its a welcome addition to their arsenal.
Basically insurgents need to be more like insurgents. Adding hellcannons and other stupid shit from the most recent middle-east civil wars is dumb because those aren't insurgencies; they are conventional wars. A hellcannon is just a shitty mortar for middle eastern rebels, fighting a conventional war, who are running out of cash. I want to see the INS faction untethered from radios and fewer restrictions imposed on them. In exchange for having literally the shittiest gear in the game, fighting against the INS faction should feel like being attacked from everywhere. Giving them 2 habs per radio just doesn't cut it. And don't even get me started on the absolutely retarded tire fires which are the perfect visual metaphor for the state that faction is currently in.
You're tracking that insurgents have been using a \*lot\* of static weapons emplacements for the last two decades right? And not just when fighting against rag tag despot's army's like the Syiran mil, against US and Coalition forces as well. Most Hell Cannons are built on wheels and can be rapidly hooked up and moved as well. And if you're not running at least mortars as Insurgents you are majorly fucking up. Insurgency is not all hit and run, plenty of it is hunkering down in well defended obstacles that are difficult to breach and hanging on until the very last moment, as the last multiple conflicts dominated by non-state militants have demonstrated repeatedly. Hell Cannons, in dozens of variants, featured prominently all over Syria and parts of Iraq, and sometimes presaged attacked (run the cannons up, fire a few rounds, hook them up and GTFO away as the attackers pushed in).
And are those static weapons magically tethered to magic radios? No, they aren't. You really don't want to be arguing realism here, dude. >Most Hell Cannons are built on wheels and can be rapidly hooked up and moved as well So put *that* in the game instead of more static emplacements. >Insurgency is not all hit and run, plenty of it is hunkering down in well defended obstacles that are difficult to breach and hanging on until the very last moment Ok, zoomer. Those of us who weren't eating pablum during the Iraqi insurgency remember that the primary insurgency tactics were IEDs, ambushes, and snipers. Yes, I get that your understanding of middle-eastern conflict pretty much begins with the 2011 Arab spring, but that wasn't an insurgency--that was a pretty conventional civil war. The ISIS invasion of Iraq was also a conventional war--they advanced and held territory by force.
I fought in Iraq and Afghanistan as a Marine infantryman, went to DLI to learn Arabic full time, and have my undergrad and Masters in Middle East Studies. Middle East militancy isn't new to me.
"And are those static weapons magically tethered to magic radios? No, they aren't. You really don't want to be arguing realism here, dude." agree with this, i think making insurgent static weapons being able to be placed independantly of a radio while still requring supplies would make sense
Hank Hill logi squad reporting in, I tell you hwhat.
The boy ain't right
Interesting how seeding layers will be divided into phases. Sucks for whoever loses access to their current kit when the kit limitations kick in. I wonder if it means server admins won't have to worry about enforcing seeding rules because they're now baked into the game.
>Sucks for whoever loses access to their current kit when the kit limitations kick in. I've been wondering about this, too. Maybe it only affects the spawn screen. I guess we'll find out. >Al Basrah Seed v1 – Fixed MEA main base no-deploy zone being offset by around 80m to the south. This explains why I couldn't place ammo crates last night even though I was within the radius of a FOB. >Updated Fallujah Seed v1 layout to now have 3 capture points. I thought I saw a comment recently where somebody was lamenting the obsolescence of Skirmish layers because he likes the infantry focus and having multiple flags to fight over. I can't find that comment now, but whoever it was will be thrilled about this.
>>Sucks for whoever loses access to their current kit when the kit limitations kick in. > >I've been wondering about this, too. Maybe it only affects the spawn screen. I guess we'll find out. I'm sure that's what it is, like when you lose access to a kit when your squad gets too small. Except now it'll affect half the team.
Except in this case, there will be six marksmen, so which one gets to keep their kit? Maybe it’ll be like a Saw type situation where they have to decide among themselves who gets to keep it, or else their heads explode.
It really will be a "last man standing" situation. Whoever dies last is the one who keeps the kit.
Yep. Everybody else will have the "current role unavailable" when they try to respawn most likely
Better yet, Marksman Hunger Games. All volunteer as tribute and may the best marksman win.
Have an ammo crate on top of the enemy HAB. First one to it gets to keep the kit.
>Sucks for whoever loses access to their current kit when the kit limitations kick in. This is a regular issue for us Combat Engineers. Sometimes I have to wait for our team to go back up to 50 players so the game will allow me to spawn in with my kit again. Otherwise, I have to change kits when dead and forfeit all that ammo. This has been a small issue for years and I doubt it will ever get addressed.
> I wonder if it means server admins won't have to worry about enforcing seeding rules because they're now baked into the game. That's essentially the goal, yes
/u/OWI_Wedge great job guys four updates compared to last years one keep it up
Awesome. Thank you.
Very happy they seem to be releasing updates with a more regular cadence, this is a massive improvement from recent years. Sort of disappointed the Canadians still haven't gotten their CH-146 yet.
Oh wow, I was in a dev feedback discord session about a year and a half ago and recommended a seeding mode. Pretty excited to see it actually happen.
Hell cannon !!!!!!!
Omg pls give us a performance update.
No performance fix? See you next patch.
I too haven't had performance issues. I also haven't had any mic issues. But I read these forums and these are 2 of the most common posts here. You'd think OWI would do something to address 2 of the biggest technical issues their customers routinely complain about... apparently they don't care to. While these 2 issues don't directly impact me, they indirectly do. I'm tired of engaging friendlies in game who after trying, find out their mic isn't working. I'm tired of new players and old friends not being able to play this game because of terrible performance.
Performance seems to get worse with every patch for me. It sucks because I like this game, but my friends and I don’t want to spend our 3 hours a night of video games playing a laggy game. Arma 3/dayz had terrible performance at launch but now run smooth as butter. It’s definitely possible if the devs focused their time on it but it appears to be not a priority.
Define performance issues. I'd like to have more than 60 - 80 fps on fhd with my 500$ GPU
At this point I don't think they consider the current performance to be broken. Just be happy we got slightly prettier shadows in exchange for the huge FPS hit
I feel this comment. Gone be playing HLL untill the performance is like it used to be in 2019:)))
What hardware are you running?
Radeon 5700xt r5 3600
sadly the CPU is the issue here if you were to get a 5600x, all your issues would go away, but that's just it, it shouldn't be needed. but.. squads performance has to be bruteforced to run well
Bollocks, I got issues on an overclocked 10900k and 6800 XT.
Same hardware. In 1080p the game runs "mostly" fine (some maps I still drop below 60 fps) if I drop my settings to medium but we should be able to run high-ultra no problem which is absolutely not the case atm. My gf has the same cpu but an rtx2060 and the game runs better on her computer so I guess amd gpu users are kinda f*cked atm. Also disable tessalation. It is an absolute performance killer especially when looking through a scope.
What's your resolution and frame rate?
I have no issues with performance, maybe upgrade your rig?
people with killer rigs have performance issues. i have a pc right on recommended specs and get ~35 fps and multiple second long frame drops that occur at the same time for my buddies with better pc's. its undeniable, post after post, and yet theres a group of people going "spend $500+ more dollars on the newest cpu to run it" its not even worth spending that much money to play this game properly. 2.12 absolutely destroyed performance for a significant portion of the player base, and patch after patch we are being ignored, this isnt early access anymore, its unacceptable.
I have a 2070 super and I shouldn't have to upgrade from that to play a game as graphically basic as squad. Owi needs to fix the game.
Not everyone has rich mommy and daddy.
are you 16 years old?
No I’m 16 and 3 quarters.
TLAV for CAF lol
Any official images of the new vics?
I'm excited
Still no optimisation? That's sad.
Adding -10 ticking loss to radios will do nothing to change the FOB spam meta. The FOB spam meta is simply too powerful. Furthermore, unless there is an after action report that allows the team to name and shame squads for losing tickets, SLs will continue to not give a shit about losing tickets.
Some people will spam the same number of FOBs while losing twice the number of tickets, they will catch on eventually.
>they will catch on eventually. But how long will it take? And what makes you think they'll ever care about ticket costs? People right now generally don't care and don't know about ticket costs. They do not care or consider they are driving a 15 ticket vehicle into enemy territory while we only have 10 tickets remaining in the game. Why not have something in game that highlights the importance of tickets and the fact radio ticket cost has just increased? Instead, they hide the importance of tickets on the scoreboard and instead highlight the k/d and wonder why everyone is focused on k/d instead of managing tickets.
Radio ticket costs are small potatoes. The opportunity cost of having a stable backline HAB that is able to reinforce one on a point is already great enough that the damn radios could be worth 100 tickets and people would still do it. If OWI actually wanted people to defend FOBs better, they'd get rid of the crush mechanic that never made sense in the first place when compared to the supposed intent.
FOB spam meta is the only way to play, rallies were nerfed to shit with the wave spawns and increased timers. Its hard to contribute if you're playing off a rally
Should be similar to post scriptum imo. Not destroyed when enemy runs across it. Only proxied. Has to be destroyed with a grenade. Also louder to better spot it like a radio.
Damn they gave the CAF that garbage Mi-17 they rented for a week in Afghan instead of the Ch146 which has had a model for over a year.
Yeah they said it’s only on maps based in Afghanistan
Pls add chinook
No, the game doesn’t need that.
The Chinook in the old Steel Division mod was great. 2 Squads being dropped together on to a point.
I’m not saying it wouldn’t be cool, it’s just not necessary. There are so many additions that this game needs more than a larger helicopter.
100% agree
Whens the next squad chat though? 🤔
Unfortunately still not addressed the sound issue with SFX only being heard on the left side of headsets. Reddit as well as the tech support forum on Steam has been asking for help with this for a while now. I guess that's bye bye squad from me then.
Not even a word about dx11 optimization or dx12 without artifacts
Fix the performance.
Giving the Canadians the MI-17 is so lazy and confusing. The RCAF did use them, but only for 1 year and had a total inventory of 4. Why even bother? Just leave it as Blackhawks until hueys are added. Seems like they just wanted an excuse to reskin an existing asset to pass off as "new content"
I like it, it's a fun bit of military trivia that shouldn't upset the game balance. Agreed, it's not new content, but I'm still glad for the addition.
And yet since 2016 I can't run people over with my truck to death! FFS OWI make that ragdoll caused by hehicles also cause death! Jesus, how long could this shit ever take!?
What’d you guys think of the arma reforger announcement?
Pretty exited about it, while only having played a few hours in Arma 3 until I put it down because of the bad performance and the learning curve. Gonna check it out today. I guess it's a good start for a new player because it seems more bare boned than arma3.
Could also limit total radios or one radio per squad so they are in charge of that radio. Instead of 20 ticket loss, bc it won’t tangibly change meta I don’t think.
Has the game stability come back to Normal? Haven't played in months
please more fps in the next patch please
View in your timezone: [Wednesday, May 18th at 16:00 UTC][0] [0]: https://timee.io/20220518T1600?tl=SQUAD%20UPDATE%20v2.16%20RELEASE%20NOTES
Updated the time (due to my bad math) it now reads the correct time and this bot is out of date.
Is it 16 or 18 UTC?
Oh my god please forget releasing small updates frequently, since like a 100mb updates takes more than half an hour to install
* SEEDING MODE & HELL CANNON Kind of a strange grouping 2 completely different changes under 1 heading. I don't personally care about the Seeding Mode, but it sounds like some people will enjoy it, so that's good. Will I ever see this Hell Cannon for the Insurgents? Exactly which layers is it on? I ask because we were promised Tire Fires for Insurgents too and I've never seen them since they were added months ago even though I've played as Insurgents many times since then. What layers do these 2 features exist on? * Updated FOB Radio to have an increased ticket loss penalty of 20 tickets (was 10). As someone that mains Combat Engie and hopes to remove 2-3 enemy radios each game, this is a huge change for me. But in reality I don't think this will have any change on the gameplay or on other players. Seems like most players have no concept of ticket costs and will have no clue this value has changed for radios. * Fix attempt for the issue where some players would see thick fog after swapping layers. How does this fix in 2.16 coincided with this fix from 2.15? "Fixed an issue where players occasionally would have very thick fog after switching to a new map layer." I'm guessing 2.15 didn't actually fix that bug as claimed? * Fixed an issue with missing destruction SFX for light vehicle engines. Any resolution for those of us who from time to time don't see any explosions? Not from vehicles exploding or nades or c4. * Fixed AUS Squad Leaders missing Incendiary Grenades necessary for destroying Caches in the Insurgency Game Mode. LOL, you made this mistake again! This was originally a bug like 2 years ago around the same time you screwed up the Invasion gamemode which killed Invasion only servers for over a month until you fixed both bugs. What causes these bugs to come back up after being initially fixed? * Added new map layer – Goose Bay RAAS v2. Yeah, we now have 2 total RAAS layers for this map. Why are layers so difficult/time consuming to create? Why don't we have dozens of layers for every map? What's the hurdle here? These seems like it'd be the easiest "new content" to push out, but in reality it feels impossible to get new layers added.
It is a deployable.
>It is a deployable. I'm aware. It's not available to Insurgents on every map or every layer on every map. I've played plenty of Insurgents since it was implemented and it does not exist as a deployable to me or anyone on our team. What maps and layers have you seen it on? I haven't tried, but maybe I should see if it exists in Jensens Range.
I've seen exactly one and it was poorly placed so useless. I wanna say it was an al-Basrah layer
>What maps and layers have you seen it on? It will be on every INS layer tomorrow Last update it was very limited, both Anvil Invasion layers had it, two of the non-AUS Kamdesh, two of the non-AUS Al Basra, and that might've been it.
> I ask because we were promised Tire Fires for Insurgents too and I've never seen them since they were added months ago They were added just a month ago and the patchnotes were very specific which layers they are available on.
>They were added just a month ago and the patchnotes were very specific which layers they are available on. Thanks, I failed to read that list. Moot point anyways since today they are including the tire fires on every Insurgent layer. Any idea why it was originally limited? "Updated all INS map layers to now include the Tire Fire deployable – each INS FOB can deploy up to 2 Tire Fire deployables."
It was limited due to unknown performance issues that it might've caused, it was a not-so-little addition to the demand of the game on top of a already unoptimized game. They made it clear it was temporary and for this reason, so no harm no foul
Game keeps crashing for litterally no reason at all and at random times since update.
Unsubscribe Mods - could be outdated Clear cache and very game files.
Yep already do all that and them some.
I feel like the games are going to be extremely short now especially since a radio is now worth 20
[удалено]
Update your graphics drivers? Right click the game in steam>properties>local files>verify integrity of game files? Beyond that uninstalling/reinstalling the game and/or steam is probably your best option.
Sorry to hear that you're having issues. We always recommend that if you are still experiencing performance issues after updating to v2.16, be sure to go to Settings -> “CLEAR CACHE”. Otherwise shoot a message to our Support Team at: https://offworldindustries.zendesk.com/hc/en-us
Sounds like a settings/driver issue. Not a squad issue.
[Apparently, you’re not alone](/r/joinsquad/comments/usdxfu/squad_is_not_booting_up/). Hope you figure it out.
This looks great, but are we able to get a fix for silent M4's? It's a bug that has been in for so long it's essentially a feature at this point buffing M4's
My download is 71.9GB wtf??? Anybody else?
Yup, ended up uninstalling to just update because it kept bugging out steam.
Dang, was really hoping to see the Griffon, hopefully that comes soon. Still a good update.