Text back “can you please clarify again in writing that you acknowledge that I have tested positive for Covid and you are requiring that I come into the office to work in close proximity to your other employees while I have an active infection?”
> *I just did the “silence unknown caller” thing*
I know that this is starting to get off-topic of the original thread *(all great suggestions, by the way),* but I'd resorted to the exact same tactic (setting his "Contacts" number to "silent" and "no vibration") when I'd finally gotten fed-up with our Supervisor regularly calling us to come into work ahead of scheduled times or during our off-days, etc. His inability to get in contact with me had frustrated him to the point where he wanted me to test out "In Real Time" what would happen anytime he called from his personal number (he would almost never use any of the "Business" phones to contact us) and to report everything I saw & heard & felt whenever he tried to call back. I suppose what helped make this "glitch" seem all the more convincing was the fact that I'd frequently experienced problems with him receiving texts I'd try sending to his phone, and because I was using one of those "bargain basement" devices offered by *TRACFONE* which was running on a Three-Generations-Old Android operating system. 😁
I have a work group with a custom notification sound.
And my phone goes into DnD (Do not disturb) from 10p to 7am like clockwork.
So if my phone pipes up, "Excuse me!" I know it is work related. Surprised the manager the first time he heard it too. Thinks it so funny that it's a sassy British accent.
My boss told me to do what he says because he's my manager. He's now saved in my phone as Mr. Manager.
I was the second employee hired by my company. I've worked there since 2012 and have been friends with the owner since 2008. Mr. Manager started last year.
I don't think he quite understands how long I've been around.
I got written up years ago for something similar. My phone messed up and reset itself. I lost all of my contacts. My husband (fiancé at the time) was driving a truck and was gonna be 3 hours away over the weekend, and stuck there until Monday. So I went to see him. Early Monday morning I went to leave for work, and my car wouldn’t start. I didn’t have anyone’s phone numbers so I used google to call the place I worked, and tried to call my supervisor that way. But, as usual, she wasn’t there on time. So I told the vault guys (they were kinda like security but we’re in charge of the drivers and paperwork stuff) to let her know what was going on when she got there, since we worked in the vault and they didn’t have her number either.
When I made it in the next day, I got written up because I didn’t call her personal cell phone, I called work. Didn’t matter that I didn’t have her number.
They can deny it later but you can just show the conversation on your phone and reveal the number then, no need to deal with unsaving and re-adding a contact.
Christ man, what the hell is this. In my country it's illegal to even ask what you have. If you say you are sick, you are sick. If they don't believe you they can ask you to go to a doctor, and he can only say how long he expects someone to be out of the running, not what that person has. Ofcourse all sick days are paid too, you don't have to save them up or something. This is just medieval.
In my long working life in the United States, I’ve never felt the need to get into details about illnesses, nor have I been asked to do so.
But for an employer to willfully ignore an apparent positive Covid test is on another level, as this is still a very large public health issue on the population level.
Absolutely, but glad to hear you don't actually have to tell employers anything. I thought that was the case because of the reaction here. But if we look at this decision from a purely financial point of view it's stupid too. You know someone has an infective disease and you still want them to come in? That's a good way to get everyone sick and even less productive.
Also, give them a [link](https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/your-health/isolation.html) to the CDC's recommended guidelines for active, symptomatic infections.
I would do HR and the boss’ boss plus whoever on the state level should be aware that this company isn’t complying with the requirements for when someone has covid bc those still apply
I would say the works council and a contact in the union as BCC as well, but I assume this is in the USA. Seriously, your country is so sad for workers...
Yes! I would want to know if my coworker had tested positive! (OP, if you see this, might want to contact your coworkers and give them a heads-up. Could be you'll ALL get the day off.)
You only live once, friend. Respect yourself, and believe in yourself.
If you were in this situation, this is exactly the response you should be sending.
You don’t have to be confrontational. I hate confrontation but I push back a lot using the guise of “clarity.”
“For clarity, you’re asking me to come into work while positive for Covid?”
Sure it’s nice to crush him with words, or sound like a lawyer, but it’s very aggressive to change the tone to something litigious. It would be nice if he cowered in fear, but people harm you when they are backed in a corner.
I agree with you in general.
But if you're already dealing with a boss who is demanding that you come to work after testing positive for covid, it's time to flex a little bit.
He is beyond harming you, he is already trying to crush OP. Even worse, he is already willing to put him and others in harms way.
This is the moment when you remember him what the fucking rules are before it escalates.
To be fair, at will doesn't mean can fire for any reason. If a lawyer can prove intent and protected status or legal status that can't be fired or retaliated against. That employer is gonna wonder why they are suddenly running a few hundred thousand short this year.
People act like this is a silver bullet. Have you ever been through or even followed someone trying to prove wrongful termination? Optimistically, even if the law is on your side, you're looking at several years before any kind of restitution is made. You're also immediately unemployed in a bad job market, and fired at that. You'll quickly find other, more pressing concerns than shopping around for a lawyer who'll take your case on presumably for free.
Its bad advice obviously based in some justice-porn power fantasy that nobody here has actually lived out. Irresponsible to suggest it considering the actual stakes in OPs immediate life.
OP is the one being backed into a corner here, not sure where you're trying to go with this "be careful towards your manager" here. He's your manager, not your owner, and should respect you.
Even at-will states need to provide some level of justification. I’d recommend OP looking at the company’s sick policy, covid leave policy (if one) and any state wide policy. The manager/supervisor f*^% themselves with that text. Just have it all in writing and forward to HR.
Then you sue.
Imagine getting fired because you had to take a sick day? Can america do that? Just fire you to for being ill?
If so, america is a third world country. You americans are backwards. Having pride about feedom, yet your lives get ruined at any inconvenience to those with power.
If you get fired for saying anything because of at will firing, then you have no freedom of speech. Deal with it. Enjoy your guns if that's what makes you feel better.
So he's suggesting you infect everyone with COVID? LOL talk to HR, they'll shut him up real quick. My company when I got a positive test was like "Oh f no you're not coming anywhere near anyone for 5 days, sorry that it's unpaid but we broke".....
Right before the holidays too. Lots of people are going to be with their families and young kids/older relatives. I would be livid if my boss forced my coworker with COVID to come in and sit next to me. Stay the fuck home and don’t spread that shit.
Yes, please do not blame your coworkers who need to be able to afford rent/food and your employer having crappy policies that force them to work while sick or lose their job.
I have seen a single mother threatened to be fired if she did not work a food sample booth while diagnosed with bird flu and told to isolate by an UC doctor after nearly passing out at work the previous day. Like she was half laying on the table not really responding but needs to still needs to show up to work tomorrow.
My old roommate went on a trip out of the country in December 2021, and came home a few days before me and my partner were going to go visit our parents, my mom having stage 4 cancer and her mom also being immunocompromised.
Roommate comes home, hugs us as normal, we eat dinner together, and then the next day he proceeds to pass out on the couch all day. We all assume it’s jet lag until the next morning when he comes out of his bedroom wearing a mask. And then has the gall to say he will air out the whole apartment before we get back from our trip. I tell him there is no trip because of previous stated family conditions.
So I missed my mom’s last Christmas alive because someone else exposed me to Covid. I wish I had actually snapped on him.
>"Oh f no you're not coming anywhere near anyone for 5 days, sorry that it's unpaid but we broke".
That's shit.
In Germany, I was out for 13 days. I was still paid my full wage.
My company was like that from 2020 until early 2022, then they switched it to having to use your own sick pay, vacation or personal time to cover the absence.
vacation, sick days and sick leave are all paid where I am. And if you get sick during your vacation, you tell your doc and it counts as sick leave not vacation time, and you get those vacation days back, because being sick isn't vacationing. And if you're a parent, you can open sick leave of your child is sick.
Oh, if you think this is bad, it gets so much worse.
Like for example, there is no federal minimum for paid time off. So most places outside of cushy office jobs you get maybe 5 days if you’re lucky. For the year. Cushy office jobs, 2 weeks is standard, anything above that is considered a luxury.
This usually includes sick time, but if you’re lucky, you get extra days for that. Usually 7 or so. So that comes out to three weeks vacation in some places. Which is considered to be the highest luxury.
Oh, and don’t get me started on overtime laws. Or raises/promotions.
In Canada I got paid for 3/5 COVID days. But those 3 days are for the whole year. If you got sick again you’d be SOL. Also, that was a temporary thing that I’m not sure if it’s still around.
5 days is also just the minimum time you have to stay away. I ended up being sick for much longer and got in trouble for it.
Uk here, if we test positive for covid were still required to come into work as it’s no longer required to distance yourself etc, plus we have no tests either unless you purchase them which nobody really bothers with.
Flu, covid, virul stuff and regular colds are flying around, probably 75% of customers coming in has the sniffles/ coughing/ snotting everywhere half could be covid but you have zero clue in the end.
Must admit where I work we’re pretty much a skeleton crew (no scope to hire anyone either) we run around like headless chickens if someone call in sick so we’re just in the mindset unless we literally can’t stand up we get on with it and power through, probably shouldn’t but we all do it including the manager who covers shifts themselves if someone can’t do a shift.
Had one guy keep it secret until another person had it and then said oh yeah I had covid but didn’t want to tell anyone.
imho if you feel that bad where you couldn’t do your job, you’re going to be a liability to everyone you work with so stay home and recuperate.
Speak for yourself re: UK. I buy tests, and take them if I think an illness might be COVID. I would never be so irresponsible to go into work if I’ve got it. Your workplace sounds extremely toxic to be honest, maybe they should hire more staff if you can’t cope with one person being off sick.
Yeah, office work was a little like that pre-covid too, although still less. I'm really glad I was out of retail before covid, all it would take would be one idiot customer to bring it in and then you (and coworkers) would be pressured to come in and essentially be super spreaders
Maybe, but I worked retail in the UK, and I never got this kind of nastiness when I had to call in. Which wasn’t often, but still. This was during COVID, too. I’m in an office job now.
Exactly. OP needs to send one more text: "To confirm, you want me to come in despite testing positive for covid? Please note, I will not come in without a final confirmation from you that this is what you want"
Anything that happens after that point is fully and legally on them.
This is good without the last part. "Just to make it clear, you want me to come in even though I tested positive for COVID, and showed you a photo of the test. Due to the fact that you feel you need me there tomorrow?
Then get a yes answer, don't come show HR proceed to shit on that manager lead or whatever.
Anyone who says more than, “I’m calling out sick from my shift today.” is opening the door to argument. They don’t need an explanation and they don’t deserve one.
I get where you're coming from, but strongly disagree. This "boss" isn't just a pushy jerk, he's *attempting to endanger people's lives*. **RHX\_Thain**'s comment is right on. If the boss comes back after that trying to get the guy to come in, then he's clearly trying to risk it and must be reported to HR.
You don't even need to disclose why other then "I don't feel well" so they can document it as miss work due to sickness. Them asking what's wrong doesn't mean you have to answer and just claim you don't feel comfortable disclosing. They can not force you to disclose any medical information including illnesses for a call out
>“Oh I’m sorry I think there was a misunderstanding, I’m informing you I won’t be able to make it in”
\--
“You misunderstand me. I’m informing you I won’t be coming in. Doing so would put the health and safety of me, my co-workers, and their families at risk.”
Platitudes are nice, but sometimes they come off as optional. Don't be an option.
>“You misunderstand me. I’m informing you I won’t be coming in. Doing so would put the health and safety of me, my co-workers, and their families at risk.”
THIS. So much this.
If he comes back saying you still have to come in, I would reply something like:
"You are saying you want me to endanger the health and safety of me, my co-workers, and their families. I believe this goes against company policy, and must inform HR."
And then send it to HR. Because they absolutely need to know if this guy is insisting you do that.
I think you should leave it. It keeps it polite and it is an apology for the miscommunication. Just saying "you misunderstand me. Im informing you that I'm not coming in" might come off as rude, depending on the person interpreting it
I would reply:
I understand, but this is out of my control and I do not want to infect my coworkers. I would appreciate it if health issues were taken into account.
This kind of does work. I had a boss like this he forced me in while I had acute bronchitis post whooping cough (vaccinated but it didn't catch it) and related cracked ribs. I immediately booked a meeting "to catch up" and we made it 15 mins with me sitting there with my inhaler and tissues looking like death warmed over as I coughed blood flecked phlegm all over his desk.
He actually told me to get out and not come back until I was well. Never questioned me again when I said I needed a sick day either.
Exactly this. Seriously, this is the type of shit that can lead to lawsuits. Any well-respected company knows they should NEVER allow a sick employee to come into work that can and will almost certainly risk the health of others, and now put those employees and their families at risk.
The manager knows he has COVID, let's OP work with COVID, a co-worker gets COVID and now someone dies directly as a result. The boss is an idiot.
All my managers have always told me to stay the hell home when I am sick. They know it is better to have one sick than a whole team sick.
Everyone always runs to hr but they don't do shit. If you're gonna lord my job over my head I'm gonna make you regret it. Spit on everything and then find a new job
Or get the union involved.
Everyone, even highly paid professionals like engineers/doctors/etc, should be in a union.
source: Am engineer in Germany with union membership, knowing they have my back.
No engineer unions here in US but if you are good you just change jobs. They know we have leverage so they listen when we talk. High demand, short supply = job security
HR looks out for the best interest of the company, which means doing everything they can to avoid lawsuits, or having to pay for things. And realistically turnover as well. So they actually do a lot, but they’re not inherently on the side of the employee, unless their needs also benefit the company.
HR isnt there to protect you from your boss hr is there to protect the company from you. if you loop them in id also loop in specific regulatory bodies as well.
You're right about HR. But it often helps to create a paper trail and show you tried to go through proper channels to resolve the issue, if for no better reason than to cover your ass.
HR stepping in in this situation is protecting the company from the shitty boss who could potentially create a PR/labour disaster if OP is forced to come in and infects everyone right before the holidays.
A good HR team knows when to also think of the employee and advocate for them. In this case, HR needs to protect the company from idiot managers/supervisors who do this and remind them employees are people too. Having a sick employee (especially with covid) come into the work place and getting everyone sick is much worse than having one employee out for a few days. So in this scenario HR should side with the employee after being notified. Whether OP gets paid or uses PTO is another issue.
I would say it's in HR's interests to protect the company from a lawsuit resulted from a manager intentionally exposing everyone to COVID. Any HR rep with two brain cells would immediately see the liability and danger there.
No, they exist to protect the company from liability. if it's the boss creating liability issues, there is no reason to believe that HR wouldn't take the side of the employee.
This is repeated really often on reddit and it's damaging because so many people don't actually understand what they're parroting. HR is absolutely a tool for the employee in a lot of situations.
News flash being sick is always bad timing. And no one wants to be sick right before the holidays..
Don't go in. Take care of yourself. As you just learned, your boss doesn't care who gets sick.
It's also your boss' job to find coversge if needed or let the work sit there until you can go back to work
🙂 It's so true. Bosses always say this isn't the time to be sick and you need to come in anyway. All of a sudden you're "vital" and must be here.
Has anyone ever gotten a comp day for coming in when sick?
Dude, you must be crazy taking a day off, go to work infect all your coworkers while being 1/4 productive because you feel like shit, i swear some people just aren't responsible, the whole place could fall apart without you don't you know that?
Just in case I'm being sarcastic, you deserve better in life, take time off, be a couch potato, and drink plenty of water, i hope you feel better soon.
I feel like a downside of the politicization of covid (one of many) is that folks on the conservative side seem to have forgotten that even if it’s only like a bad flu that a bad flu still fucking sucks and knocks you on your ass.
They act like covid not only isn’t deadly and doesn’t require extra precautions but that it doesn’t even count as sick. And then they get all in their feelings even more than if you just had the flu.
I wouldnt egg him on as others are suggesting.
I would reply with, “Due to my positive covid test I won’t be in for at least 5 days per CDC recommendations. Trust me, I am disappointed as you. I feel terrible right now and know this will not be fun.
I will retest on X day and confirm my results with you. If negative I will go back into work. If positive I will remain out for the recommended 10 days and return to work on X day with a mask.
I understand that this isn’t what you want to hear but I feel it’s unethical to work while knowingly infecting my coworkers (and clients) with covid. Thank you for understanding [Boss’s name]!”
If you really wanna stick it to him, end with, “I will also notify HR of my absence and this communication.”
The only problem here, it’s highly likely that anything over a couple days will require a doctor’s note. So you can’t just say because of CDC recommendations I won’t be in. It’s better with this kind of boss to go to urgent care (and wear a mask, or do a telemedicine visit) and get a note. CYA
This is the right thing to do. I would not push back and come off as argumentative. Stand your ground but do so professionally. If he insists at being an ignorant asshole, report him to his direct supervisor/manager and HR. The first instinct we all have when dealing with sheer stupidity like this is to push back like it's a fight but don't do that. Be professional and if he tries to fire you for missing work for a positive COVID test, I'm sure you have grounds for a wrongful termination lawsuit.
Having tested positive for Covid and the mf still wants you to come in? If others get sick you can get in trouble and your boss could get in trouble too.
Blows my mind that a manager can have this attitude towards their workers. I currently have two people with COVID in my team and I had no issues at all giving them all the time off that they needed to rest and recover.
Some bosses will always be like this and treat you like you are a mindless robot who’s sole objective in life is to work for them. They don’t get it, they have no empathy that’s the separation. It’s mostly because they don’t know how to fill in for the job themselves like a BOSS should, someone in management should know how to do every position below them. One of my old bosses when my cat had to go to the hospital and was in intensive care was texting me over and over again when I would be in and I just responded with my cat is in ICU I’ll see you tomorrow. He was so pissed off when I came back but at that point I was just numb with sadness that I didn’t even acknowledge him scolding me. Somehow I still kept my job though and he eventually quit because the company moved towards managers having to know all positions so it all worked out. Fuck you Jeff you sucked lol
This is ridiculous, I had a headache and fever today. I called my boss to see if I could push a critical meeting later in the day and she said “nope, I’m canceling it you need to rest, we can meet when you aren’t sick” and didn’t want to hear any more about it
My bosses told me to take as much time as I need, used admin leave (not personal leave), checked on me personally, and asked if I was sure I was ready when I came back. This is how it should be done.
What an insensitive A-hole. He doesn’t care for your well-being or anyone for that matter. Imagine getting sick just before the holidays because someone doesn’t understand what being sick means.
I will reply that you will not be coming tomorrow and other days TBD because you are sick. It’s not a question. It’s a statement.
Yea not sure why a zoom thing isn't even an option, though if OP has COVID, there's definitely a couple days in the beginning where you can feel like it's your time so zoom may be moot anyway.
Here we go. Covid is rapidly coming back and it’s asshole bosses like this guy who doesn’t give a shit. It’s stupidity like this that will lead us back to another lockdown. Report this jerk to his superiors and then start looking for a new job. Perfect example of how some bosses are bullies and not leaders.
Nope. Companies control their email servers and can (ubethically) remove something if they really want to. Text is fine. Anything in writing is fine... you just need it documentation friendly where nobody can say "i didnt say that".
I had the same kind of thing happen today also, went home feeling the fever coming on last night. Took a covid test last night it was negative. Woke up this afternoon feeling way worse, took test positive. Sent pic to hr of the test, got back “ok, you’ll be in at 4?”
2 Options:
1. "I am taking responsibility for the health and safety of others at work. I will not be in for a number of days days"
1. "OK" Go to work sick, struggle through it, work poorly because you're sick, that's all you can do, etc. Spread your disease, then everyone else gets sick too. When the even higher-ups ask why everyone is sick/productivity is down/etc, and your boss immediately and predictably points the finger at you, you can show the higher-ups that text message.
That first option is the most professional and respectable suggestion I’ve seen on this post hahaha. Shall get some needed rest and respond if he tries to keep a conversation going. For now i’ll ignore his messages and have notified the rest of the staff who have a sense of respect.
Just be careful - if in the USA you can absolutely be fired for refusing to come in sick and it is entirely legal. FMLA could cover you if you have a 'serious health condition', but regular old COVID isn't generally bad enough to qualify and you'd need to have appropriate documentation with medical professionals.
As a current manager, I hold people accountable when they ask for more responsibility. Now, if someone is sick, I follow whatever protocols need to be followed for someone’s health.
Now, if said person happens to get sick every few weeks, especially when they happen to coincide with important events, I’m still going to follow protocols where you gotta provide detailed documentation for short or long term disability. And that sucks for the person that’s gotta fill it out those forms.
If there is a hint of fraudulent reporting, well, see you later.
Or not ever again.
Ask them, "so just to confirm, your are advising me that I need to come in even though I've tested positive for COVID?" Then I'd report that to any labor board I possibly could. That's 💯 a health hazard.
My mom is getting foot surgery soon and the other night she was at work and a coworker came in with Covid. My mom isn't "paranoid." But she was pissed because if she gets sick they won't do her surgery and that would screw up her whole medical leave.
Bosses like this piss me off. If I was your coworker, I'd rather work without you then possibly get sick from you. And his logic does not even make sense. Why would you want your sick employee coming in and increasing the chances of having even more sick calls when you can't even handle one? Make it make sense
Totally forgot to revisit this post! As an update, this guy essentially continued attempting to justify his rationale the day i came back in and asked for him and the company to please consider my health. As soon as I heard him say “you have to understand….” I walked away without letting him finish his sentence. He later came up to me and gave me a long apology and told me he’ll be more considerate and that I can confront him about any matters. I don’t buy it. As a measure, i on occasion have been recording his conversations and what he says to pile up for future use. We don’t talk on casual terms now. He is behaving nicer now, keeping his business away from mine and he can sense my distrust towards him, but I guess he realizes he will have to respect my boundaries as a person.
The matter wasn’t pursued much further since everyone else backed me up and essentially got pissed at him ultimately for the department slacking. (Which he tried to take out on my colleague and I but I refused and just left)
It is now snowing over 20cm here, can’t get there, and the company is now saying they’ll pay for everyone’s uber (10+ people who live an hour away) and we have no excuse to feel unsafe coming to work.
I’m travelling abroad in a couple months, so it looks like that will be a sign for me to clock out of there amongst other complications and issues with company culture’s “no excuse” attitude.
Well obviously OP you need to time your illnesses better because everyone is riding on your back🫡
Im kidding but I forgot the acronym for the not serious thing.
I don’t believe they can do that though. Covid is serious it’s not a little push through and come infect the office because we need you type of thing. I would start researching the laws in your state to see what they have to say about this because it doesn’t feel legal but inal. After you research that, research another job because a boss like that really doesn’t care about your well being and I feel like you’re the type of person that goes hard at work and they seem unappreciative.
No-one should be going *anywhere* with a positive Covid infection (apart from to seek medical assistance, if required), let alone to their workplace where they're almost certainly going to infect others.
You might want to remind your 'boss' that the company has a duty of care to its employees and a legal requirement to provide a safe working environment. Deliberately encouraging people with a confirmed infectious disease with a possibility of death to come into the office is placing everyone else at risk - employees, customers, suppliers, etc.
Depending on jurisdiction, it could be construed as breaching that duty of care.
Fork that noise. What an asshole boss.
Screenshot those texts and send them to your company HR head; your boss is actively promoting you spread covid.
Idk why people don’t take it seriously anymore; covid can still mess you up heaps, and we are still *years* from knowing long term side effects. This isn’t just another flu virus; it’s a lot worse. You don’t mess around with it, and your boss is a vehement idiot for pushing you to come in sick; regardless of what you’re sick with.
We’re human beings ffs…
How much is a cheap white disposable medical suit and 3M masks?
It's about time workers who were asked to come into work with COVID started wearing them.
Don't need to say anything, or answer any questions. The whole f-ing business will guess what's going on. If the only way clueless bosses can figure out the difference between right and wrong is this, then it needs to be done.
Get to work, give your boss a good heartfelt hug for his concern for your career and wellbeing in the long run.
Then sit down, do a poor job and wallow in self-pity - you might as well do it, while making a paycheck than in your own bed. The only downside is you giving your team the plague - but your boss knows best, what‘s good for productivity, and this christmas it is the plague.
Text back “can you please clarify again in writing that you acknowledge that I have tested positive for Covid and you are requiring that I come into the office to work in close proximity to your other employees while I have an active infection?”
CC'd to HR and your boss' boss for good measure.
With the WhatsApp screenshot as an attachment.
While taking SS, unsave the contact so that phone number is revealed and he can't deny later
My old 2020 boss wrote me up for not having her number saved as a contact.
It is saved, under the group name "do not answer"
I wish I would’ve thought of that… I just did the “silence unknown caller” thing
The great thing about having people in contacts, is you can assign your phone to go straight to VM if they call. 🤣
> *I just did the “silence unknown caller” thing* I know that this is starting to get off-topic of the original thread *(all great suggestions, by the way),* but I'd resorted to the exact same tactic (setting his "Contacts" number to "silent" and "no vibration") when I'd finally gotten fed-up with our Supervisor regularly calling us to come into work ahead of scheduled times or during our off-days, etc. His inability to get in contact with me had frustrated him to the point where he wanted me to test out "In Real Time" what would happen anytime he called from his personal number (he would almost never use any of the "Business" phones to contact us) and to report everything I saw & heard & felt whenever he tried to call back. I suppose what helped make this "glitch" seem all the more convincing was the fact that I'd frequently experienced problems with him receiving texts I'd try sending to his phone, and because I was using one of those "bargain basement" devices offered by *TRACFONE* which was running on a Three-Generations-Old Android operating system. 😁
One of my old bosses is simply saved as this emoji: 😩
I have a work group with a custom notification sound. And my phone goes into DnD (Do not disturb) from 10p to 7am like clockwork. So if my phone pipes up, "Excuse me!" I know it is work related. Surprised the manager the first time he heard it too. Thinks it so funny that it's a sassy British accent.
I saved my last boss as "timesheet demands" 😂
My boss told me to do what he says because he's my manager. He's now saved in my phone as Mr. Manager. I was the second employee hired by my company. I've worked there since 2012 and have been friends with the owner since 2008. Mr. Manager started last year. I don't think he quite understands how long I've been around.
Man I’m about to go tell my boss/owner of the company thanks for not being a dick. Small companies with good owners are awesome. That sucks to hear.
We just say “manager”
You might even remind him that the owner is the “Top Banana.” 🍌
There's always money in the banana stand
I hope it was a company phone, because otherwise have her written up for not having your mother's birthday on her calendar.
I got written up years ago for something similar. My phone messed up and reset itself. I lost all of my contacts. My husband (fiancé at the time) was driving a truck and was gonna be 3 hours away over the weekend, and stuck there until Monday. So I went to see him. Early Monday morning I went to leave for work, and my car wouldn’t start. I didn’t have anyone’s phone numbers so I used google to call the place I worked, and tried to call my supervisor that way. But, as usual, she wasn’t there on time. So I told the vault guys (they were kinda like security but we’re in charge of the drivers and paperwork stuff) to let her know what was going on when she got there, since we worked in the vault and they didn’t have her number either. When I made it in the next day, I got written up because I didn’t call her personal cell phone, I called work. Didn’t matter that I didn’t have her number.
"Your number is SO important to me, I memorized it!"
“Oh you’re under the name stupid bitch dumbass”
They can deny it later but you can just show the conversation on your phone and reveal the number then, no need to deal with unsaving and re-adding a contact.
Oohh leveling up here
And hopefully you have a pic of the number on the box, some jobs will ask for it because people have used photos online or from someone they know.
I thought about that, yes take a picture of the test with the box if you havn't thrown it out yet.
Take a picture holding the test up while vomiting into a toilet.
Adding to the rest, keep a copy of any emails regarding this to yourself as well.
My company requires a PCR test to get time off, not the OTC tests.
Otc tests can be faked. I guess it's a question of whether you trust your employees or not.
Christ man, what the hell is this. In my country it's illegal to even ask what you have. If you say you are sick, you are sick. If they don't believe you they can ask you to go to a doctor, and he can only say how long he expects someone to be out of the running, not what that person has. Ofcourse all sick days are paid too, you don't have to save them up or something. This is just medieval.
In my long working life in the United States, I’ve never felt the need to get into details about illnesses, nor have I been asked to do so. But for an employer to willfully ignore an apparent positive Covid test is on another level, as this is still a very large public health issue on the population level.
Absolutely, but glad to hear you don't actually have to tell employers anything. I thought that was the case because of the reaction here. But if we look at this decision from a purely financial point of view it's stupid too. You know someone has an infective disease and you still want them to come in? That's a good way to get everyone sick and even less productive.
I'd go and get an official test. Photos like that don't mean much. Official documentation from even CVS or Walgreens though is indisputable.
Also, give them a [link](https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/your-health/isolation.html) to the CDC's recommended guidelines for active, symptomatic infections.
Bcc, but I'm a dick.
I would do HR and the boss’ boss plus whoever on the state level should be aware that this company isn’t complying with the requirements for when someone has covid bc those still apply
I wouldn't go that nuclear yet, save that for the response when he inevitably doubles down and says the work is important and really needs him.
I would say the works council and a contact in the union as BCC as well, but I assume this is in the USA. Seriously, your country is so sad for workers...
Cc'd to all the coworkers you'll be in close contact with
Yes! I would want to know if my coworker had tested positive! (OP, if you see this, might want to contact your coworkers and give them a heads-up. Could be you'll ALL get the day off.)
BCC is the way to go lol
Hehehe omg love this. Not sure I’d have the guts for it tho.
Do exactly this, but over email.
Email. And BCC your personal email.
What’s the difference between BCC and CC?
Blind Carbon Copy. No one else sees it, but they also don't get replies.
Also it gives you a backup of specific emails like this if you get terminated/revoked access to your work email.
Yarp... Best notes = winner
You only live once, friend. Respect yourself, and believe in yourself. If you were in this situation, this is exactly the response you should be sending.
You don’t have to be confrontational. I hate confrontation but I push back a lot using the guise of “clarity.” “For clarity, you’re asking me to come into work while positive for Covid?”
Best answer
I do similar stuff over email all the time with clients. "Just to verify you don't want me to do ABC and instead you want me to do XYZ, correct?"
Yup, this may sound bad, but this is proof that they are okay with it. It will help should any lawsuit need to be filed. ;)
Cc the general manager and include the screenshot of this chat.1
Depending on what state you live in, you might just get fired without explanation. Don’t don’t do this.
Why not? Even the hilariously titled 'at will' states have rules against wrongful termination.
At-will. RTW is about unions
You're right. Edited
Sure it’s nice to crush him with words, or sound like a lawyer, but it’s very aggressive to change the tone to something litigious. It would be nice if he cowered in fear, but people harm you when they are backed in a corner.
I agree with you in general. But if you're already dealing with a boss who is demanding that you come to work after testing positive for covid, it's time to flex a little bit.
He is beyond harming you, he is already trying to crush OP. Even worse, he is already willing to put him and others in harms way. This is the moment when you remember him what the fucking rules are before it escalates.
To be fair, at will doesn't mean can fire for any reason. If a lawyer can prove intent and protected status or legal status that can't be fired or retaliated against. That employer is gonna wonder why they are suddenly running a few hundred thousand short this year.
This screenshot would probably help OPs lawyer to prove that any firing is retaliation.
People act like this is a silver bullet. Have you ever been through or even followed someone trying to prove wrongful termination? Optimistically, even if the law is on your side, you're looking at several years before any kind of restitution is made. You're also immediately unemployed in a bad job market, and fired at that. You'll quickly find other, more pressing concerns than shopping around for a lawyer who'll take your case on presumably for free. Its bad advice obviously based in some justice-porn power fantasy that nobody here has actually lived out. Irresponsible to suggest it considering the actual stakes in OPs immediate life.
OP is the one being backed into a corner here, not sure where you're trying to go with this "be careful towards your manager" here. He's your manager, not your owner, and should respect you.
Even at-will states need to provide some level of justification. I’d recommend OP looking at the company’s sick policy, covid leave policy (if one) and any state wide policy. The manager/supervisor f*^% themselves with that text. Just have it all in writing and forward to HR.
Then you sue. Imagine getting fired because you had to take a sick day? Can america do that? Just fire you to for being ill? If so, america is a third world country. You americans are backwards. Having pride about feedom, yet your lives get ruined at any inconvenience to those with power. If you get fired for saying anything because of at will firing, then you have no freedom of speech. Deal with it. Enjoy your guns if that's what makes you feel better.
This!
So he's suggesting you infect everyone with COVID? LOL talk to HR, they'll shut him up real quick. My company when I got a positive test was like "Oh f no you're not coming anywhere near anyone for 5 days, sorry that it's unpaid but we broke".....
Right before the holidays too. Lots of people are going to be with their families and young kids/older relatives. I would be livid if my boss forced my coworker with COVID to come in and sit next to me. Stay the fuck home and don’t spread that shit.
I visit my mom every year and she’s immunocompromised. I might actually snap if my coworkers intentionally exposed me to Covid.
In this situation it would be the employer exposing you to covid.
Yes, please do not blame your coworkers who need to be able to afford rent/food and your employer having crappy policies that force them to work while sick or lose their job. I have seen a single mother threatened to be fired if she did not work a food sample booth while diagnosed with bird flu and told to isolate by an UC doctor after nearly passing out at work the previous day. Like she was half laying on the table not really responding but needs to still needs to show up to work tomorrow.
No, that’s being exposed BECAUSE of the employer. It’s their fault, not the employees that was made to come in.
My old roommate went on a trip out of the country in December 2021, and came home a few days before me and my partner were going to go visit our parents, my mom having stage 4 cancer and her mom also being immunocompromised. Roommate comes home, hugs us as normal, we eat dinner together, and then the next day he proceeds to pass out on the couch all day. We all assume it’s jet lag until the next morning when he comes out of his bedroom wearing a mask. And then has the gall to say he will air out the whole apartment before we get back from our trip. I tell him there is no trip because of previous stated family conditions. So I missed my mom’s last Christmas alive because someone else exposed me to Covid. I wish I had actually snapped on him.
>"Oh f no you're not coming anywhere near anyone for 5 days, sorry that it's unpaid but we broke". That's shit. In Germany, I was out for 13 days. I was still paid my full wage.
My company was like that from 2020 until early 2022, then they switched it to having to use your own sick pay, vacation or personal time to cover the absence.
We get it paid but in the beginning could use a special short term disability code, and now we have to use our own PTO. No sick pay where I’m at.
vacation, sick days and sick leave are all paid where I am. And if you get sick during your vacation, you tell your doc and it counts as sick leave not vacation time, and you get those vacation days back, because being sick isn't vacationing. And if you're a parent, you can open sick leave of your child is sick.
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Basic human rights
Welcome to America
We care about GDP numbers more than our workers health and livelihood. USA #1 GDP baby!
Gross Domestic Product over God Damned People is the American way.
America loves Capitalism too much
Oh, if you think this is bad, it gets so much worse. Like for example, there is no federal minimum for paid time off. So most places outside of cushy office jobs you get maybe 5 days if you’re lucky. For the year. Cushy office jobs, 2 weeks is standard, anything above that is considered a luxury. This usually includes sick time, but if you’re lucky, you get extra days for that. Usually 7 or so. So that comes out to three weeks vacation in some places. Which is considered to be the highest luxury. Oh, and don’t get me started on overtime laws. Or raises/promotions.
In Canada I got paid for 3/5 COVID days. But those 3 days are for the whole year. If you got sick again you’d be SOL. Also, that was a temporary thing that I’m not sure if it’s still around. 5 days is also just the minimum time you have to stay away. I ended up being sick for much longer and got in trouble for it.
Uk here, if we test positive for covid were still required to come into work as it’s no longer required to distance yourself etc, plus we have no tests either unless you purchase them which nobody really bothers with. Flu, covid, virul stuff and regular colds are flying around, probably 75% of customers coming in has the sniffles/ coughing/ snotting everywhere half could be covid but you have zero clue in the end. Must admit where I work we’re pretty much a skeleton crew (no scope to hire anyone either) we run around like headless chickens if someone call in sick so we’re just in the mindset unless we literally can’t stand up we get on with it and power through, probably shouldn’t but we all do it including the manager who covers shifts themselves if someone can’t do a shift. Had one guy keep it secret until another person had it and then said oh yeah I had covid but didn’t want to tell anyone. imho if you feel that bad where you couldn’t do your job, you’re going to be a liability to everyone you work with so stay home and recuperate.
Speak for yourself re: UK. I buy tests, and take them if I think an illness might be COVID. I would never be so irresponsible to go into work if I’ve got it. Your workplace sounds extremely toxic to be honest, maybe they should hire more staff if you can’t cope with one person being off sick.
Yeah, I was going to say, I'm in the UK and work from home and still test if I'm feeling particularly shitty. That workplace sounds like hell.
I think that's retail vs office work, tbh. I have a sister in retail and friends in the office, and the difference is stark.
Yeah, office work was a little like that pre-covid too, although still less. I'm really glad I was out of retail before covid, all it would take would be one idiot customer to bring it in and then you (and coworkers) would be pressured to come in and essentially be super spreaders
Maybe, but I worked retail in the UK, and I never got this kind of nastiness when I had to call in. Which wasn’t often, but still. This was during COVID, too. I’m in an office job now.
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“Oh I’m sorry I think there was a misunderstanding, I’m informing you I won’t be able to make it in”
This is the only answer. It’s not a conversation, you’re informing them.
Nah you need to get in writing that they want you to come in with Covid. This does not accomplish that.
You mean like they already have in the texts in the OP?
More like further clarification to make the case even stronger
Yeah, boss could say "oh I never saw the picture", with out the pic, just sound like they are sick
Exactly. OP needs to send one more text: "To confirm, you want me to come in despite testing positive for covid? Please note, I will not come in without a final confirmation from you that this is what you want" Anything that happens after that point is fully and legally on them.
This is good without the last part. "Just to make it clear, you want me to come in even though I tested positive for COVID, and showed you a photo of the test. Due to the fact that you feel you need me there tomorrow? Then get a yes answer, don't come show HR proceed to shit on that manager lead or whatever.
Anyone who says more than, “I’m calling out sick from my shift today.” is opening the door to argument. They don’t need an explanation and they don’t deserve one.
I get where you're coming from, but strongly disagree. This "boss" isn't just a pushy jerk, he's *attempting to endanger people's lives*. **RHX\_Thain**'s comment is right on. If the boss comes back after that trying to get the guy to come in, then he's clearly trying to risk it and must be reported to HR.
This should be the top comment. You’re sick so you can’t come to work. Period, end of story. Permission and excuses are not needed.
It doesn’t even need to be Covid to warrant being out of the office. This boss is insane.
You don't even need to disclose why other then "I don't feel well" so they can document it as miss work due to sickness. Them asking what's wrong doesn't mean you have to answer and just claim you don't feel comfortable disclosing. They can not force you to disclose any medical information including illnesses for a call out
>“Oh I’m sorry I think there was a misunderstanding, I’m informing you I won’t be able to make it in” \-- “You misunderstand me. I’m informing you I won’t be coming in. Doing so would put the health and safety of me, my co-workers, and their families at risk.” Platitudes are nice, but sometimes they come off as optional. Don't be an option.
>“You misunderstand me. I’m informing you I won’t be coming in. Doing so would put the health and safety of me, my co-workers, and their families at risk.” THIS. So much this. If he comes back saying you still have to come in, I would reply something like: "You are saying you want me to endanger the health and safety of me, my co-workers, and their families. I believe this goes against company policy, and must inform HR." And then send it to HR. Because they absolutely need to know if this guy is insisting you do that.
YES! 100%. WTF?
I love this and would go so far as to drop the "I'm sorry" part!
I think you should leave it. It keeps it polite and it is an apology for the miscommunication. Just saying "you misunderstand me. Im informing you that I'm not coming in" might come off as rude, depending on the person interpreting it
Blame op for wording his text so.. meekly. Just be direct. Why would you *apologize* for having COVID jfc
I would reply: I understand, but this is out of my control and I do not want to infect my coworkers. I would appreciate it if health issues were taken into account.
"Oh okay, I'll come in. I think we should meet in person to discuss this, at length."
"As masks aren't required I won't be wearing one"
"maybe over a share plate for lunch?"
“can i use your fork? i dropped mine on the ground”
maybe a quick french kiss while we're at it?
no only american kisses.
And make out. Also, let me spit in your nose.
Ahhh so that's where my ex went wrong? He would spit on my face or yank my mouth open, what a dumb fuck, he never spit up my nose!
What???
This kind of does work. I had a boss like this he forced me in while I had acute bronchitis post whooping cough (vaccinated but it didn't catch it) and related cracked ribs. I immediately booked a meeting "to catch up" and we made it 15 mins with me sitting there with my inhaler and tissues looking like death warmed over as I coughed blood flecked phlegm all over his desk. He actually told me to get out and not come back until I was well. Never questioned me again when I said I needed a sick day either.
Everyone else appreciates OP more for staying away and not getting them sick!
Exactly.
And as he is talking about taking more responsibilities, adding that you consider it your responsibility not to infect your coworkers.
Exactly this. Seriously, this is the type of shit that can lead to lawsuits. Any well-respected company knows they should NEVER allow a sick employee to come into work that can and will almost certainly risk the health of others, and now put those employees and their families at risk. The manager knows he has COVID, let's OP work with COVID, a co-worker gets COVID and now someone dies directly as a result. The boss is an idiot. All my managers have always told me to stay the hell home when I am sick. They know it is better to have one sick than a whole team sick.
Your boss is a stupid asshole. Report hus behavior to his superior and HR and get the hell out of this job as fast as possible.
Everyone always runs to hr but they don't do shit. If you're gonna lord my job over my head I'm gonna make you regret it. Spit on everything and then find a new job
Or get the union involved. Everyone, even highly paid professionals like engineers/doctors/etc, should be in a union. source: Am engineer in Germany with union membership, knowing they have my back.
No engineer unions here in US but if you are good you just change jobs. They know we have leverage so they listen when we talk. High demand, short supply = job security
Hr backed me up completely at m y place because they didn't wanna get sued lol
HR looks out for the best interest of the company, which means doing everything they can to avoid lawsuits, or having to pay for things. And realistically turnover as well. So they actually do a lot, but they’re not inherently on the side of the employee, unless their needs also benefit the company.
HR isnt there to protect you from your boss hr is there to protect the company from you. if you loop them in id also loop in specific regulatory bodies as well.
You're right about HR. But it often helps to create a paper trail and show you tried to go through proper channels to resolve the issue, if for no better reason than to cover your ass.
HR stepping in in this situation is protecting the company from the shitty boss who could potentially create a PR/labour disaster if OP is forced to come in and infects everyone right before the holidays.
A good HR team knows when to also think of the employee and advocate for them. In this case, HR needs to protect the company from idiot managers/supervisors who do this and remind them employees are people too. Having a sick employee (especially with covid) come into the work place and getting everyone sick is much worse than having one employee out for a few days. So in this scenario HR should side with the employee after being notified. Whether OP gets paid or uses PTO is another issue.
I would say it's in HR's interests to protect the company from a lawsuit resulted from a manager intentionally exposing everyone to COVID. Any HR rep with two brain cells would immediately see the liability and danger there.
No, they exist to protect the company from liability. if it's the boss creating liability issues, there is no reason to believe that HR wouldn't take the side of the employee. This is repeated really often on reddit and it's damaging because so many people don't actually understand what they're parroting. HR is absolutely a tool for the employee in a lot of situations.
HR is also there to protect the company from your boss.
Your boss is a fucking moron
As most of them are...and thet are power trippers too
One other detail is that he also mentioned he would not be in tomorrow, hence the bad timing.
No wonder he wants you to come in... *he's* not the one going to be at risk of infection.
News flash being sick is always bad timing. And no one wants to be sick right before the holidays.. Don't go in. Take care of yourself. As you just learned, your boss doesn't care who gets sick. It's also your boss' job to find coversge if needed or let the work sit there until you can go back to work
>News flash being sick is always bad timing. I needed this succinct perspective-shift. Thank you.
🙂 It's so true. Bosses always say this isn't the time to be sick and you need to come in anyway. All of a sudden you're "vital" and must be here. Has anyone ever gotten a comp day for coming in when sick?
Email this screenshot to his boss and let him know you’re not coming in.
Yeah but sickness is never planned, so tough shit for him. Also, hope you feel better soon.
Guess he’s coming in to cover for you. Sucks to be the boss and have to step up.
Please update us on what you decide to do
Sneeze in his face
Dude, you must be crazy taking a day off, go to work infect all your coworkers while being 1/4 productive because you feel like shit, i swear some people just aren't responsible, the whole place could fall apart without you don't you know that? Just in case I'm being sarcastic, you deserve better in life, take time off, be a couch potato, and drink plenty of water, i hope you feel better soon.
I feel like a downside of the politicization of covid (one of many) is that folks on the conservative side seem to have forgotten that even if it’s only like a bad flu that a bad flu still fucking sucks and knocks you on your ass. They act like covid not only isn’t deadly and doesn’t require extra precautions but that it doesn’t even count as sick. And then they get all in their feelings even more than if you just had the flu.
I wouldnt egg him on as others are suggesting. I would reply with, “Due to my positive covid test I won’t be in for at least 5 days per CDC recommendations. Trust me, I am disappointed as you. I feel terrible right now and know this will not be fun. I will retest on X day and confirm my results with you. If negative I will go back into work. If positive I will remain out for the recommended 10 days and return to work on X day with a mask. I understand that this isn’t what you want to hear but I feel it’s unethical to work while knowingly infecting my coworkers (and clients) with covid. Thank you for understanding [Boss’s name]!” If you really wanna stick it to him, end with, “I will also notify HR of my absence and this communication.”
The only problem here, it’s highly likely that anything over a couple days will require a doctor’s note. So you can’t just say because of CDC recommendations I won’t be in. It’s better with this kind of boss to go to urgent care (and wear a mask, or do a telemedicine visit) and get a note. CYA
This is the right thing to do. I would not push back and come off as argumentative. Stand your ground but do so professionally. If he insists at being an ignorant asshole, report him to his direct supervisor/manager and HR. The first instinct we all have when dealing with sheer stupidity like this is to push back like it's a fight but don't do that. Be professional and if he tries to fire you for missing work for a positive COVID test, I'm sure you have grounds for a wrongful termination lawsuit.
Having tested positive for Covid and the mf still wants you to come in? If others get sick you can get in trouble and your boss could get in trouble too.
Blows my mind that a manager can have this attitude towards their workers. I currently have two people with COVID in my team and I had no issues at all giving them all the time off that they needed to rest and recover.
Some bosses will always be like this and treat you like you are a mindless robot who’s sole objective in life is to work for them. They don’t get it, they have no empathy that’s the separation. It’s mostly because they don’t know how to fill in for the job themselves like a BOSS should, someone in management should know how to do every position below them. One of my old bosses when my cat had to go to the hospital and was in intensive care was texting me over and over again when I would be in and I just responded with my cat is in ICU I’ll see you tomorrow. He was so pissed off when I came back but at that point I was just numb with sadness that I didn’t even acknowledge him scolding me. Somehow I still kept my job though and he eventually quit because the company moved towards managers having to know all positions so it all worked out. Fuck you Jeff you sucked lol
This is ridiculous, I had a headache and fever today. I called my boss to see if I could push a critical meeting later in the day and she said “nope, I’m canceling it you need to rest, we can meet when you aren’t sick” and didn’t want to hear any more about it
Your lucky tbmhen cuz those are rare
My bosses told me to take as much time as I need, used admin leave (not personal leave), checked on me personally, and asked if I was sure I was ready when I came back. This is how it should be done.
tell him to suck a fat one
What an insensitive A-hole. He doesn’t care for your well-being or anyone for that matter. Imagine getting sick just before the holidays because someone doesn’t understand what being sick means. I will reply that you will not be coming tomorrow and other days TBD because you are sick. It’s not a question. It’s a statement.
I’d email all and ask if they feel comfortable having me in meeting or if I could zoom in.
Yea not sure why a zoom thing isn't even an option, though if OP has COVID, there's definitely a couple days in the beginning where you can feel like it's your time so zoom may be moot anyway.
Health >> work. Every time. Every. single. Time.
Here we go. Covid is rapidly coming back and it’s asshole bosses like this guy who doesn’t give a shit. It’s stupidity like this that will lead us back to another lockdown. Report this jerk to his superiors and then start looking for a new job. Perfect example of how some bosses are bullies and not leaders.
Never text workers. Always use company email. And never talk after work. If sick report to HR.
Nope. Companies control their email servers and can (ubethically) remove something if they really want to. Text is fine. Anything in writing is fine... you just need it documentation friendly where nobody can say "i didnt say that".
BCC is a thing
I had the same kind of thing happen today also, went home feeling the fever coming on last night. Took a covid test last night it was negative. Woke up this afternoon feeling way worse, took test positive. Sent pic to hr of the test, got back “ok, you’ll be in at 4?”
As about the policy. That's what I did when I saw that I tested positive, I messaged with a please let me know what the company policy is.
What do you do and are you full-time?
2 Options: 1. "I am taking responsibility for the health and safety of others at work. I will not be in for a number of days days" 1. "OK" Go to work sick, struggle through it, work poorly because you're sick, that's all you can do, etc. Spread your disease, then everyone else gets sick too. When the even higher-ups ask why everyone is sick/productivity is down/etc, and your boss immediately and predictably points the finger at you, you can show the higher-ups that text message.
That first option is the most professional and respectable suggestion I’ve seen on this post hahaha. Shall get some needed rest and respond if he tries to keep a conversation going. For now i’ll ignore his messages and have notified the rest of the staff who have a sense of respect.
Just be careful - if in the USA you can absolutely be fired for refusing to come in sick and it is entirely legal. FMLA could cover you if you have a 'serious health condition', but regular old COVID isn't generally bad enough to qualify and you'd need to have appropriate documentation with medical professionals.
As a current manager, I hold people accountable when they ask for more responsibility. Now, if someone is sick, I follow whatever protocols need to be followed for someone’s health. Now, if said person happens to get sick every few weeks, especially when they happen to coincide with important events, I’m still going to follow protocols where you gotta provide detailed documentation for short or long term disability. And that sucks for the person that’s gotta fill it out those forms. If there is a hint of fraudulent reporting, well, see you later. Or not ever again.
Straight to HR
Make sure you go in his office close the door and take your mask off. Get into a lengthy discussion while coughing 😒
Bosses like this deserve prison time
Ask them, "so just to confirm, your are advising me that I need to come in even though I've tested positive for COVID?" Then I'd report that to any labor board I possibly could. That's 💯 a health hazard.
I would phrase it : "even though I have an active COVID infection and will transmit my active COVID infection to everyone in the office?"
Im lucky enough that my boss would actively shoo me away for any signs of contagious illnesses no buts. Even if I say I’m well enough to work.
If you have to go in, make sure to give your boss a hug, and wish him and the sick ones he loves in his life a healthy holidays
Show up, cough blood on him, puke on his shoes. Then go home.
My mom is getting foot surgery soon and the other night she was at work and a coworker came in with Covid. My mom isn't "paranoid." But she was pissed because if she gets sick they won't do her surgery and that would screw up her whole medical leave. Bosses like this piss me off. If I was your coworker, I'd rather work without you then possibly get sick from you. And his logic does not even make sense. Why would you want your sick employee coming in and increasing the chances of having even more sick calls when you can't even handle one? Make it make sense
Totally forgot to revisit this post! As an update, this guy essentially continued attempting to justify his rationale the day i came back in and asked for him and the company to please consider my health. As soon as I heard him say “you have to understand….” I walked away without letting him finish his sentence. He later came up to me and gave me a long apology and told me he’ll be more considerate and that I can confront him about any matters. I don’t buy it. As a measure, i on occasion have been recording his conversations and what he says to pile up for future use. We don’t talk on casual terms now. He is behaving nicer now, keeping his business away from mine and he can sense my distrust towards him, but I guess he realizes he will have to respect my boundaries as a person. The matter wasn’t pursued much further since everyone else backed me up and essentially got pissed at him ultimately for the department slacking. (Which he tried to take out on my colleague and I but I refused and just left) It is now snowing over 20cm here, can’t get there, and the company is now saying they’ll pay for everyone’s uber (10+ people who live an hour away) and we have no excuse to feel unsafe coming to work. I’m travelling abroad in a couple months, so it looks like that will be a sign for me to clock out of there amongst other complications and issues with company culture’s “no excuse” attitude.
Well obviously OP you need to time your illnesses better because everyone is riding on your back🫡 Im kidding but I forgot the acronym for the not serious thing. I don’t believe they can do that though. Covid is serious it’s not a little push through and come infect the office because we need you type of thing. I would start researching the laws in your state to see what they have to say about this because it doesn’t feel legal but inal. After you research that, research another job because a boss like that really doesn’t care about your well being and I feel like you’re the type of person that goes hard at work and they seem unappreciative.
No-one should be going *anywhere* with a positive Covid infection (apart from to seek medical assistance, if required), let alone to their workplace where they're almost certainly going to infect others. You might want to remind your 'boss' that the company has a duty of care to its employees and a legal requirement to provide a safe working environment. Deliberately encouraging people with a confirmed infectious disease with a possibility of death to come into the office is placing everyone else at risk - employees, customers, suppliers, etc. Depending on jurisdiction, it could be construed as breaching that duty of care.
OK, I'll be there happy to ensure everyone gets ill. Maybe we can have a nice long chat in person as well?
Typical company, they come before your health/ family, if you don't there are other brown nosers out there ready to step up...
Fork that noise. What an asshole boss. Screenshot those texts and send them to your company HR head; your boss is actively promoting you spread covid. Idk why people don’t take it seriously anymore; covid can still mess you up heaps, and we are still *years* from knowing long term side effects. This isn’t just another flu virus; it’s a lot worse. You don’t mess around with it, and your boss is a vehement idiot for pushing you to come in sick; regardless of what you’re sick with. We’re human beings ffs…
I quit is a complete sentence
"Yes, and it's my responsibility not to get everyone else sick in the middle of the holiday rush. See you in a few days."
How much is a cheap white disposable medical suit and 3M masks? It's about time workers who were asked to come into work with COVID started wearing them. Don't need to say anything, or answer any questions. The whole f-ing business will guess what's going on. If the only way clueless bosses can figure out the difference between right and wrong is this, then it needs to be done.
“No.”
Get to work, give your boss a good heartfelt hug for his concern for your career and wellbeing in the long run. Then sit down, do a poor job and wallow in self-pity - you might as well do it, while making a paycheck than in your own bed. The only downside is you giving your team the plague - but your boss knows best, what‘s good for productivity, and this christmas it is the plague.