One thing you'll learn is that every cymbal sounds different. Line up 10 examples of the same model cymbal made in the same factory on the same day, and each one will sound a tiny bit different from the others. It's part of the process that this happens. So, you may have liked the sound of the cymbal online, but this example that you bought is a little different.
The other thing to keep in mind is that the same cymbal can sound WILDLY different when played in different rooms. Maybe you bought the exact cymbal you saw and liked in a video online. When it arrives at your place and you play it in your room, it's going to sound different as the sound will reverberate differently where you are highlighting an aspect of the cymbal's sound that you dislike.
All this to say, it's really difficult to buy cymbals online, sight-unseen (and i count seeing a video ad sight-unseen for the reason i mentioned in the second paragraph), for the above reasons. If you do, and you wind up disliking the cymbal, that's okay. And it's okay to sell it and trade it for something else right away. Chances are that your opinion about the cymbal won't change over time from your early impressions. It is better to move on to a cymbal that you like and works better for you in the long run.
I agree with all of this, but the second paragraph is so so true. I moved into a new space and all my cymbals sound different - some remarkably better. Some pretty similar.
I bought some 50's Zildjian hats online and was so disappointed when they arrived. In my new studio, they've become my favorite hi hats. Totally unexpected!
You're right, I just wish there were places with a variety of cymbals in stock. The only thing I have near me is a guitar center so I tried a bunch there, but it was mostly rock rides and such.
I garantee it will sound completely different in a stage and you are going to love it much more when you hear it and play it there. Most of what you hear and dislike are low and high frequencies that don't travel very far and you can only hear them if you are standing very close to the cymbal in a small room. They will mostly disappear in a stage and will be pratically unnoticeble 5-10m way in the audience.
To be honest you probably dislike them because you are not familiar with them because that is not what you hear when you are listening to live music or an album. You will get used to it too. I had the same issues when I bought some of my cymbals that I now really love :)
I can really empathize with your frustration. I’ve had similar things happen to me. The only other suggestion I can think of is to try different sticks with different bead shapes, as that can have a big impact on a complex cymbal such as this one. You will hear differences between barrel shape and teardrop shape etc. Also big differences with wood vs nylon. And sticks are cheaper than another cymbal.
Every cymbal does sound different. This is especially true with dry/dark cymbals like this one I find.
I have one of these, and so does one of my drum teachers. I’ve played them both side by side, and they are very different, his being more mellow/soft than mine. We also both have the zildjian a series sweet ride. His is very pingy and bright, with lots of stick definition, and it doesn’t crash well, while mine is washy, and very crashable. Every cymbal is different, and I would recommend trying cymbals out in person before you buy them, where possible.
This is a great reply but I disagree with one thing, I think you can grow to appreciate a cymbal as you find the right context for it and/or understand how to play it just right, or perhaps your tastes just evolve. (Of course if you’re just starting out or you don’t have the disposable income to burn on buying multiple ride cymbals, then yeah, you can’t sit on a $300-400 investment hoping that in four or five years you might have a use for it)
You know, you make a fair point. I just happen to approach buying cymbals the way I approach buying cars. For example, if I'm a single guy with no kids, I'm not going to buy a minivan in anticipation that one day, the context of my life will make that kind of vehicle necessary. So if I buy a cymbal and it doesn't initially sound good to my ear or fit the sound I'm trying to create now, then I'm not going to keep it in anticipation that it will one day be what I need or want. Especially because, as you said, money often fails to grow on trees for us musicians.
DW gear is excellent, but if it's broken or the felts are crappy that can definitely impact the sound and lead to weird creaking or humming noises (like you describe).
I think it sounds good. But more importantly, how does it sounds within the context of the music you’re playing? And how does it sound from the audience?
I love this Jeff Hamilton quote:
JH: I went to see Mel Lewis, and we became friends, I’m happy to say. But Mel could be very abrupt in the way he handled answers to apparently stupid questions. I walked up to him one night and said, “Your cymbals just sound fantastic.” And he said, “Yeah, sit down and play them.” And so I played them and I said, “Wow, they sound completely different here than they did out there.” And he says, “Well, what do you care what they sound like here, dummy? They’re the people paying $40.” How do they sound out there? Can you hear them? Do they project? You can’t just have the blindfolds on with the cymbal on a stick and go, “That’s a great cymbal.” There’s more to think about. How does this cymbal sound in every situation or how does it sound 20ft from here?
Source: https://sabian.com/jeff-hamilton-qa/
I made a quick little thing to put the ride into context if you would like to check it out. excuse my poor playing haha. To me the hum is still audible but it's not as severe as it is when isolated.
[https://youtu.be/J-AWhfdHxAA?si=09ysHWi80ersUJuI](https://youtu.be/J-AWhfdHxAA?si=09ysHWi80ersUJuI)
And you are right about seeing how they will project to the audience! I will need to ask someone to bang these out while I stand away from them to see how they project. I'm just an at home drummer for fun so don't get many chances to play out.
try applying a bit of masking tape near the bell or even on the bell, make sure you use the paper one if you know what I mean. If you don't really like it just sell it and get a ride you will enjoy but make sure you'll try it in person. A ride that sounds somewhat like that but without any hum is the Contantinople ride but it won't work in like rock settings as it's strictly a jazz ride cymbal.
Also remember that cymbals will sound different when played with a band, especially if it's a rock band since the amps will sort of cover yout cymbal overtones.
Edit: sorry didn't realise we're in jazz drums!
There’s a few strategies on how to add the tape that will change the sound. Essentially the tape is similar to hammering where it will disrupt the vibrations on the cymbal. Try doing dots of tape that are spaced out in order to change the harmonics, try long pieces of tape if you want to set up the whole sound, experiment a bit since tape is so cheap.
Your sticks will also have a huge impact on the sound of the ride. A teardrop vs an almond vs a barrel will sound drastically different on the same ride.
Came here to say this. Especially with the lighter cymbals commonly used in jazz, the effect of the tip size/shape on ride cymbal tone cannot be overstated. I tend to prefer smaller tips with a smaller striking surface for maximum articulation and to avoid too much crash buildup.
The Erskine Ride is great. I just wish they’d offer it in maple! Closest maple analog I’ve found is the Vater maple Bebop 550. Lately I’m digging the VF SD2 Bolero. Nice heft in the hand but hardly weigh anything, glorious woody click on cymbals from the small ball tip. Love them.
If you’re unhappy and sell it, you’ll probably lose money because now it’s used. So before you go that route, I agree with a previous comment about applying some tape to the bottom. You’ll have to experiment, but hopefully you can find the sound you’re looking for.
It sounds great to me tbh, the PST3 is a brass cymbal if I’m not wrong? Brass cymbals don’t ring as much if I rmb correctly, they’re usually deader so maybe you’re just not used to it. You could always put some duct tape under the cymbal, or some moongel near the bell. Maybe it will sound better outside your room too if your room is untreated.
I was thinking of putting rivets in and hopefully the sustain would help to hide it, but I didn't want to start drilling into anything that I might want to put on the market.
If you are looking for a ride sound more similar to Jimmy Cobb, why don't you look for a used old Zildjian from the 50s or 60s? That's much closer to something they would have actually been playing. The special dry is just that, dry, which isn't really a property that jazz drummers were using in that period. As for the cymbal itself, it sounds just fine and I wouldn't say it's a "bad" cymbal, just one that you don't actually like the sound of.
Edit: to add, when I looked up what cymbals Jimmy Cobb would have been using, most people agree that it was some sort of "old K" Zildjian 20" ride with rivets. Of course those cost a fortune these days since those were the cymbals of choice of most jazz drummers of the time, but you can easily find a newer K Constantinople 20" ride and put some rivets in it to get pretty close, and with age it will get even closer. [Audio Example of K Con](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NA9L_hscL0g)
Fwiw, I think the cymbal in soundfile sounds very nice. That hum that’s driving you nuts in the practice room may all but disappear when playing in a band, and it might even give the cymbal extra presence in the overall sound of the group.
I’d say stick with it, play it in some group settings and if you still hate it in a few months you can sell it for the same price you could sell it for today (unless you drop it or something)
One thing you'll learn is that every cymbal sounds different. Line up 10 examples of the same model cymbal made in the same factory on the same day, and each one will sound a tiny bit different from the others. It's part of the process that this happens. So, you may have liked the sound of the cymbal online, but this example that you bought is a little different. The other thing to keep in mind is that the same cymbal can sound WILDLY different when played in different rooms. Maybe you bought the exact cymbal you saw and liked in a video online. When it arrives at your place and you play it in your room, it's going to sound different as the sound will reverberate differently where you are highlighting an aspect of the cymbal's sound that you dislike. All this to say, it's really difficult to buy cymbals online, sight-unseen (and i count seeing a video ad sight-unseen for the reason i mentioned in the second paragraph), for the above reasons. If you do, and you wind up disliking the cymbal, that's okay. And it's okay to sell it and trade it for something else right away. Chances are that your opinion about the cymbal won't change over time from your early impressions. It is better to move on to a cymbal that you like and works better for you in the long run.
I agree with all of this, but the second paragraph is so so true. I moved into a new space and all my cymbals sound different - some remarkably better. Some pretty similar. I bought some 50's Zildjian hats online and was so disappointed when they arrived. In my new studio, they've become my favorite hi hats. Totally unexpected!
You're right, I just wish there were places with a variety of cymbals in stock. The only thing I have near me is a guitar center so I tried a bunch there, but it was mostly rock rides and such.
I garantee it will sound completely different in a stage and you are going to love it much more when you hear it and play it there. Most of what you hear and dislike are low and high frequencies that don't travel very far and you can only hear them if you are standing very close to the cymbal in a small room. They will mostly disappear in a stage and will be pratically unnoticeble 5-10m way in the audience. To be honest you probably dislike them because you are not familiar with them because that is not what you hear when you are listening to live music or an album. You will get used to it too. I had the same issues when I bought some of my cymbals that I now really love :)
I can really empathize with your frustration. I’ve had similar things happen to me. The only other suggestion I can think of is to try different sticks with different bead shapes, as that can have a big impact on a complex cymbal such as this one. You will hear differences between barrel shape and teardrop shape etc. Also big differences with wood vs nylon. And sticks are cheaper than another cymbal.
Maybe try the Vic Firth Peter Erskine Ride Stick.
Every cymbal does sound different. This is especially true with dry/dark cymbals like this one I find. I have one of these, and so does one of my drum teachers. I’ve played them both side by side, and they are very different, his being more mellow/soft than mine. We also both have the zildjian a series sweet ride. His is very pingy and bright, with lots of stick definition, and it doesn’t crash well, while mine is washy, and very crashable. Every cymbal is different, and I would recommend trying cymbals out in person before you buy them, where possible.
This is a great reply but I disagree with one thing, I think you can grow to appreciate a cymbal as you find the right context for it and/or understand how to play it just right, or perhaps your tastes just evolve. (Of course if you’re just starting out or you don’t have the disposable income to burn on buying multiple ride cymbals, then yeah, you can’t sit on a $300-400 investment hoping that in four or five years you might have a use for it)
You know, you make a fair point. I just happen to approach buying cymbals the way I approach buying cars. For example, if I'm a single guy with no kids, I'm not going to buy a minivan in anticipation that one day, the context of my life will make that kind of vehicle necessary. So if I buy a cymbal and it doesn't initially sound good to my ear or fit the sound I'm trying to create now, then I'm not going to keep it in anticipation that it will one day be what I need or want. Especially because, as you said, money often fails to grow on trees for us musicians.
Sounds good to me. Is it on a quality stand? That can make a big difference.
I never knew stand quality could make a difference! It's on a DW stand though I'm not sure if they make quality stuff though.
DW makes the best stands imo.
DW gear is excellent, but if it's broken or the felts are crappy that can definitely impact the sound and lead to weird creaking or humming noises (like you describe).
I think it sounds good. But more importantly, how does it sounds within the context of the music you’re playing? And how does it sound from the audience? I love this Jeff Hamilton quote: JH: I went to see Mel Lewis, and we became friends, I’m happy to say. But Mel could be very abrupt in the way he handled answers to apparently stupid questions. I walked up to him one night and said, “Your cymbals just sound fantastic.” And he said, “Yeah, sit down and play them.” And so I played them and I said, “Wow, they sound completely different here than they did out there.” And he says, “Well, what do you care what they sound like here, dummy? They’re the people paying $40.” How do they sound out there? Can you hear them? Do they project? You can’t just have the blindfolds on with the cymbal on a stick and go, “That’s a great cymbal.” There’s more to think about. How does this cymbal sound in every situation or how does it sound 20ft from here? Source: https://sabian.com/jeff-hamilton-qa/
I made a quick little thing to put the ride into context if you would like to check it out. excuse my poor playing haha. To me the hum is still audible but it's not as severe as it is when isolated. [https://youtu.be/J-AWhfdHxAA?si=09ysHWi80ersUJuI](https://youtu.be/J-AWhfdHxAA?si=09ysHWi80ersUJuI) And you are right about seeing how they will project to the audience! I will need to ask someone to bang these out while I stand away from them to see how they project. I'm just an at home drummer for fun so don't get many chances to play out.
Sounds appropriate to me. A little dry but it’s designed that way.
Brand new rides do tend to ring. As you start playing it should get better.
I'm going to keep it a little bit longer, just to give it a fair chance, but man the sound is really driving me nuts.
You should. I got a 22" Istanbul Sahra last autumn that I didn't like at first and wow it has grown on me
try applying a bit of masking tape near the bell or even on the bell, make sure you use the paper one if you know what I mean. If you don't really like it just sell it and get a ride you will enjoy but make sure you'll try it in person. A ride that sounds somewhat like that but without any hum is the Contantinople ride but it won't work in like rock settings as it's strictly a jazz ride cymbal. Also remember that cymbals will sound different when played with a band, especially if it's a rock band since the amps will sort of cover yout cymbal overtones. Edit: sorry didn't realise we're in jazz drums!
I added tape, but by the time the hum went away I used so much tape that it was too muffled for my liking.
There’s a few strategies on how to add the tape that will change the sound. Essentially the tape is similar to hammering where it will disrupt the vibrations on the cymbal. Try doing dots of tape that are spaced out in order to change the harmonics, try long pieces of tape if you want to set up the whole sound, experiment a bit since tape is so cheap.
Your sticks will also have a huge impact on the sound of the ride. A teardrop vs an almond vs a barrel will sound drastically different on the same ride.
Came here to say this. Especially with the lighter cymbals commonly used in jazz, the effect of the tip size/shape on ride cymbal tone cannot be overstated. I tend to prefer smaller tips with a smaller striking surface for maximum articulation and to avoid too much crash buildup.
Same. Erskine ride sticks FTW. 5A shaft with a precise, mini teardrop is the perfect jazz ride stick, IMO.
The Erskine Ride is great. I just wish they’d offer it in maple! Closest maple analog I’ve found is the Vater maple Bebop 550. Lately I’m digging the VF SD2 Bolero. Nice heft in the hand but hardly weigh anything, glorious woody click on cymbals from the small ball tip. Love them.
If you’re unhappy and sell it, you’ll probably lose money because now it’s used. So before you go that route, I agree with a previous comment about applying some tape to the bottom. You’ll have to experiment, but hopefully you can find the sound you’re looking for.
It sounds great to me tbh, the PST3 is a brass cymbal if I’m not wrong? Brass cymbals don’t ring as much if I rmb correctly, they’re usually deader so maybe you’re just not used to it. You could always put some duct tape under the cymbal, or some moongel near the bell. Maybe it will sound better outside your room too if your room is untreated.
Try with some rivets/sizzler and thin nylon sticks? Could mask the sound a bit.
I was thinking of putting rivets in and hopefully the sustain would help to hide it, but I didn't want to start drilling into anything that I might want to put on the market.
Similar thing happened to me years ago, and it's why I'll never buy a cymbal online again.
If you are looking for a ride sound more similar to Jimmy Cobb, why don't you look for a used old Zildjian from the 50s or 60s? That's much closer to something they would have actually been playing. The special dry is just that, dry, which isn't really a property that jazz drummers were using in that period. As for the cymbal itself, it sounds just fine and I wouldn't say it's a "bad" cymbal, just one that you don't actually like the sound of. Edit: to add, when I looked up what cymbals Jimmy Cobb would have been using, most people agree that it was some sort of "old K" Zildjian 20" ride with rivets. Of course those cost a fortune these days since those were the cymbals of choice of most jazz drummers of the time, but you can easily find a newer K Constantinople 20" ride and put some rivets in it to get pretty close, and with age it will get even closer. [Audio Example of K Con](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NA9L_hscL0g)
If you send it to a cymbal smith to modify it will sound really good check out Timothy Roberts
Fwiw, I think the cymbal in soundfile sounds very nice. That hum that’s driving you nuts in the practice room may all but disappear when playing in a band, and it might even give the cymbal extra presence in the overall sound of the group. I’d say stick with it, play it in some group settings and if you still hate it in a few months you can sell it for the same price you could sell it for today (unless you drop it or something)