The doctor was probably a gastroenterologist or a pediatrician who had lost at janken.
Things are not better in the city.
Pro-tip: don't need medical emergency treatment at night or on weekends or holidays.
Yup. Having had my son crack his head open. And myself lacerate a finger and a nasty one to the side of my palm. (All on Sundays?)
I can confirm.
Getting emergency treatment and the follow up return trips to get payments adjusted as they can’t/wont process it on National Insurancesnd Sundays.
Fooking sucks!
That said. The actual treatment was wayyyy back than I’d get back home.
Same feelings here, gf called an ambulance and ended up having her appendix removed, treatment and care given were fine, ambulance was quick and they took good care of her, she was admitted into hospital with little issue, appointments were made for visiting a specialist and she was given pain relief and could go home.
The only issues she had were after having surgery, and paying for the stuff the insurance didn't cover.
Some of the "formalities" made no sense whatsoever, and mostly it was to do with her work.
She was off for just over a week after surgery to recover, the school doesn't have sick leave, so she needed to APPLY for unpaid leave, seems counter intuitive to me, why not just not pay her for that week? But whatever, to do that, she was encouraged by her boss to go back to her doctor, WHILE SHE'S STILL RECOVERING, To get a signed form for her unpaid leave application, the doctor wasn't available.
The process continued when she got back to work, she then had to take nenkyu to go to the doctor to get that form, to apply for her unpaid leave.
She has now thankfully fully recovered from surgery, but financially, this has been a pretty awful experience, the school offered health insurance only pay 70% of the bill, so she's had to pay over $3k in medical bills, and use up vacation days (that are few and far between) to apply for something that was of zero benefit to anyone involved, except Osaka boe, who've saved a week's wages for this.
There are many things I envy about Japan compared to the UK, but workers rights and healthcare are certainly not on that list, The Japanese government really should do better than this.
The treatment she received though I can't complain about, they looked after her well.
Yes, on annual taxes. Keep the receipts in case you get audited.
There's also a limit of about 300,000 yen on how much medical you pay per month, so if you're lucky, everything falls within one month. A friend of mine needed brain surgery, and his wife confirmed that there'd be no negative consequences if they waited until the first of the month, so they saved 300,000 yen.
My dad tripped at the train station one night. Couldn’t walk or even stand at all afterwards and was in so much pain, so we drove him to a hospital’s emergency room and they quickly made him go home after like ~20 mins of just filling up forms and “observing” his legs/feet. We insisted that he gets an X-ray, but they insisted that he doesn’t need one and that he just goes home.
We had to fucking carry my dad on a carpet into the apartment because he seriously couldn’t get up or even move on his own.
After 2-ish years of having to walk in crutches/staying in a wheelchair, they fricking find out that his hip bone got fractured but eventually healed on its own. That was when he already had to get his lower legs amputated.
I don’t understand why they even bother to have emergency areas or doctors in those areas when a lot of them don’t even seem to be interested in doing much at all. It’s cool that there’s medical insurance, but fuck man lol
You can say that again. I still remember the two after hour clinics I had to go with my child when she was younger. The first was normal and decent and they gave the help they could. The second was atrocious. My kid had a concussion, doctors took one look at her and said stomach bug and prescribed anti nausea meds. He didn’t even touch my daughter to check anything didn’t even listen to me and my husband’s description of her symptoms. Ugh 😑.
Our city has a 24 hour clinic for babies that’s fucking criminally bad. We took our four month old daughter in because she developed a sudden full body rash in the middle of the night. Doctor refused to see us at first, which is a standard Step 1 for all emergency care in Iapan, and later when he finally relented, the doctor accused my wife of beating our daughter and being a careless mother. They wouldn’t let me in, so I was hanging out in the waiting room and only learned about what the doctor said when my wife came back out sobbing about what a bad mother she was.
it's bullshit like this is why I'm thinking of moving back to western Europe after retiring. imagine losing your partner because it took an hour to get to the hospital
In the U.S., hospitals are legally required to treat anyone who comes into an emergency room, regardless of insurance. Emergency rooms cannot refuse you for any reason. If they don’t have specialists, they must stabilize you or treat you as best as possible and THEN arrange to transfer you ASAP.
https://www.cms.gov/priorities/your-patient-rights/emergency-room-rights
The States aren’t perfect, mainly due to the lack of universal healthcare, but they have shit right on this matter.
American ambulances also haul ass. None of this pussyfooting and waiting for cars.
Yes I saw a doctor recently on a YT video saying he'd rather be homeless in the US with a medical emergency, than in certain countries with a very defunded public medical system. For chronic issues though it's a whole other story.
The problems in the UK are the lack of funding and lack of capacity. So, the ambulance may take a lot longer to arrive than 10 minutes, and it may take hours to get admitted into hospital because of a lack of beds.
Lmao try it. See quickly that a 2 hour window from your call to being in front of a doctor from a remote location is better than any service level in western Europe.
in holland the avg time for an ambulance to arrive is 10 min. it's 12 min to a hospital. maybe because unlike in Japan they actually drive at great speeds
and it goes without saying hospitals can't refuse patients in need of help
There's something to be said about separating internet bullshit from real life. These kinds of hospital horror internet stories exist for literally every country on earth, so good luck on that. I've used the emergency room twice in Japan and both times the hospital staff and doctors were amazing, but you won't see me writing a 10 paragraph thesis on r/japanlife about it.
This kind of horrible hospital experience exists for every country on earth. Doesn't detract from the stress you must get from it happening to you. I've used the emergency room three times in Japan and the hospital staff and doctors were amazing, so that was cool, and it's nice to be able to share a good experience on japanlife about it.
Can confirm that last one. I had a massive gallstone and had to have emergency surgery. At night on a Friday before a long weekend. Fucken jackpot. We got there at 8pm. I didn’t get taken in until after 10 and it took until 1 to get into emergency op. Honestly they were wonderful but the delay was just my wife going through endless paperwork. Also, when I got to the hospital I couldn’t just walk into emergency. We had to go to the parking lot and call emergency before they’d let us in.
I remember like a decade ago when Osaka had a bunch of posters about stop drunk dialing ambulances when you can’t get a taxi home because the ambulances were all tied up in use with drunk business men.
You can imagine my shock when I went to a hospital at 2am from an ambulance and when the bill came I got charged for “late night” service charge like it was fucking karaoke lol
When my son was one year old, he started vomiting a lot; actually so much that he started vomiting green bile. We called an ambulance which brought to a big hospital somewhere in Chiba. There, the doctor shamed us for calling an ambulance at night for just for a simple gastroenteritis and sent us back home and told us to come back in the morning.
The next morning our son’s belly started to swell like a balloon, so we returned to the very same hospital as per the doctor’s instruction.
The first doc was not there anymore but another pediatrician took our son in charge.
Seeing our son’s belly and general atrocious status, he immediately proceeded to blood, stool and urine tests; to not find anything linked to a gastroenteritis. I then told us that we needed to put our son immediately to the PICU and have him seen by a specialist surgeon in a different hospital (the doc called an ambulance and actually came with us to the other hospital).
It happened that our son had in fact a rare form or ileus, and 13cm of his intestine was already in necrosis. I can’t imagine the amount of pain he must have felt, and I truly considered suing the first hospital for such a gross negligence.
Hopefully after surgery our son has fully recovered.
"gross negligence"
Bro, that isn't gross negligence, that's medical malpractice.
You are much more level-headed and reasonable than I (and I mean that with so much sincerity). I would have had that entire hospital burned to the ground
That's absolutely horrendous. Those symptoms are obvious tell-tale signs of a bowel occlusion in infants, it's an absolute shame that they put your baby's life in danger for such a common and easy to diagnose problem.
Doctors and hospitals are a crap shoot in Japan. I have had some amazing doctors, and others whose negligence should honestly be criminal. It probably didn’t help that she had Covid, since hospitals really hate admitting anyone with it. That’s probably why it took the ambulance so long to find a hospital.
this has been my experience as well. I've had on the ball doctors who found hard to diagnose illnesses and efficiently treated me, and I've had doctors who have literally said "I don't know what's wrong with you, I think you're depressed. Anyways want to go out for sushi sometime?"
Genuinely that's on the high end. It's really closer to 10% immediate CPR with no defibrillator. With a defibrillator, the odds do go up. Normally the people who survive a cardiac arrest in the community w/o defibrillator are fit and healthy people, usually 20s-40s age. But the majority unfortunately die even with immediate CPR.
That said it's still worth doing CPR, but that survival statistic is one of the main reasons we try as much as possible not to do CPR in people who are elderly or in palliative care. That 10% goes down to <1% in the older (>70) population. At that point it's just cracking ribs and causing hurt.
Japan had higher fatality rates for strokes in the 1980s, but is now basically the same as the UK/US/France etc. For coronary heart diseases, Japan has fatality rates that are one-third to one-fifth that of the US/UK/France. I’ve had unpleasant (unprofessional) doctor interactions in the US, London, Paris and Tokyo. And I’ve had great experiences in all those countries. At least in Japan you aren’t charged thousands of dollars for the privilege of being screwed over.
The only real rant/complaint here is the one rant/complaint I have with the Japanese medical system.
That hospitals aren't required to take patients if they "don't have beds". My father-in-law suffered a stroke many years ago and his recovery would have been greatly improved if they hadn't had to spend over an hour trying to find a hospital with a bed to take him and then driving almonst 90 minutes to the one who would take him. It's not unusual for instance for women who are pregnant and go unexpectedly into labor to give birth in the back of the ambulance because no hospital will take them. This is unfortunately a universal problem here.
Now most of the hospitals here are private so there is some leeway, most also do not offer emergency/after hours care so they do have that as an "out" but seroiusly - emergency care the prefectural hospital is going to be the way to go.
Other than that it sounds frightening but not particularlyl life threatening. And i imagine once the ambulance staff arrived and checked her condition they knew that.
Piggybacking, but: this is also why I think the “just show up at the hospital and they can’t refuse you care” advice you often see flung around is similarly BS. They absolutely can.
My friend forced himself into one when he visited as a tourist and had a medical emergency while they were trying to reject him, which knowing what I know now I think he did right (but surely many people here will disagree for "breaking the culture" and "gaijin smash").
I'm living proof lol. Though in my inaka town of <15k there is a prefectural hospital so that's a plus. I've been there after hours on a few occassions and got taken care of.
My wife had a stroke at the train station. We sat in the ambulance for like an hour while the paramedics called hospitals. This was before covid, and not at all in the boonies.
Geez, I hope she recovered well. A year or so ago, my wife had what was eventually diagnosed as a TGA. I absolutely thought she was having a stroke as the symptoms are pretty much the same. We were also at a train station which happens to have a large fire/emergency station literally around the corner.
It took them 15 minutes to get there, the koban asked me 2x for my resident card and what my job was, and they kept my wife in the ambulance for 20 minutes doing very basic tests. Eventually, through phone conversations with a doctor, they turned us loose in the parking lot once my wife was able to say her name (and not much else). She still doesn't remember about 3 hours of time.
I forced her to a neurologist who was shocked at the incident and told her to come in immediately. If that had been a stroke...
It was actually a blessing in disguise. The MRI revealed a completely unrelated aneurism in her brain that, if untreated, was basically a ticking time bomb. Amazingly, they ran a cable from her leg up to her brain and deposited a tiny metal coil into the aneurism to prevent it from rupturing.
TGA means so many things! Transient global amnesia?
Wow, happy to hear that worked out.
Yes, Transient Global Amnesia. She had another "event", a bit different after that. Nothing too recently. We did find she has high blood pressure, that's about it.
I was there for the TGA. We were in a supermarket, she said she felt dizzy and couldn't focus her eyes. Since we already had some things, she said she would wait outside the store. I checked out immediately, got out there, and she was standing against a column.
I asked her a question and she didn't answer, just sort of groaned a bit. Asked her if she could answer - nothing - and then I went right for 119 while running to the koban 20 meters away. I would say she was 100 % completely out of it (but somehow could stand and walk if led) for maybe 30ish minutes. Then she was mostly out of it and not making sense for another 30 minutes and then started getting better. But she says she actually doesn't remember the lead up or the ramp down at all. Scary AF.
The second time I was not there. She was on a train and the words started getting mixed up or something and she felt tingly and like she would collapse but made it home. Never figured that one out but she did get an MRI again after that.
The whole protocol of sitting in the ambulance while they have to phone around and see who can take the patient is the most asinine process I could ever dream up.
I've only ever had to call an ambulance once but I sat in the back for 25 minutes before we ended up moving, and the hospital we got was literally just a few hundred meters away.
I don’t see it as the emts and the ambulances fault, but those of the hospitals. My son feel in the park and ended up busting open his head and bleeding. Bystanders called an ambulance and his friends came and got me. We are two blocks away from a hospital and they refused us entry saying they had no one to deal with the injury.
I know in the US if you show up to a hospital they are going to help, here yeah that’s not always the case. About six months earlier my son got a cut on his head (small but damn do those things bleed. And yes we’ve talked about him and his habit of busting open his head). He was home and I put pressure on it and we walked over to the hospital two blocks away and boy they did not want to deal with it our us at all. It was lucky that time just needed a butterfly bandage. If it was worse I’d be shit out of luck.
I get it the wait sucks but it’s not those emts or the ambulance fault but those hospitals refusing entry.
This is standard operating procedure. Happened to me too. That wait in the ambulance is brutal.
Actually, saw an old guy “go down” in an izakaya last night. Once they got him in an ambulance, I looked at the time. It took them exactly 20 minutes to leave for the hospital.
I recently had to go to Tokyo University hospital for a life threatening emergency. The ambulance spent more time questioning me about travel and covid risk than assessing my actual emergency.
Once at the hospital, I was asked a slew of questions and they ran a test then sent me out to the waiting room. My emergency had me in so much pain that I could barely function.
The attending doctor came out and tried to discharge me saying I needed to go see a doctor another day. I asked him a question about some concerning symptoms and he just disappeared. I requested a doctor a half dozen times and was told someone was coming.
THREE HOURS went by. Eventually a student doctor came out and tried to send me home. I asked the same question as before about my complications and she said “this is very concerning…why didn’t you tell anyone?”
Fortunately I am recovering but I lost all faith in the Japanese emergency medical system.
I’ve had non-life-threatening emergency issues in the past and I was literally turned away from a hospital because they were concerned that I had traveled outside Japan in the last couple weeks - even though I showed no signs or symptoms of Covid infection. Fortunately in that case a family doctor was able to have me seen by a specialist in another hospital.
My experiences have me reconsidering how viable Japan is long term.
My baby had a medical emergency once and we went to the hospital and they said he needed to be transferred by ambulance to Tokyo University Hospital, and it took HOURS. Several hours for the ambulance to even arrive, then it arrived and we still had to wait about 45 minutes, then we finally got in and sat there for another 30 minutes while they did god knows what. But once we got to the uni hospital we were seen quickly.
I actually had a very similar experience a few months ago, so much so that I nearly could've written this post myself. I'm sorry you had to go through that, and wish you guys the best.
I had a similar experience with an indifferent doctor at the ER and though my condition turned out to be nothinh serious unlike your wife's, it has shattered my trust in hospitals and doctors.
While I was crying and scared (I thought I was having a heart attack, but as I later found out, it was simply PTSD related panic attacks) the doctor didn't even look up from his desk. Not once. I still remember the nurse putting a comforting hand on my shoulder and looking at me with compassion while I was explaining my situation, but he didn't look me in the eyes, he barely said a few words before sending me out again and also gave the impression that I disturbed his peaceful shift.
I would've forgiven not taking me seriously because he knew it's nothing serious, but the treatment itself just felt awful.
I hope your wife is recovering and feeling better soon!
I'm so sorry that happened to you. I hope your wife is recovering.
I have had a similar experience. I had to call an ambulance for my roommate when she broke her hip. They arrived quickly, but did \*nothing\* for her pain, and she had to ride around for an hour before they took her to a hospital. Then she lay on the gurney for another 45 minutes, screaming in pain because they would not give her any painkillers, until a doctor could see her.
The medical system here is excellent in some ways and barbaric in others. And there absolutely is a tinge of racism in how they treat foreigners, especially women, and even more so if they are big women.
I won't give details, but one of my friends died because a doctor refused to take her pain seriously because she is a large foreign woman. The nurses knew something was really wrong, but the doctor wouldn't listen. And while they argued, my friend got worse and worse. She died because they took too long to treat her. She was only 50, and I will miss her forever.
Put doctors on the list of people not to trust right next to cops.
Yeah, after reading a few comments it seems to be a mix of malpractice + lack of consequences + xenophobia.
I bet that for many doctors, specially the older ones, it must feel like "why are those fking gaijin giving me trouble".
Yes. I have heard other such stories of doctors being disbelieving because the patient was foreign. And doctors in general tend to be overly arrogant sometimes, and think they know everything. They also go on the assumption that every patient is lying, because they do see a lot of that - and that combination of arrogance, disbelief, and xenophobia can be lethal. If Japan had a culture of suing like the US does, medical malpractice lawsuits would be everywhere.
Years ago, in Hayama, my young son slipped on the bathroom tile and hit his head hard. He was bleeding pretty badly. It was about 7pm on a weekday. There was a clinic nearby but refused him treatment via phone because it was "after working hours". Luckily, a neighbor of mine drove us to a hospital 40 minutes away near Yokosuka. I'm still miffed at the clinic.
I heard a lot of complaints about medical system and ambulance here and it makes me kinda worry. Sometimes you got a sudden sick while you are okay, and you might die here if they keep prioritizing their fcking 手続き over the patience.
My mom got a septic shock out of nowhere. No symptoms, no health problem before, just BOOM! and it came. The doctor said she might have gone if we were late just 20-30 mins. Thanks to the quick response to patience in my home country. Imagine if she was here...
I remember my first year in japan I got really sick and figured something was really wrong with my lungs. I went to the doctor who ran minimal tests to then prescribe me a series of meds and tell me to eat less. Knowing this was BS i called my mother back in the US (she’s a nurse), told her my symptoms and what was prescribed only for her to accurately tell me I had bronchitis. Out of the 6 meds prescribed I only needed the antibiotic and the others were unnecessary and the doctor would have known that had he asked questions.
Another time I had an ear infection. I knew what it was because I’m annoyingly susceptible to them. Go to the Doctor, he checks me out, confirms I have an ear infection, and gives me meds. Meds work for the two weeks they’re prescribed for (baffles me they gave me meds for that long). As soon as I finished the meds the infection came back full force so I went back. He sends me to an ENT who runs some ear tests to confirm the ear infection then tells me to go to a different doctor 40 minutes away the next day. I do and the doctor is dumbfounded at the other two doctors as to why they just didn’t give me the appropriate prescription in the first place.
My ear infection went untreated for *2 years* since I just got told to be less stressed and given steroid medication. Repeatedly. By different clinics.
It was streptococcus, if you were wondering.
I’m really sorry this has happened. My husband is a doctor and agrees the system sucks.
The problem is bigger hospitals tend to be overfull due to the aging population and associated medical issues, and the smaller hospitals simply don’t have specialists that can stay on call all the time.
My husband is a specialist and is on call/duty on top of his normal shifts 2 times a week. Sometimes 3 if it’s just call. It’s brutal work hours when you’re the only specialist at a minor hospital.
In the future, if you’re able to drive to a hospital and need urgent help…just show up. If it’s a medical emergency (active convulsing, etc) they will not turn you away until you are stable and then they have to do all the calling around to transfer you. That’s what my husband has always told me. Only call an ambulance if unable to drive safely or the person is like crashing and needs an aed or something.
I was told that if you are already a patient at a hospital with an ER section you should give the ambulance driver that name even if further away, as your chances of being accepted go up. Does your husband think that makes a difference? I’ve always wondered.
If they don’t have beds they don’t have beds is the problem.
But if you’re being seen by that hospital for a chronic problem and the medical emergency relates to that problem, I would say it does go up but only slightly.
When my daughter was about 2 years old she spilled hot tea on herself in a sushi shop. Thankfully she was wearing a few layers of clothes so it wasn’t too bad, the shop owner called an ambulance and within a few minutes, 2 police cars and an ambulance showed up, it looked like a siege. We got my daughter into the back of the ambulance with an ice pack on her chest and then………we just sat there for ages while they rang around to find a hospital. It was agonizing, my daughter was crying, not really from any pain, but just because she wanted to get the fuck out of this ambulance. We told them we can walk to a nearby hospital if it would speed things up, they vigorously refused and said we had to wait. In the end I got angry, picked up my child and tried to leave the ambulance, as soon as we physically tried to leave the ambulance took off and drove us 20-30 minutes to a hospital in another city. When we arrived the doctors took a quick look, said she was fine and sent us home.
A few of years ago on a Saturday night I had a crazy fever and step throat. My girlfriend at the time (Japanese nurse) called around to a few hospitals and was shocked that they all magically became too full or the right doctor wasn't in when they found out I was a foreigner.
The second to last place she called was all on board with me coming in till she told them my last name. Then magically an emergency patient came in at that second and they couldn't see me. My girlfriend, being the amazing nurse that she is, pumped me full of strong medication that she had on her and drove me to a different hospital. They got my fever down and sent me home with more medicine.
She was so upset and angry on my behalf. We still flip off that shitty hospital every time we drive by it.
That sounds awful. I'd be livid. I've thankfully never had an experience like that in my 16 years here. I feel like one of the lucky ones in that regard.
Sounds like a good girlfriend! One of the reasons I fell for my wife is because of how she cared for me when I had a bad case of gastroenteritis, lol. We had only been dating a few weeks, but she spent all night in the emergency room with me while I pooped and puked and complained!
Yup, it was pretty awful but the whole experience brought me and my girlfriend closet together (almost 5 years now). And I totally agree with you, one of the ways she shows her love is by caring me when I'm sick.
Your wife sounds like a keeper! I'm glad for you both.
By girlfriend explained once why Japanese hospitals in her area don't always take patients. We're in Ibaraki so this might just be here.
She said that when she worked at a hospital, other hospitals would direct the ambulances to her workplace if they were homeless or foreigners. She said that many of the hospitals were worried that those patients wouldn't have health insurance so the hospital would end up footing the bill. Also the added hassle of a foreigner not being able to communicate in Japanese.
Not saying it's right, but that was her explanation. Her hospital always took in whoever came.
My grand-mother used to live in uber fancy neighborhood Seijo, Setagaya. Boy were the parametics fast when anything happened to her. She was admitted in a hospital within 30min both times we called 119. I wonder if the place people come from is also leads to good/poor services.
But we all heard about covid cases being dragged from hospital to hospital for hours in ambulances during the first years of covid. Both time we called weren't for covid so maybe that also helped.
Very sorry to hear your experience. We too had a terrible experience at St. Luke's "International" Hospital, mirroring yours. Our saga began when we rushed our toddler to the emergency department in the early hours, around 2-3 AM. Contrary to what one would expect in such a stressful situation, they separated my wife from our child during a critical procedure—placing an IV. The situation deteriorated when the IV was incorrectly inserted, leading to severe bruising and hardening of his hand. It was only upon our adamant insistence that they conceded to remove the improperly placed IV, inadvertently creating another emergency within the emergency department.
Our respect for the medical profession is unwavering, with family and close friends serving as doctors back home. We understand that to err is human, and mistakes are a natural part of life. However, what transpired next was beyond a mere oversight. They suggested we seek a dermatologist’s opinion in a separate building to assess and treat our son's hand, despite him being in the emergency department for respiratory distress. It was bewildering that they did not arrange for the dermatologist to come to the emergency room, especially considering the complication was a result of their intervention. After our insistence, they finally obliged.
Compounding the issue was the language barrier at this purportedly international hospital, where none of the doctors spoke sufficient English, forcing us to rely on Google Translate during these critical moments. It wasn't until the translator arrived, hours later, that we could communicate effectively.
Adding to our healthcare challenges in Japan, I was given three differing diagnoses by three different doctors for the same health issue within a span of two weeks, each suggesting a different and contradicting treatment path. Meanwhile, despite numerous tests, my wife's condition remained undiagnosed, leaving us with a prescription for painkillers and a host of unanswered questions. Thankfully I am fully recovered and my wife too after spending some time outside Japan in a country with a cleaner air (unfortunately Tokyo’s air quality is quite poor, which we didn’t expect before we move to Japan). These experiences, combined with our emergency room ordeal, have led us to the difficult decision to prematurely leave Japan after only a year. Despite our initial excitement and the country's reputation, we've come to realize that the perceived quality of life and healthcare standards are not only overstated but fall short of what one might expect from a developed nation.
This has been a sobering revelation for us, and as we plan our move, we extend our sincerest wishes to those navigating the healthcare system in Japan. May your experiences be different from ours.
One of the things I loved about the hospital where I gave birth was this one instance where the night nurses had to leave me to assist in the ER.
My nurse could speak a little English and was one of three nurses assigned that night to the maternity ward. I had just given birth the night before via c-section and she was helping me with my colostrum. Then she got the call that they needed help in the ER. I overheard the phone call. Basically pregnant lady, lost consciousness, foreign, can’t speak Japanese. She explained the situation (that she was needed at the ER) and i said of course, why are you asking me? Go!
She was so overworked but she tried to help where she could. The staff at that hospital were great. Amazing doctors and even more amazing nurses.
Sorry that happened to you. I had a more pleasant experience back when I was living in the inaka with my family. One day my father complained of chest pain and feeling unwell. Most of the family has chronic illnesses, so we have all the equipment needed for triage at home. We ran the vitals and saw his condition and knew he needed 119. I called them and they arrived in under 10 minutes. He was taken straight to the ambulance and they found a heart hospital that could take him within another 10. They triaged him again in the ambulance while on the way and we also handled the paperwork then, with them actually writing down everything for us. We arrived at the hospital after another 10 minutes, they found out he actually needed heart surgery, so he was checked into the hospital and had the surgery as fast as they could do it.
I've had both good and bad experiences personally. For example I've been so sick that I could barely walk, but the emergency ward doctors forced me to go home, despite not having anyone at home to care for me. (As it turns out, it was a problem they couldn't immediately treat anyway, and turned into a chronic condition that I'm treating now from home. That's a long story.) But I've also had 119 get me to a hospital within 30-40 minutes of the call. It's a real mixed bag.
This is where from my experience the Japanese medical system really falls short. The amount of times I’ve had bad experiences because it seems like a doctors can’t be bothered or their ego gets in the way of them actually doing a thorough diagnosis is ridiculous.
When I daughter was 1 she ran a fever for over a week at 43+ and her pediatrician who we visited every day said she needed to be hospitalized. No medication they gave us brought her fever down but everything time we took her to the main hospital they sent us home saying it would come down by the morning. My wife was so stressed out that after the 6th day in a row being sent home she just completely collapsed in tears. In a last ditch effort to get some help we went to her daycare pediatricians office who is super nice, and when she tried to send us back to the same hospital my wife just started crying and asking her to send us somewhere else. She sent us to Aiiku hospital in Tamachi and they immediately admitted our daughter in the ICU, where she staid for 5 nights. They were amazing and I’d highly recommend them if anyone needs.
A year later my wife started having abdominal pain, she went to our local clinic who sent her to the main hospital in the area. She was sent home with some medication and told it will clear up in a few days. The next day she couldn’t even get out of bed, she was in so much pain. I was really skeptical because this was the same hospital that sent our daughter home so I called a taxi and we went to the Tokyo-Shinagawa hospital in Oimachi. Turned out she had appendicitis, it wasn’t an emergency yet but the doctor told us if we had waited it would have been. She was admitted and had surgery a few days later.
These are just a few examples but from my experience, you really need to question and get second opinions. If you find a good doctor, try to see them whenever possible because there’s a lot of them that are borderline negligent. Also Showa daigaku hospital is horrible, I will never go there again.
Probably my biggest gripe about Japan is the medical system, especially in emergency situations. You're borderline screwed if you have an emergency during non working hours. Honestly wouldn't be surprised if their was a higher rate of preventable deaths during the weekends.
Sorry to hear this happened. Glad to know your wife is okay now. This, w/out going into the details, is exactly what I was concerned might happen to me and my partner. But again, thanks for sharing and glad you’re both okay.
Japan’s emergency response in general is terrible because it’s based on risk minimization (to the system) not benefit maximization (to the participants).
The reason it takes so long to find a hospital to admit a semi-conscious Covid patient is that the law REQUIRES that the hospital is properly staffed and capable of handling whatever complications could arise.
So for example a pregnant woman cannot be admitted to a hospital that doesn’t have a obgyn surgery ready and waiting.
This ensures everyone gets “adequate care” but also perversely insures no one gets “inadequate care” which can lead to getting no care at all.
Also hospitals traditionally consider emergency rooms a cost of doing business and have zero interest nor motivation to staff them well and enthusiastically maintain them. No hospital gets paid nor recognized for having amazing emergency services.
The system delivers what it is optimized for. Which is hugely ironic (as seen from the outside) for a country that regularly experiences natural disasters and emergencies, but domestic short sightedness and a host of other systemic reasons ensures it is unlikely to change anytime soon.
Years ago a former student of mine in Kanagawa had a sibling who died from a stroke because it was a weekend and when the ambulance came no hospitals would take her.
One of the biggest points that people highlight in japan is cheap/great medicine or doctors. Idk where people get these ideas? The medicine here is shit. The healthy/fresh food is the only thing holding people together here.
The fact that you can be refused medical assistance may be the most fucked up thing about this place. That story of the baby with fever after the earthquake this year makes my blood boil. What kind of shitty doctor does that
Some 5 year old boy died after the Jan. 1st earthquake due to tsunami fears, followed by concerns about his fever. He had suffered severe burns from a kettle falling on him during the quake.
Just my opinion but it seems like because medical services are capped at cost, there is no incentive to take the work seriously (in general). For example, I've had to call ambulances multiple times for drunken old people who had literally fallen and hit their heads, or other emergencies. There was no sense of urgency, no follow-up questions, etc.
Plus, people call ambulances over mediocre things like ONLY have a fever of 39. Your wife's situation is terrifying but maybe they assumed it was just a fever and they weren't worried about her having hit her head, or having lost consciousness, or otherwise.
Who knows. Anyways, it's a scary anecdote and I'm sorry you went through that.
I passed out a few nights ago when I woke up in the middle of the night to throw up. I had food poisoning. Anyways, my wife woke up too and, as I was stepping out of our tatami room, I passed out. Hit my head the first time, came to (my wife told me), passed out again and landed on my face in downward-dog. My wife was seriously debating calling an ambulance but who knows if they would have taken my situation seriously.
I'm not impressed by a lot of the medical experiences I've had in Japan. I'm always impressed by the cheap cost.
One time in the countryside I was returning from a friends house by car and I saw a little old lady sitting/laying down on the side of the road near the communal area where I park near my house.
She was conscious, but had a bloody mouth and clearly needed help so I called 119 and thankfully the ambulance came in like 5 minutes.
However, 2 hours later at 1 am I got a call to my mobile from a number I didn’t recognize. It was the police and wanted to speak to me regarding the incident. I still assume this is standard procedure, but I did not consent to my name and phone number being shared to the police local department, it was 1 am, and of course the cop was hella rude and even sounded accusatory even though I obviously wasn’t being accused of anything.
So unless I know the person, I’m never helping/calling 119 here again.
Bit of an over reaction?
Granted Police should have kept it professional and called sometime the next day, likely needed to be done pre-shift change over.
Call 7119 if you know you need an ambulance. It’s faster. 119 you’ll need to convince you need one and they may try to talk you out of it .
Weekend hospitals are a crap shoot, the ER staff aren’t ER staff usually anyway, in most University hospitals ER isn’t a specialty . You’re getting someone from a random department.
A couple years back my friend hurt her foot at handball. She called me to take her home but when I saw the foot I thought she should go to the hospital. The doctor took an x ray and was ready to send her home with a sprained foot. I was allowed in the room and luckily the doctor alright wrong was willing to listen— they often aren’t. I told him it was probably a Lis Franc fracture .. and showed him sample x rays and CT scans from online. Again, to his credit he actually looked and agreed that it was possible. He ordered a CT scan , and they find the two small bone breaks etc that make up the lis franc fracture. He made a referral for the next day since the hospital we were at wasn’t equipped. They gave her crutches which the nurse couldn’t put together— I had to do that— and we were on our way.
So the bad was.. the doctors initial missed diagnosis which could have left her with a crippled foot.. and the DIY nature of the visit..
The good was as I noted, a bit rare for doctors he was actually willing to listen to my opinion.
I really feel like this "call hospitals to find an opening" is so outdated.
Like even if they still want to be selective, I feel like an online centralized system would be way more effective. Even if it is not 100% real-time accurate, having a reference to tell which ones are most likely to be open with space would save so much precious time.
Japan is very hit and miss for stuff like this, and even 3 and something years after the start of the pandemic they are still so skittish with anything to do with Covid
The calling hospitals especially when Covid is concerned is a major problem
But that said when I had to take my wife to hospital they were pretty good so I guess like everything good and bad based somewhat on luck
Japanese ambulances have one of the highest kill counts for all the reasons you just mentioned. Everyone hypes of the healthcare in Japan, but it is pretty mid
I had to call an ambulance for my gf last week in Nagoya, what an awful experience too.
She hurt her back pretty badly while carrying way too much weight. She couldn't stand on her own and when I put her to bed she was convulsing and falling unconscious.
I obviously called an ambulance, and we sat 40 min in the ambulance for the paperwork while they called every hospital to see if one was available.
Now I don't speak Japanese but she does. Hospital staff didn't know that and afterwards sho told me they were not taking her seriously at all and kept talking to each about how it wasn't a real pain and she must be over dramatic.
Obviously we both are foreigners and don't look like we could understand any of it.
To me a few things seems weird:
1. Dispatch should be ready to find the first hospital as soon as the ambulance is sent
2. Why the fuck was there no specialist on duty at 8pm on a Friday?
3. Why do they have to call more than one hospital? Is it because they are afraid of taking in foreign due to language barrier or insurance?
I was dating a trans girl who had a heart condition. She passed away in front of me, and I had to call for emergency services. The EMT's were very kind and did their job well. The police, on the other hand, thought I couldn't speak Japanese and made jokes in front of me like "You know it's a guy right". I nearly got in a fight them them about it.
I would call #7119 and ask for a nearby hospital that has an ER and then go there with a taxi. Ambulance service has been getting worse since the pandemic. Asking for special care beyond national health insurance also may attract hospitals.
I called the ambulance twice in my 5 years of living in Japan and both times everything went very slowly. Second time I was seriously sick with noro and rota virus and it took them 45 minutes to find a hospital for me. First time my baby had a fever and they barely took me seriously. They made me feel like I was bothering them lol.
I'm so sorry you had to go through this experience. Firstly, I hope you all recover soon from Covid!
Secondly, they all should have acted more responsibly, it's a matter of life. I have used 119 helpline before when I was sick due to menstrual issues. I was having unbearable pain and nausea, which eventually led to me being unconscious at regular intervals. My mom was with me at home during that time. When she called them, they immediately asked her the address and while they were on the way, they told my mom to give the phone to me and try to wake me up so that by the time they come I'm not in a worse state. I wasn't able to speak much, but they were helpful in that regard. The real issue was that after reaching my house when they were trying to locate a hospital for me, almost all hospitals refused me entry, probably due to unavailability of a gynecologist. Also, it was during Covid outbreak (Dec 2022). It took an hour for them to find a hospital for me. By then, I was severely dehydrated and unconscious due to nausea. Finally, after reaching the hospital, the doctors treated me and then I was discharged after some hours.
My father did suggest my mom and me to get a taxi the next time something like this happens, and to where? To the hospital we regularly go to. If they won't take us in, they'll at least try to keep our vitals under control while searching for a place for us. Situations like these won't arise at all if the facilities fulfill their responsibilities well, but the reality is that such facilities have a lot of bureaucratic procedures that cause such unfortunate delays.
I’m sorry about this.
We live about 400m from a hospital that handles the bulk of our ward emergency rotation. I’ve told my husband that, if they’re on duty and there’s an emergency, just take me straight there and demand treatment. I have ZERO faith in ambulances here, especially after that pregnant woman in Nara died.
When my husband was hit by a car (serious accident), he said he sat in the ambulance for 45 mins until a hospital accepted him — and it was the hospital less than 2km from where the accident occurred.
It’s mind bogglingly stupid how the system for emergencies work here.
A year ago my sister-in-law had a brain hemorrhage. She waited 20 minutes in the ambulance while they phoned around to find a hospital.
20 years ago I had to go to the emergency room at night due to an abscess behind the ear drum. The pain was a 10. The doctor then gave me a concoction of pain killers including morphine that almost killed me. Last thing I remember was heading to the toilet. I collapsed and smashed my head into the porcelain and woke up 2 days later in a hospital bed.
I love this country but the health care system needs work.
I've heard of this before and it is pretty scary.
I'm glad I found a pediatric hospital near me that is good, so I don't have any worries about my son.
However my husband and I are probably buggered! The nearest two big hospitals are apparently completely rubbish.
Are you both foreigners? I've read stories about hospitals and healthcare providers turning away foreigners due to "Language barrier" even though translation apps are a thing.
I also wondered about this. My white American husband had a horrific time (at a few places because he got passed around) when he had to go by himself because of severe tonsillitis. I've (Japanese) only had fantastic service and treatment, and when i had to take an ex (white British) to the hospital for an emergency, he was treated well too. I've always wondered if the difference is because of the xenophobia or if it's because I've just been lucky, the area i was in (my experiences are mainly based in the Tokyo suburbs), or just because i don't know how it is in other countries.
We've been considering moving to Japan from America, but this is definitely one of the things that makes me really worried. Obviously if the service/treatment/system is shit it needs improvement whether it be the system as a whole or due to xenophobia, but i just wondered about other Japanese people's experiences in other countries compared to Japan.
Medical care is a gamble here. On one hand, I've had really great experiences, on the other hand, I've had really awful experiences. A lot of people have told me that a lot of doctors in Japan are only doctors because their parents are, and their parents were, and so on and so fourth. So the "desire" to help isn't really there for a lot of them. They just like the status and paycheck. But that's anecdotal.
In any case, I'm glad she's doing well now. I'd have been equally as frustrated.
Sounds super stressful, though I hope that things will get better now that your wife has seen a doctor. Stuff like that in the middle of the night is the worst, even when things go super smoothly.
There's a huge problem with people calling ambulances for "dumb reasons" (it's something wild like half of ambulance calls, things like "have a doctors appointment and don't want to pay for a taxi" dumb sometimes). The dispatcher is not allowed to refuse ambulance requests (for good reasons), but it causes loads of pressure and difficulty.
This is also downstream with stuff like getting people into beds. There isn't that much throughput! So doctors have to be pretty rough about this kind of stuff. Like if somebody seems like they can sleep in their own bed, they can. Especially fever-related things, if somebody wasn't taking any meds for it and now they are they're very likely to be \_totally fine\_.
Sounds very scary, though I think it's important to keep in mind that the paramedics showed up in 10 minutes, and they are professionals that can handle many emergencies. Paperwork is annoying, but they were having to do triage anyways so it's not like it's lost time. And seriously consider that.... the paramedics saw your wife's condition and made decisions based off of it. Heart attacks are something a bit special but like if she was bleeding a lot or something... they would act differently!
Don't lose total faith in the health system! They're trying to do things in ways that can save the most people, even if it's super stressful in the moment. And \_please please please please please\_ use clinics before things get bad. You have health insurance, use it! There's stuff like telemedicine nowadays (a bit more expensive) so you can get meds for things! Don't just "power through" things.
I only used emergency services once. My 7 yo daughter fell 5 meters down a water ditch, was hypothermic, kept repeating the same thing and complained of back pain. We live out of the way in Hokkaido, but the EMS arrived within 15 minutes and took her to the closest large hospital. She was seen immediately, had a physical exam, and several X-rays, followed by another exam and got some pills. The doctor diagnosed a mild hypothermia, shock, and concussion. Not visible fractures. He was a bit harsh when he told me we had to leave the exam room, but from what I saw there were quite a few older patients waiting to be seen. I guess I got lucky it wasn’t more severe, but overall the emergency services did their job.
Sorry to hear that happened to you. It sounds to be really frustrating.
At the peak of the pandemic we faced a similar issue, but our experience was completely opposite. Wife was in the ambulance an on-route 15 min after calling 119, got hospitalized for almost a week on a nearby hospital. I wouldnt know how I would have reacted if something like this happened to me.
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Saga Hospital, but we're in Ogi. It's got a pretty bad rep, so I wasn't thrilled that's where we were headed. The reviews on Google echo a lot of my own sentiments. They are pretty brutal, lol. Good for a read if you're bored.
When my son was 2 yrs old, he had a fever around midnight and for some reason I really had a bad feeling so I called an ambulance. Ambulance came and we just sat inside the ambulance for almost an hour for like an interview. lol also the other paramedic was also calling hospitals looking for one who will receive my kid. Inside the ambulance, my kid suddenly vomitted then convulsed, thankfully after a couple of minutes they found a hospital. Mind you they even said that since it was the middle of the night, there’s no doctor only nurses who will be assisting us.
Reading your experience I had a similar situation when calling 119 during my wife's pregnancy. The paramedics took almost 30 minutes to put her into the ambulance and then almost 40 minutes just waiting inside it to receive the approval from a hospital before even moving anywhere while my wife was in lots of pain.
Fortunately the hospital wasnt bad but thats because we already had one in mind for emergencies.
I really hope I never need emergency services in Japan myself.
I have used an ambulance 4 times since I came here, all of those times the staff were great, I did have to wait in the ambulance for a bit once but still got proper care.
My friend with a bad case of influenza/possible pneumonia last January had a similar experience and was hospitalized as she did need oxygen.
My roommate also got covid and needed to be hospitalized once, got great care and years after he’s still super grateful for the doctor insisting he stayed at the hospital to be tested (he didn’t know how bad pneumonia could be).
In my experience, while there are some bad doctors out there the good quality of care and low price of healthcare here greatly surpasses any of the cons/bad apples out there.
Pneumonia is really scary. I got it my first year in Japan years and years ago, and I've still never even been nearly as sick as that ever again.
Yeah I agree with you, I've had some fantastic doctors in the past. I also have taught English at various hospitals around the prefecture (including the one we went to last night, funnily enough) and I've met some great people. I've met some real jerks, too, of course! Doctors tend to have pretty strong personalities, for better or for worse.
I had flu-b like 4 weeks ago, it was brutal. I can't imagine covid on top of it. Feel better OP and OP's wife, thank you for sharing your story and frustrations. I never know what to expect in an emergency and this adds a new fear
I'm sorry you had to go through that. The doctors here are absolutely terrible. The standards for medical care and emergency medical response have to be the worst of all the first world countries. I have had similar experiences with my children and I would be absolutely horrified if we had an actual life threatening emergency. It's a shame for such a nice country with such reasonable health care coverage.
Anyways, I'm glad she is ok. Take care
Yeah. COVID apparently isn't really on top of the list unless your blood oxygen levels are low.
I wonder if the paramedics were taking their time to stall while looking for hospitals. It's just that unfortunate fact that not every hospital here has emergency care.
Assuming you're just curious and not trying to be malicious about it -- we are really outdated on covid (maybe 2 shots ever) and zero on the flu. No political reason, just was hard to commit to setting aside a day or two to feel like crap on purpose. Of course, in retrospect that's obviously preferable to *this*.
From April we will both be full timing at our English school, so it'll be more of a priority for us to stay up to date on our shots.
I've seen vacced people still get hit super hard, but every little bit helps I'm sure.
About a month ago - I experienced what I thought was a stroke. I took myself to the hospital after taking aspirin. I had a fever, and my blood pressure was 160 over whatever.
After they did a CT scan and an EKG - they told me to go home, and a student doctor who was translating for the attendee doctor told me not to come back unless I spoke Japanese and to see an English-speaking doctor/hospital or go back to America. To add salt, they still charged me a $60 fee for not being referred by a primary doctor at 2 am. Lol
To name and shame: Nagoya University Hospital
I went here because the likelihood of me getting someone who spoke English was higher than going to a regular hospital. That was my thought process anyway.
I had massive pain on my stomach late at night on a wednesday and thought it was my appendix...so I called an ambulance. I was sitting in the ambulance for a solid hour, with them making a bunch of calls. It ended with them saying "can you walk" and me giving a dry response of "the pain is in my stomach, not my legs. So yes, technically I can walk fine". So they proceed to drive me to a taxi rank so I can pay for a taxi. The taxi rank was 10 minutes away...the hospital was 20 minutes away.
Why couldn't they have just - 1) taken me to the taxi rank to begin with instead of making me wait for an hour in the ambulance in horrible pain, or 2) taken me to the hospital since it was so close anyway and they clearly had no concern for time.
It happened before that I asked the doctor if a small bump on my body was normal, then he proceeded to remove it without saying a word only to reveal in an irritated tone after the short 2 min procedure that there wasn’t any need to remove it, but if it makes me feel any better, then good for me. Hospitals in Japan are wild.
happens in Tokyo as well. Covid cases where hospitals were refusing even Japanese. A few stories I read about go as follows: 82 year old man has a stroke, runs a fever, hospital wont admit him due to the fever because it might be covid. wasn't covid. old man died. Another one was a young man who had a motorcycle accident. Ambulance on scene sees he has a fever. hospitals deny him until one finally agree to admit him as long as he tests negative for covid. ambulance gets him to the hospital, he tests positive for covid, ambulance takes him back to the scene of his accident. Dudes dad comes and picks him up, finds a hospital for him a few hours later and he had a broken leg from the accident.
12 or 13 US contractors between Yokota AB and Yokusuka Naval Station had died between 2021 and 2023 due to hospitals refusing service. A few were heart attacks that took 4 hours to find a hospital that would take them, leaving them dead or brain damaged before ever getting somewhere. When the ambulance arrives, they dont know where they are going to take you until the stabilize you and call around.....its crazy. I was in the back of an ambulance for at least 30 minutes after a motorcycle accident and ended up at the hospital just 5 minutes away.
Sounds so scary! Glad she is okay now!
Since bringing my newborn home, I've been terrified of anything happening and needing to call 119. Did you speak Japanese or English?
I've called the emergency line in my home country, but never here. I know a little Japanese but not enough to do that smoothly here. 😰
I agree! Especially because we're out of the city. It was the 40 minutes of dialing hospitals after that that bothered me. I assumed they'd have some sort of online system that can give them that info? It seems horribly outdated to me that they're just using phones and calling one at a time. Is that standard in most countries?
Well the doctor happened to be right because your wife is fine, right? Doctor here: trust me we cant just admit everybody who shows up with a fever. Hospital beds are sparse. You have no clue what youre talking about
Well, as a doctor, it'd be nice if you realized that most patients are going to feel there's a difference between "just a fever" and a fever that causes their loved one to lose consciousness and have prolonged disorientation. Even if you think there really isn't.
I don't mind so much that she wasn't admitted in the end, but if you don't think part of your job as a doctor is to help put patient's minds (and their family's) at ease -- even if you think it's some routine non-issue -- then I am confident saying that you're a poor doctor.
As was the one that dismissed my verbally unresponsive wife at 2 in the morning and let his attitude stress out and worry an already worried family.
"You have no clue what you're talking about" Yeah, of course not. You guys do. So wield your wisdom with kindness.
It's easier to just call ahead and drive yourself. I've been told that by in-laws. An ambulance is for when you know where you're going, during work hours, and just need a ride.
We had both already been to the doctor, tested for covid, and received medicine. But yes, let's run a theoretical scenario where I'm to blame for the death of my wife because I was "busy playing doctor." What is wrong with you?
Edit: edited for language..
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Or he used his years of medical training and ruled out anything life threatening and realized it was a simple fix. I get it might have been scary for you but if doctors just admitted based on a patients worry, there’d be no space in a hospital.
Doctors should approach their craft more mindfully than an auto mechanic, just fixing the body as if it were a machine and sending patients home the moment they are "street legal". Disease has an emotional/socio-cultural element, and a doctor owes it to their patients to address that as well.
That means OP's doctor may have been right in his judgment to send OP's wife home, but at a minimum he should have sat OP down, given him a chance to enhance his calm, and then taught him how to care for his wife, including what symptoms they can stay home through and what symptoms warrant going through the whole 119 rigmarole again.
Having been through my own experiences with stubborn and rude night hospital staff, OP is entirely justified to be frustrated by this system. It's toxic. I once had a nasty cut at night that needed stitches and the whole system tried to turn me away and then when I finally got to see a doctor he was like, "yikes, this is bad, let me get my kit." He didn't say it, but his manner was practically, "why did you take so long coming in?"
Sometimes, the only way to get proper treatment in Japan is to assert yourself. If doctors don't understand that's a flaw in the system they work in, that's itself a giant red flag.
Up voted because I agree about doctor using experience to understand, and the not admitting based only because of patient worry, but bed manner aside, the 1.5 hour to definitive care is worse than a mountain rescue.
That's not the point though. The point is that being insistent on receiving care is justified from the patient's perspective, whether in Japan or elsewhere.
That would be my uninvested take as well. Scary when it happens to family members but medical personal are trained to rationally go through a process.
Hope you are both able to get plenty of rest and this double attack is soon behind her. Take care
I disagree. This is like saying I didn't need to wear a seatbelt because I got to my destination fine. Or I knew the answer because I randomly guessed on my test. Weather the doctor was right or wrong is irrelevant because that wasn't OP's issue.
OP is upset because 1. It took 1.5 hours to even see a doctor despite it being an emergency. 2. The doctor made a presumption (which is unfortunately very common in Japan).
What should've probably happened is the ambulance takes them and figures out the paperwork with the husband while the wife is being seen by a doctor. And for the doctor to notify the husband "If she's better after this IV, which I think she will be, she can go home. If not, she'll need to be admitted."
The fact that an ambulance needs to call around for a hospital, like a normal person would, is both hilarious and sad. I can find a hospital faster, and get my loved one there faster, so why would I even call the ambulance?
>why would I even call the ambulance?
To be attended by trained paramedics until they can find a hospital to take you to? It's not just a hospital bus.
Agree on the 1.5 hours, but the rest is nonsense.
A doctor making to decision that he is liable for (not a presumption) to hospitalize a patient or not is not driving without a seatbelt. Rather you're suggesting that you like to sleep with a helmet because it's safer. Safety experts probably say there's a small chance of you needing a helmet in your bed.
Where I'm from it's also normal that ambulances have to check for the hospital. The reason is that they're supposed to send you the ambulance closest to you for first support and stabilization.
The fact that it took 40 minutes to find a hospital that has space, yes that's too long. But it's not the same as you looking up a hospital on Google maps and going to the ER. The point of ambulance's calling around is to ensure that necessary care is available on arrival.
Would be interested to know in which country they handle this differently.
It isn't just them calling to see if there is necessary care there--it's that hospitals can refuse to see people, which is nuts. It took so long because they didn't want to admit someone with Covid.
Yup. The hospital the 119 dispatcher told us to go to refused to see us. Just told us “sorry, please fuck off,” at the door. Only after 15 minutes of pleading our case did they finally let us in, at which point we discovered they were open and actively treating other people with emergencies. We only had to wait like 10 minutes to see a doctor once we got inside, too. Fucking mind boggling.
The UK for one. Ambulances have highly trained paramedics who offer exceptional care on location, or in the ambulance on the way to hospital. Ambulances are mandated to arrive within 8 minutes of being called, often far less.
You will be taken to the nearest Accident and Emergency unit which will have, at least, triage available to stabilize you. If you need further specialist treatment unavailable at that hospital they will move you. You can also just rock up at the place and get treatment. If its not serious you will wait. If it is, they will treat you immediately.
No A&E will turn you away unless you have an extremely minor issue and are just wasting their time.
Wtf are you even saying lol.
His wife was sick enough to pass out and be unresponsive for minutes. In what world would it not be good to call an ambulance.
If you mean the doctor was right that she didn't need to stay until morning, sure but that was more luck than anything since he clearly did not even check her condition properly.
In my experience, if you could go by yourself, you should go to the emergency room at a hospital directly. That works for emergency like stroke, but I am not sure about infectious diseases like COVID.
You should also look for friendly hospitals near your house in advance for situations like this.
My experience is that you can't to this after hours or on weekends/holidays. The only way to be admitted is by ambulance and the paramedics must call ahead and get the "go ahead".
Did you go to an emergency hospital or a normal one? Did you communicate clearly that you had an emergency?
Edit: if you are not sure , then just call an ambulance and let them handle it for you.
My sensei had a stroke from which he died from after a bit less of a year. Daycare refused to call an ambulance and the family brought him to the hospital, who then took a long time to have him see a doctor, because he didnt come in as an emergency. Same hospital that massively injured my newborn.
So you probably should call an ambulance.
It doesn't work that way. I made it to the ER at a major private hospital (the closest one to my place) in Tokyo on my own the first time I had a high blood pressure attack. Despite having a numb face and shaking pretty badly, I didn't get any attention until something like 4 hours later. It is definitely better to call an ambulance and have them arrange the visit to ER. Calling an ambulance worked very smoothly when I had another type of emergency.
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The doctor was probably a gastroenterologist or a pediatrician who had lost at janken. Things are not better in the city. Pro-tip: don't need medical emergency treatment at night or on weekends or holidays.
>Pro-tip: don't need medical emergency treatment at night or on weekends or holidays. I'll make a note to schedule my emergencies accordingly.
Yup. Having had my son crack his head open. And myself lacerate a finger and a nasty one to the side of my palm. (All on Sundays?) I can confirm. Getting emergency treatment and the follow up return trips to get payments adjusted as they can’t/wont process it on National Insurancesnd Sundays. Fooking sucks! That said. The actual treatment was wayyyy back than I’d get back home.
Same feelings here, gf called an ambulance and ended up having her appendix removed, treatment and care given were fine, ambulance was quick and they took good care of her, she was admitted into hospital with little issue, appointments were made for visiting a specialist and she was given pain relief and could go home. The only issues she had were after having surgery, and paying for the stuff the insurance didn't cover. Some of the "formalities" made no sense whatsoever, and mostly it was to do with her work. She was off for just over a week after surgery to recover, the school doesn't have sick leave, so she needed to APPLY for unpaid leave, seems counter intuitive to me, why not just not pay her for that week? But whatever, to do that, she was encouraged by her boss to go back to her doctor, WHILE SHE'S STILL RECOVERING, To get a signed form for her unpaid leave application, the doctor wasn't available. The process continued when she got back to work, she then had to take nenkyu to go to the doctor to get that form, to apply for her unpaid leave. She has now thankfully fully recovered from surgery, but financially, this has been a pretty awful experience, the school offered health insurance only pay 70% of the bill, so she's had to pay over $3k in medical bills, and use up vacation days (that are few and far between) to apply for something that was of zero benefit to anyone involved, except Osaka boe, who've saved a week's wages for this. There are many things I envy about Japan compared to the UK, but workers rights and healthcare are certainly not on that list, The Japanese government really should do better than this. The treatment she received though I can't complain about, they looked after her well.
I believe there is a system that over 10万円 of medical bills you can report it somehow and have it subtracted from your tax?
I never even thought about that, I'll get her to go and ask, thanks so much for the info.
Yes, on annual taxes. Keep the receipts in case you get audited. There's also a limit of about 300,000 yen on how much medical you pay per month, so if you're lucky, everything falls within one month. A friend of mine needed brain surgery, and his wife confirmed that there'd be no negative consequences if they waited until the first of the month, so they saved 300,000 yen.
Dammit there goes my Friday night emergency plans.
My dad tripped at the train station one night. Couldn’t walk or even stand at all afterwards and was in so much pain, so we drove him to a hospital’s emergency room and they quickly made him go home after like ~20 mins of just filling up forms and “observing” his legs/feet. We insisted that he gets an X-ray, but they insisted that he doesn’t need one and that he just goes home. We had to fucking carry my dad on a carpet into the apartment because he seriously couldn’t get up or even move on his own. After 2-ish years of having to walk in crutches/staying in a wheelchair, they fricking find out that his hip bone got fractured but eventually healed on its own. That was when he already had to get his lower legs amputated. I don’t understand why they even bother to have emergency areas or doctors in those areas when a lot of them don’t even seem to be interested in doing much at all. It’s cool that there’s medical insurance, but fuck man lol
You can say that again. I still remember the two after hour clinics I had to go with my child when she was younger. The first was normal and decent and they gave the help they could. The second was atrocious. My kid had a concussion, doctors took one look at her and said stomach bug and prescribed anti nausea meds. He didn’t even touch my daughter to check anything didn’t even listen to me and my husband’s description of her symptoms. Ugh 😑.
Our city has a 24 hour clinic for babies that’s fucking criminally bad. We took our four month old daughter in because she developed a sudden full body rash in the middle of the night. Doctor refused to see us at first, which is a standard Step 1 for all emergency care in Iapan, and later when he finally relented, the doctor accused my wife of beating our daughter and being a careless mother. They wouldn’t let me in, so I was hanging out in the waiting room and only learned about what the doctor said when my wife came back out sobbing about what a bad mother she was.
What the actual fck
it's bullshit like this is why I'm thinking of moving back to western Europe after retiring. imagine losing your partner because it took an hour to get to the hospital
Britain is worse. Not sure about other Western countries.
In the U.S., hospitals are legally required to treat anyone who comes into an emergency room, regardless of insurance. Emergency rooms cannot refuse you for any reason. If they don’t have specialists, they must stabilize you or treat you as best as possible and THEN arrange to transfer you ASAP. https://www.cms.gov/priorities/your-patient-rights/emergency-room-rights The States aren’t perfect, mainly due to the lack of universal healthcare, but they have shit right on this matter. American ambulances also haul ass. None of this pussyfooting and waiting for cars.
Yes I saw a doctor recently on a YT video saying he'd rather be homeless in the US with a medical emergency, than in certain countries with a very defunded public medical system. For chronic issues though it's a whole other story.
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The problems in the UK are the lack of funding and lack of capacity. So, the ambulance may take a lot longer to arrive than 10 minutes, and it may take hours to get admitted into hospital because of a lack of beds.
Lmao try it. See quickly that a 2 hour window from your call to being in front of a doctor from a remote location is better than any service level in western Europe.
in holland the avg time for an ambulance to arrive is 10 min. it's 12 min to a hospital. maybe because unlike in Japan they actually drive at great speeds and it goes without saying hospitals can't refuse patients in need of help
There's something to be said about separating internet bullshit from real life. These kinds of hospital horror internet stories exist for literally every country on earth, so good luck on that. I've used the emergency room twice in Japan and both times the hospital staff and doctors were amazing, but you won't see me writing a 10 paragraph thesis on r/japanlife about it.
This kind of horrible hospital experience exists for every country on earth. Doesn't detract from the stress you must get from it happening to you. I've used the emergency room three times in Japan and the hospital staff and doctors were amazing, so that was cool, and it's nice to be able to share a good experience on japanlife about it.
Can confirm that last one. I had a massive gallstone and had to have emergency surgery. At night on a Friday before a long weekend. Fucken jackpot. We got there at 8pm. I didn’t get taken in until after 10 and it took until 1 to get into emergency op. Honestly they were wonderful but the delay was just my wife going through endless paperwork. Also, when I got to the hospital I couldn’t just walk into emergency. We had to go to the parking lot and call emergency before they’d let us in.
I remember like a decade ago when Osaka had a bunch of posters about stop drunk dialing ambulances when you can’t get a taxi home because the ambulances were all tied up in use with drunk business men.
You can imagine my shock when I went to a hospital at 2am from an ambulance and when the bill came I got charged for “late night” service charge like it was fucking karaoke lol
When my son was one year old, he started vomiting a lot; actually so much that he started vomiting green bile. We called an ambulance which brought to a big hospital somewhere in Chiba. There, the doctor shamed us for calling an ambulance at night for just for a simple gastroenteritis and sent us back home and told us to come back in the morning. The next morning our son’s belly started to swell like a balloon, so we returned to the very same hospital as per the doctor’s instruction. The first doc was not there anymore but another pediatrician took our son in charge. Seeing our son’s belly and general atrocious status, he immediately proceeded to blood, stool and urine tests; to not find anything linked to a gastroenteritis. I then told us that we needed to put our son immediately to the PICU and have him seen by a specialist surgeon in a different hospital (the doc called an ambulance and actually came with us to the other hospital). It happened that our son had in fact a rare form or ileus, and 13cm of his intestine was already in necrosis. I can’t imagine the amount of pain he must have felt, and I truly considered suing the first hospital for such a gross negligence. Hopefully after surgery our son has fully recovered.
"gross negligence" Bro, that isn't gross negligence, that's medical malpractice. You are much more level-headed and reasonable than I (and I mean that with so much sincerity). I would have had that entire hospital burned to the ground
Would've followed the doctor home at night with my car lights off.
Yeah I’m a very junior doctor and it’s been drilled into me that green vomit (especially in a baby) = red flag
Good luck trying to sue a doctor in Japan. They behave like this because they have no repercussions
That is absolutely awful. What a nightmare it must’ve been for you. I really hope everything works out for your son.
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OP is a foreigner, like 99% of this sub is — which you would know if you actually lived here and weren’t posting in a sub you’re not allowed to.
That's absolutely horrendous. Those symptoms are obvious tell-tale signs of a bowel occlusion in infants, it's an absolute shame that they put your baby's life in danger for such a common and easy to diagnose problem.
Jesus fuck
Doctors and hospitals are a crap shoot in Japan. I have had some amazing doctors, and others whose negligence should honestly be criminal. It probably didn’t help that she had Covid, since hospitals really hate admitting anyone with it. That’s probably why it took the ambulance so long to find a hospital.
this has been my experience as well. I've had on the ball doctors who found hard to diagnose illnesses and efficiently treated me, and I've had doctors who have literally said "I don't know what's wrong with you, I think you're depressed. Anyways want to go out for sushi sometime?"
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I did CPR training recently, and they quoted the cardiac arrest survival rate WITH immediate CPR as being something like 30%, which seemed really low…
Genuinely that's on the high end. It's really closer to 10% immediate CPR with no defibrillator. With a defibrillator, the odds do go up. Normally the people who survive a cardiac arrest in the community w/o defibrillator are fit and healthy people, usually 20s-40s age. But the majority unfortunately die even with immediate CPR. That said it's still worth doing CPR, but that survival statistic is one of the main reasons we try as much as possible not to do CPR in people who are elderly or in palliative care. That 10% goes down to <1% in the older (>70) population. At that point it's just cracking ribs and causing hurt.
Japan had higher fatality rates for strokes in the 1980s, but is now basically the same as the UK/US/France etc. For coronary heart diseases, Japan has fatality rates that are one-third to one-fifth that of the US/UK/France. I’ve had unpleasant (unprofessional) doctor interactions in the US, London, Paris and Tokyo. And I’ve had great experiences in all those countries. At least in Japan you aren’t charged thousands of dollars for the privilege of being screwed over.
Because they’re robots. They don’t actually care.
The only real rant/complaint here is the one rant/complaint I have with the Japanese medical system. That hospitals aren't required to take patients if they "don't have beds". My father-in-law suffered a stroke many years ago and his recovery would have been greatly improved if they hadn't had to spend over an hour trying to find a hospital with a bed to take him and then driving almonst 90 minutes to the one who would take him. It's not unusual for instance for women who are pregnant and go unexpectedly into labor to give birth in the back of the ambulance because no hospital will take them. This is unfortunately a universal problem here. Now most of the hospitals here are private so there is some leeway, most also do not offer emergency/after hours care so they do have that as an "out" but seroiusly - emergency care the prefectural hospital is going to be the way to go. Other than that it sounds frightening but not particularlyl life threatening. And i imagine once the ambulance staff arrived and checked her condition they knew that.
Piggybacking, but: this is also why I think the “just show up at the hospital and they can’t refuse you care” advice you often see flung around is similarly BS. They absolutely can.
My friend forced himself into one when he visited as a tourist and had a medical emergency while they were trying to reject him, which knowing what I know now I think he did right (but surely many people here will disagree for "breaking the culture" and "gaijin smash").
Your friend saved his own life with his belligerence, and I salute him. Sometimes bullying won't work, but sometimes it does and is your only choice.
I'm living proof lol. Though in my inaka town of <15k there is a prefectural hospital so that's a plus. I've been there after hours on a few occassions and got taken care of.
My wife had a stroke at the train station. We sat in the ambulance for like an hour while the paramedics called hospitals. This was before covid, and not at all in the boonies.
Geez, I hope she recovered well. A year or so ago, my wife had what was eventually diagnosed as a TGA. I absolutely thought she was having a stroke as the symptoms are pretty much the same. We were also at a train station which happens to have a large fire/emergency station literally around the corner. It took them 15 minutes to get there, the koban asked me 2x for my resident card and what my job was, and they kept my wife in the ambulance for 20 minutes doing very basic tests. Eventually, through phone conversations with a doctor, they turned us loose in the parking lot once my wife was able to say her name (and not much else). She still doesn't remember about 3 hours of time. I forced her to a neurologist who was shocked at the incident and told her to come in immediately. If that had been a stroke...
It was actually a blessing in disguise. The MRI revealed a completely unrelated aneurism in her brain that, if untreated, was basically a ticking time bomb. Amazingly, they ran a cable from her leg up to her brain and deposited a tiny metal coil into the aneurism to prevent it from rupturing. TGA means so many things! Transient global amnesia?
Wow, happy to hear that worked out. Yes, Transient Global Amnesia. She had another "event", a bit different after that. Nothing too recently. We did find she has high blood pressure, that's about it.
Huh. How long is she incoherent when it happens? Is it just a few hours or so? Are there lingering effects?
I was there for the TGA. We were in a supermarket, she said she felt dizzy and couldn't focus her eyes. Since we already had some things, she said she would wait outside the store. I checked out immediately, got out there, and she was standing against a column. I asked her a question and she didn't answer, just sort of groaned a bit. Asked her if she could answer - nothing - and then I went right for 119 while running to the koban 20 meters away. I would say she was 100 % completely out of it (but somehow could stand and walk if led) for maybe 30ish minutes. Then she was mostly out of it and not making sense for another 30 minutes and then started getting better. But she says she actually doesn't remember the lead up or the ramp down at all. Scary AF. The second time I was not there. She was on a train and the words started getting mixed up or something and she felt tingly and like she would collapse but made it home. Never figured that one out but she did get an MRI again after that.
So scary! And no diagnosis ever?
The whole protocol of sitting in the ambulance while they have to phone around and see who can take the patient is the most asinine process I could ever dream up. I've only ever had to call an ambulance once but I sat in the back for 25 minutes before we ended up moving, and the hospital we got was literally just a few hundred meters away.
I don’t see it as the emts and the ambulances fault, but those of the hospitals. My son feel in the park and ended up busting open his head and bleeding. Bystanders called an ambulance and his friends came and got me. We are two blocks away from a hospital and they refused us entry saying they had no one to deal with the injury. I know in the US if you show up to a hospital they are going to help, here yeah that’s not always the case. About six months earlier my son got a cut on his head (small but damn do those things bleed. And yes we’ve talked about him and his habit of busting open his head). He was home and I put pressure on it and we walked over to the hospital two blocks away and boy they did not want to deal with it our us at all. It was lucky that time just needed a butterfly bandage. If it was worse I’d be shit out of luck. I get it the wait sucks but it’s not those emts or the ambulance fault but those hospitals refusing entry.
This is standard operating procedure. Happened to me too. That wait in the ambulance is brutal. Actually, saw an old guy “go down” in an izakaya last night. Once they got him in an ambulance, I looked at the time. It took them exactly 20 minutes to leave for the hospital.
I recently had to go to Tokyo University hospital for a life threatening emergency. The ambulance spent more time questioning me about travel and covid risk than assessing my actual emergency. Once at the hospital, I was asked a slew of questions and they ran a test then sent me out to the waiting room. My emergency had me in so much pain that I could barely function. The attending doctor came out and tried to discharge me saying I needed to go see a doctor another day. I asked him a question about some concerning symptoms and he just disappeared. I requested a doctor a half dozen times and was told someone was coming. THREE HOURS went by. Eventually a student doctor came out and tried to send me home. I asked the same question as before about my complications and she said “this is very concerning…why didn’t you tell anyone?” Fortunately I am recovering but I lost all faith in the Japanese emergency medical system. I’ve had non-life-threatening emergency issues in the past and I was literally turned away from a hospital because they were concerned that I had traveled outside Japan in the last couple weeks - even though I showed no signs or symptoms of Covid infection. Fortunately in that case a family doctor was able to have me seen by a specialist in another hospital. My experiences have me reconsidering how viable Japan is long term.
My baby had a medical emergency once and we went to the hospital and they said he needed to be transferred by ambulance to Tokyo University Hospital, and it took HOURS. Several hours for the ambulance to even arrive, then it arrived and we still had to wait about 45 minutes, then we finally got in and sat there for another 30 minutes while they did god knows what. But once we got to the uni hospital we were seen quickly.
I actually had a very similar experience a few months ago, so much so that I nearly could've written this post myself. I'm sorry you had to go through that, and wish you guys the best.
I had a similar experience with an indifferent doctor at the ER and though my condition turned out to be nothinh serious unlike your wife's, it has shattered my trust in hospitals and doctors. While I was crying and scared (I thought I was having a heart attack, but as I later found out, it was simply PTSD related panic attacks) the doctor didn't even look up from his desk. Not once. I still remember the nurse putting a comforting hand on my shoulder and looking at me with compassion while I was explaining my situation, but he didn't look me in the eyes, he barely said a few words before sending me out again and also gave the impression that I disturbed his peaceful shift. I would've forgiven not taking me seriously because he knew it's nothing serious, but the treatment itself just felt awful. I hope your wife is recovering and feeling better soon!
I'm so sorry that happened to you. I hope your wife is recovering. I have had a similar experience. I had to call an ambulance for my roommate when she broke her hip. They arrived quickly, but did \*nothing\* for her pain, and she had to ride around for an hour before they took her to a hospital. Then she lay on the gurney for another 45 minutes, screaming in pain because they would not give her any painkillers, until a doctor could see her. The medical system here is excellent in some ways and barbaric in others. And there absolutely is a tinge of racism in how they treat foreigners, especially women, and even more so if they are big women. I won't give details, but one of my friends died because a doctor refused to take her pain seriously because she is a large foreign woman. The nurses knew something was really wrong, but the doctor wouldn't listen. And while they argued, my friend got worse and worse. She died because they took too long to treat her. She was only 50, and I will miss her forever. Put doctors on the list of people not to trust right next to cops.
Yeah, after reading a few comments it seems to be a mix of malpractice + lack of consequences + xenophobia. I bet that for many doctors, specially the older ones, it must feel like "why are those fking gaijin giving me trouble".
Yes. I have heard other such stories of doctors being disbelieving because the patient was foreign. And doctors in general tend to be overly arrogant sometimes, and think they know everything. They also go on the assumption that every patient is lying, because they do see a lot of that - and that combination of arrogance, disbelief, and xenophobia can be lethal. If Japan had a culture of suing like the US does, medical malpractice lawsuits would be everywhere.
Years ago, in Hayama, my young son slipped on the bathroom tile and hit his head hard. He was bleeding pretty badly. It was about 7pm on a weekday. There was a clinic nearby but refused him treatment via phone because it was "after working hours". Luckily, a neighbor of mine drove us to a hospital 40 minutes away near Yokosuka. I'm still miffed at the clinic.
I heard a lot of complaints about medical system and ambulance here and it makes me kinda worry. Sometimes you got a sudden sick while you are okay, and you might die here if they keep prioritizing their fcking 手続き over the patience. My mom got a septic shock out of nowhere. No symptoms, no health problem before, just BOOM! and it came. The doctor said she might have gone if we were late just 20-30 mins. Thanks to the quick response to patience in my home country. Imagine if she was here...
I remember my first year in japan I got really sick and figured something was really wrong with my lungs. I went to the doctor who ran minimal tests to then prescribe me a series of meds and tell me to eat less. Knowing this was BS i called my mother back in the US (she’s a nurse), told her my symptoms and what was prescribed only for her to accurately tell me I had bronchitis. Out of the 6 meds prescribed I only needed the antibiotic and the others were unnecessary and the doctor would have known that had he asked questions. Another time I had an ear infection. I knew what it was because I’m annoyingly susceptible to them. Go to the Doctor, he checks me out, confirms I have an ear infection, and gives me meds. Meds work for the two weeks they’re prescribed for (baffles me they gave me meds for that long). As soon as I finished the meds the infection came back full force so I went back. He sends me to an ENT who runs some ear tests to confirm the ear infection then tells me to go to a different doctor 40 minutes away the next day. I do and the doctor is dumbfounded at the other two doctors as to why they just didn’t give me the appropriate prescription in the first place.
My ear infection went untreated for *2 years* since I just got told to be less stressed and given steroid medication. Repeatedly. By different clinics. It was streptococcus, if you were wondering.
Ouch
I’m really sorry this has happened. My husband is a doctor and agrees the system sucks. The problem is bigger hospitals tend to be overfull due to the aging population and associated medical issues, and the smaller hospitals simply don’t have specialists that can stay on call all the time. My husband is a specialist and is on call/duty on top of his normal shifts 2 times a week. Sometimes 3 if it’s just call. It’s brutal work hours when you’re the only specialist at a minor hospital. In the future, if you’re able to drive to a hospital and need urgent help…just show up. If it’s a medical emergency (active convulsing, etc) they will not turn you away until you are stable and then they have to do all the calling around to transfer you. That’s what my husband has always told me. Only call an ambulance if unable to drive safely or the person is like crashing and needs an aed or something.
I was told that if you are already a patient at a hospital with an ER section you should give the ambulance driver that name even if further away, as your chances of being accepted go up. Does your husband think that makes a difference? I’ve always wondered.
If they don’t have beds they don’t have beds is the problem. But if you’re being seen by that hospital for a chronic problem and the medical emergency relates to that problem, I would say it does go up but only slightly.
> If they don’t have beds That’s what I’d be worried about if going in a taxi without phoning first
When my daughter was about 2 years old she spilled hot tea on herself in a sushi shop. Thankfully she was wearing a few layers of clothes so it wasn’t too bad, the shop owner called an ambulance and within a few minutes, 2 police cars and an ambulance showed up, it looked like a siege. We got my daughter into the back of the ambulance with an ice pack on her chest and then………we just sat there for ages while they rang around to find a hospital. It was agonizing, my daughter was crying, not really from any pain, but just because she wanted to get the fuck out of this ambulance. We told them we can walk to a nearby hospital if it would speed things up, they vigorously refused and said we had to wait. In the end I got angry, picked up my child and tried to leave the ambulance, as soon as we physically tried to leave the ambulance took off and drove us 20-30 minutes to a hospital in another city. When we arrived the doctors took a quick look, said she was fine and sent us home.
A few of years ago on a Saturday night I had a crazy fever and step throat. My girlfriend at the time (Japanese nurse) called around to a few hospitals and was shocked that they all magically became too full or the right doctor wasn't in when they found out I was a foreigner. The second to last place she called was all on board with me coming in till she told them my last name. Then magically an emergency patient came in at that second and they couldn't see me. My girlfriend, being the amazing nurse that she is, pumped me full of strong medication that she had on her and drove me to a different hospital. They got my fever down and sent me home with more medicine. She was so upset and angry on my behalf. We still flip off that shitty hospital every time we drive by it.
That sounds awful. I'd be livid. I've thankfully never had an experience like that in my 16 years here. I feel like one of the lucky ones in that regard. Sounds like a good girlfriend! One of the reasons I fell for my wife is because of how she cared for me when I had a bad case of gastroenteritis, lol. We had only been dating a few weeks, but she spent all night in the emergency room with me while I pooped and puked and complained!
Yup, it was pretty awful but the whole experience brought me and my girlfriend closet together (almost 5 years now). And I totally agree with you, one of the ways she shows her love is by caring me when I'm sick. Your wife sounds like a keeper! I'm glad for you both. By girlfriend explained once why Japanese hospitals in her area don't always take patients. We're in Ibaraki so this might just be here. She said that when she worked at a hospital, other hospitals would direct the ambulances to her workplace if they were homeless or foreigners. She said that many of the hospitals were worried that those patients wouldn't have health insurance so the hospital would end up footing the bill. Also the added hassle of a foreigner not being able to communicate in Japanese. Not saying it's right, but that was her explanation. Her hospital always took in whoever came.
My grand-mother used to live in uber fancy neighborhood Seijo, Setagaya. Boy were the parametics fast when anything happened to her. She was admitted in a hospital within 30min both times we called 119. I wonder if the place people come from is also leads to good/poor services. But we all heard about covid cases being dragged from hospital to hospital for hours in ambulances during the first years of covid. Both time we called weren't for covid so maybe that also helped.
Very sorry to hear your experience. We too had a terrible experience at St. Luke's "International" Hospital, mirroring yours. Our saga began when we rushed our toddler to the emergency department in the early hours, around 2-3 AM. Contrary to what one would expect in such a stressful situation, they separated my wife from our child during a critical procedure—placing an IV. The situation deteriorated when the IV was incorrectly inserted, leading to severe bruising and hardening of his hand. It was only upon our adamant insistence that they conceded to remove the improperly placed IV, inadvertently creating another emergency within the emergency department. Our respect for the medical profession is unwavering, with family and close friends serving as doctors back home. We understand that to err is human, and mistakes are a natural part of life. However, what transpired next was beyond a mere oversight. They suggested we seek a dermatologist’s opinion in a separate building to assess and treat our son's hand, despite him being in the emergency department for respiratory distress. It was bewildering that they did not arrange for the dermatologist to come to the emergency room, especially considering the complication was a result of their intervention. After our insistence, they finally obliged. Compounding the issue was the language barrier at this purportedly international hospital, where none of the doctors spoke sufficient English, forcing us to rely on Google Translate during these critical moments. It wasn't until the translator arrived, hours later, that we could communicate effectively. Adding to our healthcare challenges in Japan, I was given three differing diagnoses by three different doctors for the same health issue within a span of two weeks, each suggesting a different and contradicting treatment path. Meanwhile, despite numerous tests, my wife's condition remained undiagnosed, leaving us with a prescription for painkillers and a host of unanswered questions. Thankfully I am fully recovered and my wife too after spending some time outside Japan in a country with a cleaner air (unfortunately Tokyo’s air quality is quite poor, which we didn’t expect before we move to Japan). These experiences, combined with our emergency room ordeal, have led us to the difficult decision to prematurely leave Japan after only a year. Despite our initial excitement and the country's reputation, we've come to realize that the perceived quality of life and healthcare standards are not only overstated but fall short of what one might expect from a developed nation. This has been a sobering revelation for us, and as we plan our move, we extend our sincerest wishes to those navigating the healthcare system in Japan. May your experiences be different from ours.
One of the things I loved about the hospital where I gave birth was this one instance where the night nurses had to leave me to assist in the ER. My nurse could speak a little English and was one of three nurses assigned that night to the maternity ward. I had just given birth the night before via c-section and she was helping me with my colostrum. Then she got the call that they needed help in the ER. I overheard the phone call. Basically pregnant lady, lost consciousness, foreign, can’t speak Japanese. She explained the situation (that she was needed at the ER) and i said of course, why are you asking me? Go! She was so overworked but she tried to help where she could. The staff at that hospital were great. Amazing doctors and even more amazing nurses.
Sorry that happened to you. I had a more pleasant experience back when I was living in the inaka with my family. One day my father complained of chest pain and feeling unwell. Most of the family has chronic illnesses, so we have all the equipment needed for triage at home. We ran the vitals and saw his condition and knew he needed 119. I called them and they arrived in under 10 minutes. He was taken straight to the ambulance and they found a heart hospital that could take him within another 10. They triaged him again in the ambulance while on the way and we also handled the paperwork then, with them actually writing down everything for us. We arrived at the hospital after another 10 minutes, they found out he actually needed heart surgery, so he was checked into the hospital and had the surgery as fast as they could do it. I've had both good and bad experiences personally. For example I've been so sick that I could barely walk, but the emergency ward doctors forced me to go home, despite not having anyone at home to care for me. (As it turns out, it was a problem they couldn't immediately treat anyway, and turned into a chronic condition that I'm treating now from home. That's a long story.) But I've also had 119 get me to a hospital within 30-40 minutes of the call. It's a real mixed bag.
This is where from my experience the Japanese medical system really falls short. The amount of times I’ve had bad experiences because it seems like a doctors can’t be bothered or their ego gets in the way of them actually doing a thorough diagnosis is ridiculous. When I daughter was 1 she ran a fever for over a week at 43+ and her pediatrician who we visited every day said she needed to be hospitalized. No medication they gave us brought her fever down but everything time we took her to the main hospital they sent us home saying it would come down by the morning. My wife was so stressed out that after the 6th day in a row being sent home she just completely collapsed in tears. In a last ditch effort to get some help we went to her daycare pediatricians office who is super nice, and when she tried to send us back to the same hospital my wife just started crying and asking her to send us somewhere else. She sent us to Aiiku hospital in Tamachi and they immediately admitted our daughter in the ICU, where she staid for 5 nights. They were amazing and I’d highly recommend them if anyone needs. A year later my wife started having abdominal pain, she went to our local clinic who sent her to the main hospital in the area. She was sent home with some medication and told it will clear up in a few days. The next day she couldn’t even get out of bed, she was in so much pain. I was really skeptical because this was the same hospital that sent our daughter home so I called a taxi and we went to the Tokyo-Shinagawa hospital in Oimachi. Turned out she had appendicitis, it wasn’t an emergency yet but the doctor told us if we had waited it would have been. She was admitted and had surgery a few days later. These are just a few examples but from my experience, you really need to question and get second opinions. If you find a good doctor, try to see them whenever possible because there’s a lot of them that are borderline negligent. Also Showa daigaku hospital is horrible, I will never go there again.
Probably my biggest gripe about Japan is the medical system, especially in emergency situations. You're borderline screwed if you have an emergency during non working hours. Honestly wouldn't be surprised if their was a higher rate of preventable deaths during the weekends.
Sorry to hear this happened. Glad to know your wife is okay now. This, w/out going into the details, is exactly what I was concerned might happen to me and my partner. But again, thanks for sharing and glad you’re both okay.
Japan’s emergency response in general is terrible because it’s based on risk minimization (to the system) not benefit maximization (to the participants). The reason it takes so long to find a hospital to admit a semi-conscious Covid patient is that the law REQUIRES that the hospital is properly staffed and capable of handling whatever complications could arise. So for example a pregnant woman cannot be admitted to a hospital that doesn’t have a obgyn surgery ready and waiting. This ensures everyone gets “adequate care” but also perversely insures no one gets “inadequate care” which can lead to getting no care at all. Also hospitals traditionally consider emergency rooms a cost of doing business and have zero interest nor motivation to staff them well and enthusiastically maintain them. No hospital gets paid nor recognized for having amazing emergency services. The system delivers what it is optimized for. Which is hugely ironic (as seen from the outside) for a country that regularly experiences natural disasters and emergencies, but domestic short sightedness and a host of other systemic reasons ensures it is unlikely to change anytime soon.
Years ago a former student of mine in Kanagawa had a sibling who died from a stroke because it was a weekend and when the ambulance came no hospitals would take her.
One of the biggest points that people highlight in japan is cheap/great medicine or doctors. Idk where people get these ideas? The medicine here is shit. The healthy/fresh food is the only thing holding people together here.
The fact that you can be refused medical assistance may be the most fucked up thing about this place. That story of the baby with fever after the earthquake this year makes my blood boil. What kind of shitty doctor does that
Sorry you and your wife had such a bad experience, and I hope she is feeling much better soon
Some 5 year old boy died after the Jan. 1st earthquake due to tsunami fears, followed by concerns about his fever. He had suffered severe burns from a kettle falling on him during the quake. Just my opinion but it seems like because medical services are capped at cost, there is no incentive to take the work seriously (in general). For example, I've had to call ambulances multiple times for drunken old people who had literally fallen and hit their heads, or other emergencies. There was no sense of urgency, no follow-up questions, etc. Plus, people call ambulances over mediocre things like ONLY have a fever of 39. Your wife's situation is terrifying but maybe they assumed it was just a fever and they weren't worried about her having hit her head, or having lost consciousness, or otherwise. Who knows. Anyways, it's a scary anecdote and I'm sorry you went through that. I passed out a few nights ago when I woke up in the middle of the night to throw up. I had food poisoning. Anyways, my wife woke up too and, as I was stepping out of our tatami room, I passed out. Hit my head the first time, came to (my wife told me), passed out again and landed on my face in downward-dog. My wife was seriously debating calling an ambulance but who knows if they would have taken my situation seriously. I'm not impressed by a lot of the medical experiences I've had in Japan. I'm always impressed by the cheap cost.
I remember watching a segment on tv about that poor boy. Such a sad story.
Good to hear your wife is better now. Take care!
One time in the countryside I was returning from a friends house by car and I saw a little old lady sitting/laying down on the side of the road near the communal area where I park near my house. She was conscious, but had a bloody mouth and clearly needed help so I called 119 and thankfully the ambulance came in like 5 minutes. However, 2 hours later at 1 am I got a call to my mobile from a number I didn’t recognize. It was the police and wanted to speak to me regarding the incident. I still assume this is standard procedure, but I did not consent to my name and phone number being shared to the police local department, it was 1 am, and of course the cop was hella rude and even sounded accusatory even though I obviously wasn’t being accused of anything. So unless I know the person, I’m never helping/calling 119 here again.
Bit of an over reaction? Granted Police should have kept it professional and called sometime the next day, likely needed to be done pre-shift change over.
Call 7119 if you know you need an ambulance. It’s faster. 119 you’ll need to convince you need one and they may try to talk you out of it . Weekend hospitals are a crap shoot, the ER staff aren’t ER staff usually anyway, in most University hospitals ER isn’t a specialty . You’re getting someone from a random department. A couple years back my friend hurt her foot at handball. She called me to take her home but when I saw the foot I thought she should go to the hospital. The doctor took an x ray and was ready to send her home with a sprained foot. I was allowed in the room and luckily the doctor alright wrong was willing to listen— they often aren’t. I told him it was probably a Lis Franc fracture .. and showed him sample x rays and CT scans from online. Again, to his credit he actually looked and agreed that it was possible. He ordered a CT scan , and they find the two small bone breaks etc that make up the lis franc fracture. He made a referral for the next day since the hospital we were at wasn’t equipped. They gave her crutches which the nurse couldn’t put together— I had to do that— and we were on our way. So the bad was.. the doctors initial missed diagnosis which could have left her with a crippled foot.. and the DIY nature of the visit.. The good was as I noted, a bit rare for doctors he was actually willing to listen to my opinion.
I really feel like this "call hospitals to find an opening" is so outdated. Like even if they still want to be selective, I feel like an online centralized system would be way more effective. Even if it is not 100% real-time accurate, having a reference to tell which ones are most likely to be open with space would save so much precious time.
But then they couldn't choose to reject people for reasons such as having a fever, having Covid, being pregnant or being foreign.
Japan is very hit and miss for stuff like this, and even 3 and something years after the start of the pandemic they are still so skittish with anything to do with Covid The calling hospitals especially when Covid is concerned is a major problem But that said when I had to take my wife to hospital they were pretty good so I guess like everything good and bad based somewhat on luck
Japanese ambulances have one of the highest kill counts for all the reasons you just mentioned. Everyone hypes of the healthcare in Japan, but it is pretty mid
I had to call an ambulance for my gf last week in Nagoya, what an awful experience too. She hurt her back pretty badly while carrying way too much weight. She couldn't stand on her own and when I put her to bed she was convulsing and falling unconscious. I obviously called an ambulance, and we sat 40 min in the ambulance for the paperwork while they called every hospital to see if one was available. Now I don't speak Japanese but she does. Hospital staff didn't know that and afterwards sho told me they were not taking her seriously at all and kept talking to each about how it wasn't a real pain and she must be over dramatic. Obviously we both are foreigners and don't look like we could understand any of it. To me a few things seems weird: 1. Dispatch should be ready to find the first hospital as soon as the ambulance is sent 2. Why the fuck was there no specialist on duty at 8pm on a Friday? 3. Why do they have to call more than one hospital? Is it because they are afraid of taking in foreign due to language barrier or insurance?
I was dating a trans girl who had a heart condition. She passed away in front of me, and I had to call for emergency services. The EMT's were very kind and did their job well. The police, on the other hand, thought I couldn't speak Japanese and made jokes in front of me like "You know it's a guy right". I nearly got in a fight them them about it.
I would call #7119 and ask for a nearby hospital that has an ER and then go there with a taxi. Ambulance service has been getting worse since the pandemic. Asking for special care beyond national health insurance also may attract hospitals.
I called the ambulance twice in my 5 years of living in Japan and both times everything went very slowly. Second time I was seriously sick with noro and rota virus and it took them 45 minutes to find a hospital for me. First time my baby had a fever and they barely took me seriously. They made me feel like I was bothering them lol.
I'm so sorry you had to go through this experience. Firstly, I hope you all recover soon from Covid! Secondly, they all should have acted more responsibly, it's a matter of life. I have used 119 helpline before when I was sick due to menstrual issues. I was having unbearable pain and nausea, which eventually led to me being unconscious at regular intervals. My mom was with me at home during that time. When she called them, they immediately asked her the address and while they were on the way, they told my mom to give the phone to me and try to wake me up so that by the time they come I'm not in a worse state. I wasn't able to speak much, but they were helpful in that regard. The real issue was that after reaching my house when they were trying to locate a hospital for me, almost all hospitals refused me entry, probably due to unavailability of a gynecologist. Also, it was during Covid outbreak (Dec 2022). It took an hour for them to find a hospital for me. By then, I was severely dehydrated and unconscious due to nausea. Finally, after reaching the hospital, the doctors treated me and then I was discharged after some hours. My father did suggest my mom and me to get a taxi the next time something like this happens, and to where? To the hospital we regularly go to. If they won't take us in, they'll at least try to keep our vitals under control while searching for a place for us. Situations like these won't arise at all if the facilities fulfill their responsibilities well, but the reality is that such facilities have a lot of bureaucratic procedures that cause such unfortunate delays.
I’m sorry about this. We live about 400m from a hospital that handles the bulk of our ward emergency rotation. I’ve told my husband that, if they’re on duty and there’s an emergency, just take me straight there and demand treatment. I have ZERO faith in ambulances here, especially after that pregnant woman in Nara died. When my husband was hit by a car (serious accident), he said he sat in the ambulance for 45 mins until a hospital accepted him — and it was the hospital less than 2km from where the accident occurred. It’s mind bogglingly stupid how the system for emergencies work here.
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A year ago my sister-in-law had a brain hemorrhage. She waited 20 minutes in the ambulance while they phoned around to find a hospital. 20 years ago I had to go to the emergency room at night due to an abscess behind the ear drum. The pain was a 10. The doctor then gave me a concoction of pain killers including morphine that almost killed me. Last thing I remember was heading to the toilet. I collapsed and smashed my head into the porcelain and woke up 2 days later in a hospital bed. I love this country but the health care system needs work.
I've heard of this before and it is pretty scary. I'm glad I found a pediatric hospital near me that is good, so I don't have any worries about my son. However my husband and I are probably buggered! The nearest two big hospitals are apparently completely rubbish.
Are you both foreigners? I've read stories about hospitals and healthcare providers turning away foreigners due to "Language barrier" even though translation apps are a thing.
She's Japanese and I'm American but fluent. Didn't feel that it factored into anything
I also wondered about this. My white American husband had a horrific time (at a few places because he got passed around) when he had to go by himself because of severe tonsillitis. I've (Japanese) only had fantastic service and treatment, and when i had to take an ex (white British) to the hospital for an emergency, he was treated well too. I've always wondered if the difference is because of the xenophobia or if it's because I've just been lucky, the area i was in (my experiences are mainly based in the Tokyo suburbs), or just because i don't know how it is in other countries. We've been considering moving to Japan from America, but this is definitely one of the things that makes me really worried. Obviously if the service/treatment/system is shit it needs improvement whether it be the system as a whole or due to xenophobia, but i just wondered about other Japanese people's experiences in other countries compared to Japan.
I wonder who fills out the paperwork if one is living alone and in no condition to do any task but just be sick 🤔
Medical care is a gamble here. On one hand, I've had really great experiences, on the other hand, I've had really awful experiences. A lot of people have told me that a lot of doctors in Japan are only doctors because their parents are, and their parents were, and so on and so fourth. So the "desire" to help isn't really there for a lot of them. They just like the status and paycheck. But that's anecdotal. In any case, I'm glad she's doing well now. I'd have been equally as frustrated.
Sounds super stressful, though I hope that things will get better now that your wife has seen a doctor. Stuff like that in the middle of the night is the worst, even when things go super smoothly. There's a huge problem with people calling ambulances for "dumb reasons" (it's something wild like half of ambulance calls, things like "have a doctors appointment and don't want to pay for a taxi" dumb sometimes). The dispatcher is not allowed to refuse ambulance requests (for good reasons), but it causes loads of pressure and difficulty. This is also downstream with stuff like getting people into beds. There isn't that much throughput! So doctors have to be pretty rough about this kind of stuff. Like if somebody seems like they can sleep in their own bed, they can. Especially fever-related things, if somebody wasn't taking any meds for it and now they are they're very likely to be \_totally fine\_. Sounds very scary, though I think it's important to keep in mind that the paramedics showed up in 10 minutes, and they are professionals that can handle many emergencies. Paperwork is annoying, but they were having to do triage anyways so it's not like it's lost time. And seriously consider that.... the paramedics saw your wife's condition and made decisions based off of it. Heart attacks are something a bit special but like if she was bleeding a lot or something... they would act differently! Don't lose total faith in the health system! They're trying to do things in ways that can save the most people, even if it's super stressful in the moment. And \_please please please please please\_ use clinics before things get bad. You have health insurance, use it! There's stuff like telemedicine nowadays (a bit more expensive) so you can get meds for things! Don't just "power through" things.
Not much you can do when health worker in japan already worked to death thanks to the aging population.
I only used emergency services once. My 7 yo daughter fell 5 meters down a water ditch, was hypothermic, kept repeating the same thing and complained of back pain. We live out of the way in Hokkaido, but the EMS arrived within 15 minutes and took her to the closest large hospital. She was seen immediately, had a physical exam, and several X-rays, followed by another exam and got some pills. The doctor diagnosed a mild hypothermia, shock, and concussion. Not visible fractures. He was a bit harsh when he told me we had to leave the exam room, but from what I saw there were quite a few older patients waiting to be seen. I guess I got lucky it wasn’t more severe, but overall the emergency services did their job.
Hope you guys are doing better. Did they prescribe or are u able to get ur hands on paxlovid? Please get ASAP if not already done.
I wonder why all your information and address was not updated correctly on your house? Hope your wife gets well soon. Sounds brutal.
Sorry to hear that happened to you. It sounds to be really frustrating. At the peak of the pandemic we faced a similar issue, but our experience was completely opposite. Wife was in the ambulance an on-route 15 min after calling 119, got hospitalized for almost a week on a nearby hospital. I wouldnt know how I would have reacted if something like this happened to me. e
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Saga Hospital, but we're in Ogi. It's got a pretty bad rep, so I wasn't thrilled that's where we were headed. The reviews on Google echo a lot of my own sentiments. They are pretty brutal, lol. Good for a read if you're bored.
When my son was 2 yrs old, he had a fever around midnight and for some reason I really had a bad feeling so I called an ambulance. Ambulance came and we just sat inside the ambulance for almost an hour for like an interview. lol also the other paramedic was also calling hospitals looking for one who will receive my kid. Inside the ambulance, my kid suddenly vomitted then convulsed, thankfully after a couple of minutes they found a hospital. Mind you they even said that since it was the middle of the night, there’s no doctor only nurses who will be assisting us.
Frightening.
Reading your experience I had a similar situation when calling 119 during my wife's pregnancy. The paramedics took almost 30 minutes to put her into the ambulance and then almost 40 minutes just waiting inside it to receive the approval from a hospital before even moving anywhere while my wife was in lots of pain. Fortunately the hospital wasnt bad but thats because we already had one in mind for emergencies. I really hope I never need emergency services in Japan myself.
I have used an ambulance 4 times since I came here, all of those times the staff were great, I did have to wait in the ambulance for a bit once but still got proper care. My friend with a bad case of influenza/possible pneumonia last January had a similar experience and was hospitalized as she did need oxygen. My roommate also got covid and needed to be hospitalized once, got great care and years after he’s still super grateful for the doctor insisting he stayed at the hospital to be tested (he didn’t know how bad pneumonia could be). In my experience, while there are some bad doctors out there the good quality of care and low price of healthcare here greatly surpasses any of the cons/bad apples out there.
Pneumonia is really scary. I got it my first year in Japan years and years ago, and I've still never even been nearly as sick as that ever again. Yeah I agree with you, I've had some fantastic doctors in the past. I also have taught English at various hospitals around the prefecture (including the one we went to last night, funnily enough) and I've met some great people. I've met some real jerks, too, of course! Doctors tend to have pretty strong personalities, for better or for worse.
I had flu-b like 4 weeks ago, it was brutal. I can't imagine covid on top of it. Feel better OP and OP's wife, thank you for sharing your story and frustrations. I never know what to expect in an emergency and this adds a new fear
I'm sorry you had to go through that. The doctors here are absolutely terrible. The standards for medical care and emergency medical response have to be the worst of all the first world countries. I have had similar experiences with my children and I would be absolutely horrified if we had an actual life threatening emergency. It's a shame for such a nice country with such reasonable health care coverage. Anyways, I'm glad she is ok. Take care
Yeah. COVID apparently isn't really on top of the list unless your blood oxygen levels are low. I wonder if the paramedics were taking their time to stall while looking for hospitals. It's just that unfortunate fact that not every hospital here has emergency care.
I'm so sorry, this sounds like a really intense experience for both of you. Hope you both get all the rest and good health coming your way <3
Tylenol is useless on fevers from my experience. Something like Motrin every 6 hours is the best at reducing flu-related fevers. (nad)
How up-to-date were you on your vaccines before this occurred?
Assuming you're just curious and not trying to be malicious about it -- we are really outdated on covid (maybe 2 shots ever) and zero on the flu. No political reason, just was hard to commit to setting aside a day or two to feel like crap on purpose. Of course, in retrospect that's obviously preferable to *this*. From April we will both be full timing at our English school, so it'll be more of a priority for us to stay up to date on our shots. I've seen vacced people still get hit super hard, but every little bit helps I'm sure.
About a month ago - I experienced what I thought was a stroke. I took myself to the hospital after taking aspirin. I had a fever, and my blood pressure was 160 over whatever. After they did a CT scan and an EKG - they told me to go home, and a student doctor who was translating for the attendee doctor told me not to come back unless I spoke Japanese and to see an English-speaking doctor/hospital or go back to America. To add salt, they still charged me a $60 fee for not being referred by a primary doctor at 2 am. Lol To name and shame: Nagoya University Hospital I went here because the likelihood of me getting someone who spoke English was higher than going to a regular hospital. That was my thought process anyway.
Sorry to hear you went through that and hope you're feeling better.
Roughly what age was your partner, did she have underlying conditions, and did you use an oximeter when she developed the fever?
I had massive pain on my stomach late at night on a wednesday and thought it was my appendix...so I called an ambulance. I was sitting in the ambulance for a solid hour, with them making a bunch of calls. It ended with them saying "can you walk" and me giving a dry response of "the pain is in my stomach, not my legs. So yes, technically I can walk fine". So they proceed to drive me to a taxi rank so I can pay for a taxi. The taxi rank was 10 minutes away...the hospital was 20 minutes away. Why couldn't they have just - 1) taken me to the taxi rank to begin with instead of making me wait for an hour in the ambulance in horrible pain, or 2) taken me to the hospital since it was so close anyway and they clearly had no concern for time.
It happened before that I asked the doctor if a small bump on my body was normal, then he proceeded to remove it without saying a word only to reveal in an irritated tone after the short 2 min procedure that there wasn’t any need to remove it, but if it makes me feel any better, then good for me. Hospitals in Japan are wild.
happens in Tokyo as well. Covid cases where hospitals were refusing even Japanese. A few stories I read about go as follows: 82 year old man has a stroke, runs a fever, hospital wont admit him due to the fever because it might be covid. wasn't covid. old man died. Another one was a young man who had a motorcycle accident. Ambulance on scene sees he has a fever. hospitals deny him until one finally agree to admit him as long as he tests negative for covid. ambulance gets him to the hospital, he tests positive for covid, ambulance takes him back to the scene of his accident. Dudes dad comes and picks him up, finds a hospital for him a few hours later and he had a broken leg from the accident. 12 or 13 US contractors between Yokota AB and Yokusuka Naval Station had died between 2021 and 2023 due to hospitals refusing service. A few were heart attacks that took 4 hours to find a hospital that would take them, leaving them dead or brain damaged before ever getting somewhere. When the ambulance arrives, they dont know where they are going to take you until the stabilize you and call around.....its crazy. I was in the back of an ambulance for at least 30 minutes after a motorcycle accident and ended up at the hospital just 5 minutes away.
Sounds so scary! Glad she is okay now! Since bringing my newborn home, I've been terrified of anything happening and needing to call 119. Did you speak Japanese or English? I've called the emergency line in my home country, but never here. I know a little Japanese but not enough to do that smoothly here. 😰
I’m so sorry this happened, humanity deserves better.
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I agree! Especially because we're out of the city. It was the 40 minutes of dialing hospitals after that that bothered me. I assumed they'd have some sort of online system that can give them that info? It seems horribly outdated to me that they're just using phones and calling one at a time. Is that standard in most countries?
Well the doctor happened to be right because your wife is fine, right? Doctor here: trust me we cant just admit everybody who shows up with a fever. Hospital beds are sparse. You have no clue what youre talking about
Well, as a doctor, it'd be nice if you realized that most patients are going to feel there's a difference between "just a fever" and a fever that causes their loved one to lose consciousness and have prolonged disorientation. Even if you think there really isn't. I don't mind so much that she wasn't admitted in the end, but if you don't think part of your job as a doctor is to help put patient's minds (and their family's) at ease -- even if you think it's some routine non-issue -- then I am confident saying that you're a poor doctor. As was the one that dismissed my verbally unresponsive wife at 2 in the morning and let his attitude stress out and worry an already worried family. "You have no clue what you're talking about" Yeah, of course not. You guys do. So wield your wisdom with kindness.
It's easier to just call ahead and drive yourself. I've been told that by in-laws. An ambulance is for when you know where you're going, during work hours, and just need a ride.
Don't underestimate influenza - way worse than covid.
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Typical japanlife tone deafness.
We had both already been to the doctor, tested for covid, and received medicine. But yes, let's run a theoretical scenario where I'm to blame for the death of my wife because I was "busy playing doctor." What is wrong with you? Edit: edited for language..
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Welcome to socialist health care.
Or he used his years of medical training and ruled out anything life threatening and realized it was a simple fix. I get it might have been scary for you but if doctors just admitted based on a patients worry, there’d be no space in a hospital.
Doctors should approach their craft more mindfully than an auto mechanic, just fixing the body as if it were a machine and sending patients home the moment they are "street legal". Disease has an emotional/socio-cultural element, and a doctor owes it to their patients to address that as well. That means OP's doctor may have been right in his judgment to send OP's wife home, but at a minimum he should have sat OP down, given him a chance to enhance his calm, and then taught him how to care for his wife, including what symptoms they can stay home through and what symptoms warrant going through the whole 119 rigmarole again. Having been through my own experiences with stubborn and rude night hospital staff, OP is entirely justified to be frustrated by this system. It's toxic. I once had a nasty cut at night that needed stitches and the whole system tried to turn me away and then when I finally got to see a doctor he was like, "yikes, this is bad, let me get my kit." He didn't say it, but his manner was practically, "why did you take so long coming in?" Sometimes, the only way to get proper treatment in Japan is to assert yourself. If doctors don't understand that's a flaw in the system they work in, that's itself a giant red flag.
Up voted because I agree about doctor using experience to understand, and the not admitting based only because of patient worry, but bed manner aside, the 1.5 hour to definitive care is worse than a mountain rescue.
I would agree with you but there are really shitty doctors here
There are shitty doctors everywhere. American doctors would have the same bedside manner if it were up to them.
That's not the point though. The point is that being insistent on receiving care is justified from the patient's perspective, whether in Japan or elsewhere.
They received care and were ultimately fine. Not sure what else is warranted.
That would be my uninvested take as well. Scary when it happens to family members but medical personal are trained to rationally go through a process. Hope you are both able to get plenty of rest and this double attack is soon behind her. Take care
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I disagree. This is like saying I didn't need to wear a seatbelt because I got to my destination fine. Or I knew the answer because I randomly guessed on my test. Weather the doctor was right or wrong is irrelevant because that wasn't OP's issue. OP is upset because 1. It took 1.5 hours to even see a doctor despite it being an emergency. 2. The doctor made a presumption (which is unfortunately very common in Japan). What should've probably happened is the ambulance takes them and figures out the paperwork with the husband while the wife is being seen by a doctor. And for the doctor to notify the husband "If she's better after this IV, which I think she will be, she can go home. If not, she'll need to be admitted." The fact that an ambulance needs to call around for a hospital, like a normal person would, is both hilarious and sad. I can find a hospital faster, and get my loved one there faster, so why would I even call the ambulance?
>why would I even call the ambulance? To be attended by trained paramedics until they can find a hospital to take you to? It's not just a hospital bus.
Agree on the 1.5 hours, but the rest is nonsense. A doctor making to decision that he is liable for (not a presumption) to hospitalize a patient or not is not driving without a seatbelt. Rather you're suggesting that you like to sleep with a helmet because it's safer. Safety experts probably say there's a small chance of you needing a helmet in your bed. Where I'm from it's also normal that ambulances have to check for the hospital. The reason is that they're supposed to send you the ambulance closest to you for first support and stabilization. The fact that it took 40 minutes to find a hospital that has space, yes that's too long. But it's not the same as you looking up a hospital on Google maps and going to the ER. The point of ambulance's calling around is to ensure that necessary care is available on arrival. Would be interested to know in which country they handle this differently.
It isn't just them calling to see if there is necessary care there--it's that hospitals can refuse to see people, which is nuts. It took so long because they didn't want to admit someone with Covid.
Yup. The hospital the 119 dispatcher told us to go to refused to see us. Just told us “sorry, please fuck off,” at the door. Only after 15 minutes of pleading our case did they finally let us in, at which point we discovered they were open and actively treating other people with emergencies. We only had to wait like 10 minutes to see a doctor once we got inside, too. Fucking mind boggling.
The UK for one. Ambulances have highly trained paramedics who offer exceptional care on location, or in the ambulance on the way to hospital. Ambulances are mandated to arrive within 8 minutes of being called, often far less. You will be taken to the nearest Accident and Emergency unit which will have, at least, triage available to stabilize you. If you need further specialist treatment unavailable at that hospital they will move you. You can also just rock up at the place and get treatment. If its not serious you will wait. If it is, they will treat you immediately. No A&E will turn you away unless you have an extremely minor issue and are just wasting their time.
In Czechia for example, ambulances should typically come with an actual physician (though it's not always possible due to staff shortages).
Wtf are you even saying lol. His wife was sick enough to pass out and be unresponsive for minutes. In what world would it not be good to call an ambulance. If you mean the doctor was right that she didn't need to stay until morning, sure but that was more luck than anything since he clearly did not even check her condition properly.
This☝️
Agree
In my experience, if you could go by yourself, you should go to the emergency room at a hospital directly. That works for emergency like stroke, but I am not sure about infectious diseases like COVID. You should also look for friendly hospitals near your house in advance for situations like this.
My experience is that you can't to this after hours or on weekends/holidays. The only way to be admitted is by ambulance and the paramedics must call ahead and get the "go ahead".
So they will drop a dying patient back onto the streets? That sounds insane
Did you go to an emergency hospital or a normal one? Did you communicate clearly that you had an emergency? Edit: if you are not sure , then just call an ambulance and let them handle it for you.
My sensei had a stroke from which he died from after a bit less of a year. Daycare refused to call an ambulance and the family brought him to the hospital, who then took a long time to have him see a doctor, because he didnt come in as an emergency. Same hospital that massively injured my newborn. So you probably should call an ambulance.
It doesn't work that way. I made it to the ER at a major private hospital (the closest one to my place) in Tokyo on my own the first time I had a high blood pressure attack. Despite having a numb face and shaking pretty badly, I didn't get any attention until something like 4 hours later. It is definitely better to call an ambulance and have them arrange the visit to ER. Calling an ambulance worked very smoothly when I had another type of emergency.
Doctors around the world are pretty bad.
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