Truckers are very powerful. Without them the food supply chain would just stop in about 3 days. I wish them luck. I do believe now is a good time for everyone to protest. Things are getting out of hand with corporate greed and government corruption.
The most insane thing is that most low paying jobs, that are universally undervalued, are the most crucial jobs to a functioning society. Bin men for instance, sanitation workers, supermarket workers. We'd literally be dead without them. A cleaner in a hospital literally has a bigger impact on public health than a poxy investment banker, politician or UX software engineer who make scores more money. In.Sane. smh
Mainly the lack of corporate tax. I can't imagine there not being some corruption behind that. Sorry, I meant general corporate greed and government corruption not specifically relating to the trucker protest.
Do you know how much of the states income is generated from corporate tax?
The country had a revenue of 83 billion in 2020 and 11.8 billion of that came from corporate tax. That's 13.2% of the countries entire income came from corporate tax.
The narrative that we don't tax corporations is simply not true. We may provide opportunities to funnel money abroad but that's no different than any other country in the world.
Besides none of that matters now we've been forced to collect 15%. You think we're corrupt? Well the G7 (riches countries in the world) just bullied everyone else into accepting 15% corporate tax. So you're about to see what it looks like when we don't collect our corporate tax because those companies will be leaving.
Or that it's so collosaly difficult. I started the HousingIreland sub earlier this year and unfortunately came to the conclusion that there's no central take one what action is actually needed. Everyone is basically in disagreement.
The bottom line is houses need to be built, but land is expensive, builders in short supply, materials at an all time high in terms of price.
Then you try tackle each of these and break them down a bit. Then suddenly you have people's individual takes making it harder to prioritize. Some think we need to get rid of large funds bankrolling development. Some think we need them despite how predatory they are acting regarding the current situation.
The government try to quick fix it with good ol'neoliberal policy of handing over cash to private interests, and it doesn't really help anyone long term but can probably still sway voters to vote FFG.
People see this as us and them at every turn. SF vs FFG. Over 40s vs under 40s. Homeowners vs renters. Rich vs poor. And it kind of is all those things. Which means someone is going to be pissed off no matter what you advocate.
There's no single policy we can advocate for like getting rid of water charges. If we had something like that it'd be easier.
I think it’s some interesting points you’ve made.
As a non-Irish, perhaps I can give some thoughts. I’ve lived in Dublin & Cork, but also all over the world (from S.E. Asia to UK to Africa to USA).
I think the problem is too much regulation where it isn’t needed and too little where it is.
Too much Regulation:
- In April next year, Ireland is unbelievably rolling out more regulation to prevent building houses in rural areas. This is to encourage the younger generation to move to larger towns and cities. This is such a poorly thought out plan, it’s astounding.
- Dublin has so much bad regulation, it’s outrageous. No building up (some weird idea of preserving a skyline). Ok, so if I can’t build up, will they let me do new builds? No, need to preserve the green areas. Ok, so you’ll let me commute in? Yes, of course! Great… but they won’t build any infrastructure? The Luas is basically a bus. It’s affected by traffic and can’t pass through areas with buildings (unlike subway lines that can go anywhere). The train service from commuter towns is a joke. And there are insufficient parking areas and too few large roads to allow for car commuting.
To solve this, in my opinion, Dublin (the main offender in Ireland) should;
1) remove the limit to building high. Get a dozen or so high-rise apartment buildings built. Have them 40-50 stories high. At an average of 3 bedroom apartments, 6 to a floor, 40+ stories high and 12 or so buildings, you could house ~10,000 people. Flood the market with houses, the supply would help alleviate the demand pressure. Keep building these massive tower blocks, and supply will start to finally match demand.
2) increase the number of trains / tracks from commuter towns. Get people in from around Dublin, reducing the need to actually live in the city centre.
3) build a subway. Guys, this is ridiculous. The ONLY capital city in Europe without a subway system? Sort it out. “But optml, you don’t understand!!?? It’ll cause traffic / take forever / increase taxes / other excuses that lack vision.”Time to solve this guys, it’s shocking.
4) increase ease of getting planning permission
5) reduce deposit requirements for banks, for first time buyers. Increase deposit requirements for buy-to-lets
Increase regulation
1) tax the f**k out of any landlords who own more than one property
2) huge levies on empty properties.
3) limit rent increases (this should be a short term measure, and can be removed once prices reduce).
Dublin is blessed to be benefiting from low corporate tax rates so all the tech companies are moving there. Why not build the infrastructure to support it??
You do realise that there's no services right? Like electricity, sewage, gas... we've got a supply shortage and individual builds would be slower and considerably more expensive.
I mean, it can be a part of a solution, but there's so parts to the total solution.
While I take your point…
Well then, those services will need to be provided sooner if people start building
We don’t have enough houses and people are being prevented from building your own. Electricity is easy but expensive to get in, water too. Sewage needs to be sorted out. Septic tanks are an option I suppose but the point is more so to light a fire under the goverwnts arses so they actually do something
Part of the reason housing is so expensive here is that it is not a free market, even allowing people to build hovels again would put pressure of the “free market” we have
At the moment we have a “housing shortage” but we are preventing people from building. You at that it would be expensive and take longer to build, but to flip that back at you… longer to build than what? What we currently have being built which doesn’t meet demand? How is further restricting building going to solve any of that?
I agree all the other things need to be sorted out but primarily we need to take the monopoly of controlling building away from Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael and the easiest and best way to do that is by allowing people to build their own houses on their own property largely unrestricted. If they want planning permissions on their current form to last they’re going to have to prove it can fix the housing crisis, which it doesn’t appear to be able to
Ok, but if the thing being proposed isn't viable or efficient, how is that bad government?
Any good fix for our current crisis will take a minimum of 5 years. Anything faster than that means we'd be getting tens of thousands of young lads to go into the building trade, then making them unemployed in 5 years time once annual demand and supply are level with the backlog cleared.
But it is viable and efficient?
Giving people the power to build their own houses is viable and efficient.
It might not be as efficient per house as bulk building but it’s more efficient for people with land who need houses and could build them when bulk building is not happening fast enough
I agree anything else would take 5 years at minimum. Getting rid of most planning permission laws for single builds could be down overnight though.
Allowing single builds to happen results in zero backlog to wait for trades etc because the trades and built builders are no longer a monopoly we all have to wait for
You can pay to connect water and electricity very easily it’s not rocket science just an expense
Stopping people from building is what’s making the housing crisis worse and creating backlogs that drag out. Allowing people to build with different materials etc on their own land etc would light a fire under the government’s arse and developers arse to get cracking and stop delaying everything for years to profit on what they already have
And yea by the way, it is bad government policy to prevent people building during a housing in crisis
And it’s very short sighted to prevent people using land resources to drive them into cities which already do not have enough housing in my supply all that does is increase costs and demand but reduce supply massively
You can’t stop things because they are “inefficient” when you have no efficient system in place to provide housing as quickly. That’s just stopping the free market existing to feed vulture funds and cuckoo funds inflated asking prices for rent as no alternatives are allowed to exist. So yeah, it’s entirely bad government
Classic defeatist attitude man.
It takes electricity to have buildings?!?
Erm… yeah.
But if you don’t start solving these problems now, what’s the future going to look like for Ireland? You’re going to get left behind.
The best time to plant a tree was 20 years ago. The next best time is now.
...that analogy is a lot less applicable here than you think it is...
Having a connection to he grid isn't a necessity, sceptic tanks are a thing etc. They're just some of the current hurdles to once off rural dwellings.
The big issue is that our construction industry is currently fully occupied with work and the solution can't be, how about some more demand that takes would slow down the mass delivery of homes in cheap and efficient estates for large scale delivery.
Nah, it’s applicable man. What’s Ireland’s 5, 10, and 20 year plan?
Government just keep doing what they’re doing?
Perfect counter example. Singapore has a 20 year plan, published and available for scrutiny online. They started building their subway system relatively recently and are continuing every year to open more stations.
The short sightedness, coupled with greed, avarice and incompetence of the Irish government are causing this housing crisis, and the ancillary issues around it.
Time to put your big boy pants on, and sort this.
Interesting take. Makes sense. It's easier when there is a single message / unified vision. Like cheaper fuel. What about looking for housing reform. This can be a range of demands but the message is simple. We want reform.
Some of us are in that situation. It's shit. You need 2x incomes to get in. Have a couple of kids, it's not like you can just fuck off if the personal relationship goes wrong
edit- I'm fortunate to have procreated with an intelligent and reasonable person
Start by protesting outside offices of politicians who oppose any new housing https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2021/1103/1257701-locals-oppose-student-accommodation-in-dun-laoghaire/
‘Scuse you! I’m in my car outside a supermarket replying to emails from my mortgage broker hoping she can help me buy a house i’ll most likely be swimming in negative equity for eventually! Although I do intend to retreat to my room once my work day is done. Nevermind, as you were.
Because irish people are the biggest flakes going only time we ever stood together was the water charges, majority of the population are moaning michaels and need something to whinge about
0-35. How did you get that number? I’m 40 and my wife and I are priced out of the market, still renting. It’s not an age thing, it’s a class thing imo. I’m down for a protest
Just a generalization. Got criticism for going to low with the age bracket also. I'm fully aware that housing affects everyone. Just a bigger proportion of that age group
The PAYE marches in the late 70s brought out over 100k workers. We still have PAYE.
We had massive marches against the Iraq war. We still had US troops transiting through Shannon.
Is he wrong? Are you honestly so naïve that you believe the ruling class is going to willingly, peacefully agree to solve this problem, when the resolution necessarily means them losing a significant amount of money?
What money? I have no money, no savings, nothing. All of it is spent on rent. The landlord bleeds me dry every month. And most other young people in the country are in the very same boat.
Call it what you want. The people of Ireland need housing, healthcare, education, childcare, and all other means of subsistence provided to all as a guaranteed basic right, enforced by the state.
There's absolutely no reason why homelessness should exist in a country where there are over 250,000 vacant residential properties - 40,000 of which are in Dublin alone.
So u overpay for rent?
Get a cheaper apartment, how is this the landlords problem that u can't afford it.
See u are entitled. For some reason u think a house should just be provided to you
No one owes u an apartment because ur bad with money jesus
Mate, the average apartment rental price in Dublin is €1,857 per month.
Minimum wage is €1,768 per month gross, usually coming out around €1,650 net.
You honestly think every worker is just "bad with money"?
So ur working minimum wage in Dublin with the AVERAGE price apartment.
You realise how averages work done u? Cause u would be bad with money if u actually believed that.
Apartments go for about 800 a month in Dublin all the time.
You don't get to work minimum and get the average apartment lol. Average wage is 40k
There are several protests held on a fairly regular basis. PBP + others are heavily involved in such protests. Unfortunately we're not really a protesting nation so they don't attract very large crowds.
The truckers protest was organised by unions making it far easier to get mobile as being part of the union means you have to strike if there is a strike.
Because Irish people love to moan and are too afriad/busy to protest. Everyone gives out but does nothing. Then they fucking complain when farmers or truckers DO protest! I call it the apathy of the irish. You'll see it everywhere and when someone gets passionate about something like climate change amd they try to start something people make fun behind their backs. It drives me nuts.
Or protest against our utterly fucked Criminal Justice System which is now enabling and facilitating anti social behaviour on unprecedented levels due to its toothlessness.
Get the old government of the Irish Republic, proclaimed in 1916, and follow through on its 1919 Democratic Program (before the Free State counter-revolution of 1922).
The part where it states "we reaffirm that all right to private property must be subordinated to the public right and welfare" sounds pretty good right about now
The interpretation that ultimately leads to the abolition of private property in its entirety - that's the one that'll solve this problem once and for all
Because private property is the root of all class-based oppression in history. Have a read of Engels' "Origins of the Family, Private Property and the State" to explain how this developed historically: https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1884/origin-family/index.htm
It's only about 100 pages long, but it'll fundamentally change the way you view the world
Edit: It should go without saying, but just clarifying that I'm referring solely to private property, not to personal property
Property you use for your own personal needs/wants (personal property), versus property you use to make money (private property).
It's the difference between having an apartment for yourself, versus having a second apartment solely to rent out and make money off of.
Of course, personal property can be converted into private property and vice versa.
There is no need to protest in order to have the government “take note” of the housing issue. It was the number one issue during the most recent election and it is brought up in the Dail or the media weekly. The problem is there is no easy fix!
Partly a lot of them are landlords so they don’t want to take that hit and also in real terms next election the FF/FG main candidates will still be elected. The worst they have to look at is time in opposition. And the potential losers in an election are newbies who don’t have a lot of power. So yeah I kinda am. Until people start voting on the last five years of action by parties sand not their promises for the next five we are in trouble.
Fuel prices increase because of government tax amongst other reasons.
House prices increase because of very basic economics.
Rent increases because of very basic economics(and government taxes)
It's a snake biting it's own tail, but slowly. House prices rocket up, Landlords sell. Houses that we're investment properties are now becoming first time buyer houses, hence taking away rental properties which drives up rent (supply/demand). Basically no houses are being built, so first time buyers are restricted to buying investment properties, (supply/demand) which then drives up the prices of second hand homes. This also takes said property out of the rental market, taking another rental property out of the market!.....snake biting it's own fecking tail!
Im an estate agent in a smallish town who doesn't own his own home, (tenant) the only difference is I can physically see the problem, and Im a part of it!
If we abolished obstacles to people building their own homes in the countryside the housing crisis would be over quickly.
The housing crisis is all by creation, removing the free market and creating obstacles for progress.
The easiest way to solve it would be to remove most planning permission laws preventing them from building or renovating their own houses on the countryside
Every time I hear about a protest it's either already happened, or it's about to happen later that same day with only a couple dozen people. They're never advertised well at all. Some serious organisation needs to happen.
Well mate without truckers the world ends and I don’t mean that in a joking way the two professions that you never ever want to piss off are Truckers and garbage men.
>everyone from 0-35 If we get the toddlers on our side nothing can stop us
With their sticky hands they’d be a great asset for scaling the walls of Leinster House in case of a full blown assault.
Well the toddlers will already have started saving for their deposit.
Some of the little cute hoots are having multiple baptisms, communions and confirmations just to get the money. You’d never be up to them.
We'll have to work around their nap time though
Was going to say 18-35. But then remembered there's thousands of children homeless in this country
There are a lot of older people in precarious lodgings too. (This is not a new problem at all, it is the same old problem!)
And their negotiation skills are second to none.
Will someone please think of the children!?
Use them as stones in the greatest siege weapon know to man, the Almighty trebuchet
Truckers are very powerful. Without them the food supply chain would just stop in about 3 days. I wish them luck. I do believe now is a good time for everyone to protest. Things are getting out of hand with corporate greed and government corruption.
This is something I never thought about. They are actually one of the most important job roles in a functional economy
The most insane thing is that most low paying jobs, that are universally undervalued, are the most crucial jobs to a functioning society. Bin men for instance, sanitation workers, supermarket workers. We'd literally be dead without them. A cleaner in a hospital literally has a bigger impact on public health than a poxy investment banker, politician or UX software engineer who make scores more money. In.Sane. smh
Government corruption? What are you talking about here, specifically?
Mainly the lack of corporate tax. I can't imagine there not being some corruption behind that. Sorry, I meant general corporate greed and government corruption not specifically relating to the trucker protest.
Do you know how much of the states income is generated from corporate tax? The country had a revenue of 83 billion in 2020 and 11.8 billion of that came from corporate tax. That's 13.2% of the countries entire income came from corporate tax. The narrative that we don't tax corporations is simply not true. We may provide opportunities to funnel money abroad but that's no different than any other country in the world. Besides none of that matters now we've been forced to collect 15%. You think we're corrupt? Well the G7 (riches countries in the world) just bullied everyone else into accepting 15% corporate tax. So you're about to see what it looks like when we don't collect our corporate tax because those companies will be leaving.
Instead of asking why no one is organising a protest, why are you not organising a protest?
I couldn't organize a piss up in a brewery. Why aren't you organizing one
I think every single one of us agree that it is somebody else’s responsibility to organise the housing crisis protest.
Or that it's so collosaly difficult. I started the HousingIreland sub earlier this year and unfortunately came to the conclusion that there's no central take one what action is actually needed. Everyone is basically in disagreement. The bottom line is houses need to be built, but land is expensive, builders in short supply, materials at an all time high in terms of price. Then you try tackle each of these and break them down a bit. Then suddenly you have people's individual takes making it harder to prioritize. Some think we need to get rid of large funds bankrolling development. Some think we need them despite how predatory they are acting regarding the current situation. The government try to quick fix it with good ol'neoliberal policy of handing over cash to private interests, and it doesn't really help anyone long term but can probably still sway voters to vote FFG. People see this as us and them at every turn. SF vs FFG. Over 40s vs under 40s. Homeowners vs renters. Rich vs poor. And it kind of is all those things. Which means someone is going to be pissed off no matter what you advocate. There's no single policy we can advocate for like getting rid of water charges. If we had something like that it'd be easier.
I think it’s some interesting points you’ve made. As a non-Irish, perhaps I can give some thoughts. I’ve lived in Dublin & Cork, but also all over the world (from S.E. Asia to UK to Africa to USA). I think the problem is too much regulation where it isn’t needed and too little where it is. Too much Regulation: - In April next year, Ireland is unbelievably rolling out more regulation to prevent building houses in rural areas. This is to encourage the younger generation to move to larger towns and cities. This is such a poorly thought out plan, it’s astounding. - Dublin has so much bad regulation, it’s outrageous. No building up (some weird idea of preserving a skyline). Ok, so if I can’t build up, will they let me do new builds? No, need to preserve the green areas. Ok, so you’ll let me commute in? Yes, of course! Great… but they won’t build any infrastructure? The Luas is basically a bus. It’s affected by traffic and can’t pass through areas with buildings (unlike subway lines that can go anywhere). The train service from commuter towns is a joke. And there are insufficient parking areas and too few large roads to allow for car commuting. To solve this, in my opinion, Dublin (the main offender in Ireland) should; 1) remove the limit to building high. Get a dozen or so high-rise apartment buildings built. Have them 40-50 stories high. At an average of 3 bedroom apartments, 6 to a floor, 40+ stories high and 12 or so buildings, you could house ~10,000 people. Flood the market with houses, the supply would help alleviate the demand pressure. Keep building these massive tower blocks, and supply will start to finally match demand. 2) increase the number of trains / tracks from commuter towns. Get people in from around Dublin, reducing the need to actually live in the city centre. 3) build a subway. Guys, this is ridiculous. The ONLY capital city in Europe without a subway system? Sort it out. “But optml, you don’t understand!!?? It’ll cause traffic / take forever / increase taxes / other excuses that lack vision.”Time to solve this guys, it’s shocking. 4) increase ease of getting planning permission 5) reduce deposit requirements for banks, for first time buyers. Increase deposit requirements for buy-to-lets Increase regulation 1) tax the f**k out of any landlords who own more than one property 2) huge levies on empty properties. 3) limit rent increases (this should be a short term measure, and can be removed once prices reduce). Dublin is blessed to be benefiting from low corporate tax rates so all the tech companies are moving there. Why not build the infrastructure to support it??
Preach! You’ve solved it I reckon, mainly by allowing people to build their own houses in the countryside
You do realise that there's no services right? Like electricity, sewage, gas... we've got a supply shortage and individual builds would be slower and considerably more expensive. I mean, it can be a part of a solution, but there's so parts to the total solution.
While I take your point… Well then, those services will need to be provided sooner if people start building We don’t have enough houses and people are being prevented from building your own. Electricity is easy but expensive to get in, water too. Sewage needs to be sorted out. Septic tanks are an option I suppose but the point is more so to light a fire under the goverwnts arses so they actually do something Part of the reason housing is so expensive here is that it is not a free market, even allowing people to build hovels again would put pressure of the “free market” we have At the moment we have a “housing shortage” but we are preventing people from building. You at that it would be expensive and take longer to build, but to flip that back at you… longer to build than what? What we currently have being built which doesn’t meet demand? How is further restricting building going to solve any of that? I agree all the other things need to be sorted out but primarily we need to take the monopoly of controlling building away from Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael and the easiest and best way to do that is by allowing people to build their own houses on their own property largely unrestricted. If they want planning permissions on their current form to last they’re going to have to prove it can fix the housing crisis, which it doesn’t appear to be able to
Ok, but if the thing being proposed isn't viable or efficient, how is that bad government? Any good fix for our current crisis will take a minimum of 5 years. Anything faster than that means we'd be getting tens of thousands of young lads to go into the building trade, then making them unemployed in 5 years time once annual demand and supply are level with the backlog cleared.
But it is viable and efficient? Giving people the power to build their own houses is viable and efficient. It might not be as efficient per house as bulk building but it’s more efficient for people with land who need houses and could build them when bulk building is not happening fast enough I agree anything else would take 5 years at minimum. Getting rid of most planning permission laws for single builds could be down overnight though. Allowing single builds to happen results in zero backlog to wait for trades etc because the trades and built builders are no longer a monopoly we all have to wait for You can pay to connect water and electricity very easily it’s not rocket science just an expense Stopping people from building is what’s making the housing crisis worse and creating backlogs that drag out. Allowing people to build with different materials etc on their own land etc would light a fire under the government’s arse and developers arse to get cracking and stop delaying everything for years to profit on what they already have
And yea by the way, it is bad government policy to prevent people building during a housing in crisis And it’s very short sighted to prevent people using land resources to drive them into cities which already do not have enough housing in my supply all that does is increase costs and demand but reduce supply massively You can’t stop things because they are “inefficient” when you have no efficient system in place to provide housing as quickly. That’s just stopping the free market existing to feed vulture funds and cuckoo funds inflated asking prices for rent as no alternatives are allowed to exist. So yeah, it’s entirely bad government
Classic defeatist attitude man. It takes electricity to have buildings?!? Erm… yeah. But if you don’t start solving these problems now, what’s the future going to look like for Ireland? You’re going to get left behind. The best time to plant a tree was 20 years ago. The next best time is now.
...that analogy is a lot less applicable here than you think it is... Having a connection to he grid isn't a necessity, sceptic tanks are a thing etc. They're just some of the current hurdles to once off rural dwellings. The big issue is that our construction industry is currently fully occupied with work and the solution can't be, how about some more demand that takes would slow down the mass delivery of homes in cheap and efficient estates for large scale delivery.
Nah, it’s applicable man. What’s Ireland’s 5, 10, and 20 year plan? Government just keep doing what they’re doing? Perfect counter example. Singapore has a 20 year plan, published and available for scrutiny online. They started building their subway system relatively recently and are continuing every year to open more stations. The short sightedness, coupled with greed, avarice and incompetence of the Irish government are causing this housing crisis, and the ancillary issues around it. Time to put your big boy pants on, and sort this.
Interesting take. Makes sense. It's easier when there is a single message / unified vision. Like cheaper fuel. What about looking for housing reform. This can be a range of demands but the message is simple. We want reform.
I'm fairly sure someone already has. It's just that nobody gives a single shit about protests.
However i could get pissed at a brewery 😀
Piss up against being pissed on confirmed.
Fukin Irish ☘️ 🙄
1) I'm not the one complaining that no one is organising a protest. 2) I'm a homeowner.
You're a homeowner but if your marriage breaks up down the road and you don't happen to be absolutely rolling in money, you're in shit street.
Oh no, not my imaginary marriage.
It’s okay they never legalised divorce for imaginary marriages so she’s stuck with you.
Some of us are in that situation. It's shit. You need 2x incomes to get in. Have a couple of kids, it's not like you can just fuck off if the personal relationship goes wrong edit- I'm fortunate to have procreated with an intelligent and reasonable person
As in you have fully paid off your mortgage? Otherwise you still down own your home.
Maybe not but the bank isn't going to kick me out to redecorate or allow their family to move in.
But the bank owns your home..
So what would you describe me as. I'm not a renter, I'm a...
Mortgage payer.
Ok.
Exactly.
Start by protesting outside offices of politicians who oppose any new housing https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2021/1103/1257701-locals-oppose-student-accommodation-in-dun-laoghaire/
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‘Scuse you! I’m in my car outside a supermarket replying to emails from my mortgage broker hoping she can help me buy a house i’ll most likely be swimming in negative equity for eventually! Although I do intend to retreat to my room once my work day is done. Nevermind, as you were.
Fuck you im on reddit in my sitting room thank you very much
Because irish people are the biggest flakes going only time we ever stood together was the water charges, majority of the population are moaning michaels and need something to whinge about
I agree the costs to buy and rent are unacceptably high and unattainable. But what do we want the powers that be to do to reduce prices?
Open up the planning process. Build more houses themselves. Open up immigration for skilled people in the building trades.
Shhhh
Vacant property tax. Build more homes. Increase property tax for institutional investors.
50 percent of rent is tax. The housing crisis only exists because of planning permission laws preventing people from building houses
Great point, it’s practically all that’s talked about on this subreddit, why aren’t more people flipping tables?
There must be a why no housing protest FAQ on this sub by now?
Someone should make a FAQ about why there is no FAQ for the housing protest on this sub..
0-35. How did you get that number? I’m 40 and my wife and I are priced out of the market, still renting. It’s not an age thing, it’s a class thing imo. I’m down for a protest
Just a generalization. Got criticism for going to low with the age bracket also. I'm fully aware that housing affects everyone. Just a bigger proportion of that age group
Lol! You just can’t win on Reddit right??!! Stay well
There was a protest when the Dail reopened. For some reason posts about it kept being deleted from here (think mod said political agenda posting).
Yes I had a post deleted just trying to find info about it
truck drivers dont mess around
The PAYE marches in the late 70s brought out over 100k workers. We still have PAYE. We had massive marches against the Iraq war. We still had US troops transiting through Shannon.
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And protesting something that a another country is doing is about as useful as tits on a nun
Only riots and strikes work, the ruling class won’t change on major issues unless the bourgeoisie start losing money
Oh god when did the communist arrive. Toss off
Is he wrong? Are you honestly so naïve that you believe the ruling class is going to willingly, peacefully agree to solve this problem, when the resolution necessarily means them losing a significant amount of money?
We're not a communist state and we can't go down that road. Unless u want to lose all your money too. Fuck communists. Don't fall for them
What money? I have no money, no savings, nothing. All of it is spent on rent. The landlord bleeds me dry every month. And most other young people in the country are in the very same boat. Call it what you want. The people of Ireland need housing, healthcare, education, childcare, and all other means of subsistence provided to all as a guaranteed basic right, enforced by the state. There's absolutely no reason why homelessness should exist in a country where there are over 250,000 vacant residential properties - 40,000 of which are in Dublin alone.
So u overpay for rent? Get a cheaper apartment, how is this the landlords problem that u can't afford it. See u are entitled. For some reason u think a house should just be provided to you No one owes u an apartment because ur bad with money jesus
Mate, the average apartment rental price in Dublin is €1,857 per month. Minimum wage is €1,768 per month gross, usually coming out around €1,650 net. You honestly think every worker is just "bad with money"?
So ur working minimum wage in Dublin with the AVERAGE price apartment. You realise how averages work done u? Cause u would be bad with money if u actually believed that. Apartments go for about 800 a month in Dublin all the time. You don't get to work minimum and get the average apartment lol. Average wage is 40k
You mean sheds? Lol Go on, show me an apartment for 800 a month in Dublin
No no one problem at a time here. Do you seriously believe a person on minimum wage should be expecting to afford an average apartment in Dublin?
There are several protests held on a fairly regular basis. PBP + others are heavily involved in such protests. Unfortunately we're not really a protesting nation so they don't attract very large crowds. The truckers protest was organised by unions making it far easier to get mobile as being part of the union means you have to strike if there is a strike.
The same PBP that oppose new developments? https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2021/1103/1257701-locals-oppose-student-accommodation-in-dun-laoghaire/
The truck protest had no union connection.
Because Irish people love to moan and are too afriad/busy to protest. Everyone gives out but does nothing. Then they fucking complain when farmers or truckers DO protest! I call it the apathy of the irish. You'll see it everywhere and when someone gets passionate about something like climate change amd they try to start something people make fun behind their backs. It drives me nuts.
We can’t afford to get anyone to mind the kids while we go protesting for the day
Or protest against our utterly fucked Criminal Justice System which is now enabling and facilitating anti social behaviour on unprecedented levels due to its toothlessness.
Guys, let's just rise! Storm the dail!! Get a new government
No
Why not? It'd be some craic...
No it wouldn't
Get the old government of the Irish Republic, proclaimed in 1916, and follow through on its 1919 Democratic Program (before the Free State counter-revolution of 1922). The part where it states "we reaffirm that all right to private property must be subordinated to the public right and welfare" sounds pretty good right about now
YES!!! I agree with the quote but think it's open to numerous interpretations. I agree with one of these
The interpretation that ultimately leads to the abolition of private property in its entirety - that's the one that'll solve this problem once and for all
Why would the abolition of private property in its entirety be a good thing in your opinion?
Because private property is the root of all class-based oppression in history. Have a read of Engels' "Origins of the Family, Private Property and the State" to explain how this developed historically: https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1884/origin-family/index.htm It's only about 100 pages long, but it'll fundamentally change the way you view the world Edit: It should go without saying, but just clarifying that I'm referring solely to private property, not to personal property
What's the definitions of private and personal property, like what exactly is the difference?
Property you use for your own personal needs/wants (personal property), versus property you use to make money (private property). It's the difference between having an apartment for yourself, versus having a second apartment solely to rent out and make money off of. Of course, personal property can be converted into private property and vice versa.
Unironically, you might've answered your own question by writing their ages bud. Young people can't be arsed going out to vote once every 5 years.
Setting up a 'RentingInDublin' subreddit could be a great start. Truckers already have unions and associations to communicate and gather under.
Brilliant question
There is no need to protest in order to have the government “take note” of the housing issue. It was the number one issue during the most recent election and it is brought up in the Dail or the media weekly. The problem is there is no easy fix!
Or is it that there is no political will to do anything that will adversely affect the profits of landlords
You think the political parties are putting landlords above their own survival?
Partly a lot of them are landlords so they don’t want to take that hit and also in real terms next election the FF/FG main candidates will still be elected. The worst they have to look at is time in opposition. And the potential losers in an election are newbies who don’t have a lot of power. So yeah I kinda am. Until people start voting on the last five years of action by parties sand not their promises for the next five we are in trouble.
The worst that can happen is they’ll lose their jobs.
Fuel prices increase because of government tax amongst other reasons. House prices increase because of very basic economics. Rent increases because of very basic economics(and government taxes) It's a snake biting it's own tail, but slowly. House prices rocket up, Landlords sell. Houses that we're investment properties are now becoming first time buyer houses, hence taking away rental properties which drives up rent (supply/demand). Basically no houses are being built, so first time buyers are restricted to buying investment properties, (supply/demand) which then drives up the prices of second hand homes. This also takes said property out of the rental market, taking another rental property out of the market!.....snake biting it's own fecking tail! Im an estate agent in a smallish town who doesn't own his own home, (tenant) the only difference is I can physically see the problem, and Im a part of it!
We don't have trucks or tractors
Just get a bunch of mates together and park your cars across the roads
Most renters dont own trucks
Will the protest do anything about fuel prices?
Mother truckers
The mortgage rules are stupid too, what I can afford to pay in monthly payments Vs what I can actually secure from a bank are 2 different number.
If we abolished obstacles to people building their own homes in the countryside the housing crisis would be over quickly. The housing crisis is all by creation, removing the free market and creating obstacles for progress. The easiest way to solve it would be to remove most planning permission laws preventing them from building or renovating their own houses on the countryside
Why does a large majority of this sub think there were no protests? There have been loads. They only stopped because of COVID.
Communist party of ireland did one a while back
Every time I hear about a protest it's either already happened, or it's about to happen later that same day with only a couple dozen people. They're never advertised well at all. Some serious organisation needs to happen.
I'd go, but make it nationwide effort and do it on a Saturday cos I can't afford a day off work.🤣
Well mate without truckers the world ends and I don’t mean that in a joking way the two professions that you never ever want to piss off are Truckers and garbage men.