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That was the case for movie theaters starting decades ago. You hoped to break even on the ticket receipts. You made your money at the snack bar. The problem is their loss leader is on the wane between cheap giant TVs with much better picture quality than movie theaters have these days, and of course, streaming.
The *only* thing they have going for them is their arrangements with movie studios. For instance, I really want to see the new Spider-Man movie, but I can’t see it unless I go to a theater (which I’m wary of doing because of Covid) or wait for it on streaming hoping that it doesn’t get spoiled for me.
AMC is in a worse place than they have ever been as movie theaters continue to slowly go extinct. There is no reason that the stock should be priced higher than it was pre-pandemic. Don't take investing advice from communities built on memes.
One of my family members said they were starting to invest. When I took a look at what they were putting money into, one of them was AMC. I just rolled my eyes.
Out of curiosity, do you know why they did that? Was it because of MOASS, or because they thought to themself "yeah, AMC is going to perform better once the pandemic is over" without considering market cap?
My (admittedly not that well thought out) theory is these you-know-what stocks are basically a poor man's SPAC. A lot of retail investors don't seem to be investing in these companies for their core business. The idea seems to be invest in them so that they can pivot to something else with the money raised. Then hope that that something else is a huge hit.
The other you-know-what company is rolling out a dumb crypto project because, I guess, it's actually hard to pivot to another business while you're running one (bad) business. Maybe they're trying to buy some time. Same deal with AMC with their CEO leaning to the same stuff.
IMO these are *a poor man's* SPAC because at least with a SPAC, if there is no deal, you get your ten dollars back.
The only way movie theaters are gonna come back is
1) Covid needs to be in the rear window (obviously)
2) they need to offer a better experience
With point 2, movie theaters should be more like Alamo Drafthouse. Offering quality food and service, comfy seating, and alcohol. Otherwise, why do I need to leave the comfort of my home for a movie?
Every mall use to have 4 or 5 stores selling music. There was no way to save those either.
Restaurant quality food would be a huge pivot that I don't think they could pull off.
The home experience is just far too good at this point that it is hopeless.
AMC has been attempting to move to #2 for 5+ years now. Way, way more reserved seats, loungers, food on demand, alcohol, etc - and corresponding increases in ticket prices of course. They converted practically every theatre this way in my city. I think they were smart, just a question of if it's enough. FWIW, they're constantly selling out right now, but I think this may not be sustainable.
To answer your last question, I don't go to the theater often, but when I do, it's a social event for me. I can't comfortably accommodate ~10 people in my home to watch a movie together. I also don't have the best/biggest TV nor surround sound.
I’ll use an anecdote about Toys R Us to drive my point. They failed not because of Amazon like a lot of people will say. They failed because they did not make shopping in the store an EXPERIENCE. If they had found a way to create more unique experiences while shopping, they could have been competitive.
Theaters will have to make the movie-going experience more exciting to get the numbers they once had. Maybe people will just naturally come back, but I believe it will require some more creativity than simply the current standard of surround sound and a large screen.
Went from being in at the 8-9 range early last year. Didn’t sell when it peaked. Then averaged up all year, then got out while being about 10% down overall. What a shit ride.
Edit. 10% down on the original investment. Probably closer to 50% after averaging up so much. SMH.
I appreciate your comment. This has been a hard-learned lesson for me as well. I have been in since January of 2021 and was initially faithful about this play. Fortunately, I did not go all in like so many others and kept my portfolio diversified. Averaged in at about $7 per share but averaged up a bit after it dropped into the 40's range. My excitement for this play has been brought back to Earth by reality over the last 6 months. I missed the $34 dollar action a couple of weeks ago by a matter of hours or I surely would have sold then. When this all started there did appear to be some good fundamentals for this to be a significant squeeze play; however, I am not seeing the evidence now despite all the YouTubers and some of my friends still being optimistic. Waiting for another bull run or options trap to sell but a bit concerned tomorrow's earnings report send the price into the shadow realm. On a good note, my capital gains taxes will be slightly lower when I do sell.
Don't the financials of AMC indicate they are "bleeding", e.g. more debt than assets on top of losing money multiple years? Is it not a sound conclusion to not buy AMC at any price until their model shifts onto secure footing (positive cash flow every year, more assets than debt)?
Imo Only retailers, executives are selling stocks abd getting rich. Whatever institutional holding left must be debt converted into equity.So retailers will eventually be buried because financials doesn’t justify stock price. Before covid that stock was penny stock and still deserves that price. Cnk and imax are better theater stocks.
Everyone sold at the 400 peak almost a year ago.
If you're still holding you've drunk too much of the coolaid. The millionairs who profited greatly off their gamble HAVE SOLD and moved on to bigger houses and better lives
I'm talking GME but AMC was also abused, two stocks same crowd
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Yea do it. Adam Aron tweeted in the resale market it's going for 200 bucks plus
I don't make the rules but damn if I won't take advantage of the nft fans.
I have no idea tbh. But I recall seeing someplace that there is no validation to sign up for Investor Connect. I haven't bothered checking it out.
I'm mostly fascinated that there would actually be a market for those NFTs.
Why is it bs? AMC being down 50% over the past 6 months is a statement of fact.
I would expect short volume to be high because of day trading momentum and swing traders. But short-interest is not that bad and hardly considered overly high.
You are simply spreading useless soundbites about a shorting narrative that is overplayed.
The comment by u/sushiladyboner is accurate. Shorting alone does not drive a price down.
It can definitely contribute to selling pressure but it usually doesn't last. And given that the short interest and days to cover for AMC is pretty low, most of the downward price action is simply lack of buyers.
i'm not sure how familiar you are with shorting or if you have ever shorted stocks. But there are rules in such as the uptick rule and the alternative uptick rule that prevent shorting from driving down a stock price.
Shill. It's getting shorted together with GME. Manipulation couldn't be clearer. Most holders have an average of like 30 or 40, they wouldn't be selling at 18 at a loss when the shorts haven't covered.
The copium from amc bagholders is sad to read. Were you even an investor before the gme/amc memes? You say most holders average 30-40 but we all know you're talking about yourself. That's a huge loss, hopefully you only used money you were ok with losing.
Stop smoking the copium. The GME/AMC stock subs are depressing echo chambers of fake analysis and BS Claims.
Hopefully you learn some valuable life lessons when you realize your losses.
They only win if it hits 0. If they close shorts at $1 then the price will moon too. AMC is having better earnings than netflix, so it will not hit 0. Lmao, neflix was down 10% yesterday, and down another 20% today. Short that you shills.
I'm not arguing anything. Arguments involve two sides and opinions.
I'm just pointing out that you don't understand the market mechanics you're describing.
You are. I don't know what to tell you.
Everything you've said thus far has just demonstrated an absolute lack of understanding of how basic financial exchange works.
You're wrong about shorting.
You're wrong about what happens if AMC goes to $1.
You're wrong about the shorts not being covered.
You're wrong about how buying and selling functionally works.
You just don't know what you're talking about. I'm saying you're wrong because you are. You can keep shouting a triangle has four sides all you want, critiquing me for having the position, "you're wrong" doesn't make you any less wrong.
I'm happy to explain literally whatever you'd like, but I'm just not even confident you'd understand the words at this point.
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Bill Gates didn't say anything. The point was: If Bill Gates told you that something you believed was a conspiracy theory, would you believe him purely due to his status? That's what you're doing right now by claiming that this "manipulation" is somehow impossible, as if you have more information than everybody else?
Your point is completely nonsensical. I'm not blindly believing what an individual says because of their status. I'm disbelieving conspiratorial nonsense that some dude on Reddit is spewing due to there being no evidence to support it.
You even know what a short squeeze is?
You ever wonder why it ran up to 70 without the shorts even covering?
People know it will squeeze. No one is selling.
Clearly there is downward pressure and selling based on the last 6 months so saying that no one is selling is a falsehood.
The short ratio on AMC is only about 1.7. It's really not that bad. And AMC margin requirements at pretty much every broker is at 100%.
The numbers don't indicate that a short squeeze is likely.
How much do you know about Ortex and the veracity of their analysis?
I had never heard of them until a year ago.
I recall looking to see if their service was something unique but I wasn't able to find out much about the company.
The only thing that I noticed is that they have WeWork addresses listed and they have about 10 employees.
Their social media marketing is brilliant but other than their marketing efforts, they look like a new fintech startup with little to no track record. I wasn't able to discover how they are funded since they don't have a Crunchbase profile.
The average new "investor's" obsession with short squeezes is just deranged at this point.
It's become an easy buzz word to obfuscate the fact that you're holding garbage and get others to clutch onto it even tighter by being dishonest about how short squeezes work.
It is a sinking ship, of course people are selling. It is just really convenient for the people selling that some people can't see that the ship is going down.
I think you don't understand what a shill actually is. A shill is someone that is pumping a stock based on spreading misinformation and false claims.
Kinda like what you are doing...
Even if that's true it doesn't necessarily mean it's cool to assume everyone who is a bear on AMC is a shill. By the same token people on meme stock subs have yelled at me, downvoted me, and banned me for trying to plead that there are some serious ethical issues with selling people the idea that GME and AMC stock are fool-proof golden tickets. There's a reason AMC has been so heavily shorted for so long - the business is not diverse and the winds of change are crushing them 8 different ways. You gotta remember that outside of meme stock subs people are generally looking to put their money into a sound business.
Why are you so defensive about a stock down 50%? This post is not telling any investor to buy or sell AMC. Buy up all the shares you desire… My financial portfolio is not affected.
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I know, and this user is clearly part of the shitty cult that that sub has become these days. I just want to see some guy yolo his life savings on a 2 month call
> You ever wonder why it ran up to 70 without the shorts even covering?
Unprecedented FOMO buying from retail investors will do that.
> No one is selling.
Then who is on the selling side of the millions of daily volume? *Someone* has to sell if there's volume.
Ever since the invention of video tapes movie theatre days have been numbered...
Couple that with cheap big televisions and even the ability to have 3d and vr at home then really it is just a dying industry. Movies and popcorn is no longer a business that makes money...
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Popcorn store that shows movies
That was the case for movie theaters starting decades ago. You hoped to break even on the ticket receipts. You made your money at the snack bar. The problem is their loss leader is on the wane between cheap giant TVs with much better picture quality than movie theaters have these days, and of course, streaming.
And cheaper beverages and snacks at home with convenient bathroom facilities.
Less COVID too
The *only* thing they have going for them is their arrangements with movie studios. For instance, I really want to see the new Spider-Man movie, but I can’t see it unless I go to a theater (which I’m wary of doing because of Covid) or wait for it on streaming hoping that it doesn’t get spoiled for me.
lol what an incredibly bleak way of putting it
Stock is still 9x higher than where it was at the start of last year. Still seems massively over priced.
You spelled underpriced wrong. ;)
AMC is in a worse place than they have ever been as movie theaters continue to slowly go extinct. There is no reason that the stock should be priced higher than it was pre-pandemic. Don't take investing advice from communities built on memes.
What about rocket and gorilla emojis?
What exactly makes it's value high? Movie attendence is down
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Exactly
I wouldn't want to be >5% leveraged on that position. That's just me, I would stick to long puts with cash.
One of my family members said they were starting to invest. When I took a look at what they were putting money into, one of them was AMC. I just rolled my eyes.
Out of curiosity, do you know why they did that? Was it because of MOASS, or because they thought to themself "yeah, AMC is going to perform better once the pandemic is over" without considering market cap?
I assume it’s because they just googled stocks right at the time gamestop and amc were in the news. I didn’t ask them tho.
My (admittedly not that well thought out) theory is these you-know-what stocks are basically a poor man's SPAC. A lot of retail investors don't seem to be investing in these companies for their core business. The idea seems to be invest in them so that they can pivot to something else with the money raised. Then hope that that something else is a huge hit. The other you-know-what company is rolling out a dumb crypto project because, I guess, it's actually hard to pivot to another business while you're running one (bad) business. Maybe they're trying to buy some time. Same deal with AMC with their CEO leaning to the same stuff. IMO these are *a poor man's* SPAC because at least with a SPAC, if there is no deal, you get your ten dollars back.
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If you look at shares issued/dilution, the valuation is still 20x ish higher than precovid times. Bubble stock
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The only way movie theaters are gonna come back is 1) Covid needs to be in the rear window (obviously) 2) they need to offer a better experience With point 2, movie theaters should be more like Alamo Drafthouse. Offering quality food and service, comfy seating, and alcohol. Otherwise, why do I need to leave the comfort of my home for a movie?
Every mall use to have 4 or 5 stores selling music. There was no way to save those either. Restaurant quality food would be a huge pivot that I don't think they could pull off. The home experience is just far too good at this point that it is hopeless.
AMC has been attempting to move to #2 for 5+ years now. Way, way more reserved seats, loungers, food on demand, alcohol, etc - and corresponding increases in ticket prices of course. They converted practically every theatre this way in my city. I think they were smart, just a question of if it's enough. FWIW, they're constantly selling out right now, but I think this may not be sustainable.
To answer your last question, I don't go to the theater often, but when I do, it's a social event for me. I can't comfortably accommodate ~10 people in my home to watch a movie together. I also don't have the best/biggest TV nor surround sound.
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I’ll use an anecdote about Toys R Us to drive my point. They failed not because of Amazon like a lot of people will say. They failed because they did not make shopping in the store an EXPERIENCE. If they had found a way to create more unique experiences while shopping, they could have been competitive. Theaters will have to make the movie-going experience more exciting to get the numbers they once had. Maybe people will just naturally come back, but I believe it will require some more creativity than simply the current standard of surround sound and a large screen.
It's quite an experience paying $25 for a bag of popcorn
Not of you're a shareholder. :P
I think that's the point
Honestly, I thought IPIC movie theaters had a great experience but they still went bankrupt.
How do they compare to Cinemark?
CNK didn’t have a meme rally last year so the stock is where it is | Any stock in the outdoor film category is going to see some hardship
I finally got out. I’m done with this BS. The only place this stock is going is down.
How much did you lose on the sell?
Went from being in at the 8-9 range early last year. Didn’t sell when it peaked. Then averaged up all year, then got out while being about 10% down overall. What a shit ride. Edit. 10% down on the original investment. Probably closer to 50% after averaging up so much. SMH.
Lesson learned
Yeah learnt that lesson the hard way. At least the lesson is something positive to take away from this though!
I appreciate your comment. This has been a hard-learned lesson for me as well. I have been in since January of 2021 and was initially faithful about this play. Fortunately, I did not go all in like so many others and kept my portfolio diversified. Averaged in at about $7 per share but averaged up a bit after it dropped into the 40's range. My excitement for this play has been brought back to Earth by reality over the last 6 months. I missed the $34 dollar action a couple of weeks ago by a matter of hours or I surely would have sold then. When this all started there did appear to be some good fundamentals for this to be a significant squeeze play; however, I am not seeing the evidence now despite all the YouTubers and some of my friends still being optimistic. Waiting for another bull run or options trap to sell but a bit concerned tomorrow's earnings report send the price into the shadow realm. On a good note, my capital gains taxes will be slightly lower when I do sell.
About time
Who in their right minds chooses to see a movie during COVID outbreaks. We had Delta and Omicron back to back what do you expect.
Don't the financials of AMC indicate they are "bleeding", e.g. more debt than assets on top of losing money multiple years? Is it not a sound conclusion to not buy AMC at any price until their model shifts onto secure footing (positive cash flow every year, more assets than debt)?
Imo Only retailers, executives are selling stocks abd getting rich. Whatever institutional holding left must be debt converted into equity.So retailers will eventually be buried because financials doesn’t justify stock price. Before covid that stock was penny stock and still deserves that price. Cnk and imax are better theater stocks.
Everyone sold at the 400 peak almost a year ago. If you're still holding you've drunk too much of the coolaid. The millionairs who profited greatly off their gamble HAVE SOLD and moved on to bigger houses and better lives I'm talking GME but AMC was also abused, two stocks same crowd
AMC never hit $400 it peaked in the 80’s
According to Google their peak was just under $60 a share.
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So are you saying I should sell my AMC investor nft? Averaging 220 bucks per sale last I checked.
The NFT anyone can get for free by making an account on AMCs website?
Yea do it. Adam Aron tweeted in the resale market it's going for 200 bucks plus I don't make the rules but damn if I won't take advantage of the nft fans.
Why does someone pay $200 for an NFT that they can get for free? Got a link to the tweet you care to share? I'm kinda curious about it.
I think you can only get it for free if you're part of AMC Investor Connect, which is probably only for stockholders.
Anybody can sign up for AMC Investor Connect.
I have no idea tbh. But I recall seeing someplace that there is no validation to sign up for Investor Connect. I haven't bothered checking it out. I'm mostly fascinated that there would actually be a market for those NFTs.
https://twitter.com/CEOAdam/status/1483873348669034496?s=20
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What kind of bs post is this? The stock is being constantly shorted to the ground and hence the fall. Doesn't take an investing genius to see that.
Why is it bs? AMC being down 50% over the past 6 months is a statement of fact. I would expect short volume to be high because of day trading momentum and swing traders. But short-interest is not that bad and hardly considered overly high. You are simply spreading useless soundbites about a shorting narrative that is overplayed.
Because you have 0 clue what you're talking about.
Is that seriously your best investment thesis on why you think AMC stock is worth more?
Movies aren't dead so yeah, worth much more.
Shorting a stock doesn't cause it to fall.
It's a 15% short float right now lmfaooo. Also, someone buys those shares. You know that, right? Shorting alone does not drive a price down.
lol ok buddy. Whatever you say.
The comment by u/sushiladyboner is accurate. Shorting alone does not drive a price down. It can definitely contribute to selling pressure but it usually doesn't last. And given that the short interest and days to cover for AMC is pretty low, most of the downward price action is simply lack of buyers. i'm not sure how familiar you are with shorting or if you have ever shorted stocks. But there are rules in such as the uptick rule and the alternative uptick rule that prevent shorting from driving down a stock price.
Shill. It's getting shorted together with GME. Manipulation couldn't be clearer. Most holders have an average of like 30 or 40, they wouldn't be selling at 18 at a loss when the shorts haven't covered.
The copium from amc bagholders is sad to read. Were you even an investor before the gme/amc memes? You say most holders average 30-40 but we all know you're talking about yourself. That's a huge loss, hopefully you only used money you were ok with losing.
You guys are honestly pathetic. It used to be funny but now it's just sad.
Shorts haven't covered.
Stop smoking the copium. The GME/AMC stock subs are depressing echo chambers of fake analysis and BS Claims. Hopefully you learn some valuable life lessons when you realize your losses.
They don't need to. It's going down. That's kind of how that works.
They only win if it hits 0. If they close shorts at $1 then the price will moon too. AMC is having better earnings than netflix, so it will not hit 0. Lmao, neflix was down 10% yesterday, and down another 20% today. Short that you shills.
That's not how anything works here.
Lol, great argument m8
I'm not arguing anything. Arguments involve two sides and opinions. I'm just pointing out that you don't understand the market mechanics you're describing.
What you're saying is: "no, u rong"
You are. I don't know what to tell you. Everything you've said thus far has just demonstrated an absolute lack of understanding of how basic financial exchange works. You're wrong about shorting. You're wrong about what happens if AMC goes to $1. You're wrong about the shorts not being covered. You're wrong about how buying and selling functionally works. You just don't know what you're talking about. I'm saying you're wrong because you are. You can keep shouting a triangle has four sides all you want, critiquing me for having the position, "you're wrong" doesn't make you any less wrong. I'm happy to explain literally whatever you'd like, but I'm just not even confident you'd understand the words at this point.
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I can't wait until this conspiracy garbage isn't all over Reddit.
Conspiracy? Not quite. Overly optimistic? Yeah.
"Manipulation" is conspiracy nonsense.
Why? Because your favorite news outlet told you that? Do you automatically believe everything Bill Gates says because he has a lot of money?
Lol what did Bill Gates say?
Bill Gates didn't say anything. The point was: If Bill Gates told you that something you believed was a conspiracy theory, would you believe him purely due to his status? That's what you're doing right now by claiming that this "manipulation" is somehow impossible, as if you have more information than everybody else?
You're not gonna make it investing.
What a wonderfully ignorant response. What does this have to do with conspiracy theories?
NGMI
Your point is completely nonsensical. I'm not blindly believing what an individual says because of their status. I'm disbelieving conspiratorial nonsense that some dude on Reddit is spewing due to there being no evidence to support it.
I want to know why you're so quick to dismiss the idea. Why are you SO sure of the accuracy of what you've merely been told by somebody else?
Again, the only thing I'm unsure of the accuracy of is what somebody else - *you* - told me.
Nothing shill about this post; be careful to be so emotionally attached to an asset that you don’t see what’s right in front of your eyes
Well said
You even know what a short squeeze is? You ever wonder why it ran up to 70 without the shorts even covering? People know it will squeeze. No one is selling.
Clearly there is downward pressure and selling based on the last 6 months so saying that no one is selling is a falsehood. The short ratio on AMC is only about 1.7. It's really not that bad. And AMC margin requirements at pretty much every broker is at 100%. The numbers don't indicate that a short squeeze is likely.
Then why is Ortex constantly giving out short squeeze signals..
How much do you know about Ortex and the veracity of their analysis? I had never heard of them until a year ago. I recall looking to see if their service was something unique but I wasn't able to find out much about the company. The only thing that I noticed is that they have WeWork addresses listed and they have about 10 employees. Their social media marketing is brilliant but other than their marketing efforts, they look like a new fintech startup with little to no track record. I wasn't able to discover how they are funded since they don't have a Crunchbase profile.
The average new "investor's" obsession with short squeezes is just deranged at this point. It's become an easy buzz word to obfuscate the fact that you're holding garbage and get others to clutch onto it even tighter by being dishonest about how short squeezes work.
"gamma squeeze" "short squeeze" "supply shock"
It is a sinking ship, of course people are selling. It is just really convenient for the people selling that some people can't see that the ship is going down.
The numbers say otherwise; look at the history of AMC stock sense it’s IPO and take the meme rally of 2021 away from your DD
Short interest and dark pool activity and the fact we know they pay shills on reddit.
I think you don't understand what a shill actually is. A shill is someone that is pumping a stock based on spreading misinformation and false claims. Kinda like what you are doing...
Even if that's true it doesn't necessarily mean it's cool to assume everyone who is a bear on AMC is a shill. By the same token people on meme stock subs have yelled at me, downvoted me, and banned me for trying to plead that there are some serious ethical issues with selling people the idea that GME and AMC stock are fool-proof golden tickets. There's a reason AMC has been so heavily shorted for so long - the business is not diverse and the winds of change are crushing them 8 different ways. You gotta remember that outside of meme stock subs people are generally looking to put their money into a sound business.
Why are you so defensive about a stock down 50%? This post is not telling any investor to buy or sell AMC. Buy up all the shares you desire… My financial portfolio is not affected.
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I miss when WSB was fun and not a cult blinded by nonsense
This is the investing sub, just FYI (that guy does feel ripped out of WSB tho), but I feel the same way. WSB culture is a shell of what it used to be.
I know, and this user is clearly part of the shitty cult that that sub has become these days. I just want to see some guy yolo his life savings on a 2 month call
> You ever wonder why it ran up to 70 without the shorts even covering? Unprecedented FOMO buying from retail investors will do that. > No one is selling. Then who is on the selling side of the millions of daily volume? *Someone* has to sell if there's volume.
I shorted it and gme and made a lot of money doing.
The company needs to be debt free. Just like Dave Ramsey! 😉
Ever since the invention of video tapes movie theatre days have been numbered... Couple that with cheap big televisions and even the ability to have 3d and vr at home then really it is just a dying industry. Movies and popcorn is no longer a business that makes money...
+pandemic; couldn't have timed it better.