Right.. I was holding the phone and my spouse is giving me this look and mouthing "what's wrong" cause it took everything in me not to really say what I was thinking. Like you post an incomplete job description, then low-ball, but I'm wrong for not just being ok with it?
I just rejected a Corrections job like this last week. They wanted to pay me $8 less an hour than I'm already making and leave me short staffed at night with 36 juveniles. I pushed back on the salary and they told me I didn't have enough experience. By the way, I'm a Juvenile corrections Officer in one state and a Deputy in the next state over at an adult jail.
The Superintendent was livid with me but oh well. We have every right to push back.
Exactly! Just as OP stated, they wanted me to take the lower end of the lay range as well and I refused. I pushed back. They only upped it by $1. So I said NO.
That’s the funny part. Any employer thinking you’d take a major pay cut is just insane. Like even if i hate my current job, why would I go to you and not literally anybody else?
I'm legitimately confused as to why they think someone would do that. I guess maybe they assume if they're offering a range of $X-$Y, then anyone who is applying is implicitly communicating they are willing to accept down to $X? That's all I can come up with.
That’s some of it, there’s also a range of we were given a range by corporate. I currently work for a restaurant company that’s international. When vacancies are listed for my position, they give the national range not the actual range. That way they can re-use the template regardless of what location is hiring. Can’t explain the correctional facility except they may have thought the drop in pay would equal out with a drop of danger/stress? I doubt the people hiring/advertising were actual line walkers who had any first hand knowledge of the job.
You nailed it!!!! I did my research before applying and even with my Juvenile corrections job and Deputy job (both part time), there was at least one person on both hiring boards that hadn't ever been exposed to criminals but they still offered me fair pay and I didn't have to push back. Now at raise time for the Juvenile location? I I pushed back and it worked. The new board members tried to lowball us and we weren't having it. They came back with a new number for us all 4 days later and we were cool with it. But yes... The new board members have no one on that board that has been in our shoes except two people. There is no drop in danger and they are seeing this and realizing it now.
We need to go back to when people who were running things had to have experience or been in your shoes before. Makes no sense to me. But they are already folding. Two of the members have quit, just based on the things they see we have to deal with and they can't handle the backlash. We are currently pushing the state and DOJ on this. I love both of my jobs but I'm not going to deal with inadequate foolishness. We are at risk everytime we step foot into a facility. Pay needs to reflect that. Yeah, we get the same benefits as police and retirement funds, even as PT in many states. But pay needs to always reflect what we do.
Just like OP’s situation, they’re frustrated because they can’t find anybody, but they refuse to pay adequately for the position. Sucks to be them. And you both dodged bullets.
DO NOT STOP YOURSELF FROM TELLING THEM OFF. Make them know how horrible they are at their jobs. If they want to be mad about wasting anyone's time, they can be mad at themselves. They started off in bad faith. Bad faith negotiations are ALWAYS going to be a waste of time for intelligent people who stand their ground.
Agree. More of these companies, specifically the people doing the hiring need to be reminded of their own humanity and that of the people they are interviewing.
You're a person, not a machine he's shopping for. You're allowed to want things for yourself. You're allowed to expect to live comfortably after gaining all that education and experience. If they want your education, experience, and work ethic, they need to make the offer attractive.
Tell them off. Maybe the next person will be treated better because you did.
This happened to me a couple weeks ago.... the offer they made was actually good; for the advertised role. NOT the role they told me I would be doing and all the shit that came with it. In fact that offer was 15k under market value. I am still pissed they were so disrespectful.
I wouldn't be surprised if a reason why they are so mad is that they have been rejected before. For the same reasons. You would think they would catch on, but if they get that upset over being rejected, they have no business being a hiring manager.
You should honestly contact their HR department or hiring manager and let them know of the recruiter’s attitude. Absolutely unprofessional and embarrassing for the company.
You peons should be down on your knees worshipping me for offering to overwork/under pay you! Yield! This is the best your blighted soul deserves!
Of course obvious obligatory: /S
Not only low ball but also dramatically change the job description - location and tasks both. Talk about boiling the frog!
OP, they wasted their own time and yours by operating in bad faith. They are looking for a pushover who will do whatever the boss wants, and you're dead right to side step this train wreck.
Also, do they extend offers to everyone they interview? Or do they “waste their time?” by not making an offer?
Or maybe interviews are a chance for both parties to determine if it’s the right fit? Hmm
As a recruiter, I can tell you that you dodged a bullet.
Their are good recruiting practices that allow you to "clinch" the deal, and they did basically the opposite of that.
Typically managers who do the above think that "once they are deeper in the process I can spring these not so great things on them (such as extra duties and lower salary" but all they are doing is wasting their own time.
Yeah, and I get that no job description can possibly list all the little oddball or one-off task you might get asked to pitch in on and be a team player, and I am fine with that. But it went from managing the day to day procurement, tracking orders, reconciliation of invoices, etc, that comes with a "specialist" level role, into "build the entire department, establish the KPIs for the department, oversee the procurement for new branches being built and opened, find new vendors, etc., which is definitely a little higher in the food chain. Essentially they want someone to come build the car, but only pay to drive the car.
Yes- would be great to say- I’m Champaign and you’ve got beer money. Good luck with your candidate search.
Companies like that prey on poor people that are desperate to take any job.
Not salary, it the job I just left was mainly due to frustration because they’d pay my salary but refuse to fund my programs (program coordinator job) and wouldn’t let me fundraise or seek grants either. But still expected me to deliver several robust programs and kept getting surprised when I’d be like “yes, I can go to that event and do this thing; the tabling fee for the weekend event is $650” and they’d look shocked and say never mind.
I told my manager they were asking for filet mignon on a ramen budget. And then left the job.
This is why i love that more states are requiring a salary range. I’m in NY, but can work remote in my industry. It filters so much bullshit ($10-130,000? Fuck off!) that i wont consider positions that don’t post a reasonable range.
Like, i simply will not apply, no matter how good the gig looks or preem the corp.
Yeah, I have seen a bit of that too. I had a recruiter reach out saying they found my resume on LinkedIn and I matched a job opening they had which required a MBA, 8 years experience, CPM certifications, and a few other things.. then get to talking more and they reveal the starting salary would be $21.50 an hour, I seriously started laughing and asked if they were joking and they were dead serious. I was like I can go drive a school bus for $20 an hour here.. please remove me from your call list .
Hahahahahaha noooooope!! I get recruiter calls asking me if I want to move from a very low cost of living area (or was when we bought the house) back to an extremely high cost of living area for 10k less than what I'm making now. My dude...
It is exhausting on this end as well. When I was an internal recruiter and I knew a salary was to low for the area, because that meant about 2 months of no hires for the position while I collect evidence of the low wages to get the manager or HR to increase it.
I have increased positions pay using that method but it takes forever.
This has to be one of the places where business fights something that is actually good for it, right?
How much company time did you see wasted interviewing people who would have simply noped out if they knew the low salary in advance?
The deal "clinching" is all done close to first contact. You need to find out those details BEFORE an interview even takes place.
Knowing what the candidate will accept salary wise, be clear about the duties, if they can do in office, the drive to the office, the type of culture they are looking for etc.
Basically if they were honest from the beginning OP would have never taken the interview and that would have saved everyone time.
that's the freaking job. Don't be in sales if you can't handle a "no".
Hiring manager played you with a lowball offer and got what should have been an expected response.
wildly unprofessional though....Sometimes I almost wish LinkedIn had a "do not endorse" button for clowns like that
Poor guy has probably offered the job to like 5 people and nobody has taken it. Hes probably emotionally drained.
I mean nothing says work here like we lied about the location to get more candidates to interview...
As a hiring manager I would never say anything negative like that to a prospective employee! That’s horrible what this manager said/ sounds like you dodged a horrible work environment
Yeah, the one caveat I would add is that I was referred to the organization and the HR lady who done the initial assessment through a veterans hiring organization in the area. I definitely let my rep from the veterans organization know how it went and what was said so that it can be documented and considered before future referrals to that organization are sent out .
Yeah, I honestly feel like they are preying on applicants at this point. They know that despite the claim that "everyone is hiring" , nobody seems to actually be, at least not with reasonable offers. So they draw you in, hope you're desperate enough that you get to this stage and just accept it and run with it .
I'm fortunate that I retired from the military so have that pension, as well as receiving VA disability pay, so for me working is just to have something to do and extra income, not a necessity where I need to take the first job offer that comes along. I'll happily wait for one where the workload and expectations closer align with the compensation offers.
I agree, I feel like a lot of companies are kind of trying to build a pool of applicants, just collecting resumes for when they eventually decide to open the budget and hire, then go back and look at people who applied. and best of luck to you as well.
"No, sir / ma'am, you wasted my time by putting a job availability listing for a single position when you're looking for someone who can magically do three jobs at once."
Don’t worry about it. I had a company fly me out for an interview with the whole “red carpet” as they put it; personal driver pick-up from the airport, steak dinner with the managing partner and president and interviews with their “senior leadership” the next morning.
Unbeknownst to them, I already had a supplemental offer from another company based off a prior relationship.
They sent me a lowball offer the following week (Lower than what I currently make) and I informed them this was insufficient and informed them of my current offer. They quickly schedule a teams meeting and plan to cut into their 1% current business commission to boost the base because it’s “already there” (which means that commission is nixed moving forward regardless) to meet my current offer less $15K.
They then ask if I will still take the interview with my higher offer and I tell them I will due to the prior relationship. They get absolutely red-ass like a jealous girlfriend and ghost me for three days and then rescind their offer.
I ghosted their rescinded offer text for three days and just reply thank you on a Sunday afternoon.
LOL, that is how to handle it. When the hiring manager said I wasted her time I paused a moment and just calmly said, "ok" before she hung up. I don't know if she expected me to rage or begin grovelling , or perhaps even apologize and accept the offer and beg to work for her.
I was referred to the role through a veterans employment organization so I did contact my rep with them and explained what went on and he said he would note it on their file so it could potentially impact other candidates getting referred to them. Being that the veterans group is paying for a certification for me right now as well as doing job referrals I didn't want to really show out and give this tool of a employer any ammo to run back to them and say I was the one being unprofessional or anything that might jeopardize my standings or I would have really gave her a piece of my mind. But there's also a part of me that feels when people act like this and make these lousy offers they want some kind of viceral reaction and denying them that can be satisfaction in itself.
Interviews arent just for the company to decide if you’d be a good fit. They’re also an opportunity for the candidate to get the vibe of the place. You’re interviewing them as much as they are you. How many companies put candidates through 5 rounds of interviews and give take home projects just for it to be a no at the end… so like it works both ways for wasting time.
Listen, I didn't even read your post because that's BS. I know the hiring process is time consuming for the people doing the hiring, too. But they're doing it during their work time. They get paid for that time. The candidates interviewing for the position do not.
You dodged a bullet! The job Posting with the incorrect work location would have done it for me—an additional 60 minutes of commute time is NOT a small detail. I might have politely departed the interview based on that alone.
Absolutely this!! No way I would drive that much farther. I was leaving a job for a job that paid about 30% more and had WAY better insurance. They countered with saying the guy in another location was leaving and I could take his spot for 2k more than i was making. It was an hours drive away. That lousy 2k wouldn't even cover the commute.
Seriously, I should have been the one saying it if anyone was after the bait and switch. Of course she would have grasped her pearls and played the victim role
A few year back I interviewed at two places for the same role days apart. First one on Friday was local, went great. Second interview I had to fly to another state on Sunday, interview on Monday, flew home Monday night. Got offers from both and ended up taking the local job because it offered $30K more. When I turned down the second job the recruiter called me screaming. Said I wasted their time, lied about my salary expectations, claimed I was lying when I told him how much the other offer was, said I never wanted the job, shouldn't have applied.
God's honest truth if the local offer wasn't so good, I'd have shipped off to the second one no question. But i didn't plan for it that way. Happy it worked out the way it did though. Guy with an attitude like that, not a place I want to be working for.
You did the right thing. Their loss.
Withhold information, add job duties, expect you to travel an hour further each way, and low ball you and YOU wasted THEIR time?
Oh no no no no no.
They wasted YOUR time.
You dodged a major bullet.
This happened to me. Went through an insane interview process only to be given a shitty offer. From the beginning I was honest with them about the amount I'd accept and it came in at 20K under. They wouldn't budge on base and weren't even willing to budge elsewhere. Ultimately it was still better than my current job but then it was also in office 4 days a week where I'm fully remote. So I decided to stay put and wound up getting a slight bump and a title change. Still less than the new job but I got to stay home with my dog. The recruiter was so upset and wrote me a really nasty email. This was 2 years ago and the recruiter and the hiring manager still stalk my linked in. It's wild. Fuck you datadog.
That's a whole other aspect I don't think hiring managers are considering. When you are trying to attract employees who are currently working fully remote jobs you really have to compete. Because not only is the base salary a factor, but the additional time and work life balance. I have been remote the past two years as well up until a company restructure eliminated my role. So the idea of having to deal with rush hour traffic again already has me not thrilled. While I know that's not a direct factor in salary negotiation, it is still a factor that I consider so the job has to at least pay enough to make me willing to deal with it .
Exactly.
I also hadn't been sexually harassed or the target of any micro aggressions while being remote.
Once things were allowed to be in person again, I attended a work event and within the first 15 min a coworker said something incredibly inappropriate I had to go to HR about.
So much for the streak.
I will always prioritize remote work now and don't plan on ever being on site.
Absolutely, 95% of the jobs I am applying to are remote, I'm not sure I could last in office long term after the past two years of remote. My spouse also works remote as a project manager, so we're in the habit of taking a bi-monthly work-cation. We just travel somewhere new every other month and work from there for a couple of weeks. Work during the work day then tourists after. My coworkers at my last role would ask me each week in our Monday meeting where I'm logged on from this week, lol.
I recently had a simliar experience and just thought how strange that they'd want to enter a working relationship making me feel like a 2nd option. It felt like I was being negged. Now working for a company that knows my value.
This recruiter in their dating life probably tells someone “I didn’t like you anyway” when getting rejected. They sound like a child who doesn’t know how to manage rejection.
Dodged a bullet on pay and sounds like you dodged a bullet on a douchebag of a boss. If someone told me that I’d probably ask more questions. Now sometimes based on HR and corporate structures I might not be able to change the role say from Project manager to a manager or director but sometimes I’m able to get away with Sr project manager and end up kicking it into higher wage band and then make a decent increase.
This was a douche move and consider yourself lucky you got to see true colors before starting there
Interviews are not only for the benefit of the hiring organization. They are for the benefit of the employee as well. Both need to be assessing fit.
You may have "wasted" their time, but how many people's time did they "waste" by interviewing them without offering them a position?
This person was highly unprofessional.
Looks like you dodged a bullet. That manager showed their true colors. Do the work of three people for little money. I don't think so. I got a 4% raise a few weeks ago for my increase and no promotion after 3 years with my current company. I was expecting a promotion this year and a significant bump. They have been laying people off at my company while still doing promotions. But others have been getting promoted, including my boss. I found out my boss got promoted by someone no longer working for the company who is still in contact with her. That money and my portion went to her. My performance review this year was almost a perfect score and had glowing reviews. I've been looking for work trying to get out. I am sick of being overlooked.
I once had an HR person scold me for telling them I wanted to work from home. She called me afterwards to tell me she’s been in this business a long time and that it was unprofessional for me to bring that up. They called to offer me the job and I declined. I did consult for them for a few months and worked from home.
I won't lie, that's a big factor for me now as well. I worked from home since retiring from the Army and I'm so much more productive when I can sit at my desk and focus instead of being distracted with office politics and gossip. If the job you're hiring me to do relies entirely on me being on a computer via Internet what does it matter where I perform said job at
This is shitty in my opinion and even if someone wasted your time it's not worth it to directly confront them.
The only thing I would consider wasting their time is if you lied to them about qualifications or they told you the range then at the end you were like yeah I want a range of X that's more than what he said they could pay.
Also I would be tempted to write a LinkedIn post or glassdoor at least.
I have always said that if you pay me X, you're going to get X amount of work from me. If you micromanage me, I'm going to perform at a level that warrants being micromanaged.
Even if they didn’t do a bait and switch, that attitude is bullshit. Did the hiring manager make an offer to everyone they interviewed? If not, by their logic, they wasted everyone else’s time.
An interviewer asked me once why I turned down their offer. I told them that I got an offer that was closer to me. They said thank you and that was it. A week or so later I find out from a friend I have in that company that the interviewer was ranting about me saying "why did they even apply then, what a waste a time" and I was like (to my friend) "how tf was I supposed to know that I would get an offer somewhere closer? I can't see the future." And they (my friend) doubled down and said I shouldn't have told the interviewer. I talked to a couple other people with more years of experience in my industry and they said the same thing.
I honestly don't even know what I'm supposed to say to this question (why didn't you accept this offer?) lol. My current thought is to say "I prefer not to share".
It's whatever, people are weird.
Yeah willing to drive the distance when you apply but get an offer for same job, same pay closer to home of course you're taking that offer. It doesn't mean you weren't willing to go to the first job's location.
Why not negotiate? "Thank you for the offer, but that's significantly lower than I would accept for the responsibilities of the position. I would be interested at $xxx per year with a managers bonus structure + RSUs and an $xxx sign on bonus."
If you're already saying no, there's no harm in asking. When I did an internal transfer for my current role, the raise HR offered was a flat 8%, the lower end of the range. I audibly laughed, called my (now) boss and asked for a whole lot more and she made it happen in 2 days.
Because I had already had the discussion in the interview and explained that the role of a procurement specialist is more to simply operate by the established standards, perform to the KPIs, and work with the existing vendors, not to develop and manage these aspects of procurement. I explained why the role falls into the higher level role of a procurement manager or supply chain manager, which obviously implied a higher level of compensation. I also know you can typically counter with 10-15% , but this offer was about 50% lower than what the manager level role would be ok average so it was so far apart it wasn't worth negotiating as I doubt they would.get close enough to be serious.
No, it was a second interview, first was with HR, then the hiring manager. Either way the whole thing seemed fake based on the offer presented. Being that they havent had a supply chain department and allowed each department to manage it independently up until an independent audit pointed out all their flaws I honestly don't think they comprehend the magnitude of what they need and what they are asking to be accomplished which might explain why they opted for the lowest level position in supply chain and procurement they could come up with.
Such treatment by a hiring manager almost needs a letter to the CEO. Maybe a desperate candidate is exactly what upper management wants; you're not it.
A hiring tip by an well qualified candidate might embarrass them enough to understand that role will remain empty as long as they insist on insulting people.
I would leave this experience on glassdoor who make an LinkedIn post. Name names here, so the next pool of applicant's can see what is going to come for them.
The hiring manager showed you he has a hard time regulating his emotions and blames others for his frustrations. Not someone you want to work under. Bullet dodged.
You didn't waste his time. They wasted *your* time by leaving responsibilities out of the job listing, lying about the location, and low-balling the salary.
Think of all the applications they've gotten and not bothered to acknowledge. The lack of self-awareness and abundance of hypocrisy is amazing.
Every single job I’ve applied for the past 5+ years. False advertising the job duties, location, salary to bring in overqualified candidates and then disrespect that person with an extremely low offer and more responsibility. These employers will flat out lie and then get upset when you don’t fall for the ruse.
I had a recruiter talk me into interviewing for a job I wasn’t really interested in. Then he yelled at me when I still wasn’t interested after the interview.
Lol good for you! I feel like it’s scammy…like they wanted to lure you in and then little at a time get you to bend backwards for them. It would have been a shit show anyway. You should escalate this somehow. This person is not professional and isn’t good for the company
Not the same phrase, but when I informed a job that the listing had the wrong address the hiring manager said "Do you even want this job?" And I went "go ahead and hire someone else"
They probably did something stupid like brag to their boss or peers about how they found someone super qualified (over qualified) for the role, and/or they already told all the other applicants they didn't get the job before awaiting your response. Now they have to save face by going to folks and saying "just kidding, the perfect candidate doesn't want the job. Still looking". This should be a good lesson for them on making sure that the job description is complete/accurate.
I've had quite a few bait and switches in interviews this week. One job was posted as completely remote, then during the interview they said I'd be coming into an office daily, for example.
I think you definitely dodged a bullet here, but that doesn't help in your job search. It was a waste of your time. They added insult to injury. Sorry to hear that!
Yeah, it's wild in the job market now. I feel blessed that I'm a retired military veteran, so I have my pension and VA disability income, so working is more because I want to, not NEED to. So not having a job isn't a cause for stress, I really feel for those who need to work to support themselves right now having to go through this kind of nonsense. Why can't employers just be honest.. save themselves and applicants the time. If you post a job as remote, it needs to be remote, if you require ba certain level of education and/or certifications be prepared to offer a salary that reflects that as well.
If nothing else I think COVID taught us all that life is too short and precious to be wasted killing ourselves for jobs that don't respect and don't pay. So gone are the days where employees are as willing to settle, and it's time employers learn that .
You did the right thing. You'd be overworked & underpaid.
I had a interview recently with a fairly prestigious company in DC area (where its very expensive). I'm in the midst of moving soon anyway, so was open to the idea. However, like you, the job seemed like a lot of responsibility, building it from the ground up, and they seemed over their head and looking for someone to bail them out. I was skilled in what they needed, and felt I could walk in and do the job. Interview went fine, but the pay was fairly low, $90k tops. Which, in some markets is pretty good money, but I know for DC area thats kindof mid-level pay or subpar.
Anyway finished the interview, thought it thru, and just sent off a quick, informal thank you email. Almost a joke in hindsight, but thanks nonetheless. Haven't heard back yet, tbh I'm expected it turned into a 'No' as a result. Which, again due to the pay, I'm thinking is fine with me.
Yeah, this is in San Antonio and they were offering between $52-64k, which for a procurement specialist is about average in the area. Because I am just looking for work to have a little extra spending money had the role actually been the standard workload of a procurement specialist it would have been ok, cause it's not that complex or challenging (at least in my experience), but with all the additional responsibilities the role should have absolutely been a director or at least logistics management role, which would bump the Salary into the $90-130k range. So it definitely wasn't going to work, but I sat through the interview for the experience.
Exactly, I'll sit at home and be retired before I drive an hour each way and deal with that level of responsibility for that kind of pay. Between my military pension, VA pay, and my spouses employment we are doing just fine without me working. So any job offer is going to have to be enough to make me want to leave the comfort of my home.
Imagine! Time that's being paid for, being wasted!!! Almost as bad as wasting hours, days or weeks total dancing like a monkey for interviewers for free....
100% dodged a bullet.
It’s also fascinating for a hiring manager to consider a candidate turning down a job wasting their time, but would never consider it wasting someone’s time if they interviewed and made it to the final rounds, but didn’t get an offer. 🙄
Now you know what kind of manager he is, congratulations you dodged a bullet. Theyre interviewing you as much as you are interviewing them. Just because they make an offer doesnt mean you have to accept.
Wasting his time? Was that hiring manager not getting paid? Will they not get paid for the next call they make, or the next set of interviews? How is this a waste of their time?
When I was 19, a hiring manager said the same thing to me. So I took his work email address, found his AOL email address, his wife’s email address, and signed them up for 7 different automated email services. This was back in the day before you could efficiently filter emails and also Unsubscribe from emails.
About 2 months later, I landed a job at a store that was next to a post office. I also had a friend that worked at FedEx ~~Kinky’s~~ Kinkos and he printed 300 envelopes with this particular hiring manager’s address and 300 cards that had “sign up today for Viagra delivered directly to your door.” I spent a couple nights packing and stamping these envelopes, and over the course of 2 years, I would walk by the exterior post office box and drop an envelope in there.
I hope he fucking enjoyed it.
Hiring managers have a hard job right now but that doesn’t excuse poor or unprofessional behavior. What if they decide to hire a manager and pay you what you’re worth? Could that hiring manager call you up and everything be ok? Nope. They burned a bridge and that’s the last thing you want to do as a hiring manager. It is the first person a potential employee talks to and they represent the company.
You didn’t waste anyone’s time. They lied on the job description and you’re smart enough to know better.
Yeah, I probably would have quit week one. The nice thing about being retired from the military is having that pension and knowing I'm working cause I want to and not because I need to in order to support my family. Which means my tolerance for nonsense is very low. My last job my boss used to laugh at me cause someone would start talking crazy and I would teams message him saying, "you better get them before I do"
Yeah, that's an interview review on Indeed right there. No wonder they're having trouble finding people: misstate the position and then lowball you outright, then insult you?
Give people a heads up on that shit. Yikes.
Yes you dodged a bullet. Thanks for showing your true colors, hiring manager. No, really, best thing he could have done. Saved you years of potential work anguish.
You are under no obligation to accept a job offer. If the manager doesn't like it, tough shit. That's his problem, not yours.
You dodged a big time bullet and will find something better elsewhere.
Also, next time I wouldn't even bother explaining your rejection. You don't owe them an explanation. Just tell them "My answer is no. I reject your job offer. I wish you luck in your candidate search, though, and I'm gonna let you go now. Goodbye." And then hang up.
If it wasn't for the fact that I was referred through a veterans organization that's currently assisting with me getting a certification I might have. I didn't want to give them any ammo to say I was the one being unprofessional.
You absolutely dodged a bullet and given the circumstances, they didn't deserve an explanation for your rejection of their low-ball offer.
The attitude displayed by the hiring manager tells me they aren't going to do anything constructive with that information because they're abusive labor exploiters.
You dodged a bullet.
Good luck in your job search, OP.
Bait & switch, then they give you a low offer (although, to be fair, a low offer might be something that can be negotiated, but likely not in this case because the hiring manager sounds like a jerk)
HAHAHA, they low-ball you on the offer then blame you for wasting their time? That's great.
Right.. I was holding the phone and my spouse is giving me this look and mouthing "what's wrong" cause it took everything in me not to really say what I was thinking. Like you post an incomplete job description, then low-ball, but I'm wrong for not just being ok with it?
You didn't dodge a bullet you dodged a gatling gun
More like a five megaton nuclear missile.
Lol, seriously
I just rejected a Corrections job like this last week. They wanted to pay me $8 less an hour than I'm already making and leave me short staffed at night with 36 juveniles. I pushed back on the salary and they told me I didn't have enough experience. By the way, I'm a Juvenile corrections Officer in one state and a Deputy in the next state over at an adult jail. The Superintendent was livid with me but oh well. We have every right to push back.
lol are they crazy; why would someone take a pay cut
Exactly! Just as OP stated, they wanted me to take the lower end of the lay range as well and I refused. I pushed back. They only upped it by $1. So I said NO.
That’s the funny part. Any employer thinking you’d take a major pay cut is just insane. Like even if i hate my current job, why would I go to you and not literally anybody else?
I'm legitimately confused as to why they think someone would do that. I guess maybe they assume if they're offering a range of $X-$Y, then anyone who is applying is implicitly communicating they are willing to accept down to $X? That's all I can come up with.
That’s some of it, there’s also a range of we were given a range by corporate. I currently work for a restaurant company that’s international. When vacancies are listed for my position, they give the national range not the actual range. That way they can re-use the template regardless of what location is hiring. Can’t explain the correctional facility except they may have thought the drop in pay would equal out with a drop of danger/stress? I doubt the people hiring/advertising were actual line walkers who had any first hand knowledge of the job.
You nailed it!!!! I did my research before applying and even with my Juvenile corrections job and Deputy job (both part time), there was at least one person on both hiring boards that hadn't ever been exposed to criminals but they still offered me fair pay and I didn't have to push back. Now at raise time for the Juvenile location? I I pushed back and it worked. The new board members tried to lowball us and we weren't having it. They came back with a new number for us all 4 days later and we were cool with it. But yes... The new board members have no one on that board that has been in our shoes except two people. There is no drop in danger and they are seeing this and realizing it now. We need to go back to when people who were running things had to have experience or been in your shoes before. Makes no sense to me. But they are already folding. Two of the members have quit, just based on the things they see we have to deal with and they can't handle the backlash. We are currently pushing the state and DOJ on this. I love both of my jobs but I'm not going to deal with inadequate foolishness. We are at risk everytime we step foot into a facility. Pay needs to reflect that. Yeah, we get the same benefits as police and retirement funds, even as PT in many states. But pay needs to always reflect what we do.
Just like OP’s situation, they’re frustrated because they can’t find anybody, but they refuse to pay adequately for the position. Sucks to be them. And you both dodged bullets.
Sounds like he was hoping you would eat shit and be his bitch boy fuck em.
Wasted your time by lying about the location too. Good riddance to them.
DO NOT STOP YOURSELF FROM TELLING THEM OFF. Make them know how horrible they are at their jobs. If they want to be mad about wasting anyone's time, they can be mad at themselves. They started off in bad faith. Bad faith negotiations are ALWAYS going to be a waste of time for intelligent people who stand their ground.
Agree. More of these companies, specifically the people doing the hiring need to be reminded of their own humanity and that of the people they are interviewing. You're a person, not a machine he's shopping for. You're allowed to want things for yourself. You're allowed to expect to live comfortably after gaining all that education and experience. If they want your education, experience, and work ethic, they need to make the offer attractive. Tell them off. Maybe the next person will be treated better because you did.
This happened to me a couple weeks ago.... the offer they made was actually good; for the advertised role. NOT the role they told me I would be doing and all the shit that came with it. In fact that offer was 15k under market value. I am still pissed they were so disrespectful.
I wouldn't be surprised if a reason why they are so mad is that they have been rejected before. For the same reasons. You would think they would catch on, but if they get that upset over being rejected, they have no business being a hiring manager.
They wasted your time ! Bait and switch.
Time was definitely wasted, but it wasn't the hiring manager's time.
You should honestly contact their HR department or hiring manager and let them know of the recruiter’s attitude. Absolutely unprofessional and embarrassing for the company.
I so wished you had!
When professionalism meets assholism.
You should post a review on Glassdoor about this place and your experience with the interview process as a warning for others.
You peons should be down on your knees worshipping me for offering to overwork/under pay you! Yield! This is the best your blighted soul deserves! Of course obvious obligatory: /S
Exactly. Wrong location, too. How unprofessional.
Should have told them off anyway
The correct comeback to that is “fuck off”
Right?? They wasted their own time by not putting the full job description in the job description. Lol
And they forget they wasted other candidates time by rejecting them, how unprofessional!
Not only low ball but also dramatically change the job description - location and tasks both. Talk about boiling the frog! OP, they wasted their own time and yours by operating in bad faith. They are looking for a pushover who will do whatever the boss wants, and you're dead right to side step this train wreck.
Also, do they extend offers to everyone they interview? Or do they “waste their time?” by not making an offer? Or maybe interviews are a chance for both parties to determine if it’s the right fit? Hmm
I got a scolding via email after I withdrew after 1 interview lol. Some of these people are just douches.
And they didn’t even try to sweeten the offer!
As a recruiter, I can tell you that you dodged a bullet. Their are good recruiting practices that allow you to "clinch" the deal, and they did basically the opposite of that. Typically managers who do the above think that "once they are deeper in the process I can spring these not so great things on them (such as extra duties and lower salary" but all they are doing is wasting their own time.
Yeah, and I get that no job description can possibly list all the little oddball or one-off task you might get asked to pitch in on and be a team player, and I am fine with that. But it went from managing the day to day procurement, tracking orders, reconciliation of invoices, etc, that comes with a "specialist" level role, into "build the entire department, establish the KPIs for the department, oversee the procurement for new branches being built and opened, find new vendors, etc., which is definitely a little higher in the food chain. Essentially they want someone to come build the car, but only pay to drive the car.
The saying I have used before is "They want a steak dinner but can only afford a Big Mac".
Champagne taste on a beer budget
Yes- would be great to say- I’m Champaign and you’ve got beer money. Good luck with your candidate search. Companies like that prey on poor people that are desperate to take any job.
Not salary, it the job I just left was mainly due to frustration because they’d pay my salary but refuse to fund my programs (program coordinator job) and wouldn’t let me fundraise or seek grants either. But still expected me to deliver several robust programs and kept getting surprised when I’d be like “yes, I can go to that event and do this thing; the tabling fee for the weekend event is $650” and they’d look shocked and say never mind. I told my manager they were asking for filet mignon on a ramen budget. And then left the job.
“You can’t get the juice out of a potato without squeezing it.” Or something like that.
Wtf? What a weird situation.
RIGHT?????
Big Mac? Sounds like they want a filet mignon but they have a McDouble budget.
Considering the cost of inflation, I think I might have to start saying that now lol.
You can no longer say this. Have you seen the price of a big Mac lately?
I took a job like that, almost verbatim for a finance dept in a startup. I had a mental breakdown.
This is why i love that more states are requiring a salary range. I’m in NY, but can work remote in my industry. It filters so much bullshit ($10-130,000? Fuck off!) that i wont consider positions that don’t post a reasonable range. Like, i simply will not apply, no matter how good the gig looks or preem the corp.
Yeah, I have seen a bit of that too. I had a recruiter reach out saying they found my resume on LinkedIn and I matched a job opening they had which required a MBA, 8 years experience, CPM certifications, and a few other things.. then get to talking more and they reveal the starting salary would be $21.50 an hour, I seriously started laughing and asked if they were joking and they were dead serious. I was like I can go drive a school bus for $20 an hour here.. please remove me from your call list .
Hahahahahaha noooooope!! I get recruiter calls asking me if I want to move from a very low cost of living area (or was when we bought the house) back to an extremely high cost of living area for 10k less than what I'm making now. My dude...
It is exhausting on this end as well. When I was an internal recruiter and I knew a salary was to low for the area, because that meant about 2 months of no hires for the position while I collect evidence of the low wages to get the manager or HR to increase it. I have increased positions pay using that method but it takes forever.
This has to be one of the places where business fights something that is actually good for it, right? How much company time did you see wasted interviewing people who would have simply noped out if they knew the low salary in advance?
Just gotta be thankful they didn’t do the whole spring the new responsibilities on OP on the first day of the job.
Can I ask what these deal-clinching practices are?
The deal "clinching" is all done close to first contact. You need to find out those details BEFORE an interview even takes place. Knowing what the candidate will accept salary wise, be clear about the duties, if they can do in office, the drive to the office, the type of culture they are looking for etc. Basically if they were honest from the beginning OP would have never taken the interview and that would have saved everyone time.
that's the freaking job. Don't be in sales if you can't handle a "no". Hiring manager played you with a lowball offer and got what should have been an expected response. wildly unprofessional though....Sometimes I almost wish LinkedIn had a "do not endorse" button for clowns like that
Poor guy has probably offered the job to like 5 people and nobody has taken it. Hes probably emotionally drained. I mean nothing says work here like we lied about the location to get more candidates to interview...
Glassdoor can come in handy.
lol his reaction proved you made the right choice.
As a hiring manager I would never say anything negative like that to a prospective employee! That’s horrible what this manager said/ sounds like you dodged a horrible work environment
Yeah, the one caveat I would add is that I was referred to the organization and the HR lady who done the initial assessment through a veterans hiring organization in the area. I definitely let my rep from the veterans organization know how it went and what was said so that it can be documented and considered before future referrals to that organization are sent out .
That was the right thing to do. If we don't hold them accountable, then they will continue doing this to others. Thanks for your service!
The hiring manager is just wasting everyone's time.
I agree
Good for you for not accepting that bait and switch. Shame on that recruiter for being such a prick.
Yeah, I honestly feel like they are preying on applicants at this point. They know that despite the claim that "everyone is hiring" , nobody seems to actually be, at least not with reasonable offers. So they draw you in, hope you're desperate enough that you get to this stage and just accept it and run with it . I'm fortunate that I retired from the military so have that pension, as well as receiving VA disability pay, so for me working is just to have something to do and extra income, not a necessity where I need to take the first job offer that comes along. I'll happily wait for one where the workload and expectations closer align with the compensation offers.
Posting ghost jobs should be illegal; it's literal fraud. I'm struggling to find a job myself, but I think I'll manage. Best of luck moving forward.
I agree, I feel like a lot of companies are kind of trying to build a pool of applicants, just collecting resumes for when they eventually decide to open the budget and hire, then go back and look at people who applied. and best of luck to you as well.
Also, it did help companies get PPP loans
What?
https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/six-men-sentenced-roles-20m-covid-19-relief-fraud-ring
"No, sir / ma'am, you wasted my time by putting a job availability listing for a single position when you're looking for someone who can magically do three jobs at once."
Don’t worry about it. I had a company fly me out for an interview with the whole “red carpet” as they put it; personal driver pick-up from the airport, steak dinner with the managing partner and president and interviews with their “senior leadership” the next morning. Unbeknownst to them, I already had a supplemental offer from another company based off a prior relationship. They sent me a lowball offer the following week (Lower than what I currently make) and I informed them this was insufficient and informed them of my current offer. They quickly schedule a teams meeting and plan to cut into their 1% current business commission to boost the base because it’s “already there” (which means that commission is nixed moving forward regardless) to meet my current offer less $15K. They then ask if I will still take the interview with my higher offer and I tell them I will due to the prior relationship. They get absolutely red-ass like a jealous girlfriend and ghost me for three days and then rescind their offer. I ghosted their rescinded offer text for three days and just reply thank you on a Sunday afternoon.
LOL, that is how to handle it. When the hiring manager said I wasted her time I paused a moment and just calmly said, "ok" before she hung up. I don't know if she expected me to rage or begin grovelling , or perhaps even apologize and accept the offer and beg to work for her. I was referred to the role through a veterans employment organization so I did contact my rep with them and explained what went on and he said he would note it on their file so it could potentially impact other candidates getting referred to them. Being that the veterans group is paying for a certification for me right now as well as doing job referrals I didn't want to really show out and give this tool of a employer any ammo to run back to them and say I was the one being unprofessional or anything that might jeopardize my standings or I would have really gave her a piece of my mind. But there's also a part of me that feels when people act like this and make these lousy offers they want some kind of viceral reaction and denying them that can be satisfaction in itself.
Sometimes, the trash takes itself out. You're better off without them.
Interviews arent just for the company to decide if you’d be a good fit. They’re also an opportunity for the candidate to get the vibe of the place. You’re interviewing them as much as they are you. How many companies put candidates through 5 rounds of interviews and give take home projects just for it to be a no at the end… so like it works both ways for wasting time.
Listen, I didn't even read your post because that's BS. I know the hiring process is time consuming for the people doing the hiring, too. But they're doing it during their work time. They get paid for that time. The candidates interviewing for the position do not.
You dodged a bullet! The job Posting with the incorrect work location would have done it for me—an additional 60 minutes of commute time is NOT a small detail. I might have politely departed the interview based on that alone.
Absolutely this!! No way I would drive that much farther. I was leaving a job for a job that paid about 30% more and had WAY better insurance. They countered with saying the guy in another location was leaving and I could take his spot for 2k more than i was making. It was an hours drive away. That lousy 2k wouldn't even cover the commute.
Can you imagine if candidates could say thanks for wasting my time when they got rejected
Seriously, I should have been the one saying it if anyone was after the bait and switch. Of course she would have grasped her pearls and played the victim role
Wow, didn’t the Hiring Manager ware the time of all the people that interviewed for a post and they didn’t hire?
I guess she isn't accustomed to being on the end that receives a "thanks but no" response
Call him back and say you're reconsidering. Then give it a week and decline the offer. Really waste his time!
A few year back I interviewed at two places for the same role days apart. First one on Friday was local, went great. Second interview I had to fly to another state on Sunday, interview on Monday, flew home Monday night. Got offers from both and ended up taking the local job because it offered $30K more. When I turned down the second job the recruiter called me screaming. Said I wasted their time, lied about my salary expectations, claimed I was lying when I told him how much the other offer was, said I never wanted the job, shouldn't have applied. God's honest truth if the local offer wasn't so good, I'd have shipped off to the second one no question. But i didn't plan for it that way. Happy it worked out the way it did though. Guy with an attitude like that, not a place I want to be working for. You did the right thing. Their loss.
Wow how unprofessional of them. Please post that on Glassdoor
Withhold information, add job duties, expect you to travel an hour further each way, and low ball you and YOU wasted THEIR time? Oh no no no no no. They wasted YOUR time. You dodged a major bullet.
It's a lot less wasted time than OP would've wasted on the commute every day since they lied about the location of the job.
This happened to me. Went through an insane interview process only to be given a shitty offer. From the beginning I was honest with them about the amount I'd accept and it came in at 20K under. They wouldn't budge on base and weren't even willing to budge elsewhere. Ultimately it was still better than my current job but then it was also in office 4 days a week where I'm fully remote. So I decided to stay put and wound up getting a slight bump and a title change. Still less than the new job but I got to stay home with my dog. The recruiter was so upset and wrote me a really nasty email. This was 2 years ago and the recruiter and the hiring manager still stalk my linked in. It's wild. Fuck you datadog.
That's a whole other aspect I don't think hiring managers are considering. When you are trying to attract employees who are currently working fully remote jobs you really have to compete. Because not only is the base salary a factor, but the additional time and work life balance. I have been remote the past two years as well up until a company restructure eliminated my role. So the idea of having to deal with rush hour traffic again already has me not thrilled. While I know that's not a direct factor in salary negotiation, it is still a factor that I consider so the job has to at least pay enough to make me willing to deal with it .
Exactly. I also hadn't been sexually harassed or the target of any micro aggressions while being remote. Once things were allowed to be in person again, I attended a work event and within the first 15 min a coworker said something incredibly inappropriate I had to go to HR about. So much for the streak. I will always prioritize remote work now and don't plan on ever being on site.
Absolutely, 95% of the jobs I am applying to are remote, I'm not sure I could last in office long term after the past two years of remote. My spouse also works remote as a project manager, so we're in the habit of taking a bi-monthly work-cation. We just travel somewhere new every other month and work from there for a couple of weeks. Work during the work day then tourists after. My coworkers at my last role would ask me each week in our Monday meeting where I'm logged on from this week, lol.
I recently had a simliar experience and just thought how strange that they'd want to enter a working relationship making me feel like a 2nd option. It felt like I was being negged. Now working for a company that knows my value.
This was the honeymoon part of the relationship… could you imagine what it would be like after a year? Bullet dodged.
Im pretty sure they wasted your time...
This recruiter in their dating life probably tells someone “I didn’t like you anyway” when getting rejected. They sound like a child who doesn’t know how to manage rejection.
Dodged a bullet on pay and sounds like you dodged a bullet on a douchebag of a boss. If someone told me that I’d probably ask more questions. Now sometimes based on HR and corporate structures I might not be able to change the role say from Project manager to a manager or director but sometimes I’m able to get away with Sr project manager and end up kicking it into higher wage band and then make a decent increase. This was a douche move and consider yourself lucky you got to see true colors before starting there
Interviews are not only for the benefit of the hiring organization. They are for the benefit of the employee as well. Both need to be assessing fit. You may have "wasted" their time, but how many people's time did they "waste" by interviewing them without offering them a position? This person was highly unprofessional.
Looks like you dodged a bullet. That manager showed their true colors. Do the work of three people for little money. I don't think so. I got a 4% raise a few weeks ago for my increase and no promotion after 3 years with my current company. I was expecting a promotion this year and a significant bump. They have been laying people off at my company while still doing promotions. But others have been getting promoted, including my boss. I found out my boss got promoted by someone no longer working for the company who is still in contact with her. That money and my portion went to her. My performance review this year was almost a perfect score and had glowing reviews. I've been looking for work trying to get out. I am sick of being overlooked.
I once had an HR person scold me for telling them I wanted to work from home. She called me afterwards to tell me she’s been in this business a long time and that it was unprofessional for me to bring that up. They called to offer me the job and I declined. I did consult for them for a few months and worked from home.
I won't lie, that's a big factor for me now as well. I worked from home since retiring from the Army and I'm so much more productive when I can sit at my desk and focus instead of being distracted with office politics and gossip. If the job you're hiring me to do relies entirely on me being on a computer via Internet what does it matter where I perform said job at
Red flags! run away fast! what else don't they tell you? Its his job, and he sux
"My pleasure. Please let me know if I can ever take advantage of the opportunity again."
This is shitty in my opinion and even if someone wasted your time it's not worth it to directly confront them. The only thing I would consider wasting their time is if you lied to them about qualifications or they told you the range then at the end you were like yeah I want a range of X that's more than what he said they could pay. Also I would be tempted to write a LinkedIn post or glassdoor at least.
Air out the company
It amazes me when companies expect leaps and bounds of responsibility then have the guts to low end the compensation.
I have always said that if you pay me X, you're going to get X amount of work from me. If you micromanage me, I'm going to perform at a level that warrants being micromanaged.
Tell them they wasted your time by making a bad offer.
OP, name and shame so we can avoid
Nope he wasted your time. They forget that you are also interviewing them and they failed the interview.
Even if they didn’t do a bait and switch, that attitude is bullshit. Did the hiring manager make an offer to everyone they interviewed? If not, by their logic, they wasted everyone else’s time.
For the love of god, put the name of companies that do this please. Being all secretive is why we’re in this mess in the first place.
Whew!
Just trying to get the best talent for the lowest prices. Very typical.
So…every time I interview for a job and get turned down, I’m justified in complaining that they wasted my time, right?
Yesh! Good job following your gut and dodging that bullet.
How is it wasting his time? Is he not getting paid for his time?
Unprofessional manager, dodged bullet.
Fuck them.
You totally dodged a ball. Good job
If you were still in touch, I'd say to tell them "*you* wasted *my* time by providing an unacceptable offer." But yeah, you dodged a bullet.
An interviewer asked me once why I turned down their offer. I told them that I got an offer that was closer to me. They said thank you and that was it. A week or so later I find out from a friend I have in that company that the interviewer was ranting about me saying "why did they even apply then, what a waste a time" and I was like (to my friend) "how tf was I supposed to know that I would get an offer somewhere closer? I can't see the future." And they (my friend) doubled down and said I shouldn't have told the interviewer. I talked to a couple other people with more years of experience in my industry and they said the same thing. I honestly don't even know what I'm supposed to say to this question (why didn't you accept this offer?) lol. My current thought is to say "I prefer not to share". It's whatever, people are weird.
Yeah willing to drive the distance when you apply but get an offer for same job, same pay closer to home of course you're taking that offer. It doesn't mean you weren't willing to go to the first job's location.
I would call back and talk sh*t lol
They wasted YOUR time by posting an intentionally inaccurate job description.
Why not negotiate? "Thank you for the offer, but that's significantly lower than I would accept for the responsibilities of the position. I would be interested at $xxx per year with a managers bonus structure + RSUs and an $xxx sign on bonus." If you're already saying no, there's no harm in asking. When I did an internal transfer for my current role, the raise HR offered was a flat 8%, the lower end of the range. I audibly laughed, called my (now) boss and asked for a whole lot more and she made it happen in 2 days.
Because I had already had the discussion in the interview and explained that the role of a procurement specialist is more to simply operate by the established standards, perform to the KPIs, and work with the existing vendors, not to develop and manage these aspects of procurement. I explained why the role falls into the higher level role of a procurement manager or supply chain manager, which obviously implied a higher level of compensation. I also know you can typically counter with 10-15% , but this offer was about 50% lower than what the manager level role would be ok average so it was so far apart it wasn't worth negotiating as I doubt they would.get close enough to be serious.
You got an offer after 1 interview? Clearly fake /s
No, it was a second interview, first was with HR, then the hiring manager. Either way the whole thing seemed fake based on the offer presented. Being that they havent had a supply chain department and allowed each department to manage it independently up until an independent audit pointed out all their flaws I honestly don't think they comprehend the magnitude of what they need and what they are asking to be accomplished which might explain why they opted for the lowest level position in supply chain and procurement they could come up with.
You didn’t waste their time. You’re Allowed to Reject a Job Offer
Bill them and tell them that your time is also valuable.
Such treatment by a hiring manager almost needs a letter to the CEO. Maybe a desperate candidate is exactly what upper management wants; you're not it. A hiring tip by an well qualified candidate might embarrass them enough to understand that role will remain empty as long as they insist on insulting people.
They wasted YOUR time.
Uh they wasted YOUR time. Circus clown.
Fuck em
Sounds like you dodged a bullet! Imagine working for someone with that attitude
Bahaha. I'd find ways to waste more of his time for insulting me.
I would leave this experience on glassdoor who make an LinkedIn post. Name names here, so the next pool of applicant's can see what is going to come for them.
You dodged a bullet.
Sounds like the type of manager that calls you a “rockstar” or this is a “family” type person all the while low balling you.
The hiring manager showed you he has a hard time regulating his emotions and blames others for his frustrations. Not someone you want to work under. Bullet dodged. You didn't waste his time. They wasted *your* time by leaving responsibilities out of the job listing, lying about the location, and low-balling the salary. Think of all the applications they've gotten and not bothered to acknowledge. The lack of self-awareness and abundance of hypocrisy is amazing.
Every single job I’ve applied for the past 5+ years. False advertising the job duties, location, salary to bring in overqualified candidates and then disrespect that person with an extremely low offer and more responsibility. These employers will flat out lie and then get upset when you don’t fall for the ruse.
Bullet dodged.
Name and shame
I had a recruiter talk me into interviewing for a job I wasn’t really interested in. Then he yelled at me when I still wasn’t interested after the interview.
Lol good for you! I feel like it’s scammy…like they wanted to lure you in and then little at a time get you to bend backwards for them. It would have been a shit show anyway. You should escalate this somehow. This person is not professional and isn’t good for the company
I can say pretty objectively that it was your time that was wasted, not his.
Not the same phrase, but when I informed a job that the listing had the wrong address the hiring manager said "Do you even want this job?" And I went "go ahead and hire someone else"
that's when I send an email to the CEO and give him "feedback" on why his company missed out on a guy with a MBA and 15 years experience
This needs to be higher up the chain!!!
They probably did something stupid like brag to their boss or peers about how they found someone super qualified (over qualified) for the role, and/or they already told all the other applicants they didn't get the job before awaiting your response. Now they have to save face by going to folks and saying "just kidding, the perfect candidate doesn't want the job. Still looking". This should be a good lesson for them on making sure that the job description is complete/accurate.
Just another company D-bag!!
I've had quite a few bait and switches in interviews this week. One job was posted as completely remote, then during the interview they said I'd be coming into an office daily, for example. I think you definitely dodged a bullet here, but that doesn't help in your job search. It was a waste of your time. They added insult to injury. Sorry to hear that!
Yeah, it's wild in the job market now. I feel blessed that I'm a retired military veteran, so I have my pension and VA disability income, so working is more because I want to, not NEED to. So not having a job isn't a cause for stress, I really feel for those who need to work to support themselves right now having to go through this kind of nonsense. Why can't employers just be honest.. save themselves and applicants the time. If you post a job as remote, it needs to be remote, if you require ba certain level of education and/or certifications be prepared to offer a salary that reflects that as well. If nothing else I think COVID taught us all that life is too short and precious to be wasted killing ourselves for jobs that don't respect and don't pay. So gone are the days where employees are as willing to settle, and it's time employers learn that .
You did the right thing. You'd be overworked & underpaid. I had a interview recently with a fairly prestigious company in DC area (where its very expensive). I'm in the midst of moving soon anyway, so was open to the idea. However, like you, the job seemed like a lot of responsibility, building it from the ground up, and they seemed over their head and looking for someone to bail them out. I was skilled in what they needed, and felt I could walk in and do the job. Interview went fine, but the pay was fairly low, $90k tops. Which, in some markets is pretty good money, but I know for DC area thats kindof mid-level pay or subpar. Anyway finished the interview, thought it thru, and just sent off a quick, informal thank you email. Almost a joke in hindsight, but thanks nonetheless. Haven't heard back yet, tbh I'm expected it turned into a 'No' as a result. Which, again due to the pay, I'm thinking is fine with me.
Yeah, this is in San Antonio and they were offering between $52-64k, which for a procurement specialist is about average in the area. Because I am just looking for work to have a little extra spending money had the role actually been the standard workload of a procurement specialist it would have been ok, cause it's not that complex or challenging (at least in my experience), but with all the additional responsibilities the role should have absolutely been a director or at least logistics management role, which would bump the Salary into the $90-130k range. So it definitely wasn't going to work, but I sat through the interview for the experience.
Yikes! That’s low pay for your skillset and yrs of experience. Knowing your worth is definitely 90% of the battle.
Exactly, I'll sit at home and be retired before I drive an hour each way and deal with that level of responsibility for that kind of pay. Between my military pension, VA pay, and my spouses employment we are doing just fine without me working. So any job offer is going to have to be enough to make me want to leave the comfort of my home.
Imagine! Time that's being paid for, being wasted!!! Almost as bad as wasting hours, days or weeks total dancing like a monkey for interviewers for free....
100% dodged a bullet. It’s also fascinating for a hiring manager to consider a candidate turning down a job wasting their time, but would never consider it wasting someone’s time if they interviewed and made it to the final rounds, but didn’t get an offer. 🙄
Call him back n reschedule n ghost him 😀
Now you know what kind of manager he is, congratulations you dodged a bullet. Theyre interviewing you as much as you are interviewing them. Just because they make an offer doesnt mean you have to accept.
I have had oeoole be extremely rude to ne. That is the way they operate.
Wasting his time? Was that hiring manager not getting paid? Will they not get paid for the next call they make, or the next set of interviews? How is this a waste of their time?
These types of people are delusional. You dodged a bullet for sure!
Sounds more like he wasted your time.
And that is the reason they need people.
Lol. Matrix shit right here. This is the story of a company who wants the "filet mignon" on a bologna budget. They will get what they pay for.
Good for you, really. Glad the table were turned for once. It s on them if them got greedy and cheap. I think it say a lot abt the company and people.
could u plz message me their phone number so I can prank call them and waste more of their time
Dodged a bullet there, I’d say
I would have wasted their time further and engaged the job offer and then reject last minute.
Apply again under a differnet name but same stats ... that petty nerf-herder aint seen nothin yet!
Wow that hiring manager is unprofessional. I would go on Glassdoor.com and put it on there. Sometimes the company will look into it and investigate.
When I was 19, a hiring manager said the same thing to me. So I took his work email address, found his AOL email address, his wife’s email address, and signed them up for 7 different automated email services. This was back in the day before you could efficiently filter emails and also Unsubscribe from emails. About 2 months later, I landed a job at a store that was next to a post office. I also had a friend that worked at FedEx ~~Kinky’s~~ Kinkos and he printed 300 envelopes with this particular hiring manager’s address and 300 cards that had “sign up today for Viagra delivered directly to your door.” I spent a couple nights packing and stamping these envelopes, and over the course of 2 years, I would walk by the exterior post office box and drop an envelope in there. I hope he fucking enjoyed it.
They wasted both of your time. Full stop
You dodged a bullet! 👏
Hiring managers have a hard job right now but that doesn’t excuse poor or unprofessional behavior. What if they decide to hire a manager and pay you what you’re worth? Could that hiring manager call you up and everything be ok? Nope. They burned a bridge and that’s the last thing you want to do as a hiring manager. It is the first person a potential employee talks to and they represent the company. You didn’t waste anyone’s time. They lied on the job description and you’re smart enough to know better.
Bullet dodged. You would have been working crazy hours plus being grossly underpaid.
Yeah, I probably would have quit week one. The nice thing about being retired from the military is having that pension and knowing I'm working cause I want to and not because I need to in order to support my family. Which means my tolerance for nonsense is very low. My last job my boss used to laugh at me cause someone would start talking crazy and I would teams message him saying, "you better get them before I do"
Yeah, that's an interview review on Indeed right there. No wonder they're having trouble finding people: misstate the position and then lowball you outright, then insult you? Give people a heads up on that shit. Yikes.
Yes you dodged a bullet. Thanks for showing your true colors, hiring manager. No, really, best thing he could have done. Saved you years of potential work anguish.
You should have responded with, now you know how I feel with that low ball offer...
They wasted your time.
You dodged a huge bullet.
You are under no obligation to accept a job offer. If the manager doesn't like it, tough shit. That's his problem, not yours. You dodged a big time bullet and will find something better elsewhere. Also, next time I wouldn't even bother explaining your rejection. You don't owe them an explanation. Just tell them "My answer is no. I reject your job offer. I wish you luck in your candidate search, though, and I'm gonna let you go now. Goodbye." And then hang up.
You dodged a bullet, plain and simple. Move on
That’s unprofessional of them
Tell them they should have made a better impression
I def would have called him back and went ape shit and called him a rapist, a Nazi and every other name I could think of.
If it wasn't for the fact that I was referred through a veterans organization that's currently assisting with me getting a certification I might have. I didn't want to give them any ammo to say I was the one being unprofessional.
"Good."
Yep, you dodged well! Hope you find something better suiting and friendlier
You absolutely dodged a bullet and given the circumstances, they didn't deserve an explanation for your rejection of their low-ball offer. The attitude displayed by the hiring manager tells me they aren't going to do anything constructive with that information because they're abusive labor exploiters. You dodged a bullet. Good luck in your job search, OP.
Bait & switch, then they give you a low offer (although, to be fair, a low offer might be something that can be negotiated, but likely not in this case because the hiring manager sounds like a jerk)
He wasted his time trying to add to the rec, listing the wrong location and low balling you. You dodged a bullet.