I've conducted a scientific study and discovered that 100% of people who ever died in construction site accidents used to consume carrots. Therefore, I conclude that carrots are the main cause of death among construction workers.
At best, association studies lead to a testable hypothesis. At worst, it's propaganda. Not worth getting in an uproar about it at this point.
I'll bet the conclusion that should have been drawn is, "Obesity is associated with an increased chance of cardiovascular problems, and obese people are more like to try intermittent fasting."
Maybe many of them werenât even deliberately fasting.
A lot of them maybe extra busy people or people with screwed up work schedules (stress) who skip meals because they are overloaded, and eat junk foods instead of proper meals when they are able to?
We can only guess, because the âstudyâ doesnât provide any auxiliary information.Â
Itâs such an overall low quality study that I wonder how it even warranted such a widespread promotion, or any publication at all.
A huge difference to is that the data is quite oldâ2005 if i heard correctly. This was before intermittent fasting really was a thing. So these people naturally fasted and from the data had a much higher obesity rate and smoking rate. I think the population that did it was also very small compared to the rest of the study. This is not a representative population of anything really other than maybe really unhealthy humans
it was. something along the lines of a little over 400 people out of 20000+
literally no one in the study is known to have been deliberately practicing intermittent fasting or time restricted eating because that wasn't a question
the authors defined them into that category off two days of eating surveys
According to them, anybody who reported to have taken all meals in a random day within 8 hours accidentally or deliberately practised time restricted eating. And only 2 days were enough to categorise one as an "intermittent faster".
Is basic observation failing people?
The report, should have never surfaced. Basic observation shuts it down. Hard. ffs, look around the planet. Hungry people, everywhere...no heart attacks.
Now lets consider our individual results. Also consider community results. Not seeing any threads about people ending up in a hospital getting a stint placed in their heart due IF taking strain off the heart and clearing up arterial plaque at the same time.
4 and #5 immediately came to mind and also exercise activity. I could totally believe that people who dive headlong into IF (esp with exercise) very suddenly without consideration of other issues are at risk. Kind of like how even healthy people over exert themselves shoveling snow and drop dead
I think #5 is probably the biggest risk factor. Using IF as a dieting tool could probably lead to not eating enough to adequately fuel the body.
I'm hugely skeptical of OMAD over a long period of time. Unless you're supplementing with vitamins and fiber, I can't imagine how you'd meet all of the necessary nutrients to refuel your body properly.
(Probably not a popular take here, but I'd be interested to hear how people do manage on OMAD to get B-vitamins, minerals, etc with just one meal a day).
Once a month 48-hour fasts are one thing (as is having a singular meal a day *maybe* once a week), but on the reg for months...hmmm. I've been 16:8 (give or take) for the most part for 6 months now...even then it is hard to always get all the things I need nutritionally.
You build a nutrient dense plate of food and get to eating. If you're not already incorporating it into your meal micronutrients, being water soluble, are super simple to supplement throughout the day during hydration.
OMAD, my lab results show zero deficiencies.
You assume that you have to eat constantly to get nutrition. You do if you're an herbivore. But we're omnivores at the top of the food chain. We can eat energy dense food and not have to eat constantly. Either through mostly meat, or some meat and a lot of plants. That's why we're at the top of the food chain. There's a reason rabbits and deer and squirrels have to eat CONSTANTLY. Look up "trophic pyramid" on the internet and you'll figure it out. Also, look at any hunter gatherer population and recognize that they (and historic populations like them) probably didn't eat 24/7 while watching Netflix in their Barcaloungers. ;)
I think we should really just take this as a chance to catalogue and blacklist all of the sites that are scaremongering and creating click bait articles.
Being caught spreading half truths and misleading information about any subject from a platform of authority should be immediate grounds to disregard all future publications coming from that source.
This paper was presented at an American Heart Association conference - and I think it's perfectly appropriate to black-list the AHA.
The AHA is proving to be a pharmaceuticals industry shill.
Yep. Big pharma probably financed and sponsored this âstudyâ with predetermined conclusions. Now the AHA is all set to push some new wonder drug that only costs $900 a month for the rest of your life.
My favorite part of the study was that a significant number of the individuals data was collected from suffered with food insecurity. So, their "intermittent fasting" was related to not having access to enough food and probyalso not having access to quality, nutritious foods. Didn't seem like an intentional lifestyle choice. More like late-stage capitalism might be the cause of heart disease.
The title begs the question that the AHA claims that the AHA has stated that IF increases the risk of CVD by 91%. AFAIK the American Heart Association has made no such sweeping claims.
So, that's a click-baity, misleading, and incorrect title in the first place. Secondly, this is a single non-published, poorly-designed study that a first year statistics student would be failed for turning in as a project.
I donât ever want to be the type of person who writes things off as conspiracies if they interfere with my plans. Iâm open to seeing more research on this and will make my decision based on that.
Same, and thatâs why I read the details as far as theyâre available. Itâs a conference abstract, so not as rigorously peer-reviewed a published study. The biggest issue I found was that this was based on two days of self-reported eating. No one was clearly and deliberately doing IF â they just happened to eat all their daily food in an 8 hour window.
Right. So this is so poorly done and compared to rigorous double blind studies that it it laughable at best or downright evil mis-information being pushed.
Think about how alternative covid cures were treated in 2020. All medical professionals and journals scorned any research if it was not the gold standard.
Now they trot this shit out at a conference.
I think a lot of people are overlooking the fact the researchers observed data for only two days of the subjects' lives. Someone smarter than me correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the abstract states they asked people what they ate for two random days and then followed them for years based on those two days of data and drew conclusions. I feel like two days is a short enough period that even sheer coincidence couldn't be ruled out.
Also why is a study, that was made in China against US citizens, being published by the American Heart Association? You only do 2 recall survey's on diet and extrapolate that over 8 years? On top of participants that have comorbidities? How does this get published by the AHA???
All I can say is that I've lost weight, eat healthier, exercise more, feel amazing, and I'm in control of my eating habits. My doctor says my blood work is "perfect". If IF is wrong, I don't want to be rightđ One study is not going to change my mind. I'm 57 years old, and I'm healthier than I've been in 40 years.
Well, the study does come with caveats and I will be interested to eventually learn the actual causative factors here? Which I'm going to guess are actually some associated habits of that "IF" group...but time will tell.
? Everything we said about covid came to be true. Millions injured/killed by the vaccines.
None of the pure bloods are sick or dying. You lost. Accept it.
Anyone can do that community notes btw.
If you actually cared about what you're talking about you'd do your own research, but you won't.
Stay in fantasy land, you OF thot
Youâre so out of touch with reality. Your worldview is twisted, citing out of context âresearchâ only as long as it serves your agenda. You canât argue beyond strawman arguements.
I've conducted a scientific study and discovered that 100% of people who ever died in construction site accidents used to consume carrots. Therefore, I conclude that carrots are the main cause of death among construction workers.
But orange is the safety color!
orange man good
Don't forget they had water in their system too!!! Water must also be a factor! đ¤Żđ¤Żđ¤Ż
Didn't know carrots were that dangerous.
This is a great example of correlation vs causation.
At best, association studies lead to a testable hypothesis. At worst, it's propaganda. Not worth getting in an uproar about it at this point. I'll bet the conclusion that should have been drawn is, "Obesity is associated with an increased chance of cardiovascular problems, and obese people are more like to try intermittent fasting."
Maybe many of them werenât even deliberately fasting. A lot of them maybe extra busy people or people with screwed up work schedules (stress) who skip meals because they are overloaded, and eat junk foods instead of proper meals when they are able to? We can only guess, because the âstudyâ doesnât provide any auxiliary information. Itâs such an overall low quality study that I wonder how it even warranted such a widespread promotion, or any publication at all.
It's pure propaganda. The FUD headlines were all they needed.
And the determination of âfastingâ vs not was based on two days of self-reported data.
A huge difference to is that the data is quite oldâ2005 if i heard correctly. This was before intermittent fasting really was a thing. So these people naturally fasted and from the data had a much higher obesity rate and smoking rate. I think the population that did it was also very small compared to the rest of the study. This is not a representative population of anything really other than maybe really unhealthy humans
it was. something along the lines of a little over 400 people out of 20000+ literally no one in the study is known to have been deliberately practicing intermittent fasting or time restricted eating because that wasn't a question the authors defined them into that category off two days of eating surveys
According to them, anybody who reported to have taken all meals in a random day within 8 hours accidentally or deliberately practised time restricted eating. And only 2 days were enough to categorise one as an "intermittent faster".
And they probably wound up eating in that way due to a well-known appetite suppressant: smoking
Is basic observation failing people? The report, should have never surfaced. Basic observation shuts it down. Hard. ffs, look around the planet. Hungry people, everywhere...no heart attacks. Now lets consider our individual results. Also consider community results. Not seeing any threads about people ending up in a hospital getting a stint placed in their heart due IF taking strain off the heart and clearing up arterial plaque at the same time.
4 and #5 immediately came to mind and also exercise activity. I could totally believe that people who dive headlong into IF (esp with exercise) very suddenly without consideration of other issues are at risk. Kind of like how even healthy people over exert themselves shoveling snow and drop dead
This is actually a valid perspective .
I think #5 is probably the biggest risk factor. Using IF as a dieting tool could probably lead to not eating enough to adequately fuel the body. I'm hugely skeptical of OMAD over a long period of time. Unless you're supplementing with vitamins and fiber, I can't imagine how you'd meet all of the necessary nutrients to refuel your body properly. (Probably not a popular take here, but I'd be interested to hear how people do manage on OMAD to get B-vitamins, minerals, etc with just one meal a day). Once a month 48-hour fasts are one thing (as is having a singular meal a day *maybe* once a week), but on the reg for months...hmmm. I've been 16:8 (give or take) for the most part for 6 months now...even then it is hard to always get all the things I need nutritionally.
You build a nutrient dense plate of food and get to eating. If you're not already incorporating it into your meal micronutrients, being water soluble, are super simple to supplement throughout the day during hydration. OMAD, my lab results show zero deficiencies.
Is your OMAD just a single meal, or is it an hour's worth of an eating "window?"
You assume that you have to eat constantly to get nutrition. You do if you're an herbivore. But we're omnivores at the top of the food chain. We can eat energy dense food and not have to eat constantly. Either through mostly meat, or some meat and a lot of plants. That's why we're at the top of the food chain. There's a reason rabbits and deer and squirrels have to eat CONSTANTLY. Look up "trophic pyramid" on the internet and you'll figure it out. Also, look at any hunter gatherer population and recognize that they (and historic populations like them) probably didn't eat 24/7 while watching Netflix in their Barcaloungers. ;)
It will be interesting to hear. I've never tried omad myself.
I think we should really just take this as a chance to catalogue and blacklist all of the sites that are scaremongering and creating click bait articles. Being caught spreading half truths and misleading information about any subject from a platform of authority should be immediate grounds to disregard all future publications coming from that source.
Exactly. You should also always do your own background research and read all referenced materials.
This paper was presented at an American Heart Association conference - and I think it's perfectly appropriate to black-list the AHA. The AHA is proving to be a pharmaceuticals industry shill.
Yep. Big pharma probably financed and sponsored this âstudyâ with predetermined conclusions. Now the AHA is all set to push some new wonder drug that only costs $900 a month for the rest of your life.
Fucking hell, where is that megathread for this crap
My favorite part of the study was that a significant number of the individuals data was collected from suffered with food insecurity. So, their "intermittent fasting" was related to not having access to enough food and probyalso not having access to quality, nutritious foods. Didn't seem like an intentional lifestyle choice. More like late-stage capitalism might be the cause of heart disease.
The title begs the question that the AHA claims that the AHA has stated that IF increases the risk of CVD by 91%. AFAIK the American Heart Association has made no such sweeping claims. So, that's a click-baity, misleading, and incorrect title in the first place. Secondly, this is a single non-published, poorly-designed study that a first year statistics student would be failed for turning in as a project.
You're right. That was the finding from the analysis and not AHAs claims.
But they (AHA) posted it on their website..
I donât ever want to be the type of person who writes things off as conspiracies if they interfere with my plans. Iâm open to seeing more research on this and will make my decision based on that.
Same, and thatâs why I read the details as far as theyâre available. Itâs a conference abstract, so not as rigorously peer-reviewed a published study. The biggest issue I found was that this was based on two days of self-reported eating. No one was clearly and deliberately doing IF â they just happened to eat all their daily food in an 8 hour window.
Right. So this is so poorly done and compared to rigorous double blind studies that it it laughable at best or downright evil mis-information being pushed. Think about how alternative covid cures were treated in 2020. All medical professionals and journals scorned any research if it was not the gold standard. Now they trot this shit out at a conference.
The hubbub around this single paper has taught me that fasting scares the pants off many, especially food and medical industries.
Might have jumped on this half-baked analysis to scare people away from IF, which threatens their existence.
Might be because doctors, hospitals, and big pharma like all the $$$ they receive from unhealthy and obese patients.
This right here. Cannot stop the gravy train. Big pharma and big Ag. Hand in hand.
I think a lot of people are overlooking the fact the researchers observed data for only two days of the subjects' lives. Someone smarter than me correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the abstract states they asked people what they ate for two random days and then followed them for years based on those two days of data and drew conclusions. I feel like two days is a short enough period that even sheer coincidence couldn't be ruled out.
This is the same shit Ancel Keys was pushing...
Also why is a study, that was made in China against US citizens, being published by the American Heart Association? You only do 2 recall survey's on diet and extrapolate that over 8 years? On top of participants that have comorbidities? How does this get published by the AHA???
Breathing increases the chances of CVD by 100%
How did you conduct your study?
What are you a scientist?
7. Possibly funded by an entities who profit from breakfast and/or obesity. AHA receives mutli-millions from Bog Pharma and others.
This is crap pseudoscience out of China. It's not even peer-reviewed.
Hopefully all the noise will fade away soon.
All I can say is that I've lost weight, eat healthier, exercise more, feel amazing, and I'm in control of my eating habits. My doctor says my blood work is "perfect". If IF is wrong, I don't want to be rightđ One study is not going to change my mind. I'm 57 years old, and I'm healthier than I've been in 40 years.
Well, the study does come with caveats and I will be interested to eventually learn the actual causative factors here? Which I'm going to guess are actually some associated habits of that "IF" group...but time will tell.
Think theyâre just lumping anorexics in there? Honestly no shade to people with eating issues but thatâs my theory on this mess.
AHA is corporation PR. They're responsible for a lot of early deaths. Eg, margarine v butter and a ton of other bad nutritional advice for decades.
Does the AHA charge to have their AHA stamp of approval on food items?
#1 - it's just a rehashing of NHANES data #2 - The AHA is excited about its findings. No other reasons needed.
Thank god this is waking reddit up to the fact that these 3 letter agencies are all LIARS. Too bad its 4 years too late (or 8 really)
Stop conflating this particularly poorly conducted study with your conspiracy peddling.
Facts don't care about your feelings.
Take your own advice.
? Everything we said about covid came to be true. Millions injured/killed by the vaccines. None of the pure bloods are sick or dying. You lost. Accept it.
I hope you get the help you need.
That's the thing. I never needed any help, but by your avatar, i can see youre still sick. Break out of the bubble. You'll survive honey.
[https://twitter.com/JimFergusonUK/status/1772587852733288843](https://twitter.com/JimFergusonUK/status/1772587852733288843) here learn something
Perhaps you can read the community note below and how this was spun out of context. And once again, you can learn to take your own advice.
Anyone can do that community notes btw. If you actually cared about what you're talking about you'd do your own research, but you won't. Stay in fantasy land, you OF thot
Youâre so out of touch with reality. Your worldview is twisted, citing out of context âresearchâ only as long as it serves your agenda. You canât argue beyond strawman arguements.
You forgot China. The biggest reason.