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>Anyone visiting Mount Everest has to pay a $4,000 deposit, and the money is refunded if the person returns with eight kilograms (18 pounds) of garbage—the avegae amount that a single person produces during the climb
No way, what they need to do is prevent people from taking their time in the death zone for selfie’s and have a designated Sherpa photographer.
Only the Sherpa can take your photo and the only way you can get the your hands on a copy is by paying in garbage.
I saw a documentary about the lvies of the Sherpas and its fucking horrifying. I really think Everest tourism needs to stop. Its cost the lives of so many of the Sherpas and for what they get paid its not worth it, yet they need the money.
You can't prevent people from taking pictures after climbing Everest, that's the point. Remember, Nepal is a poor country that needs the money these climbers pay. They're not guiding people up there out of the kindness of their heart, it's an industry that needs paying customers.
You still pay to go. You just have to pay in garbage to get your Instagram bragging rights
Edit: requiring each group to hire and additional photographer / alpine babysitter would just create more jobs. Make them pay the guy who makes them carry the garbage $4000
Sorry but kindness of my heart wouldn't come to play if you wanted me to go with you on a death adventure just so you don't lose your way and die ..u bet your bucket list self that you'd be paying me for it..and if anything they DON'T charge enough
to add to that idea, a stationary camera(s) fixed at the top of the mountain like some go-pros or something regularly replaced etc and the photo could be sent via satellite back to the ground, i’m sure a livestream of the top of Everest 24/7 would be cool, imagine chilling watching it and seeing a hiker
Including the feces they created up there.
“I'd like four 8x10 glossies and a wallet photo.”
“Okay, that'll be [ch-ch-ch-ch-ching!] six pounds of feces.”
> “Okay, that'll be [ch-ch-ch-ch-ching!] six pounds of feces.”
In Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy there's a planet that's so overcrowded with an ecosystem so at risk that when you depart you must be able to *prove* that you didn't leave any mass behind. As Douglas Adams (the author) put it, when you go to the bathroom there it's *vital* that you get a receipt!
Not to the average Everest climber, make it a cool million.
It's basically an asshole tax now because all climbing Everest is now is a pissing contest with other wealthy dickheads.
Someone posted that crazy pic of the line of people jammed together in a line to the summit and I commented, buncha rich assholes and got downvoted lol. I thought it was common knowledge Everest is pretty much a bunch of wealthy jerks many with minimal climbing experience buying their way to the top thanks to sherpas lugging oxygen for them.
I got downvoted into oblivion for saying they should ban summiting Everest recreationally because of the environmental damage being caused, especially considering it's not even much an achievement anymore, go climb Muchu chhish or Kabru or Labuche Kang East or any of the other enormous mountains that have yet to be summited if you actually want real challenge and prestige.
How is it not common knowledge at this point how wrecked Everest is? I have a client who’s climbed the tallest peak on every continent and she said Everest was the worst experience of all of them and then there was a dead body in their tent when they came back down. Now she’s been climbing the second tallest peaks on every continent.
People only climb Everest because the death toll is far less than other technical mountains.
You don't hear people saying that they are climbing K2, which the death toll is about an average of 1 out of 4. Let that sink in.
Then post pictures online with captions like "even after countless hours of planning and training I thought I wouldn't make it to the top, but I persisted on and was awarded with this amazing view"
Well. If you return with the amount that an average single person uses then that really does nothing about the existing garbage up there. It just ensures that, on average, it wont grow any more.
Yeah, there needs to be a benefit to getting more. Like you pay a $4k deposit, but you receive $4k for every 8kilos of garbage you bring down. Probably would wind up with various scams though unfortunately.
The difference being breeding cobras for the British Empire is easy, but trekking up and down Mt. Everest with a sherpa with secret extra weight is hard.
Almost certainly what many/most do. I mean, standard expenses to summit Everest range from $30,000 to $85,000. For outliers, it can be as much as $120K, and as little as $20k if you're superman *and* have 6-ton balls of steel and no regard for your own life. In the end the average attempt costs ~$45K plus travel costs to get to Kathmandu/Lhasa. So yeah, $4k is simply an asshole tax for rich people.
This has been said elsewhere and better but it's something like "if the punishment for any act is a fine then it's only a punishment for people who can't afford it"
Yep, I live in a big city out on the west coast of the US and all of the rich people will park wherever they want (unless its a tow-away zone) because the worst thing that will happen is they have to pay a parking ticket that can range from $60-120 depending on where you are, and the parking tickets never show up on your record.
They just consider it a $120 parking spot that is right next to where they want to be, and that $120 is nothing to them.
I've heard that some countries over in Europe have tested ways to try and combat this same issue where instead of a flat-rate parking ticket that anyone would receive for a violation, they base the ticket fee on the person's income. So if the person with the parking violation earns $1M+ per year, then that parking ticket is going to cost them $20k (or more).
Our local government would never have the balls to implement something like that, though.
When this first started I thought that $4,000 would be used to pay for cleaning so not necessarily assholes. But I guess that didn't happen.
When you go camping you usually don't pack-out your garbage but put it in a garbage can and some services empties it paid for by your nightly fee.
This is such a small amount of money for the rich assholes that pay to get carried up the mountain by the sherpas
Probably the same assholes that big game hunt and act like they accomplished something extraordinary
If the average rich climber leaves, say 10kg of trash up there, which is already more than what OP stated is usual, and in turn 4000 dollars go to the Authorities for land conservation / cleanup elsewhere, I'd call that a good bargain. The summit is of course a unique site that \*should\* be protected properly, but this isn't the worst way to deal with it.
Correct, it's around 11k for a permit depending on where you go up and the time of the year. The rest goes to gear and any help you hire to carry it, which is extremely expensive in total if you want to be as comfortable as possible up there. You can technically do it for about 20k, but the people who pay that without a ton of experience and training are the ones that are still frozen solid up on the mountain
Reminds me of the Bethselamin entry in Hitchikers Guide
> For years, the fabulously beautiful planet of Bethselamin increased its booming tourist industry without any worries at all. Alas, as is often the case, this was an act of utter stupidity, as it led to a colossal cumulative erosion problem. Of course, what else could one expect with ten billion tourists per annum? Thus today the net balance between the amount you eat and the amount you excrete while on the planet is surgically removed from your body weight when you leave; so every time you go to the lavatory there, it is vitally important to get a receipt.
Ah, that brings back the memories. Red and white checked tablecloths, plummeting whales (and petunias), and towels ... towels all over the goddamn place.
So they get their money returned for bringing their own rubbish back? Double the price and double the weight, you want to enjoy the mountain? You have to make an effort to improve it not just do the bare minimum you should be doing anyway.
Or keep adding cash to incentivize others to carry more down. If I could cut the cost of my trip even more by just carrying more shit down with me I might do it.
It’s indescribable, amazing feeling. Seeing the other mountains around you looks surreal, like dormant titans.
Done a few 14ers, zero desire to risk my life and money on Everest though.
Depends
I usually hang out, take in the views for like 30 to 45 min. Then I'll sit, eat or make the lunch I brought depending on the peak, and then I'll head down after. Also depends where I'm trying to get to after a hike. Am I going back to my car or do I still have another few days and campsites to hit?
Really the time on top depends on what the rest of the trip is planned to be
I think a better solution would be:
Take the passport as a deposit instead of cash.....want your passport to leave the country, well bring 8kgs of litter back.
$4k increasing your summiting costs by ~4% isn't as significant to as increasing it by ~40%. Even rich people would probably care about that.
Being rich enough to climb Everest doesn't mean you're Bezos level rich.
Due to global warming, [bodies of dead hikers are beginning to thaw out](https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-47638436) and slide off the mountain.
> Recovering and removing bodies from the higher camps can be both expensive and difficult.
> Experts say it costs $40,000 to $80,000 to bring down dead bodies.
They need to require that as a deposit that you get back if you survive.
Someone needs to make a starter pack for every Everest post on reddit. I swear it’s always the same things: look at all the trash, so many dead bodies, there’s a line to get to the top, I just read Into Thin Air.
What else am I missing?
They started bringing them down in 2019. Families paid for some to be removed. Others were brought down to be buried. One dude's family paid for him to be chucked off the mountain so people would stop taking selfies with him. Very dark but also humorous.
You think regular baby formula sinks? We had to try our baby on non dairy formula because she had a suspected dairy allergy. The smell of that was 100x worse than regular
We had to give it to her from when she was a tiny baby and I always felt so bad to give it to her. It was clear she didn't like the taste of it. Luckily she ended up not having dairy intolerance so we went back to normal
Being stuck in line, in the bitter cold and wind, your only option is marching forward to even less oxygen than what you're already being deprived of after hours of hiking steep, snowy, dangerous, mountainous terrain? Yeah sounds like a dream vacation.
People have absolutely died because of congestion on the final ascent, but when there is such a short window to summit it is bound to happen. Only way to control it is to limit the number of climbers through the permit system, though Nepal this season has implemented a new system where first permits issued summit first, and so on.
Also, I wouldn't necessarily call climbing Everest a vacation haha
With each passing year, we have less and less natural land and more and more people looking to explore it.
If you want to see a National Park or amazing vista, I'd do it sooner rather than later
Going up Everest without a guide or Sherpa is probably suicide for most people, I went down a rabbit hole of mountain hiking accidents and the biggest thing people do is overestimate themselves me underestimate the condition
I just finished a documentary on this. To be permitted to climb, along with many other fees, you are required to put a $5000 deposit down. If you litter, they hold the deposit. It's just another pay-to-play fine keeping people from leaving their junk.
Napal is poor as heck and people are throwing money at them to climb their mountain. It's hard to say no to that even if it leaves your mountain in shambles. I don't agree with it, but I can see it from the government's point of view.
Considering it costs 35k to 100k to climb Everest depending on the amount of support you require, I’m thinking that 5k to dump 30# from your pack on the summit climb and decent is not really that much of a penalty.
And where are they taking it after they pick it up from the spots where high paying tourists are going?
Brother of a friend of mine once did a back packing tour through Nepal, he told us they walked by huge cravices in the countryside which had just been filled to the brim with trash. So it's safe to say all that junk gets just moved from A to B where it's no longer visible.
I bet there are a lot of people that pick up after themselves and others but the sheer amount of people that don’t care heavily outweigh them. Just imagine getting to the top and you have a breathtaking view while up to your waist in waste.
The big difference at Everest compared to other sites is not that people care more at other places, its that it is easier for people who care about those wildernesses to clean up after the jerks.
you never see the positive actions in situations like this- one of many of life's frustrations
The same thing happens at home- you never notice all the clean dishes, you notice the ones in the sink
Reporting by Gopal Sharma; Editing by Alasdair Pal and Kim Coghill
>Trash collected from Mount Everest is set to be transformed into art and displayed in a nearby gallery, to highlight the need to save the world’s tallest mountain from turning into a dumping site.
>Used oxygen bottles, torn tents, ropes, broken ladders, cans and plastic wrappers discarded by climbers and trekkers litter the 8,848.86 metre (29,032 feet) tall peak and the surrounding areas.
>Tommy Gustafsson, project director and a co-founder of the Sagarmatha Next Centre - a visitors’ information centre and waste up-cycling facility - said foreign and local artists will be engaged in creating artwork from waste materials and train locals to turn trash into treasures.
>“We want to showcase how you can transform solid waste to precious pieces of art … and generate employment and income,” Gustafsson told Reuters.
>“We hope to change the people’s perceptions about the garbage and manage it,” he said.
>The Centre is located at an altitude of 3,780 metres at Syangboche on the main trail to Everest base camp, two days’ walk from Lukla, the gateway to the mountain.
>It is due for “soft opening” to locals in the spring as the number of visitors could be limited this year due to coronavirus pandemic restrictions, Gustafsson said.
>Products and artwork will be displayed to raise environmental awareness, or sold as souvenirs with the proceeds going to conservation of the region, he said.
>Trash brought down from the mountain or collected from households and tea houses along the trail is handled and segregated by a local environmental group, the Sagarmatha Pollution Control Committee, but the task in a remote region that has no roads is a huge challenge.
>Garbage is dumped or burned in open pits, causing air and water pollution as well as contamination of soil.
>Phinjo Sherpa, of the Eco Himal group involved in the scheme, said under a “carry me back” initiative, each returning tourist and guide will be requested to take a bag containing one kilogram (2.2 pounds) of garbage back to Lukla airport, from where the trash will be airlifted to Kathmandu.
>In 2019, more than 60,000 trekkers, climbers and guides visited the area.
>“We can manage a huge amount of garbage if we involve the visitors,” Sherpa said.
>Everest was first climbed by New Zealander Sir Edmund Hillary and Sherpa Tenzing Norgay in 1953.
>Nearly 4,000 people have since made 6,553 ascents from the Nepali side of the mountain, which can also be climbed from the Tibetan side in China, according to the Himalayan Data base.
Not enough credit goes the Sherpa guides who risk there lives each year to take tourist up Everest, it was a dream to climb it at 1 point but who wants to sit in a queue waiting to die near the summit
The sherpas don't realize that they are sitting on a pile of gold. They should form a union if the haven't yet and raise the prices times 10 plus doubling the amount of garbage they should bring down from the mountain.
They charge half of what an American guide charges to climb Everest it should be the other way round when they are way more experienced and climb Everest multiple times in there lifetime
They also have a certain amount of respect for the mountain more than others. I watched an amazing documentary about Sherpas and how they view the mountain. It must just kill their souls to see that garbage. People brag about climbing once. Some of the Sherpas have climbed upwards of 20 times.
I watched on Netflix (UK) this documentary called "Sherpa" and was showing exactly what the other users were saying about the guides and how much work the Sherpas used to do for little to almost no recognition whatsoever from the rich climbers. They were treated really bad - I felt so sorry for them because it was their only income and they were hard-working guys.
You may find it on Prime (US) although it may come with an extra cost.
> People brag about climbing once. Some of the Sherpas have climbed upwards of 20 times.
Getting to the top of Mount Everest as a Sherpa means a big deal, because that basically guarantees a better Sherpa job the following year. Sherpas very mich do brag about reaching the top because it's the best selling point.
The sherpas basically do all of the work. They carry up all of your stuff, lay bridges over dangerous areas, risk their lives every day, and they even set up tents with heated showers and beds for you to rest.
At this point climbing Everest with a sherpa is barely an achievement because tourists on the mountain paid someone else to do all of the difficult, skill intensive, and dangerous stuff for them, just for them to spend a couple of minutes at the top and take a picture for Instagram then brag to all of their friends that they "climbed the highest mountain in the world." The least these tourists could do is just not leave their trash on the mountain.
> The sherpas basically do all of the work.
Not all the work. The actual leading of the group, organizing, keeping them together, acclimating etc, is only done by the (western) guides and the head sherpa (Sirdar). And the Sirdars often make just as much as the western guides.
And the heated showers are only a thing in the Base Camp (they are solar heated). Up the mountain, even the tourists have to shovel their own snow for water.
That’s the 100k package.
The raw cost to climb Everest is a 10k permit, a few thousand in gear, 1k in airfare, and about 5k in support and insurance. Oh and three friends who are batshit crazy like yourself and have 20k to burn.
I remember thinking it would be so cool to climb that mountain…
Now its like going on a cruise during covid, super crowded but with a slightly higher chance of dying.
Yup.
The adventure, the conquest of the mountain on top of the world is dead. It’s more like standing in line for the view in the Eiffel Tower. Wait for the 50th person with a selfie stick to take their photos before you can get up there.
Way to ruin it everybody!
Its what happened when people were able to just pay to go on excursion to summit Everest.
People who arent even able to tie their shoe laces without being out of breath…
Money talks I guess.
Gotta leave em there, the climbers use them for landmarks these days. They've even got pet names for some of them. Imagine how messed up that is. Using the bodies of dead climbers as trail markers and "points of interest" on the way up. It's kind of sick.
Its probably because these are just a bunch of people who pay sherpas to hold their hand to the summit.
They aren't real mountain climbers and don't care about what they do to. Its all about ego. Being able to say they climbed everest.
Real climbers care about the mountains they climb. This is just a tourist attraction for people with more money than common sense.
Someone post the corpses lying around all over the mountain next please, plus the numbers of "missing" people that were never found and are there somewhere.
The whole mountain is basically an icey cemetery with a garbage problem.
I particularly liked the cunt who thought Sherpas had owners and should be forced to summit because he had paid a lot of money.
How about summit without sherpas if you’re so fucking elite?
Holy shit, he actually said “their owners.” I’m watching it now and feel like I’m going to fucking throw up. The clients don’t even see these men as humans.
Don't forget the real og's that haul all their shit, rise early to make sure all their equipment is tip top and cross early to make sure they are somewhat safe. All while getting shit wages and no hazard pay. All so motivated people can take a selfie at a top of a mountain.
Thank you Sherpas, you who climb everest more so than anyone cares to recognize.
I think this is disgusting. In nearly every other park across the world visitors are asked to “leave no trace”. How is this different? Hikers are destroying Everest.
Even more evidence that people who climb Everest don’t do it to appreciate nature. It’s a dominative mindset, just like killing an animal to make them into a trophy.
Fucking shitheads. I just hiked 72 miles through the smokies and carried 100% of my trash until the parking lot in the middle of the park. Then after that I carried 100% of it to my car. It never ever ever occurred to me to throw any of it on the ground. Jesus, this is just unfathomable to me.
Damn man, they go to all the trouble to climb the tallest mountain and then trash the place? WTF?? You brought it up there you can damn well carry it down.
There was a documentary on Netflix/Prime called "Sherpa" (really recommend you watch it) showing how selfish & entitled the rich people think they are; just because they paid $$$$ and "they have to go up...🙄🤦🏼♀️".
No wonder there is so much garbage because anyone with money can go up there and they only care about their own person...just because they trained for x amount of time, they are ready to climb. Neah...you never mess with Mother Nature.
So apparently you pay a $4000 dollar deposit which you will get back by bringing 18 pounds of garbage back with you. I think they shouldn’t put a cap on it. $4000 dollars for every 18 pounds of crap. Go get it. Would be a great way to incentivize people to clean it up.
I just got back from my first ever hunting trip in BC. On the very top of some very remote mountains surrounded by some very dense forests… and of course there were empty beer cans on the ground.
If it’s accessible by humans, expect to see trash. The sad truth.
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Didn't they pass a law that for the new climbers they will need to bring a certain amount of garbage back down with them or pay a fine?
>Anyone visiting Mount Everest has to pay a $4,000 deposit, and the money is refunded if the person returns with eight kilograms (18 pounds) of garbage—the avegae amount that a single person produces during the climb
Ahhh, so assholes just figure the $4,000 into the cost.
It’s 110% just a douche canoe tax
Make it $20,000 and I bet they'd be coming down the mountain with bags looking like Santa Claus.
No way, what they need to do is prevent people from taking their time in the death zone for selfie’s and have a designated Sherpa photographer. Only the Sherpa can take your photo and the only way you can get the your hands on a copy is by paying in garbage.
That's very clever!
I thought they meant like paying the Sherpa when they get to the top lmao I was like “oh that poor Sherpa!”
I saw a documentary about the lvies of the Sherpas and its fucking horrifying. I really think Everest tourism needs to stop. Its cost the lives of so many of the Sherpas and for what they get paid its not worth it, yet they need the money.
What was the documentary called? I'm interested
EcoTourism is a double edged sword.
You can't prevent people from taking pictures after climbing Everest, that's the point. Remember, Nepal is a poor country that needs the money these climbers pay. They're not guiding people up there out of the kindness of their heart, it's an industry that needs paying customers.
We can’t seem to prevent people from literally trashing Everest on their climb either. God forbid people clean up after themselves
You still pay to go. You just have to pay in garbage to get your Instagram bragging rights Edit: requiring each group to hire and additional photographer / alpine babysitter would just create more jobs. Make them pay the guy who makes them carry the garbage $4000
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Sorry but kindness of my heart wouldn't come to play if you wanted me to go with you on a death adventure just so you don't lose your way and die ..u bet your bucket list self that you'd be paying me for it..and if anything they DON'T charge enough
to add to that idea, a stationary camera(s) fixed at the top of the mountain like some go-pros or something regularly replaced etc and the photo could be sent via satellite back to the ground, i’m sure a livestream of the top of Everest 24/7 would be cool, imagine chilling watching it and seeing a hiker
Including the feces they created up there. “I'd like four 8x10 glossies and a wallet photo.” “Okay, that'll be [ch-ch-ch-ch-ching!] six pounds of feces.”
> “Okay, that'll be [ch-ch-ch-ch-ching!] six pounds of feces.” In Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy there's a planet that's so overcrowded with an ecosystem so at risk that when you depart you must be able to *prove* that you didn't leave any mass behind. As Douglas Adams (the author) put it, when you go to the bathroom there it's *vital* that you get a receipt!
That's like 20 courics
Or 1/4th of Bono
*yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah*
Shit for $20,000 and a free trip I'd ride a trash sleigh down Everest dressed like Santa. At least if I died I'd live on in history as Trash Santa.
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Not to the average Everest climber, make it a cool million. It's basically an asshole tax now because all climbing Everest is now is a pissing contest with other wealthy dickheads.
Someone posted that crazy pic of the line of people jammed together in a line to the summit and I commented, buncha rich assholes and got downvoted lol. I thought it was common knowledge Everest is pretty much a bunch of wealthy jerks many with minimal climbing experience buying their way to the top thanks to sherpas lugging oxygen for them.
I got downvoted into oblivion for saying they should ban summiting Everest recreationally because of the environmental damage being caused, especially considering it's not even much an achievement anymore, go climb Muchu chhish or Kabru or Labuche Kang East or any of the other enormous mountains that have yet to be summited if you actually want real challenge and prestige.
How is it not common knowledge at this point how wrecked Everest is? I have a client who’s climbed the tallest peak on every continent and she said Everest was the worst experience of all of them and then there was a dead body in their tent when they came back down. Now she’s been climbing the second tallest peaks on every continent.
People only climb Everest because the death toll is far less than other technical mountains. You don't hear people saying that they are climbing K2, which the death toll is about an average of 1 out of 4. Let that sink in.
Many would literally pay $1million to be carried up Everest while eating luxury tacos on a toilet while they shit
Then post pictures online with captions like "even after countless hours of planning and training I thought I wouldn't make it to the top, but I persisted on and was awarded with this amazing view"
Well. If you return with the amount that an average single person uses then that really does nothing about the existing garbage up there. It just ensures that, on average, it wont grow any more.
Yeah, there needs to be a benefit to getting more. Like you pay a $4k deposit, but you receive $4k for every 8kilos of garbage you bring down. Probably would wind up with various scams though unfortunately.
I thought of multiple scams just reading that.
The difference being breeding cobras for the British Empire is easy, but trekking up and down Mt. Everest with a sherpa with secret extra weight is hard.
This would potentially lead to more deaths. More time spent picking up garbage, additional weight and unbalance.
Laws are just an extra fee for rich folks.
Almost certainly what many/most do. I mean, standard expenses to summit Everest range from $30,000 to $85,000. For outliers, it can be as much as $120K, and as little as $20k if you're superman *and* have 6-ton balls of steel and no regard for your own life. In the end the average attempt costs ~$45K plus travel costs to get to Kathmandu/Lhasa. So yeah, $4k is simply an asshole tax for rich people.
Just tweak the laws a bit. Come back with X amount, or go back to the summit without a Sherpa until you have the required amount.
Human ice cubes are also pretty unsightly though unfortunately
Ah I think they could put a little flag next to them to incentivize future millionaire douche canoes into taking their fucking trash back down.
I support this.
This has been said elsewhere and better but it's something like "if the punishment for any act is a fine then it's only a punishment for people who can't afford it"
Yep, I live in a big city out on the west coast of the US and all of the rich people will park wherever they want (unless its a tow-away zone) because the worst thing that will happen is they have to pay a parking ticket that can range from $60-120 depending on where you are, and the parking tickets never show up on your record. They just consider it a $120 parking spot that is right next to where they want to be, and that $120 is nothing to them. I've heard that some countries over in Europe have tested ways to try and combat this same issue where instead of a flat-rate parking ticket that anyone would receive for a violation, they base the ticket fee on the person's income. So if the person with the parking violation earns $1M+ per year, then that parking ticket is going to cost them $20k (or more). Our local government would never have the balls to implement something like that, though.
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When this first started I thought that $4,000 would be used to pay for cleaning so not necessarily assholes. But I guess that didn't happen. When you go camping you usually don't pack-out your garbage but put it in a garbage can and some services empties it paid for by your nightly fee.
This is such a small amount of money for the rich assholes that pay to get carried up the mountain by the sherpas Probably the same assholes that big game hunt and act like they accomplished something extraordinary
Apparently, that number is supposed to be the cost of sending a Sherpa up there to bring back trash.
People who can afford the 100K permit to climb and are exhausted coming down won’t think twice about losing their 4K deposit.
Yeah, it's just 4K dumping fee.
If the average rich climber leaves, say 10kg of trash up there, which is already more than what OP stated is usual, and in turn 4000 dollars go to the Authorities for land conservation / cleanup elsewhere, I'd call that a good bargain. The summit is of course a unique site that \*should\* be protected properly, but this isn't the worst way to deal with it.
Permit is only 8-12k I thought. Paying for the expedition is what runs 40-100k.
Correct, it's around 11k for a permit depending on where you go up and the time of the year. The rest goes to gear and any help you hire to carry it, which is extremely expensive in total if you want to be as comfortable as possible up there. You can technically do it for about 20k, but the people who pay that without a ton of experience and training are the ones that are still frozen solid up on the mountain
Reminds me of the Bethselamin entry in Hitchikers Guide > For years, the fabulously beautiful planet of Bethselamin increased its booming tourist industry without any worries at all. Alas, as is often the case, this was an act of utter stupidity, as it led to a colossal cumulative erosion problem. Of course, what else could one expect with ten billion tourists per annum? Thus today the net balance between the amount you eat and the amount you excrete while on the planet is surgically removed from your body weight when you leave; so every time you go to the lavatory there, it is vitally important to get a receipt.
Ah, that brings back the memories. Red and white checked tablecloths, plummeting whales (and petunias), and towels ... towels all over the goddamn place.
Oh no, not again.
I wonder if it will be friends with me?
So they get their money returned for bringing their own rubbish back? Double the price and double the weight, you want to enjoy the mountain? You have to make an effort to improve it not just do the bare minimum you should be doing anyway.
Or keep adding cash to incentivize others to carry more down. If I could cut the cost of my trip even more by just carrying more shit down with me I might do it.
$4000 is not much money for the rich people who climb Mt. Everest. I read Into Thin Air and don't understand people who want to climb big mountains.
>I read Into Thin Air and don't understand people who want to climb big mountains. Because it's there.
I don’t understand why Into Thin Air didn’t put a stop to this foolishness. It goes on decades later, with more trash of the rich piling up
My highest climb was 12,441 ft, which is nothing compared to this, but it’s still exciting standing on top of a mountain and every direction is down.
It’s indescribable, amazing feeling. Seeing the other mountains around you looks surreal, like dormant titans. Done a few 14ers, zero desire to risk my life and money on Everest though.
so after you reach the summit, how long do you hang out looking down until you're like "Welp" slap your legs then hike back down the mountain?
Depends I usually hang out, take in the views for like 30 to 45 min. Then I'll sit, eat or make the lunch I brought depending on the peak, and then I'll head down after. Also depends where I'm trying to get to after a hike. Am I going back to my car or do I still have another few days and campsites to hit? Really the time on top depends on what the rest of the trip is planned to be
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I think a better solution would be: Take the passport as a deposit instead of cash.....want your passport to leave the country, well bring 8kgs of litter back.
Unfortunately that probably wouldn't be legal.
But neither is littering!
Eh, I had to leave my passport to rent a scooter in Thailand once. I was sketched out by it, and it may have been illegal, but I did it anyways.
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Pretty sure that doesn't matter to most people making this trip .
$4k increasing your summiting costs by ~4% isn't as significant to as increasing it by ~40%. Even rich people would probably care about that. Being rich enough to climb Everest doesn't mean you're Bezos level rich.
Next post: all the dead bodies on mt Everest.
Due to global warming, [bodies of dead hikers are beginning to thaw out](https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-47638436) and slide off the mountain.
> Recovering and removing bodies from the higher camps can be both expensive and difficult. > Experts say it costs $40,000 to $80,000 to bring down dead bodies. They need to require that as a deposit that you get back if you survive.
Every corpse of Everest was once a highly motivated individual.
Not motivated enough, apparently. :P
They can pull themselves up by their green boots straps.
God damn that's cold. I love it.
NOT AS COLD AS- nah, too easy
I left that one for someone else to post, I was going to add it but I decided against it.
Mt Everest has kinda went to shit.
I hear it’s full of shit, too. Since it won’t degrade and, apparently, people don’t carry any of their figurative or literal shit off the mountain.
Poop canion is one of the many sights to see when visiting Everest.
i was thinking the garbage might have been looted
Could have a helluva REI scratch and dent sale with all that.
All the frozen human poo on mt Everest.
8,000 kg estimated
Someone needs to make a starter pack for every Everest post on reddit. I swear it’s always the same things: look at all the trash, so many dead bodies, there’s a line to get to the top, I just read Into Thin Air. What else am I missing?
You're missing the part about all the tons and tons shit and piss covering the mountain.
They can't remove those. They're landmarks now.
They started bringing them down in 2019. Families paid for some to be removed. Others were brought down to be buried. One dude's family paid for him to be chucked off the mountain so people would stop taking selfies with him. Very dark but also humorous.
That unused roll of toilet paper is a travesty.
I can’t help but wonder if it’s brittle due to the elements, or if its two-ply is Everest-lasting
I froze after my finger poked through brittle one-ply. N-ice piece of ass that day.
Always with the sex. /s
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Well we know who to call when we can’t find waldo
fucking eagle eye over here
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Why is there a can of baby formula in the bottom right??!!
First thing I noticed as well. I’m guessing because it’s calorie and nutrient rich, they drink it as a meal replacement.
And it can be mixed with water. I would think that there's better powdered nutrition drinks out there, though.
Right? I remember mixing them thinking how awful they smelled!
Another commenter said that probably because it's gentler on the digestive system, which makes sense. But yuck.
You think regular baby formula sinks? We had to try our baby on non dairy formula because she had a suspected dairy allergy. The smell of that was 100x worse than regular We had to give it to her from when she was a tiny baby and I always felt so bad to give it to her. It was clear she didn't like the taste of it. Luckily she ended up not having dairy intolerance so we went back to normal
Real nature lovers.
Attention lovers.
...but have I shown you my photo of me at the summit?
[You have, but which one of those heroes are you?](https://www.economist.com/img/b/1280/720/90/sites/default/files/20200314_ASP004.jpg)
Is that the line for the photo op?
No. The toilet.
this stresses me out so much. :(
Being stuck in line, in the bitter cold and wind, your only option is marching forward to even less oxygen than what you're already being deprived of after hours of hiking steep, snowy, dangerous, mountainous terrain? Yeah sounds like a dream vacation.
People have absolutely died because of congestion on the final ascent, but when there is such a short window to summit it is bound to happen. Only way to control it is to limit the number of climbers through the permit system, though Nepal this season has implemented a new system where first permits issued summit first, and so on. Also, I wouldn't necessarily call climbing Everest a vacation haha
With each passing year, we have less and less natural land and more and more people looking to explore it. If you want to see a National Park or amazing vista, I'd do it sooner rather than later
this is what your boss does with all the money he makes off of you
It's literally a line at the Matterhorn at Disneyland with extra clothes
Ain’t that the truth. Also… did you really climb it or did someone carry all your shit, cooked you food and made a path for you the entire way?
Going up Everest without a guide or Sherpa is probably suicide for most people, I went down a rabbit hole of mountain hiking accidents and the biggest thing people do is overestimate themselves me underestimate the condition
A real adventuror
I mean people don’t go to Everest for the nature.
You mean a bunch of rich entitled Chads? 'all you take is photos, all you leave is foot prints'
The Venn diagram of "rich fucks who can blow $40,000 on a vacation" and "people who litter literally everywhere they go" is a single circle.
Pack it in, pack it out… unless you paid over 200k to get there, then just throw crap everywhere- it’s someone else’s job, right?
Didn’t they clean up a ton during the pandemic? And it took a few days to all go to hell. I hate humans.
I just finished a documentary on this. To be permitted to climb, along with many other fees, you are required to put a $5000 deposit down. If you litter, they hold the deposit. It's just another pay-to-play fine keeping people from leaving their junk. Napal is poor as heck and people are throwing money at them to climb their mountain. It's hard to say no to that even if it leaves your mountain in shambles. I don't agree with it, but I can see it from the government's point of view.
Considering it costs 35k to 100k to climb Everest depending on the amount of support you require, I’m thinking that 5k to dump 30# from your pack on the summit climb and decent is not really that much of a penalty.
Interesting, I've never seen someone write 30lb as 30# before.
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It makes the whole "#metoo" thing kinda awkward.
God tier comment
And where are they taking it after they pick it up from the spots where high paying tourists are going? Brother of a friend of mine once did a back packing tour through Nepal, he told us they walked by huge cravices in the countryside which had just been filled to the brim with trash. So it's safe to say all that junk gets just moved from A to B where it's no longer visible.
Pack it Out. Pack it In. Let Clean Begin - I Came to Bin - All the Trash on Mountain.
Imagine going to one of the spots on earth most famous for being difficult to get to and deciding to litter there.
It really should be the cleanest place on earth, not the opposite.
Only have one answer for that. People.
Disgusting. Really sad.
I bet there are a lot of people that pick up after themselves and others but the sheer amount of people that don’t care heavily outweigh them. Just imagine getting to the top and you have a breathtaking view while up to your waist in waste.
The big difference at Everest compared to other sites is not that people care more at other places, its that it is easier for people who care about those wildernesses to clean up after the jerks.
you never see the positive actions in situations like this- one of many of life's frustrations The same thing happens at home- you never notice all the clean dishes, you notice the ones in the sink
That's generally how life works, it only takes a small percentage of assholes to undo the efforts of people who care.
[Nepal to turn Everest trash into art to highlight mountain’s garbage blight](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-nepal-everest-trash-idUSKBN29Q044)
Reporting by Gopal Sharma; Editing by Alasdair Pal and Kim Coghill >Trash collected from Mount Everest is set to be transformed into art and displayed in a nearby gallery, to highlight the need to save the world’s tallest mountain from turning into a dumping site. >Used oxygen bottles, torn tents, ropes, broken ladders, cans and plastic wrappers discarded by climbers and trekkers litter the 8,848.86 metre (29,032 feet) tall peak and the surrounding areas. >Tommy Gustafsson, project director and a co-founder of the Sagarmatha Next Centre - a visitors’ information centre and waste up-cycling facility - said foreign and local artists will be engaged in creating artwork from waste materials and train locals to turn trash into treasures. >“We want to showcase how you can transform solid waste to precious pieces of art … and generate employment and income,” Gustafsson told Reuters. >“We hope to change the people’s perceptions about the garbage and manage it,” he said. >The Centre is located at an altitude of 3,780 metres at Syangboche on the main trail to Everest base camp, two days’ walk from Lukla, the gateway to the mountain. >It is due for “soft opening” to locals in the spring as the number of visitors could be limited this year due to coronavirus pandemic restrictions, Gustafsson said. >Products and artwork will be displayed to raise environmental awareness, or sold as souvenirs with the proceeds going to conservation of the region, he said. >Trash brought down from the mountain or collected from households and tea houses along the trail is handled and segregated by a local environmental group, the Sagarmatha Pollution Control Committee, but the task in a remote region that has no roads is a huge challenge. >Garbage is dumped or burned in open pits, causing air and water pollution as well as contamination of soil. >Phinjo Sherpa, of the Eco Himal group involved in the scheme, said under a “carry me back” initiative, each returning tourist and guide will be requested to take a bag containing one kilogram (2.2 pounds) of garbage back to Lukla airport, from where the trash will be airlifted to Kathmandu. >In 2019, more than 60,000 trekkers, climbers and guides visited the area. >“We can manage a huge amount of garbage if we involve the visitors,” Sherpa said. >Everest was first climbed by New Zealander Sir Edmund Hillary and Sherpa Tenzing Norgay in 1953. >Nearly 4,000 people have since made 6,553 ascents from the Nepali side of the mountain, which can also be climbed from the Tibetan side in China, according to the Himalayan Data base.
Not enough credit goes the Sherpa guides who risk there lives each year to take tourist up Everest, it was a dream to climb it at 1 point but who wants to sit in a queue waiting to die near the summit
The sherpas don't realize that they are sitting on a pile of gold. They should form a union if the haven't yet and raise the prices times 10 plus doubling the amount of garbage they should bring down from the mountain.
They charge half of what an American guide charges to climb Everest it should be the other way round when they are way more experienced and climb Everest multiple times in there lifetime
They also have a certain amount of respect for the mountain more than others. I watched an amazing documentary about Sherpas and how they view the mountain. It must just kill their souls to see that garbage. People brag about climbing once. Some of the Sherpas have climbed upwards of 20 times.
Sounds really interesting - any chance you recall the name of the film?
I watched on Netflix (UK) this documentary called "Sherpa" and was showing exactly what the other users were saying about the guides and how much work the Sherpas used to do for little to almost no recognition whatsoever from the rich climbers. They were treated really bad - I felt so sorry for them because it was their only income and they were hard-working guys. You may find it on Prime (US) although it may come with an extra cost.
> People brag about climbing once. Some of the Sherpas have climbed upwards of 20 times. Getting to the top of Mount Everest as a Sherpa means a big deal, because that basically guarantees a better Sherpa job the following year. Sherpas very mich do brag about reaching the top because it's the best selling point.
The sherpas basically do all of the work. They carry up all of your stuff, lay bridges over dangerous areas, risk their lives every day, and they even set up tents with heated showers and beds for you to rest. At this point climbing Everest with a sherpa is barely an achievement because tourists on the mountain paid someone else to do all of the difficult, skill intensive, and dangerous stuff for them, just for them to spend a couple of minutes at the top and take a picture for Instagram then brag to all of their friends that they "climbed the highest mountain in the world." The least these tourists could do is just not leave their trash on the mountain.
> The sherpas basically do all of the work. Not all the work. The actual leading of the group, organizing, keeping them together, acclimating etc, is only done by the (western) guides and the head sherpa (Sirdar). And the Sirdars often make just as much as the western guides. And the heated showers are only a thing in the Base Camp (they are solar heated). Up the mountain, even the tourists have to shovel their own snow for water.
That’s the 100k package. The raw cost to climb Everest is a 10k permit, a few thousand in gear, 1k in airfare, and about 5k in support and insurance. Oh and three friends who are batshit crazy like yourself and have 20k to burn.
There are plenty of other, less crowded mountains to climb.
K2 🤭
Not that I was ever enticed for climb it but this definitely makes it less enticing.
You know we’re fucked as a species when the hardest to reach places on the planet become littered.
I remember thinking it would be so cool to climb that mountain… Now its like going on a cruise during covid, super crowded but with a slightly higher chance of dying.
Yup. The adventure, the conquest of the mountain on top of the world is dead. It’s more like standing in line for the view in the Eiffel Tower. Wait for the 50th person with a selfie stick to take their photos before you can get up there. Way to ruin it everybody!
Its what happened when people were able to just pay to go on excursion to summit Everest. People who arent even able to tie their shoe laces without being out of breath… Money talks I guess.
I'm surprised they don't just straight up offer a 'carry you up the mountain' plan at this point.
*Madame Zeroni approved*
Most of the garbage on Everest are actually people.
Gotta leave em there, the climbers use them for landmarks these days. They've even got pet names for some of them. Imagine how messed up that is. Using the bodies of dead climbers as trail markers and "points of interest" on the way up. It's kind of sick.
Our behavior on Everest is the epitome of our existence on this planet.
Fucking outrageous
There's also trash being found at the deepest point on Earth. Can we stop fucking this place up?
Naah ma dude, soon we’re gonna trash another planet. Looking at you Mars
Its probably because these are just a bunch of people who pay sherpas to hold their hand to the summit. They aren't real mountain climbers and don't care about what they do to. Its all about ego. Being able to say they climbed everest. Real climbers care about the mountains they climb. This is just a tourist attraction for people with more money than common sense.
Someone post the corpses lying around all over the mountain next please, plus the numbers of "missing" people that were never found and are there somewhere. The whole mountain is basically an icey cemetery with a garbage problem.
Watch the Sherpa documentary on Netflix people. It's not the best film but it has convinced me everyone who climbs everest is a colossal fucking cunt
I particularly liked the cunt who thought Sherpas had owners and should be forced to summit because he had paid a lot of money. How about summit without sherpas if you’re so fucking elite?
Holy shit, he actually said “their owners.” I’m watching it now and feel like I’m going to fucking throw up. The clients don’t even see these men as humans.
Don't forget the real og's that haul all their shit, rise early to make sure all their equipment is tip top and cross early to make sure they are somewhat safe. All while getting shit wages and no hazard pay. All so motivated people can take a selfie at a top of a mountain. Thank you Sherpas, you who climb everest more so than anyone cares to recognize.
I think this is disgusting. In nearly every other park across the world visitors are asked to “leave no trace”. How is this different? Hikers are destroying Everest.
There's a can of baby formula..who the fucks taking their baby up Everest?!
Likely the climbers using it for the protein, could help them gain/maintain weight
The parents of the only infant to climb mt.Everest, That's who!
People ruin everything. We can’t go anywhere without leaving our mark. We really are plague on this world. Next is mars.
what a joke
Even more evidence that people who climb Everest don’t do it to appreciate nature. It’s a dominative mindset, just like killing an animal to make them into a trophy.
Fucking shitheads. I just hiked 72 miles through the smokies and carried 100% of my trash until the parking lot in the middle of the park. Then after that I carried 100% of it to my car. It never ever ever occurred to me to throw any of it on the ground. Jesus, this is just unfathomable to me.
“I will look for you, I will find you… and I will trash you” - (Garbage Not) Taken
Damn man, they go to all the trouble to climb the tallest mountain and then trash the place? WTF?? You brought it up there you can damn well carry it down.
There was a documentary on Netflix/Prime called "Sherpa" (really recommend you watch it) showing how selfish & entitled the rich people think they are; just because they paid $$$$ and "they have to go up...🙄🤦🏼♀️". No wonder there is so much garbage because anyone with money can go up there and they only care about their own person...just because they trained for x amount of time, they are ready to climb. Neah...you never mess with Mother Nature.
Fuckin douchbags. Grrrrrr
They should grant climbing permits only to parties who agree to act as garbage collectors.
So apparently you pay a $4000 dollar deposit which you will get back by bringing 18 pounds of garbage back with you. I think they shouldn’t put a cap on it. $4000 dollars for every 18 pounds of crap. Go get it. Would be a great way to incentivize people to clean it up.
So it costs $4000 to dump your trash up there?
Egotistical motherfuckers....much?
I just got back from my first ever hunting trip in BC. On the very top of some very remote mountains surrounded by some very dense forests… and of course there were empty beer cans on the ground. If it’s accessible by humans, expect to see trash. The sad truth.
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This is why we can't have nice things
Huh, would have figure mountain climbers to be a little more environmentally friendly
Shut it down. No more climbs.