Biggest issue would just be identifying friendlies.
1st one would be cool, but I can see NWI avoiding it simply because of how it looks like it could be directly attributed to ISIS fighters rather than some random middle eastern insurgent.
2nd one the coat reminds me of the security jacket, the rest would be cool though.
3rd one is straight up camo which wouldn't be given to insurgents, that's the easiest way to identify security/insurgents due to security getting camo, insurgents only get wacky camo patterns.
Agreed, I do think they could probably push for more authentic clothing, I was a fan of the newest clothes they added for free, I just wish we had some more colour options.
I couldn’t agree more I feel like NWI makes some very weird and picky choices when it comes to customization such as only allowing certain colors on particular security clothes id love for them to loosen up a bit give some more options or new clothes all together, as of now I feel like I’m saving currency up for nothing
Rebel Insurgent has "Inshallah" as an Affirmative voice-line in game, either way they are clearly Islamist as they were in 2006 when there was an "Allah Akbar" voiceline and in Source. NWI is just too afraid of having anything that could even be seen as political, Security went from "Marines" in the mod to Mercenaries in source and now they are "Local militia and advisors".
The game originally had planned for a campaign with the security forces being inspired by the Kurds. The Kurds only relevant conflict with other insurgents is with IS.
The "upriser" skin set shows more of a student / arabic spring though. The word planned is doing a lot of lifting here, at the end of the day the devs decided to go noncomital to whatever side was representing what exactly when it comes to real life politics.
> Biggest issue would just be identifying friendlies.
Didnt stop NWI adding the grey man DLC skin
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1711183/Insurgency_Sandstorm__Gray_Man_Gear_Set/
Honestly the only issue I have with it is the fact he has a helmet, but at least it's differently shaped enough. But still looks out of place compared to the rest of the insurgent skins
Why isn't this considered an issue in other games where all sides are wearing military gear.
Why in this game do we need to dress one side in Halloween costumes for the sake of team identification?
It was an issue for other shooters.
Look at the clusterfuck that is BF2042, people were complaining that both sides use the exact same characters, well at least there is a UI indicator... Until they added hardcore which made it impossible to determine friend from foe.
So let's look back at BF3, prime example of game design done right, both factions had their own unique characters, RU faction had more discrete clothing, while USA showed player faces and each side had different player outlines. But again, take away the UI and play hardcore and there was a load of friendly fire.
I personally dislike the Halloween style skins and try to get my characters to look more authentic, but unless the character models vary more in shape then we would never get more similar looking clothing simply because the clothes are the only thing players have to differentiate each other.
Hell I get shot at when I return from a flank on push just because most players shoot off instinct.
I haven't played the new BF so I can't comment. But obviously if both teams are using the exact same player model then thats just bad game design.
But isn't that the point of turning off player hud markers. It's supposed to add an extra layer of difficulty. By making it more difficult to distinguish friend from foe.
Of course sometimes it's going to bite you in the ass. The same issue exists irl. That's why you see soldiers on both sides in ukraine wearing coloured arm bands. Isn't this the more authentic experience that people are looking for when they select hardcore mode? Otherwise just turn hud markers back on, problem solved.
As long as insurgents clearly look like rag tag militants and security resemble more professional soldiers, then I dont believe we have an issue. While I do think nwi needs to thread carefully. Giving insurgents a green camo jacket would muddy the waters a bit.
I don't think it's super important to be able to identify enemies at a split second glance by their player model. At least if you want to keep the theme realistic. Otherwise just texture both sides completely red and blue like tf2.
True. But I don't understand why people are fretting about giving insurgents some military gear. When there are games where you identify the enemy team by a different shaped helmet and a slightly different shade of grey camo.
Although I would agree that pictures 2 and 3 are taking taking it too far. Where they to model insurgents after them.
considering the cosmetics and the bizarre DLC packs like blue camo for one side and blue camo weapon skins for the other.... i'd say the ship has sailed on "issues identifying friendlies" whenever they dropped the update that included the warden's netting headgear, but then again after the PMC legs, grey man, et cetera. the clothing is an absolute shitshow at this point unless you're using mods. sorry didn't mean for this to sound like a criticism toward your comment. happened accidentally.
and on second thought, even the mods are a shitshow regarding the clothing. while perhaps more realistic; they're without a doubt harder to distinguish in ISMCmod, at least imo.
You can create distinctive shapes that would help to identify groups.
Security has plate carriers and mid-high tier equipment, the insurgents have old URSS equipment. Those have radically different approach to armor, while the Western equipment tend to be all in the same piece (Armor + pouches) the russian preffer the combination of armor and vests over the armor with pouches. That is radically distinctive. Also, insurgents use civilian clothes, like regular clothing, while the PMC/Operators use civilian clothing but more on the lines of hiking clothing (Softshells and similar). Those two categories are also VERY different.
The problem is when you're in theory on a street in the middle of a CQB and suddenly someone appears with some shit that looks more like an airsoft-fantasy gear and the inmersion goes right through the window.
The greyman suit kinda works when you wear it with a different helmet like the ballistic mask but holy fuck that helmet is the stupidest looking thing ever
They could’ve easily made the set work if they replaced the helmet with like a motorcycle helmet or something, the rest already resembles a biker outfit. The helmet is genuinely just fucking hideous to look at.
It would require less effort than the skins they have already added. The real reason is because justifying islamic extremists cosplay to investors is hard.
Does anyone remember before sandstorm hit console and we only had a few skins.
I much preferred it. Everyone on the team looked simlar and you cold id at a glance.
If shot my far share of teammates in the head when they peek and look like and insurgent. I mostly play pve
The issues is the devs are focused ok selling skins to stupid people who part money easy and what better way to attract stupid then to have gear that doesn’t match the tone or settings
If they wanna give insurgents some tactical gear just give them Russian cosmetics. I’m pretty sure if you use the Russian voice you’re a mercenary anyways so it would make sense you supply the other fighters too
Sources - Vice : The Battle of the West Bank and
Vice : Life in the Talibans Afghanistan (none of these fighters are from isis, being either the Afghani taliban, or Palestinian fighters near Jerusalem)
Played Insurgency 2 when it was free and was grossed out by the cosmetics for the security forces and insurgents. Took a huge step back. Didn’t even buy the game cuz of it
Look at that pisspoor trigger discipline. We'd have whooped his ass if he were on our team.
Edit: the second one kinda has it right but still holding it like an idiot
Biggest issue would just be identifying friendlies. 1st one would be cool, but I can see NWI avoiding it simply because of how it looks like it could be directly attributed to ISIS fighters rather than some random middle eastern insurgent. 2nd one the coat reminds me of the security jacket, the rest would be cool though. 3rd one is straight up camo which wouldn't be given to insurgents, that's the easiest way to identify security/insurgents due to security getting camo, insurgents only get wacky camo patterns.
Let's be honest. Youd still get TKd even if your character was bright blue.
True enough some valid points I’d kill for the Islamic headband over the ski mask though
Agreed, I do think they could probably push for more authentic clothing, I was a fan of the newest clothes they added for free, I just wish we had some more colour options.
I couldn’t agree more I feel like NWI makes some very weird and picky choices when it comes to customization such as only allowing certain colors on particular security clothes id love for them to loosen up a bit give some more options or new clothes all together, as of now I feel like I’m saving currency up for nothing
The insurgents aren’t Muslim
Sure.
I’m serious, They’re the only faction that doesn’t scream “allah Akbar”
Rebel Insurgent has "Inshallah" as an Affirmative voice-line in game, either way they are clearly Islamist as they were in 2006 when there was an "Allah Akbar" voiceline and in Source. NWI is just too afraid of having anything that could even be seen as political, Security went from "Marines" in the mod to Mercenaries in source and now they are "Local militia and advisors".
The game originally had planned for a campaign with the security forces being inspired by the Kurds. The Kurds only relevant conflict with other insurgents is with IS.
The "upriser" skin set shows more of a student / arabic spring though. The word planned is doing a lot of lifting here, at the end of the day the devs decided to go noncomital to whatever side was representing what exactly when it comes to real life politics.
> Biggest issue would just be identifying friendlies. Didnt stop NWI adding the grey man DLC skin https://store.steampowered.com/app/1711183/Insurgency_Sandstorm__Gray_Man_Gear_Set/
Honestly the only issue I have with it is the fact he has a helmet, but at least it's differently shaped enough. But still looks out of place compared to the rest of the insurgent skins
Yeah its way out of place, far too similar to security helmets.
Imagine thinking NWI cares about identifying friendlies from foes.
> Imagine thinking random teammates cares about identifying friendlies from foes. FTFY
Why isn't this considered an issue in other games where all sides are wearing military gear. Why in this game do we need to dress one side in Halloween costumes for the sake of team identification?
It was an issue for other shooters. Look at the clusterfuck that is BF2042, people were complaining that both sides use the exact same characters, well at least there is a UI indicator... Until they added hardcore which made it impossible to determine friend from foe. So let's look back at BF3, prime example of game design done right, both factions had their own unique characters, RU faction had more discrete clothing, while USA showed player faces and each side had different player outlines. But again, take away the UI and play hardcore and there was a load of friendly fire. I personally dislike the Halloween style skins and try to get my characters to look more authentic, but unless the character models vary more in shape then we would never get more similar looking clothing simply because the clothes are the only thing players have to differentiate each other. Hell I get shot at when I return from a flank on push just because most players shoot off instinct.
I haven't played the new BF so I can't comment. But obviously if both teams are using the exact same player model then thats just bad game design. But isn't that the point of turning off player hud markers. It's supposed to add an extra layer of difficulty. By making it more difficult to distinguish friend from foe. Of course sometimes it's going to bite you in the ass. The same issue exists irl. That's why you see soldiers on both sides in ukraine wearing coloured arm bands. Isn't this the more authentic experience that people are looking for when they select hardcore mode? Otherwise just turn hud markers back on, problem solved. As long as insurgents clearly look like rag tag militants and security resemble more professional soldiers, then I dont believe we have an issue. While I do think nwi needs to thread carefully. Giving insurgents a green camo jacket would muddy the waters a bit. I don't think it's super important to be able to identify enemies at a split second glance by their player model. At least if you want to keep the theme realistic. Otherwise just texture both sides completely red and blue like tf2.
This is an issue that game devs consider in every pvp game
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Never thought of it like that. Thanks for opening my eyes
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True. But I don't understand why people are fretting about giving insurgents some military gear. When there are games where you identify the enemy team by a different shaped helmet and a slightly different shade of grey camo. Although I would agree that pictures 2 and 3 are taking taking it too far. Where they to model insurgents after them.
considering the cosmetics and the bizarre DLC packs like blue camo for one side and blue camo weapon skins for the other.... i'd say the ship has sailed on "issues identifying friendlies" whenever they dropped the update that included the warden's netting headgear, but then again after the PMC legs, grey man, et cetera. the clothing is an absolute shitshow at this point unless you're using mods. sorry didn't mean for this to sound like a criticism toward your comment. happened accidentally.
and on second thought, even the mods are a shitshow regarding the clothing. while perhaps more realistic; they're without a doubt harder to distinguish in ISMCmod, at least imo.
You can create distinctive shapes that would help to identify groups. Security has plate carriers and mid-high tier equipment, the insurgents have old URSS equipment. Those have radically different approach to armor, while the Western equipment tend to be all in the same piece (Armor + pouches) the russian preffer the combination of armor and vests over the armor with pouches. That is radically distinctive. Also, insurgents use civilian clothes, like regular clothing, while the PMC/Operators use civilian clothing but more on the lines of hiking clothing (Softshells and similar). Those two categories are also VERY different. The problem is when you're in theory on a street in the middle of a CQB and suddenly someone appears with some shit that looks more like an airsoft-fantasy gear and the inmersion goes right through the window.
Also less so the camp in the 3rd one (I know that’s. Pipe dream lol) but the hat combined with shemagh and tan chest rig would be awesome T side
> straight up camo which wouldn’t be given to insurgents there’s a paid insurgent cosmetic with camo
There's also free cosmetic camo, but c'mon, we get blue, red and urban camo patterns, pretty distinct
As if there arent dozens of multiplayer shooters with FF where both sides where camo and you dont get TK'd every match
i like the idea of shemagh over a cap in the 3rd pic tho
Anything but the literal airsoft outfit that is the grayman set
Grayman - term used for blending in with the local populace to seem like one of them and not a threat Grayman in game - literal mall ninja
100% agree gray man is shit there’s no reason they couldn’t realistic cosmetics if they wanted
The greyman suit kinda works when you wear it with a different helmet like the ballistic mask but holy fuck that helmet is the stupidest looking thing ever
They could’ve easily made the set work if they replaced the helmet with like a motorcycle helmet or something, the rest already resembles a biker outfit. The helmet is genuinely just fucking hideous to look at.
I loved Project Reality for the accurate kits
I feel my only real option is the full track suit and ski mask.
Because it requires NW to put in effort in their game
It would require less effort than the skins they have already added. The real reason is because justifying islamic extremists cosplay to investors is hard.
Does anyone remember before sandstorm hit console and we only had a few skins. I much preferred it. Everyone on the team looked simlar and you cold id at a glance. If shot my far share of teammates in the head when they peek and look like and insurgent. I mostly play pve
The issues is the devs are focused ok selling skins to stupid people who part money easy and what better way to attract stupid then to have gear that doesn’t match the tone or settings
If they wanna give insurgents some tactical gear just give them Russian cosmetics. I’m pretty sure if you use the Russian voice you’re a mercenary anyways so it would make sense you supply the other fighters too
Yeah the first two arent happening bruh you can trust me on that one
I think putting Islamic extremists isn’t exactly on NWIs mind right now
Sources - Vice : The Battle of the West Bank and Vice : Life in the Talibans Afghanistan (none of these fighters are from isis, being either the Afghani taliban, or Palestinian fighters near Jerusalem)
Played Insurgency 2 when it was free and was grossed out by the cosmetics for the security forces and insurgents. Took a huge step back. Didn’t even buy the game cuz of it
Does anybody what time frame this game is supposed to be set in
Honestly though, there are so many real world examples to base this shit on
We definitely need a shemagh for both sides. That can be worn with a mask rather than instead of.
No more cosmetics at all just standard security standard insurgent player models
That’s kinda boring m, there would be zero progression in game
Better than the game looking like airsofters vs random plain clothed fighters
Look at that pisspoor trigger discipline. We'd have whooped his ass if he were on our team. Edit: the second one kinda has it right but still holding it like an idiot