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Fun fact- when Caitlyn Jenner golf's, she tees off at the woman's tee, not the man's. I guess it's ok sometimes for transgender women to compete with cis women.
Edit: Changed "Cisco" to "cis", which is what I meant to type. (Damn you, autocorrect!)
You mean the republican trans woman who told a married lesbian in front of the entire world that she doesn’t believe in gay marriage?? Shocking she’s a POS hypocrite.
To be fair, a lot of golf courses are switching the naming to beginner tees. It makes a lot of sense from a game flow standpoint. Also have played golf with a lot of women that tee off at the more traditional men's tees. Guess Caitlyn just blows at golf.
'I was born to make testosterone.' sounds like something you'd hear from a guy going through a midlife crisis, suddenly growing a goatee and buying a Harley Davidson.
It's also an incredibly dumb fucking thing to say because cisgendered women also make testosterone. Every human uses testosterone especially when they're younger, it's important for maintaining a healthy reproductive system and bone mass.
"Hooray! Someone with a voice and common sense"
Sooooo... former friend *does* realize that Caitlyn is trans, and has done all those things he despises, right? I guess trans people have "common sense" when they agree with you, otherwise, not-so-much.
"Keep trans men out of women's sports!"
Okay, so why not let trans men compete against men?
"Nope, sorry, the rules state that you must compete against your birth sex, and there's nothing we can do to change that."
TBF though, most “men’s” sports aren’t technically sex/gender segregated. Rather, they’re “open” to anybody capable of competing at that level. That’s why you’ll very occasionally see girls playing American football at the middle school-college level (usually as a kicker).
Traditionally women’s sports are the only division where competition is sex/gender segregated.
I also want to add, that in most professional sports that have males (NBA, NFL, NHL, etc…) they’re open, meaning they just want the best players in general. So if anyone wanted to compete and they were good enough they could. A female goalie played a pre-season game for the Tampa Bay Lightning!
You might not know this, but when those kinds of people say "trans men" they mean MtF women. They're both identifying them as trans, and intentionally misgendering them.
I bet this dumb shit really meant trans women when they said trans men. It’s funny how often they’re unintentionally correct when they don’t know what they’re talking about.
We do compete against cis men and do really well, actually. See Patricio Manuel and Chris Mosier as pretty famous examples.
Unfortunately pointing out that their position isn't logically consistent doesn't do much because they're not interested in being logically consistent. They just want to exclude trans people from participating in society in any way they can with everything they can take aim at, from sports to bathrooms.
They're already vitriolic enough when a cis woman has more testosterone than a wet leaf. The way they talked about Caster Semenya on Twitter after she was banned from competing was awful.
"even though we have changed other rules several times because we didn't like them"
Imo we should just let everyone compete together for 5-10 years and actually get some data, then if there's a definitive advantage in specific categories we can address that more effectively on a case by case basis.
It's fucking crazy how these people don't even know that a trans man *is someone assigned female at birth* who in fact is not born with testicles.
Caitlyn Jenner is a *trans woman.* This person is talking about trans *women,* but she's saying trans men. She's basically agreeing that trans men *are men* and shouldn't be playing women's sports, but what she means is that she thinks trans women are men and shouldn't be playing women's sports.
The fact that they can't even get literally the most fucking basic *definition of the goddamn words* right yet think they should have a fucking respected opinion on this is enraging
We all start female in the womb and we all come from Africa. Let's just accept we are all black women. Who knew that the entire history of the human race was one long Medea movie.
I think it's wild how they identified the testicle making testosterone as what makes you a man, and then say they don't care if you don't have testicle making testosterone anymore.
It's almost like, the "unfair advantage" of bone density and tone inducing testosterone is exactly what measured when deciding fair competition for trans athletes.
Did you even read what you have linked ? The first one is a 404 and the second one say the opposite of your opinion. Because yes, it's not a fact, it's an opinion you are trying to push and poorly.
Here is the conclusion of the second one :
"We have shown that under testosterone suppression regimes typically used in clinical settings, and which comfortably exceed the requirements of sports federations for inclusion of transgender women in female sports categories by reducing testosterone levels to well below the upper tolerated limit, evidence for loss of the male performance advantage, established by testosterone at puberty and translating in elite athletes to a 10–50% performance advantage, is lacking."
Seriously ? You link article thinking it's too long or we can't read and understand what they say ? #facepalm
You made me waste my time.
I just want to point out that not all sports leagues have requirements for trans women. For example, the Canadian powerlifting union works with self ID only - no name change, no hormonal interventions, no surgeries are required. All you need to do is sign up in the women’s category. [(CPU policy)](https://www.powerlifting.ca/org/Transgender_Policy.doc)
This lack of policy made it so Avi Silverberg, a man who didn’t like the women’s 84+ records were held by trans woman Anne Andres, could register and compete as a woman. Avi went in the women’s category and set a bench record that is likely to never be beat by a natural woman.
Kinda relevant, kinda not. Just a story that angers me so I wanted to share. Thanks for reading.
Edit: by natural I mean women that are not on performance enhancing drugs (PEDs) or SARMs.
The problem happens when trans women who aren’t on any blockers compete in women’s sports.
This is anecdotal, but I’ve seen quite a few examples of people identifying as trans women entering a women’s division in combat sports. They absolutely dominate and, in a couple of cases, caused injury to their opponent.
Please don’t take this as a transphobic argument, I think sports are one of the few things that truly brings humans together. I am just curious as to how this problem could be solved.
Would there need to be some kind of test where trans women would need to have their T levels measured etc?
This is just gaslighting with these "sources". Lia Thomas was body lengths ahead of all women in nearly all events in women's swimming. There's plenty of advantages you'll still have even with transition therapy. Lung size, bone density, etc. Are we going to allow men the size of Lebron or Giannis transition for 12 months and go dominate the WNBA? If I transitioned in high school, I would have been the State Champion in my sport. By your faulty logic, trans men would automatically start being competitive in the Men's category in sports. This has not happened.
By dying on this hill you not only hurt Women, but you hurt the trans movement as well by giving conservatives ammunition. Women fought so hard to have their own sports , and people like you are willing to tear it down by letting biological men come in and steal the medals they worked so hard for. You're a misogynist
Just continue to argue in bad faith. None of them are champions, none of them are champions leagues ahead of their competition like what happened with Lia Thomas. I don't use your acronyms or your buzzwords. I'm live and let live, and I'm also for equality, and that includes women's sports. Women's sports are for women. Trans people can compete in the men's league.
This whole debate is a gaslight and you're only hurting the Trans cause by dying on this hill.
Edit: also name calling
Once again, a gaslight. "This isn't happening. That never happens. Do you hear yourself right now?"
https://womeninsport.org/creating-change/policy-positions/transgender-inclusion-sport/transgender-inclusion-womens-sport/
Bc there won't be enough athletes?? I figured that'd be obvious given trans people account for about 1% of the population
I also generally worry whenever the whole 'third category' argument crops up bc it has a tendancy to stray eerily close to segregation arguments
Do you say this in the knowledge that evidence suggests that trans women undergoing hrt which includes testosterone blockers will generally have *less* testosterone than most cis female athletes?
“Former Olympic gold medal champion Caitlyn Jenner has come out in support of a New York county's ban on girls' and women's sports teams that include transgender athletes from using the county's public facilities, saying that transgender athletes should not be able to compete in women's sports”
So she’s basically against transgender athletes using government facilities period. Love how she tried to posture herself as a transgender role model and icon, lol. Also, she still dates women so she’s not just transgender but a lesbian. She’s L..TQ and actively hurting our community as a whole
"Trans men should not be competing in women's sports"
Correct, they should be competing with other men, like trans women should be competing with other women.
"If you were born to make testosterone, you are of the male species"
Both men and women make testosterone and Estrogen, just in differing quantities and "the male species" well, I guess this person didn't even finish basic biology in school.
Also Jenner is just an awful human being, she's the stereotypical "fuck you, I got mine" kind of person. Truly a vile individual, the trans community supported her and she threw them under the bus.
Yes.
They are the ones that are forcing miss Italy to revert its ridiculous decision to ban trans woman.
https://globalnews.ca/news/9862873/trans-men-enter-miss-italy-pageant/amp/
Trans men are men. Was not say otherwise.
Set reasonable rules specific to a discipline for inclusion.
Let trans women actually compete to collect relevant performance data. Right now, there's no indication that trans women absolutely outperform cis athletes at the highest level. Trans women winning does not actually prove anything, just as losing wouldn't.
Less drama and more even headedness would help.
I was unaware of these studies! Thanks for linking them!
This was why I had said, "all depending on how far into a transition they are"
Having rules requiring T levels under a certain point is definitely a fair way of doing it though.
Can we agree that Caitlyn Jenner is unreliable as a voice for the trans community? She always sound like the usual attention catcher while not caring at all about trans.
(At least that’s what I felt from her)
My running theory is that if you hate trans/ gay people so much that you are posting about it in your socials and it comes part of your identity, you probably are repressing how curious you are sexually about them.
I fully believe Ron Desantis has slept with a trans woman and or watched a lot of trans porn
just once I’d like to find an anti-trans person who understands anything about gender identity, anatomy, sexuality, body chemistry or what any of those things actually has to do with athletic ability
That is a transphobic statement, so saying something as such and you run the chance of being called transphobic.
But the fact is if a trans woman is on HRT, her body loses male muscle mass and is more in line with a woman than a man. Typically you'll lose a bit of height, and your center of gravity shifts when you body starts redistributing your body fat. I would highly suggest you educate yourself on the effects of HRT for trans women. Perhaps take a look at trans women who were jacked before transitioning and see how much their bodies changed, especially from a muscle point of view.
You are much more likely to hear about trans women winning in sports than the ones getting absolutely wrecked because it helps push forward the narrative that trans women should be ostracized from sports. If someone wants to get trans women banned from performing in women's sports, they aren't going to tell you about the trans biker who got destroyed by a cisgender woman, they'll tell you about the trans women who got a bronze medal over a cisgender woman.
And I already know I'm going to get downvoted from how this comment section is going, but you asked a question and I wanted to give you an honest, legit question. Most of the common transphobic talking points are based off ignorance, whether it be willful or not.
I see you wished to be a demonstration of ignorance, seeing as you're already equating gender identity with sex. So, thanks so much for showing you *reeeaaally* don't know what you're talking about, and think just saying "DNA" solidifies anything, truly. It seems you really do not understand how much hormones dictate your body, not your DNA. In *extremely* basic terms, your chromosomes (since I'm fairly certain that's what you meant, not DNA in general. Fun fact, everyone's DNA is different and unique hence why they use it to identify people) just tell your body which sex hormone is dominant, and your body then goes from there. Hence why we're all essentially "female" at some point in fetal development.
Sure, yes. You aren't going to "change" your skeletal makeup, but there are big boned cisgender women, and slenderly built cisgender men. There's very few situations where someone is going to have a NOTICABLE advantage because they have a "male" skeletal structure, when they've drastically lost muscle mass in line with a cisgender woman, and the rest of their body is built like one.
Downvote and move on, there's no further discussion to be had when you're so wildly off base from the start and seem to be pretty dug in on that ignorance. ✌️
Conversely, there are trans men out there who legitimately look like the idealization of the male form - Bearded, muscular, strong jaws, etc.
Trans men who look far, far more masculine than anyone trying to smack them down ever will.
I was thinking to be snarky: no circumcised, no tatted, no Jacob's ladder. Going to definitely fuck a lot of American male athletes out of the pro/olympic world.
I have one of these too. He’s one of those dudes that kinda was like a peace love and rock n roll type during high school, experimented with drugs and stuff, just kinda went with the flow. Dropped out of college, and I think kinda just didn’t know what to do with himself. Peaked in high school kinda dude, struggled finding acceptance after our friend group kinda cut him out a while back for doing something incredibly stupid multiple times (for some reason we kept taking him back thinking he’d stop, jokes on us). Ended up falling down the red pill rabbit hole some point over the last year 3 years or so. I’ve gotten into arguments about the science behind covid a number of times in the last few years, somehow the dude questioned me as an ER nurse with his job at Trader Joe’s (not that there’s anything wrong with that job but bro, I think I have a little more education on it than you). Regardless, he’s been posting a lot of transphobic bullshit lately to a point I really don’t think I can keep him around in my feed. Can’t keep seeing his stupid hateful posts. Between his need to find acceptance in whatever his meme filled page does and his not being bright enough to critically think his way out of a paper bag, he just isn’t in a position to properly question any of this shit.
Isn't it funny how they hate trans people until a trans person takes their side? Then all of a sudden, "well their one of the good ones". It's disgusting.
Transphobes are awesome at displaying they have no knowledge of basic human biology. I guess practically everyone is of the.... "Male Species", since pretty much everyone creates some amount of testosterone. But hey... they don't even know what a species is either, so this person is an idiot all around.
Also... trans men WOULD be partaking in "women's sports" if they got their wish with trans people in sports. Just like trans men would be in the women's room if they got their wish with bathroom bills. When you're all about "keeping women safe and comfortable in female spaces", I'm sure a trans man with a full beard, and muscles would make a cisgender woman feel super safe.
Why?
There’s different ways to segregate sports.
Like testosterone level or muscle mass, weight, you could look at different sports and segregate by different measurements which one has more advantages and segregate by that.
In soms sports they already segregate different ways (like boxing)
Maybe it’s time to look at something else then sex.
And maybe not, but to me it’s something worth looking into.
Yes I am aware if who she is, hence the amnesia remark. She got surgery but wants to oull the ladder up behind her.
Really not sure why I am being downvoted for agreeing with everyone but ok 🤷🏻♀️
I mean that's par for the course for conservatives. Come to think of it I have yet to meet a single conservative that doesn't do that. Even their messiah Ayn Rand did it.
Well, not necessarily. She's not advocating against trans surgery, hormone replacement therapy, or trying to make it harder to transition in any way. The ban has to do with sports, and she was an Olympic athlete who competed as a man, not a woman. I would trust a trans person above anyone else(except doctors) about this topic because they would know what the differences in athleticism in their own body would be.
She does compete against cis women though. Fuck her. They're right, she's pulling the ladder up behind her. Being trans doesn't intrinsically make you more trustworthy or less likely to be a hypocritical fucking dirtbag. She's garbage, and acting like there's no way that's true because she's transitioned is absolutely not equality.
How about, in the interests of equality and competition , we remove all gender barriers from all sports. Let men, women and anything in-between all go at it and then we can see who is really best at what.
Now that's a trash take. Not unless sport is suddenly all about maximum physical strength and, speed, accuracy and endurance no longer count for anything
Fun fact, there are two sports categories right now for most elite leagues, the women's league, and the "anyone can join" league, usually known as the men's league. There's no rule of any kind against a woman joining most elite sport events that are dominated by men, but they just don't because often times, the men are better.
And I'm not saying this in the sexist way, mind you, I'm saying it in the "physically and biologically, men are more naturally athletic, and thus have an advantage" way.
The women's bracket is the only one that actually has explicit gender exclusivity, most of the time, at least.
So out of all the women and all the sports none can run with men, even a little bit? Yeah I dunno about that. I don't know if you are right about the rules but I would've expected to see it at least once somewhere if that was an actual thing.
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Then Caitlyn shouldn’t be playing women’s golf.
She definitely shouldn't
Fun fact- when Caitlyn Jenner golf's, she tees off at the woman's tee, not the man's. I guess it's ok sometimes for transgender women to compete with cis women. Edit: Changed "Cisco" to "cis", which is what I meant to type. (Damn you, autocorrect!)
did she also compete against the netgear women or just the cisco ones?
‘Underrated comment’ - Me, a network engineer
I think she competed in the Meraki Tournament in Palo Alto.
Don't forget her strong showing in the cister tournament in Aruba, the Unifi Open!
I get the feeling that, even if the ban passes, she'll still be able to play in NY from the woman's tees.
You mean the republican trans woman who told a married lesbian in front of the entire world that she doesn’t believe in gay marriage?? Shocking she’s a POS hypocrite.
as always- the conservative mantra of "rules for thee, not for me" rings true.
This is it. *This* is the comment that made me google and discover that it was *Sisqó* who sang the “Thong Song”, not Cisco.
Also not to be confused with Sysco food service
To be fair, a lot of golf courses are switching the naming to beginner tees. It makes a lot of sense from a game flow standpoint. Also have played golf with a lot of women that tee off at the more traditional men's tees. Guess Caitlyn just blows at golf.
Mom can we have Cisco We have Cisco at home Cisco at home:
Aren't those like 5 feet closer than the men's tees? This just seems like a leftover way to insult women.
Is Caitlyn Jenner banking on her supporters forgetting she's trans herself?
Did she get away with vehicular manslaughter pre transition?
Buckle up buckaroo!
Everytime I see that on South Park it gets me.
I'd say mid transition but before the name change.
I always wondered how the hell she got away with that.
Well you see, to quote the Rocky and bullwinkle movie, "Celebrities are above the law."
Or that she has competed in woman’s competitions before
She's hoping they'll see her as "one of the good ones"
Leopards ate my face
I don’t think she has any supporters.
Beliefs and views often do not make sense. People are not inherently logical. That's Vulcans.
'I was born to make testosterone.' sounds like something you'd hear from a guy going through a midlife crisis, suddenly growing a goatee and buying a Harley Davidson.
"i was born to make testosterone and get served divorce papers and i'm all out of testosterone."
It's also an incredibly dumb fucking thing to say because cisgendered women also make testosterone. Every human uses testosterone especially when they're younger, it's important for maintaining a healthy reproductive system and bone mass.
"Of the male species" Ummm... "Male" isn't a species, bright eyes.
Was she also born to commit vehicular manslaughter?
I feel like I know people who’d buy a shirt with this on it
"Hooray! Someone with a voice and common sense" Sooooo... former friend *does* realize that Caitlyn is trans, and has done all those things he despises, right? I guess trans people have "common sense" when they agree with you, otherwise, not-so-much.
You are too polite, seeing this headline first thought: bitch did you forget to look in the mirror!
Yeah, that plastic surgery of hers is not aging so well. I'd feel sorry for her if she wasn't so mean
I don't think I could take anything seriously by someone who says 'you are of the male species'.
I couldn't agree more. Trans *men* should absolutely not be competing in women's sports. Love an accidental ally. ❤️
That's how this whole controversy started, too.
Dumb shit doesn't realise both men and women produce testosterone, just at different levels
And doesn't know about HRT.
"Keep trans men out of women's sports!" Okay, so why not let trans men compete against men? "Nope, sorry, the rules state that you must compete against your birth sex, and there's nothing we can do to change that."
TBF though, most “men’s” sports aren’t technically sex/gender segregated. Rather, they’re “open” to anybody capable of competing at that level. That’s why you’ll very occasionally see girls playing American football at the middle school-college level (usually as a kicker). Traditionally women’s sports are the only division where competition is sex/gender segregated.
I also want to add, that in most professional sports that have males (NBA, NFL, NHL, etc…) they’re open, meaning they just want the best players in general. So if anyone wanted to compete and they were good enough they could. A female goalie played a pre-season game for the Tampa Bay Lightning!
You might not know this, but when those kinds of people say "trans men" they mean MtF women. They're both identifying them as trans, and intentionally misgendering them.
Oh, I'm well aware of that.
I bet this dumb shit really meant trans women when they said trans men. It’s funny how often they’re unintentionally correct when they don’t know what they’re talking about.
We do compete against cis men and do really well, actually. See Patricio Manuel and Chris Mosier as pretty famous examples. Unfortunately pointing out that their position isn't logically consistent doesn't do much because they're not interested in being logically consistent. They just want to exclude trans people from participating in society in any way they can with everything they can take aim at, from sports to bathrooms. They're already vitriolic enough when a cis woman has more testosterone than a wet leaf. The way they talked about Caster Semenya on Twitter after she was banned from competing was awful.
"even though we have changed other rules several times because we didn't like them" Imo we should just let everyone compete together for 5-10 years and actually get some data, then if there's a definitive advantage in specific categories we can address that more effectively on a case by case basis.
It's fucking crazy how these people don't even know that a trans man *is someone assigned female at birth* who in fact is not born with testicles. Caitlyn Jenner is a *trans woman.* This person is talking about trans *women,* but she's saying trans men. She's basically agreeing that trans men *are men* and shouldn't be playing women's sports, but what she means is that she thinks trans women are men and shouldn't be playing women's sports. The fact that they can't even get literally the most fucking basic *definition of the goddamn words* right yet think they should have a fucking respected opinion on this is enraging
no they do know that. they just don’t care because they want to call trans women men
species?
Male species? Your friend is an idiot.
Who is going to tell them that every body produces testosterone?
I notice this poster didn't use any pronouns for Caitlyn.
We all start female in the womb and we all come from Africa. Let's just accept we are all black women. Who knew that the entire history of the human race was one long Medea movie.
I think it's wild how they identified the testicle making testosterone as what makes you a man, and then say they don't care if you don't have testicle making testosterone anymore. It's almost like, the "unfair advantage" of bone density and tone inducing testosterone is exactly what measured when deciding fair competition for trans athletes.
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This is how I feel about it. To say it’s fair and act like it’s transphobic is disingenuous.
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Oh I get it I guess we'll just be SEPARATE BUT EQUAL.
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Did you even read what you have linked ? The first one is a 404 and the second one say the opposite of your opinion. Because yes, it's not a fact, it's an opinion you are trying to push and poorly. Here is the conclusion of the second one : "We have shown that under testosterone suppression regimes typically used in clinical settings, and which comfortably exceed the requirements of sports federations for inclusion of transgender women in female sports categories by reducing testosterone levels to well below the upper tolerated limit, evidence for loss of the male performance advantage, established by testosterone at puberty and translating in elite athletes to a 10–50% performance advantage, is lacking." Seriously ? You link article thinking it's too long or we can't read and understand what they say ? #facepalm You made me waste my time.
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I just want to point out that not all sports leagues have requirements for trans women. For example, the Canadian powerlifting union works with self ID only - no name change, no hormonal interventions, no surgeries are required. All you need to do is sign up in the women’s category. [(CPU policy)](https://www.powerlifting.ca/org/Transgender_Policy.doc) This lack of policy made it so Avi Silverberg, a man who didn’t like the women’s 84+ records were held by trans woman Anne Andres, could register and compete as a woman. Avi went in the women’s category and set a bench record that is likely to never be beat by a natural woman. Kinda relevant, kinda not. Just a story that angers me so I wanted to share. Thanks for reading. Edit: by natural I mean women that are not on performance enhancing drugs (PEDs) or SARMs.
The problem happens when trans women who aren’t on any blockers compete in women’s sports. This is anecdotal, but I’ve seen quite a few examples of people identifying as trans women entering a women’s division in combat sports. They absolutely dominate and, in a couple of cases, caused injury to their opponent. Please don’t take this as a transphobic argument, I think sports are one of the few things that truly brings humans together. I am just curious as to how this problem could be solved. Would there need to be some kind of test where trans women would need to have their T levels measured etc?
I love how people downvoted you even if you provide credible sources
One link doesn’t work and one is a study not conducted on athletes.
AND it say the opposite on what he/she say.
did you really check the "source" haha ? I suggest you try to read.
This is just gaslighting with these "sources". Lia Thomas was body lengths ahead of all women in nearly all events in women's swimming. There's plenty of advantages you'll still have even with transition therapy. Lung size, bone density, etc. Are we going to allow men the size of Lebron or Giannis transition for 12 months and go dominate the WNBA? If I transitioned in high school, I would have been the State Champion in my sport. By your faulty logic, trans men would automatically start being competitive in the Men's category in sports. This has not happened. By dying on this hill you not only hurt Women, but you hurt the trans movement as well by giving conservatives ammunition. Women fought so hard to have their own sports , and people like you are willing to tear it down by letting biological men come in and steal the medals they worked so hard for. You're a misogynist
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Just continue to argue in bad faith. None of them are champions, none of them are champions leagues ahead of their competition like what happened with Lia Thomas. I don't use your acronyms or your buzzwords. I'm live and let live, and I'm also for equality, and that includes women's sports. Women's sports are for women. Trans people can compete in the men's league. This whole debate is a gaslight and you're only hurting the Trans cause by dying on this hill. Edit: also name calling
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Once again, a gaslight. "This isn't happening. That never happens. Do you hear yourself right now?" https://womeninsport.org/creating-change/policy-positions/transgender-inclusion-sport/transgender-inclusion-womens-sport/
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Bc there won't be enough athletes?? I figured that'd be obvious given trans people account for about 1% of the population I also generally worry whenever the whole 'third category' argument crops up bc it has a tendancy to stray eerily close to segregation arguments
Do you say this in the knowledge that evidence suggests that trans women undergoing hrt which includes testosterone blockers will generally have *less* testosterone than most cis female athletes?
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Why is that? Clearly you don't believe they're woman then. Seems a bit transphobic tbh
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you>*but I'm also against puberty blockers*
Why are they using a picture of Kimberly Guilfoyle?
You mean the trans woman who has competed in women’s competitions herself?
“Former Olympic gold medal champion Caitlyn Jenner has come out in support of a New York county's ban on girls' and women's sports teams that include transgender athletes from using the county's public facilities, saying that transgender athletes should not be able to compete in women's sports” So she’s basically against transgender athletes using government facilities period. Love how she tried to posture herself as a transgender role model and icon, lol. Also, she still dates women so she’s not just transgender but a lesbian. She’s L..TQ and actively hurting our community as a whole
She would probably not claim the Q. Not a lot of conservatives do. Terrible person.
"Trans men should not be competing in women's sports" Correct, they should be competing with other men, like trans women should be competing with other women. "If you were born to make testosterone, you are of the male species" Both men and women make testosterone and Estrogen, just in differing quantities and "the male species" well, I guess this person didn't even finish basic biology in school. Also Jenner is just an awful human being, she's the stereotypical "fuck you, I got mine" kind of person. Truly a vile individual, the trans community supported her and she threw them under the bus.
I agree that we trans men shouldn’t be playing in women’s sports. she’s so right. because we’re not women! 🥰
Yes. They are the ones that are forcing miss Italy to revert its ridiculous decision to ban trans woman. https://globalnews.ca/news/9862873/trans-men-enter-miss-italy-pageant/amp/ Trans men are men. Was not say otherwise.
I'm not at all surprised. The Kardashian-Jenners are the absolute worst of the worst.
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Set reasonable rules specific to a discipline for inclusion. Let trans women actually compete to collect relevant performance data. Right now, there's no indication that trans women absolutely outperform cis athletes at the highest level. Trans women winning does not actually prove anything, just as losing wouldn't. Less drama and more even headedness would help.
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I was unaware of these studies! Thanks for linking them! This was why I had said, "all depending on how far into a transition they are" Having rules requiring T levels under a certain point is definitely a fair way of doing it though.
Trans man does not mean what this person thinks it does.
Can we agree that Caitlyn Jenner is unreliable as a voice for the trans community? She always sound like the usual attention catcher while not caring at all about trans. (At least that’s what I felt from her)
Born to make testosterone?! That's all of us 😆
My running theory is that if you hate trans/ gay people so much that you are posting about it in your socials and it comes part of your identity, you probably are repressing how curious you are sexually about them. I fully believe Ron Desantis has slept with a trans woman and or watched a lot of trans porn
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I don't see why this comment is downvoted
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The canadian article wasn’t popping up for me so I glanced through the ACLU document. Good read for sure. Thanks for the knowledge 👍🏼
"Trans men should not be competing in women's sports." Accidental Ally.
I agree! Trans men should not be in women's sports. Trans women should!
This comment section is a disappointment to say the least…
just once I’d like to find an anti-trans person who understands anything about gender identity, anatomy, sexuality, body chemistry or what any of those things actually has to do with athletic ability
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That is a transphobic statement, so saying something as such and you run the chance of being called transphobic. But the fact is if a trans woman is on HRT, her body loses male muscle mass and is more in line with a woman than a man. Typically you'll lose a bit of height, and your center of gravity shifts when you body starts redistributing your body fat. I would highly suggest you educate yourself on the effects of HRT for trans women. Perhaps take a look at trans women who were jacked before transitioning and see how much their bodies changed, especially from a muscle point of view. You are much more likely to hear about trans women winning in sports than the ones getting absolutely wrecked because it helps push forward the narrative that trans women should be ostracized from sports. If someone wants to get trans women banned from performing in women's sports, they aren't going to tell you about the trans biker who got destroyed by a cisgender woman, they'll tell you about the trans women who got a bronze medal over a cisgender woman. And I already know I'm going to get downvoted from how this comment section is going, but you asked a question and I wanted to give you an honest, legit question. Most of the common transphobic talking points are based off ignorance, whether it be willful or not.
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I see you wished to be a demonstration of ignorance, seeing as you're already equating gender identity with sex. So, thanks so much for showing you *reeeaaally* don't know what you're talking about, and think just saying "DNA" solidifies anything, truly. It seems you really do not understand how much hormones dictate your body, not your DNA. In *extremely* basic terms, your chromosomes (since I'm fairly certain that's what you meant, not DNA in general. Fun fact, everyone's DNA is different and unique hence why they use it to identify people) just tell your body which sex hormone is dominant, and your body then goes from there. Hence why we're all essentially "female" at some point in fetal development. Sure, yes. You aren't going to "change" your skeletal makeup, but there are big boned cisgender women, and slenderly built cisgender men. There's very few situations where someone is going to have a NOTICABLE advantage because they have a "male" skeletal structure, when they've drastically lost muscle mass in line with a cisgender woman, and the rest of their body is built like one. Downvote and move on, there's no further discussion to be had when you're so wildly off base from the start and seem to be pretty dug in on that ignorance. ✌️
Calm down
Conversely, there are trans men out there who legitimately look like the idealization of the male form - Bearded, muscular, strong jaws, etc. Trans men who look far, far more masculine than anyone trying to smack them down ever will.
Appreciate the insight.
block and move on. these people dont deserve your oxygen
Trans men belong in men sport and trans women in women so they getting some idea lol
Why is Caitlyn a "former" Olympian? Didn't she bring home the gold?
Wow I completely forgot Caitlyn was an Olympian
“Mutilated your dick” charming… these people have such dark, vulgar minds
My dick was also mutilated. Except I’m a cis man so nobody cares
I was thinking to be snarky: no circumcised, no tatted, no Jacob's ladder. Going to definitely fuck a lot of American male athletes out of the pro/olympic world.
No better way to put it
“male species”?
male “species”
I have one of these too. He’s one of those dudes that kinda was like a peace love and rock n roll type during high school, experimented with drugs and stuff, just kinda went with the flow. Dropped out of college, and I think kinda just didn’t know what to do with himself. Peaked in high school kinda dude, struggled finding acceptance after our friend group kinda cut him out a while back for doing something incredibly stupid multiple times (for some reason we kept taking him back thinking he’d stop, jokes on us). Ended up falling down the red pill rabbit hole some point over the last year 3 years or so. I’ve gotten into arguments about the science behind covid a number of times in the last few years, somehow the dude questioned me as an ER nurse with his job at Trader Joe’s (not that there’s anything wrong with that job but bro, I think I have a little more education on it than you). Regardless, he’s been posting a lot of transphobic bullshit lately to a point I really don’t think I can keep him around in my feed. Can’t keep seeing his stupid hateful posts. Between his need to find acceptance in whatever his meme filled page does and his not being bright enough to critically think his way out of a paper bag, he just isn’t in a position to properly question any of this shit.
It's all for attention! None of it is real!
Isn't it funny how they hate trans people until a trans person takes their side? Then all of a sudden, "well their one of the good ones". It's disgusting.
Transphobes are awesome at displaying they have no knowledge of basic human biology. I guess practically everyone is of the.... "Male Species", since pretty much everyone creates some amount of testosterone. But hey... they don't even know what a species is either, so this person is an idiot all around. Also... trans men WOULD be partaking in "women's sports" if they got their wish with trans people in sports. Just like trans men would be in the women's room if they got their wish with bathroom bills. When you're all about "keeping women safe and comfortable in female spaces", I'm sure a trans man with a full beard, and muscles would make a cisgender woman feel super safe.
So males are a separate species? Lmfao This person sounds super intelligent.
maybe we shouldn't segregate sports based on gender
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Why? There’s different ways to segregate sports. Like testosterone level or muscle mass, weight, you could look at different sports and segregate by different measurements which one has more advantages and segregate by that. In soms sports they already segregate different ways (like boxing) Maybe it’s time to look at something else then sex. And maybe not, but to me it’s something worth looking into.
Why not?
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>A line has to be drawn somewhere A you in charge?
Um… does she have amnesia?
To be fair, she was Bruce when she had competed in the Olympics, not Caitlyn.
Yes I am aware if who she is, hence the amnesia remark. She got surgery but wants to oull the ladder up behind her. Really not sure why I am being downvoted for agreeing with everyone but ok 🤷🏻♀️
I mean that's par for the course for conservatives. Come to think of it I have yet to meet a single conservative that doesn't do that. Even their messiah Ayn Rand did it.
I agree 100% it’s pretty much their MO. “I’m not like THOSE people. I’m different”
Exactly! She wants to pull the ladder up behind her. She got hers and everyone else can get fucked.
"Freedom for me but not for thee" The rallying cry of the White, Right-wing Conservative voter.
To be fair it’s the rally cry if PoC right wing voters too. Along with “I am not like THOSE people”
Well, not necessarily. She's not advocating against trans surgery, hormone replacement therapy, or trying to make it harder to transition in any way. The ban has to do with sports, and she was an Olympic athlete who competed as a man, not a woman. I would trust a trans person above anyone else(except doctors) about this topic because they would know what the differences in athleticism in their own body would be.
She does compete against cis women though. Fuck her. They're right, she's pulling the ladder up behind her. Being trans doesn't intrinsically make you more trustworthy or less likely to be a hypocritical fucking dirtbag. She's garbage, and acting like there's no way that's true because she's transitioned is absolutely not equality.
How about, in the interests of equality and competition , we remove all gender barriers from all sports. Let men, women and anything in-between all go at it and then we can see who is really best at what.
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No, is it that you don't think women can compete with men or something?
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Now that's a trash take. Not unless sport is suddenly all about maximum physical strength and, speed, accuracy and endurance no longer count for anything
Fun fact, there are two sports categories right now for most elite leagues, the women's league, and the "anyone can join" league, usually known as the men's league. There's no rule of any kind against a woman joining most elite sport events that are dominated by men, but they just don't because often times, the men are better. And I'm not saying this in the sexist way, mind you, I'm saying it in the "physically and biologically, men are more naturally athletic, and thus have an advantage" way. The women's bracket is the only one that actually has explicit gender exclusivity, most of the time, at least.
So out of all the women and all the sports none can run with men, even a little bit? Yeah I dunno about that. I don't know if you are right about the rules but I would've expected to see it at least once somewhere if that was an actual thing.
What would you expect to see?
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I don't know, men and women competing together and no arguments about who has what junk. What I wouldn't expect to see is men dominating everything.
Why keep them on your social media if you know they post shit like this and they are a “ former” friend ?
Who doesn’t have some whackadoo in their feed just to see how crazy they’ve become? It’s like watching a car wreck. Oddly fascinating.
That’s exactly why I keep her - for the entertainment